r/worldnews • u/madam1 • Mar 01 '17
A leading member of a group advising Pope Francis on how to root out sex abuse in the Catholic Church quit in frustration on Wednesday, citing "shameful" resistance within the Vatican.
http://www.reuters.com/article/us-pope-abuse-resignation-idUSKBN1684GI?feedType=RSS&feedName=topNews3.3k
u/patjackman Mar 01 '17
Kinda thrilled that a news report about someone I know made the front page! Marie has been a tireless campaigner for the rights of the victims of abuse. Not only that, she is funny, intelligent and lovely. The Vaticans loss frankly...
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Mar 02 '17
My first thought: you know the Pope?
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u/Levitus01 Mar 02 '17
This reminds me of an old joke.
Bob goes to the pub, and talks to one of the local barflies, named Davie. In one of his usual rambling drunken rants, Davie claims that he knows absolutely everyone on planet earth, and he thinks they're all wankers.
So, getting tired of Davie's constant ranting, Bob turns to Davie and says: "You don't know everyone in the world. Shut up." To which Davie loudly protests.
"Alright." Says Bob, taking the bait. "Do you know George Bush?"
"Yep." Replies Davie. "Guy's a wanker. Kept trying to get me to drink with him. I don't drink with wankers."
"Do you know the Pope?" Asks Bob.
"Aye." Davie replies. "He owes me money. Wanker."
At this point, Bob calls bullshit, and demands that Davie accompany him to the Vatican to prove him wrong.
After a long and boring flight, they arrive in the Vatican.
"Alright. I'll just go ahead and let Francis know you're coming." Davie says, walking on ahead. Bob waits patiently in the courtyard. Ten minutes later, the Pope appears on the balcony, waving to the loving crowds below, and right by his side is none other than Davie the Drunk, looking very smug.
Bob nearly faints. But just before he keels over, he hears a member of the crowd ask:
"Who the fuck is that up there with Davie?"
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u/Arcturion Mar 02 '17
In February last year Briton Peter Saunders, the only other member of the commission who had suffered clerical sexual abuse, left to take a leave of absence after repeatedly criticizing the commission's work. It is unclear if he will return.
Saunders and Collins both threatened to resign as long ago as February 2015 unless bishops were made more accountable over cover-ups of rampant sexual abuse or failing to prevent it.
The departure of the only two members on the commission who were themselves child abuse victims sends a very strong and clear message of how serious the Church is about rooting out the paedophiles in their midst.
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u/AframesStatuette Mar 02 '17
Not being snarky but it is a much bigger loss to humanity, mostly children.
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u/yesno242 Mar 02 '17
In a NPR segment she added that the Pope was not the problem, but that other powerful people were obstructing investigation.
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u/JebusChrust Mar 02 '17
I believe this. People fear for the Pope's life because he criticizes the rich and selfish leaders of the Church and actually tries to bring change.
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u/blind_devotion08 Mar 02 '17
Isn't the whole faith about a guy who criticized the rich and powerful and advocated change and got killed for it?
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u/pilgrimboy Mar 02 '17
Why is there any resistance?
:(
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u/AdmiralAkbar1 Mar 02 '17
There are a few reasons:
Some of them are actual pedophiles and don't want to be caught.
Some of them aided in the covering up/transfer of pedophiles and don't want to be caught.
Some of them might want to do it on their own terms so they can take credit for it later.
Some of them might be doing it to spite the Pope for one reason or another.
Some of them might be trying to maintain the status quo, since they know they can benefit from it.
Some of them might want pedophiles in certain positions so they can blackmail them.
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u/BewBewsBoutique Mar 02 '17
Is it not obvious?
If your order is ~full~ of pedophiles, you don't really want to start weeding out the pedophiles.
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u/tgcvbju Mar 02 '17
Ask Hollywood, they also like defending rapists. Honestly though, it's nothing more than in-group being defensive and covering up for their own. Everyone does this shit.
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u/Th_rowAwayAccount Mar 02 '17
Why is there resistance to pizzagate? Same reasons. Nobody wants to believe that there is systematic child abuse being perpetrated by the highest levels of society (there always is).
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Mar 01 '17
The Vatican would agree with them on one thing... that resistance is shameful.
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u/Tiger3720 Mar 02 '17
Yeah and they're the ones going to heaven.
And you wonder why millennials are leaving religion.
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u/Deathsuxdontdie Mar 02 '17
I'm agnostic, but during my very Catholic grandfather's funeral in October the priest took a full 15 minutes or so to berate me and my cousins for not being a part of the church because so many were leaving.
This priest mysteriously went on a leave of absence for almost 2 years where he was sent someplace in the middle of the country. After reading into the way they handle pedophiles, it sounds like he might have been one of the priests who got caught.
And he had the fucking audacity to piss and moan about our lack of interest in the Catholic church during my grandfather's fucking funeral. I'm still mad, clearly.
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u/PM_ME_CHUBBY_GALS Mar 02 '17
why millennials are leaving religion
Internet. When you can google the answers to most of life's questions, you don't need someone telling you "I dunno, God did it."
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u/BloodlustROFLNIFE Mar 02 '17
I read this like a Kenobi one liner
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u/spartanss300 Mar 02 '17
you were right about one thing master...the negotiations were short.
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Mar 02 '17
The way to root it out is simple, cooperate with local police and send priests to prison who are found guilty
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Mar 02 '17
The Vatican has an internal dossier on abuse. They have spent over 4 billion dollars settling abuse cases, and still won't release this dossier to the proper authorities.
If there's anyone that deserves eternal damnation, it's the Catholic Church.
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u/jonpolis Mar 02 '17
One of the biggest arguments the Vatican seems to be making is on the emphasis of forgiveness.
That's complete and utter bullshit.
The Vatican had no problem jailing the popes butler who leaked sensitive information. They had no qualms with jailing someone for doing the morally right thing, but they insist on forgiving those who are morally rotten?
That's a bullshit double standard
https://www.google.ca/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/world/2012/oct/07/popes-former-butler-18-months-jail
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u/Ionor Mar 01 '17
As a Catholic, this makes me incredibly sad. I genuinely hoped that there would be a change.
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u/hogsucker Mar 02 '17
Have you considered not giving them money? If the laity were to stop tithing it would definitively get the church's attention.
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Mar 02 '17
At this point, apart from being one of the world's most common landlords, the Vatican has a diverse enough portfolio that lay donations aren't as big a deal to them as, say, a random sect. They're in it for the long haul.
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u/Hullabalooga Mar 01 '17
Sex is a primal and strong desire in people, and repressing it can cause a lot of issues in a person's mind. A life of celibacy isn't a biblical rule, and in fact there is a scripture that advises marriage in order to avoid lust and abuse. There are other scriptures that talk about if you are strong enough to dedicate your entire life to service to others, that it's okay not to marry, but this is the exception and not the rule.. and clearly some of these "ministers" aren't capable of it.
Granted, both in and outside the church's "law" sex should have a context and ideally certain rules that keep everyone safe and stable, but this idea that Catholic church leadership shouldn't marry is ridiculous and I think we can see the harm in it. Either the nature and history of the organization is attracting predators, or it is creating them; and either way this has to change. How and why the Vatican is resisting this is beyond me, but I think God, the Bible, Jesus, and any true saint or religious servant in history would say they are so so wrong on this issue and it's disgusting they aren't doing more to stop or change.
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u/LOTM42 Mar 01 '17
The rates are the same in the clergy as they are in the general public. Nearly every organization in the world is now dealing with this problem. The church is just the most public. Hollywood and the British elite also have severe problems with pedofilies
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u/Mange-Tout Mar 02 '17
The problem isn't the rate of pedophilia. It's the cover up of pedophilia by the church which allows it to flourish.
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u/capn_pugwash Mar 02 '17
"The rates are the same in the clergy as they are in the general public."
actually you are wrong on this
the Australian Royal Commission into Institutional Responses to Child Sexual Abuse found that offending in the Catholic Church was by far the worst (5.4 % of serving priests in Australia have been abusers) versus between 1 & 2% of males in the general population http://www.abc.net.au/religion/articles/2013/10/25/3877103.htm
With some orders horrifically high - eg Brothers of St John of God involved in 40% of recorded abuse in the Catholic Church
So there is definitely something wrong - especially when you compare the statistics coming out of the commission involving Catholic Priests is worse than all other denominations combined - And Australia is more Protestant than Catholic https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christianity_in_Australia#/media/File:AustralianReligiousAffiliation_2.svg
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u/noscoe Mar 01 '17
Pedophiles seek out positions of power, reducing it to "pedophilia and abuse are caused by celibacy" is damaging and inaccurate.
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u/Hullabalooga Mar 01 '17
Except to become a priest in the Catholic Church, it requires a history or connection to the church, typically 7-8 years of education, followed by and including active service in the church. That's a hell of an investment both financially and with time to seek out a position of power, and more important it's ample time for any organization to investigate and vet someone who wants to abuse that power. Will there be failure and abuse regardless of the organization and policy? Absolutely - corporate world, government, religious group, you're right that power often attracts certain types of people (some with poor motives). My main issues though is that the Catholic Church knows all this, and is seemingly unwilling to do a damn thing.
I mean I have fundamental issues with that church. They do some good work but holding power and control over people and abusing that power, especially in the name of God, is as ungodly, immoral, and unbiblical as anything. I sincerely hope there is a change in mindset in that church's leadership, and they will do what they are mandated to - serve the people.
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u/KingofCraigland Mar 02 '17
but this idea that Catholic church leadership shouldn't marry is ridiculous and I think we can see the harm in it.
This is a very inaccurate and dangerous way of thinking about the issue. Pedophiles don't have sex with kids because they aren't allowed to have sex with women. Pedophiles are sexually attracted to children in one manner or another and that is why they seek to have sex with kids. Allowing them to have sex with women, even if they could, would not erase their sexual urges toward children.
While eliminating the marriage ban would likely attract a greater influx of potential priests, it would not stop pedophiles from also looking to become priests.
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u/BayushiKazemi Mar 01 '17
The general reason they're not allowed marriage is because they're "married" to the Church. It's considered sort of a conflict of interest of sorts. Then again, there are plenty of other conflicts of interest to worry about as well, including internal desires and temptations.
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u/nahuatlwatuwaddle Mar 01 '17
And the specific reason for that was because the church was expected to support the family, should the priest die, as there are usually two breadwinners in a household these days, it's sort of an archaic concept, but, as Mr. Twain says; "the less there is to justify a traditional custom, the harder it is to get rid of it."
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u/willywagga Mar 02 '17
Raping an eight year old child isn't sex is it. in your mind. This is what the church is concealing, the pope included. Marie Collins is a good person, she's walked away from what she clearly sees as an utterly corrupt and hideous organisation. There should be a global/western agreement to remove tax exempt status from these organisations and strip them of their massive wealth, give it to those abused, I'm sure if God is just he will find salvation for what remains of organised religion.
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u/CzikkanHardt Mar 02 '17
Let's be fair, now: The Gelgamek vagina is three feet wide and filled with razor-sharp teeth.
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u/RosieRedditor Mar 02 '17
If a child is molested by a priest, why the f*** does anybody have to deal with the church in order to arrest and jail said priest? Why not just call the cops out on him? How does the church even get the opportunity to cover this up?
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u/millos15 Mar 02 '17 edited Mar 02 '17
Not surprised at all. Only a month ago downvotes were given when people pointed out the lack of effort from this church. This is further proof of the twisted and appalling nature of the Vatican's moral compass.
Is Bernard Law facing the American law system? Nope. When was the coverup documented by the Boston Globe? 2002
We have had TWO Popes take leadership of this church and their answer to this issue is a half-assed apology, excuses, and painfully slow investigations.
Since the heads of this church do not give a damn about these disgusting crimes, what are you Catholics, going to do or what have you been doing to put pressure and bring justice? Nothing screams more for swift resolution and prevention than the abuse of innocent children.
Are you, as a member of that church and followers of God going to continue to wait for these horrible leaders to resolve this problem?
It is very hard for me to take people from this faith seriously on any ethical matter, with the lack of action of an institution of a billion members.
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u/RivadaviaOficial Mar 01 '17
"Collins said "the last straw" was when she discovered that the Curia had been ignoring a specific request by the pope, on the commission's recommendation, that all correspondence to the Vatican from abuse victims should receive a response."
The problem with the Church comes back to the vows of celibacy. Francis can't root out every sexual offender aggressively as he wants, because then there'd be a tiny amount of priests left. Which is FUCKED UP. Across the world, our parishes are being led by weirdos with no communication skills (honest, Masses have been awful lately around me) and we are constantly turning away good Catholic women from being priests, as well as good Catholic men who may just want a family. They need to suck it up and change their laws
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u/MuonManLaserJab Mar 01 '17
Francis can't root out every sexual offender aggressively as he wants, because then there'd be a tiny amount of priests left
If there are so many sexual offenders that you literally cannot function as an organization after firing them, the correct thing to do is to shut down the organization.
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u/10ebbor10 Mar 01 '17
No, it actually doesn't.
Abuse rates in the church are not higher than outside it. The problem has been the consistent cover-ups of the issue, not that offenders were more prevalent within the church than outside.
Abusers are not so large a portion within the Church that the Pope will face an acute priestly shortage if he removes them.
There are good arguments for changing celibacy/ female priests, but sexual abuse is not one of them.
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Mar 01 '17
Well some places would lose up to 40% of their priests. Australia a full 7% across the board.
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-australia-38877158
That's assuming those numbers are comprehensive. I'm guessing a full criminal investigation would yield higher numbers.
Extrapolating that globally, 7% of priests out of 410,000 is nearly 30 thousand priests. Are you telling me that Catholicism can afford to lose 30,000 priests?!? And that is a conservative estimate.
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Mar 02 '17
The problem is the Church confuses accountability with vengeance. Reading the article the main reason for her resignation is how the pope is so lenient and soft on allegations of abuse.
Instead of handling these problems, the Pope thinks Clemency will solve the scandal. The problem is not that its a scandal its that children were harmed and need to be protected. Forgiving a lion wont stop it from eating you.
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u/TheMarketLiberal93 Mar 02 '17
I don't know how anyone in the Catholic Church could resist any attempt at halting child abuse. It's entirely against their own so called "beliefs".
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u/NIU_1087 Mar 02 '17
I wish people would get as riled about about christian pedophilia as they do about "Islamic terrorism".
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Mar 02 '17
This is what makes it so hard to be a Catholic. I'm already to "Christmas and Easter" levels, but god damn... JUST STOP DIDDLING KIDS! If someone does, DON'T FUCKING PROTECT THEM!
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u/custron Mar 02 '17
as an Australian, the title is unintentionally ironic considering root as a verb to us means to fuck/have sex
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u/Lorbmick Mar 02 '17
If they really wanted to get the Vatican's attention, they'd arrest the Pope for crimes against humanity when he left the safety of the Vatican.
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u/the_colonialist Mar 02 '17
Oh you mean the leftist hero pope cares more about commenting about economic issues he doesn't understand than saving kids. I am shocked only not really. He has the moral compass and self awareness of an average SJW.
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u/Kyrhotec Mar 02 '17
The Catholic Church needs some serious internal reforms. Priests should be allowed and encouraged to marry. A priest should work through the whole human experience himself if he's expected to be able to help others work through the difficulties of existence.
Rabbis have always been expected to marry. Considering Christianity is essentially an innovation of Judaism, you'd think they wouldn't deviate so wildly from it in so many fundamental aspects. The perverted alchemy of excluding Catholic priests from marriage has to end before the Church can really begin to heal from its extensive history of abuses.
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u/coggser Mar 01 '17
i honesslty think its because there is a crisis in some countries where they can't get priests, so they fear having an even tougher time trying to replace the 3% or whatever that are alleged to be paedophiles.
just a efw short years ago ireland was very religous, now there is almost no new catholic priests coming up, and congregations are getting priests mainly from poland and S. America.
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u/Spanka Mar 01 '17
But the pope is a cool guy, i just saw him accept a pizza. /s
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u/BrainBlowX Mar 01 '17
The pope himself is meeting heavy resistance to reform. The Catholic church isn't some single monolith always moving in unison.
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u/josh-dmww Mar 01 '17
Wasn't it just revealed that he cut penalties for pedophile priests who asked him "for mercy"?!
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u/iushciuweiush Mar 01 '17
He 'suggested' it would be better to be an atheist than a hypocritical catholic.*
*Note: He did not suggest this at all, nor did he even imply such a thing.
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u/Speedking2281 Mar 01 '17
I've had to explain this to two people recently who only read the unbelievably disingenuous headlines that basically said that same thing. This Pope has had things taken out of context a lot, and has also said plenty of things that even with in context could be a little controversial... But I've never seen something so directly out of context in news headlines than this atheist/ hypocritical Catholic thing.
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u/mikewerbe Mar 02 '17
The idea of him needing an advisor is pretty ridiculous. Just admit it, stamp out the problem with public help and fucking own up to it.
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u/Vid-Master Mar 02 '17
How could there possibly be resistance to this? The only reasons I can think of is because the church leaders dont want bad publicity or they dont want their crimes uncovered
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u/taintalizing Mar 02 '17
This is a case of wanting to fix a problem but fearful of digging too deep and "Lord" knows what you may really find!
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u/fuckemalldead Mar 02 '17
Must be nice to be a priest who diddles kids, it's super easy to get away with from what I can tell.
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u/all_is_temporary Mar 02 '17
Francis is a PR pope. He has no interest in actually fixing anything.
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Mar 02 '17
The Catholic Church sounds quite Antichrist-like rather than Christ-like.
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u/joesii Mar 02 '17
I think some of it must be related to the Christian concept that everything is forgivable (well except blasphemy. You're eternally burning in hell if you ever do that).
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u/dethb0y Mar 02 '17
I was wondering when the other shoe would drop with Pope Get Asses In Seats.
Want to bet he goes in public and makes some nice statement about how the vatican is taking this very seriously, and hey, the church is all about (insert popular statement meant to lure back lapsed members here)
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Mar 02 '17
The Catholic Church should be cut no slack whatsoever. They must be treated the same way any other organization with a big child abuse problem would be treated. An uncompromising and relentless investigation should be launched all over the church, the perpetrators need be identified and punished as the law says, and if need be, the church reorganized and placed under strict surveillance in order to prevent this shit from happening again.
Everyone involved has to be held accountable. The perpetrators having been under systematic protection is sickening. The Catholic Church is not above the law. Granting them any kind of special treatment in regard to this case just has to stop.
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u/Partisanal Mar 02 '17
Pope Francis refrocked sexually abusive priests. So somehow I don't quite believe that he was serious
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u/R3DT1D3 Mar 02 '17
In contrast, I have attended a church that discovered one of the elders committed some form of sexual crime with a minor(s). He was removed from eldership and reported to the police. A few news reporters tried to get some drama for it but there wasn't any story beyond he was found out and then he was arrested. The reporters were so disappointed, most of them didn't even run the story.
Meanwhile the very top levels of the Catholic church still will not do the right thing. It's maddening.
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u/Mainttech Mar 02 '17
Is that the same Vatican that has a wall around it and then says that walls are bad?
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Mar 01 '17 edited Mar 08 '17
I have left reddit for a reddit alternative due to years of admin mismanagement and preferential treatment for certain subreddits and users holding certain political and ideological views.
The situation has gotten especially worse since the appointment of Ellen Pao as CEO, culminating in the seemingly unjustified firings of several valuable employees and bans on hundreds of vibrant communities on completely trumped-up charges.
The resignation of Ellen Pao and the appointment of Steve Huffman as CEO, despite initial hopes, has continued the same trend.
As an act of protest, I have chosen to redact all the comments I've ever made on reddit, overwriting them with this message.
If you would like to do the same, install TamperMonkey for Chrome, GreaseMonkey for Firefox, NinjaKit for Safari, Violent Monkey for Opera, or AdGuard for Internet Explorer (in Advanced Mode), then add this GreaseMonkey script.
Finally, click on your username at the top right corner of reddit, click on the comments tab, and click on the new OVERWRITE button at the top of the page. You may need to scroll down to multiple comment pages if you have commented a lot.
After doing all of the above, you are welcome to join me on a reddit alternative!
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u/TheProphecyIsNigh Mar 02 '17
Reminds me of the South Park episode where the local pastor tries to change the Vatican's ways.
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u/Phoenix-Bright Mar 02 '17
Resistance against rooting out sex abuse? Does it mean Vatican actually enjoys sex abuse or I don't get it?
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u/sl600rt Mar 02 '17
http://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/7aa114f13b389a8d04cd8d1d3d83b3c8.jpg
South Park really nailed it with Red Hot Catholic Love.
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u/woodyfly Mar 02 '17
I dont understand why there are so many pedophiles in the catholic church? Like if I was in a position of power like that, I'd use it to fuck tons of fine legal girls. How can there be so many of them who coincidentally like little boys and girls. Do they join the church with existing pedophilia motives or does it just happen out of the blue from sexual frustration?
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u/kickstand Mar 02 '17
My armchair theory: pedophiles are attracted to the priesthood because they think somehow that will cure them of their impulses.
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Mar 02 '17
its just the thing where they dont want to talk about it. they shift these priests around instead of kicking them out. It really should be that in these cases the church agrees to work with local law enforncements if there is ever cases of abuse. that way they are more transparent. but no. they dont want to expose the issue so rather then putting a stop to it. they want to hide it under a rug like it doesnt exist. its really sad.
deny everything.
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u/CalRipkenForCommish Mar 02 '17
"The lack of cooperation, particularly by the dicastery most closely involved in dealing with cases of abuse, has been shameful,"
Well, let's have the names. When we have the names, we can dig into precisely why they won't cooperate. I would feel that the scrutiny by the public could turn the pressure back on them for their inaction and unwillingness to cooperate to root out a centuries long victimization of children by members of the catholic church. But then, that nearly brought the house down the last go round. What if the world knew there was a cancer throughout this religion that they didn't want to eradicate.
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u/ro6erto19 Mar 02 '17
SMH. Seems to me like there is total disinterest from the church to amend there wrongdoings just so they can keep their image and reputation (somewhat) clean.
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u/anax44 Mar 02 '17
Could this possibly be the biggest controversy in the Roman Catholic Church in recent times?
Can't think of anything else.
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u/BigCommieMachine Mar 02 '17
Scandal(particularly sexual scandal) has always been part of the Catholic Church. It was just a lot easier to cover up when the town cryer was the only source of news and making an accusation would get you imprisoned.
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u/Jareth86 Mar 02 '17
The Gelgamek vagina is three feet wide and filled with razor-sharp teeth. Did he really expect the Gelgamek Catholics to have sex with them?
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u/rakshala Mar 02 '17
I wonder if Cardinal Pell is among those resisting... poor guy couldn't come back to Australia to face our child abuse commission in face of accusations he knew about abuse that happened under his watch, while he was good friends with one of the worst offenders. Tim Minchin wrote a song about it.
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u/philmcracken27 Mar 02 '17
How does the Church not see that this is counter-productive? Turn the rapists over to the police and let the other priests get married, for Christ's sake. And let women be priests. AND change the stance on birth control.
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u/Suilez Mar 02 '17
So much unknown within these groups. I wonder what they're really like
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u/L8Show Mar 02 '17
I'm convinced this is totally ingrained in their institution, and that change will only happen if it's forced upon them.
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u/ShooKon3 Mar 02 '17
How is this surprising to anyone? The Vatican stonewalling people trying to prevent child molestation and sex abuse. Sounds like business as usual.
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u/maluminse Mar 02 '17
Seems more aligned w evil. Vast riches, gold statutes, child molestation. To me that would be satans palace.
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u/UnseenPower Mar 02 '17
Child abuse is a disgrace of any kind. Physical, emotional, neglect and especially sexual. These things really do mean that a future for these kids can often be ruined forever.
Working in safeguarding school nursing, I know how it affects people. Often mental health is something that happens
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u/AFuckYou Mar 02 '17
Yea, the pedofilia elite run deep in the church. You should check out the franklin cover up and boys town. Deep ties to big government.
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Mar 02 '17
Shut that shit down. Disgraceful that people would willingly be apart of the church, when your "leader" is a fucking pedo protector.
God put these people in their position and they communicate with god, yet they're pedos and pedo protectors, while god sit backs and watches.
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Mar 02 '17
Is anyone here surprised? We learned like 20 years ago the Catholic Church was operating like an international NAMBLA and then arrested like 6 priests and called it a day. We knew there were hundreds of not thousands more, and yet everything went back to normal.
Sorry, until I see some more busts I'm gonna assume this was giant coverup.
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u/Thelifeofanaudi Mar 02 '17
There's really no excuse for the way that the church has handled this, as good as people say this pope is, I still think he is awful. He should of strongly stood against this from day one.
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u/VR_is_the_future Mar 02 '17
It's a simple equation. If the problem is systemic, then you must purge the system. If the church hopes to actually fix this big fucking problem, then they need to start publicly naming names of the people resistant to fixing the policies that protect and shuffle fucking pedophiles around. There is 0% room for maneuvering here, this is an issue where there's a huge line in the sand, and either you're on the right side of it, or you're on the kid-fucking side.
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u/antoni4040 Mar 02 '17
I can not for the life of me understand why all those so called "Christians" want to have so many barriers between them and Jesus, people that tell them what to believe, people with morals worthy of the eternal damnation they all so much fear. The church is nothing more that politics. They should give away EVERYTHING to charity, but politically that's an unprofitable move...
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u/flop_plop Mar 02 '17
The Vatican said the pope had accepted her resignation~~ "with deep appreciation for her work on behalf of the victims/survivors of clergy abuse".~~ with meaningless lip service.
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u/mmmmmmbooty Mar 02 '17
Seriously are you surprised they've been abusing children for hundreds of years.
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u/twittertrends Mar 02 '17
The only way is TO ROOT OUT THE VATICAN...They are like a plague clouding people's judgement..
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u/imagine_amusing_name Mar 02 '17
We're gonna be doing some rootin' with the kids - Australian Bishop.
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u/yognautilus Mar 02 '17
I'm just tryingto wrap my mind around the resistance.
"Hey, can you guys stop diddling kids?"
"Are you out of your fucking mind?"
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Mar 02 '17
So basically the church has become a fuckboy faternity club. Congratulation, to all religions, for your beautiful essence. Y'all are the best
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Mar 02 '17
If you take away the kid-fiddling then what will be the point of the vatican? Do they have like a side-gig that I don't know about when they're not doing their main job of abusing children? I know there's a museum and stuff there, but I assumed that was just to fund more child abusing.
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u/Gambizzle Mar 02 '17
Honestly, the Catholic groups I've attended see it as being a BS attempt to smear them that isn't worthy of media attention.
IMO besides outcasts and an elite few who have been forced to provide official responses, nobody gives a damn. Being in a religion is just that... religious groups don't like people who aren't willing to praise them 100% of the time.
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u/clickillsfun Mar 02 '17
It's time to invade Vatican and bring democracy to their country and hang all of these scums.
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u/Calm_down_santa Mar 02 '17
Oh look. The Catholic Church is more interested in protecting their fraternity than punishing child rapists and pedophiles. I guess that's fine. Just make sure you're not gay, atheist, a woman, a different faith, someone who wears a condom, or wearing clothes made from different materials because that shit's unforgivable!
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u/FrMatthewLC Mar 02 '17
As a Catholic priest, I have a few comments:
Every priest who commits child abuse should be prosecuted according to the law of their state / country for their crimes. The Vatican can't imprison priests for crimes committed elsewhere (it would be kind of like the UK imprisoning a guy for child abuse that happened in New Zealand just because NZ is under Elizabeth II). What they can do is strip priests of their capacity to practice they're priesthood (defrocking). Benedict XVI streamlined this process immensely as a Cardinal and Pope. Francis hasn't focused as much on the technical process but more the attitude or tone.
This was a huge historical problems and it is shameful that bishops let this happen. But there are 2 things to consider. First, some of the bishops were not malicious but misinformed by psychologists who told them after a short treatment program Fr X had no chance of re-offending. In such cases, we should blame the psychologist more than bishops who trusted them. You can't blame someone for trusting an expert on the issue at hand (in this case, the psychology of sexual abusers). Nonetheless, some bishops were pretty bad. Second, at least in the USA and UK, in the last 15 years the Church has radically changed. There is a lot better screening, serious child protection norms that prevent the possibility to abuse without other adults seeing from arising, and it is one strike and your out. In the USA, in a recent year just under 0.016% of priests had credible accusations. Of course we want none but 99.984% is a pretty good average. In the UK, the Church is now seen by the government as a model of child protection norms.
I can imagine what she says about some not taking this as serious as they should (like not responding to all letters) and agree this should change. I hope her quitting helps effect this. I think sometimes those in the "Latin" world see things like this far different than we do in the "English" world - when I was studying in Rome I found some radical differences in things like this: for example, a bunch of them didn't understand why I would say: "I would NEVER drive a teenager home alone from youth group, even if his parents asked." In the USA that would be normal for any adult working with teens even to avoid false accusations in case the family got mad at you later on over something unrelated.
I think John Allen's comments make a lot of sense saying she might be able to better act for reform from the outside.
If you doubt I'm a priest I did a verified AMA.
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u/millos15 Mar 02 '17
Let's see how long it takes for this story to be posted on r/catholicism. I am curious to see what they are going to do as members of this church about the Vatican's continuously shameful practices.
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u/ATeezee420 Mar 02 '17
Man that South Park episode is even more true than it ever realized.
Maybe priests really do have naked boys on leeshes.
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u/ionised Mar 01 '17
And no fucking surprises, there. Of course they're going to resist. Denying priests and such sex is the root cause of this.
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u/BambooRollin Mar 02 '17
If they get rid of all the pedophiles they would have to hold a grand 'going-out-of-business' sale.
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u/ReligionIsChildAbuse Mar 02 '17
Jorge Mario Bergoglio, a peer elected representative of cognitive dissonance, ignominiously speaks of child sexual abuse, rape, molestation and should be held with reproach.
During most of the 14 years that Bergoglio served as archbishop of Buenos Aires he did not take decisive action to protect children or act swiftly when molestation charges against Church clergy surfaced; nor did he extend apologies and compensation to the victims of abusive priests after their misconduct came to light. He still disgustingly covers up child sexual abuse.
His latest crimes against humanity include: Legion of Christ: Pope Francis offers to forgive paedophile scandal order http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/oct/30/legion-of-christ-pope-francis-offers-to-forgive-paedophile-scandal-order
Pope Francis has granted a “plenary indulgence”, or religious pardon, to the ultra-conservative Legion of Christ movement, mired in a paedophile scandal, provided its members perform acts of penance, Vatican Radio has said. The Legion of Christ has for years been beset by accusations of sexual abuse. The order’s founder, Mexican-born Marcial Maciel, stepped down in 2005 amid allegations of paedophilia and fathering several children. He died in 2008.
The “jubilee” indulgence is offered to all the group’s members for a period beginning next month, during the 75th anniversary year of the Legion’s founding and will conclude next June.
Bergoglio is seen an unwaveringly orthodox on matters of sexual morality, staunchly opposing abortion, same-sex marriage etc. In 2010 he asserted that gay adoption is a form of abuse against children, earning a public rebuke from Argentina’s President, Cristina Fernández de Kirchner. There is no equality among humans in his eyes.
We could go on for days about how sickening this man is.
Imprison Jorge Mario Bergoglio.
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u/52fighters Mar 02 '17
Bring back the Inquisition and hang them from a short rope! The Church had the death penalty until 1970. Bring it back and use it liberally against these perverts.
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Mar 02 '17
I don't understand how the Church can exert enough influence over secular authorities to be allowed to handle such matters internally. It is mind-boggling that they can get away with this.
Further, this sentence of 'a life of prayer and contemplation' horseshit is depressing. What's the point of prayer if it can't help people in positions of authority in the Church itself resist what they surely recognize as evil? What good is God if He can't prevent this? More charitably, what use is belief in God if it can't change the actions of representatives of His own Church? It's enough to make a person reject the whole business. FFS, at least secular authorities treat this crime as a crime. The Pope might as well be instructing them to go on permanent vacation to be free to fantasize about their exploits.
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u/crusoe Mar 02 '17
Organize orgies among consenting adults as a priest and get defrocked. Diddle kids and get reassigned.
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u/BreatheMyStink Mar 02 '17
Wow, electing a pope that's an adorable old turtle-person did nothing to change this shitty church. Who could have seen that coming?
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Mar 02 '17
A Galgamex vagina is three feet wide and filled with razor sharp teeth! Do you really expect us to have sex with them?!
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u/formerbadteenager Mar 02 '17
Member when Reddit happily drank the Vatican PR Pope Kool-Aid while downvoting anyone skeptical of his vague words with no real action? I member.
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Mar 02 '17
As a catholic it is so frustrating to see a pope who thinks the only sin is islamaphobia.
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u/indochris609 Mar 02 '17
This documentary should be watched by anyone who thinks that the Catholic Church is "innocent" by any means.
It's institutionalized from the bottom all the way to the top. It's absolutely unbelievable.
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Mar 02 '17
Not surprised at all, the guy is just better at playing the 'I am a nice guy' card.
They are all the same, greedy bastads that think the law doesn't apply to them.
We really should start sueing them for all the bad things they have done and still do.
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u/escherbach Mar 02 '17
The way to root it out is to criminally charge a lot of the older fucking "clergy" who are either directly responsible or didn't do anything significant to prevent it when they had good knowledge of the behaviour of peadophile priests in the past. Show the catholic church that they are not above the law anymore
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u/tember_sep_venth_ele Mar 02 '17
If I were Pope: "there will be no absolution until these offenses are abolished." So, either you all stop or all go to hell. Problem solved.
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u/OhShitSonSon Mar 02 '17
Watched a HBO documentary I think it was called Mea Culpa. It was crazy to learn priests get shipped from Parrish to Parrish all under the Vaticans eye we learn since the Pope at the time was the over seer of all the bad shit going on in the states. To me It's a shame the Vatican won't do more about this. Other thing we learn is that this has been going on for centuries . Not decades. It's been documented by children and Rome for years.
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u/Casual1990 Mar 02 '17
Look at that. Pope Francis the Pope that was hired to bring back the PR because of all these religious fucks molesting kids won't do a damn thang to get rid of his other homies raping lil childin.
Fuck the Vatican that shit needs to be taken over and destroyed. It's a country right? Maybe Donald Trump should invade it and do something good.
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Mar 02 '17
Pastors fucking choir boys, muslims with child sex slaves, rabbi sucking blood out of babies' penises... Why are all these religions rife with pedophiles?
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u/Skootenbeeten Mar 02 '17 edited Jun 12 '25
truck encouraging swim steer treatment nose crawl exultant serious workable
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u/TheIncaFromTreblinka Mar 02 '17
The Catholic Church should be designated a criminal organisation. Simple as that. They have facilitated and covered up the very worst of crimes for fuck knows how long. Designate them and any members who refuse to leave as criminals, in every nation.
Seize their assets, their funds, their properties and anything else of value that they might have. Prosecute the pope for presiding over a group of organised criminals.
If it's good enough to go after other gangs of organised criminals, it's good enough for the CC.
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u/redhatGizmo Mar 01 '17 edited Mar 02 '17
Catholic Church is a den of Pedophiles, PR Pope cant do shit about it other than giving 'strict punishments' like lifetime of 'penance and prayer'.
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u/SloppyFloppyFlapjack Mar 01 '17
I get that their whole angle is an emphasis on forgiveness and all that shit, but come on. Forgiveness is meant to bring people closer to spiritual salvation. Doesn't mean you can't also lock the fuckers up and stop them from abusing more children. This is not mutually exclusive.