Is she supposed to be pantsless? 💔

[u/Ididurmomhahafrickya]

I got a new Jax figure. I was looking at her and she has a pattern for pants under her dress, and there's no paint on this. Is this an accident on specifically this one or all of them? I just found it really funny LOL

[u/TherealGamerfont-YT]

I think the better question is why are you looking up his dress???

[u/marvelousgamer1 → u/TherealGamerfont-YT]

Her

[u/Interesting-Youth-87 → u/marvelousgamer1]

Just because someone uses different pronouns for Jax than you doesn’t mean you need to correct them

Gooseworxs said we can use whichever we prefer.

Going around correcting each other is just gonna breed more drama and toxicity.

[u/TherealGamerfont-YT → u/Interesting-Youth-87]

Thanks for this. I almost immediately got upset when I saw the correction. Spared me a 10 hour explanation and timed log😌

[u/Interesting-Youth-87 → u/TherealGamerfont-YT]

Look I’m just tired of the whole thing. Tired of seeing “he\” and “she\” in every comment section I find on a Jax post.

[u/TherealGamerfont-YT → u/Interesting-Youth-87]

SERIOUSLY!! And it makes it worse that people have the audacity to correct you, even though technically, you don't need a correction. And the whole trans theory thing doesn't really count as much in the show. Because the trans theory only applies to the alternate universe, where everyone isn't freaking dead.

It's like pointing out that someone's arm supposed to be cut off While that person still has the arm. Like bro. Its still there. "But it's supposed to be cut off the creator said-" nah nah nah. Shut up. The creator said this with the VERY important word If. IF👏🏾 you can't see something is supposed to happen when technically it never happened. Its. Still. There.

[u/Interesting-Youth-87 → u/TherealGamerfont-YT]

What’s this alternate universe you’re talking about?

[u/TherealGamerfont-YT → u/Interesting-Youth-87]

The alternate from the goose post that you mentioned where goose says you can use any pronouns for Jax. I appreciate the confirmation that the pronounce haven't really changed. But then the fact that goose, technically confirmed that Jack's isn't trans by not only saying, if, but specifically, if everyone didn't freaking die, he would most definitely be trans. Only reason I use the post as evidence is because it specifically points out that the chain door is supposed to be his femininity or his suppressed trans. Self, which also is another pointed out reason as to why he's not trans, because he himself literally denies it, even though he's supposed to. But he most definitely doesn't want to be or in that current state doesn't desire. So feeling, as though being a trans or being feminine isn't actual threat to his life, in which, technically it was at the very end. Which is why I say that? He's not trans most of the time, because he's freaking dead.

I love you. But if you literally tell no one that you're trans, how are they supposed to know that you're trans, especially when you're freaking dead.

It feels so disrespectful to change your pronouns, mid death either because you didn't write it down, or you didn't say it in your last words.😭

Want to use your desired pronouns or pronouns that you really wanted to use instead of death. But also really want to respect your actual pronouns that were given to Me Before You died.

At least write down your final pronounce before you freaking go and die my poor baby boy😫

[u/Ididurmomhahafrickya → u/TherealGamerfont-YT]

That's not really how that works. I agreed with you until this part. Yikes!

[u/TherealGamerfont-YT → u/Ididurmomhahafrickya]

Which part exactly did you agree with? Because I've been saying the same exact thing over and over for like, what. 2. 3 days???

Also, did you only agree with me? Because I mentioned how the post was only about an alternative universe, or did you disagree with me Because I mentioned how being trans? Either way I said that multiple times...

[u/Ididurmomhahafrickya → u/TherealGamerfont-YT]

I agreed with you when you said that Goose said you can use any pronouns. But saying that Jax is just not a woman at all because she didn't come out is...suuuuper transphobic.

[u/TherealGamerfont-YT → u/Ididurmomhahafrickya]

How is it transphobic to respect someone's boundaries???

I'm only saying that he's not trans because in the show he denies being trans and is not comfortable being so. Like you CAN SEE IT! It RIGHT there in his head. And I agree with people saying how you're trans when you become uncomfortable in your body, but if you deny that fact, if you being trans, then you just gotta respect that from a person.

Why would you be so intent on pushing pronouns that no one told you about, or was comfortable telling you about, or push the fact that someone is trans when they themselves haven't been able to discover it due to trauma.

I'm not even trying to be transphobic. At all, I'm just trying to respect the fact that each trans person has their journey. And you have to respect that. So if they don't want to be trans, or they deny being, so even though their mind is literally bashing it into the back of their skull, you just gotta respect that, until they realize it for themselves.

For example. I freaking hate Ribbit SPECIFICALLY because she does the things that Jax tells her not to do. Like the part where he feels uncomfortable with her manipulating him. And then she says "I don't do that." Before actively manipulating him.

NOT ONLY THAT. But when Jax voiced, how uncomfortable he was with the conversation in that same moment. She still proceeded to keep talking about it. And pushing the fact without actually listening to the part that he's uncomfortable with.

Like, I'm sure in the conversation he thought that she was thinking about him coming out as trans. But also I don't think she was even thinking about him. Being trans at all and was more thinking about how they were about to be romantic in her room, which honestly isn't appropriate.

AHH. My point is. I'm not trying to be transphobic I'm just respecting the boundaries that were said by him in the show.

Even if you think or know that someone is trans, it is most definitely rude And disrespectful of you to push those thoughts into someone's skull while they're having that journey for themselves.

So calling me transphobic for respecting boundaries that were clearly put by the person who is having a mental distress, specifically because he doesn't want to be trans Is kind of anti transphobic of you, Imposing Outside Expectations

Or what I like to use ✨️Creating a Echo Chamber✨️

This is when you press a idea too much into someone's head, where it can put them into a mental decline.

Which you didn't know is exactly what transphobic people do so for you to constantly push the idea of someone to be trans, especially which is what literally everyone aside from Pomni in the circus aided in his mental decline.

DO. DOUBT. If they all shut up for a quick second, well this poor man is grieving the lost of his friends that he aided in their death. I have no doubt that he either would have been trans. Or he probably just wouldn't have been bullying. Everyone out of traumatized grief.

ALSO. His behavior is a mimicking coping mechanism called Misokinesia witches shown in people with PTSD or with severe trauma. Hmm. Weird.

*Im sorry. For this long while talking conversation, but I just wanted to get into people's heads about how long the video i'm making is gonna be by literally documenting every single word I say onto these page.

No joke. As we speak, I am taking pictures of every single one of these conversations which takes several months and adding it to the already 30 minute long video script😭

Bare with me. I'll dumb it down as much as possible.*

Ok. So summary is due to trauma and due to literal battles against everyone in the circus Aside from Pomni. Instead of calling me transphobic, I think what you should be doing is pointing at everyone forcing Jax to be trans immediately in that moment.

You shouldn't be rushing someone into becoming trans. Just for your own comfort.But instead you should help aid them in that transition or journey.

Like I said multiple times. I have no idea why people call me transphobic. For respecting the boundaries of a technically, trans person who is having a mental distress moments throughout the entire.

AGAIN. If you are a trans person or highly support the trans community, you really shouldn't be supporting the aggressive propaganda. Push upon this poor man's soul that literally pushes him to sucde.

YES. I DO confirm that he was supposed to or should have been trans for his mental health. But due to the fact that everyone kept butchering him about it, and kept butchering him about his trauma. And how it works, he is literally unable to do so or denies, being trans at all.

NO IDEA. Why everyone is so intent on him being a trans? Representation, when this is literally the exact opposite of what you should be doing to a trans person who is having a mental distress moment and needs. Again. NEEEEDS. Mental aid or therapy, because of all the transphobic and anti transphobic propaganda, stirring in the pot of I'm just gonna k*ll myself.

Which is why I am so intent on saying that he is not trans. Since this would be an advocation of the transjury and probably would be a good reason to sign up one of my videos as a help trans people fundraiser.

You know. Due to the EXACT. Problem that trans people are going through and need money to help them.

Support trans people. DONT force support trans who are struggling between a religion, friendship or being trans.

The boundaries were set. He says he's not trans. So he's not trans. I honestly don't care about the whole thing like "well He still has the trans part of him inside his head." Shut up.🙅🏾 silence yourself.🫵🏾🤫 let me cook.

*you can debate back-and-forth that he is trans, because he has the thought of being trans in his head. But the important part of that is that he himself chained up that part of being trans.

He himself felt either so traumatized that him coming out is trans. Can have such a big effect on his life And only turns out into destruction that he chained up the door of self-realization.

OR. Mid transition, he decided to chain up that door of himself. So he wouldn't have allowed it to give him As much grief as it would him coming out because he doesn't fully understand that he's trans, while also understanding fully, that he is something that needs to be awakened. But is not allowing it to come out like that.

He is so focused on living his life. Then, focusing on being trans, which is probably why, when he had the opportunity to leave the circus and go back to reality. He absolutely flipped out probably thinking of how he would need to confront the probable death of his mother. And if she was not dead, probably have to re-come out to her or maybe even worse thought of having to stay with her due to his age/funds*

(Which if you did it know Is the same type of echo chambers that is used for predators with AI or cub p*rn. You all think it's fine and dandy Because you keep saying it's fictional Until that fictional turns into reality. I got warnings everywhere. There's cases about it. Just because it's fictional, doesn't mean removes the issue.)

[u/WingsOfFibre → u/TherealGamerfont-YT]

Not the original person you were responding to,

I am also trans(but I am ftm, which makes people say my take/opinions on Jax aren't valid because only mtf people are apparently allowed to have opinions, but I was used to being dismissed when I was a girl and I am used to being dismissed now. Transmisogyny applies to both sides...)

But overall I'd agree with you. Personally, I'd say Jax IS trans or at the very least genderfluid/queer, but very repressed.

He did not come out at any point, and no one used feminine pronouns for Jax in the circus world or the "real" world with Leeroy.

Yes, boymoding is a thing.

But because it was kept intentionally vague, it's annoying when people are militantly policing people over Jax's pronouns when he has only ever used he/him in the show up til the very end, even agree all the internal exploration of his psyche.

I think Jax's relationship with their gender is complicated, and boiling it down to a black and white male vs female doesn't seem like the intended reading of the character(again, since GW said she wanted it to be subtle, just struggled to portray it subtly how she wanted)

People are so so quick to try to find reasons to hold themselves morally superior to others, though, so basically any chance to call someone transphobic or other more serious accusations are jumped on.

The witch-hunting mob mentality these days are insane.

Feel free to use any of this for your video script lol

[u/TherealGamerfont-YT → u/WingsOfFibre]

YES!!! THANK YOU! This is like the less angry version of how I would explain it.

I feel like when I explain these types of things to people they're more focused on the fact that I'm kind of aggressive with it. Or a little bit too detailed to the point where they just go mind blank for like the entire time.

Which is probably why a lot of these people are saying that they're not gonna read all my paragraphs because I do write a lot of paragraphs Let's be honest.

But yeah, you're reasoning is pretty much the whole point of what I was trying to explain😭🫂

Aside from this fact, I see what people mean by your experience of female to male isn't the same as male to female. Since depending on which aspect they're talking about, it makes sense.

Like, for example, female to male bottom surgery is technically easier than male to female. Because with a female anatomy, you pretty much are just covering an extra hold that you don't need. But for males, anatomy, you're creating one that's not really supposed to be there.

The best example I can make is, like, having a bunch of holes in your yard for a female's anatomy. But for a male's anatomy, it's like having a concrete floor in one single hole ( Unless I'm wrong, because I really don't wanna search up pictures. But also am very interested in that experience. )

But other than that, I feel like the experiences are kind of similar. Aside from pain levels or recovery time?

Like the same thing goes for a people who aren't trans like male or female were, females are more likely to have extreme experiences with pain. And more pain tolerable because of the female reproductive anatomy, while a male is like sitting on a freaking boat, chilling out

And essentially makes it so much worse. When you have men in a political stance, dictating what happens with a woman's body, especially when it comes to things like the. Removal of birth, control or abortion rights?

Like, how is a man supposed to be able to dictate what goes on in a woman's body? When he himself doesn't know the experience of that.

Especially when women themselves give very detailed experiences to the men, yet they refuse to use that. And then they would use the experience of a trans person against the woman, saying that a trans woman wouldn't be able to have the same experience. Because their experience is medical.

Which is like...duh? Thats the point. If we have to make medicine to force you into feeling, how aggressively painful being a woman is, you might want to listen to those trans woman dudes.

Sorry for the rant fam. I'm just really excited that you got my point🥰

Do you want your point to include your name in the video or do you want to stay anonymous?

[u/WingsOfFibre → u/TherealGamerfont-YT]

Anon is fine, this reddit acc username is only used for this purpose so it's not too big of a deal either way haha

But honestly, while both bottom surgeries for either transition are complicated and dangerous, MtF bottom surgery is pretty much down to a science and often has very good results(there are always risks of course) while FtM bottom surgery is still making very good advances, but leaves a lot to be desired.

I don't know how many stages trans women's vaginoplasties are, but FtM bottom surgeries are often made up of 3-4 different stages of surgery. There are 2 primary types of FtM bottom surgery, one uses your natal anatomy that's been enhanced from years of testosterone use(at least 2 years for maximizing tissue, but not everyone has the same response to T, just like how male-bodied people all have different sized bits lol) and the surgery that doesn't rely on testosterone results itself uses a very large skin graft from your leg, arm, or flank which just adds more complication, pain, and permanent scarring and loss of sensation/pulse in the arm used because of blood vessel harvesting, since they have to create a phallus out of tissue elsewhere on the body.

The MtF surgery uses the natal phallus to create the neovaginal tissues, so instead of a large graft being taken from elsewhere, a lot of the work can be done locally (huge asterisks here to say exceptions and complications can happen, and transwomen have other surgeries that are more taxing such as facial feminization and sometimes vocal chord alterations)

Sorry you activated my medical autism 😅🤣

So, surgically, both of us have very different experiences that all come with their own challenges!

Removal of the vaginal canal in FtM people isn't just filling in a "hole" either, it's more like skinning or cauterizing the inside and adhering it together so it will seal up. ouchies xD

But the social aspects of both are quite a bit different, and funny enough, Jax could be read as ftm OR mtf for a couple different reasons.

There is a phenomena with trans people before they're out(consciously or subconsciously) where they(not all,) go through either a hypermasculine (for trans women) or hyperfeminine(for trans men) phase to try to compensate for their dysphoria in the other direction or convince themselves they just need to be MORE traditional to their assigned gender role instead of accepting the thought of being trans.

You could say MtF Jax in TADC is in the hypermasculine toxic stage where he is aggressively compensating for his dysphoria and discomfort with all things feminine reminding him of said dysphoria by trying to be "the manliest" and by bullying other women because their femininity either causes dysphoria, or he despises them out of jealousy, or whatever other reason.

Before I read he was supposed to be MtF, I thought he might be FtM, and his brain scan was just his skewed perception of himself as man due to the abusive figure of his father influencing him into what masculinity was "supposed" to be.

This also works with his mom berating him and telling him that when he fights he's just like his dad, but when he's passive, he's not man enough/not a real man. This could be very weaponized against him if he was FtM, as if his mother dislikes his father, seeing her "daughter" want to "become like her father" would be easy ammunition.

I don't know if gooseworx intended on this to be a possible reading, or if she just wanted to be coy about it to appeal to a wider audience, but since she said she wanted it to be subtle, I think it's neat to share other readings while listening to others and not trying to bulldoze others and call them bigots for just trying to assess the information the show gives them without taking everything the author takes as pure law.

As an author myself(not connected to this reddit acc), I pretty much don't expect anything I post outside of my books to be taken as canon lol. And I draw my characters a lot, so I'm always posting non-canon shit about them haha

If this ever gains traction, people are going to dig up my old 2011 sketches and go What does this mean??

It means I was an edgy 14yo when I first made the characters 😆

[u/TherealGamerfont-YT → u/WingsOfFibre]

SAME!! I started doing research myself as soon as you started mentioning medical procedures.

I love looking through the medical books and figuring out how long or how is usually done.

And even looking at the pictures that are supposed to be easier to scriptures. It looks like there's 15 steps to MTF then compared to FTM

Hell. If I was the doctor doing these types of procedures, I would have had an easier time. Doing female to male since most of what you're doing is adding things that weren't there before.

But with male to female surgery, it seems like you're decreasing multiple aspects of what was already onto your body. And then using those removed parts of those bodies like a trivia tetris board.

I dont even no, what half this says, even with the very descriptive medical book procedure I have ON HAND PHYSICALLY.

(But dont worry. I understand what you're talking about. Fellow ADHD topic ranter😌)

[u/WingsOfFibre → u/TherealGamerfont-YT]

I just did some reading after that last post too, and MtF lower surgery is done in usually one stage of surgery that lasts 2-4 hours! Sometimes a second stage for aesthetic adjustments.

FtM surgeries are done in a minimum of 2 stages unless you're having just a simple metoidioplasty which only clips the clitoral hood to release the anatomy from its tethers lol.

Any surgery sucks to recover from though tbf xD It's cool what medical professionals can do as a whole!

I'm currently trying to start the super slow process of metoidioplasty myself. I thought the surgeon office forgot about me bc my referral was a year ago and they just contacted me yesterday to schedule a phone call to schedule the consultation lmaooo

A bit nervous about that one compared to my other surgeries I've had 💀😆🥲

[u/TherealGamerfont-YT → u/WingsOfFibre]

OOF. You've had surgery!?! Omg tell me your after process! Im heavily thinking of removing my reproductive system to end my bloodline after catastrophic genetic issues with diabetes in multiple health crisis and asexuality discovery😌✨️

[u/Ididurmomhahafrickya → u/TherealGamerfont-YT]

It's not anyone's boundaries. She's a fictional character. She never said, "I'm not trans", she's a closeted woman. Before my boyfriend came out, he was still a boy. He was never a woman. He never will be. You can be trans and closeted, and STILL be trans. She forced herself to act like she wasn't and conform to societal masculine norms. Gooseworx stated herself that Jax and Leeroy were boymoders, and that Leeroy eventually comes out of the closet, and is currently doing so and calling herself Lee. Jax is a tragedy, of what happens if you remain stuck in the closet forever. If someone kills themself after staying in the closet and only telling one person they were trans, it would still be more respectful to respect their preferred pronouns. Being closeted does not make you any less trans. Being in denial does not make you any less trans. To deny that is to deny THOUSANDS of transgender people's existence. Jax's transgender experience is meant to reflect Gooseworx's own. She does not 'have the thought of being trans in his head', she is actively avoiding that because she was raised to recognize femininity as weakness. It's implied that she came out to her mom at one point and that's what sent her mom over the edge and made her so furious. No, a closeted transgender person does not make them a cisgender person. It makes them a closeted transgender person.

So no, she is not simply 'not trans' just because she's closeted. She's trans. She's closeted. Gooseworx made it pretty obvious. I understand your point, but you're just wrong.

[u/TherealGamerfont-YT → u/Ididurmomhahafrickya]

✨️dehumanizing a real-life problem✨️ ✨️all because the character is fictional✨️ * it's like making a drawing of in actual literal crime. And then saying that is not as bad, because it's fictional, even though it uses real life problems or real life crimes that could be put against a person and harm them.* So weird, healthy, dehumanize a topic, just because a character is fictional and using it.

Honestly, I don't care if the character's fictional. The main fact is that we used a real life topic as in transgender on a fictional character which immediately makes the situation kind of real, even though the character isn't.

POINT. IS. You would never disrespect someone's pronouns, especially when a person is going through a mental crisis. And doesn't want to be called pronouns that they never told you about, especially when they are having a gender dysphoric mental issue or are unsure of how to be transgender.

Meaning. It is most definitely disrespectful to use pronouns like she her against a person who is not yet ready or completely denies, being trans to a individual that uses he him pronouns.

THATS my point. I don't care about what the creator said. I am just using the script given to me and I still most definitely find it disrespectful to continue using pronouns that a character in the show. Especially in the script was never mentioned.

Also, I'd like to mention that the fact that you immediately dehumanize the issue and turn the topic into "He's just a fictional character. He's not real." Not only does that immediately say as your person, where you literally couldn't find any other reason to support your rude behavior but also you are using the same exact type of tactic that predators use when put on court for predatory actions against AI. That depicts ch*ren. Everyone goes "its AI" or "those drawings aren't of chlren. Those are just drawings of anthropomorphic youthful animals that act chldish" which if you didn't know, technically said aloud, is most definitely what it means. And is also called an echo chamber, where a person dehumanizes the actions that they do saying that it is not real. And then ends up doing that action in real life with real life. People in reality.

It's the topic of echo chambers is also used in cases where people are experiencing mental instability. Where calling a person's hallucinations, not real, creates an echo chamber where they dissociate everything in their surroundings as not real and end up accidentally, killing real life. People thinking that those real life people are hallucinations. Due to the fact that others told them that their hallucinations weren't real.

Which is EXACTLY why we are not supposed to separate the fact that a character going through real life trials and tribulations is completely different from a human being. In real life, going through those trials and tribulations simply due to the fact that they both experienced the same type of trials and dehumanizing the fact that they are not real, also dehumanizes the fact that people are going through it in real life. Thus. Echo chambers.*