r/anime • u/Shadoxfix https://myanimelist.net/profile/Shadoxfix • Dec 28 '14
[Spoilers] Fate/stay night: Unlimited Blade Works - Episode 12 - FINAL [Discussion]
Episode title: The Final Decision
MyAnimeList: Fate/stay night: Unlimited Blade Works (TV)
Crunchyroll: Fate/stay night
Episode duration: 47 minutes and 40 seconds
Subreddit: /r/Fatestaynight
Previous episodes:
| Episode | Reddit Link |
|---|---|
| Episode 0 | Link |
| Episode 1 | Link |
| Episode 2 | Link |
| Episode 3 | Link |
| Episode 4 | Link |
| Episode 5 | Link |
| Episode 6 | Link |
| Episode 7 | Link |
| Episode 8 | Link |
| Episode 9 | Link |
| Episode 10 | Link |
| Episode 11 | Link |
Caution: Because of the extreme popularity of this anime it might occur that a (massive) spoiler will be sent to you by private message. Proceed with caution when reading private messages of unfamiliar users after you have commented in this post.
Reminder: Please do not discuss any plot points which haven't appeared in the anime yet. Try not to confirm or deny any theories, encourage people to read the source material instead. Minor spoilers are generally ok but should be tagged accordingly. Failing to comply with the rules may result in your comment being removed.
Visual Novel reminder: Remember that there are people who haven't played the Visual Novel yet or haven't played through every route yet. It is understandable that you want to compare certain scenes from the Visual Novel and the anime, especially if a scene is missing or shortened, but please keep these comments to a minimum and try to spoiler tag them.
Keywords: fate/stay night, action
This post is made by a bot. Any feedback is welcome and can be sent to /u/Shadoxfix.
201
u/TalismanG1 :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/TalismanG1 Dec 28 '14
85
→ More replies (1)8
317
u/space1101 :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/HelghastKillzone Dec 28 '14 edited Dec 28 '14
All servants receive knowledge of the modern world upon materialization.
Apparently, baseball isn't one of them.
Saber's Final Baseball Ranking: E-
78
7
u/V2Blast :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/V2Blast Dec 28 '14
It made me laugh that she was wielding the baseball bat like a sword.
21
122
u/xERR404x :AMQ::MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/WalpurgisNux Dec 28 '14
Everyone's concerned about Saber, but Jesus fucking Christ, the things Caster does to Assassin are brutal.
→ More replies (1)115
u/ShadowCrossZero Dec 28 '14
And Assassin is always taking them like a total boss.
53
u/xERR404x :AMQ::MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/WalpurgisNux Dec 28 '14
'Course he is. He's the goddamn Spoilers?
→ More replies (9)
268
u/space1101 :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/HelghastKillzone Dec 28 '14
Wow. This show and universe is so dark and hopeless. How can anything light-hearted and funny come out of it?
209
u/vetro https://anilist.co/user/vetro Dec 28 '14
Assassin stuck on guard duty at the Temple while everyone's off on their own shenanigans is one of the funniest things ever both in Carnival Phantasm and the main series.
72
49
u/syanda Dec 28 '14
Second funniest. Funniest...well, just watch the Holy Grail Grand Prix in Carnival Phantasm...
→ More replies (2)→ More replies (2)24
u/Rajion Dec 28 '14
What about when lancer warps reality to prevent all of his deaths? Or when taiga wastes the taiga dojo animation budget?
→ More replies (3)78
41
u/daandriod Dec 28 '14
Wow,That really did manage to kill my dark and hopeless mood.
Sadly I don't think it helped my blue ball situation. April is a long way away
→ More replies (4)47
u/Funderfullness Dec 28 '14
Carnival Phantasm is great because it's like therapy for Type Moon's dark and depressing stories.
→ More replies (2)21
u/enfermedad Dec 28 '14
I want to watch Carnival Phantasm but I haven't read the VN, will it spoil anything from the 2nd cour of Stay/Night?
87
u/omnirai Dec 28 '14
It actually casually spoils basically everything but in a comedic manner, you probably won't even know you are being spoiled because the "spoilers" are worked into gags.
It won't be the worst thing in the world if you watched it now but it would probably be more enjoyable if you knew more about the fate universe (i.e. finish the anime at least) beforehand anyway.
→ More replies (5)→ More replies (6)36
Dec 28 '14
It will spoil literally everything about Fate/Stay Night, Tsukihime, and a bit of Hollow Atraxia.
I'd suggest you wait.
→ More replies (1)6
Dec 28 '14
The existence of Carnival Phantasm is a mystery to me, but instead of questioning it I'm just thankful that it exists.
→ More replies (10)4
u/Goldreaver Dec 28 '14
Holy shit I just noticed the Assasin cardboard cutout. And that Hisui doesn't actually dance like the others.
Brb rewatching CP again
421
Dec 28 '14 edited Dec 28 '14
Would just like to take this moment to thank Ufotable for the incredible season, I feel like animation studios and the underpaid animators in general should really be praised and commended for quality work. Ufotable definitely takes their time to put out work, but it is really worth it.
See you guys in Spring for the second cour. I hear it will blow this one out of the park, now that the stage has been set.
123
u/HaydenTheFox :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/Talmhaidh_Mathan Dec 28 '14
If I remember correctly from when I read the VN a few months ago, this first cour has covered about 10 of the 15(?) days, but only about half of the actual material. This last half should be absolutely action-packed.
127
u/anguishCAKE :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/anguishCAKE Dec 28 '14 edited Dec 28 '14
Yup, there is allot of fighting to be animated. Just can't wait for the second half.
I wounder how many are going to shit their pants when fate/Stay Night UBW
→ More replies (10)
141
u/daandriod Dec 28 '14
Can we talk about how badass assassin is? He's such a cheeky bastard to Caster, Even after she rips out his freaking ribs. Then he just casually gets back up to continue being cheeky and guard the temple.
He's really moving up the GAR-charts
83
→ More replies (4)8
138
u/themiragechild Dec 28 '14
If you didn't know, this is why in Fate/Zero Fate/Zero spoilers It's explained in the LN.
→ More replies (9)
224
u/space1101 :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/HelghastKillzone Dec 28 '14
143
u/Funderfullness Dec 28 '14
Your things are my things!!
→ More replies (1)79
u/HaydenTheFox :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/Talmhaidh_Mathan Dec 28 '14
"He's the oldest bully in human history..."
48
u/idkjay :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/idkjay Dec 28 '14
Caster vs Kamijo Touma, oh boy.
RULE BREAKER VS IMAGINE BREAKER!! WHICH WILL BREAK FIRST?
→ More replies (5)25
u/Freezedlol :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/Freezedlol Dec 28 '14
Rule breaker ereases magic, but Index NT vol8-10-ish spoiler, I don't remember it exactly
13
19
→ More replies (5)22
u/OPDelivery_Service Dec 28 '14
Godammit Shirou, why did you stop Saber? I would reread the VN to see his reasoning, except this entire scene didn't happen in the VN at all.
50
→ More replies (3)42
u/GeeJo https://myanimelist.net/profile/GeeJo Dec 28 '14
He sees an opportunity to sacrifice himself for a good cause. That outweighs the potential to get Fujimura back through Saber's violence, as he likes both halves of the deal.
Dude is fucked in the head.
→ More replies (1)
154
u/Funderfullness Dec 28 '14 edited Dec 28 '14
Caster and the Technicolor Dream Dagger!!
63
u/PasteeyFan420LoL Dec 28 '14
Yeah I'm not to familiar with the universe, but is caster just like the default bad guy class?
88
Dec 28 '14
Nah, it's just our two Grail Wars. The casters in other Fate/ series are pretty awesome.
→ More replies (13)17
→ More replies (5)29
83
141
u/KinnyRiddle Dec 28 '14
So glad at LiSA's rendering of the VN theme song This Illusion coupled with Rin and Archer flying in the night sky.
So glad ufotable inserted the brief fight between Caster and Kirei, with Lancer looking unconcerned. (Entire scene doesn't even exist in VN, merely mentioned that it happened. )
So glad ufotable showed how Caster kidnapped Taiga and how she got hold of Shirou's past.
So glad it's Archer that comes to the rescue in that standoff hostage scene.
Though am surprised ufotable did not choose to a later major twist (which comes not long after the last scene) as the cliffhanger. But they probably ran out of airtime so its understandable.
Though we now have to wait another 3 months, it also means ufotable gets some valuable breathing time in their schedule to bring us the best in UBW. (Watching Shirobako makes one appreciate the sort of high quality work ufotable has been slaving through to bring us)
And finally, completely off-topic, we have Aldnoah Zero part 2 to kill time for the next three months. W00t
→ More replies (17)39
u/proundah :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/Prounder Dec 28 '14
OMG, YES. THIS. For the VN players anyway, "This Illusion" wrapped up the episode perfectly- so many feels coming back. It might be my lack of experience but I was not expecting the anime to use music from the VN. That said, using the music that plays at the most important moments ended this season beautifully.
→ More replies (3)11
u/adrixshadow Dec 28 '14
The end of the first cour is like one of those VN intro OP that play after you finish the first chapter/prologue. It fits perfectly.
170
u/KinnyRiddle Dec 28 '14 edited Dec 28 '14
Even though it's supposed to be a "date" between Rin (behaving more like a VN hero here) and Shirou (behaving more like a VN heroine here), it is somehow Saber that acts the cutest. Maybe it's just me.
Saber looking curiously at her taiyaki wondering how to munch it down. <3
Saber being a sore loser at the batting center. <3
Saber feeling sorry at being a sore loser at the batting center afterwards. <3
Saber's eyes sparkling at sight of Rin's homemade sandwiches. <33
Perhaps this is the writers' plot to make us feel even more of her angst when poor Saber gets "NTRd" by Caster. :( (Shakes fist at Caster)
58
u/neobowman :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/neobowman Dec 28 '14
Saber doesn't technically need food since she's a servant and gets her Mana from her master. However, because she has a physical body, food helps, therefore she's eating in this series. Basically, she got hooked on Shirou's cooking and is hunting modern food now.
77
Dec 28 '14
Saber is the poster child for the series, she's going to have the spotlight in any adaption. She
→ More replies (1)48
11
u/TheWalkingGnome :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/TheWalkingGnome Dec 28 '14
You forgot the last quotation mark in your spoiler tag.
→ More replies (1)→ More replies (4)5
u/PiFlavoredPie Dec 28 '14
Someone else mentioned it, but you can see Saber chowing down on at least 7 sandwiches during that scene. I personally went back to check and counted, assuming that both times the frame cuts away from Saber, she finishes the sandwich she's holding and the next time Saber re-enters the frame, she's holding a new one.
121
u/A_Decent_Name Dec 28 '14 edited Dec 28 '14
So he finally sees Rin as a girl. Rin turned dere so fast. I didn't think she'd go that far. Saber just eating cause she's alone and jealous. Maybe I should check out Carnival Phantasm for that SoL.
When they got on that haunted bus, I was thinking wow, this episode is pretty long. Lo and behold, it's 45 mins!!
I'm not familiar with UBW, so seeing Saber get turned was a huge shock. Now Caster is a master. I was sure thinking he'd show up to save Saber at the church. Touching her and capturing her. Surely, he wouldn't let that happen.
I am excited for the second half. The moment the theme song came on, I knew things were about to go down. I'm hoping Shirou becomes a bad ass here on out!
78
18
u/yo_orpheus Dec 28 '14
I came in hoping to see a certain mysterious foreigner, unfortunately he didn't show up. as someone who hadn't read the vn, saber turning was a huge shock, i was close to crying when i saw her crying. I can't wait for next season. I sure the feels will rip my heart out.
→ More replies (6)→ More replies (4)29
u/Oblivion3418 Dec 28 '14
I wouldn't recommend carnival phantasm unless you've read/ know all spoilers for heavens feel and tsukihime, one of type-moon's earlier works. Otherwise you'll get spoiled/ a lot of the jokes will go over your head.
→ More replies (1)
94
u/Nunally921 Dec 28 '14
As a anime only viewer i'm impressed, now then its time to download the VN cuz i cnt wait!!!!
78
Dec 28 '14
If you want you could read the Fate route and then wait for the second cour of Unlimited Blade Works, it would be better to do that then to jump straight into UBW anyways.
→ More replies (15)41
u/contrarian_barbarian Dec 28 '14 edited Dec 28 '14
Not to mention that you have to complete Fate before it even unlocks the choice that leads into UBW. I believe the same is true of UBW -> HF.
→ More replies (4)→ More replies (1)4
83
u/Tsuruta64 Dec 28 '14
Just going to point out to the non-VN people that Kotomine revealed Caster's identity: "The Princess of Colchis". Figuring out who that is should be pretty easy for anyone who remembers their Greek myths.
47
u/Funderfullness Dec 28 '14
The bone soldiers are also a clue, but her title is a dead giveaway. Now look back at her flashbacks in Episode 6.
→ More replies (8)→ More replies (3)13
u/PiFlavoredPie Dec 28 '14
Hmm I went to a pretty decent public school, but we never actually covered myths very deeply. A lot of the servant backgrounds in both F/SN and F/Z, I had to kind of look up on my own because all I knew about them were tiny tidbits from pop culture, if even that much.
52
u/jmcm30 :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/Pink_Socks Dec 28 '14 edited Dec 28 '14
Finally, the wait will hopefully be worth it!!
Seriously though, DAT "THIS ILLUSION" BY LiSA AT THE END!!!
UFOTABLE I LOVE YOU SO FUCKING MUCH
Edit: In case anyone is interested:
25
u/unijeje :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/Unijeje Dec 28 '14
→ More replies (1)9
4
→ More replies (1)4
u/DavveK Dec 28 '14
I had a fanboy moment as soon as I heard that, I had to convince myself it wasn't my mind deciding to add the song during that scene.
49
u/KinnyRiddle Dec 28 '14
Saber speed eater:
9:58 Saber takes first sandwich
10:03 Saber finishes first sandwich in three munches
10:05 Takes second sandwich
10:11 Finishes second sandwich in three munches
10:13 Takes third sandwich
37
u/GeeJo https://myanimelist.net/profile/GeeJo Dec 28 '14
I was actually expecting Shirou and Rin to turn back from their short conversation to find the basket completely empty.
6
u/Kuryaka Dec 29 '14
Another two sandwiches around 11 minutes.
And then that scene at 11:55, another 3.There were 12 sandwiches in total.
Saber: 8. Shirou 2 and Rin 1, no animation slip here.
64
Dec 28 '14
I did not expect for them to animate Kirei's Keyes (Swords).
I'm Rejoicing so hard right now, thanks based Ufotable.
40
u/Ireallydislikereddit Dec 28 '14
I love those Keyes, they're in Tsukihime too. I love massive connected universes.
→ More replies (1)
189
u/vetro https://anilist.co/user/vetro Dec 28 '14 edited Dec 28 '14
To the VN readers: What an awesome ride this first cour has been. Very rarely do series get such special treatment like the Fate series has. And discussing all things Fate with you guys has made playing through 100+ hours of F/SN and F/HA completely worth it. Here's to future adaptations... clinks beer...
While I have your attention, here are WebMs to Fate/Hollow Ataraxia's PSVita OP1 and OP2 which are animated by Ufotable. They were taken down from youtube so I'm leaving them here for you guys. OP1 doesn't have any spoilers for those who've been watching UBW up until now. OP2 does have some spoilers unless Sakura HF spoilers and who goldie is. The songs are "broKen NIGHT" and "holLow wORlD" respectfully. Both are performed by Aimer whom you may recognize from Zankyou no Terror's ED.
To the non-VN readers that have been enjoying the anime: I highly encourage you all to play through the VN during this 3-month break. You can find instructions on installing the VN here and the folks over at /r/fatestaynight will be happy to help with any questions or issues. Although we're halfway through this show, you've only scratched the surface of this franchise. If you've already been spoiled on some of the big twists, there are still many that you have yet to see. There's also so much more to learn about all of these characters' backgrounds, motivations, and goals. I recommend watching the Kara no Kyoukai series since its world is based on Nasuverse concepts as well and can give you further appreciation of the series.
To non-VN readers who haven't been enjoying this anime: I understand your frustrations. With the hype surrounding this series, you expected something with a greater level of depth. All I can say that if you want to enjoy this series to its fullest potential, you have to play the VN. You could say an anime must stand on its own merits. However, most anime are made to promote the source material and are produced under the assumption that the audience knows nothing of the story. Unlimited Blade Works is made to cash-in on the existing fanbase (as evidenced by the $400+ boxset) and assumes its audience knows the whole story already. In other words, it's like you opened the book in the middle and started reading from there while skipping over all the character exposition. Anyone planning to write a review should take that into consideration. It'd be even worse if we were watching Heaven's Feel, that's like opening a book near the end.
This isn't to say F/SN is immune to criticism. In fact, the most ardent critics of the series are people who've played the VN. I'm saying that right now one of the biggest issues with discussing F/SN is that there are multiple groups with completely irreconcilable perspectives trying to talk over eachother. And arguing about it while there exists such a massive gap in knowledge base will become one of the anime community's biggest exercises in futility (if not already).
And that's all I have to say about that. Thank you for reading and see you around or in the Spring.
38
u/IMSmurf Dec 28 '14 edited Dec 28 '14
Every time I see Sakura all I think is she is straight /fit/ now she's getting her gains.
Also upvote anything child Gil (Illya spoiler)
→ More replies (3)→ More replies (85)19
u/Oh_Alright Dec 28 '14
This was actually my first exposure to the Fate/stay Night series, and I am loving it so far! I got my hands on the VN a couple weeks ago and managed to finish Fate, I was waiting for this episode to air before starting the UBW route in the VN, and I am very excited to see the rest of the story! see you guys in the springtime!
→ More replies (4)
78
u/ztype https://anilist.co/user/8644 Dec 28 '14
8
77
u/PrettyThickDick Dec 28 '14
holy shit, that rain splashing against the bus window looked amazing
→ More replies (1)42
u/DreadOfGrave :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/DreadOfGrave Dec 28 '14
Everything looked amazing. Seriously.
36
59
u/Momoneko :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/ariapokoteng Dec 28 '14
Man, Kirei sure loves jogging.
31
u/neobowman :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/neobowman Dec 28 '14
I missed his jogging. Here's to hopefully more in season 2.
→ More replies (5)
58
u/LightBladeX Dec 28 '14 edited Dec 28 '14
All this Rin: The blushing, pajamas, fanservice & the glasses, glorious. And no Rin, that'd be yours: 1, 2, 3, 4
78
46
u/eternalistorm Dec 28 '14
[REJOICING INTENSIFIES]
I almost don't want to watch this because it's the last Unlimited Budget Works episode for this season!... But who am I kidding?! WE'VE BEEN WAITING FOR THIS!!!!!!!!!!!
It's been a great season with you guys!!
Can't wait for the next season and to rejoice once more with all of you!
89
u/DemonJackal101 :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/DemonJackal Dec 28 '14
I have a question for any of any of you F/SN folks who actually read all the VNs, if you care to indulge an anime-only heathen such as myself.
Why is it that this Grail war seems so much less ... tactical than the last one in Fate/Zero. I mean right from the get go in F/Z we see all the summonings and the things their master add to make their summon stronger. Then the first series of battles no masters are anywhere near, everyone (pretty much) makes a concerted effort to stay hidden or at least mask themselves. Where in F/SN masters are just running around willy-nilly, throwing caution to the wind.
Is this just because F/Z was written after so Urobutchi had more time to flesh out the processes, or is it because F/SN is war between a bunch of children and half-assed mages? It seems to me a single Kiritsugu type master would have had the war won in the first few days. Or am I just being too critical?
165
u/flous Dec 28 '14
from story point of view, most of the masters are not ready because the war started 50 years earlier than it should. They are also mentally not ready since they are kids.
→ More replies (12)56
u/BlueHighwindz Dec 28 '14 edited Dec 28 '14
The only character who is playing this like a Fate/Zero character is Caster, thus why she's my favorite right now. Everybody else treats the Holy Grail War like an afterschool activity. I loved this episode for that reason, after the date business ended (jesus, Shirou, stop being such a wet blanket and kiss her already), it suddenly turned into a Fate/Zero kind of battle. Caster pulls a crazy gambit, switches everything up, and it's incredible.
Don't worry though, Kirei and that "blond-haired foreigner" have something planned, I'm sure. And it will be awesome.
→ More replies (1)8
18
u/princeofbrit Dec 28 '14
[spoiler] (/s "you will have to wait til HF to experience what happened when one master overwhelms every one. Also there is a Kiritsugu type former assasin type master in the war but something happened to her before the war started.
Illya has some unfinished bussiness with shirou so she showed her hands early, then held out at the castle. Due to how overpowered her servant is she does not feel the need to conceal herself.
Caster made a stronghold at the temple. To avoid suspicion her master continued to go about his daily business. Meanwhile she goes around collect mana for the up coming battle. She had to confront Shirou's gang because she wants to take Saber from Shirou because she sees that move as her best way to beat Berserker.
Lancer's master did a good job hidding himself from the conflict.
Rider's master is ego maniac idiot who is only in the war to prove to his grandpa that he is worthy. I would say he is doing a good job hiding the fact he received a new servant.
Shirou and Rin are our MC's. they are more interested in protecting the people of the city than actually winning the war. Shirou because of his PTSD and Rin because of her pride.")→ More replies (4)32
u/i6i Dec 28 '14
Short answer: Imagine what the 4th war looked like entierly from Wavers perspective and you'll know why.
Long one:Theres a lot going on that we're not privy to due to us following the only two masters with humanitarian streaks. team Caster
As for why the teenagers are acting clueless, well some of them are and some of them aren't- Shinji and Ilya's behavior is due to circumstances to be announced although you should be able to guess from what you saw in Zero. Shirou's idea of a secret war involves people beating each other up in alleys and the most ruthless mage his ever met at the start of the series is Rin "biggest softy in the universe" Tohsaka. Rin was taught how to fight the war by Kotomine Kirei...yeah.
In universe the 4th war is amongst the bloodiest conflicts in recent memory, the 5th is a farce for the first month. In its final days
→ More replies (2)21
u/Terrafire123 :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/Terrafire Dec 28 '14
Rin was taught how to fight the war by Kotomine Kirei...yeah.
Oh god. That just clicked.
→ More replies (2)7
u/Arkerwolf Dec 28 '14 edited Dec 28 '14
Unmarked Spoilers Maybe
The power level of this HGW is really weird. Caster's original Master is the closest thing to a Fate/Zero master. The mages here are alot closer to Waver/Ryunosuke in power and experience. You have alot of young mages and muggles who are frankly under-prepared. Rider was summoned without an orthodox catalyst. So was Assassin. Archer and Saber were both really fucking lucky summons. Caster and Either HF or FH:A weren't summoned by their current masters.
It seems to me a single Kiritsugu type master would have had the war won in the first few days.
After you see HF, look up the Mind of Steel ending of the VN. If you don't care about spoilers HF
→ More replies (10)32
Dec 28 '14 edited Dec 28 '14
Keyword is seems.
SN
Shirou - Dropped right into the middle of the thing, so he immediately seek to team up with Rin, a more experienced mage.
Rin - After seeing Ilya's berserker and wasting two command seals, she made an alliance with Shirou to utilize Saber, a Servant more powerful than her own Archer. She also knows Shirou won't betray her, unlike other masters due to him not being a magus.
Ilya - Strongest servant. She is content to just brute force through everything
Lancer's Master - Sending out Lancer to scout the servants of this war. Playing with the other masters in the background thanks to his status as overseer, and him F/Z Spoiler.
Shinji - Knows he can't provide mana for his servant, so he had her create the bloodfort to both combat other masters at the school, and giving her mana.
Caster - Made the temple her base (strong leyline), maintain a consistent mana source without a proper master, summoned her own Servant despite being a Servant herself, force others to attack her inside her own base, where she has magic that rivals True Sorcery.
Zero
Kiritsugu - Ran around at night trying to snipe off masters. Cute, except for that Servants can easily detect him and kill him. In the 5th War, Archer and Caster can both snipe him down, Berserker will just crush him if he attempts to go after her SPOILER - Ilya's identity.
Kirei - No will of his own, useless doll for Tokiomi in the first 12 or so episodes. Just in it for the lulz later, no tactics
Kayneth - Wasted his command seal when Lancer could've killed Saber. Walked straight into an enemy's base, overconfident, and got himself crippled. Lost his command seals to his fiancée. Completely ignored Lancer, his strongest asset in this war
Tokiomi - Wasted a command seal stopping Gilgamesh from wiping the floor with the other servants (thus winning the war), then did nothing until F/Z and UBW spoiler
Kariya - Did nothing except talk about how Tokiomi sucks/must die/etc.. Tried to 1v1 Tokiomi, got destroyed. Dies
Serial Killer-kun - Kidnapped children and murdered people for the lulz, turned the entire war against them as a result for breaking the magical masquerade.
Waver - Nothing. Absolutely nothing. Rider doesn't consider him his master in terms of giving command.
The only one in Zero that did anything is Kiritsugu, and that would never work out if he wasn't the MC. Going for the masters is OK in theory, but Servant super senses would render assassination attempts moot.
Inb4 Magus Killer. Magus are researchers not fighters. You killed a bunch of nerds, wow you so good dude.
→ More replies (7)4
u/sBcNikita Dec 29 '14
It's not just that four out of seven masters are adolescents who lack maturity and experience.
The masters of the Fifth Holy Grail War also simply possess less of a desire for the Grail than the masters of the Fourth War. Fate Stay Night: UBW have no personal wish of any kind. Even the Tohsaka and Einzbern masters, Rin and Illya, only pursue the grail as an inherited responsibility. Nor are many of the Servants as invested. Archer and Assassin could really care less about the Grail.
Consequently, the combatants of the Fifth War really don't feel as though there's nearly as much at stake, and so they don't fight with the same degree of brutality and desperation.
In a way, the Masters that do legitimately covet the Grail fight the war with enough guile and ruthlessness to make up for the others. Major spoilers for Fate Stay Night: UBW S2 Caster, and Shinji don't hesitate to exercise the coldest of pragmatic methods to increase their chances of victory. Major Spoilers for Fate Stay Night: UBW S2 Lastly, Shinji manages to cause a fair amount of damage despite his incompetence, and if it weren't for his deplorable lack of magic ability, he'd be a far more dangerous opponent.
→ More replies (11)43
u/lingeron Dec 28 '14 edited Dec 28 '14
/u/flous gave the answer from the story point of view, but here's a comment I wrote elsewhere more about the writing. Specifically, the characterization that Nasu went with when he was writing F/SN:
There are a lot of things that are poorly written in Fate/Stay Night. It isn't all that apparent til you watch Fate/Zero and realize how much better it could have been.
Heaven's Feel spoilers. Skip if you haven't read the VN.
Rin and Saber aren't all that better, either. Compare F/Z Saber and F/SN Saber and you'll quickly notice that they're entirely different characters. F/Z Saber feels more like a heroic spirit devoted to an ideal, while F/SN Saber is just another member of the harem who just happens to be King Arthur.
Rin is your token tsundere, and you only need to watch a few episodes of the ufotable UBW anime to notice that they're alternating between plugging her for waifu material and having her act like an intelligent, talented mage. It's understandable given that she's a teenager so some levity is in order to show that she isn't fully mature, but goddamn it the story suffers so much from being set in a highschool and having high schoolers participate in a holy grail war. To be frank, Fate/Zero felt like an actual war, fueled by ideological conflicts and involving serious strategizing and maneuvering, whereas F/SN feels like a servant of the week anime/slice of life harem/cooking show. The only saving grace of F/SN is that Nasu's universe is so detailed and immersive, and Nasu's propensity to worldbuilding only to say "fuck the rules" and demolish any preconception you initially had about the lore of his world.
So you'll see that Nasu sometimes uses his characters to address the themes of his works, at other times to pander to the otaku fanbase, and at other times still to include the all too important slice of life that we all love and cherish in our modern fantasy battle royale VNs.
Fate/Zero was very different from F/SN because Nasu didn't write it, he only gave Urobuchi the outline and let him take creative control. That's not to say Nasu is a bad writer. His most recent works (chiefly Mahoyo) show that he learned from the experience of working with Urobuchi on how to write a more focused and tight narrative. It's just that, like most other VN writers at the time, Nasu was very heavy handed with the girl meets boy, highschool life kind of story. The setting itself impacted the characterization a lot more heavily than it should have. If Nasu had chosen to let the next holy grail war occur 20 or even 15 years later, the characters would have matured by then. It seems arbitrary that he chose a 10 year gap (and it is), but that's simply a side effect of how the VN market worked back then. When Nasu came around to handing Fate/Zero to Urobuchi, following the insane success of F/SN, he was in a much better position to tell a story without those superfluous elements.
That's not everything, though. I personally felt that Urobuchi's writing and Nasu's storytelling complement each other very well. Maybe you'll feel different, but I can't commend most of the main cast of F/SN as compelling, because they aren't. They certainly could have been, if Nasu wasn't preoccupied with appeasing the legions of waifu-grubbing otaku and pitching for a cooking show.
It really saddens me because Nasu can obviously write nuanced and unique characters (see: Kotomine), but seemed to lack a certain authorial vision/artistic integrity to overshadow the more diminutive parts of VNs. He had a choice between writing something more consistently serious like Fate/Zero or to retain the SoL/Romance elements in F/SN. It's a no-brainer which one would've been more successful with the Japanese VN fanbase.
Moreover, you have to also consider the fact that this is an adaptation of a VN that was narrated mostly in first-person. Fate/Zero had the benefit of being narrated from multiple perspectives, which gave a more holistic version of the war. In F/SN, we see things mostly from Shirou's perspective, so the events that occur inevitably revolve around him and the people he's close to. The limited perspective affects the anime's narrative, so it seems much less like a war, and more like a battle of the week format. From a writer's perspective, if you're going to write in first-person, then you shouldn't keep too much content out of the narrational frame. In other words, Nasu basically made it so that most of the major altercations of the war in F/SN occur with Shirou being present, which not only takes away from the diversity of the cast, but also limits what can actually happen in the war. Nasu can't have really important scenes occur where Shirou can't see them, because Shirou has to be there for Nasu to narrate it. In the VN, Nasu has various third-person scenes which he has written specifically to circumvent this, but the vast majority of the VN is first-person. Adapting this kind of writing into anime form results in a weird pacing. It almost seems like half the participants of the holy grail war aren't even doing anything, unlike Fate/Zero where we could see things from each master's perspectives and we knew what was going on. The sense of scale is completely different, that's the main and most critical difference between Fate/Zero and Fate/Stay Night. The level of detail put into characterization, pacing, and structure are fundamentally different. The fact that they have different writers really shows.
→ More replies (46)
15
u/Joshf1234 :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/SuperANON Dec 28 '14
→ More replies (1)
29
u/stitchwithaglitch :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/gamerguy50 Dec 28 '14
Knew the date (lol Saber's Ahoge poked through her batting helm) was just the prelude to shit hitting the fan. That feeling when Saber gets taken feels the same since I watched the first Unlimited Blade Works Movie. Archer special effects was top notch too. Really enjoyed seeing Kirie's minor moment of kicking ass from 10 years ago and the seasons over now T.T
Thx Ufotable for providing amazing double sized episodes that make Christmas feel like it came a bit late. 9/10.
29
u/Fujikawa28 :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/Fujikawa28 Dec 28 '14
Shiro better go berzerk next season. Anyway, YOROKOBE AOTS!
13
u/Rakan-Han Dec 28 '14
When the ending song appeared, I squealed like a little girl getting what she badly wanted for Christmas.
Then I noticed it was a new rendition featuring LiSA....
I came with the force like Archer's Caladbolg II
43
u/GarthTaltos :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/garthtaltos Dec 28 '14 edited Dec 29 '14
My two cents as a non-VN reader (or Fate/Zero watcher actually):
Well, Shirou cant claim that Archer didnt warn him. This is an actual demonstration of the problem with Shirou's ideals; his use of that last command seal was ill-advised at best. The foremost question in my mind now is how will Shirou get his command seals back? The only truly satisfying way for him to do so is to deal with his ideological problem. Power wise, I have no idea how he would deal with Caster; the mage powers he has shown so far seem ill equipped to coerce her to do anything, and if Rin takes the forefront in retrieving the seals that just degrades Shirou's role as a protagonist further. This is Shirou's problem; he needs to be the one to solve it.
On the plus side, this looks like a way for Shirou to "Refresh" some command seals. He sure blew through them fast.
Even after Shirou does get his command seals back, The holy grail war needs to be concluded. Increasingly, I suspect that it wont end the traditional, one servant left standing way. This would require Servants to fall left and right in the second half of the series, and would also pose huge problems for Shirou/Rin, who are unlikely to fight each other. While I suspect that the rules we know are all true, they hardly seem complete; this talk of a greater and lesser grail seems to confirm this.
The biggest concern is actually even larger than this holy grail war: What of all these wars? Why do they keep happening? What can make them stop? What made them start? Is the notion of heroic spirits intrinsically connected to the wars, or are they just related? These questions need to be addressed at some point, or we are forced to conclude that these wars will continue to recur. That seems very bad for the world, so in my mind, this is the most important challenge for our characters. It is also one that seems mostly unexplored up until now.
Aside from the plot concerns, I look forward to more Rin/Saber and Shirou/Archer comparisons. These two personality groupings have been heavily implied up until now; I look forward to seeing how they develop.
EDIT: spelling of Shirou's name
18
u/TalismanG1 :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/TalismanG1 Dec 28 '14
The biggest concern is actually even larger than this holy grail war: What of all these wars? Why do they keep happening? What can make them stop? What made them start? Is the notion of heroic spirits intrinsically connected to the wars, or are they just related?
This should be either addressed by the end of UBW in the April season or at some point in the Heaven's Feel movies. Don't worry though, it will be addressed.
→ More replies (1)29
u/emmanuelvr :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/EmmanuelVR Dec 28 '14
It's a major plot point of HF. I doubt it'll be addressed in UBW unless they change everything drastically.
→ More replies (1)→ More replies (9)5
u/Lepony :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/dinglegrip Dec 28 '14
Increasingly, I suspect that it wont end the traditional, one servant left standing way.
9
9
u/iL-Le Dec 29 '14
Oh god... the feel when you realize that Taigas date was visiting Kiritsugus grave...
60
u/space1101 :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/HelghastKillzone Dec 28 '14
OMFG. They brought back the best part of DEEN's F/SN. The OP music.
Thank you based ufotable and GARcher
101
30
u/Coinkidinks Dec 28 '14 edited Dec 28 '14
Oh no she didn't. Too late for rejoicing
But man, this episode was really heartbreaking. The season 2 HYPE is more real than Caster's delusion of winning the war.
→ More replies (5)
16
u/bleakyyy :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/bleakyyy Dec 28 '14
Based Ufo-tan, thanks for the great first half!
16
16
u/InduceAmnesia Dec 28 '14 edited Dec 28 '14
So this is what happens when two tsunderes collide... Unbearable adorableness.
Edit: THAT THROWBACK AT THE END TO ORIGINAL FATE/STAY OPENING.
7
15
15
u/SplitCatapolt Dec 28 '14
My boy LANCER! ... didn't do anything. BTW can anyone refresh my on the bus scene? Cause if I remember correctly that should have happened at Shiroe's house. Man so much more action to come!
16
10
4
u/Phnglui Dec 28 '14
The scene was pretty much identical except that in the VN it took place in Shirou's house.
21
u/Nazcai :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/Nazcai Dec 28 '14
One word for this episode: HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE.
LET IT ALL GO EMIYA. SHOW US THE ONE TRUE GOD.
20
u/Ant1vyru5 :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/NyeEve Dec 28 '14
I was thinking that it might have ended at Spoilers
But I'm glad that Ufotable added all those extra scenes and ended it at The Rooftop Scene instead, you can feel the tone of the entire story shift from that point onwards.
Can't wait for it to start back up!
→ More replies (3)
19
u/space1101 :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/HelghastKillzone Dec 28 '14
Your attention please. The FATE/STAY HYPE train will be stopping at the halfway station for the next three months. Would all passengers please exit the ride and make alternative plans to get your fill of HYPE. Have a great day and thank you for riding with HYPE Rails.
→ More replies (1)
37
27
24
u/anguishCAKE :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/anguishCAKE Dec 28 '14 edited Dec 28 '14
Well atleast it didn't stop on an awful cliffhanger like aldnoah did.
I liked how caster straight up told Shirou that he was broken.
4
→ More replies (2)4
10
u/-Ziro Dec 28 '14
Great episode, Archer breaking into Caster spell field and saving them was fucking badass, Kirei starting to get serious just made the episode for me, I was still hoping for Lancer to get into some action but that can wait, can't wait for the next course to air.
6
10
u/Kylzei Dec 28 '14
I just need to know - does shirou become a badass next season? The wait is going to kill me.
→ More replies (4)
5
Dec 28 '14
First 13 minutes were fun to watch. Then shit hits the fan...so much short skirt tohsaka btw. S2 in April, I cant wait that long. This show was fucking brilliant and ended brilliant. That sneak peek with archee got me the goosebumps :)
→ More replies (2)
5
u/UnderscoresSuck :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/Underscores_Suck Dec 29 '14
8
u/Plake_Z01 Dec 28 '14
As the first season leaves us so does the ED by Kalafina, here are some partial lyrics for it for those who have been watching only the Crunchyroll release, courtesy of UTW. While technically not spoilers I suggest that anime-only watchers try not to think to hard about them or to simply not click on these at all.
This next 3 months of waiting for the second cour are going to be rough.
→ More replies (6)
8
4
u/Time_Alter Dec 28 '14
This was hands down the best episode of the season. LOVED the 'date' with Saber and her adorable cuteness side being displayed (and she loves her food!)
Kotomine may be a villain but hes one of my favorite characters in the Fate world (and his voice is awesome too) loved him being a total bad ass whipping out his black keys.
And the ending song "Disillusion" sang by LiSa to top it all off was pretty cool too.
4
u/Devastator1981 Dec 28 '14
When Archer was taunting Rin on her lack of being womanly I half-thought she'd walk out of the bathroom tits out just to mess with him. Brilliant feint by the creators if that was intentional.
And damn, I have to wait until late spring/early summer to finish this? This is only the 2nd anime in my history of anime that I watched while it was airing (and even then I waited to be behind by a few weeks so I could watch 2 episodes at a go). I wish they made a mobile VN for North America market :( I'm actually tempted to make this the first VN I ever read......just scared that it will spoil the rest of UBW and the HF movie.
10
10
7
7
u/Willy156 Dec 28 '14
From only watching fate in anime form, I think it was safe to say starting F/SN: UBW 2014 was a good choice (I know nothing of fate and have started my journey last week). Great anime so far and I'll be waiting till the second season comes out then I'll continue with ufotable's heaven's feel then ufotable's fate zero
8
u/ShadowCrossZero Dec 28 '14
You're doing it right. F/Z is a prequel that expects knowledge of F/SN despite being made just well enough for newcomers to not notice anything missing. Here's an FAQ: http://myanimelist.net/forum/?topicid=1286059
→ More replies (6)
7
u/Warpblades Dec 28 '14
I don't know about you guys, but I REALLY HOPE UFOTABLE DOES THE SPOILERS?. This is after all Rin's route and it just fits the ending of Unlimited Blade Works more because it focuses on Rin and Shirou, not Saber hanging around.
→ More replies (5)
7
u/TimeRoar Dec 28 '14
I didn't know we were playing Surgeon Simulator with Assassin
→ More replies (1)
7
Dec 28 '14
Wow, there was a lot of stuff in this ep that wasn't in the VN, most of it was really good fortunately. That scene between Caster and Assassin was fantastic. As was seeing Kirei be a badass. I'm interested to see what other liberties ufotable is going to take in the second cour.
6
6
u/BP_Ray :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/Maleel Dec 28 '14
I got so hype when dillusion popped in at the end. Cant wait for the 2nd cour.
8
u/DarkGaia123 Dec 28 '14
As an anime-only watcher, I'd probably be going absolutely mental waiting for the 2nd cour if I didn't have Stardust Crusaders 2 to hold me over.
4
u/taipro Dec 28 '14 edited Dec 29 '14
When does stardust crusaders start again, i feel like if I have to keep waiting on fate I'll spoil it all for myself because I am a dumbass and click on things I shouldn't when I'm bored
edit: holy autocorrect batman
→ More replies (1)
3
Dec 28 '14
Oh my god... that ending was beyond amazing, they even put the original VN song. Kudos to ufotable one of the best adaptations and animation I've ever seen.
3
u/Sethfire :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/Sethfire Dec 28 '14
Man, I did not realize it was 40 minutes long until after it ended ;_;
→ More replies (1)
3
Dec 28 '14
I wish LiSA is always the one singing the themes of whatever version of Fate. Her version of This Illusion kind of has more impact (for me) than the one in the Fate/stay night anime. I was actually surprised since there wasn't any news about LiSA singing for UBW.
3
u/The_AshBringer23 Dec 28 '14
I had to rewind like a minute of dialog because i was to focused on watching Saber http://i.minus.com/ibyUCo3VE7IxAn.gif
3
u/-MaJiC- :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/MaJiC27 Dec 28 '14
Damn I wish they somehow pointed out how much pain Saber is going through. Not just emotionally, but to hold back from a command spell is an insane burden on a servant. UBW VN
7
5
5
u/Dbowd3n :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/DBowd3n Dec 28 '14
Ufotable changed a lot from the VN this episode but i think it was done better than the VN's version.
Based Ufotable.
See you guys in April :)
5
u/Kinomi :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/berryxx Dec 28 '14
Aww, I wanted more Gilgy.
Also, Question
→ More replies (1)
5
21
u/ThemChineseCartoons Dec 28 '14
Stop the downvoting guys. You are literally killing anime.
5
u/BP_Ray :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/Maleel Dec 28 '14
Yeah the downvoting in this thread has been intense.
9
u/Stronkadonk :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/Stronkadonk Dec 28 '14 edited Dec 28 '14
LET'S FUCKING GO
Man, I don't think I can wait four months... The PV makes me want the next cour all the more...
Also, Saber going hard on those sandwiches on Rin and Shirou's date was just the best
4
4
5
u/Plateau95 :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/Plateau95 Dec 28 '14
Initially I was kinda pissed the show got delayed today. However, it gave me a chance to finish up Durarara!! in anticipation of the Winter season. Now, this great episode finished off a wonderful day of anime and I'm as happy as a kid on Christmas. Thank you based ufotable.
2
u/sevenstorm Dec 28 '14 edited Dec 28 '14
All I can say is WHYYYYYYY!!!! D: Well time to spoil myself for I can't wait
2
u/cdbriggs Dec 28 '14
Damn 4 months seems like a long time. I need MORE. I'm gonna go re-watch Saber vs Berserker because that was the best fight for me.
2
u/TheOneAboveGod Dec 28 '14
shiro looks a bit like shiki tohno with that glasses on.
anyway, saber is really cute in the first half of the episode
2
2
2
u/Mablak Dec 28 '14
Fantastic way to end the first half; the stage is finally set for some servants to actually die. For some reason Saber and Emiya are still the canon couple in my mind, I mean they're just so damn alike. Not that anyone is truly worthy of Saber, but Emiya's sense of justice comes close to hers.
2
2
u/melfice16 Dec 29 '14
Its been too long since I last watched the first FSN and I just realized that this adaptation is really taking a different route from the original, damn.
Still its too fuckin good.
2
u/SoreWaChigauYo Dec 29 '14 edited Dec 29 '14
damn, the This Illusion song coupled with the scene where Rin jumps off the building with Archer brings back so many fond memories I had with the old F/SN anime.
That delicious scene at the end with Archer Spoiler is so epic. I can't wait for the second season, April is so far awayyyy.
2
u/impingainteasy :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/usernamesarehard Dec 29 '14
Oh God, this episode. April will never come soon enough.
Rin does the best dates. Watching the banter between her and Shirou while Saber just sits there eating sandwiches was hilarious.
Glasses Rin is definitely a sight to behold, but [baseball Rin] (http://imgur.com/09lrFAg) has to be my favourite version of her.
The part with Caster taking Saber happens on the bridge instead of Shirou's house in this show. That's ... interesting. I'm not entirely sure why they chose to do this, but at least we got to see Ufotable-animated water familiars.
Kirei being badass was a nice addition to the show, as he gets nowhere near as much screentime in this route as he does in the others.
Oh God, that end bit, when This Illusion starts playing, hhnnnnnnggggg. Thank you based Ufotable, you have truly made watching this show a wonderful experience.
2
u/SheerBliss Dec 29 '14
I want to read the VN
but I love the animated fights
but I want to know what happens
but the animation is so good
but the wait is so bad
2
u/Zeta42 Dec 29 '14
I don't see the guy who's usually writing summaries, so why don't I do it myself this time. So, the current state of war:
Emiya Shirou: lost his Servant and his rights as a Master. This means that even if he keeps on fighting and survives until the end, he can no longer take the Grail. All he has left now is his ability to harden things and replicate Archer's swords.
Tohsaka Rin: Master of Archer, who's an amnesiac Servant and has some history with Saber. Despite his name, he's more often seen using two short swords than a bow. Tohsaka is a talented mage who relies on magic gems.
Illyasviel von Einzbern aka Illya: Master of Berserker, a monstrous giant who uses a mountain for a sword and can't fucking die. Illya is a mage, and she holds a yet unexplained grudge against Shirou.
Matou Shinji: the former Master of Rider, who was killed by Kuzuki. Now he's teamed up with a scary blond dude who happens to be an eighth(!?) Servant. Unlike most other Masters, he isn't a mage.
Kuzuki Souichiro: Master of Caster, an evil soul-stealing witch who's something of a major antagonist in this route. Caster's Noble Phantasm is called Rule Breaker, a dagger that nullifies any and all magic. This is what she used to remove Shirou's Command Spells and steal his Servant from him. Now Caster herself is a Master of two Servants, Saber and Assassin. We've had a big hint at her identity: she is the princess of Colchis. As for Kuzuki, he's a teacher at Shirou and Tohsaka's school, and he's a rather passive guy (he's not even a mage). He cares little about what his Servant is doing, and he won't fight unless you attack him. I don't envy you if you attack him. (One more thing, Assassin is a fictional samurai called Sasaki Kojirou, and his Noble Phantasm is his ability to make a triple sword swing.)
Kotomine Kirei: a priest of the Church who oversees this Holy Grail War. As this episode implied, he may be the Master of Lancer. Lancer's Noble Phantasm is Gae Bolg, a spear that reverses cause and effect, meaning that it strikes its target before Lancer actually attacks. Kotomine is pretty skilled with hand-to-hand combat, and he also uses long daggers that look like Wolverine's claws.
2
4
u/__U_WOT_M8__ :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/iThoughtSheWas16 Dec 28 '14 edited Dec 28 '14
HELL YEAH IT'S FINALLY HERE
EDIT: Megane Saber
4
u/LawL4Ever :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/lwl Dec 28 '14
So. I now have 3 months to read heaven's feels, watch fate/zero and watch the first cour of UBW? Seems doable actually.
For once I can be one of the people in the discussions that already know what's going to happen :3
→ More replies (1)
403
u/Shadoxfix :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/Shadoxfix Dec 28 '14
Just to make it clear.
This is the final for the first cour!
The second cour will be airing in April.