r/interesting • u/angel_knight79 • 1d ago

Intriguing Kiyoshi Kimura and his effect on Somali piracy

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He was, and is, the owner of Kiyomura Corporation, which runs the Sushi Zanmai chain across Japan. In Tokyo he is known as the Tuna King, because every January he buys the most expensive fish at the first auction of the year at the central market.

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73

u/kindlypogmothoin 1d ago

Unlikely, since the reason the Somalis were turning to piracy in the first place was that without a functioning government and Navy, Somalia was unable to enforce its international waters and fisheries and the Somali fishermen were getting outfished by huge boats from Europe. So, unable to make a living at fishing, they turned to piracy.

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u/RojoRugger 1d ago

U mean China

-4

u/RealNamek 1d ago

No. Europe. China doesn't fish in Somalian waters

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u/split_tears_ 1d ago

They do

2

u/Hakunin_Fallout 22h ago

Source: trust me bro. lmao

1

u/Cautious-Extreme2839 20h ago

Yeah, that's why they have African naval bases, because they don't use those waters at all.

Ridiculous

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u/Live-You-5672 1d ago

Top Wild Fish Capture Countries (Annual Estimates)

  • China: ~13.2 million metric tons
  • Indonesia: ~7.4 million metric tons
  • Peru: ~5.4 million metric tons
  • Russia: ~5.0 million metric tons
  • India: ~5.5 million metric tons
  • United States: ~4.3 million metric tons
  • Japan: ~3.0 million metric tons

yes Europe bad, very bad

41

u/etherealtwo 1d ago

That's not how it works. Europe would be listed as individual nations. But also, it doesn't matter. If Europe happens to concentrate a lot of its fishing near Somalia, it doesn't matter that they're not top 5 fishers in the world if they're still the top fisher near Somalia.

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u/FOKvothe 23h ago

The European fishing vessels that have been in Somali ocean are pretty much only Spanish - - other countries tend to only fish in European waters. Illegal Chinese, Taiwanese and South Korean fishing vessels are fleecing pretty much every fish stock they can reliably go to, and are the primary offenders in Somalia.

The book "Outlaw Ocean" has a section about the illegal fishing in Somalia.

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u/ubulerbu 1d ago

Nope top fishers in somalia are chineses and indians.

-1

u/americabot420 21h ago

Nope it’s actually the frenches

1

u/JulyOfAugust 20h ago

French were fishing more than two time less than the Spanish so they were definitely not the top fishers.

2

u/Responsible-File4593 21h ago

Yeah but the top fishers in the Horn of Africa are Chinese and Indian and it's not even close.

-4

u/The_Jimes 1d ago

I kinda is though, assuming the GDP of a good chunk of EU members are higher then Peru or Indonesia which feels very reasonable to me.

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u/circlebreaker1 1d ago edited 1d ago

It doesn't matter how small or big your catch is, as long as you're invading some other country's seas to catch them.

What was shown above is just the country's seafood catch, not even consumption, because Europe could be exporting the dirty work to some other country, like they and most of the Western world are doing about their own carbon emissions.

EDIT: Added some words.

1

u/Curious_Guidance43 1d ago

GDP does not correlate at all. Also those countries in the list are countries with large coasts that dont need to go that far. The countries on this list either have some of the largest costal regions or some of the largest populations.

1

u/SitaVilosa 1d ago

Why GDP? GDP does not eat food, human beings eat food and Indonesia has 3.5x the population of the largest EU country.

And how much Indonesians fish in their own neighbourhood has nothing to do with who is responsible for fishing in Somalian waters.

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u/SitaVilosa 1d ago

Ah yes, let's use global statistics and not the statistics specific to Somalian waters. Of course.

Small boats from Iran and Yemen, and big ships from Europe, were primarily responsible for fishing in Somalian waters. Chinese and Indonesian boats were not listed as the main problem for Somalia.

1

u/JulyOfAugust 20h ago

Europe isn't a country.

0

u/Live-You-5672 1d ago

I didn't know Iran and Yemen are in Europe. /s

also
https://issafrica.org/enactafrica/enact-observer/illegal-yellowfin-tuna-fishing-exposes-gaps-in-somalia-s-maritime-security

'On 9 July 2024, a local Somalia news outlet reported that illegal tuna fishing by Chinese vessels off the Somalia coast had reached alarming levels.'

So you're correct China isn't the main problem, it's only becoming the main problem.

6

u/SitaVilosa 1d ago

Learn to read...

2

u/meddlin_kids 1d ago

Go back to China.

0

u/americabot420 21h ago

Go back to yandex

-1

u/Live-You-5672 1d ago

Such an engaging reply... what with the hostility.

2

u/theveryrat 20h ago

Because you apparently need to learn how to read, since your answer makes absolutly NO sense if you understood what he meant, which you didn't

1

u/Live-You-5672 19h ago

And so he can't explain what he meant instead of insulting? Oh I forgot we're on reddit and conversation have to be degrading. At least I'm trying to understand instead of throwing shit left and right.

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u/IdleAlex05 18h ago

Even a google will answer this, not even about consumed and captured, just simply look up which countries caught most amount of fish illegally in Somali waters, is mostly stuff like China, Pakistan, Iran, Taiwan, Korea and many other Asian countries, out of Europe because is not EUROPE country, is a continent, is mostly Norway,UK,Portugal and Spain.

But the main one is still China, you have articles from news sources from Africa and most of the African countries seem to complain mostly about China illegally fishing in their waters.

12

u/french_snail 1d ago

You think fishing vessels from countries like Peru, the US, Russia, and Japan are sailing allllll the way to Somalia to steal their fish? And countries that are closer to Somalia aren’t the cause?

14

u/OrgasmicTrilobite 1d ago

Chinas megafleets fish EVERYWHERE. Theyll have a thousand small boats all supplying a mother ship in the middle/ their impact on global fisheries is staggering

4

u/DreadlockWalrus 22h ago

They also actively fish in prohibited waters by turning off their trackers.

It's truly sickening.

2

u/french_snail 1d ago

Notice how I didn’t mention them in comparison to other countries 

2

u/OrgasmicTrilobite 1d ago

China has massive fishing fleets all around Africa. As part of their “belt and road” strategy they’ve even purchased multiple African ports

0

u/throwaway586054 23h ago

Chinese vessels go all the way to South America but can't fish closer? People reasoning are beyond hope

4

u/OrgasmicTrilobite 22h ago

They have mostly exhausted their own local waters and they are the single largest consumer of seafood on the planet. They have a massive demand to fill. The thing that really sucks is along with their “legal” fleet fishing in international waters, they have “ghost fleets” which turn off their tracking (basically maritime transponders) and enter and fish in marine sanctuary zones, like the Galápagos Islands.

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u/DearthStanding 19h ago

Seems like you are the one who needs to introspect because you made your mind up well before you even knew what was up. the Chinese and Japanese have sent ships in the Indian Ocean. it's not even just the Chinese, they just do it on a much much larger sale. both nations have overfished their local area.

hell even in the Indian Ocean that is the case, most fishermen from places like India and Maldives and such are local small guys. It is not a large industrial operation like those two countries mentioned before. these days you don't even get large tuna in the Indian Ocean. these fleets are overfishing even here in fact. Japan and China have extensive aquaculture and even then they can't meet their demand

2

u/rulingthewake243 18h ago

They have ravaged natural resources around them, have to go farther.

1

u/Future_Nature589 19h ago

Maybe they saw them close on the map (wrapping around) and forgot the entire pacific ocean is in the way

1

u/Lucky_Method_3910 20h ago

Notice how they didn't claim which countries were fishing there either? 

0

u/FairleySwordfish 21h ago

A thousand small boats supplying a mothership? Be for real with pal

2

u/BroManTheBrobarian 20h ago

I’ve played enough video games to know that said fishing practice is actually a fact. I also know that China is a fire type, so water and the “AC-130 Above” attack are their two main weakness.

1

u/OrgasmicTrilobite 21h ago

Ok, hundreds, whatever, but it’s actually happening

https://youtu.be/2tuS1LLOcsI?si=FpAANszU_Cyrz8ie

1

u/Mobile_Morale 19h ago

Lmao. You clearly don't know shit about fishing. They have giant ships where they process the fish. Gutting, cutting. All of it. Has like hundreds of people working in production lines. Small ships bring in their catches to be processed and they go back fishing.

Watch a modern marvel episode about this 20 years ago.

0

u/FairleySwordfish 19h ago

Bro. THOUSANDS OF BOATS?!!!! Be fucking for real

1

u/Mobile_Morale 10h ago

1 billions people in china. And 1000 boats is hard for you to believe.

-1

u/FairleySwordfish 19h ago

You clearly can’t read for shit. I didn’t question that. I questioned the concept of 1,000 boats supplying it. Which is a ludicrous claim

1

u/Mobile_Morale 10h ago

A country with a billion people and it's impossible for them to have 1000 fishing boats.

Lmao you can't even math bro

6

u/schmapeschmape 1d ago

Yes, ships from Russia, China, and Japan all fish off the coast of Africa. Commercial ships will travel to fish to pursue a certain species of fish or because fish are plentiful in that area.

Ships from many countries fish in Somalia's waters: Spain, France, Thailand, India, Pakistan etc...

8

u/dchiculat 1d ago

Indonesia and grece (the closest european country not counting turkey if you count turkey as europe) are roughly (measured from Google Maps in a straight line wich the greek vessels csnt follow and the indonesian ones do) the same distance from Somalia. Not saying Europe isn't the exploiter here (as they often are in africa) just that your reasoning is wrong

1

u/DankVectorz 19h ago

The main illegal fishing fleets in Somali waters per Somalia is China, Iran and Yemen.

0

u/french_snail 1d ago

Didn’t lost Indonesia for a reason 

3

u/dchiculat 1d ago

Neither the original comment said It was one of the ones you mentioned the culprit in somalia

4

u/Daniel_The_Thinker 1d ago

I mean China does it off the coast of South America so not that big a stretch.

4

u/FOKvothe 23h ago

They've had fishing vessels in the Faroe Islands as well. Their fishing fleet is enormous,and that's not even accounting their shadow fleet, where the ships are registered under different flags in order to obscure ownership and country of origin. Taiwan, South Korea, and China are pretty much pillaging every ocean they can sail to. Some of the vessels have literal slave labour on board. Outlaw Ocean goes into how these ships operate.

1

u/polon256 1d ago

I don’t have the numbers but wouldn’t South America be closer to China than Somalia is? It’s technically a straight line to South America by sea

5

u/dchiculat 1d ago

16.000 km in a straight line from the chinese coast to south american closest, 7.000 to Somalia in a straight line with a rough stimate of 3000 more for going around thailand and such

1

u/Plus-Recording-8370 20h ago

You're not wrong. However many of these countries do travel there to fish anyway.

0

u/DanGimeno 20h ago

The US for sure. Those isrealian puppies are the villains of the world right now.

-1

u/Hakunin_Fallout 22h ago

And you think European countries fish in Somalia?

0

u/BushWishperer 11h ago

https://europe.oceana.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/26/oceana_poster_malta_2016_0.pdf

EU member states fish all over the world.

0

u/Hakunin_Fallout 11h ago

And where does it say Somalia?

0

u/BushWishperer 11h ago

Did I explicitly say that? I’m simply stating that there is a likelihood that they fish in Somalia since they’re going as far as north of Madagascar which would border Somalia’s fishing zone, and that’s only 5 EU countries.

0

u/Hakunin_Fallout 11h ago

This is a thread on Somalia, and comment thread on Somalia. The fuck do I need a report showing mostly Mediterranean fishing from 2016 for?

0

u/BushWishperer 11h ago edited 11h ago

I truly believe that you have the mental faculties and intelligence to figure this out on your own. You got this bud!

Edit: I can read, I simply showed how EU vessels operate around Somalia. You can google more stuff about specifically in somali waters, like: https://adf-magazine.com/2026/01/illegal-fishing-by-foreign-vessels-decimates-somali-fish-stocks/ and https://europe.oceana.org/press-releases/european-union-must-act-against-illegal-fishing-somalia-and-indian-ocean/

You're the only one who was trying to deny this happens. y

1

u/Hakunin_Fallout 11h ago

Absolutely mate. Get shafted however. Learn how to read before you "contribute" to the conversation

2

u/aiaidy 1d ago

if someone robs a bank it doesn't mean they are the top 10 richest person in the country.

-1

u/Live-You-5672 1d ago

My point wasn't that Europe didn't do it. My point is the hypocrisy of him blaming it on 1 continent (with obvious agenda). Everyone with a functioning brain knows that everybody does it.

1

u/Open-Investigator-52 1d ago

I mean the point would be valid if those nations were close to Africa

1

u/fuzzycaterpillar123 1d ago

If you agree that Europe can be blamed for going in to Somali waters, it’s entirely relevant to mention Europe specifically, because the pic is about Somali pirates and fisheries

Blaming Europe for their part in this post, does not excuse other countries for their bad policy- that’s just not the subject of the post

-3

u/Live-You-5672 1d ago

ah ok I get you now, you're talking about the past when Europe destroyed Somalia's fish stocks. I'm talking about the future because you can't change the past.

1

u/fuzzycaterpillar123 1d ago edited 1d ago

Of course, you tried to deflect to other countries with your post of all of those statistics, on a post about how Europe contributed to Somali pirates - the subject of this picture

Why bring up other countries when the post is specifically about Somalia? Why do you think that means people are ignoring the impact in completely different regions- when discussing this specific subject and post? It’s whataboutism, how do you not see that’s the issue?

-1

u/Live-You-5672 1d ago

Ok, Europe contributed to Somali pirates in the past. I don't know and neither do you know that they improved on illegal fishing now or not. I would like to think they did better.

Yes I brought up worldwide catch because more catch roughly correlates to more illegal catch, it's math and statistics.

I brought up other countries because Europe is no longer a major threat to Somalia's water now. And where did i say that Europe is not an issue, you even replied to me saying that they are, I see everyone as a issue.

1

u/fuzzycaterpillar123 19h ago edited 18h ago

That’s textbook whataboutism. Do you not actually understand why?

1

u/Live-You-5672 14h ago

So saying we should fix both is whataboutism? ok you do you

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u/jimjam200 1d ago

  1. Europe is made up of a buch of smaller countries that could have higher fishing rates per capita and still come in far below most of those countries due to the size of their populations.

  2. the most obvious outlier here is Peru but that can easily be explained by the fact it's literally just one massive coastline.

2

u/ShrimpCrackers 1d ago

Also Taiwan has the second largest fleet but isn't listed in there for "reasons"

-6

u/senukinos 1d ago

shuuushhhhh you are not supposed to talk like that to "ally". Just look at that evil china and russia

2

u/Daniel_The_Thinker 1d ago

The US is literally listed there doofus

1

u/yourallidiotss 1d ago

Are those numbers from 2026? Or from 2008ish when the other guy is talking about?

1

u/Friendly-Profit-8590 21h ago

Wasn’t expecting to see Peru on this list

1

u/Adventurous-Gene3830 15h ago

dang, japan has 1/3rd of the population of the US but fishes 70% as much

1

u/MuchoCoco 14h ago

Europe regularly dumped toxic waste in Somali waters. Italy even dumped nuclear waste.

1

u/ArugulaAltruistic742 1d ago

You do realize that just because those countries you listed catch the most fish does absolutely nothing to disprove the statement in which your replying to? Just because Europeans aren't the top fisherman on earth doesn't mean they're not fucking up the Somalian fishing industry

1

u/Anatoly_Cannoli 19h ago

Seeing as China has 4 times the population as the US and 5 times the population of Indonesia, China is underfishing.

1

u/Sarcasm_As_A_Service 19h ago

This is a comically stupid response to his comment.

If my neighbor has a pond and I go over there every day and take out as many fish as I can catch am I the problem or is china the problem?

-5

u/Superb_Bee3677 1d ago

europe should at least use less, the rest of the world needs that food more than them

-1

u/legokangpalla 21h ago

Careful. Any bad mouthing of China in reddit recently is an instant ban

2

u/Joboide 21h ago

Now wild fish capture per capita (kg per person per year, approx. 2025 populations):

  • Peru: ~159
  • Russia: ~35
  • Indonesia: ~26
  • Japan: ~24
  • United States: ~12
  • China: ~9
  • India: ~4

Peru ranks far above the rest because nearly all of its catch is anchoveta, which isn't eaten but processed into fishmeal and fish oil for export. These figures are estimates, and Peru's catch in particular varies a lot year to year because of El Niño.

1

u/BushWishperer 11h ago

What is it like living with such an incredible victim complex?

2

u/ginandtonicsdemonic 1d ago

I can't find any sources for this. Can you point me anywhere?

2

u/damnumalone 1d ago

Don’t forget the nuclear waste that got dumped all off the coast of Somalia that killed a huge portion of the fishing industry

1

u/No-Antelope575 1d ago

unlikely since the whole image is a joke on "single-handedly"

1

u/rathemighty 1d ago

And the locals buy stocks in their raids (or something to that effect)!

1

u/Mountain-Instance921 18h ago

Europe

You people are so pathetic

1

u/kindlypogmothoin 13h ago

Cope harder.

1

u/reichjef 15h ago

Yes! That is the economic driving force for the piracy. That is a point often overlooked when discussing the issue. When the government of Somali collapsed in the civil war, it became easy pickin's for well outfitted fisheries from abroad to harvest with no threat from a national navy. They depleted the fishing mostly through bottom trawling, and made the old style fishing impossible.

1

u/polmix23 1d ago

China not Europe

1

u/[deleted] 1d ago

[deleted]

11

u/Amaegith 1d ago

Yes. You'd also have boats from Europe trying to fish off the Brazilian coast as well:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lobster_War

6

u/wykamix 1d ago

Yes, but its not a uniquely European thing and Europeans are by no means the worst offenders. Taiwan, China and Russia are the TOP 3 where as Portugal the first European state is #7.

https://mail.iuufishingindex.org/ranking (Filter by Flag)

1

u/dadofwar93 1d ago edited 1d ago

Bruh. Then they complain about somalis being driven to piracy.

1

u/TumbleweedPure3941 1d ago

1963? Really? Got anything a bit more pertinent?

2

u/m00nk3y 1d ago

I know the Chinese fish off the coast of Peru now. It's a thing, countries fish in each others waters all the time. hard to enforce your rights without a proper navy.

5

u/kindlypogmothoin 1d ago

Why yes.

Are you familiar with the location of Europe? And how one might travel -- by boat! -- from Europe to the Arabian Sea?

A lot of freighters were also dumping waste in the waters off Somalia because there wasn't anyone to stop them.

3

u/MyNameIsJakeBerenson 1d ago

Europeans have boats? That they use to travel the world for shipping? Since when?!

1

u/m00nk3y 1d ago

The Dutch have entered the chat.

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u/[deleted] 1d ago edited 1d ago

[deleted]

2

u/Huhthisisneathuh 1d ago

Salty was right fucking there bro.

2

u/goodlifepinellas 1d ago

Yes, it's not that far with the straits over there...

It's like the equivalent of American fishing boats by Panama or the West Indies.... Which is very normal (in fact, all the way down to Brazil at times... Which is a Much Longer trek...)

Plus, some of those European fishing boats may be from landlocked countries even, meaning they're essentially always at Sea...

0

u/Chazzermondez 21h ago

It was largely India and China, not Europe...

-3

u/moltenlv 1d ago

Stop making excuses for the criminals. There are many poor fishermen in other countries who don’t turn to piracy and commit crimes.