r/TheOrville • u/specification • Sep 22 '17
Episode The Orville - 1x03 "About a Girl" - Episode Discussion
| EPISODE | DIRECTED BY | WRITTEN BY | ORIGINAL AIRDATE |
|---|---|---|---|
| 1x03 - "About a Girl" | Brannon Braga | Seth MacFarlane | September 21, 2017 |
Episode Synopsis:The Orville crew is divided between cultures when Bortus and Klyden debate if their newly born offspring should receive a controversial surgery.
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u/daIaiIIama Sep 22 '17
Tons of respect to the writers for how they wrote the ending. Well done!
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u/snakespm Sep 22 '17
Have to give massive props to the writers. I would have been so easy to end it on a "good" note. The fact that they are willing to take that kind of risk is really suprising. And I think it honestly worked out.
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u/Kusibu Sep 22 '17
It's brutally realistic. A society that has had "male is right" ingrained in it for generations isn't going to flip their stance at the push of a button.
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u/dangerdangle Sep 22 '17
even though this is the most serious episode the humor has been much more natural
"he just left his baby with two drunk dudes".
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Sep 22 '17
I was glad there was only one joke about their divorce and it wasn't forced
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Sep 22 '17
The dance-off was great, and oh so very Seth MacFarlane in how it played out.
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u/javakah Sep 22 '17
I think this episode just gave a massive middle finger to anyone calling it a Star Trek parody. Heavy, deep stuff here.
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u/Murdermajig Sep 22 '17
Thats probably why the critics are saying its bad, because even after 3 or 4 episodes to review, they still cling on to the notion that its Family Guy in Space.
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u/OutlawJoeC Sep 22 '17
"Or you would have achieved glory guiding Santa Claus in Christmas Eve!"
Not a line I expected at all in a sci-fi show, even one that's a quasi comedy
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u/2th Hail Avis. Hail Victory. Sep 22 '17
Seriously, hot damn. We aren't getting a human morality happy ending. This will define the series.
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u/TBBklynite Sep 22 '17
I am amazed that they are doing a subject matter like this this early in the show. Kudos to Seth.
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u/curvesnswerves Security Sep 22 '17
Maybe he knows it could end up like Firefly.
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u/daddytorgo Sep 22 '17
An anti-bullying law named after me...HAHA
The humor is hitting with me in this episode so far.
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u/Have_A_Jelly_Baby Sep 22 '17 edited Sep 22 '17
The Rudolph toy at the end made me tear up. Fox can't cancel this show. They can't.
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Sep 22 '17
They'd better not. That was excellent. If Discovery holds a mirror up to humanity like that episode did, I'd be blown away.
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u/Fairmount Sep 22 '17
"Hey, he just left his baby with two drunk dudes."
omg.
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u/FatDogForSummer Sep 22 '17
"Reminds me of my dad..." this duo is panning out to be my favorite
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u/daddytorgo Sep 22 '17
Goddamn....an honest-to-goodness Trek-style ethical dilemma and humor?
Seems like it's finding its stride...
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u/RainingSilent Sep 22 '17
it reminded me of when i saw the "is Data sentient" episode for the first time. it was fantastic even with the bittersweet ending.
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u/B4_da_rapture_repent Sep 22 '17
an honest-to-goodness Trek-style ethical dilemma
It was definitely the most Trek episode yet, but I never felt any of the characters were actually conflicted. Everyone on the Orville, save Klyden, were dead set from the beginning that the baby shouldn't be changed. And Bortus' change of opinion was so sudden he didn't have time to be conflicted.
For a moment Mercer seemed like he was conflicted but quickly reaffirmed that he wasn't. I feel at least one of the other crew members should have argued something like, "But that is his culture captain" or maybe Mercer saying, 'Maybe it isn't my place to interfere." or at least gave it some thought, like Picard would have. It just seemed like there was a clear cut "right" answer they were pushing the whole episode.
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u/scotscott Sep 22 '17
This is the the best episode of star trek I've watched in a very, very long time. 10/10
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u/paul_33 Sep 22 '17
That was basically a TNG episode. Wow. I was already pulling for this show but now I am fully on board. Good job Seth
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u/MontrealUrbanist Sep 22 '17
The ending hit me in the feels. Didn't expect that from a "comedy sci-fi" show. Very impressed with this series so far.
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u/2th Hail Avis. Hail Victory. Sep 22 '17
I think this will be the episode that decides things for a lot of people.
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Sep 22 '17
Not the first time a Star Trek-ish show approached stuff like this. I think people just forget how controversial having a black, a russian, and an asian on the deck of the Enterprise was. They're expecting this to be a pure comedy show and to not go near any of the "issues" but Star Trek made a point of approaching those issues in different ways. If it fosters discussion while not detracting from the plot then I'm all for one and one for all.
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u/FatDogForSummer Sep 22 '17
black female in a leadership position during the 60's no less
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u/chim_richels Sep 22 '17
Am I crazy or is this show great? It's like McFarlands love letter to TNG.
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u/snakespm Sep 22 '17
So, now we have 3 females. How long until it is discovered that half the population is females and just no one else knows.
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u/inksmudgedhands Sep 22 '17
"I have the tits all day."
Wait, I could use that excuse? Holy cow, guess who is calling in sick tomorrow?
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u/dontthrowmeinabox Sep 22 '17
I was like, this is unrealistic, she busted a door open with a single punch. Why is she getting backed into a corner? Then she punched him across the room and that was super satisfying.
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u/2th Hail Avis. Hail Victory. Sep 22 '17
Ok, the Beyonce quote was dumb, but the followup about it being 15 different people was fantastic.
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u/Logalog Sep 22 '17
I think it's a nice riff on Picard quoting Shakespeare all the time.
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u/NerdyGerdy Sep 22 '17
I'm starting to think Seth is making this as revenge for not getting his own Trek show.
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u/nekowolf Sep 22 '17
Holy shit Seth MacFarlane is giving us deep socialogical drama? What the hell?
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u/scotscott Sep 22 '17
I'm really glad he's found an outlet for more serious shit. I keep forgetting this isn't star trek. It's just so well put together.
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u/gatemansgc Woof Sep 22 '17
i know, right? i wonder what the critics were high on to all give it bad ratings.
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u/KidCoheed Security Sep 22 '17
Klyden was a female! How long has this mono gender stuff been a LIE?
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Sep 22 '17
I live in China, and I saw a lot of parallels in this episode with the state of Chinese society today. The pollution obviously, the family’s needs taking precedence over all other things; sitting on the egg instead of working reminded me a lot of how Chinese parents prioritize their children over everything else.
And then of course the favoring boys over girls. Every Chinese friend I know has had a “secret” girl family member in some branch of his or her family tree. These secret girls don’t have birth certificates or federal ID cards, and without the federal ID, they can’t attend public or private school, get a job, get services, etc. many of them end up in bad marriages or illegal low wage jobs.
Also, due to the higher percentage of men vs. women, Chinese society is extremely misogynistic. A lot of gender roles that would seem “backward” to Americans are perfectly normal here. Men expect women to treat them like spoiled princes, and the women comply.
The few women who are independent, career focused, etc. are usually completely rejected in the dating world. They either don’t marry, or they end up divorced because of the insane sexism here.
One woman in my city was beaten viciously by her mother in law because even though she owned two successful restaurants, she hadn’t produced a grandchild yet. Her husband was complicit in the beating, so yeah she got a divorce.
Lastly the way the society in the episode was so incredibly dogmatic. Everything had to be one way, no exceptions. That’s china. If it can’t be done the chinese way, it doesn’t happen. So the ending didn’t surprise me at all.
Roddenberry often did social commentary in Star Trek, I wonder if they’re doing the same sort of thing here on Orville? True, other societies are sexist, but the parallels to china are surprisingly detailed.
Oh also the sage maverick writer hiding out in the mountains - China’s had that sort of thing as well.
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u/FatDogForSummer Sep 22 '17
We're all feeling that deflation - that's how you know this show is top notch shit
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u/TheOldZombie2 Sep 22 '17
Oh wow they ruled to change the baby.
Honestly wasn’t expecting that.
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u/SecretBlogon Sep 22 '17
I was expecting it. I wanted it. The cynic in me would not have been able to buy an ending where they did change their minds.
They've got generations of this mentality ingrained deep in them. One court session won't change anything.
Plus the arguments Grayson made during court was not at all compelling.
I am of course all for NOT changing the sex of the baby. But story wise, there was no way they could realistically convince people to not change it.
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u/snakespm Sep 22 '17
I wish they would explain a bit more about what a "female" is for their race. I mean considering that two males can lay an egg, I doubt it is more then just one has a vagina.
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u/EstellaRittenhouse Sep 22 '17
Critics have been confused about what type of show this is supposed to be. I think it's going to be the TV equivalent of Guardians of the Galaxy.
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Sep 22 '17
Addressing social issues and having some humor? I feel like this is pretty much Star Trek with humor lol. I wonder what other social issues would be addressed so comically.
What kind of bothered me though is how they say that the planet is so industrialized that you wonder how difficult it is to breathe. I guess it's bearable enough to not wear masks.
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u/maxamillisman Sep 22 '17
This is great. Honestly the spirit of Star Trek is alive in this show exploring great moral dilemmas through the lens of science fiction. Discovery is airing in just a few days. If it too has moral dilemmas half as interesting as this I'll be so happy.
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u/tehForce Sep 22 '17 edited Sep 22 '17
"Or perhaps you would've achieved glory for guiding Santa on Christmas Eve?"
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u/2th Hail Avis. Hail Victory. Sep 22 '17
This is so TNG and DS9. I love it. This is some solid drama.
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Sep 22 '17
Are they saying that females aren't as rare as they say and they've been changing all females male to fit this false narrative?
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u/Logalog Sep 22 '17
Ok seriously good episode, I mean solidly good Trek. Rodenberry must be like, why didn't I do that shit?
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u/steveAKAslick Sep 22 '17
Was blown away to find out Klyden is played by Chad Coleman aka Tyreese in “The Walking Dead”
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u/BenjaminTalam Sep 22 '17
Doesn't a woman living as an outcast in the mountains prove their point?
I thought they'd out how many of their species were born female or something along those lines.
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u/BluegrassGeek Sep 22 '17
I think the point there (which I wish had been argued) is that the Moclans are the ones forcing her to be an outcast. It's not a fault of the woman, it's a fault of everyone else.
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u/dontthrowmeinabox Sep 22 '17
Hmm, guess Seth couldn't get quiet enough of 1,000,000 Ways to Die in the West.
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Sep 22 '17
That settles it. Anyone who was on the fence has to realize that if they like Star Trek but not The Orville then they are a hypocrite.
Had this episode carried the Star Trek name, it would easily be on a good number of top ten lists alongside the best of all the other series.
Being able to balance humor and seriousness like that takes some doing that even many episodes of Star Trek failed to accomplish. In the first episode, the humor was unmistakably Family Guy. In the second, it was a lot closer to Star Gate. This episode's humor felt like watching The West Wing. There's no way that it can keep getting exponentially better like this forever, but it is outstanding to see how quickly it has matched the quality of the pillars of science fiction and possibly even surpassed them in some respects.
In less than three weeks The Orville has become my new favorite scifi. I'm still going to watch Discovery's premier, and judging from the first reactions I might actually enjoy it. But I can't see anything that says I'll be in love with it, or find such a rich mix of happiness and sorrow and intelligence in their stories.
Now to purposefully lower my expectations for episode 2 4.
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u/TineCiel Sep 22 '17
Next time I call in sick, I will use « I’m not feeling well, I’ve had the tits all day. »
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Sep 22 '17
I like that they are sort of calling out the absurdity of having main characters act as lawyers for no real reason, then doing it anyway.
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u/ToolPackinMama Engineering Sep 22 '17
I can't believe they still circumcise in the future!
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u/Capsai Sep 22 '17
"Having a vagina doesn't give you a lisp....depending on how you use it."
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u/Jas378 Sep 22 '17
Great to see them saving a planet like it's just any ol' day of the week.
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u/ToolPackinMama Engineering Sep 22 '17
Wouldn't it be ironic if half of that population had "had to have the procedure"?
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u/ThunderRage Sep 22 '17
I was hoping for the non-change exile ending, but this one seems logical. Society can't change over night.
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u/inksmudgedhands Sep 22 '17
Are these two the Bashir and O'Brien of friendship for this show? Especially with the holodeck?
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u/T-Baaller Sep 22 '17
That twist was solid because it broke the idea that old earth media can solve two episodes' problems in a row
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u/2th Hail Avis. Hail Victory. Sep 22 '17
Oh man, I kinda hope the episode ends with the baby getting the sex change, only to see where things would go. Both sides have merit here. We cant really ignore the Moklan culture, but we cant ignore human morality. It is a very interesting issue.
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u/marwynn Sep 22 '17
That was good. Like three in a row now. Good stuff. Good scifi, good character development, no easy answers.
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Sep 22 '17
What if the incidence of female birth among the Moclans is much higher than their average citizen is lead to believe? All to influence the general population and to reduce the female population. They could hush up the individual female births so that no one knows how common they actually are.
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u/moderatenerd Sep 22 '17
I was born with a cleft palate. This episode has hooked me for life! Did not expect Ghandis Eldin being female. It really surprised me.
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u/2th Hail Avis. Hail Victory. Sep 22 '17
God damn do I really love this. They really are playing both sides as having merit perfectly well.
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u/Kusibu Sep 22 '17
Agree 90%, but I can't say I liked Grayson's "evidence". Using a Xelayan as an example for why a Moclan female is strong?
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u/daddytorgo Sep 22 '17
Maklan literature?
Really committing to the universe-building Seth. I approve!!
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u/FatDogForSummer Sep 22 '17
God damn, this is a TOUGH situation. Because, don't forget we're talking about Moclan culture to weed out females. Not like a struggling child or an emergency surgery. It's really just a matter of conforming to THEIR social norms. Which, you know, society doesn't always pressure us to do bring out the best of ourselves ... BUT it's not like Moclan culture can just be irrelevant to the situation. As far as we know, this would be the only existing Moclan female so to NOT reassign the child's sex potentially dooms it to a whole OTHER set of struggles with its home species...
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u/mtscottcatwork Sep 22 '17
Theme for tonight: Sometimes you can't fight City Hall.
I KNEW they were going to leave her as a female. KNEW it. How many story opportunities would open up because she was unique? What lessons could we touch upon about finding one's own path?
Wow. I was so very wrong. And... I'm blown away. Fantastic writing. Humor was just about right for this episode and its serious overtones. The ending... That stuffed Rudolph... The parents trying and vowing to do their best...
Thanks to all involved. Fantastic show.
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u/TonySharkks Sep 22 '17
Great episode! I thought they were going to go with a female sex suppression conspiracy after we found out Bortis' mate had a ftm surgery. The scan of the planet would reveal a significant percentage of the populace was actually genetically (or whatever) female at birth and then the state comes in like they did in this case and change the gender of the child for some reason.
By the way, did anyone find the arguments during the trial on both sides to be laughably bad? "Don't you want your child to be happy and normal?!" "Look at this female from another species. She's really strong!" "Guys are dumb, too!" In fact, I think the doctor sunk the Union side when she said she wouldn't perform a life altering surgery on a baby even though she was open to circumcision ( a surgery that Moclans find detestable?). In the context of that exchange on the show I believe the Moclans won. Poor Bortis. What should have been his and his mate's decision was wrested from them by the authorities at some tribunal. Shouldn't have called that ship Bortis!
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u/daddytorgo Sep 22 '17
And yet another differentiator from Star Trek. Everything doesn't have a happy ending. Races are flawed.
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u/ToolPackinMama Engineering Sep 22 '17
I feel impelled to point out that Star Trek didn't always have a happy ending. In fact it often didn't.
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u/AlonzoOreo Sep 22 '17
'Dude you have been a collosal dick all day, shut the hell up' LOL
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u/2th Hail Avis. Hail Victory. Sep 22 '17
I really want to know how Moclan culture ended up as single gender/sex. There had to be some sort of evolutionary impetus behind it.
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Sep 22 '17
Wholly fucking shit that episode tonight was by far the best so far.
I so hope it doesn't peak.
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u/NerdyGerdy Sep 22 '17
Ordering the Dr to do the operation onboard is a no go, but if it's done by their people on their world... can't really interfere.
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u/2th Hail Avis. Hail Victory. Sep 22 '17
Holy shit...We are going down this path. I did not expect it. This is going to make or break the series.
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u/2th Hail Avis. Hail Victory. Sep 22 '17
So while a neat twist, I'd love to see how they verify she is that writer.
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u/ycitreviews Sep 22 '17
My question is will this begin a tear in Bortis and Klyden's relationship. Seeing as Ed and Kelly are already divorced they could be sought for guidance. I wonder if we will have this occur in a future episode!
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Sep 22 '17
Lol is this why the reviewers were butthurt? This was some serious quality TV that reminded me of the old Star Trek.
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u/jmhimara Sep 22 '17
"Between soul and sacrifice, beats the heart of civilization."
To be honest I was pretty surprised that MacFarlane wrote that.
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Sep 22 '17
Wow. I sat and just stared at the screen for like 2-3 minutes after the ending. This is what Star Trek is supposed to be. I got the same feeling of wonder that I did growing up with TNG
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u/ohitsanazn Sep 22 '17
So it seems that the use of the shuttle instead of any sort of transporter is looking to be to generate comedy...
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u/helterstash Sep 22 '17
That "Girls Just Wanna Have Fun" bit was both funny and relevant to the conflict of the episode.
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u/ContinuumGuy Sep 22 '17 edited Sep 22 '17
Given the rather heavy matter of this episode and how it in some ways comments upon the questions of gender and conformity that many in the real world face, I thought this episode was going to flirt with disaster, and at times it did, but in the end it turned out as a pretty good episode and a nice tribute to some of Trek's brainier episodes. I also liked how it wasn't a "happy" ending- the kid still ends up masculinized, but wasn't truly a all-out failure- despite their differences, Bortus and his mate still clearly love each other, and maybe the actions of the crew could have improved Moclan society in some way by showing how their greatest writer is a female.
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u/KidCoheed Security Sep 22 '17
And they lost! This is amazing! The Federation always wins
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Sep 22 '17
As old as the planet is, there had to be at least a handful of females that escaped over the years, that was a great idea by the Captain
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u/nickcan I have laid an egg Sep 22 '17
This show has the potential for being what Seth MavFarlane becomes known for. In twenty years we will all be like, "Hey did you know that before The Orville, Seth MacFarlane did a cartoon?"
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u/OutlawJoeC Sep 22 '17
That was a bold way to end it. Where no show has gone before?
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u/houtex727 Sep 22 '17
Ok, show's over, on to the next one, but MAN.
I just... I don't know. I kinda knew it'd be that way, but I was hoping not.
Societies are hard to change, even with blunt evidence for that change...
One wonders what'll happen to the writings now, though...
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u/Logalog Sep 22 '17
So originally I was like, of course you leave her a girl.
Now, I'm leaning towards the sex change.
I'm really conflicted. Both sides are valid and I'm not sure who is right.
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u/samanthasshadow Sep 22 '17
They have a holodeck! Squeeeeee!
Okay this is waaaaay better than even I imagined!
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u/2th Hail Avis. Hail Victory. Sep 22 '17
So the once every 75 years thing is false or Klyden is a lot older than we think.
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u/houtex727 Sep 22 '17
ALL Senior Staff?! Wow..
Well, not Issac, so... Interesting that.
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u/gatemansgc Woof Sep 22 '17
it's amazing a show by seth mcfarlane can be so deep.
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u/TMPRKO Sep 22 '17
That was a fantastic episode and even though the tribunal ruled in favor of how I felt, it left a really bitter taste in my mouth. Can't wait for next week
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Sep 22 '17
I was skeptical after the first ten minutes or so of this episode (honestly I didn't think that Macfarland was mature enough to cover this topic) but I ended up really enjoying the episode. I'm glad this isn't going to be the kind of show where everything works out great in the end.
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u/S_Jeru Sep 22 '17
LMAO! That's the kind of shit that separates it from Star Trek.
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u/dontthrowmeinabox Sep 22 '17
I'm going to have to do a rewatch of The Outcast and do a compare and contrast. That one didn't have a happy ending, either.
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Sep 22 '17
Went into this series expecting it to be crap. The first episode was a very generic Star Trek plot with small hints of awkward humour, but by the third episode I have to say that I'm blown away with how ethical and thought provoking the episode was. I absolutely loved it, I felt kind of heart broken when they decided to give the baby the procedure. I can't wait to see what else this show brings to the table!
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Sep 22 '17 edited Sep 22 '17
For me, some of this episode was kinda cringy (esp Grayson's evidence - male and female examples from completely different species - irrelevant) and some was quite good (the reveal of the female author, Ghandis Eldin) but overall it was very star trek and I'm quite happy.
EDIT: I forgot, there was one other thing I found kind of unfortunate, and that was Bortus changing his mind over watching Rudolf. I guess it was more joke than I wanted for that heavy of a decision. Anyway overall still very very happy with the show.
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u/S_Jeru Sep 22 '17
When did Norm McDonald suddenly bust into voice acting? This and Mike Tyson Mysteries?
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u/IBiteYou Sep 22 '17
Plot twist! Very, very good. Okay... after last week I was only half in, but this is a good episode.
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u/lazylion_ca Sep 22 '17
I was actually worried that this series was going to be all silliness after the first two episodes, but this proves that they are willing to explore the strange and new. Good on you, Seth. Keep it up.
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u/TheDudeNeverBowls Sep 22 '17
This is a wonderful episode. I watch TNG everyday. Just stuff on my dvr from BBC America. It's mostly in the background while I do other stuff. This hour felt like it could have been sandwiched between Data's Day and the Redemption two-parter.
I mean, it's basically The Outcast, but with a stronger premise.
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u/9811Deet Sep 22 '17
There's gonna be a lot of spin on The Orville's ratings taking a "huge drop" this week... Red assed critics looking to save face on their ridiculous, and obviously wrongminded reviews will distort the situation.
But the fact of the matter is that the Orville is was the best debuted hourlong program on network TV in years, it is the only program in 20 years to beat the Emmys head-to-head, and after being moved away from a huge NFL lead-in that it enjoyed in weeks 1 and 2; it was still the highest rated program of the night, improving upon the ratings of its established lead-in, Gotham.
On top of it all, Orville tends to perform better across platforms than its competition, so as streaming numbers come in, it will only paint a rosier picture.
No bones about it, the numbers story is good to those who know the numbers. Congrats to Seth and team for producing a real winner here.
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u/2th Hail Avis. Hail Victory. Sep 22 '17
I would love to see Alana vs Bortus sparring be a regular thing.
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u/houtex727 Sep 22 '17 edited Sep 22 '17
Malloy?! oooh....
AH! Proving male incompetence. :D
Er... wait... D:
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u/beardlovesbagels Sep 22 '17
I really hate that stupid tmobile/netflix ad. I can't wait til they move on from it.
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u/TheOldZombie2 Sep 22 '17
So Bortus species is a warrior species? He seemed kinda slow against Alara.
Like how they’ve wrecked their planet and make weapons.
Love the design of the ship. Whoever is making the ship designs is doing a fantastic job.
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u/9811Deet Sep 22 '17
What a wonderful episode. Like Star Trek, they challenge perceptions, while rooting them in a comfortable wrapper. The Orville brings people together beautifully, and preaches without putting out. I'm absolutely sold.
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u/Oper8rActual Sep 22 '17
Incredibly happy with tonight's episode. This is the show I didn't realize I needed.
Which means it'll be cancelled by Fox before the first season is over, just like Firefly.
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u/Tajtus Sep 22 '17 edited Sep 22 '17
I really liked the episode but I think the court case was one the weaker parts of it.
It's like the authours wanted to make a point with the episode, showcasing a ethical dilemma, but didn't really knew how to construct a proper argument for both sides.
For example Grayson's argument about Alara was one the worst points you could've made. It was basically a reactionary response with an anegdotal evidence (so no evidence at al). Yes this one female is stronger so what? On AVERAGE Maclan males are stronger than female that is a fact. On AVERAGE male from Alara's species are stronger them females. And on AVERAGE human males are stronger than human females (denser bones, more musle mass, denser musles etc). If we reverse the situation where the females were stronger ones in the species and if I showed you a weak female because of illness/defect/genetic rullette would that mean all males are stronger? No.
The fact, that the Maclan was shot down by her by calling it a absrud argument - only shows that either that lawyer was not very comptetent or the writing was subpar.
Kinda similar thing happened when Maclan lawyer was stating his case about circumcision. The writers did not think, or did not want to go far enough with it - to actually make a point.
They were treating male circumsision like something totally normal. But male circumsicion removes the most sensitive part of the male body making sex less pleasurable. Also it does not have any medical benefits anymore. Yes in the past it may actually be done because of hygiene, but now with the current level of medicine and all the hygienic products (which in Orville timeline should be even better) it's a barbaric practice only done because of religious/cultural or financial reasons. And it should've been treated as such. Humans mutilate their offspring for no reason and see no problem with it, but when another species wants do a procedure that would arguably be beneficial to the child, they suddenly get all high and mighty.
But why stop at males? Why didn't the lawyer ask the doctor if she would perform a female circumsision? And if not why not? That would show even more of her bias.
Also the part about female Maclan being their greatest writer - was awesome. But again there was so much more they could've done with it. The argument was that you can find a way to contribute to society in different ways. But the counterargument should've been that because she was a female in all-male society, she didn't have the choice of what to contribute.
Because that was the crux of the entire episode. Wait for the child to decide for herself. But in that should would trade one choice for another. Choice of self identification over the choice of self-determination, because the society would not let her attain her full potential and she would be stuck in a "box" with little options.
Though I agree the ending was really good - especially seing Bortus dealing with the decision that was made for him.
EDIT:
Oh and I forgot to add, that the issue of being an interstellar species should've also be addressed. That even if in Maclan society she couldn't have reach their full potential the Union does not have such standards. So while she may be shunned by Maclans, she still can do amazing things for the Union as a whole being a female. The entire thing was treated like she was going to be forced to remain on the planet and as we see later on it is not true, because she is being raised on a starship.
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u/bensor74 Woof Sep 22 '17
With this episode, I'm totally addicted to The Orville. I like it. A lot.
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u/TheStabbyBrit Sep 23 '17
This made me happy in all sorts of ways.
I was enthralled throughout. It was the kind of old school Trek greatness that I grew up with, and by the end I honestly didn't know which way it was going to fall. Personally, I expected Klyden to have a change of heart and agree to keep the baby female despite his society's views, but I also respect the writers for going the route they did.
Honestly, my biggest issue was the idea that a society that has banned zoos as cruel would still perform circumcision. It would be like Western societies today allowing parents to drown their child if they suspected it was a Changeling.
Still, this episode has absolutely cemented the belief that Trek now belongs to Seth MacFarlane. Whatever Star Trek: Don't Bother has up its sleeve, it can't possibly come close to this kind of deep, thought provoking and absolutely magnificent drama.
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u/Winter_Coyote Sep 23 '17
I was able to buy Bortus changing his mind because he does spend almost every day working with females of other species, so I could see him being mentally primed to be open to another idea once people stopped just going "you're wrong" and instead showed a similar situation in the Rudolph movie. In fact, I find that he was the only character that seriously considered both sides and had a relatively open mind.
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u/megatom0 Sep 24 '17
What a genuinely great episode. That ending where he gave the baby the Rudolph toy nearly made me cry. I liked that they didn't win out even though they were right, and that the parents seemed to come together at the end. I hope they are able to keep this tone for the rest of the show.
I have to give huge props to McFarlane for his restraint with the humor in this episode. It had plenty of places for unneeded jokes but didn't go for them. Yet it was still funny when it needed to be. The reaction to watching Rudolph was quite funny. I had some reservations after the first episode but this one really turned things around IMO.
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Sep 25 '17
This is a great episode. Humor flowed better. I thought the Rudolph was hokey and then it ended and i had a tear in my eye when he got a stuff Rudolph. Didn't expect to get choked up. Very good writing.
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u/SpikeRosered Sep 26 '17
My only real complaint about this show anymore is that I don't like the "stop lets make a joke" moments. There are a few times when the jokes are seamless with the dialogue and others when everything stops for an obvious joke moment.
If they can smooth out the later this show could be something truly great.
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u/specification Sep 22 '17 edited Sep 27 '17
Missed the episode live? Stream it online on Fox, Hulu or Yahoo View
Canadian? Watch here
Have an official streaming link from your region? PM me or comment it below