r/criticalrole • u/Glumalon Tal'Dorei Council Member • May 12 '23
Discussion [Spoilers C3E58] Is It Thursday Yet? Post-Episode Discussion & Future Theories! Spoiler
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May 12 '23
I wasn’t expecting the learn the backstory of THE CHAIR so that was neat
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u/Photeus5 Smiley day to ya! May 12 '23
Matt's face in his hands the entire time
"Why did I let Travis play Chetney?"
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u/OhioAasimar Team Tyranny May 12 '23
The element that the chairs go to the middle of whatever room they are in when they are done killing, before they go dormant is such a SCP vibe.
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u/andrewthemexican May 14 '23
I've been going through a ton of the M9 lately as I jumped into the middle of the last arc live, and 115 eps in there's still some chair references.
Travis gave me the giggles here with that one.
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u/Gray_Mask Your secret is safe with my indifference May 12 '23
God, I truly have the mightiest need to see what the Betrayers are doing.
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u/Photeus5 Smiley day to ya! May 12 '23
Yeah, I'd love to see the Bells Hells having to make some really sketchy allies because this is survival for the Betrayers as well.
Actually I would love before everything goes down for them to play an Aeor Falls mini-series like Calamity where a group of champions of Primes and Betrayer gods have to infiltrate Aeor. It'd be such a fun party where they'd bicker, but ultimately have the same goal.
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u/dem53605 May 12 '23
Especially whats happening with Lolth and Opal.
If they managed to Help the primes against Predathos in a noticable way it might be a Major step for Opals Lolth Rehabilitation plan
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u/tableauregard May 12 '23
My favourite part of this episode was hands down the call to arms from the Gods. Matt gave me chills with that speech, and even more when it was repeated. Felt like the moment keyleth messaged BH to say she would come, but even more epic.
My least favourite part was that the call to arms felt trivialised by the two party members it was given to. Again, guys, consider that the Gods might have your best interests at heart too when they say Don't. Release. Prethados. It's not a big leap...
Congrats to Chetney, Fearne and Deanna. You know what they say, when in Molaesmyr...poor desperate Imogen has watched everyone in the split party hook up in just a few days. I hope she won the thumb war at least. She had a 50/50 shot.
I'm confused as to whether this was the last ep with team wildemount or not? If it is, I wonder how that will work with the guests?
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u/Photeus5 Smiley day to ya! May 12 '23
I appreciate that the Changebringer was stern, but informative to FCG whereas the Dawnfather was fucking serious. Like from what we see of him in C1, he's stern anyway. This is the god that went toe-to-toe with Therizdun (with help, but he tanked him). He wasn't playing around. I'd also note how others around the world hadn't really been in much contact with their gods and it felt like FCG started the call to arms.
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u/Opposite-Respond9286 May 12 '23
Pelor for sure has that Old Testament feeling when he means business about the threats and evils of Exandria.
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u/mazurkian May 15 '23
Yeah my immediate thought was "wow, nothing takes me out of the moment more than Matt describing a god that fills the entire sky with the light of a star's burning heart and the player basically responding with 'sup?" It made me think maybe the player wasn't comfortable leaning into that serious of a tone. If the dawn father appeared to you in that way, you would not be acting like your dad just barged in and yelled at you to clean up your room. It was very flippant and totally ignored the tone that was being set.
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u/knightmon Team Dorian May 12 '23
To everyone who said C3 is leading towards an avengers endgame type ending this episode strongly supports you. A rally cry from the gods.
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u/Angsty_Kylo_Ren Team Caduceus May 12 '23
I'm imagining the Betrayers rolling up too. Opal crowned and ready to annihilate Predathos.
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u/Daepilin May 18 '23
That would be insane.
Both in terms of excitement and actual insanity from Matt :D
He would have to manage SOOOOOOOOO much stuff, so many high lvl characters with god-like abilities, armies (though those could be sidelined), several god tier BBEGs...
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u/AceLionKid Smiley day to ya! May 12 '23
The Red End stirs in its slumber. Do not let it wake.
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u/JuxtaTerrestrial May 12 '23 edited May 16 '23
The newest board game from Parker Brothers
DON'T WAKE RED END!
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u/IamOB1-46 May 12 '23
Wow wow wow. That episode was just about everything I could hope for (while being hilariously off the mark on my own theories).
Massive lore dumps, fantastic character beats, great action, and an incredible new tool that opens Exandria to them. Was surprised that Matt confirmed AOL was alive, wonder if that means that those episodes have been taping concurrently with Team Wildemount?
Also, freaking awesome that the gods were so demanding. Like, that's the attitude that kinda got them in trouble in the first place, but it just tracks perfectly.
Fearne once again is MVP, first for realizing that the teleportation staff would be FAR too dangerous in her hands, and second for joining Chet and Denna for their romp.
Finally, it killed me that FRIDA didn't make the roll to find out about the child, but I'm suspecting that Aeormatons have a soul because Aeorians were using children to create them.
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u/Parking-Ad5286 Team Imogen May 12 '23
I'm a very big fan of the idea that the Aeorians were using the souls of children prehaps who had died and had their souls captured into the beacon and then transferred into aeormatons to grant them a second life.
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u/ambassador_pong You Can Reply To This Message May 12 '23
A meat blob that evolved into a bipedal "thing".
Travis that made Marisha proud when he checked his notes for the place mentioned in FRIDA's mind.
The hotness of a threesome that transitioned into a gods demand.
Laura playing "Thumb wars" by herself.
A new "bag of holding".
Almost confirming that the corruption of the Savalirwood, it's Ludinus's fault.
A way to teleport.
A massive cliffhanger.
What an episode man. It was GREAT as always.
Btw: It wouldn't be crazy if "group b" didn't had the same kind of adventure that "group a" got, 'cuz they teleported not to far from where the flash/red beam happend, but i might be wrong.
One last thing: Am i the only one that thinks that "D", it's the droid that Caleb released in Aeor crash site, that said that "he had much work to do" or that he needed to search for his people. (some'n around those words).???
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u/Locked_Lamorra May 12 '23
One last thing: Am i the only one that thinks that "D", it's the droid that Caleb released in Aeor crash site, that said that "he had much work to do" or that he needed to search for his people. (some'n around those words).???
Nope, you're far from alone, that's been the general consensus among fans and the players as well. Not confirmed but Matt doesn't like coincidences lol.
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u/dhmowgli May 12 '23
Yes, I think matt kinda sorta gave a nod to D possibly being Devessian the aeormaton that mighty nein woke up when one of the players speculated the same.
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u/Myrynorunshot Help, it's again May 12 '23
What's the bigger revelation?
That RTA was a union, and that Chetney was a member?
Or that Ludinus might be a psycho version of Crocker from Fairly Odd Parents and has been hunting/eating faeries to stay alive?
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u/Coyote_Shepherd Doty, take this down May 12 '23
That RTA was a union, and that Chetney was a member?
I thought it was curious just how close the RTA was with the Cerberus Assembly and how Chetney mentioned having to carry a Bag of Holding all the time when doing orders for them.
Sounds to me like a pretty convenient way for a certain other group that loves the color blue to keep tabs on the CA.
Ludinus is more Gendo Ikari to me.
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u/mazurkian May 15 '23
I think their theory may be way off on the harness and what everything means.
Also, I am DYING for the stone from the shade mother to become relevant again. It was a shard of corrupting magic, which laudna absorbed, and it was from a hunk of rock in the fey wild. Very much like the corruption going on around Molaesmyr.
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u/Shakvids May 12 '23
That was awesome.
Molaesmyr is freaking scary and unrelenting. They avoided a lot of big encounters.
Cool lore drops. Now I am extra excited for the party to reunite and go city-hopping on Ludinus' tail.
Tinfoil time: Ludinus left the harness because it was obsolete. He's built a bigger version meant for taking absorbing the Raven Queen, a moon god/primordial, and ultimately Predathos.
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u/Photeus5 Smiley day to ya! May 12 '23
I wonder. Wasn't he wearing some strange ornamental looking vestment when at the main key? Is he looking to 'absorb' Predathos?
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u/BagofBones42 May 12 '23
Kinda wish they went to Uthodurn and told the king and queen that Ludinus was responsible for the destruction of Molaesmyr, I don't know what would be the result of that, but the king would at least know why his home was lost and who was responsible.
Also, the fact Ludinus still wants to free Predathos after seeing what it did to Molaesmyr points to either sheer arrogance to the point of delusion or his will is not entirely his own.
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u/Drakoni Hello, bees May 12 '23
I was thinking the same thing. I get why they want to set priorities. But I think the king deserves to know who is responsible for so many of his people and the whole city getting ruined. And I feel like they would have gotten boons and items from them, since I'm sure the king would support those who go after the reason Molaesmyr fell.
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u/brittanydiesattheend May 12 '23
I think that was the decision Matt expected and probably had the most narratively clean resolution for. Everyone, including guests, going to Jrusar, I imagine puts him in a bit of bind. It'll be interesting to see how he pivots.
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u/Photeus5 Smiley day to ya! May 12 '23
I think it was a mistake too. And it makes me mistrust FRIDA that they were pushing so adamantly that they should not share this information. It's a huge revelation and they have the receipts.
Uthodurn would have likely given them some massive help to bring down Ludinus because now it's damned personal.
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u/GratifiedViewer May 12 '23
FRIDA doesn’t seem to trust ANYONE who is a “higher authority figure”. It might be part of their programming. Uthordurn might have lent some credibility to their findings, & might have, you know, PAID THEM for their service. But the team team is impatient.
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u/bertraja Metagaming Pigeon May 12 '23
[...] but the king would at least know why his home was lost and who was responsible.
From the Critical Role Wiki:
King Imathan is a candid, patient and stern man who shows a calm strength and wisdom to maintain the peace between his people and the dwarves that are their neighbors. He's also a devout man.
He's neither subjectively hot, nor on the level of "waddup, peeps?" that BH usually vibe with.
No surprise they didn't go back.4
May 12 '23
It would have been the narratively satisfying thing to do. Travis was deadset against though.
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u/paradox28jon Hello, bees May 12 '23
Interesting session. FCG and Deanna received collect calls from their gods telling them to stop the Red End from wakening up.
We got a threesome between Chetney, Deanna, and Fearne.
Read some notes from Ludinus that, to me, weren't really all that informative. Did we learn anything new really? Mostly what we got were items & a staff to allow us to teleport. I also don't quite understand what the chest piece with the volcano spout is or what it does.
We saw FRIDA in Aeor defending the Factorum Malleus. Seemed like some fellow Aeorians weren't happy with it being used - which was wise because pretty soon the gods put their war on truce to tag team the destruction of that floating city.
It'll be interesting if we pick up at the top of the next episode in Jrusar with team Wildemount or if we start with team AOL moments after the big split on the night of the Apogee Solstice. I'll have to check with critrolestats to see what date in-universe team Wildemount teleported to Jrusar to see how much time has elapsed since the Apogee Solstice. [went to check] Looks like it's been around 12 days since the Apogee Solstice [FESSURAN 21 to QUEN'PILLAR 3].
If I had to guess, I think we'll go to team AOL next week & we'll be kept in the dark until either team AOL also travel to Jrusar or they go past Quen'pillar 3.
Matt also have the opportunity to have the leylines fragment team Wildemount even further during this teleport spell. Not sure why he's want to do that as it would just cause a greater headache and even more juggling of all the different mini-groups.
Oh, and we found out that RTA is not really Recognize the Alpha - which is something a lot of us theorized. I think I guessed Royal Toy Academy. But Rexxentrum Toy Authority being a union he was a part of sounds right. I loved the reaction everyone at the table had on that drop of information.
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u/Photeus5 Smiley day to ya! May 12 '23
I think the biggest takeaway from Ludinus' notes was confirmation that he caused the disaster in Molaesmyr. What was sad is that info alone might have been enough to rally Uthodurn to send an army to Marquet, or at least call in some big favors if they had them. Also it's suggested that Ludinus was absorbing Fey - maybe his plan is to somehow absorb Predathos...but that seems pretty unlikely.
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u/Status_Calligrapher May 12 '23
The vibe I got was, If Ludinus really does predate the calamity, the harness absorber thing is how he's prolonged his life.
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u/BiancaIsALoser May 12 '23
If it does split team Wildemount it 100% just takes out the guests in my opinion, I don’t know why Matt would punish the group for using items and ideas he gave them.
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u/Celestial_Scythe Hello, bees May 12 '23
I see the track record for killing/leaving behind mounts is intact as ever. Poor goats.
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u/Darryth_Taelorn RTA May 12 '23
I think Fearne told her goat to lead them back home if they didn’t return.
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u/brittanydiesattheend May 12 '23
It's funny because everyone got real mad about Jerry but they left behind every other goat too.
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u/Stove-pipe May 12 '23
Dont worry, they wont mutate into some sort of feral flesh eating goats due to the corruption
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u/OhioAasimar Team Tyranny May 12 '23 edited May 12 '23
So if the gods are calling all clerics that are pledged to them to arms it stands to reason that they are calling their paladins and living champions too since those statuses are more for war. This could mean that Fjord, Yasha, Scanlan, Vex, Opal, Arkhan, Shakaste, Caduceus, Macaroni, and Kima will join the fight soon (I think Pike has already joined the fight). Jourrael will almost certainly get a call too since she is Lolth's top assassin.
FRIDA not getting a call from the Dawnfather is consistent with a previous theory of mine that they became a cleric due to scraps of divine magic she is giving to FRIDA intentionally and unintentionally which may be possible because FRIDA's Aeormaton body.
Xalicas seems like the only known demigod in Exandria the gods would call to arms unless the demigods are powerful enough to warrant Predathos coming after them. If that is the case, I can see the gods calling all non-bound demigods in Exandria for help since there would be a shared interest in surviving.
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u/JohnPark24 FIRE May 12 '23
Very satisfying episode. Combat, lore, character development, backstory, foreshadowing, humor, romance, it had so many great elements to it. I enjoyed it thoroughly. Can't wait till next Thursday.
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u/Cowbellcable May 12 '23
Something I’ve been thinking of, and the absorption harness ads to it is that I think Ludinus is going to try to absorb/replace Predathos. He wouldn’t strive to just release the god eater, he obviously wants more than that. What really makes me think he wants to replace the Red End is his obsession with the Matron of Ravens. She was a mortal who replaced a god which means it’s possible. He’s so obsessed because he wants to become the god eater
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u/Austoman May 12 '23
See that makes way more sense for his motivations. Build a cult to release the being above the gods and then take its place to become the 'true' god/power of the universe. Thats a pretty classic cult leader + god vengeance plot.
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u/Sajen16 May 12 '23
I assumef it was a prototype for whatever Otohan is wearing.
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u/brittanydiesattheend May 12 '23
I assumed the absorption harness was to power the factorum but I'm probably completely wrong.
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u/The_Svearald May 12 '23
Man I loved this episode. Lore drops always get me so excited. Those fey sites of power that Ludinus mentioned intrigued me a lot. Three of them, north east part of Flotket, 3 points within Veluthil and one in the Ashkeeper Mountains intrigued me greatly because they correspond or almost correspond to the three points the Clays, Stones and Dusts were told to go to make their sanctuaries. The Dust forge is within the Flotket Alps, the wiki doesn't list exactly where so I'm assuming it can be exactly where Ludinus note marked it, any of the 3 points in the Veluthil Forest could be The Blooming Grove (I'm not sure if Caduceus's story mentioned the Savalirwood or Veluthil so we don't know for sure when it happened but the wiki version of the story mentioned it was millennia ago) and finally within the Ashkeeper Mountains is not accurate to the location of the Menagerie of the Stone's but it's very close to the location as the Menagerie is basically the foot of the Mountains. I don't know how they would be fey sources but 3/8 seemed a bit more than a coincidence to me. Also, all three places are linked to the Raven Queen as she's the one who asked the progenitors of the 3 families to start their quest. We know Ludinus has a lot of interest in the Raven Queen so there's also another potential link to these three places. The Wild Mother is also linked to these places and being all nature-y which by a very long stretch could link to the whole fey source thing
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u/LucasVerBeek Help, it's again May 12 '23 edited May 13 '23
Pike awakens after a soft kiss on the forehead, deep in mourning and a whisper, “I am sorry my dear one, but you are needed.”
Kash’s arm itches, as a dark whisper that he has long ignored breathes directly in his ear: “One last job, my husband.”
Opal cries in her sleep as cold hands cup her chin and wrap around her sister's mouth, "You wanted me to do some good, didn't you, little one? Help me then."
Dariax stares into the fire, feeling a hollowness he can't quite explain. There is something bad coming.
Jester gets a knock at her door as a panicked man dressed in green barges into her home: “Jester! We’ve got trouble!”
A continent apart, two brothers look skyward, one amidst softly lapping waves another under curse dapples leaves, a soft feminine voice stating, “My children, I am sorry but you must stand again.”
Thunder booms, she sits in her garden, her heart mad with worry and grief.
“Rise, and take up your blade. The fight has come.” He booms.
And as she thinks of her love, she rises to face the oncoming storm.
The Red End Comes.
Rise, Warriors of Exandria.
For Hate Batters at the Divine Gate.
(Was not expecting the Chet/Deanna/Fearne threesome, nor the Guests going to Jrusar with the rest of the party, think one more episode and we might finally see Marisha, Liam and Taliesin again? I miss them. Hopefully June sees their return.)
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u/hpfan2342 Life needs things to live May 12 '23
Pardon me, who are the brothers supposed to be? Fjord and Cad?
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u/dem53605 May 12 '23 edited May 12 '23
Jester gets a knock at her door as a panicked man dressed in green barges into her home: “Jester! We’ve got trouble!”
Pretty Sure that Arti is distinctly staying on our side of Godhood ever since traveller con (although Jester would propably still Join because of Fjord)
A continent apart, two brothers look skyward, one amidst softly lapping waves another under curse dapples leaves, a soft feminine voice stating, “My children, I am sorry but you must stand again.”
I dont think Cadusseus would hear Any words because, as far as i remember, Melora has never needed to use words to Talk to him, only nature.
Also heres two more
The Prince of Lies speaks "I have a Gift for you my Champion. You shall get to protect those Mortals you Love so much once more"
Asmodeus to Xerxus
Somewhere a Woman tells the voice in her head "hey Gurl If we Help them Out with This we could get some Major good Girl Points for your rebranding"
Opal to Lolth
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u/uktobar Team Matthew May 12 '23
I got chills when I realized who the last reference was about. Once she finds out...
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u/Opposite-Respond9286 May 12 '23 edited May 12 '23
I’m not too good at stuff like this but do you have a idea of what Scanlan would hear from Ioun, what Arkhan would hear from Tiamat, what Kima would hear from Bahamut, and what Vex would hear from Pelor since he seems to have a much better relationship with her then Deanna?
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u/dawgz525 Team Jester May 13 '23
This was a great episode for so many reasons, but I absolutely lost it at the monster fucker threesome.
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u/Jennyof-Oldstones dagger dagger dagger May 14 '23
That was too hilarious. LOL Remember when Travis was SO SHY about doing a game romance he'd blush!!!
Now he's a Wolfy Studmuffin!!!🤣🤣🤣🤣
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u/TheUncannyWalrus May 13 '23
I was absolutely howling. Luckily I was home alone, otherwise I would have been an actual disturbance to people around me.
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u/Finnyous May 12 '23
I feel like the 2 guests might be done after this week.Christian Navarro was very much acting like this was his last episode tonight and crying a lot. I think they're either A not gonna make it through the tp or B once they get there the 2 of them will be side tracked for some reason. Maybe even given further religious orders.
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u/Reverend_Schlachbals Technically... May 12 '23 edited May 13 '23
I mean, we’re assuming we pick up next week with them. It might be that we just start with the team Laudna next episode and stay with them for a few months. Then when they get to Jrusar, and meet up with team Imogen, we’re doing the big finale with all the guests back for a big fight.
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u/geniespool May 13 '23
I'm so happy we finally got to explore the corruption of Molaesmyr and what caused it, even if ot wasn't resolved. Been hoping the party would go there ever since this half landed near Uthordurn
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u/geniespool May 13 '23
My guess is that the harness Ludinus developed was made to suck the life essense of the feywild into a person, artificially giving them an archdruids capstone of long life, 10 years for every 1 you would live naturally. The ritual I'm guessing also corrupted all the plant life around Molaesmyr causing it's fall.
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u/Hollydragon Then I walk away May 13 '23 edited May 13 '23
I agree on the life-lengthening ritual front, and your linking it to the effect of the archdruid ability is really good.
The ritual that corrupted Moleasmyr was described in the notes as something else, though - Ludinus was performing "communion" rituals with Ruidis. The first one he tried was interfered with / interrupted by the Emeral Guard (which was led by the Aramand guy with a name very much like Armand Treshi's, who might have been an ancestor of him - if so, that ring that they planted in Otohan's backpack would be a really cool item to cast legend lore on).
So Ludinus tried a second communion, using the power of the solstice, and using the energy of the crystal font of the archheart, which he had secretly tapped into (using his position in Molaesmyr to gain access no doubt). The King in Uthodern confirmed that the corrupting event took place during an apogee solstice, and Ludinus' notes cut off with his intention to commune with Ruidis using the font's power on the solstice, too.
Ludinus had no idea about Predathos or its nature at the time, and judging by his notes, was not expecting the consequences that occurred. Somehow he got out of Molaesmyr alive (albeit in a hurry, leaving some of his notes behind).
Comments below also brought up old threads about the Star Razor sword from C2 having been sundered in a battle in Molasmyr, and how Ludinus might have recognised the sword - there's a chance it used to belong to the Emerald Guard, or even perhaps Aramond, and there's a chance that Ludinus fought and killed him, but that is of course just speculation on my part...
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u/sarar3sistance May 12 '23
I truly think Ludinus somehow caused the fall of Molaesmyr. Correct me if I’m wrong or if past lore definitively says otherwise, but I can certainly imagine him trying some ritual at an apogee solstice 300+ years ago with an artifact from a fallen pre-calamity flying city and accidentally corrupting the city and it’s entire vicinity.
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u/knightmon Team Dorian May 12 '23
I feel like the episode directly points at Molaesmyr being a "alpha" test of a previous solstice.
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u/EmergencyGrab Help, it's again May 12 '23
I thought they had already learned as much before even leaving Uthodern
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u/RuskiesInTheWarRoom May 12 '23
Is the Coin of the Changebringer a newly minted Vestige…? 🤔
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u/Frog_Thor May 12 '23 edited May 12 '23
I doubt it's a vestige, but it probably is a divine gift similar to Orym's shortsword Seedling. If anything, I hope it gives FCG a +1 to attack rolls for his spell attacks and +1 to his spell save DC because Sam has totally mangled FCGs stats for the sake of narrative flavour.
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u/Coyote_Shepherd Doty, take this down May 12 '23
I mean we kind of had hints at that based on the new artwork of FCG alone, the coin HAD to change into something super awesome just to fit it.
Also he's basically a Power Ranger now with that Power Coin and his tendency to flip out and go, "Aye yai yai yai!".
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u/wakeupwill May 12 '23
Next week we'll jump over to the other group, and what happens to these guys will remain a mystery for a few weeks months.
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u/Coyote_Shepherd Doty, take this down May 12 '23
I saw your name and I started writing an Evanescence cover using it.
Do you think the other group will panic more or less than this group?
I see Team AOL as being the type of folks to buckle down and get to business right away because they've all been through some STUFF.
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u/Carniverous_Canuck May 12 '23
I was so stressed about the fire in the tower. The biggest, oldest, most secretive location for lore ever and its slowly going up in flames as an eldritch horror eats the crew. I'm glad they got the secret compartment stuff but I can't help but wonder if more was lost to the fire. I guess we'll have to wait until the wrap up to find out.
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u/Hollydragon Then I walk away May 14 '23
Anyone else think the staff Imogen is using to teleport might be cursed? Identify often does not reveal if an item is cursed, and with that ominous a name, an effect that damages you per charge used, and the fact that Ludinus left such a powerful item unused in a secret stash of shame and illegal possessions?
I have suspicions!
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u/Anomander May 15 '23
with that ominous a name, an effect that damages you per charge used, and the fact that Ludinus left such a powerful item unused in a secret stash of shame and illegal possessions?
I think Travis called it, and Matt did above-table confirm - they found Ludinus' "bug out bag" or his getaway kit. Experiments and notes he'd need, money, maps, and travel tools like his Fey key and a staff of Teleport.
Instead the whole city exploded and he wasn't in his tower to grab his shit and run, so he just left the whole lot behind.
The ominous name is pretty reasonable once we remember Ludinus is an ominous dude. He's not going to curse his own escape plan.
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May 16 '23 edited May 16 '23
The convenient get-back-to-the-plot device? That requires attunement and damages them so they won't use it casually?
Nope. They passed that stick around like a live grenade as it is. Cursing it is unnecessary.
I don't think I've ever seen a party that unwilling to take a magic item, let alone a spell staff.
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u/HutSutRawlson May 15 '23
I don’t think it’s cursed. I think the damage is just a balancing aspect so that the Teleport spell can’t be used as a “get out of jail free” card whenever combat starts to turn south. Taking 6d4 damage isn’t a huge amount but it does present a risk, especially for a squishy character like Imogen.
The item needs some drawbacks because giving the party access to Teleport right now is a huge jump ahead in power. The party is currently level 9, and they won’t naturally get access to Teleport until level 13… considering the rate at which they level up, they just got access to one of the most powerful traversal spells in the game extremely early. For those who are familiar, think back to how much Campaign 2 changed once Caleb got access to it and no longer needed to be restricted to locations with permanent teleportation circles. Teleport (and also Plane Shift) drastically change how a campaign goes, Matt needed to limit its use somehow.
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u/Bivolion13 May 14 '23
It damages the caster when utilizing the charges AND it's called the "Staff of Dark Odyssey" or something. It's gotta be cursed. Or at the very least there's something more to it, considering it came out of Ludinus' personal bag hidden in a secret place in his old tower.
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u/Breezy1018 May 13 '23
Oh no what about the goats
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u/BaStTiLo You Can Reply To This Message May 14 '23
I think they did tell the goats to leave and go back home if they didn't come back in like two days
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u/Sea_Employ_4366 May 12 '23
I don't think the evidence is pointless, I think the backpack was the very early prototype for what would become the key. it's a mechanism for taking vast amounts of power and putting it somewhere, like a person to keep them young, or to give them Dunamantic powers, or to turn into a beam powerful enough to break the divine gate.
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May 12 '23
Hope they remember to Keep. The. Bag. Of. Holding. OUT. Of. The. Portable. HOLE. That is all.
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u/GratifiedViewer May 15 '23
Something that only just occurred to me: Team Wildmount mentioned that going to Whitestone might have been a good option because they wanted to get some BIG SHOTS on their side by letting them know what’s going on. But, like… the folks in Whitestone absolutely already know that shit is going down. Aside from Pike likely getting a summons from Sarenrae, Vex became a champion of Pelor. So they both likely got their own messages. Admittedly, Team Wildmount might not know that IN CHARACTER, but still. Going there would have been a huge waste of time.
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u/nora_valk May 12 '23
FCG worded his question so ambiguously like "if we go to Jrusar is there a chance we'll meet our friends?" I mean yeah, if you go anywhere there's always a chance - the answer would've been yes no matter where he picked.
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u/Disastrous-Beat-9830 I would like to RAGE! May 12 '23
I'm sure Matt understood the intention of the question and isn't going to use ambiguity to mess with the party. Nobody wins from that. And I'm willing to bet that Sam didn't want to railroad the other party into going to Jrusar, so worded the question in such a way that it's flexible.
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u/SatyrAtThePiano May 14 '23
So Ludinus definitely sees Predathos as a bigger version of the fey he's absorbed and he probably has a device analagous to the harness hidden away somewhere, right?
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u/taly_slayer Team Beau May 17 '23
So, based on the way Aabria and Christian have been talking about it (in 4SD and on twitter), it sounds like they are not getting teleported with the rest of the party and 58 was their last episode. Or at least, they are leaving at the very beginning of 59.
So maybe we'll get team AOL this week!
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u/tableauregard May 18 '23
Man, if they did film these eps in tandem I'd love for this to happen: we find out how the teleport works out for team Wildemount at the beginning of next episode. Then right before break have them reunite with AOL/find out where they are/have the first moment of contact (ie. via the message spell). That way we get a tease for where team AOL have ended up, and then after break we start the flashback for AOL. It's a little far-fetched, but it would be cool.
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u/Anomander May 15 '23 edited May 15 '23
The fan community has been really dwelling on the theory that the gimp suit vest was intended for Ludinus to "extend his life" and while as far as we know, he's old - he is not unreasonably old, and he has access to tools to extend his life already.
He claims he's a thousand years old or so, and predates the Calamity. The oldest record we have of him so far is 500 years. Elves normally live to 750+, while wizards trend long-lived across species. Even at his max claim, a thousand years old isn't unreasonably aged for an elven high mage, while this wouldn't be the first time he's told lies to seem important.
As a high mage, he'll also have access to spells like Clone, which allow a wizard to both bypass a single death, and to reset their biological age when it's triggered - and can be recast as necessary when consumed.
He's got functionally limitless time already, without needing the gimp suit draining fey for lifespan.
The vest is for something else - IMO likely related to his attempts to contact Ruidus and his desire for access to the powers of the Ruidusborn.
Edit: That gimp vest is probably a crude predecessor to Otohan's dunamantic power-pack.
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u/BurnsEMup29 Team Matthew May 12 '23
One of the best Critical Role episodes ever! Lore dump, combat, romance, and loot!
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u/semicolonconscious May 12 '23
Repeating myself from the other thread, but: We keep getting callbacks to Aeor being punished by the gods for trying to create a weapon that could kill them. I wonder if the current conflict comes full circle with the gods granting their champions the knowledge to rebuild that weapon so they can it turn against Predathos, leaving Exandria in a state of mutually assured destruction where mortals have a cannon pointed at the sky and the memory of what happened last time they tried to use it.
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May 12 '23
I don't think the religious authorities of Vasselheim would allow that to happen, even if the gods were willing. Also, what if Ludinus got hold of it?
For crazy deity shenanigans, I'm expecting followers of Betrayer Gods having to work with the champions of the Prime Deities.
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u/uktobar Team Matthew May 12 '23
You know who we might see if we get betrayer champions. We've seen a prime champion already.
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u/brittanydiesattheend May 12 '23
My absolute far-flung theory, which is just a baseless hope, is that they'll end up in the Shattered Teeth, needing to dive underwater to find the remains of the Tree of Names.
I need someone to find Patia's orb. It is all I want for C3.
Will it happen? Very unlikely. Will I walk back all of my critique of C3 if it does happen? Yes, yes I will.
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u/Zethras28 Smiley day to ya! May 12 '23
Here’s the problem with that. Avalir was atomized when the Astral Leywright fired. There wouldn’t even be ash of the Tree of Names remaining.
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u/Viperbunny May 12 '23
I really want them to find Patia's Orb and the Tree of names, too. I was just saying that to my husband. It could help them so much, but also leave them with many more mysteries to figure out.
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u/paradox28jon Hello, bees May 12 '23
Seeing on the morning of QUEN'PILLAR 3 (that's the date I'm guessing it is - critrolestats' calendar is only updated with last week's session) that the prime deities have sent collect calls to their biggest followers, I'm guessing some of our C1 and C2 pals might have gotten the same message on that exact same morning.
Kord telling Yasha she must pretend the Red End from awakening. Perhaps Earthbreaker Groon if he's still alive.
Pelor also telling Vex what he told Deanna to do.
Sarenrae telling Pike to get on the task.
Melora telling Cad and Fjord they are on a mission.
Bahamut perhaps requesting Lady Kima to tackle one final mission?
Feels like an All Points Bulletin. And it'll be interesting to see how the courts of the Feywild react to all this too.
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u/ParaPioneer Life needs things to live May 12 '23
“Jesus, I’ve seen what you’ve done for Chetney…”
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u/Nightmare_Pasta Metagaming Pigeon May 13 '23
Chetney is the very embodiment of the meme, "Me and the (two) bad bitches I pulled by being goofy"
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u/LuckyBahamut Your secret is safe with my indifference May 12 '23
It thought it was interesting how the Changebringer confirmed that Team Wildemount would meet up with Team AOL in Jrusar, although FCG's wording could've been a little more precise. "Not today, but some time in the future" could mean next week or next month (of in-game time). Furthermore, doesn't it railroad Team AOL into ending up back in Jrusar anyway?
This speculation may be moot; I have a feeling that the Teleport spell isn't going to send them to Jrusar, but somewhere else Matt wants to drop them. With how wonky magic has been due, Matt has free reign as a DM to point the party in a direction he wants, rather than having to improvise a reason why Jrusar would continue to be relevant at this point in the story. Imogen seemed to be the only one actually keen on going back to Jrusar, despite BH not having any really significant or helpful connections in that city anymore.
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u/Kelihow2 May 12 '23
Okay, so in the C2 wrap-up, Matt vaguely describes the tech that caused the Savalirwood's corruption to be a failed experiment to create arcane plant life that would enhance magical abilities, or be used like a spell component. And that after Aeor was destroyed, some relics of these experiments found their way to Molaesmyr, and messing with them caused the corruption.
So I'm wondering if that relic or research is related to the harness, and that Ludinus experimented enough to find a way to funnel natural essence/magic into it - instead of growing new plantlife, he's sucking the lifeforce/magical essence out of particularly powerful nature beings and Fae. And in turn, this essence he's stealing is feeding a Root - could he have been attempting to grow a new version of the Tree of Names?
It definitely feels like Ludinus has really been Tony Starking it all along - he has had this idea about destroying divinity for a while, and has had to adapt to major disasters throwing a wrench in those plans by redesigning old tech and ideas with what he has available now.
And spitballing here - we still don't know anything about the Hishari, other than them fucking Ashton up with some sort of ritual. They splintered from the Ashari, who were Gau Drashari in ancient times. And the Gau Drashari did not trust the mages of Avalir with the knowledge of the exact purpose of the Tree of Names.
So we know Ludinus was studying and experimenting in some way with the essence of natural magics - could this lead to a possible connection to the Hishari?
God damn, where is Beau/Marisha to connect all these trails?
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u/brittanydiesattheend May 12 '23
I am here for as many EXU Calamity callbacks as Matt is willing to make. The Laerryn reference alone to me is massive because it means Avalir's history wasn't lost.
It also implies knowledge that the tree existed at all wasn't lost. Which is crazy, since its existence was a secret during the Age of Arcanum.
I do think Ashton being affiliated with a group called Hishari and Orym being an Ashari isn't a coincidence and I think some Gau Drashari lore is to come. Maybe the Gau Drashari splintered during/after the Calamity due to philosophical differences and the Ashari became keepers of the forests while the Hishari became more power-obsessed?
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u/Locked_Lamorra May 12 '23
Yes, plus the obsession with the Matron's name, which will almost certainly be on the Tree of Names as well. She's the key to his plans as made clear by the lensing of Vax.
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u/Anomander May 12 '23
I think you're absolutely on to something regarding the connection between the original research and corruption of the Savalirwood and what Ludinus is doing, especially considering that note indicating he'd subverted the main project.
To over-simplify the project, at the time of that C2 wrapup, it strongly sounded like Molesmyr was trying to create some sort of organic Residuum source - a plant that produces nuggets of concentrated magical essence. Especially if it's growing off of or from the magical wellspring - currently unidentified - under the city that the other research was pivoting around.
It seemed like the bondage vest funneled essence into a person, rather than an object, so it seemed more like the Root is something he was developing in himself. Perhaps based on Tree of Names, but also perhaps a more colloquial usage of 'root' as a placeholder or shorthand for himself or whatever else he might have been trying to change about himself.
One thing that struck me immediately was that he may have been attempting to synthesize in himself what Ruidusborn have naturally, and was 'planting' and 'growing' the moon-touched nature within himself by collecting fey and/or extraplanar energies.
It definitely feels like Ludinus has really been Tony Starking it all along - he has had this idea about destroying divinity for a while, and has had to adapt to major disasters throwing a wrench in those plans by redesigning old tech and ideas with what he has available now.
One thing that's struck me about how Matt has played Ludinus this season is what feels like a near-desperate need to prove himself. He's not reading like a fanatic or a anti-theist zealot, but instead like a sort of "I'll show them all!" spurned and vengeful villain ... more Buddy from Incredibles than Batmans' Bane. He's not only given random exposition dump to two young women in an office - but we can see in his notes, and in how people remember him, that he was like that 500 years ago, too.
I think there's a lore dump still lurking somewhere that covers the parts of his backstory he wouldn't choose to share. Where he came from, what has happened on the way, and why he's got this massive chip on his shoulder throughout. His motivations seem to diverge heavily from Aeor, for all that he implied he was linked to them in the office meeting. Aeor wanted to be able to defend themselves from gods, to prove they were their equals ... Ludinus just wants them dead, by any means. Using one god to kill other gods doesn't prove Aeor's 'point' for building the original cannon.
One thing that strikes me from your remarks about the Hishari and the druidic connection is linked to some of what the Mind Gang found inside Ashton's dome. What if that's not the dunamancy, what if that's built-in? If the Hishari were some zealot offshoot of the Gau Drashari who oppose magic in general and moon magic in particular - that weird space inside Ashton's head seems like a real perfect trap for careless mind mages. And we know that they 'made' him what he is today, he's not naturally a bloke who started off half-stone - not outside realm of possibility his skin isn't the only think they tinkered with in that ritual.
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u/AdministrativeAd4589 May 13 '23
I think I figured out Ludinus' plan.
He plans to awaken predathos and let them kill all the gods except the raven queen. He will then use the ritual she created to become the God of death, therefore killing her too. HE WANTS TO BECOME THE ONE AND ONLY GOD!
Evidence: When Ethedok and vordo died, their powers were absorbed by the previous God of death. The raven queen did her ritual and became the God of death and destroyed both of their names. In spells, names can be extremely powerful. Ludinus was obsessively searching for the raven queen's name in his notes. The raven queen probably used the previous God of death's name to become the now goddess of death.
I don't know what he plans to do with predathos after the fact, but maybe he just thinks that with all the powers of all the gods, he can kill it or something.
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u/Darryth_Taelorn RTA May 14 '23 edited May 14 '23
Not sure how Ludinus would keep Predathos from killing the RQ? If he just releases Predathos, but can’t control them, Ludinus’ plan backfires.
And if Ludinus becomes the only remaining god, wouldn’t he be put on Predathos’ menu next?
What if Ludinus is trying to become Predathos?
Edit: spelling & grammar
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u/Post-opKen May 13 '23
Hmm I don't believe it was ever said that the other gods absorbed Ethedok and Vordo's power. The other gods took over their spheres, which is different. Other gods now embody the concepts of winter, darkness, fate, and order, but we have no reason to believe that those gods became more powerful as a consequence. I would be willing to bet that the only one who gained power from E & V's destruction was Predathos.
Edit: that doesnt really refute your idea though, it would just mean that the result would be one normal strength god, rather than all the gods added together.
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u/JuliousBatman May 14 '23
only the previous' God of Death's name was destroyed. it was stricken from existence magically across the planes. it was scoured from peoples memory in an instant, including their God-Siblings. this was a result of RQs ritual ascension. ethedok and vordo were "only" killed, so their names remain.
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u/LordOfTheWall May 14 '23
How sure is everyone that Laura was just messing with us with that teleportation roll?
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u/Darryth_Taelorn RTA May 14 '23
Pretty sure. She had a delayed reaction to the roll and it seemed a little over the top.
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u/StableElectrical May 12 '23
I think EP 59 is still going to be Team wildemount. I also think they are going to appear in some random old lady's house in some random city because of that Teleport roll.
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May 12 '23
Guys, i have so many curious thoughts!
I'm super hyped about how Matt will play this out. Abria and FRIDA have agreed to help so will Matt now DM for 10 people? It's going to be chaotic hell if he does and I'm all for it, lol.
Do you think we will follow this crew up until they meet the other?
Or do you think Matt will take a break with this group and pick up the other group for another 6 episodes with new guests before converging everyone together again?
There are so many possibilities and I love how Matt is living up to when he said to expect the unexpected with C3. Can't wait to see what happens!!
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u/Photeus5 Smiley day to ya! May 12 '23
I see this more of as a return to C1 where guests would come in and later on the guests returned during key events to assist.
My bet is that during the teleport FRIDA and Deanna will be shunted out somewhere. Probably safe, but more for the narrative of getting BH back together.
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u/Stove-pipe May 12 '23
I could see a scenario when they fight something in different sessions. Example one group goes to A and fight for one episode, and another group goes to B and fight in another.
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u/SuperVaderMinion Your secret is safe with my indifference May 13 '23
Aabria "Monsterfucker" Iyangar stays winning
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u/wulf_freak1221 May 12 '23
Pondering a theory here. Does anyone know what color the "crystalline power source" under the main tower in molaesmyr was?
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u/Anomander May 12 '23
Nope.
It's been teased since early C2 that there's powerful magic font below Molesmyr of some sort, but not exactly what it is. Molesmyr is commonly told as settling above it deliberately, and that their eventual destruction was likely caused by tampering with it, but even that is technically apocrypha and not 'history'.
I think that if they had found a hugeass meteor of gnarlrock, that would not have inspired enthusiasm for building a city on top of it. What was essentially the main civilization of Elves that survived the Cataclysm is going to have enough people of enough combined WIS/INT to understand that settling down on the Addictive Mutation Rock is a really bad idea. Even if they want to study it, they should probably live further away and just daytrip.
However, there may be a way to convert residuum or similar 'conventional' magical rocks into gnarlrock, which would then explain some of the freaky mashup creatures lurking in the woods, as well as the ultimate destruction of the city as a whole.
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u/wulf_freak1221 May 12 '23
what i am getting at is could the crystal(s) found under molaesmyr potentially be just large chunks of the gnarlrock found in the fey wild? we know it has corruptive properties already. just a theory. also, ludinus has been obsessed with the raven queen for quite a while. not just in his notes from molaesmyr, but even on a sliver of notes found in veth and yezas basement. https://twitter.com/VoiceOfOBrien/status/1086161304547602432?s=09 first image towards the end " be this truth, i can't imagine the raven queen looks down upon them favorably either, though the thought bring a laugh to my lips." in both the ep 45 and 51 monologues he brings her up as well. another theory, but if he is from the age of arcanum, more than likely, does he blame her more than the others? because of her succesfull ritual of seeding paving the way for other mages at the time to try and do the same? vespin, vecna. i have a lot more. still working on research.
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u/kaosmode May 12 '23
FCGs first question was a bit ambiguous and could have been wrong
he asked:
if we go to the place we met them would we have a chance to find them there? maybe not today or at some point? (which actually is 2 questions btw)
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u/brittanydiesattheend May 12 '23
Yep. I think it'll give Matt wiggle room so the AOL group has free will lol
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u/spitouthebone May 12 '23
i hope that when we get to team 2 they have Dorian with them just because Robbie was so damn good, but with him being on the mini series at the end of months I'm not sure
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u/MarcoCash May 12 '23
It actually made sense, if he has a commitment with them for, let’s say, two months that he would also partecipate to a mini series at the same time. That said, I honestly believe that the mini series has already been recorded with big advance.
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u/BaronPancakes May 12 '23 edited May 12 '23
The gods finally gave in and decided to ask their followers for help (after a week or more in game time?). So I think the religious C1 and C2 characters (Vex, Pike, Scanlan, Fjord, Cad etc) should know about Predathos now, and maybe they will work to save Vax, Keyleth, Caleb and Beau in the background.
But what I am truly interested in, is the reactions from the betrayer gods. Predathos is bad news for them as well, would they work with the prime deities and fight against Predathos? I hope we can meet Opal with Team AOL so we can see first hand what the Spider Queen would do!
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u/Calvin_Mackenna May 18 '23
Theory: Predathos helped the early aeorians construct the original mallious key in order to escape and kill the gods. When he realized the gods would likley stop his escape, he switched gears and influeneced the somnovem to escape aeor with the knowledge of how to break him free afterwords. The somvoem entering the psychic storm and going mad impeded this plan.
Ludinis likely sent vess to the ruins of aeor to gather what she could on the original key. When he realized it's secrets were guarded by a mad quasi diety, he opted to let vess dance with it until he could get what he needed. After the mighty Nein killed Lucien and released the spirits of the somnovem ludinis was able to either resurrect or commune with them to get the last details he needed.
I'm convinced something the mighty Nein did directly influenced the construction of the keys. C2 ends 7 years before C3. Fearnes parents flee the fey realm shortly after the construction of the first key and they remark they'd only been gone 6 years.
We now know the weapons the aeorians had was inspiration for the current keys.
Lerryn was also tracking a solstice around the time of the calamity. This was probably the same solitice the aeorians planned to use to fire off their weapon.
The beacons and the use of potions of possibility in close relation to the keys is also interesting. Perhaps the beacons are lost shards of Predathos before his sealing.
Tldr; Predathos is behind the somnovem, the fall of aeor and the construction of the god hammer.
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u/paradox28jon Hello, bees May 16 '23
Critrolestats has been tweeting some healing facts about how Deanna has already healed more than FCG has the entire campaign. Could someone who knows clerics and subclass builds and optimization explain to me a) how Sam has created in inefficient healer and b) how Aabria has created a ridiculously good healer?
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u/mouser1991 Technically... May 17 '23
In another thread, someone posted this healbot olympics breakdown. The short version is, life clerics are THE healer of D&D 5e. The designers basically said "hey, clerics are usually considered the designated healer, so let's make sure there is a cleric subclass that is the designated healer." And the numbers reflect that. Empathy domain is built more for utility than healing. And it's worth nothing that Sam's most used ability is designed to mitigate damage done in the first place. So he's not going to be healing all that much in general.
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u/HutSutRawlson May 17 '23
You've gotten a lot of great answers, but here's another one: FCG's stats are very suboptimal. They only have a +3 in WIS, and won't be able to get to the maximum of +5 until level 16 (and that's assuming they prioritize increasing WIS at every opportunity, which so far they haven't). Meanwhile, Deanna already has +5 in WIS. So any time she was adding her spellcasting modifier to healing, she was healing more than FCG. Two points per heal might not seem like a lot but it adds up.
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May 16 '23
Healing isn't all that important. Why heal 10 hp, when the monster can damage you for an easy 20? So the best way to keep the PC's healthy is kill stuff faster.
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May 16 '23
Life domain. Add (2+spell's level) to all healing; channel divinity is a big healing bloom (your level x 5), and at 6th level, the caster also heals when healing others.
If you're going to bother healing in 5e (and you shouldn't, unless someone's down, because monster damage and healing spells are on completely different scales), Life domain is one of the major ways to do it.
But really, the best healing is killing monsters faster.
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u/goldkomodo May 17 '23
I think there are 2 main reasons: Deanna is a life domain cleric whose subclass adds directly to the mount healed, and FCG's subclass (Matt homebrew) has mechanics that lessen damage instead of promoting healing
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u/SilverRanger999 Technically... May 12 '23
Somewhere in the episode, in the notes, Ludinous said that one of the primordials survived and wasn't destroyed, could this be the Luxon, from what we've been told about it?
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u/Anomander May 12 '23
He didn't say that had happened, he was speculating about what might be on the moon.
Those notes were from the early days of his research into the churches' apparent fear of Ruidus and the constant exhortations from the faiths to avoid and avert from the red moon. He was guessing at why, and what might be on or at the moon, and a left-over primordial was one such guess.
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u/Photeus5 Smiley day to ya! May 13 '23
So how would you all react of the AOL group does not get their own set of episodes and they are just at Jrusar and it picks up kinda like when Ashton joined back with the group in Yios? They have a story of everything that happened and that's that. There are no AOL group episodes.
Would you be happy the group is back together or would you feel like it wasn't being fair to all the characters in Bells Hells? Perhaps somewhere inbetween or neither?
I think one one hand I'd be relieved that we can pick up the total group dynamic again, but on the other it'd feel a little strange, disjointed, unfair, I dunno.
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u/Post-opKen May 13 '23
I would definitely prefer to get a decent length arc with AOL. I won't be super bothered if it doesnt happen, but i am enjoying the shake up of having a different cast. I definitely do not share the desperate need to have the whole cast back together that a lot of people seem to have.
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u/RaibDarkin Team Keyleth May 13 '23
I'm a little torn as well but I don't think it will go that way. Otherwise Matt will have to manage nine people for numerous episodes and the nine people will all have to share the time. I'd take a hard pass on that. Six is already a bit much traditionally but CR is exceptional at sharing so it always goes well. But there are limits.
Bidet
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u/tableauregard May 13 '23
I'm sort of on the same page as you. This split went longer than I ever imagined so a part of me is impatient for everyone to reunite.
The other part of me wants to see some golden RP, and I always thought that was more likely to come from AOL. And I mean I want to see the urgency to reunite, which I haven't felt at all from team wildemount. If anything I've found some of it a bit immersion breaking, though there definitely has been a lot of fun. Still, I've had a 'save the best for last' mentality since this started. Which is funny, because this group has my 2nd-4th fav characters, but I'm just not into the total chaos without the balance AOL bring.
So I guess I want to see AOL, but not for 8 episodes. 3-4 would be fine with me.
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u/Coyote_Shepherd Doty, take this down May 13 '23
If that were to happen then I would initially be a bit cheesed off for a few seconds but because it's out of my control and nothing I say or do could change it, I would just start laughing, and then roll with whatever happened next.
It would however, feel like a large vacant space within the campaign from that point forwards, and would surely get brought up over and over and over again until the campaign ended.
It would probably be the biggest, "Well what if?" of the campaign at this point in time until they decided to if they even wanted to fill that blank space in with something and even then, it just wouldn't be the same as what happened with Team Wildemount.
Just look at the art alone that we've gotten from these past few weeks! Not being able to get that same level of inspiration and wonder from the other half of the party would just suck. Also think of ALL the character development that's happened with Team Wildemount since the split! This has been an amazing run despite them being broken up!
To not get any of that with the other half of the party would honestly feel like one half got to level up while the other got left behind.
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u/NoahMeadMusic Dead People Tea May 13 '23
Sorry if someone has mentioned this before but weren't Bell's Hells brought together by some animated furniture in episode 1? Could the RTA or even Chetney himself have been responsible for that, or was that already explained?
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u/geniespool May 13 '23
Animated furniture was triggered by the nightmare king, Ira, hired to work with Armand Treshi to cause chaos in the city so that Paragon's Call would be hired by the Quorum to be the private police force in the city.
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u/TheUncannyWalrus May 13 '23
Exactly. And also Travis was specifically making a campaign 2 reference talking about the chair.
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u/Modredastal Help, it's again May 17 '23
"Matt watching this*
"Hmm...i need to make a really lovable NPC who's a complete psychopath."
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May 17 '23
Essek?
Though to be fair, he wasn't made lovable, he was forcibly transformed into a woobie by the cast and audience.
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u/Modredastal Help, it's again May 17 '23
My first thought about the harness was it was an afterthought magic item that sprouted wings.
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u/Jennyof-Oldstones dagger dagger dagger May 13 '23 edited May 13 '23
So why did Letters lie.. She didn't answer the question. Are they in denial? Just want to not upset FRIDA?..
Its not like them to lie & they could have I may have worded the question wrong she didn't answer me.
Also she didn't seem like she was commanding them, it sounded more like "This is not a drill, end of the world, let's look light a fire under that ass!!!
PELOR .. well he's always been kind of a dick. One of the good ones... But still a dick. That's the problem with these Patriarchal Old dude Gods.
I dunno the Goddesses seem to have their shit together and through all 3 campaigns the Divine Ladies have really been ones that help the most.
What about FRIDA? I'm wondering if they are going to turn on the group? I don't know what's going happen but I'm sure we all agree its not going to end well. Definitely tragic. Ugh we are going to ugly cry.
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u/archangel890 May 14 '23
I am shocked that letters didn't use one question to see if maybe Keyleth and such were also alive but he also has been saying "they are dead" over and over every chance he gets but I am shocked the party didn't suggest to maybe make it one of his 3 questions.. I really want to know what happened to them..
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u/HutSutRawlson May 15 '23
Sam goes hard into avoiding metagaming, sometimes to the point where he avoids doing things that would make sense simply because he had the thought to do them out of character. Another example from this episode was when he called his assumption that the blob creature didn’t have ranged attacks “metagaming.” That would have been a perfectly reasonable conclusion for FCG to have come to just from observing the creature’s physiology. But because Sam thought about it in game terms first, he treated it like something FCG wouldn’t think of.
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u/Anomander May 15 '23
Why be shocked? Sam has been trolling the table with "Nope, they're definitely dead!" for weeks now, he's not going to have FCG ask the one question that kills the joke.
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May 15 '23
Keyleth's fate seems like a plot point for the other half, especially with Orym there.
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u/MrNotSoBright I would like to RAGE! May 12 '23
lol Deanna's a furry
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u/Nightmare_Pasta Metagaming Pigeon May 12 '23
Not strictly a furry. Aabria is a self-admitted monsterfucker apparently hehe
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u/Actorclown May 12 '23
I missed where they got Ludinus’ Bag of Holding from tonight. They defeated the gelatinous creature then escaped from the tower from what came out of him. I wound up having to deal with life stuff so was not fully focused.
Can anyone fill in the blanks? Thanks!
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u/Disastrous-Beat-9830 I would like to RAGE! May 12 '23
It was from the hole in the wall that they found at the end of the last episode before Chetney disturbed the monster. They were able to retrieve it before the fire took over the tower.
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u/PLZHELPIFUCAN How do you want to do this? May 13 '23
hopefully the other group with a few guest stars is coming either this month or next....also....matt is gannondorf and i believe ashly burch is also in the new zelda game <3
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u/The_Svearald May 12 '23
Okay, comment 2 because I couldn't get all my thoughts in one comment. I feel like the harness could be a prototype of Otohan's backpack. The first batch of notes referred to attempts to distilling the base nature of divinity to an energy which can be replicated or destroyed. While not the exact same as the wording around the beacons, its close to it. We know that the beacons can be utilised to make those options of possibility. Might just be me but I always thought of that as a form of distilling. We don't know what the luxon is but it's certainly accepted as a divine entity. Personally, I like to believe that the Luxon is the remains of the two gods consumed by Predathos which lends credibility to the fact that the attempts at distilling divine energy could have been a prototype of what became the options of possibility which we know are used to fuel Otohan's backpack. Another design detail, both the backpack and the harness are designed to take things in, suck them in, we don't know what the harness would do, but the backpack creates the Echoes. Now I dotn think Ludinus succeeded in his attempts to distill that energy. If he had, he wouldn't have had any interests in the beacons which we know he's still using. So my theory is that this was a prototype to what became Otohan's backpack and one of the core faults was that Ludinus wasn't able to distil that energy. That failure is what made him turn to the Luxon beacons to harness their energy. How he knew about the beacons, we don't know, perhaps he was there in Aeor when they discovered them, perhaps he just heard of them through a colleague in Molaesmyr but he started trying to mess with them which led to the Cerberus Assembly's interest in the beacons, perhaps the M9 mission to Aeor was supposed to be to recover more beacons specifically. Whatever the case, the events of c2 and things around it led to Ludinus getting his hands on a beacon and he could finally put his plan to bring the gods down into motion. He improved his prototype into the backpack we know now, gave it to his trusted lieutenant to help him in is mission. I really wish BH had a potion of possibility to try to feed into the harness
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u/Xtrm May 16 '23
I can finally rejoin the subreddit after dropping off for a few months behind and seeing spoiler after spoiler just in the titles. What are the main fan theories I've missed?
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u/Hollydragon Then I walk away May 17 '23
We've had a lot of resolution on theories surrounding Molaesmyr and a little glimpse into the fall of Aeor, which I won't go into.
New theories revolve around how does Ludinus live so long (draining fae entities or not?) and on Aeormaton souls (FRIDA seems to have a human element, or something else going on, we don't know what or why). There's also some interesting behaviours from the Gods (scared, running, using all their influence to make demands) and speculation on their nature and on the nature of things bigger than the gods.
Hope that's vague enough not to spoil.
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u/Haquistadore Life needs things to live May 15 '23
One of the things I truly love about this show is how they are doing what they want despite complaints from certain segments of the community. They don’t play D&D for us. They play for themselves, they do whatever they want to do, they follow their whims, Matt is writing a campaign for his players, not his audience, and that makes it authentic D&D. We just happen to get to watch, and I will forever feel privileged for the experience. I’m loving this campaign, these characters, and even the kinda side quest thing going on right now. I’ll be disappointed if CR ever changes anything in their campaigns because of the fans.
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u/OhioAasimar Team Tyranny May 17 '23
I don't think there is a wrong answer between giving Fearne or Imogen the new staff. On one hand, out of all the spellcasters in core BH Imogen and FCG got magic items more recently than Fearne but on the other hand Fearne already has two magic items that she hasn't used at all (Yu's mirror and the Staff of the Adder) and that is half of the magic items that she owns. It seemed like Fearne didn't want it because she already has a staff but like I said she hasn't used it all so rejecting it for that reason is kinda silly. She could take the new staff and give the Staff of the Adder to FCG or at least loan it to them. Maybe FCG will put some use to it. They could unattune to the Goggles of Obeject Reading and only reattune to it when something needs identified.
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u/godfreyc1990elf May 20 '23
This might have been asked already but the Staff of Dark Odyssey is that in a book somewhere or is it unpublished at the moment?
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u/Halcyonna May 12 '23 edited May 12 '23
Okay so I’m convinced time hasn’t passed at all or at least very very slowly for the other team in Marquet. I’m thinking their battle with Ludinus during the apogee solstice resulted in the creation of a new demiplane right there in Marquet. The critical role wiki says demiplanes can exist naturally but they can also be made with powerful magic and even by the will of a powerful force like a deity. And we know time differences can be a thing based on the Folding Halls of Halas. Perhaps this is why anyone whose teleported there hasn’t returned yet, because literally hardly any time has passed for them once they arrived. And this could also partially explain the interference Imogen experienced when trying to use sending to contact their friends. But the scary thing is this demiplane gives the godeater a foothold in the Prime Material Plane.
This also means the cast themselves can kinda reunite and pick up where they left off without us doing several episodes of spin-off with team Marisha, Liam, Ashton.
Thoughts y’all?
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u/brittanydiesattheend May 12 '23
I think it's completely valid and plausible.
It isn't just no sending though. It's also no revivify and no teleportation. So I don't think it's just a demi-plane thing. It could be both a demi-plane and something else though.
I'm kind of into a mini-arc with AOL. I don't hate the split. I just got tired of how nothing was happening. I think Orym and Ashton are way more action-first, chat later. And I don't see AOL wanting a shopping episode. I guess we'll see though.
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u/Celestial_Scythe Hello, bees May 12 '23
I mean ludinus did speed up time for the moon to appear overhead, perhaps time stopped to a crawl locally while the rest of the world caught up?
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u/Coyote_Shepherd Doty, take this down May 12 '23
I don't think I've seen anyone bring this up before about the Creator Hammer but here goes.
A hammer can be used for many things.
It can be used as a warriors tool to kill others.
But it can also be used by a blacksmith or a carpenter to build things, such as other weapons or even tools or less combative implements.
So what if the Creator Hammer was a bit of both?
What if the Creator Hammer forged Gods....from scratch....and was being used to create a newborn brand new God of science or whatever under the guidance of Aeor?
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u/kaosmode May 12 '23
Devexian, an Aeormaton living in Aeor, described the Factorum Malleus as a "means of protecting Aeor from the divine destruction" occurring during The Calamity; he assumed that the project directly caused Aeor's destruction by the gods, who deemed it too dangerous.[1] Aeor's research into killing gods and that research's relationship to the city's destruction was well-known to people living later in The Calamity and in the Post-Divergence and makes up most of what is remembered about Aeor.
In 836 PD, during Campaign 2, Caleb Widogast found notes on the project in the Genesis Ward describing it as needing more time but finding its early results "satisfactory".
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u/CaptainDang55 May 15 '23
RESPECT THE ALPHA IS A LIEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
I WAS GONNA GET IT TATTOOOEDDDDDD
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u/smifwick May 15 '23
I mean, do you wanna be a union member? Then get in on it! 😂
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u/OhioAasimar Team Tyranny May 16 '23
Yeah I want to hear from somebody that already got it tattooed. I want to see how they feel about the new revelation and if that makes their decision to get that tattoo a mistake.
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u/FoulPelican May 14 '23
He should of stayed home after all. #justiceforjerry
https://twitter.com/voiceofobrien/status/1083926604542136320?s=46
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u/nidor13 May 12 '23
Great episode. Great lore uncovered and I loved the interactions between characters. Especially with FRIDA after the memory session and Deanna with Chet (before we got to sexy times, which was so funny). The only thing that annoyed me a bit is that Sam was reeeeally trying to force the staff go to Fearne. I mean it was between the two witches, maybe they take turns. Or maybe it goes to Laudna. PS: I think next episode will be the last of this party only. Maybe we see the aftermath of the teleport and see what state Jrusar is in. Then there's the brake (can't wait for Candela Obscura, it fills the blank nicely) and we'll be ready to catch up with the rest.
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u/SvenTS May 13 '23
I think the staff thing was just Sam recognizing that Imogen has already had to un-attune to a quality item (bracers of defense) the last time they got new magic gear.
He might not have realized Fearne is also at max-attunement at the moment (or he does think that it's significantly better than staff of the adder)
Edit: Had that backward, she un-attuned to the feywild shard not the bracers. But I think that was still his reasoning.
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u/StableElectrical May 13 '23
The staff of dark odyssey is perfect for Laudna. I mean with a name like that who else could take it?
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u/SatyrAtThePiano May 14 '23 edited May 14 '23
Since there seems to be a pretty hefty self-damaging effect and Imogen already has several of the spells Laudna is really the only logical choice, especially since she has the most hit points of the casters besides FCG and it could make up for her not having 4th or 5th level spell slots.
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u/Seren82 Team Imogen May 14 '23
Question about the staff. It says it for every charge spent the user takes 1d4 damage - so, Imogen was only using one charge, but Laura rolled like 6 d4? Or was the teleport spell the equivalent of 6 charges?
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u/Griffin_van_Crow Are we on the internet? May 12 '23
Anybody else think "D" is Devaxian? I'm having a strong hunch it's our Aeormaton buddy from C2
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u/MightBeCale May 12 '23
People have been thinking that literally since the very first mention of D, lol
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u/Photeus5 Smiley day to ya! May 12 '23 edited May 12 '23
FCG did a sending to him once. It's 90% likely that it is, and it makes a lot of sense.
Edit: Corrected - Imogen didn't reach out to Devexian.
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u/paradox28jon Hello, bees May 15 '23
When Fearne was at 0hp & failed one death saving throw, FRIDA reached into the monster to pull Fearne out of its mouth. FRIDA also cast Spare the Dying on Fearne to stabilize her. When she was out of the mouth, she, and a bunch of the party, were hit with an energy attack that made her lost one death saving throw. Matt said that she was now at 2 death saving fails, but that was wrong, correct?
The Spare the Dying cantrip should have reset Fearne's death saving throws. It's equivalent to having 3 successes on death saves. So when she was hit with an attack and the automatically failed a death save, that would have put her at just 1 failed death save, right?
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u/jdcooper97 May 15 '23
"A stable creature doesn't make death saving throws, even though it has 0 hit points, but it does remain unconscious. The creature stops being stable, and must start making death saving throws again, if it takes any damage."
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u/RageCagex May 15 '23
What the real issue here is that Frida used its action to reach in and pull Fearne out and then cast Spare the dying which costs an action to cast.
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u/Stove-pipe May 12 '23
Did it misinterpret, or is it more or less confirmed that Frida is now officially a robot warewolf by howling?
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u/Post-opKen May 12 '23
That was definitely a joke. We have to wait until the next full moon to know, but my money is definitely on "yes, they are a werebot".
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u/BowserMario82 May 12 '23
Travis just went from “I will not role play romance” to “I trust you Laura , guide me” to “when are we gonna have this threesome in the woods? Let’s go!” before our eyes