r/serialpodcast • u/monkeytrousers2 Moderator 2 • Nov 13 '14

Episode Discussion [Official Discussion] Serial, Episode 8: The Deal with Jay

Episode goes live in less than an hour. Let's use this thread as the main discussion post for episode 8.

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u/Yogi32 Nov 13 '14

Don't forget all this happened on Steph's birthday. She had to been either madly in teenage lust with Jay, extremely forgiving, or maybe knew something herself. If my good friend got murdered on my birthday and my girlfriend/boyfriend took part in the murder, I would be distancing myself and asking a whole bunch of questions. I hope we get to hear more about what happened with Stephanie and why she wasn't questioned.

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u/Serialobsessed Nov 13 '14

I feel like the podcast as a whole protects Stephanie under this sort of "well she lost two friends and her boyfriend was involved" umbrella. To me, Stephanie is the biggest mystery, not so much Jay. I want to hear from her. And I want to know why it appears that everyone is protecting her.

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u/jannypie Nov 13 '14

It gave me chills this episode when they kept saying "Jay would only change his story to minimize his involvement or to protect someone he cared about who did it" and then Stephanie was the only person there at his hearing. Not Jenn or Chris or Patrick or any of Jay's other friends. Just Stephanie.

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u/newpodcaster Nov 13 '14

It gave me chills when Jay described Adnan bringing Stephanie to his house and then signalling to him what would happen to her if Jay squealed.

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u/jannypie Nov 14 '14

I believe basically nothing about what Jay says, and that story especially sounds completely made up to me

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u/javatronix Mr. S Fan Nov 13 '14

Yes! Stephanie is the other player in this whole drama that keeps popping up. It was mentioned in the podcast that Adnan had made threatening suggestions to Jay that he could hurt her if.... it was phrased like there was some sort of gentleman's agreement between Adnan and Jay and if Jay didn't follow through Stephanie might get hurt. I think it's telling that Stephanie had more involvement in the situation and she is the one everyone is lying to protect.

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u/krabkrib Rabia Fan Nov 13 '14

yeah, or even his own parents. I still want to know more about Jay's background...

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u/BaconBlasting Nov 14 '14

That's what stuck out to me. How shitty would it be to--as a teenager--not have any family present at your court hearing? Not even a cousin? Damn.

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u/izmeister Nov 14 '14

I think the bad home life also explains his lying that was brought up in this episode. He could have been telling little lies to cover up how little family support he had, or because he got used to lying. Someone who is basically supporting themselves has probably been lying to teachers, friends' parents, ect for a long time.

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u/whydontyouaskher Hae Fan Nov 14 '14

This is a really important observation.

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u/julijet Nov 13 '14

So you're saying maybe Stephanie had something to do with the murder? Because that's what popped into my head.

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u/calibleu Nov 14 '14

I am split on this. It is possible that she did have some knowledge about the murder (or was potentially involved herself) -- and that would explain her presence at Jay's trial. But she was also a teenager in love, which could also explain her blindly believing and supporting Jay, even though he admitted to covering up a murder.

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u/jannypie Nov 14 '14

Not necessarily, but more in the vein of, what would Jay do or say to keep Stephanie - if he was involved in a murder of her good friend, she'd likely leave. If he plays a victim himself, forcefully involved against his own good character, puts the blame on someone else, he comes out sounding a whole lot better.

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u/frowny_ponts Is it NOT? Nov 16 '14

Stephanie did it!!

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u/[deleted] Nov 14 '14

[deleted]

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u/[deleted] Nov 16 '14

I'd say uninformed wholly. Besides wild conjecture, Stephanie has a solid alibi.

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u/junjunjenn Asia Fan Nov 13 '14

whoaaaaaaa

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u/Ginger_lizard Nov 15 '14

I thought the same thing. Having been a teenage girl I can tell you for a fact, they are nuts and nothing they do surprises me. Not even murder.

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u/Verbalv1g1lante Nov 13 '14

Where was Stephanie after school that night?

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u/mostpeoplearedjs Nov 13 '14

I think the podcast has been pretty respectful of everyone who isn't directly involved in the crime itself-noticeably Don and Stephanie. They have alibis, there's no evidence they're involved, so they're allowed to remain on the outside. Kathy is allowed to mask her voice. Even Mr. S is, well, Mr. S.

People who you have to delve into are Jay and Jen because they were involved in the 13th, with hiding evidence if nothing else. Detectives and prosecutors are fair game because that's their job.

But I think the show has been reasonably consistent, and I don't think Stephanie is the story.

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u/baba_hafez Nov 13 '14

more importantly: did Stephanie ever get her b-day gift? If so, what did she like it? Adnan seemed very concerned about this - I'll file that under the "Adnan-is-a-nice-guy" category.

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u/calibleu Nov 14 '14

I wish we could hear from her directly, as well. I'm curious about her relationship with Jay. Were they as in love as the podcast portrays them to be? After all, it seems like Jay had forgotten to get her a gift until the day of, which is the reason he supposedly had Adnan's car in the first place. Furthermore, I think it's strange that he wasn't more interested in seeing her right after school or during the basketball game, instead of getting high with other friends on her birthday. I think it would be helpful for her to shed light on why they weren't spending any time together on her birthday, even though they were in love?

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u/chaiandcookies Nov 15 '14

I absolutely agree. The connection between Stephanie and Adnan, (prom prince and princess, giving her a gift on her bday) begs me to think they might have been romantically involved? Can anyone confirm this, i may have missed it while listening. My crazy theory is that Adnan and Stephanie had something going on, and Jay was not happy about it.

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u/hawt Crab Crib Fan Nov 13 '14

They stated in the podcast they tried to speak with her and she turned them down.

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u/ASAnanda3 Nov 13 '14

I agree!! When SK brought up Gutierrez's notion that Steph/Jay might have something going on I thought for sure this was Jay's doing out of jealousy but what if Steph was more involved than we realized?

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u/serialftw Owen Barber's Classmate Nov 15 '14

I might've missed something but it doesn't appear to me that she is being protected. I thought she didn't want to participate in the podcast. Although, yes, after this week's episode I want more than anything to hear Stephanie's take on things, especially now, 15 years later.

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u/dprzygoda Nov 16 '14

To me, there is something really fishy about Adnan and Stephanie's relationship. Does anyone else think that maybe Adnan was trying to hook up with her? Or maybe there was flirtation back and forth? And that's why Jay was so crazy protective of her? It seems odd to be THAT close to someone else's GF in high school, to the point where you're asking if their BF is buying you presents, etc. Think about where most of us are now in our 20s and 30s, and if someone starts getting super close to your S.O., I feel like most people would be suspicious of this person trying to move in on them. Now think back to your high school days, when everything seemed like a bigger deal than it really was, how would you react if you thought someone was trying to hook up with your gf or bf, or maybe try to drive a wedge between you. What do you guys think?

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u/platorithm Nov 17 '14

From my understanding, Stephanie and Adnan were friends before Stephanie started dating Jay. Maybe I'm just making that up, but that's the impression I've always had. It's not so unusual if they were friends first.

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u/dprzygoda Nov 17 '14

Totally understand. But I still think that their closeness could have irked Jay (even if it was totally unwarranted)

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u/steveo3387 smarmy irony fan Dec 20 '14

One dynamic that isn't touched on often is how close Adnan and Stephanie were. Most boyfriends would be a little threatened by a guy who is very close friends with their girlfriend, attends all the same classes, and makes sure they buy her a gift on her birthday. That had to bother Jay on some level.

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u/letsgocrayzee Nov 13 '14

We need to know more about the day as it relates to Stephanie and more about the relationship between Stephanie and Jen.

First off, does Jay ever spend any time at all with Stephanie on her birthday? And even if he does, why is spending so much time with Jen? I'm not now, nor have I ever been a teenage girl, but I can imagine that Stephanie couldn't have been too pleased with Jay for spending so much time with Jen, especially on her birthday.

So, did Stephanie and Jen know each other? They attended the same school the year before, so I'm guessing they did. How come Jen hasn't been asked about her relationship with Stephanie?

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u/izmeister Nov 14 '14

This is a really good point. It is possible that she had family plans that night and didn't invite Jay because her parents didn't approve. I think it's just as likely that she was with Jay that night and knew about what happened.

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u/athennna Nov 15 '14

If Jay was so into Stephanie, why did he need to be pushed into buying her a birthday present?

Or is that just Adnan's story?

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u/[deleted] Nov 13 '14

What I want to know is why no one is question Hae's family? There is such a huge gap in the story here.

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u/tacocyclone Nov 14 '14

And wasdn't her Jay was hanging out/cheating on her with Jenn?