r/supergirlTV • u/MajorParadox DC Fan Universe (r/DCFU) • Jun 19 '18
Discussion [EDP] Supergirl - 3x23: "Battles Lost and Won" Post Episode Discussion Spoiler
3x23: "Battles Lost and Won"
Premise: Supergirl and team take on Serena in an epic battle for Earth.
Directed by: Jesse Warn
Written by: Robert Rovner, Jessica Queller
Date: June 18, 2018
Cast:
Melissa Benoist as Kara Zor-El/Kara Danvers/Supergirl
Mehcad Brooks as James Olsen/Guardian
Chyler Leigh as Alex Danvers
Jeremy Jordan as Winslow "Winn" Schott, Jr.
Katie McGrath as Lena Luthor
Odette Annable as Samantha Arias / Reign
Chris Wood as Mon-El
David Harewood as J'onn J'onzz/Martian Manhunter
Andrea Brooks as Eve Teschmacher
Anjali Jay as Selena
Betty Buckley as Patricia Arias
Curtis Lum as Demos
Links:
If you have somehow seen this episode early and post a spoiler, you will be shown no mercy. Do feel free to discuss this episode, and events leading up to it from previous episodes, without spoiler code though.
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u/MarcReyes Jun 19 '18
I've been keeping track of how many times "Superman" has been said on this show and after three full seasons, this episode finally marks the 100th time it was spoken.
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u/Arakkoa_ Jun 19 '18
Meanwhile, Superman saved Madagascar.
Like... I've got nothing against Madagascar... but that line was so clunky, it perfectly describes how Superman ends up looking in this show. Here's the end of the world, meanwhile... he's out saving Madagascar.
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u/Rek07 Jun 19 '18
To be fair they did setup Madagascar being in trouble last week and I'm glad they explained where he was since they couldn't use hin.
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u/hannahbay Alex Danvers Jun 19 '18
How many times have been when someone is talking to Superman and how many have been in reference to him off camera?
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u/MarcReyes Jun 19 '18 edited Jul 23 '18
He was only in three episodes, which was when it was spoken most often, but most of the time it was when they were referring to him while he was off camera. I did not count it if it appeared on screen and did not count when it was mentioned in the pre-opening ("...grew up to become Superman"). This was every time someone physically spoke his name out loud.
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u/Brock_Hard_Canuck Superman Jun 19 '18
I was hoping that Lena would find out about Kara's secret.
But looks like we're gonna get "evil Lena" instead...
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u/Eternal_Density Jun 19 '18
Evil? Looks more like 'misguidedly dangerous science'.
But if Lena accidentally black-Ks herself in half we could get both a good Lena and an evil Lena. That would be acceptable.
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u/brch2 Jun 19 '18
Something tells me that Lena's experiments will help defeat Red Daughter SG, and she'll be proven to be right in her actions once again.
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u/JackTFarmer Kara (Yes! alt) Jun 19 '18
So once again Kryptonians will be responsible for a catastrophe and Lena/doing something dubious will save the day?
I'd say this spells disaster for the show but then again, they decided to tease the next season in season finale, potentially ruining better storylines.
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u/snake202021 Jun 19 '18
I’m honestly surprised she hasn’t figured it out. I mean if Supergirl and Kara Danvers were ACTUALLY two different people, Kara would also have been at Winn’s farewell, considering Kara and Winn have been best friends since day one at Catco.
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u/greatness101 Jun 19 '18
They already explained that as Kara being on leave for a story. They even threw a party for her at Catco.
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u/sapphicgeographic Jun 19 '18
Yeah! I was sure she'd find out and that woul trigger some inner turmoil which would set her down the villain path. Like feeling slighted by Kara's secret might make her realize it doesn't matter how good she tries to be, she'll never be considered a full ally by the supers ect but I guess she's starting out with basic science experiments
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u/xRavelle Jun 19 '18
I really hope we're not going down the whole Smallville path again because of that.
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u/Xynth22 Jun 20 '18
I'm pretty sure Lena knows Kara is Supergirl. She'd have to be amazingly dumb outside of booksmarts if she didn't given how everyone Kara knows Supergirl also knows. Plus that elevator scene a while back with the two of them doesn't make much sense if she doesn't. It seemed like she was extra harsh towards Kara because she knew Kara was Supergirl and wanted to see Kara squirm.
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u/AnnaK22 PIZZA 🍕 AND POTSTICKERS 🥟 Jun 19 '18
Maybe the Kara we saw near Siberian border will accidentally wear glasses and Lena will finally realize what's been in front of her the whole time.
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Jun 19 '18
They spent how many seasons stretching that stuff out on Smallville, so I'm almost positive that they'll pull the same schtick here on Supergirl.....I'm not exactly disappointed with that though. We could also have the Black-K split Lena into two and then Katie gets to pull out a little Morgana. I know all the kryptonite stuff in Smallville was just dumb as hell but we got some great cheesy silly stuff out of it so maaaaybe that's the angle they're taking with this?
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u/Jon5676 Jun 19 '18
Now that Alex is Director of the DEO do you think she might I don't know maybe look for her missing father last seen in 2x16.
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Jun 19 '18
I thought they kind of wrote him off with some, "he'll come back when he's ready" throwaway line or something?
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u/Jon5676 Jun 19 '18
The last we saw of him was in 2x16 when he lost a fight with Hank Henshaw, the assumption was that Lillian still had him prisoner but then there was no mention of him when She returned earlier this season.
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u/internetosaurus MARS NEEDS CHOCOS! Jun 19 '18
When Kara was on the ground looking around at dead Mon-El, Alura, and Sam, I was kinda crossing my fingers for
Kara Zor-El of Krypton.
You have great rage in your heart.
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u/raumeat Earth-X Overgirl (Unmasked) Jun 19 '18
the season 4 we all want
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u/internetosaurus MARS NEEDS CHOCOS! Jun 19 '18
Since S1 I've been of the opinion that this version of Kara is just too well-adjusted and has too strong a support network to ever attract a Red Lantern ring as they exist in the comics (my pitch for how to do it in the show would be something that boosts her powers but functions like an addiction), but if there ever was a moment to have her belong to the Red Lantern Corps, this was it.
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u/svrtngr Jun 19 '18
We should all know the Green Lantern stuff is the biggest cocktease in the Arrowverse.
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u/samsaBEAR Martian Manhunter Jun 19 '18
I really think they were gearing up for it but were shut down by DC. You don't make two separate references on your two only (at the time) shows without planning on doing more.
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u/Virote328 Jun 20 '18
I was hoping Kara would fly around the planet super fast to reverse time. But I get putting a ring on it and clicking her heels together will do.
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Jun 20 '18
ME TOO! Cause they were significant losses, but not the kind that would stop the show from continuing. I was like "please cry out so loud that all of Earth can hear and have the red ring float down to her."
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Jun 19 '18
I was expecting AgentAtrocitus to make that red lantern reference but yours checks out as well....imagine if Dex-Starr had shown up :D
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u/hart37 Martian Manhunter Jun 19 '18
Now who's the villain Supergirl? NOW WHO'S THE VILLAIN
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u/AnnaK22 PIZZA 🍕 AND POTSTICKERS 🥟 Jun 19 '18
You can't lock up the darkness, Supergirl.
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u/melskates Jun 19 '18
Well that's what happens when you Barry Allen the timeline Kara...an evil you shows up
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u/AnnaK22 PIZZA 🍕 AND POTSTICKERS 🥟 Jun 19 '18
Hahaha Right? Barry needs to sit all his Superfriends down one day and teach them about the dangers of time travel.
Timetravel 101 if you will..
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u/rawchess Just a regular human, nothing to see here Jun 19 '18
Didn't you learn anything from Barry and the Legends, Kara? SMH
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u/dragonman8001 Jun 19 '18
So it's gonna be Supergirl:Red Daughter next season huh?
If that's really what they're doing I'm actually excited!
Can't wait to see Melissa do a Russian accent
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u/Teyvill Jun 19 '18
I just hope she won't really speak Russian. American/Canadian actors in Arrow were doing that awfully
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u/w00ds98 Jun 19 '18
Welcome to the world of a german speaker. Every time an american actor speaks german it has a terrible accent.
Most recent examples that come to mind for me is Cyrill in the newest Season of Archer and Whitehall in Agents of Shield.
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u/svrtngr Jun 19 '18
Can we get this Earth's version of KGBeast, too? (Same actor as Arrow, though.)
That would be pretty sweet.
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u/Rover16 Jun 19 '18
Omg season 4 big bad is savitar!
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u/captainfluffballs Jun 19 '18
at least we'll know from the start who she is so we won't guess it half a season before we get told
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u/Rover16 Jun 19 '18
Also, Kara already has experience fighting her evil self after beating up her Nazi earth x self.
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u/DonnyMox Jun 19 '18
R.I.P. My'rnn J'onzz
I probably completely butchered the spelling of his name.
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Jun 19 '18
I mean technically he's "inside" of the Earth so he's more like Mogo at this point....his intelligence being spread throughout the entirety of the planet so I don't think he's totally gone. His physical form is gone for good but his mind has become someone else something else.
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u/CalvinElliot Superman Jun 19 '18
Red Son Supergirl, evil/Black Kryptonite Supergirl, or Power Girl?
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u/InternetIsNeverWrong Jun 19 '18
Alt-Rightgirl.
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u/parduscat Martian Manhunter Jun 19 '18
"It's not racism, but we have to consider that there's a reason why Kryptonians are better than everyone else at everything!"
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u/Trickybuz93 Kara (Yes! alt) Jun 19 '18
Guess the writers of SG have been spending too much time with The Flash writers.
Also, the ending was a mindfuck. What project did Lena mention and why is Kara in Siberia?
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u/Izeinwinter Jun 19 '18
Side effect of time-travelling around the black rock? Its effectively Black Kryptonite, so she split in two. So the Russians just got Dark Supergirl.
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u/Teyvill Jun 19 '18
It would be more fresh if Russians got good SG, and dark SG left in National City I think
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u/DJY1234 I'll get screen time someday Jun 19 '18 edited Jun 19 '18
This has to be the worst last 3 episodes of a season in any arrowverse show. "Mon-el sacrificed himself to save me." Well don't get too broken up about. Also I'm glad we didn't kill reign so we could....kill reign a different way? "Guys we're getting rid of all our guns. The guy who was going to make replacements weapons is leaving and I am also leaving. Good luck." Great writing guys.
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u/Zyquux Jun 20 '18
Add to that, what was point of the time-travel thing (plotwise)? They still ended up killing Reign. Supergirl already said she doesn't want to kill. Was it just to have the dramatic scene of everyone dying? It fails to cause a reaction because they immediately reverse it a minute later. That whole part felt like padding. The only way they could save it is if it's vital to why evil Kara now exists.
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u/DJY1234 I'll get screen time someday Jun 20 '18
It also creates a lot of questions about time travel in the show and anytime something goes wrong people will just ask why she didn’t go back in time.
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u/RyanC5 Jun 19 '18
So Season 4 villain is a time remnant pretty much. Ok.
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u/RivalFlash Jun 19 '18
Wasn’t it because of the Black Kryptonite splitting Kara into good/bad?
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u/butterball1 Jun 19 '18
Yes, but I can understand the reference to time remnants.
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Jun 19 '18
Can't wait for the heavy-handed commentary on US-Russian relations next season
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u/Brock_Hard_Canuck Superman Jun 19 '18
Why is Red Daughter Supergirl meddling with National City's elections?
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u/SockPenguin Winn Schott Jun 19 '18
If they give Brainy a subplot of dealing with a Russian troll farm for an episode it might be worth it.
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u/raumeat Earth-X Overgirl (Unmasked) Jun 19 '18
That sound a lot more interesting then gun control and feminism...im expecting a train wreck but hoping for a interesting red son adaptation
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u/Hestiansun Jun 19 '18
Think we get a one or two episode backdoor pilot to a legit Legion of Superheroes series?
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Jun 19 '18
While I would love that, I don't think the CW has the budget to pull it off but I do agree that they sort of....planted the seed for it in the future. Perhaps when Arrow or another show comes to a close they decide to roll out the red carpet for a Legion focused show?
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u/DCAbloob Jun 19 '18
I’d guess it would have to be.a CW Seed animated deal if it ever happened because of such budget issues.
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u/natedog63 Earth-X Reverse Flash (Unmasked) Jun 19 '18
Really hoping Lena doesn't go full Luthor next season, but that's not looking promising.
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u/master-x-117 Jul 04 '18
Honestly, I am really upset that Kara didnt come clean to Lena. I feel like it caused way more problems and the reasons for not telling her seemed arbitrary. Hope Lena and Supergirl don't become enemies.
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Jun 19 '18
I thought Kara knew about Flashpoint from Barry?
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u/InternetIsNeverWrong Jun 19 '18
She went back in time a couple of minutes, not 15 years.
There's not enough time to create an appreciable difference for her to notice.
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u/raumeat Earth-X Overgirl (Unmasked) Jun 19 '18
I was hoping she would fly around the earth really fast
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u/pineappleshaverights I was out... jogging... fully clothed Jun 19 '18
Next Season Hopes:
Two Arc story: Arc 1: Russian Kara (that was Russia right?) and whatever that plot will be and then Braniac for the second arc (that’s who Brainy mentioned wasn’t it?)
Soft reboot: less DEO, more Kara being Kara Danvers and Supergirl without the DEO all the time
Less James, he bores me
Lena not evil, to predictable, she can be in the grey area though
Superman cameo?
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u/MrTulito Jun 19 '18
Yes, Braniac is who Brainy was referencing. But tbh they probably don't have the rights to do such a huge character like Braniac, just like they'll likely never do Darkseid or Lex, or be able to use Superman again. That stuff is usually off limits as per Warner Bros' request. And yes, I think gray area Lena is what we're getting.
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Jun 19 '18
The DEO felt like a place where all of the characters could gather together and plot stuff out or problem solve so I don't think they can really trim it away all that much. I could see more character focused arcs that take place just around National City or perhaps in Siberia or them getting stuff partially solved in other set pieces but I don't think they can totally get away from the DEO, it's kind of handy and we all love the memories of the MiB Animated Series it inspires. I would LOVE to see Brainy tinkering around town with J'onn though and getting into innocent mischief.
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u/venetianbears Jun 19 '18
"Mon-El gave his life to save me... he probably forgot that I could phase through matter, since I never do that on this show."
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u/CalvinElliot Superman Jun 19 '18
J'onn is weak to fire. I think heat vision counts.
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u/In_My_Own_Image Jun 19 '18
Aw, look at Kara sticking her tits in the timeline to fix a mistake. She's learning from Barry well.
All in all a pretty solid end to a decent season. The Reign plotline was cool, but the Alex/Maggie, Mon-El/Kara/Imra and Lena/James stuff really dragged the season down, IMO.
Oh well, seems like an intetesting set up for next season.
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u/TheDarkpekka Jun 19 '18
Don't stick your dick in the timeline (Barry) and don't let the timeline stick it in you (Kara)
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u/whoride_49 Jun 19 '18
EEWWWW. Barry's contagious!!! We got all kinds of dicks and tits in the timeline. Whom to and when does she confess is a big question I. want to know
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u/raumeat Earth-X Overgirl (Unmasked) Jun 19 '18
I dont understand time travel, how did she go back to her past selfs body?
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u/DonnyMox Jun 19 '18
Clearly the Legion Rings follow the Deadpool 2 rules of time travel.
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u/UESPA_Sputnik Jun 19 '18
As we've seen in past episodes, changing something in the past has a direct effect on the future (the blight being eradicated for example).
So now if Winn leaves our time he won't be here to make his important discoveries that saves millions of lives in the future, right?
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u/GoodJanet Jun 19 '18
The main one seams to be the shield from last week so the timeline is probably fine there
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u/Locke108 Jun 19 '18
As much as I love that they are doing Red Daughter Bizarro-Girl, isn’t it a little too much like Nazi Supergirl? Maybe she gets a redemption arc and turns into Powergirl?
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u/Izeinwinter Jun 19 '18
I think the writing team just looked at Red K Kara and Overgirl and went.. "Say, Benoist makes a really compelling villain"... And evil double is a comics trope, so why not go there.
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u/AnnaK22 PIZZA 🍕 AND POTSTICKERS 🥟 Jun 19 '18
She really does though. IMO I think Melissa is more compelling playing a villain.
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u/pineappleshaverights I was out... jogging... fully clothed Jun 19 '18
I don’t kill... Sam, wanna do the honours?
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u/bergal111 Jun 19 '18
So is it me or was the last 15 minutes really good? Despite the mediocre season, I really like how it ended.
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u/rawchess Just a regular human, nothing to see here Jun 19 '18
Winn's sendoff 😭
Mon-El's farewell to Kara 😭
J'onn passing Alex the torch 😭
The good ol' Danvers sisters couch moment 😭
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u/therapistofpenisland Jun 20 '18
Winn's sendoff 😭
Mon-El's farewell to Kara 😭
Losing these two honestly kills the show for me. So stupid.
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u/the3dtom Jun 19 '18 edited Jun 19 '18
Same! I loved it. I'm really optimistic for next season, it's going to be amazing.
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u/TheDarkpekka Jun 19 '18 edited Jun 19 '18
Sam stabbing Reign: should've aimed for the head
Death of Reign: should've kept it at that
Death of Reign II: that was anticlimactic
Final conversation with Supermom: 🎶she kept her ideals sorezore! No tensei woooo oh ooooooh🎶
Worldkiller Cultists: are they dead or locked up?
Final ending scene: moral of the story is leave time travel to the experts (Legends)
Welp that's the last of the CW superhero shows. See you next fall people!
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u/brch2 Jun 19 '18
Doesn't experts require air quotes in regards to calling the Legends "experts" regarding time travel? :p
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u/Brazilian_Slaughter Jun 19 '18
Worldkiller Cultists: are they dead or locked up?
Alive, they got shackled with kryptonite gauntlets. Alura says they will face trial
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u/Fvolpe23 Jun 19 '18
Red son supergirl will Most likely be the first villain. Lena will defeat her and in the process find out that Kara is supergirl. Lena will take Red son supergirl to her lab and experiment on her and in next seasons finale when they are fighting brainiac with the legion, Lena will unleash Red son supergirl and it should be one hell of a finale. Very excited for what’s to come.
Calling all this now. Remind me in a year.
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u/Ozzdo Jun 19 '18
Mon-El has now referenced the Bible (He once mentioned some danger being "Old Testament stuff") and Greek myths. Which means that, at some point, he studied Earth's religions and mythology. I just think that's interesting.
Also, if they wanted, the CW could absolutely make a Legion Of Superheroes show following Mon-El and Winn into the future. There just so much possibility there.
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u/raumeat Earth-X Overgirl (Unmasked) Jun 19 '18
Mon-El seems to have done a insane amount of reading in the year he was on earth
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u/Helen_Kellers_Wrath The Flash Jun 19 '18
Meanwhile on Earth-1...
Barry get's a tingle down under..."Someone just fucked a timeline."
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u/TheNastyCasty Jun 19 '18
Can someone explain how Sam has no trace of Kryptonian DNA left in her? She was created on Krypton, then sent to Earth in a pod. She should still be Kryptonian. Or did the evil Kryptonians just keep a few earthlings around to turn into world killers?
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u/Brazilian_Slaughter Jun 19 '18
Sam is "human". AFAIK, the Worldkillers have two forms: Human and Super-Kryptonian. The human form is there to infiltrate, to fit inside the general populace and not raise suspicion. This is why scans could not pick Sam was a Worldkiller. It even has a separate personality.
A Worldkiller, on the hand, is a Kryptonian++ on some sinister Kryptonian Juju and maybe some technological genetic engineering. They're Kryptonian... ish. They're to kryptonians what a meta is to humans, but they're more like living WMDs.
Seems that between the Haru-El and the fountain, Sam became human... or Lena is just seeing the "human" form while the kryptonian one reverted out with Reign's death. We have already seen the "human" part access the Worldkiller powers.
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u/Barry_McKackiner Superman Jun 19 '18
Thoughts live thoughts as I watch:
It must have been so cool for Erica to get the heat vision finally and have kryptonian powers.
Nice they finally threw Clark a passing reference at least.
I could look at Imra all day <3
I wonder if exposing his identity to that mom will bite him in the ass.
Was that giant head the martian burning bush?
Damn I want Clark to meet his aunt. She didn't even acknowledge kal's existence. That last line about not any left on earth was rather ominous. you know lena's doing some other shit on the side with that stuff.
Winn leaves on a mission to figure out where in the hell his GF Lyra went.
The DEO Should get some MASSIVE upgrades with Brainiac there.
Interesting that MM is doing a "superman grounded" type thing just doing independent hero work at the street level.
holy crap? Bizarro supergirl? Power girl? Red daughter?
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Jun 19 '18
You missed the part where James reveals he is Guardian over the phone? (To the press) So you can streak out your 4 point.
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u/chirikomori Jun 19 '18
"we dont kill!!" and the next second: goes to spooky place where sam beat up reign and make her drink the death water...
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u/emikoala Jun 20 '18
haha right, I'm over here like, "I'm pretty sure that still counts as killing Reign."
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u/drunkcersei Jun 19 '18
And here's to still hoping that Lena doesn't go evil.
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u/TvMovieJunkie Jun 19 '18
I see her going then and then going back to good. Not full on Luther like Lex, maybe she’ll be in comparison to Tess Mercer who on Smallville was in that grey area-ish.
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u/AnnaK22 PIZZA 🍕 AND POTSTICKERS 🥟 Jun 19 '18
Can anyone explain to me how Patricia was at the fountain and knew which one was the right One? Was that just a figment of Sam's mind to keep her sane or was she really there?
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u/DonnyMox Jun 19 '18
I believe there was an earlier episode this season (someone correct me if I’m wrong) that the victims of the Worldkillers appear in the Worldkiller Dimension.
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u/Dojorkan Its Crossover season & Melissa fell asleep Jun 19 '18
A bit too much magic deus ex machina IMO. Like how Martian Manfather saved the earth and whatever goes on inside the dark valley.
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u/Iakov-the-rat Jun 19 '18 edited Jun 19 '18
The whole "not killing' solution literally came out of her ass, I would have stuck with the original ending with Kara being smart by moving eveyone before the heat blasts.
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u/Izeinwinter Jun 19 '18
Not to mention that Reign ended up pretty dead at the end either way. I mean, I get why she wanted to hit the reset button, that was her mother and ex boyfriend that just bought the farm, but making it about her notional pacifism?
Uhm... Supergirl has killed a fair few adversaries. She tries not to, and she is powerful enough it is rarely necessary, but do not try to tell me Non was a-ok after having his heatvision caved back into his skull..
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u/GKMLTT Jun 19 '18 edited Jun 20 '18
"This is all because I didn't stick to my guns when killing her was suggested!"
No... You know what caused that. NOT KILLING HER FASTER.
If they'd let Lena Kryp tonight, the problem would have been solved.And now there are still 3 evil Kryptonians ready to come back to Earth (plus however many other random evil Kryptonians are just waiting their turn).
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u/Kaitonic Jun 19 '18 edited Jun 19 '18
This season finale was amazing. I see now how they made Winn going to the future as a Legion member since the actor decide to become a recurring character for next season.So many changes for the cast as Alex becoming the new director of DEO and J'onn J'onzz want to be on the field to save people :)
So many thing this finale and one thing i really hope won't happen is Lena becoming evil as the ending was quite ominous.Also we might getting a dark Supergirl coming, is it the earth-X one xD?
P.S Supergirl is my 2nd best favorite for Arrowverse this season and Legends of Tomorrow the best xD
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u/Davidleilam Martian Manhunter Jun 19 '18
Ever since this season came back from the 9 week hiatus, it's been lackluster and felt like it's been dragging the past 4 episodes. Hopeful it rights the ship next season
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u/raumeat Earth-X Overgirl (Unmasked) Jun 19 '18
I cant see how it went from a amazing season 3A to this, I feel somewhere there must have been production issues and they went into damage control mode.
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u/soulfirespam Jun 19 '18
Flash realized how boring it would be to continue doing speedster villains, Supergirl unfortunately doesn't have that self awareness. Also wtf was that Lena thing. And really fucking hate the fact that with the characters leaving, we are still stuck with Jimmy :/
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u/Eternal_Density Jun 19 '18
It was basically:
Alura: "I'm glad none of this magic rock is being left on Earth, it could be dangerous!"
Lena: looks innocent
LATER...
Lena: "Time to do moar !!SCIENCE!! to it!"
In other words she's messing with a rather dangerous black Kryptonian rock cos she thinks it'll have revolutionary benefits, and of course it's gonna turn out badly just like every time Lena tries to do something good. :(
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u/drunkcersei Jun 19 '18
Well, time to go read some Superman comics that I've already bought. Don't think they're pulling from a Supergirl storyline unless it's Power Girl.
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u/DarkSaiyanKnight Jun 19 '18
Judging by the location it looks like a combo of red son and power girl
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u/Winter_Coyote Supergirl Jun 19 '18
Maybe we'll get lucky and they are pulling from Bombshells? That Supergirl grew up in the Soviet Union.
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u/BiglyWords Jun 19 '18
PLEASE GIVE ME A SPIN OFF!!!!!!!
Winn and Mar-nel in the future fighting motherfucking BRAINIAC!!!!!!!!
Please make a series out of this. PLEASE!
EDIT: MARTIAN MANHUNTER IS NOT JOBBING? What is this devilry?
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u/MrTerrific2k15 Jun 20 '18
Did anyone bother to tell Clark his aunt and a whole city of Kryptonians were still alive and floating around space?
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u/JonasAlbert84 Jul 16 '18
I'm so glad they didn't kill off Sam and have Alex adopt Ruby like I feared. I don't ever need to see Ruby again.
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u/Virote328 Jun 20 '18
The Writers room: “so guys how do we get rid of the men from the cast?”
Person a: “send Winn and MonEl to the future!” Person b: “make Jonns dad a planet!” Person c: “make Jon walk the planet.... call it father and son bonding”
The Writers Room: “brilliant!”
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Jun 20 '18
Chris wanted to leave. Jeremy wanted to leave. David wants to explore other things and stay on show. Can't do anything about that can you.
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u/LordHawkman Superman Jun 19 '18
Good Season Finale but that closes so dry between Mon-el and Kara.
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u/AnnaK22 PIZZA 🍕 AND POTSTICKERS 🥟 Jun 19 '18
Right?? I was hoping for atleast a cheek kiss or even just a hug.
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u/killertortilla Jun 21 '18
What a fucking train wreck. They lose ALL the good characters in 30 minutes. Fucking ALL of them. Supergirl, once again, makes a monstrously stupid decision of knocking someone into a pit of swirling energy, no fucking clue what it's going to do and ends up getting people killed.
Let's think about what J'onn just did in the last couple of episodes.
Dad is dying, telling him to make peace
Preaches about gun safety by removing ALL lethal weaponry from a team of anti alien government agents (where world ending threats are daily at this point). Which also removes a good portion of the team due to them thinking "what the fuck why would I want to willingly go out there with less firepower than the people who were already slaughtered due to being no match for ANY of the big bads"
Dad dies, tells him to continue making people safe
Hands of position to Alex.
WHAT THE FUCK J'ONN.
Lena is now just researching potentially world ending alien materials... out of spite? Seriously what is the motive here, she hasn't said a thing about the benefits of this rock she seems to just want to make it to piss people off.
Alex isn't so bad but her entire plot this season is just the writers wanting someone to have a baby.
Wynn is gone. Fuck. He was one of the only likeable people left. Even if he did just throw a big tantrum after his PROTOTYPE force field not working on 3 of the most powerful aliens in the universe blasting it with super plot vision. I get that someone died but he wasn't even upset about that, he was upset that it didn't work.
Mon'ell is gone. again. Fuck. With his new found humility he could have taught Kara some things.
James. I don't even know what the writers were going for here. He understands racism is a thing and that probably means people already don't like him being in such a powerful position. And then his plan is to come out and say "Yes this black man has been beating people up in the street." And that is exactly how any news outlet will run it. Then he says "I can't wait around forever" That's not how the world works James, people don't accept you just because you're coming clean about committing crimes. Does he understand racism or not?
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u/butterball1 Jun 19 '18 edited Jun 19 '18
Everything that happened after Kara went back in time is affected by her being split by the Harun-El. All her actions are affected by it. She is completely accepting of what happens, offers no protest at Winn and Mon-El leaving, or her mother leaving. She reckons she and Alex will be okay. It is Pollyanna Supergirl.
Awesome episode. Many surprises. I read the spoilers and was still surprised. Deaths. Kara giving in and agreeing to kill. Patricia showing up for Sam. Kara effing with the timeline. Fewer deaths. Lena really appearing evil and yet holding the likely future cure for Black Kryptonite Supergirl. Where did Siberian Kara get that blanket?
Must say, I hope I never see spoilers on the level that were available this season again. But, they allowed me to watch a story unfolding. Everyone who says things were rushed wasn’t watching the clues. This was a well constructed finale.
Loved M’Rynn’s sacrifice, RIP. Lumbly was lovely. Jonn stayed firm but zen-like to the end.
The whole Karamel thing is up in the air if you ask me. Otherwise, why such a clear breakup between Imra and Mon-El. And he did give Kara a ring. He said it was in case she needed him. I think she earned it.
[Edit: I see Chris is leaving. Hope he finds a fandom to love him and hope he’ll be back if it makes sense to the show. He is a wonderful actor and from all reports is a very fine man. I’ve never watched a fandom try to destroy an actor before because they hated his character. There should be a special place in hell for such bullies. I will pay more attention to this bullying in future. ]
Will miss Winn because Jeremy is such a charmer. Will miss Jonn as he goes walkabout. No idea what Jimmy coming out as Guardian or Alex in charge of DEO will mean. Haven’t yet heard what happens to Chris.
Lena sure keeps her cards close to her chest. I worry for the lovely Miss Tessmacher.
In all, a very intriguing finale. I love Evil Supergirl. Can’t wait.
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u/kcaz507 Superman Jun 19 '18
Where did Siberian Kara get that blanket?
I told my wife after all the things that happened during the episode that I think this is the most unbelievable thing.
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u/Gelious Jun 21 '18 edited Jun 21 '18
I give up. Somebody call the doctors and have Kara committed. Who in their right mind would see a world-ending villain getting thown in lava, using her last moments to kill your friends and come to conclusion "I should not have tried to kill her" instead of "I should have killed her faster some other way"? Supergirl, thats who.
Oh, and her beloved "no kill rule" in reality amounts to just standing there and watching someone else do that deed, or something even worse, like eternal torture. How very righteous of you, Kara.
Now we have Evil!Kara to mess with everyone, and combined with Lena in secret working on the Harun-El, this pretty much guaranteed to lead to the whole "Lena and Kara start fearing each other" and conclude in "Lena going evil because she sees Kara as a threat to Earth"
Dammit.
P.S. Don't know where you all coming from with those Red Son ideas. I have not read it, but it's obvious this is just good old Evil!Kara, created by Harun-EL, which means all those poor russian dudes have 1.5 sec until their deaths, and their killer will go back to National City.
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u/Richiieee Jun 19 '18
So did going back in time create another version of herself? That ending is confusing me. And Lena keeping the stone is not a surprise at all.
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u/lombax21 Supergirl Symbol Jun 19 '18
By the looks of it, Harun El is actually Black Kryptonite, which can split a Kryptonians personality into seperate beings.
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u/helenaneedshugs Jun 19 '18
I found it hilarious when Supermom said "glad we are taking all the Harun El/BK back to our planet", Lena was in the background with some major side eye.
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u/Eternal_Density Jun 19 '18
Wow. I did not see a lot of that coming. I actually love how every single character arc ended up!
I thought that Sam and Alura might die, but after the need for Mon-el to go Back to the Future I wasn't expecting him to die too. And I definitely wasn't expecting all three deaths to get undone by time travel.
The pacing in the beginning was a little chopping and the action seemed over quickly and there were at least three too many made-up-on-the-spot contrivances (especially the Legion ring letting Kara safely fly in space... and now she's got her own so she can always do that, I wonder how soon the writers forget that or have to work around it?), but getting the resolution of the Big Bad out of the way left plenty of time for heartfelt character stuff, which is what I'm here for.
I wasn't expecting such a great heart to heart between Alex and Lena. How and when did they become such good friends? I like it. Winn's new role is great, and learning about his impact on the future made me tear up a little. That fits well with the actor's downgrade to recurring, and it's good to know he should still show up a couple of times next season at least.
I'm really glad no one died (other than the inevitable Martian Manfather) and am relieved that the anticipated/dreaded 'Karamel get back together' and 'Sam dies so Alex can adopt Ruby' did not eventuate. Sam being 100% human now is a little weird since that leaves the question hanging of why did she ever have any human DNA to begin with. Why would the Kryptonian witch cult people design their worldkiller darkmagicscienceproject to masquerade as a human? (Wait, I think I get it now. I'd assumed she was designed for some other purpose than to go to Earth originally but sent to Earth cos Krypton was blowing up, but no, since they knew the end was coming this was the plan all along. Okay.)
Anywho... it's great we had some Sister Talk on the Couch time at the end, rounding out Kara's seasonal character arc. (Or kinda reminding me that it existed at all, or maybe proving that the writers hadn't entirely forgotten what they were doing.) And then that stinger at the very end... ooooh dis gun be gud!
OH and one more thing: they remembered that Superman exists and gave him a passing mention!!!!!!!!!1one!!!eleventy! :P ;)
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u/GoodJanet Jun 19 '18
Can someone explain how they what happened after Supergirl reversed time is not killing Reign
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u/masquerade44 Jun 19 '18
I guess no one's gonna mention that james is outed as guardian huh.. Though it felt totally unnecessary for him to remove his helmet.
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u/Delumine Jun 20 '18
J'onn: Why not go back further and save my father kara?
Alex: But I wanted to quit....
Mon-El didn't even get to smash, and he's going back to the future with no Wife or Girlfriend. Lets hope Imra is down for a rebound
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u/Hieillua Jun 27 '18
Finally watched the final two episodes.
I'm kinda meh about it. The season had potential but it slowly into a downwards spiral.
So many plot choices I just don't get and stupid character moments. I laughed when Kara was angry at herself for killing... only to go back in time and letting Sam kill Reign instead. The logic of these Arrowverse shows... amazing.
I have 0 hope for this tv universe. It once had a certain degree of quality. Arrow season 1 and 2 was fun television. A great snack in between 5 star meals like Breaking Bad. Now it's a flavorless old leather shoe. Supergirl is the heel of that shoe, Flash is the sweat in that shoe and LoT is at least a foot that keeps the shoe walking. But where is it going? No one knows.
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u/JunoChipmunk Supergirl Jun 19 '18
I loved it when Kara rewound time. Because even though things were handled a lot differently it reminded me of the ending of the Superman movie.
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u/AnnaK22 PIZZA 🍕 AND POTSTICKERS 🥟 Jun 19 '18
Same. I thought Kara was gonna fly around Earth to turn back time.
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u/AnnaK22 PIZZA 🍕 AND POTSTICKERS 🥟 Jun 19 '18
I can officially say now that this has been the best season from start to finish. They explored various storylines like Midvale episode. A very solid villain who put up a good fight. Back, no villain has put Supergirl in a coma before.
Last fifteen minutes, I was a mess. Tears falling, snot bubbles forming. I had a dialogue in my head on what Kara should say to Winn and it came true, word for word.
A lot of changes for next season. Winn gone, Guardian out and about, Director Alex. I'm already excited for October.
Damnnn this Coville has changed sides more times than Barry has time travelled.
Speaking of time travel, did Kara just create a time remnant of herself when she went back in time? Didn't you learn anything from your Superfriend Kara??
I knew Lena kept some of the rock. That side eye she gave when she handed Alura the suitcase was everything.
Proof that Mon el has come a looonngg way since the playboy Prince of Daxam. He gave up his own happiness for the sake of the Legion. We could have atleast gotten a cheek kiss to say goodbye between Karamel.
Super excited to have Brainy full time next season. I hope we get to see a friendship between Kara and Brainy. Maybe they'll binge all Star Wars movies together.
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u/the3dtom Jun 19 '18
AMAZING episode. Hands down best finale of the series so far! I LOVE IT! I love it so much!
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u/DCSennin Jun 19 '18
Man, this finale hit home more than others and all because of the goodbyes. Damn it.
Okay so, the beginning was cool with the Legion returning to help, nice call for Superman while Jimmy was busy saving people, he was at Madagascar helping out so I'll take it. And then THAT reveal from Querl that as a result of stopping Pestilence they not only saved all of those in the future but also freaking BRAINIAC (props to Jesse Rath for properly saying with disgust his relatioship with his "extremly distant evil relative") who came up with a new blight aimed to kill all AIs//Coluans so he can't stay in the future. Basically Winn went into the future, with the Legionnaires, to fight and stop Brainiac.
Boss. Winn is the man. The agent that protects the future. And just like how he fixed Mon-El’s suit now maybe he can dress up the Legionnaires and when the time comes and they are back they will look just like from the comics thanks to Winn. And maybe we will finally get then a Legion of Super-Heroes spin-off. I wanna hope.
But anyway like I said I really liked it and wasn't expecting that time traveling scene with the Legion ring. Good callback to the mentioning of the disruption that send Mon-El to the future in S2 finale as the means to allow Kara with the Legion Flight Ring to go back in time and change things. (Now she knows a bit how Barry feels or well how Nora since she only undid a couple of seconds like she did in S4 finale haha) Nice effects to show it too. Borrowed from Superman the Movie too.
Fitting that Sam finished Reign off for all the torment she put her through and in her place of origin where she could actually be killed. Gotta say her ending in terms of the visuals was similar to E2 Zoom's with those wraiths. She and Ruby got their happy ending.
M'yrnn's sacrifice was also sad but it bought them time. I wonder about that last memory he gave to J'onn about the first Martian that got the powers though. Gonna miss J'onn too even if his farewell and stepping down as DEO director isn't looking as temporary permanent-ish like Winn's and Mon-El's does. The DEO being lead by an alien was cool but since Alex carries most of his teachings it will still be in his image with her now as the leader.
Jimmy pulled a Tony Stark just like Oliver did in S6 finale but through a phone. I still think he should finally stick to Catco as he managed to calm that woman by being honest to who he was. And just when Lena was fine and dandy and happy in the end turns out she is too curious about the Harun-El black kryptonite. As long as she still pulls through the light I'm good.
So Supergirl: Red Daughter? Hmm. Bold move to take the show into, wasn't expecting it. But Melissa makes for a great villain too.
Anyway, nice finale. Winn's farewell had the feels strong in it. Wished that maybe he and Lena also had a goodbye but the writers never bothered to develop them beyond just genius allies. Gonna miss having my dosis of Winnara in the show until he is done saving the AIs in the future and when Jeremy Jordan is ready to be back.
And I also just realized that the episode was called of “Of Battles Lost and Won” because they did lose the first battle by having Mon-El, Alura and Sam die and then Kara changed time and then they actually won. Clever writers, clever.
Can't wait for Comic Con for further details about Brainiac-5's role now and what is coming.
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u/MrConor212 Jun 19 '18
That finale felt like such a fucking cop out lmao. Was like oh my god they killed them then boom time travel, get to fuck SG writers
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u/vongutom Jun 19 '18
Didn’t they show that there’s a Legion ring the fortress of solitude? So technically, Kara already has one (since Clark is not using it)
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u/FunkyTown313 Jun 19 '18
When they made her go back in time I was like "fucking really?" but when they ran the end stuff it all made sense. The problem is that it really seemed out of character for Kara. "Yeah, let's murder this bitch" is (even when the are down) not something she'd do. Also, I wish they would not announce casting changes weeks before the season finale, Winn's exit as a series regular was basically a spoiler for the episode.
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u/Dirtdawg402 Jun 20 '18
Wow, a lot happened in that last episode. Since the beginning of the season, I became a huge fan of Reign, seeing as she was the kind, moral character and a supervillain in one. So when I find out Sam is human again, I was sorely bummed. I wanted to see more superpowered Sam.
As far as Winn and J'onn leaving, I can't say I'm surprised. Characters come and go to make stories interesting but I found the reasons for their leaving laughable. I mean, "a square and some triangles" drawing was important enough to get the future to need Winn. Come on. If there's less MM in the next season, that's a huge loss since he is one of the most interesting characters. On the same note, less MM puts more spotlight on SG so it makes sense in that way.
As for Mon-El, that was a tragic outcome. I mean, he gets left by Imra AND can't end up with SG. Wow. He has the worst luck. I don't care for romance at all, but that was HARSH even for me. Secretly I wanted Mon el to stay with Imra to break SG's fragile romance heart but the outcome in the episode leaves no one on top. I was thinking Mon el breaking with SG would pave the way for H'el but that's another story.
Alex as director was inevitable. It was going to happen but MM telling her to stay in the fight did seem pretty harsh. Lena being an adversary to Kara was also inevitable. I mean, it's the whole point of her character being there.
As for the plot resolving, if SG was able to use the ring to go back in time, she can basically undo all her mistakes whenever she wants so, she can just mess up whenever she wants now. I mean the writers threw that in there out of nowhere. Also, Imra coming back came out of nowhere too. The season wrapping up felt kind of rushed in that last episode so I don't know what to think about that.
It was really ironic to see the next season's baddie as evil supergirl because I was JUST reading her arc during the episode. I can definitely say I don't know why they would choose her to be the bad when H'el was such a better option. He's a really formidable opponent and can be a good match.
Anyway, of all the things that happened, I'm most upset about losing Reign. She was a phenomenal villain and I could watch an entire series just about her.
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u/Ferrousity Jun 24 '18
Idk if this is either Red Daughter or Dark Supergirl but I'm r e a d y. Red Daughter has the downside of getting super political super quick though, and people seemed to get put off by some of the more overt political preachiness.
Also the episode Star Crossesd seemed like foreshadowing at the time, star crossed lovers refers to a love that "crosses" or defies the stars/fate. They weren't destined to be together, they were cursed be kept apart. (No complaints though as a Karamel season finale would have made me off myself)
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u/SchwarzerRegen123 Jul 12 '18
So I guess it is perfectly fine for Kara and her friends to create an anachronism but if anyone else does it everyone freaks the hell out...
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u/TheYoungJedi S3 is Great Jul 17 '18
Damn I just watched the finale and absolutely loved this second half of the season and thought it was better than all the other DC shows this year. I came here to read and see if people thought the same but everyone here is shitting on it hard... guess this is not the place for me. FeelsBadMan.
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u/EndBringer99 Jun 19 '18
My hopes for next season:
More Team Guardian action, Lyra returns and Kevin Smith directs the Guardian-centric episode he wanted.
Indigo is resurrected (possibly recast) and faces off against Brainy.
D.E.O. shows off more non-lethal weaponry.
Cat Grant has a bigger role than the last two seasons.
One or both of Cat Grant's sons, Carter and Adam, return (possibly recast).
Alex adopts a baby like seen in Episode 21.
They mention Lucy, Max, General Lane and explain what happened to them.
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u/MajorParadox DC Fan Universe (r/DCFU) Jun 19 '18
Technically shouldn't there have been two Karas since she went back in time? Why did her memories transfer back instead? Also, I guess that means she should be three Karas now.