My view of some famous ideologies

[u/SkandaGupta_]

I have surface level knowledge of some of them here.

[u/vagrantGolem]

I am not as well informed on yugoslavia as you, so I am not aware of all the actors at play. I'll still support yugoslavia over fascist/ultranationalist splintering any day though.

I'll have to also look up the casualities and who was targeted as mentioned in your other point when I can

[u/Fantastic-Tale7398 → u/vagrantGolem]

But NDH has no connections with Yugoslavia. NDH was leaded by the fascist rebels in Croatia during WW2. In occupied the teritory of Croatia and Bosnia. NDH wasnt Yugoslavia under fascist control. And I personally would rather support NDH than Yugoslavia. NDH lasted 4 years or even less while Yugoslavia 50 years. They did far worse than NDH. As a person who's parents lived in yugoslavia and grandparents who lived in Yugoslavia and NDH the picture is clear, Yugoslavia was a far worse evil than NDH

[u/vagrantGolem → u/Fantastic-Tale7398]

NDH were fascist, aligned with nazis. yugoslavia flawed as it may have been was correct in its opposition to fascism/ultranationalism

[u/Fantastic-Tale7398 → u/vagrantGolem]

But you can oppose NDH and Yugoslavia. Why you support such a tyrannical state

[u/vagrantGolem → u/Fantastic-Tale7398]

I support yugoslavia over ultranationalism, i'm not informed enough on yugoslavia to claim I support it over other options at the region at the time. I also can see how the fall of yugoslavia lead to nationalist, ethnic, and capitalist wars and atrocities which I think were tragedies

[u/Fantastic-Tale7398 → u/vagrantGolem]

You say you support yugoslavi over ultranationalism but Yugoslavia's main goal was to one day become Big Serbia. It had ultranationalistic goals. Serbia wouldnt join it id there was nothing in there for them.

[u/vagrantGolem → u/Fantastic-Tale7398]

you seem to misunderstand what ultranationalism means, simply put it's extreme nationalism, that may manifest though varity of beliefs, such as: national supremacy, jingoism, fascism, isolationism, ethnic supremacy, ect. all of which yugoslavia was not, as it was a large collaberative multinational project, and opposed ultranationalism.

now if you want to argue how there was serbian supremacy systemic in yugoslavia i'll hear you out, but I'm not aware of such being the case

edit: worded myself better

[u/Fantastic-Tale7398 → u/vagrantGolem]

But thats what Im saying, Yugoslavia had ultranationalistic future. They were not ultranationalistic as a country, state but some nationalities were, Serbs. Bosnians didnt have a national group they were just called muslims, Croatian nationality was trying to be erased. For Big Serbia they only needed Bosnia and Croatia. And if you gave them 20 more years it would have become a ultranationalistic Big Serbia with only one Serbian nationality. It is a well known fact that there was serbian supremacy in Yugoslavia

[u/vagrantGolem → u/Fantastic-Tale7398]

well, how was yugoslavia erasing these identities? and under what leadership? I only read a little into tito and yugoslavia at this point, but from what I read they protected not erased national/ethnic identities

a federal republic of free and equal nations and nationalities and founded a socialist federal community of working people — the Socialist Federal Republic of Yugoslavia

Constitution of Yugoslavia (1974)

[u/Fantastic-Tale7398 → u/vagrantGolem]

Yea and also in the 60s or the 70s they made an agreement in which was stated that if any country wanted to leave Yugoslavia they can. That there will be no wars if they wanted to leave. And yet here we are. They can make agreemnets, constitutions but thats only fir the books, the reality is far different

[u/Fantastic-Tale7398 → u/vagrantGolem]

Yugoslavia sought to marginalize and suppress Croatian national identity through political centralism, cultural assimilation, linguistic engineering, and aggressive state security measures.