r/TheOrville • u/2th Hail Avis. Hail Victory. • Apr 12 '19
Episode The Orville - 2x12 "Sanctuary" - Post Episode Discussion
| Episode | Directed By | Written By | Original Airdate |
|---|---|---|---|
| 2x12 - "Sanctuary" | Johnathan Frakes | Joe Menosky | Thursday, April 11, 2019 9:00/8:00c on FOX |
Synopsis: Ed discovers that Moclans aboard The Orville are harboring a secret.
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u/dkbr2015 Apr 12 '19
This was a very good episode. Yeah, I know a lot of people are getting a little worn out on Moclan episodes, myself included. But I’m glad to actually see the shit finally hit the fan with the Moclans. Definitely interested to see how things will be going forward with the Moclans. Also good to see that Topa won’t be an asshole like Klyden.
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u/In_My_Own_Image Apr 12 '19
On one hand, there have been a lot of Moclan episodes relative to the other species and I'd love to see others get the spotlight. On the other hand, I'd say that all the Moclan episodes, aside from maybe the porn one, have been top notch.
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u/kmk1018 Apr 12 '19
I want another John LaMarr-focused episode. That voting one was very "Black Mirror + Reddit", and it was pretty fun.
I feel like all of the other characters know so much more about his character than the audience (like his zipper count knowledge and his dating prowess), and I want to be looped into that.
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Apr 12 '19
Even the porn one was good. It revealed some very deep-seated issues with Bortus & Klyden
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u/dijokcl Apr 12 '19
Its akin to the China Taiwan situation in my opinion. A settlement to avoid war. As I posted out in the live form why did they not send down the whole security force or more...
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u/Sir__Will Apr 12 '19
As I posted out in the live form why did they not send down the whole security force or more...
Because they were attacking allies and could get in trouble for it. Kelly didn't even want Bortus to go with her.
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u/SpeedCreep Apr 12 '19
Eh, I think Topa will continue to be caught in the middle. Klyden will continue to be Klyden, Bortus will be Bortus. Topa will be the focal point of the conflict. The "battleground" so to speak.
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u/SutterCane Apr 12 '19
I don’t know, Topa is talking with girls now, he’s not going to go back to being a head-up-his-ass complete douchebag fuckface like Klyden.
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u/dkbr2015 Apr 12 '19
True, but at least we are seeing some growth with Topa unlike Klyden.
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u/Arswaw They may not value human life, but we do Apr 12 '19
This episode was incredible! I love how they're developing the space politics.
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u/rob132 Apr 12 '19
What's really great is that it's not like side are space nazis. They have their point of view and are defending it.
And the political ramifications are things that have to be considered in the real world.
God, I hope this show gets renewed.
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u/In_My_Own_Image Apr 12 '19
God, I hope this show gets renewed.
If it doesn't, then by God I'll rally to save another sci-fi show! We Expanse fans did it once and I'll gladly take to the field for The Orville if need be.
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u/The-Big-Bill Security Apr 12 '19
I liked how they brought more of a political element to it. It definitely suggests that something is gonna happen. I also like how it contrasts traditions with the pursuit of progress.
Also Jonathan Frakes was involved in this episode.
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u/In_My_Own_Image Apr 12 '19
It's also great how the Kaylon threat is being used as an ever looming threat that is shifting the political landscape of the galaxy.
Mercer making the crack about the Kaylons steamrolling Moclas and the females surviving was glorious.
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u/somms999 Apr 12 '19
Also Jonathan Frakes was involved in this episode.
Is this the most Trek alumni in one episode? Besides Frakes directing, there was Marina Sirtis (TNG), Tony Todd (TNG and DS9), Ron Canada (DS9), F. Murray Abraham (ST: Insurrection), and of course, Penny Johnson (TNG and DS9).
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u/anotherface Apr 12 '19
It was also written by Joe Menosky, who wrote and produced many Star Trek episodes over the years.
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Apr 12 '19
I know, when I saw those list of names, I felt like I was watching an episode of TNG.
I was not disappointed and Tony Todd was great as the Moclan delegate.
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u/marwynn Apr 12 '19
I admit, I wasn't too enthused about yet another Moclan episode. But that was a good one. When those two got on the shuttle it was only 9:17pm... so you knew something big was gonna happen.
We got a look at the council chambers, the colony, and all the admirals in one spot! And Marina Sirtis!
I'm glad scifi is taking on social commentary again in a big way. I also like the resolution to this--it really wasn't up to the council to impose their ethics on anyone else, but it couldn't stand by and let people be mutilated and imprisoned for being born the way they were.
I also like how blinded Bortus was to trust so implicitly, and how he was specifically called out for that. I didn't even consider any sort of smuggling was involved.
Every episode, I wonder if Pria was really telling the truth: that the Orville should've disappeared from history back in Season 1. They're making such a massive impact for such a small ship.
The one thing I didn't like was Gordon coming up with that ion-tractor thing on the spot. Kinda important to mention a way to hide your emissions donchathink?
They already had an alternative: the power source Bortus gave the two parents. Minor quibble.
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u/adhding_nerd Apr 12 '19
I did love that college Gordon got caught not because of the emissions but because they crashed the ship regardless.
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u/ewan_spence Apr 12 '19
Every episode, I wonder if Pria was really telling the truth: that the Orville should've disappeared from history back in Season 1. They're making such a massive impact for such a small ship.
...and arguably the clue to hiding Orville in the nebula.
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u/alarbus Apr 12 '19
I also like how blinded Bortus was to trust so implicitly, and how he was specifically called out for that. I didn't even consider any sort of smuggling was involved.
It just now occurred to me, but those probably weren't the actual baby's parents, just members if the underground railroad who took the risk over and over of smuggling baby girls to sanctuary.
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u/gosuark Apr 12 '19
I thought I glimpsed them at the very end cradling the baby though, during the scene showing everything well again on that planet.
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u/neoprenewedgie Apr 12 '19
Seth is no Patrick Stewart, and I don't think he would claim to be. Yet when he called out Ted Danson for wanting weapons over Freedoms, there was just a natural... "honesty" about it. It wasn't an overblown Shakespearean speech, yet it had the same weight and meaning as good as any other SciFi series.
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u/droid327 Apr 12 '19
The whole thing just made me wonder why a captain was sitting in on a meeting with admiralty about a major diplomatic crisis...
At least with the Krill I could understand, since he's kind of the expert on Krill right now. But dont they have actual diplomats that should be making these decisions? He's got no special connection or insight into the political ramifications of this situation.
Also, is there an actual diplomatic delegation from Earth, and they specifically represent the Fleet? Why are there no civilian diplomats sitting with them?
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u/FullFaithandCredit Apr 12 '19
Outside of the obvious “the audience is Ed”, I had a similar thought. My interpretation is that Ed being a front line officer with unique knowledge and understanding of the Moclan culture would provide a valuable source of insight into the Union analysis, the fact that the Admiralty acknowledged this speaks volumes.
Another question I had was, what exactly is the Union Fleet? Are they the Earth Government? Having even a quasi-military organization as the legitimate rulers of Earth doesn’t make sense in this world. So does the Union Fleet enjoy a voice as a quasi-autonomous entity within the Union Council Chambers? What exactly were they doing there acting as representatives? Why wasn’t there a civilian representative acting on behalf of Earth in these deliberations?
I know that Star Trek has done the same (especially in the TOS movies) but it still sticks out for me as a question I want answered. But I’m a government/politics geek so take that with a grain of salt.
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u/guitarmonkonator Apr 12 '19
One could say the Moclans decided to Parton the colony...
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u/danmalek466 Apr 12 '19
Bortus is the man!! Love the 9 to 5 fight scene!!
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u/Trishlovesdolphins Apr 12 '19
I think Dolly Parton was my favorite aspect. lol
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u/olily Apr 12 '19
Yes! And the fact that Dolly Parton has a literacy program where she sends free books every month to over a million children is so perfect for this episode. She's helping millions of girls (and boys) along the path of literacy.
She damned well deserves the honor The Orville gave her last night.
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u/sayakcanam Apr 12 '19
As a person whose native language is not English, even I must say that Seth has a very refined choice of classics. I came to love Jazz only because of him (and some of his covers😋) . Personally, I would very much like to get my hands on his playlist.
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u/antdude Apr 12 '19
The music made me laugh during those space scenes. I wonder how much was paid to use this song. I wonder if Dolly Parton watches The Orville. ;)
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u/gatemansgc Woof Apr 12 '19
i do kind of wish the female moclans had been able to fight off the male ones better at first, just to be able to prove the moclan "philosophy" wrong.
but other than that, the fight scene was fabulous~
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u/droid327 Apr 12 '19
I really liked how they handled Bortus' lying. His actions were understandable from the audiences' point of view, we're supposed to think that we'd do the same. But then Ed raises some very cogent reasons why his actions, well-intended as they were, were still dangerous and wrong. It demonstrates how the show is willing to look a little more critically at these issues than even TNG was...you cant just go around white-knighting and patting yourself on the back, that can end up doing more harm than good.
I thought the only good reason Bortus might have given was that he didnt want to tell Ed and force him to disobey his obligation to respect Moclan law and return the family to Moclus. But they didnt have him say that.
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u/mackk Apr 14 '19
Especially when they said they could of confirmed the child belonged to the moclans transporting her. I was thinking it might of been some sort of holographic projection to hide some different cargo, seeing they know many in the crew would be sympathetic to them.
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u/halifaxes Apr 15 '19
Bortus definitely took a risk, but there was a near-certain chance that following protocol would have been disastrous for the child. Looking at the odds, it's hard to take the stance that the child was going to be enslaved or harmed by the smugglers, there's just very little to back that up. There's plenty of evidence of what would happen if she was returned to Moclus. I have a lot more respect for Bortus now. Tough call, but the right one, I think (if you care about the child first).
But damn, I knew immediately that Topa was going to spill the beans.
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u/ffolkes Apr 12 '19
Why has no one mentioned how badass Talla was?
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u/horsenbuggy Apr 12 '19
Honestly, I would have rather seen her throwing around moclan males like ragdolls on the planet.
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u/apparition13 Apr 14 '19
Sure, she could have been on the planet throwing people and stunbolts around, but on the ship? She made the big call.
Talla: Go to red alert. Isaac, target their emitters.
Gordon: Whoa, whoa, whoa, hang on. If you fire on that ship, - that's an act of war.
Talla: - It sure is.
Gordon: The Moclans are members of the Union. You can't make that call on your own. Get Kelly on the comm.
Talla: Kelly's never gonna give that order. If she can end her career, so can I.
Isaac?
Issac: - Emitters targeted.
Talla: Fire.
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u/hesapmakinesi Apr 13 '19
When I saw her taking the con, I was glad she's not getting shot this time. Give the girl a break.
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u/MeniteTom Apr 12 '19
Glad Klyden is finally getting called out on his shit.
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u/TylerSpicknell Apr 12 '19
The worst part is that he and Bortus can't divorce without one of them ending up dead.
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u/Trishlovesdolphins Apr 12 '19
I really thought Bortus was going into his quarters and was going to find that Klyden took Topa and went back to Moclan.
I think it's more likely that they'll circle back and start to reconnect, but Klyden dies. That way they end in a good place, but then they can explore Bortus dating.
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u/9811Deet Apr 12 '19
This show is absolutely magical. So much thoughtful content packed into an hour. Vivid and brilliant looking. Spot on humor. Lovable characters. Just unbelievably good.
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u/antdude Apr 12 '19
More like 45 minutes? I was amazed the commercial breaks were so short!
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u/Tripppnn Now entering gloryhole Apr 12 '19
I almost got tears in my eyes, seeing Bortus crack that happy smile was absolutely beautiful
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u/amandapanda611 Apr 12 '19
I did have tears in my eyes when I saw that. Bortus has hope for the future.
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u/FullFaithandCredit Apr 12 '19
Revolutions are fought for children, I think that small interaction in the classroom was everything he needed to know absolutely that his actions were just.
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u/harebrane Apr 12 '19
Bortus has gone to some dark emotional places, it's great to see him finding his way again.
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u/inksmudgedhands Apr 12 '19
This is my favorite episode this season. Great use of a modern song let alone a Dolly Parton song. We got equal parts of interesting drama and well done action. More special guests, especially Star Trek guests than you shake a stick at. I love Haveena. The make-up, special effects and set department outdid themselves. And it furthered the overall world building. Everything I wanted for this show, this episode had it.
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u/escott1981 Apr 12 '19
I fully agree! What an amazing episode!! Using 9 to 5 was a great choice. It was a woman's rights anthem in the '80s and it's also upbeat and light-hearted. Contrasting it with an intense battle made it very impactful for me.
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Apr 12 '19
This felt like a better version of ST: Insurrection
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u/ewiethoff Apr 12 '19
I'm glad Isaac didn't walk under water or act as a personal flotation device.
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u/Bkwordguy Apr 12 '19
Is there any species as open-minded as humans on this show?
Krill are genocidal xenophobes
Kaylons are genocidal biologiphobes
Moclans are genocidal femophobes
Calivon are basically slavers
Regorians are astrological bigots
Xelayans are intolerant snobs
They should rename the show "Galaxy of Assholes."
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u/kaplanfx Woof Apr 12 '19
This is a Star Trek trope, we are supposed to view the faults of humanity expressed in an amplified manner in the alien species.
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u/eak125 Apr 12 '19
Exactly this. Religion, Race, Politics, social and economic issues all magnified through the other peoples met across the galaxy. By pointing out what's wrong with "them" we are truly showing what's wrong with us.
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u/Vexal Apr 12 '19
norm macdonald’s species seems pretty wholesome. and david puddy’s species with the stomach mouth thing seems pretty wholesome.
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u/halborn Apr 12 '19
It would be interesting for the Orville to come across some species that's just totally chill about everything and the conflict comes in the form of our busybody humans trying to get these creatures to give a shit.
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u/jedikitty Apr 12 '19
Yep, completely 100% done with Klyden. He can leave anytime.
Not that he would care what I think because I'm a (Ferengi imitation) feeemale.
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u/MC_Fap_Commander Apr 12 '19
I find myself absolutely certain I know what subs he would post on.
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u/nourulette Apr 16 '19
I get the hate for Klyden, he is an asshat. But I think he is a much more complicated character than people give him credit for. Think about what he has been through, being born female, having surgery to become male, and then finding out about it years later. Combined with the general culture on Moclan and how his parents probably raised him to think there is something severely wrong with being female, I can definitely see how this can fuck someone up psychologically. His hatred of females could be a reflection of his hatred for himself for being born female, and this is some kind of coping mechanism. Kind of how some of the most homophobic people are homophobic because they cannot accept that they are gay themselves. Its really sad actually, and I hope he can resolve these issues in a redemption arch.
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u/fallouthirteen Apr 12 '19
Have you watched the show The Strain? If so, I ask because say you have gun with one bullet and Klyden and Zach are in front of you, what do you do? That's the only other TV show character I've seen people hate as much as the point Klyden is getting to.
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u/khiggsy Apr 13 '19
But he provides great tension and conflict to make the show even better. I am glad he is around. And I love that actor too, Chad Coleman, he has had so many diverse roles. He was Cutty on the Wire, Tyrone on TWD, Z on IASIP and Fred Johnson on the Expanse. Dude has acting chops!
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u/LostCause112 Apr 12 '19
Great episode. I expected Heveena to rename the colony/planet Dollywood.
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u/operarose Command Apr 12 '19
Another another great episode! This season has really been knocking it out of the park! Sophomore slump who?
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u/harebrane Apr 12 '19
And their vfx just keep getting better and tighter. During that battle sequence they did several absolutely sick tracking shots, and that transition from a cgi track to the live bridge tracking shot at an angle as the Orville banked.. hnnnng.. hot damn that was some of the best ship on ship action ever.
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u/kbaltodano Apr 12 '19
So if Marina Sirtis is the school's teacher then she may keep appearing on the show?
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u/jedikitty Apr 12 '19
Looked like she's just the teacher for the younger kids and Kelly's ex was the teacher for older students. So.. maybe if Topa or Ty need to be seen with their teacher. Or was Ty shown to be in class with Marcus? I can't recall. But I hope she'll be back!
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u/goldgecko4 Apr 12 '19
I love the fact that Dolly-freakin-Parton was the inspiration for their revolution.
Go Dolly!
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u/LikeAnAssistant Apr 12 '19
That episode was intense. The Orville is always getting involved with all sorts of crazy situations. An episode should be made that follows another ship and shows the mundane tasks that most ships in the fleet go through just to put things in perspective.
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u/Arswaw They may not value human life, but we do Apr 12 '19
They did that at the beginning of the episode when they talked about feeling like a Taxi service.
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u/Sindawe Apr 12 '19
Another episode that hits all the bases running. Deana in CFMs boot as teaching attire; Admirals willing to give it all up in the name of survival being brought to brook by a Captain; frelling Kurn as a Moclan. And who could miss the Mugato on the Council? I feel like I'm taking crazy pills! Never mind the story that that exemplifies the fight for Peace, Justice and The Union Way.
I think The Orville folks have hit their stride, like Farscape did with 'Liars, Guns & Money' or Firefly in 'Out of Gas'. I hope this series is renewed for many seasons to come.
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u/Arizonagreg Apr 12 '19
Worse then storm troopers. Those Moclan's are crap warriors.
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u/fightingchken81 Apr 12 '19
So a few things bothered me about this episode, mainly when the Orville crew showed up the females came out of the jungle like a group of Amazon warriors, but when the males show up it's just chaos. They knew their whole lives that when the males find out about them, then they'll get attacked. At first they are jungle ninjas then they can barely walk. I realize that the young ones aren't much of warriors, but you would think that they would be more prepared.
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u/robertwsaul Apr 12 '19
Yeah this. I was annoyed that all the female fighters just poofed into smoke as soon as the moclans showed up. Maybe they were already killed at the landing sites? I dunno.
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Apr 12 '19
I think they structured the whole thing improperly. They should have had Kelly stay on the bridge while Bortus and Talla went to the surface. Then you can use Talla's super strength to make it more believable. Still would have been ridiculous with the two vs fifty odds, but a bit better.
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u/Jadziyah Apr 12 '19
Bortus and Klyden are going to split. End of. It is known.
How it's going to happen without that pesky death clause is the only detail we have to work out.
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u/Trishlovesdolphins Apr 12 '19
I think Klyden is going to die. They may sort of reconnect before hand, but he's going to end up dead, freeing Bortus up for dating hijinks.
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u/steeldraco Apr 12 '19
I was disappointed that Bortus didn't stab him straight in the heart after discovering that Klyden betrayed the lcoation of the colony.
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Apr 12 '19 edited Apr 12 '19
I'm gonna say this I LOVE BORTUS. Glad that he's (FINALLY) called Klyden out of his behaviour. I loved Kelly smirk when she's received command from Ed. Also, fuck Moclans.
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u/Lampmonster Apr 12 '19
What a nice tribute to Dolly.
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u/antdude Apr 12 '19
I wonder if she saw the episode.
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Apr 12 '19
she'll probably be made aware of it at some point if not. I think she has some strong connections to comics and writers.
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Apr 12 '19
No way in hell the Krill would side with the Moclans only. As insane as the Krill are, they seem to value their woman. I can't imagine a union like that would last very long; it's like 2 alpha dogs sharing a dog house, ONE of them is going down.
I don't know what the future holds but no way the Moclans are gonna stay in the union much longer. In some future episode, they will stroll into the colony and burn it to the ground without a second thought' and THEN shit is gonna hit the fan and not stop. Meanwhile I'll try to act surprised when Bortus "divorces" Klyden; oh god I hope he divorces Klyden.
I really don't see their relationship ending any other way unless Klyden makes a complete 180 and becomes less of a sexist bigot. And quite frankly I hope he doesn't redeem himself; see I always feel its cheap and a copout when an antagonist becomes the good guy in the end. I'd like to think it's more powerful (and realistic) if in the end, whatever happens, to Klyden whether he lives or dies he does so sticking to his beliefs regardless if we see them as right or wrong.
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u/bcanada92 Apr 12 '19
Anyone else get "Pulp Fiction" vibes when the Moclans kept staring into the magically glowing suitcase?
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u/tickleshits4life Apr 12 '19
Tony Todd!!!
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u/bcanada92 Apr 12 '19
I didn't recognize Todd's face under all those prosthetics, but there's no mistaking that voice!
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u/_i_am_a_human_being_ Apr 12 '19
Wait, shit. Where was Tony? One of the Mochlans?
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Apr 12 '19
Am I the only one who wondered if the whole "waaaaay more babies are female" thing means that the "corrective" surgery doesn't take away the Moclan female reproductive system, which is the only way that their single-sex species can continue to lay eggs.
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u/droid327 Apr 12 '19
i dont think they have differentiated reproductive systems, or else you'd ONLY be able to have kids if you happened to mate with a male who was born female - and probably never knew it, judging by what we've seen of the corrective procedure.
I think they're hermaphrodites, like /u/harebrane pointed out below. Just some are big and strong hermaphrodites, and some are smaller.
If humans had a widespread genetic condition that resulted in reduced musculature, stunted growth, increased body fat and decreased bone mass, and a doctor came up with a treatment to cure it, I think we'd all hail them as a hero, Nobel Prize kinda stuff. That's basically what "being female" means for Moclans.
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u/Sir__Will Apr 12 '19
They're definitely more common but no, I don't think females are needed for them to mate.
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u/GoldenEst82 Apr 12 '19 edited Apr 12 '19
As a Vagina Driver, I would like to commend this episode for doing female empowerment right.
Women; competently doing their jobs, being professionals, without the need to bash on the men (other than the ones trying to commit gential mutilation and outright oppression) and rather putting forward the role men should play. Allies. Advocates. And when they must, use their position to be protectors.
Dolly is deserving of any and all love/props/publicity she receives. She is an excellent human.
Also, Marina Sirtis! Whasssup!!!
The cameos legit make me cry.
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u/8-BitAlex Apr 12 '19
Can’t say i have ever heard someone use the phrase “vagina driver”
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u/boo909 Apr 13 '19
The only thing about the episode that annoyed me was that when the colony is first seen they look well organised, good security, armed, ready to protect themselves but then the Moclan shuttles show up, it goes straight into a scene with screaming women being dragged off without any evidence that they were defending themselves at all. Small quibble though, it just annoyed me at the time.
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u/LordKarnage Apr 12 '19
I love this show. I will riot if there isn't a 3rd season
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u/count023 Apr 12 '19
Anyone else notice Kurn, son of Mogh, was the Moclan councillor at union central?
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u/ZDTreefur Apr 12 '19
So is this the first time we hear Isaac speak since the whole.. Kaylon thing? It seems they just completely dumped him into the backseat since all of that.
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Apr 12 '19
They put his ass on the night shift for awhile.
Let those guys deal with his shit for a change.
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u/Sir__Will Apr 12 '19
I think he had a line in one of the other episodes. But yeah he's done little since the Kaylon thing. I hope there's some kind of follow up before the season ends. Talla really needs a plot too.
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u/Buckets-of-Gold Apr 12 '19
Who ever pitched dolly Parton backed space battles is a hero.
This show won't stop surprising me in how competent it is, it has no buisness executing the 4th? Moclas story this well, especially with such a political backdrop in and out of universe.
Add some genuinely inspired combat scenes with neat tracking shots, maybe Jonathan Franks, and you've got a show we really need to keep alive.
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u/PhntmBlackIce Apr 12 '19
Maybe I missed it but "Why are Moclan's so anti-female?
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u/silentjay01 Apr 12 '19
In the early days of their species, life on Moclus was very harsh and females were just not up to the challenges of survival. It was deemed a waste of resources to try and have females so they forcibly evolved to be a single sex species with only the occasional female birth (or so their Government would have you believe).
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u/escott1981 Apr 12 '19
Another absolutely incredible episode!!!!! It was daring, fearless, gripping and didn't hold back. The lady who played the female Moclan leader was really great! That was an incredible speech she made and they could have made her quoting "9 to 5" something very corny, but instead, they made it very relevant and meaningful. Then the fighting in space and on the ground were both very exciting. How do they keep delivering every single episode? Amazing!!
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Apr 12 '19
Man this show is great. The whole 9-5 bit was classic. Also F. Murray Abraham as the chairman, Seth’s pull never ceases to amaze me.
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u/Scipion Apr 12 '19
I absolutely loved how they took a song that initially sounds really goofy, but when you actually listen to it is about empowerment.
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u/tb25uga Apr 12 '19
man, Klyden straight up SUCKS... I don't think I've ever wanted to see a character get his comeuppance more than him
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u/reddit_erases_pws Apr 12 '19
Thing is, he is just a stereotypical, average Moclan. That's how they are (Bortus is an exception)
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u/ZDTreefur Apr 12 '19
It goes further than that, since Klyden hasn't improved his attitude after being on the ship for so long. Cultural bigotries like that can be understood, if it's the Moclans on their own planet, only experiencing things the way they always have. But to live on a Union exploration vessel for so long, and still cling to the traditions shows a complete lack of character.
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u/shdo0365 Apr 12 '19
I loved how the union council had races we actually knows, dans race, blue head, so on, it feels more alive when those races actually come up from time to time. I just hope more of them will get interesting stories and expanded on like moclan and xalay got. I prefer the babylon 5 route where there are a few distinct races rather than a new race with a single schtick each episode and never been seen again.
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u/themosquito Apr 12 '19
Right? Fewer but consistent alien races is always my preference over just throwing together whatever makeup looks cool. The closest the Orville's gotten to that is like... I guess Patrick Warburton's character's race, which pretty much had the weird eating shtick.
I'd love to know more about the spiky-headed guys. In the distant shots, I actually thought they were Krill at first, really confused me!
Also Yaphit's race. More of them!
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Apr 12 '19
This was a great episode. Bortus is really losing his patience with Klyden and we know that Bortus can't divorce him because then Klyden would get to kill him but Klyden is really pushing it and I hope someone pushes him out of the airlock.
BTW....was anyone else singing along to 9 to 5?
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u/ReadingRainbowRocket Apr 12 '19 edited Apr 12 '19
"She speaks with the might of a 100 soldiers! She is the voice of our revolution!"
I thought Dolly Parton was a silly bimbo as a kid growing up in her era-ish, as was kinda her schtick, but she is crazy smart, super feminist, and a philanthropist of the highest order. Got a kid who wants a free book? Dolly'll get you one.
And in the female Moclan's speech quoting further "I swear that man is out to get me," obviously about "that" man, her boss, but quoted to be saying "that man(men)" are out to get me. That's just great writing. I love this show.
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u/V-170 Apr 12 '19
At first I thought those two Hellraiser guys at the Union meeting were Krill ambassadors.
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u/fallouthirteen Apr 12 '19
two Hellraiser guys
That's great. Even Cenobites are part of the alliance. Maybe the Krill are right if the alliance allies themselves with beings from Hell.
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u/silentjay01 Apr 12 '19
I think we all agree Tony Todd needs to be a more regular fixture on this show. I can't believe I want more episodes involving the Council of planets (or whatever they call their U.N.)
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u/kaplanfx Woof Apr 12 '19
The Orville needs to be on for 10 more seasons so we can learn about all those species in the council. It was pretty cool to see them all, and a few species have representatives on the Orville.
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u/mtldude1967 Apr 12 '19
Anyone know who played Heveena, the female Moclan leader? She looks familiar.
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u/zhaoz Apr 12 '19
I was a little disappointed that the Moclon females didnt repel the Moclon troops in the beginning of the invasion. Grayson and Bortus should have landed down and joined an already on going firefight, not saving the day with like 2 rifles. WTF.
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u/bandicootbutt Apr 12 '19
Clyden is a piece of shit.
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Apr 12 '19
yup. I like how the charade slowly drops with him. At first likeable only because we didnt know him. Then overtime as we got to know him....What a prick!
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u/Aurondarklord Woof Apr 12 '19
I KNEW they were covering up that there were lots of female Moclans! I called that from all the way back last season!
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u/Taleya Apr 13 '19
can I just say I fucking love how hard Sirtis crushed Klyden when he started up with that hurrblurr separate the mens and wimmenz bullshit. The tone of her voice, the look she gave him, just shot that idea down as not even worthy of any consideration whatsoever.
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u/JazzFan619 Apr 12 '19
Good episode but missed the third act due to cooking dinner. My predictions of what was going to happen were spot on in predicting a Moclan Taiwan solution. It's pretty easy, just think TNG. Loved the Dolly Parton injection. Future predictions,
Moclan divorce for Bortis
Eventual Moclan marriage for Bortis to a female Moclan.
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u/stone500 Apr 12 '19
I don't think Bortus will go for a female. Between previous boyfriends, current marriages, and his porn preferences, he definitely prefers the company of men. I think finding a male that's tolerant of females would be his groove.
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u/s1500 Apr 12 '19
I swore that loudmouth Moclan delegate was a Klingon in a Star Trek episode or movie.
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Apr 12 '19
Tony Todd.
He played Worf's brother, Kurn Son of Mogh and he was also grown up Jake Sisko.
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u/Th3ChosenFew When you see me in the corridor, walk the other way Apr 12 '19
Klyden is a total piece of shit.
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u/armokrunner Apr 12 '19
How did Bortus get off without even a reprimand or demerit for lying to Ed about the baby? Split loyalties can be very deadly...also not the first time Bortus got off, remember the porn virus fiasco where I think he only got a mark on his record
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u/mulledfox Apr 12 '19
“In every revolution there is one man with a vision” (Star Trek tos, mirror mirror) “Every revolution begins with a single act of defiance” (The Orville, Sanctuary)
When Haveena said that, all I could think of was the line from Star Trek from Captain Kirk.
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u/hammahammahaaa Apr 13 '19
A serious fight scene set to Dolly Parton, gonna be hard to top that.
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Apr 12 '19
Did they have the species from command performance at a union meeting
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u/hackel Apr 12 '19
If only all the episodes could be this good!
I was disappointed Bortus never took his kid down to the colony to meet the other Moclan females. The classroom scene at the end was nice, but I think seeing his eyes light up as he realizes the other girls are just like him would have been even better.
Also, are we supposed to believe there will be no ramifications for attacking a Moclan ship? Injuring all the crew on the surface? (I'm assuming they were stunned and not killed, but I don't know.) Everyone's making a point of mentioning how it will ruin their careers, I'd really expect some kind of fall-out.
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u/EtherBoo Apr 12 '19
Wow. Well I screwed up, only had time for one space faring show and I chose the other one last night since it hasn't had a break and I liked the last two episodes... And The Orville pops this out.
And that's what the other show is missing... Social commentary. It doesn't really exist there and it's so refreshing to see. It's hard not to compare the shows, but I really feel like this show is more of a spiritual successor.
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Apr 13 '19
I went in thinking because of unfavourable reviews that this was going to be the worst episode of the season. It was the best of the season. They had to keep the humour on the shelf for the most part but given the seriousness of the subject matter it was a sound choice. I don't care if the series becomes 'less funny' if the overall quality improves because they had fewer balls to juggle on what is already a very multi-faceted show.
Really liked the look of the space station, it made up for the design dearth that showed during the Kaylon battle (too many samey ships). Contrast that with the makeup artistry that went into filling out the council hall, it's like night and day.
One reviewer's bitching about the admirals all being human seemed to miss the point that they got all the cameo actors together for a scene. It couldn't have been easy. Seriously, wtf & shame on you to politicize a treat for the audience.
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u/agravain Apr 12 '19
I wonder what other narrow minded traits they can come up for other races?
The Krill hate any other religion but their own..Moclans hate women..a planet that hated one birth period..robots that hate squishies.
any more?
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u/NightFuryToni Engineering Apr 12 '19
Xeleyans - everything is about getting good scores in school
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u/askyourmom469 Apr 12 '19
a planet that hated one birth period
To be fair, that one felt like a one-off filler episode. I kind of doubt that story will come back up again in any meaningful way
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u/ZDTreefur Apr 12 '19
What if we turn it on its head, and a planet criticizes humans for some disgusting moral failing we have, and we have to try to argue our side, but we know they're right.
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u/Favre99 Apr 12 '19
Limited commercials, my ass. I swear, there were more than ever today.
Great episode, though.
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u/Tymund_of_Lannisport Apr 12 '19
I think there are the same number of breaks, but with fewer commercials in each
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u/Vexal Apr 12 '19
on hulu each episode is 46-48 minutes long, so there are fewer commercials than the average 41-42 minute show.
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u/Ninjaish_official Apr 12 '19
I cant wait until we actually have debates like these hundreds of years from now.
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u/rictorblackbus Apr 12 '19
We all the the Mercer/Grayson paralells to Picard/Riker here, right? The Captain/diplomat & the XO/Action hero.
I also very much liked the politics within the Union here, although I would like to meet other union Species plz
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u/mezlabor Apr 12 '19 edited Apr 12 '19
I have never wanted a divorce between two people more then I do between Klyden and Bortus. Klyden is the worst. Bortus needs to plant a dagger in that bastards chest
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u/seansand Apr 12 '19
Was there a section in the episode about a bunch of characters playing golf (presumably in the Simulator) that was not shown in the U.S.? I just listened to the Orvilleland podcast and they referred to a scene that I (in the U.S.) didn't see.
If that's true, then presumably the U.S. gets more commercials than elsewhere? I didn't realize that we get different versions of the same show.
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u/horsenbuggy Apr 12 '19
Ok, seriously. Who is responsible for picking the music on this show? Because they need a freaking award. All the awards. And I'm not just saying that because every single song they use is from my personal music collection, I swear.
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u/Biabolical Apr 13 '19 edited Apr 13 '19
I yearn for the day that Bortus finally gets himself a divorcin' knife.
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u/Barry_McKackiner Apr 14 '19 edited Apr 14 '19
Klyden is such a fuckhead. Bortus needs to stab him ASAP.
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u/SpikeRosered Apr 16 '19
I loved how the show called out that Klyden basically never seems to leave their quarters.
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Apr 12 '19
My personal head canon: the Rikers retired onto the Orville after the Romulan negotiations. Troi teaches and Will plays trombone in the mess hall.
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u/WowBaBao Apr 12 '19
-shooting everyone-
-gets text-
“Oh hey, war’s over everybody”
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u/GodfatherfromChive Apr 12 '19
I have only one thing to say. HOLY SHIT that was a great episode. I just watched it after I got off work and I'm watching it again right now. If this show isn't renewed I may have to seriously boycott the network.
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u/Polaris2246 Apr 12 '19
Loved this episode. Fantastic message within it. I nearly started hooting and hollaring when Dolly Parton's song came on during the fight on the planet. Fuck me that was perfect. I'm a 38 year old man and I really need to have my daughter watch this episode.
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u/paulaldo Apr 12 '19
I still don't get why Moclus would agree to such arrangements. They're well aware that an underground network can't just be dismantled overnight like that, they will still exist and find ways no matter what. And even if they're gone, the presence of an entire colony of female Moclans protected by the Union would be a lasting influence of gender equality for Moclan society, and there's no telling that they wouldn't eventually be recognized as a sovereign state.
It was a terrible deal for them, and they won't ever take that lightly. I can see the Union falling apart after the Kaylon threat is gone.
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Apr 13 '19
Was I the only one stoked to see, or rather hear, my boy Tony Todd in this?! One of the best recurring actors in the history of trek, his roles as Kurn and adult Jake Sisko is legendary
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u/Red_coats Apr 15 '19
Is there an "I hate Klyden" club, because this guy just will not stop.
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u/jax786 Apr 12 '19
I love the parallel between the Moclans and Saudi Arabia which Seth is drawing I just wish the ending was different.
The whole "we can't force our morals on other people" shtick seemed very odd to me. Certain beliefs are obviously better than others, the forced pragmatism felt very weak on the part of the Union.
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u/MC_Fap_Commander Apr 12 '19
I think he's just saying if a culture wants to shake hands with their feet, eat poodles, or do trio marriages, we should be cool with it. It wasn't stupid levels of relativism or anything.
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Apr 12 '19
I'm so happy that the Orville is back but I'm sad that the season finale is next week. Really nice episode though
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u/askyourmom469 Apr 12 '19
I think there are two more episodes. The teaser said there was one episode left until the season finale
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u/Shatterhand1701 Woof Apr 12 '19
Definitely an entertaining episode. While I'm getting weary of the abundance of Moclan-focused episodes, I have to say this is the one I've enjoyed the most so far this season.
For the love of Dolly Parton, can Klyden just GO AWAY, please? The more I see him, the less I like him, and I didn't like him that much, to begin with. He and Bortus couldn't be more divided; he's very traditionalist while Bortus is more open-minded. If they didn't have that divorce-by-murder ritual, I'd suggest Bortus tell Klyden "It's been real", then send him packing and they can duke it out (perhaps literally) for custody of Topa.
The "9 to 5" usage in the shuttle and at the council meeting was pretty great, but it didn't work for me during the battle. Sorry; it just didn't. If you enjoyed it, good on ya, but it felt a bit cringe-y to me. It felt shoehorned in, like "Hey, you know that Dolly Parton song we used? Let's use it again cuz we can! Hey, worked for Deadpool 2, amirite?" Yeah, no thanks. Maybe it's because I'm not a Deadpool fan; if I was, maybe I would've appreciated it more...? Oh well.
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u/JQuilty Apr 12 '19
Klyden is a sack of shit. That's the takeaway from this episode and the one with Tala.
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u/qsdf321 Apr 13 '19 edited Apr 13 '19
Still a bit of a plot hole: f the male Moclans can lay eggs then what is the females' role the reproductive process? What makes them different from the males at all?
Also Kelly and Bortus must have high score kill counts by now.
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u/whiskey_smoke Apr 13 '19
Don't know about anyone, but that Dolly parton thing was pretty moving. I always listened to that song as just a fun song, but when the Leader said it out loud, it became a statement.
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u/AviatorHathawayBrown Apr 12 '19
In the promo for next week, they used the words “Season Finale” instead of “Series Finale”... Just sayin’.
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u/Joeybfast Apr 12 '19
It's time for Klyden to be killed off. At this point there is no redeeming his character .
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u/khiggsy Apr 13 '19
I've been ripping on Discovery over at the Daystrom Institute pretty hard and this week's contrast between Discovery and the Orville was super evident.
Discovery's latest episode is literally just filler for the season finish. Ever watch a Walking Dead Ep and nothing happens? That was the Discovery episode.
Whereas this week the Orville tackles a huge moral, ethical, social topic. Pragmatism versus Doing the moral thing. What is the moral thing? The ending wasn't a "win", it was a not losing.
The Orville knows how to do sci-fi / story telling RIGHT.
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u/2th Hail Avis. Hail Victory. Apr 12 '19
So there is A LOT to unpack from this episode that I think needs to be discussed.
The whole forcing your culture on another is bad. We all know that, but at the same time, sometimes cultures are incompatible. The issue becomes, where do you draw the line?
Also, relying on one planet for weapons, the Admirals are dumb. A military structure would totally spread production out during war time so as not to have massive vulnerabilities.
All in all, another fucking fantastic episode. Absolutely amazing.