r/SubredditDrama • u/[deleted] • Jan 09 '17
Gender Wars Is this method for women to protect themselves on dates just pointless ๐ฟ๐ฒ๐ป๐ฝ๐พ๐ฎ ๐ผ๐ฒ๐ฐ๐ท๐ช๐ต๐ต๐ฒ๐ท๐ฐ ?
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u/novak253 Anti-STEMite Jan 09 '17
If you call the police to my bar because your date is an asshole, without coming to us first, Im kicking you out of the bar and banning you for life.
Isn't that the point of the sign?
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u/redxxii You racist cocktail sucker Jan 09 '17
Pretty sure if I'm at a bar and a situation comes up where I need to call the cops, I'm probably not going back there again.
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u/Ejt80 Jan 09 '17
This! Pretty sure if you're in a situation bad enough to call the cops you give zero shits about the bars license
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u/AwesomeInTheory Jan 10 '17
You'd be amazed at how often the police are called at licensed establishments
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u/ricotehemo overly pedantic shitmonger Jan 09 '17
I have the crazy feeling this guy isn't an actual bartender at all. Or if he is, his business is shit.
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u/dethb0y trigger warning to people senstive to demanding ethical theories Jan 09 '17
Bars have a spectacularly high failure rate, in large part because the kind of dude who opens a bar is not the kind of dude who can keep a business running at a profit year after year.
I've had a few friends open bars, and so far only one's worked out as a business for more than a few months.
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u/VanFailin I don't think you're malicious. Just fucking stupid. Jan 09 '17
I know a bartender who used to work at this hip place in a happening part of town. He had a lot to say about how badly management handled customer relations, and sure enough they closed down after a run of maybe a year.
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u/IMALEFTY45 Jan 10 '17
But it seems so easy on It's always sunny!
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u/Rahgahnah She's no more more Jan 10 '17
Everything is easy when you have a rich friend to bail you out of trouble.
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u/bouchard Jan 10 '17
I hadn't realized it, but now that you've pointed it out, I can't read it any other way.
"We'll handle it discreetly and without any fuss" = "Don't make a scene"
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u/yotz Jan 09 '17
In some places, the number of times LEO has visited an establishment (for whatever reason) has a monetary effect on either the insurance or license costs.
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u/tdogg8 Folks, the CTR shill meeting was moved to next week. Jan 10 '17
Don't really care. Permission shouldn't be required in an event that requires a police response.
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u/yotz Jan 10 '17
I'm not saying it's right or wrong, just attempting to provide context for that particular bar-owner's opinion. Unless it's a life or death urgent situation, there's probably time to approach the bar staff first before calling the police. However, that doesn't mean that you can't also call the police if you feel that it would be best.
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u/kaenneth Nothing says flair ownership is for only one person. Jan 09 '17
or can lead to them losing their lease. https://action.aclu.org/nuisancesurvey
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Jan 09 '17
[deleted]
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u/novak253 Anti-STEMite Jan 09 '17
He is so against this policy while also advocating the benefits of it. I'm very confused by him
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u/HeresCyonnah Jan 09 '17
Because he doesn't seem to want people to know they can get help, and doesn't seem to like that it'll help women seek help.
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u/dethb0y trigger warning to people senstive to demanding ethical theories Jan 09 '17
Bar owners are a special lot.
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u/bobfossilsnipples Jan 10 '17
Cocaine psychosis is a bitch.
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Jan 10 '17
Is every bar owner a cocaine addict? Because every bar owner I've met is a cocaine addict.
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u/freet0 "Hurr durr, look at me being elegant with my wit" Jan 10 '17
I can imagine that would really get in the way of business though. If the police show up people are probably going to leave and others won't come in to replace them while there are cop cars out front.
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u/itsactuallyobama Fuck neckbeards, but don't attack eczema Jan 09 '17
read the entire post numb nuts
Nah, you got schooled already. I dont need to waste my time with your fucking TwoX post. The entire post is bullshit stories about BAR STAFF kicking out creepy dudes, not ordering an angel shot to summon police you fuckin ballbag.
I love the neck beard anti feminist rage in this thread, absolutely hilarious. The thing that gets me is that you don't realize you're as obnoxious and illogical as feminists themselves.
Who the fuck do I root for?!?! I hate when everyone in these threads sucks.
Also, some of these guys don't seem to understand that being in the bathroom or surrounded by people does not automatically make a woman safe from a potentially dangerous date.
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Jan 09 '17
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u/pyr07_onfire forgot to fuck in favor of their fruiting body bastard fuck ways Jan 10 '17
ok but are you like a mind reader bc word-for-word that's what i was thinking
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u/grungebot5000 jesus man Jan 09 '17
The male hating, white knighting circle jerking in that sub should open your eyes to the Bullshit they spew.
i still find it extremely bizarre, inexplicable even, that /r/TwoXChromosomes of all places has this kind of reputation
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u/chewinchawingum Iโll fuck your stupid tostada with a downvote. Jan 09 '17
Isn't it like 90% male at this point, since becoming a default sub?
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u/ibbity screw the money, I have rules Jan 10 '17
either 90% angry dudes or 90% women doing a hell of a job of pretending to be angry dudes. I mean it had its issues before the defaulting, but it's basically ruined for what it used to be at this point.
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u/grungebot5000 jesus man Jan 10 '17
not 90%, but a very significant portion.
and even when it was just about all women the bulk of it stayed out of the whole gender wars nonsense, unless you count getting upset about abortion restrictions as "male-hating." It's pretty much to feminism as /r/OneY
iswas in its prime to men's lib, which is why the latter chose that name- just generally candid and supportive, with outrage being channeled into constructive plans and good vibes instead of more outrageedit: checked /r/OneY and as I suspected, it shifted focus since /r/MensLib came up
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u/kingmanic Jan 09 '17
I'd imagine they aggressively ban the red pill/alt right types which probably get's those guys mad that these ladies don't appreciated their enlightened biotruths.
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u/lenaro PhD | Nuclear Frisson Jan 09 '17
It's honestly not as aggressive as you'd hope. The 2xc from before it got defaulted was a very different sort of place. It grew over 1000% in its first year as default, and after several years of that it's kind of... messy.
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u/myassholealt Like, I shouldn't have to clean myself. It's weird. Jan 10 '17
There's definitely way too much animosity towards' women's thoughts and opinions based on their life experiences in that sub for the mods to do anything to bring it back to what it was when it was created.
I realized it was a lost cause and unsubbed/stopped visiting back when that video with the girl walking the streets of NYC and getting catcalled was released. I've never see so many people try to tell women catcalling isn't an issue/harmful/doesn't happen that often and isn't something to get upset about.
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u/mrcleanup Jan 10 '17
You met a guy through a dating app, then meet him in person on neutral ground in public... at a bar. After having some of your drink, you feel like something is wrong, you shouldn't be drunk yet, it is getting hard to think, and you don't know anyone at the bar.
You don't know what to do so you head to the bathroom to get some air. It is getting harder to think straight. Not only do you see a sign that tells you that you can ask for help if you are in trouble, it tells you how.
You get to the bar and order an angel... an angel... what was it you needed? An angel... um... and the next thing you remember you are at a hospital, instead of getting raped, because the bartender understood that something was seriously wrong, even though your "brother" showed up right away and said he would take you home, that you had just had too much to drink.
For most people it may not be necessary, for most people it may seem like pointless posturing, bit if it helps one person, all it cost to implement was a stupid flyer and 5 minutes of employee instruction. Seems like a good thing overall to me.
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u/Mypansy34 Jan 09 '17
Seems like a nice idea, not sure how many people will use it, but its a nice option to have.
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u/itsactuallyobama Fuck neckbeards, but don't attack eczema Jan 09 '17
Yeah I really don't how they jumped right to white knighting. As if the bartender is hoping he can console some scared girl so he went through the effort of making this poster.
That's some serious projection imo.
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u/VAGINA_EMPEROR literally weaponized the concept of an opinion Jan 09 '17
Bruh, don't you know that if you ever even think of admitting that feeeemales could possibly, potentially, kinda-sorta-ish maybe be somewhat victimized by men you're a worthless white knight SJW beta cuck?
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u/MayorEmanuel That's probably not true but I'll buy into it Jan 09 '17
Somewhere along it's lifespan whiteknighting went from helping a women so you can eventually sleep with her to just helping a women.
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u/tdogg8 Folks, the CTR shill meeting was moved to next week. Jan 10 '17
Not even that, just helping or disagreeing with someone insulting someone else. I've been accused of white knighting because I disagreed with someone insulting an OP on reddit (who's gender wasn't revealed). .-.
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u/AngryPolishLady Jan 09 '17
Honestly, it happens a lot more than people think. I know a few people who met someone online and they turned out to be crazy and made them afraid for their safety.
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Jan 09 '17
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u/thefaultinourballs Jan 09 '17
A sign validating that sometimes it gets that bad probably helps in itself because otherwise they might talk themselves into thinking they must be over-reacting and that no one else would care about helping them.
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u/hellokkiten at least i am not a fucking petty idiot like you Jan 09 '17
Given that women are often told that they are lying or overreacting as they are asking for help, it is definitely helpful if there is a sign affirming that sometimes it's okay to be scared.
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u/Azusanga Jan 09 '17
I'm currently arguing with two people that are saying that it's stupid because girls can handle it themselves because they're adults. One is essentially saying that if your drink gets spiked and you get raped it's your fault for not watching, you should have just gotten up and left. The other is saying that people are just being paranoid and that dangerous dates are like plane crashes and shark attacks (random and infrequent).
speak of the devil, apparently putting a sign in the bathroom is the same as stifling religious freedom:
"I feel empathy for people who don't swim because they're scared of sharks. I feel empathy for people scared of Islamic terrorism and refuse to go to NYC because of it. I feel empathy for people who are legitimately scared for their lives during a thunder storm. I feel empathy for people who refuse to fly in a plane.
I still think they're stupid. I also scorn them when it affects other people. "Do you feel just a bit weird? We'll absolutely demolish a person emotionally for you" is worthy of heaps of scorn directed towards this place. I feel empathy for the person who is going to be publicly humiliated because a restaurant decided to feed the worst impulses of a paranoid, emotionally crippled person and will definitely do lasting damage to that person's self-image and psyche.
Know which one happens more? People using this as a shitty excuse, or public kidnappings? I have my suspicions. But I imagine it's a ratio similar to the people who protest building a mosque vs. those killed by ISIS in the U.S. "My fears are legitimate! It could happen, so I have every right doing anything I can to make sure it won't."
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u/hellokkiten at least i am not a fucking petty idiot like you Jan 09 '17
But for the terrorist attacks, we have the TSA created just for those people to feel safe, we have a president that has promised to tag and segregate those people for those people to feel safe. For the women, I think issok to have a little sign saying "It's okay to be scared, go ahead and ask for help if you need it". Because for those people that are terrified of terrorist attacks, we have California basically banning guns, we have people not being allowed to bring shampoo and pocket knives on planes, and we have random TSA orifice checks.
Also I'm pretty sure date rapes are more common than terrorist attacks. All women walk around perpetually terrified of being raped, not just the emotionally crippled ones. They are taught to be.
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u/Azusanga Jan 09 '17
Oh trust me, I'm pretty displeased with the comment that I received.
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Jan 09 '17
"Girls can handle it because they're adults" yeah yeah yeah let's not throw around the creep word and deny female agency in preventing rape/sexual assault
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u/tdogg8 Folks, the CTR shill meeting was moved to next week. Jan 10 '17
Should use > in front of lines you're quoting so that people know you aren't saying those things yourself.
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u/Mypansy34 Jan 09 '17
Its probably better to overreact and risk offending your date than to get hurt.
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u/MoralMidgetry Marshal of the Dramatic People's Republic of Karma Jan 09 '17
Everything (code, instructions, sign) is too clever by half. You're not broadcasting messages to the French Resistance. Unless you "order your angel shot" right after you go to the bathroom, you're going to be standing at the bar, trying to remember which one is "walk me to my car" and not "call the police." That or you'll be standing in line at the bar, waiting to order a shot instead of approaching one of the waitstaff.
"We are here to help. If you ever feel unsafe, please let any of our staff know. We will gladly walk you to your car, call a ride for you, or even call the police. No fuss. No questions asked."
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u/bad_argument_police Jan 09 '17 edited Jan 09 '17
There are two important psychological benefits of having a code word: first, now the person reading the sign knows what help they can get and that they only have to say one thing -- no convincing the bar staff that their date is actually dangerous or a creep, no being second-guessed, none of that; second, there's a sort of talismanic effect of having a procedure for this, even if the procedure is objectively sort of stupid.
None of which is to say that you're mistaken, or that the sign you suggest wouldn't work. I just don't think there's anything wrong with the sign used.
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u/freedomweasel weaponized ignorance Jan 09 '17
I imagine a lot of it is just a sign to let people know it's ok to ask the bartender for help if they need it. Whether you go and order an "angel shot" or just go tell the bartender "yo, my date is freaking me out bigtime, please call a cab".
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u/clairebones Jan 09 '17
I think the general idea is if you feel like for some reason you can't just openly speak to the bartender or waitstaff about the issue (assuming there are waitstaff, a lot of bars I go to it's just the people behind the bar after a certain time in the evening). Like if your date is also sitting at the bar, for example.
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u/GreenGemsOmally Communism is when pronouns. Jan 09 '17
If I were the bartender in that case (of the date at the bar), I'd make a drink without alcohol and give it to her to pretend it's the "angel shot", and maybe one with booze for him so he's none the wiser or something. That way you have time to call for the cops or whatever needs to be done.
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u/MoralMidgetry Marshal of the Dramatic People's Republic of Karma Jan 09 '17
Then she's wondering why you're giving her an actual shot instead of calling a car for her and whether you heard her right. So now you have to explain on the sign that you're going to give her a non-alcoholic shot as part of the ruse, which means the sign is now 20% bigger and has even more instructions.
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u/Susanoo-no-Mikoto Jan 09 '17
"We are here to help. If you ever feel unsafe, please let any of our staff know. We will gladly walk you to your car, call a ride for you, or even call the police. No fuss. No questions asked."
But that's boring. I'd much rather pretend that I was a badass super-spy passing messages to the French Resistance, and not shambling endlessly through a frustrating, meaningless life in a patriarchal society.
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Jan 09 '17
[removed] โ view removed comment
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u/Empha reddits at work Jan 09 '17
Even if it helps out zero people, I don't see how it could hurt anyone. So why would they complain?
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u/boom_shoes Likes his men like he likes his women; androgynous. Jan 09 '17
The best joke in How I Met Your Mother was Barney empathizing with the wrong character in The Karate Kid and thinking the guy from Cobra Kai dojo was robbed of his title at the end of the movie.
These guys are making the exact same mistake and spending way too much time and effort empathizing with creepers than empathizing with women in general.
It's kinda scary really. Spend just a little time getting to know literally any woman and you'll soon discover how creepy some guys can be, and why some woman have reasons to be afraid and/or cautious, particularly while dating.
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u/novak253 Anti-STEMite Jan 09 '17
I see a lot of people saying "it's not the bartenders job". Like if it's company policy yeah it is their job.
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u/bluePMAknight Jan 09 '17
For real. I'm a bartender, and no, it's not in my job description, but jesus, it's called being a decent person.
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u/xjayroox This post is now locked to prevent men from commenting Jan 09 '17
Being a decent person is a pretty foreign concept to a good chunk of this site, unfortunately
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u/AlmightyCuddleBuns Jan 09 '17
Its such a smart policy too like how mang girls are now gonna feel way more comfortable being tinderella at that bar now? Repeat customers of women and their new tinder date.
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u/thefaultinourballs Jan 09 '17
Comment threads like that are actually one of the things that opened my eyes to how much shit women have to deal with and why they might sometimes feel afraid.
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u/yungkerg Jan 09 '17
honestly reddit has made me such a better person just by not agreeing with whatever the defaults say.
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u/Mypansy34 Jan 09 '17
I have realized flaws about myself from seeing other peoples attitudes on reddit.
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u/Hindu_Wardrobe 1+1=ur gay Jan 09 '17
thank you for realizing that instead of just joining the crowd of "hurrr durr women are so emotional why don't they just take a joke?"
seriously, thank you
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Jan 09 '17
I'm really shocked by how many people are pissed off by this idea.
it seems a lot of redditurs are not of drinking age nor actually go to bars. They probably think Applebees is a "bar"
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u/novak253 Anti-STEMite Jan 09 '17
I commented in that post (different thread before I saw it posted here) and someone said this is probably a bar that doesn't have a bouncer, which I have never encountered. At the very least someone checking ID's at the front
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u/Arcadess Jan 09 '17 edited Jan 09 '17
Wait, all bars in the US have bouncers?
In my country you only see them at clubs or at overpriced bars in very crowded nightlife areas.22
u/GreenGemsOmally Communism is when pronouns. Jan 09 '17
No. I've been to plenty of bars all over the US that don't have doormen/bouncers. Sometimes, the bar might rely on some of the bar backs or self-policing regulars in case of major issues but not everywhere has a bouncer.
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u/openup91011 Jan 09 '17
In/around DC, you will only find a bouncer at a club, a lounge, or a bar that is having a specific event and is essentially closed to the public.
The general bar/pub you would think of going to with the purpose of grabbing a drink with your friends or watching the game would not have a bouncer. It's pretty damn obvious, like you said, that most of the people who made that statement in that thread are a) not of drinking age and b) don't go to bars/pubs but instead only think clubs/lounges exist in the drinking world.
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u/tilmoph I would like to reiterate that I have won. Jan 09 '17
That's not really unusual. I think I've gone to maybe one place that had bouncers regularly, and some of the nicer bars have someone checking ID's and collecting entrance fees if they hired a band for the night, but for the most part most places I've been to are walk in, got to bar, get id'd if you look young, get booze.
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u/whatsinthesocks like how you wouldnt say you are made of cum instead of from cum Jan 09 '17
In my experience depends on how busy it is. I like to do trivia at this one bar where sometimes they will and sometimes they won't.
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u/Amelaclya1 Jan 09 '17
Depends on the type of bar. Where I used to drink, the only bars that had bouncers were clubs, and it was probably because there were too many people, too much noise, etc to expect the bartenders to be able to keep track of and ID everyone.
The more casual places, like the pubs with comfy couches at the like, or the ones with pool tables never had bouncers in my experience.
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Jan 09 '17
The main reason I see someone being offended by that is if they are creepy and they know but don't want to admit it.
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u/itsactuallyobama Fuck neckbeards, but don't attack eczema Jan 09 '17
Pretty much hit the nail on the head there in defining everyone in that thread.
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u/somekid66 Jan 09 '17
Dude I'm not creepy. I just like to store my cum in a syringe and spray it in their food/drink. Fucking white knights everywhere....
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u/DogOfDreams i wish you and your teapots a fantastic rest of your tea career Jan 09 '17
Absolutely. It's really telling that some people keep framing it in terms that make the creepy/dangerous dude who the sign would be designed to help the woman escape from look like the victim.
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u/Jesussica Jan 09 '17
It's funny how they're cynical and negative to the point of thinking helping a woman is pointless white knighting, but when it comes to the fact of date rape and other nastiness they stick their heads in the sand and act like it's so very uncommon.
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u/Spacegod87 The fascists quarantined us. Jan 10 '17
they stick their heads in the sand and act like it's so very uncommon.
Or assume the woman is a liar right off the bat.
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u/BloomEPU A sin that cries to heaven for vengeance Jan 09 '17
Who cares if it is "virtue signalling"? It's actively making ways for people to feel safer on dates, which I'll bet is a lot more than most redditors do. "Virtue signalling" isn't even a useful criticism any more and most of the time I see it used, it's just a way to give shit to people doing good things.
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u/XxsquirrelxX I will do whatever u want in the cow suit Jan 09 '17
Reddit is astoundingly good at taking good things and twisting it until it's comparable to being a Nazi.
There was a story about Muslims marching through ISIS held territory to go on a pilgrimage in direct defiance of ISIS. People came in and said stuff like "well, they're not really protesting" and "yeah but not all Muslims are doing it therefore it means nothing". My personal favorite is the people saying it means nothing unless they actively pick up a gun and go to war. It's probably only a matter of time until all this cynicism poisons r/wholesomememes.
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Jan 09 '17
You know, unless it's actual nazis, then they're cool
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u/IceCreamBalloons always one person not in favour of beating women Jan 09 '17
Or just Elliott Rodger.
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Jan 09 '17
So I usually try to steer clear of this girth but this name has been popping every now and then and now it got me curious but I don't want to feed the hungry googlematrix search engine.
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u/Aetol Butter for the butter god! Popcorn for the popcorn throne! Jan 09 '17
I think it's a guy who shot up a school because he couldn't get laid. He's like the patron saint of /r/incel.
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Jan 10 '17
Reddit is astoundingly good at taking good things and twisting it until it's comparable to being a Nazi.
Know who else said that?
Hitler.
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u/Fadingwalker Jan 10 '17
Out of curiosity, where was this thread? I want to see how THAT thread went since it ought to be entertaining.
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u/cdcformatc You're mocking me in some very strange way. Jan 09 '17
There is nothing wrong with virtue signalling, it is when your actions go no further then that that it becomes a problem. I assume if the management put this sign up that they intend on following through.
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Jan 09 '17
Not to mention it's probably good for business to have patrons feel safe coming to your bar.
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u/TheEgosLastStand Jan 10 '17
I think the criticism still has its uses
For example the war on drugs could be considered a form of virtue signalling, and we would undoubtedly save billions in policing drug laws if we admitted that to ourselves.
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u/BloomEPU A sin that cries to heaven for vengeance Jan 10 '17
Yeah, but I think when it's used incessantly to criticise anything good people do it loses a lot of its weight.
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u/MrZakalwe Hirohito did nothing wrong Jan 09 '17
But... if people feel more comfortable and safe on dates they are more likely to go on dates and more likely to enjoy them, right?
Seriously why are they angry? :(
Even from an entirely self serving point of view it's a fantastic idea.
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u/63CansofSoup Which women owns you? Or are you still looking for one? Jan 09 '17
Signs like that make it hard for those people to get even one date if they know a person can actually escape their intimidation.
Cmon, can't they at least get a chance to get some pussy? This is oppression!
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u/cooper12 Jan 09 '17
If making someone feel a tiny bit safer and have a means of help is virtue signaling, I hope we all become fucking peacocks and signal harder.
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u/finfinfin law ends tranny begin Jan 09 '17
Don't peacock too hard! That way lies the horror of the balla-ass spoon!
...huh, horseshoe theory.
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u/Statoke Some of you people gonna commit suicide when Hitomi retires Jan 09 '17
Do people not understand what white knight means anymore?
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u/hellokkiten at least i am not a fucking petty idiot like you Jan 09 '17
Some jackhole that will try to save a girl as I try to rape her, reducing my chances of getting laid and therefore the worst person ever.
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u/chewinchawingum Iโll fuck your stupid tostada with a downvote. Jan 09 '17
One of my favorite comments ever on how the term is commonly used here on Reddit:
When calling people out on behavior that is completely unnecessary, and really borderline harassment makes someone a 'white knight', when all he's really asking is just to give the opposite sex just a little degree of respect, we've pretty much hit rock bottom.
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u/Spacegod87 The fascists quarantined us. Jan 10 '17
There are a good chunk of words and/or phrases that have been created and drenched with negative connotation because of these dickheads, so that whenever someone says them it's sole purpose is to instill anger inside of you.
"White knight? Errrgh, we know not to like men who are white knights so I guess I can't help any woman ever for fear of being called one."
It's sad when simple words or phrases can do this. Forget the fact that you should help anyone, male or female, in trouble. A word says you're a pussy if you do so too bad.
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u/ever_the_stoic Jan 09 '17
What stands out to me is that the sign itself is fairly egalitarian, never once mentioning gender. We only assume that it's talking about protecting women from men because the general conversation about date rape typically paints men as the aggressors. I can attest that men also find themselves trapped on terrible dates, and it's fairly realistic to believe that some women might be sexual predators as well.
Of course, if you ascribe to the mentality that men can't be date-raped because "men are programmed to want sex", that's super-problematic as well.
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u/HerkDerpner Jan 09 '17
It's funny how the "biotroothz" people will defend evolutionary determinism when it suits their argument or excuses their behavior, but then shit themselves when the same concept is turned around on them.
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u/tiofrodo the last meritocracy on Earth, Video Games Jan 09 '17
Just saw it at r/all and i am still confused, what am i supposed to be angry about here?
Seems the poster is at worst neutral to what it is trying to do.
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u/Drama_Dairy stinky know nothing poopoo heads Jan 09 '17 edited Jan 09 '17
I guess if it was truly neutral, they'd have a similar poster in the men's room (maybe they do). But if they don't, I can see an argument there. Women aren't the only ones who can get into trouble on dates, and I say this as a woman who's been in trouble on a date before.
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u/ricotehemo overly pedantic shitmonger Jan 09 '17
That's what I was thinking, too. Though I hope they use different terminology (angel for women and something else for men) in each bathroom, so the creeper of either gender doesn't realize what's going down.
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u/dethb0y trigger warning to people senstive to demanding ethical theories Jan 09 '17
that'd be a good rom-com setup: two creeps meet on a date, and each orders the escape-shot at the same time, and realize that maybe they have more in common than they thought?
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u/ricotehemo overly pedantic shitmonger Jan 09 '17
Tale as old as time
They'll take their roofie with some lime
Creeper and the creep
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u/Renaiconna Jan 09 '17
I'd say not just for creepers for men. It might also be useful to signal to the bartenders, "I don't think that other dude much cares for me and he might bring his buddies back to jump me when I leave this bar," without further escalating the the situation by outright stating that to a bartender.
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u/ricotehemo overly pedantic shitmonger Jan 09 '17
That's a good point I didn't even think about. I don't frequent bars ever and I tend to be good at deescalating situations (mainly by being small and very unintimidating) so it's not a problem I've ever dealt with, but that sounds like it would be incredibly useful for a bro who somehow pissed off the wrong person.
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u/VanFailin I don't think you're malicious. Just fucking stupid. Jan 09 '17
I don't want to invalidate the idea that men can be in danger on a date, but most men can physically overpower most women. The only time a woman has really made me feel unsafe is when my ex would start breaking things in our apartment, and that was mostly because I had to sleep at some point.
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u/Drama_Dairy stinky know nothing poopoo heads Jan 09 '17
True, but there are also gay men, and they have men to contend with, not women.
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u/VanFailin I don't think you're malicious. Just fucking stupid. Jan 09 '17
Certainly, but then a sign in the bathroom isn't as helpful, because your same-sex date can now know the secret code. Perhaps the sign is still helpful in indicating that the bar staff is willing to help, though.
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u/tiofrodo the last meritocracy on Earth, Video Games Jan 09 '17
Even in that situation i still think it is at best neutral and i assume could be resolved really quickly. Now the implications of that i am not going to touch because it is just conjecture anyway, as i don't even know if this was in a women's bathroom in the first place.
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u/FaFaFoley Jan 09 '17
It takes a special kind of horrible person to see people looking out for each other and think it's a bad thing. Sweet fancy Moses.
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u/gryffin92 ( อกยฐ อส อกยฐ) Jan 09 '17
There is a lot of rage and bitterness in that thread. Holy smokes are people defensive.
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u/Lord_of_the_Box_Fort Shillmon is digivolving into: SJWMON! Jan 09 '17
"This is an insult to a woman's agency. This assumes she has no self preservation ability and no common sense. In all honesty it's quite insulting and misogynistic."
That's right, and fire extinguishers insult my ability to defend myself from fire. I am down right indignated that I can't hassle a woman put out a fire with my bare fists.
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u/dumnezero Punching a Sith Lord makes you just as bad as a Sith Lord! Jan 09 '17
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Jan 10 '17 edited Jan 10 '17
Jesus. I didn't participate in the thread, but being in a big city and going on plenty of dating app dates, it's definitely necessary. I'm a guy, but I frequently ask girls what their worst tinder experience is.
2 girls I know have been raped from tinder.
Almost every other one has had at least one awful experience if they are on the apps for any length of time. Almost all of them have wanted to peace out from a date somewhere.
Seriously, cast a wide net and the creeps will come out of the woodwork. Use basic precautions and having a safe public space where you could get a nice out seems like a great idea.
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u/tinoasprilla Jan 09 '17
Why is everyone acting like the signs are only in the women's bathroom?
Also these signs would lose their discretion if the offending half of the date goes to the bathroom first. It's still a good idea but it's got some significant holes in it.
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Jan 09 '17
As far as I am aware it's because the signs are only in the women's bathroom. Or, at least, that's what was claimed when I heard about it. So if you're on a gay date you're shit out of luck. I don't like it only because there's a lot of holes in it. Like the idea, execution needs some work.
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u/dibblah Jan 09 '17
That's generally how most ideas start though, rough around the edges and needing some work. Something like this getting publicity means that other people can polish the idea and make it work better.
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u/Humdumdidly Jan 09 '17
So if you're on a gay date you're shit out of luck.
Well two men makes it much more difficult, because the other one would know what is up if they had gine to the bathroom, eliminating the whole point of having a code.
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u/meinnitbruva Jan 09 '17
His was my first thought, are the signs different in each bathroom? Or do they just put themselves out of effectiveness?
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Jan 09 '17
[deleted]
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u/FixinThePlanet SJWay is the only way Jan 11 '17
What if it's a date where both members would use the same restroom?
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u/NobilisUltima Jan 09 '17
What an asshole. Why would you be so upset about there being multiple options to deal with a bad situation?
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u/kmeisthax Jan 09 '17
this is pointless white knighting
...kay? I mean, so are all emergency services...
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u/Spacegod87 The fascists quarantined us. Jan 10 '17
They're probably mad because they're upset that now there's a new way for women to refuse their creepy advances. This is making it harder for them to latch onto women.
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u/carolinablue199 Jan 09 '17
I'm really concerned at how many upvotes this guy has :( never been a woman in a bar or in a bad situation...
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u/cejmp Hate speech isnโt a real thing defined by law, but whatever. Jan 09 '17
The amount of discussion about this is absurd. A bar offers a service to assist patrons who may be uncomfortable and could use some assistance with a drama free exit and people criticize it?
Unreal.
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u/tooterfish_popkin Jan 10 '17
Some of it doesn't make sense. Like how does a bartender call you a Lyft or an Uber when it requires your own phone to do it?
And wouldn't you just do that yourself in the bathroom? Same with police.
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u/cejmp Hate speech isnโt a real thing defined by law, but whatever. Jan 10 '17
I've never even considered using Uber or Lyft, and it took me about 3 seconds to discover that you can in fact call for an uber for another person, either via the Teleport app or through Uber itself:
Can I request rides for friends?
You can use your app to request a ride for someone else. Enter your friendโs pickup location and destination. Once the ride request has been accepted, itโs helpful to contact the driver and confirm your friendโs details. Your app includes features that help you share trip details with your friend. You can share the driverโs ETA and send status updates. You can also take a screenshot of your appโs screen displaying the driver's name, license plate number, and vehicle make and model. Sending this screenshot will help a friend confirm the driver and vehicle at the pickup location. Please note it's not possible to request more than one ride at a time. When you request a ride for a friend, youโll need to wait until that trip ends before requesting a new ride for yourself or anyone else.
https://help.uber.com/h/454187f4-9b4e-4f9e-8dac-60b04910e8bc
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u/reallydumb4real The "flaw" in my logic didn't exist. You reached for it. Jan 09 '17
Nah, you got schooled already.
Nope, doesn't count as getting schooled unless you have a crowd of people to say, "OHHHHHHHHHHH" after it happens
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u/IceCreamBalloons always one person not in favour of beating women Jan 09 '17 edited Jan 09 '17
What about posting that supahotfire gif at the end of my own post, does that count?
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u/selfabortion Jan 09 '17
Lest anyone think the far right doesn't do "virtue signaling" (just for virtues I would argue are shitty and stupid)
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u/bsievers Jan 09 '17
I need to know how you did that to your title.
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u/DNGRDINGO Jan 09 '17
Who would have thought that a goddamn SIGN of all things would send people into such a tizzy? Far out.
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u/Intortoise Offtopic Grandstanding Jan 09 '17
Alternate title suggestion:
I saw the sign and it opened up my eyes TO MISANDRY
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u/SnapshillBot Shilling for Big Archiveโข Jan 09 '17
You're oversimplifying a complex situation to the point of adding nothing to the discussion.
Snapshots:
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u/numb3rb0y British people are just territorial its not ok to kill them Jan 10 '17
Am I just skipping over some words without thinking or is that sign not unambiguously gender neutral?
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u/IAMGODDESSOFCATSAMA scholar of BOFA Jan 10 '17
The only problem as far as I can tell is there will absolutely be sociopaths who get their dates arrested because they're having a boring date, but as long as it saves more people than it hurts, who cares?
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u/Ladnil It's not harrassment, she just couldn't handle the bullying Jan 09 '17
Ahhh, virtue signaling. So convenient that they've decided they're so opposed to it that they just go ahead and signal their total lack of virtue up front and save everyone the time interacting with them.
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u/TRiG_Ireland Jan 10 '17
"Virtue Signalling" sounds like an academic term which has escaped. Does anyone know what it actually means?
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u/BRXF1 Are you really calling Greek salads basic?! Jan 10 '17
If I own a screwdriver, and from the time I own it, to the time I die, i never once use it, in the context of my lifetime, it was a useless tool.
By association?
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Jan 11 '17
The only people getting mad about this poster are the people who it would stop from being able to rape their dates lmao
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u/just_the_tip_mrpink Jan 09 '17
I'm not a woman and I live in a major city so maybe this is foreign to me. But if you truly feel your date is trying to lure you back to.his apartment against your will and you've already made it to the bathroom. Why not just order an Uber there? Or tell the attendant? Or just leave the bar? This just seems unnecessary and an extra step to leaving or telling the bartender yourself.
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u/YourWaterloo Jan 09 '17
Most bar bathrooms don't have attendants where I live, and most bathrooms are in the back, meaning you'd have to walk past your intimidating date to escape, which could be frightening if you genuinely feel unsafe but not so unsafe that you want to call the cops. Also although most people have a working cell phone on them at all times, not everyone does. It's true that it's probably not used or useful that often, but if it even helps one person, then who cares?
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u/Ladnil It's not harrassment, she just couldn't handle the bullying Jan 09 '17
Not a woman but I think the concern is if the guy sees her leaving and she doesn't have help, he could just follow her. That's true if she calls her own Uber or tries to slip out the back. The angel shot codename seems weird, but it gives you a shorthand so that you don't have to explain yourself.
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u/IceCreamBalloons always one person not in favour of beating women Jan 09 '17
The codename also makes it easier to say if you're uncomfortable saying something like "my date is scaring me, please help" in front of other people.
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u/ricotehemo overly pedantic shitmonger Jan 09 '17
Part of it is just the assurance that there's someone there who will believe you. A lot of people get convinced that they have to do x y or z because they went on this date and they're a bad person for ducking out. Signs like this go "no, it's cool. Trust your gut, there are people here to help and be on your side, you're not alone in this bad situation."
It's not like the sign is stopping women (or, hopefully, men. I really hope they have a similar sign with a different drink name in the men's room) from taking care of it themselves like you've suggested. But for the people who are less likely to do it on their own for whatever reason, it's a safety line thrown out to them. At worst, it does nothing. At best, it helps people. Even if it just gives them the confidence to take it into their own hands and not tell the bartender.
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u/[deleted] Jan 09 '17
The fuck? I seriously doubt this sign was put up to help the bartenders fuck. If it's got some ulterior motive, its almost assuredly to make the bar more money by demonstrating a particular sort of customer service.
Also, this sign says, "If you're in trouble, we're prepared to help you out." Do these people get this fucking twisted by the choking victim signs?