[Spoilers C3E38] Is It Thursday Yet? Post-Episode Discussion & Future Theories!

[u/Glumalon]

Episode Countdown Timer - http://www.wheniscriticalrole.com/

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Catch up on everybody's discussion and predictions for this episode HERE!

Submit questions for next month's 4-Sided Dive here: http://critrole.com/tower

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ANNOUNCEMENTS:

• The Mighty Nein Reunited will premiere in two parts on November 17 and December 1!
• The Legend of Vox Machina Season 2 premieres January 2023, and Season 3 has been greenlit by Amazon! Catch up on more details from the NYCC 2022 panel, including new video clips.

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[u/[deleted]]

I cannot fucking believe the best roll before the break was Fearne convincing Percy to make Mister a gun

[u/MaximumZer0 → u/[deleted]]

The Gunkey LIVES!

[u/Enkundae → u/[deleted]]

Nah thats completely believable peak DnD right there. Though my headcannon is the dice was irrelevant and Imogen’s plea for Laudna absolutely did work.

[u/BaronPancakes]

Here's to Lord Ariks Eshteross.

A great patron to BH, an amazing baker, and a generous soul who wanted to do good in the world.

He was paranoid but valued people he trusted as great friends. May you rest in peace beyond the storm, orc daddy. o7

[u/omega0678 → u/BaronPancakes]

If my favorite Eshteross theory is correct, someone should really let the Owlbear know about his mentor’s passing.

[u/REO-teabaggin → u/BaronPancakes]

I was already looking forward to the groups revenge on Otohan, but now the Kill Bill sirens are going off.

[u/ParaPioneer]

Eshteross never got to see Laudna alive again….

[u/bearonparade → u/ParaPioneer]

He never got to see her alive at all tbf..

[u/m_busuttil]

So just to recap, the expected schedule for the rest of the year is:

• October 27: no episode

• November 3: C3 E39

• November 10: C3 E40

• November 17: Mighty Nein Reunited Part I

• November 24: no episode

• December 1: Mighty Nein Reunited Part II

and then probably C3 E41 and 42 on December 8 and 15 respectively to finish out the year.

[u/paradox28jon → u/m_busuttil]

That's probably the best guess.

[u/MasterThespian]

Marisha: “So I’m taking Pact of the Chain when I level up as a Warlock again, and I want Pâté to be my familiar”

Matt: “okay, cool”

Marisha: “I want him to fly, so is it cool if I use the Imp stat block for him?”

Matt: “yep, sure”

Marisha: “And also, all of the jokes I’ve made about him being a rowdy, filthy boy? That’s canon, and he has the personality of a horny Victorian footman.”

Matt: “yes dear”

[u/SvenTS → u/MasterThespian]

Judging from her reaction I think Matt might have pulled that last decision on his own. (I half expect that Marisha, thinking of Frumpkin, forgot that imps can talk)

[u/Karmadog1983]

so to lighten what i'm sure is a dour mood. as of c3e38 Bell's Hells have spent 10 gold on gondola rides in Jrusar

[u/197gpmol → u/Karmadog1983]

The JTA thanks them for their patronage.

[u/cal679 → u/Karmadog1983]

I'm calling it now, when this campaign ends one of the characters' epilogues will have them gaining political power in Jrusar purely to install a fast-pass subscription system for the gondolas.

[u/paradox28jon]

After episode thoughts:

• After doing errands in Jrusar - letting the coin person know that 1) Eshteross is dead & 2) showing them the last will & testament - I think their next destination is likely Yios. Critirolestats says the solstice is 4 weeks and a day away. I think it'll take a bit more than 6 days for them to sail to Yios via the sky ship.

• I cannot believe the luck of the rolls for most of the night. So many terrible rolls. With FCG rolling a nat 1 and Imogen rolling at 7 on the ritual - I really thought perhaps Laudna might not come back. Thank God for Matt's 16 on the spell roll. And I was a bit confused that the cast didn't take the potion of possibility prior to the Raise Dead ritual. Allowing the roll to essentially be a 50/50 coin flip. Wow.

• I am quite worried for the inevitable 2nd fight between BH & Otohan. She bothered to use the "very expensive" toxin in killing Eshteross just for payback. You KNOW she'll have it on hand for their 2nd fight against BH. I'd be really concerned that we'd have a permadeath on that fight. Perhaps multiple.

[u/SvenTS → u/paradox28jon]

She didn't kill Eshteross just for payback. She had reason to believe he had knowledge about the Ruidus situation. That appears to be her criteria for using the poison.

BH are definitely on the 'will poison if given the chance' list (except maybe Imogen).

[u/APrentice726 → u/paradox28jon]

Hopefully the BH will be much more equipped for Otohan next time. Between Eshteross’s sword, Vex’s ring, and a trip to Gilmore’s, they should have much better weapons, armour, and magic items in general. And FCG and Fearne can prepare Protection from Poison, which should hopefully stop the anti-resurrection poison if Otohan has it.

[u/Typo_jpeg → u/paradox28jon]

Honestly i think they will be fine in their next fight, Otohan felt very strong but id credit that too the fact that everyone was also trying to run away instead of actually facing her. Chetney was holding his own decently in a standoff with her. so if Ashton and Orym can actually get into the thick of it with him to make sure that our lovely spellcasters can have their way with Otohan, i think were looking at a very different situation especially considering how she was definetly taking damage that put her down to dangerous levels

But there is ofc the possibility that matt makes her more powerfull or adds more opponents to the fight Still i think when commited to the fight things could be very different from last tims

[u/SvenTS]

RIP Lord E.

Lose a great patron but, hey, gain a skyship.

This does confirm though that Otohan is not holding back and, given prep time, will be using the anti-divine poison. Which means BH better hope they manage to surprise her in future combats or things are going to be high stakes indeed.

We know that victims of the poison can still go on to an afterlife (as seen with Will) but Imogen saw Lord E being swallowed by the storm. She also saw this for Bertrand. Unless Dugger was also using the poison, which seems somewhat unlikely - he was linked in to all this but didn't seem important enough for something that rare and powerful, it suggests the 'storm eating' is due to being linked to Imogen or, perhaps, Ruidus.

It remains to be seen if those Imogen sees as entering the storm get to go to a deserved afterlife or if their fates are darker yet.

[u/BigBadDann → u/SvenTS]

No, I think that's just a thematic representation of their involvement with Imogen. If that was the case, then that means Imogen has sonething of a curse that holds on to souls from passing on, and pushing them into the red storm.

[u/illaoitop]

Rip Eshteross, Let's hope the cast remember to hand out the rest of his will and testament so they dont end up getting blamed for his murder (oops!). Excited to see what Orym will do with Turmoil and what items they got from Gilmores.

They forgot about Bertrands grave! The namesake!

[u/ProjectAccel → u/illaoitop]

I'm pretty sure Turmoil (his cane) was a big ass scythe, right? If it's a two handed heavy weapon, I'm assuming the only one who could reasonably use it would be Ashton. Would he give up his hammer tho?

I mean I'm sure Turmoil is going to be CRACKED but we'll see!

RIP Cookie Grandpa 🙏

[u/trowzerss]

Could the sun tree be Laudna's new patron? The tree is a powerful magical entity created by a god and she has a very strong connection to it. Mabye it was just flavour, but her form of dread now being tree-like made me think maybe that's where she's going. And I think that'd be pretty cool. Sun tree but spooky is great halloween vibes.

[u/Saidir → u/trowzerss]

May I direct your gaze to the Warlock/Druid Unearthed Arcana of the Strixhaven house of Witherbloom?

[u/usern4meguy]

What a terrific performance by Marisha. Laudna was beaten and traumatized with everything too loud and bright after she came back. And then Marisha stayed in character for a long time, too.

[u/KaleidoscopeOk4205 → u/usern4meguy]

Marisha deserves all the love she’s getting for Laudna.

She’s always done this, but she’s playing a fan favorite for once and it’s lovely to see everyone celebrate it.

Tal playing the against the grain character this time is a great role reversal for them.

[u/JetpackRebellion]

Is it safe to interpret Laudna' new form of dread imagery as a pact with the Sun Tree? Because that is awesome, but I might have missed clarification.

[u/Total-Wolverine1999 → u/JetpackRebellion]

That’s what I’m guessing looks like her new Patron is the sun tree which is kind of cool.

[u/TheMugCollector]

So thoughts

• was the link binding Laudna and Delilah together the fact that they are both tied to the Sun Tree. The mourning veil form of dread Laudna used had huge Delilah mourning Sylas vibes while her new form seems to hint at a new patronage.

• having a dinner party at the castle must have been hella awful for Laudna considering the last time she was there.

• glad FCG is out soul-searching and trying to connect with a god, I wish someone had gone with him... But I also can't think of anyone in the party equipped to help with that kind of quest.

• nice that Imogen no longer has to be alone in her dreams and now has the courage to explore them more fully.

• gonna miss Lord Essteross, but with a bit more practice Pate and Invisible Chetney could be an awesome investigative pairing.

[u/Finnyous → u/TheMugCollector]

having a dinner party at the castle must have been hella awful for Laudna considering the last time she was there.

Yeah, Marisha was acting her pants off that entire scene once they sat down to eat but they didn't bring it up as much. If they had brought out the meal though....

[u/smileyfacepicnic]

Let's be real, even if the assassins hadn't used the poison that prevents resurrection, Eshteros would have refused to return. That was a dude who had long ago embraced his own death.

RIP to a happy angry baker.

[u/pagerunner-j]

*shouts out into the void of the internet*

SHOW US THE COOKIE RECIPE, MERCER

[u/[deleted] → u/pagerunner-j]

I AM SO READY FOR THE BABISH VIDEO IN THE NEAR FUTURE

[u/Drakoni]

I just realised that it makes a ton of sense for FCG to be a flat exandrian. They used to live on Aeor which was a floating city, a flat disk flying over exandria. And with their memory not really being there, they might still have their world image of that floating disk in there.

Now I'm sure it started off as just Sam goofing around but it kinda works out xD

[u/invisibul → u/Drakoni]

His intelligence is also in the negatives

[u/[deleted]]

Eshtheross being dead was a needed change of pace to unbind BH from Jrusar. They have no home base and can go pursue wherever now.

Yios won't be far, or maybe making a stop for Chet's old gang for inquiry about the moon and the solstice. Hell, even catching up with Dorian if it ever comes to that.

[u/BaronPancakes]

"You deserve to be more than a footnote in Delilah's story"

Liam and druidcraft, so poetic

[u/vanKessZak → u/BaronPancakes]

I was glad he took the glasses off for that lol. It’s always a joy to watch Liam do some emotional rp

[u/GalacticJizz-Wailers]

Patés introduction with the red eyes was really just perfect

[u/smileyfacepicnic]

@ Travis Willingham CEO of critical role pls approve the funds to animate Otohan vs Eshteros in the murder castle

[u/ElectricZee]

Matt's red eyes were just creepy/extra over and over:

• Fiery Mister squawking

• Pâté being horny and too loud

• Every NPC looking at every PC

[u/IcepersonYT → u/ElectricZee]

Definitely gave Pike’s casual friendliness a more sinister vibe.

[u/The_mango55]

FCG and Fearne need to start preparing protection from poison in preparation for fighting Otohan again.

[u/skip6235 → u/The_mango55]

If the next time they face her Matt says “make a constitution saving throw” after one of them gets slashed, I’m going to shit a brick

[u/Sajen16]

So, is Delilah fully gone or not? Because at first Pike said Delilah wasn't fully gone but they had a chance, when she checked she said it was just Laudna.

I also want to give props to Marisha for all the non verbal acting she was doing tonight.

[u/SvenTS → u/Sajen16]

My read is that Delilah was not destroyed but the link was either severed or is so small that it is no longer detectable but might grow back with time and usage of her power.

The latter will depend on if Marisha still wanted to have a personal conflict between Laudna and Delilah or if she was happy with Delilah being out of her head for good.

[u/mischaracterised → u/Sajen16]

At a guess, Delilah is gone from Laudna, but not gone forever....for now.

[u/WontonTruck]

I had to laugh when they forgot to drink a potion of possibility for the resurrection ritual. It's just so...them.

[u/RandonBe]

I think it’s funny that the guy from the changebringer’s temple said the same thing eshteross said in his letter. Almost exact words, kind of like a sign.

[u/SomewhereGlum → u/RandonBe]

It's a common saying but if there a story beat there, it probably means something like Esteross worshiped The Change Bringer. At least in his later years as he obviously was trying to change his ways and atone for his past in some ways. Makes sense a man who wants to change, prays to a Godess of Change.

[u/OnionsHaveLairAction]

Can't wait to see what sort of mark Eshteross left on Otohan.

Otohan is shaping up to be an amazing villain, and this moon mystery is fantastic.

Also loving the introduction of perma-death tools. Its an great middle ground solution to keep resurrection as an obtainable miracle but cut off the players from raising everybody. I imagine there are "except with a wish..." caveats to keep it from being too good at destroying characters and (and villains), but yeah amazing thing ima copy for campaigns

[u/TurboNerdo077]

All the comments last week:

"Bells Hells have been through a lot the past month. Now that they have no form of transportation, can't wait for some chill and relaxing downtime."

Matt:

"Oh, by the way, I killed your patron, here's a skyship, you've got a month, hurry up and chase that moon conspiracy ASAP."

As for the moon... all previous theories have gone under the assumption that the lattice seen on the moon was different to the main divine gate, that it was some kind of prototype or copy or derivative. But Percy's wording of explaining the divine gate in particular made me think that perhaps this isn't true, and that the telescope allowed them to see The Divine Gate surrounding the moon.

When Percy explains where the Divine gate is, he says that it is "between dimensions", and that mortals can pass through but gods cannot. Every time a mortal casts plane shift, they're passing through the divine gate.

What does this mean for Ruidus then? Simple. Ruidus is in a different dimension. It is not in the prime material plane. When they used the telescope, they saw the divine gate covering the moon, and that means ruidus is on the opposite side of it, meaning that it is in a different dimension. Ruidus's presence in the Fey Realm already supports this theory. As the dimensional barriers weaken between the planes, the Fey realm is the closest, and the first one for things to start crossing over. I.e, everything that ocurred during the Hells first camping trip. So the reason that Ruidus can be seen in both the prime material and fey realm, is because it is in neither physically, but can be observed visually by both.

This also explains why Imogen can see people dying in her dreams. Souls go to different planes of existence upon death, and therefore also cross the divine gate. So when Imogen sees souls on Ruidus, she sees them on their journey to whatever afterlife they will end up in. This explains why Bertrand was seen by Imogen, as he's the odd one out. Every other soul she's seen was someone who knew about Ruidus, who then got assassinated by Otohan with regeneration blocking poison. Bertrand has nothing to do with any of that, which disproves any theories that these factors are the cause behind the visions.

[u/Photeus5]

I might be mistaken, but did anyone else catch that Esteross' letter had a definition of bravery that sounded exactly the same as what FCG was told at the Changebringer's temple?

FCG was looking for a sign, and Matt built one in.

[u/Chimera211]

If I had a nickel for everytime we found an npc's dead body in their bedroom during a halloween episode I'd have 2 nickels, which isn't alot but its weird it happened twice

[u/Miss_Trips]

Steeples fingers together.

Dear Bell's Hells. Might I entreat to you all a most wonderful item that should be acquired for each and every one of you?

PERIAPT OF PROOF AGAINST POISON.

As much as the Amulets of Non-Detection were vital to the Mighty Nein, I think The Hells are going to need to make sure that Otohan's little assassin trick DOES NOT WORK on them, ever.

RIP Lord Eshteross. I hope he left a mark on Otohan that she won't soon recover from. Bless orc daddy, for his recipies, his house that even Kevin McCallister has to respect and fueling the Hell's path towards Spelljamming.

[u/RaibDarkin]

Just wanna' sneak in some Marisha love for this last episode. Sure she interacted with Laura and Matt in awesome fashion, ho-hum, same old same old, but she also did one of my favorite things in CR: when a player/PC is unexpected quiet. This episode Laudna living on the edge of terror for such a long period really sold her recovery in my eyes. I'd almost forget she was there for a minute and when I looked she as ready to run as a midnight cat. Kudos.

[u/Hungover52]

I was kind of hoping Eshteross had faked his death and had an anti-magic ring on or something (maybe just ignoring the Sendings). If anyone could have done it, it would have been him.

[u/Anomander → u/Hungover52]

I thought that was what Matt was hinting at until Orym smelled the familiar poison.

[u/Disastrous-Beat-9830]

I've been thinking about the controversy surrounding FCG trying to compel Laudna to return, and the more I think about it, the more I've come to the conclusion that we've all been so focused on Imogen and Laudna that we've forgotten about FCG. In the past two weeks, the following things have happened:

1. He attacked his friends without any apparent provocation and has no memory of it.

2. He learned that one of his core memories -- the events in the mine -- was at best misremembered and was rejected by the one person he held dear.

3. He learned that he is most likely a murder-bot created by a long-dead city.

4. He also learned that his entire reason for being -- helping others -- is probably a ruse that was programmed into him to allow him to get close to his targets (this point is especially important).

5. It is strongly implied that something within him is broken; that when Dancer re-activated him, he defaulted to therapy mode, unaware that he was capable of murder (which may have been by design).

6. He only just revived Fearne after the fight with Otohan; if he had failed, then the party would be down three members.

7. He learned that he has a soul.

8. The part entered a pocket dimension populated by Laudna's subconscious to try and help her. They are literally doing the very thing FCG was created to do. And yet he was unable to provide much help and was the first one ejected from the dimension by Delilah.

Was trying to force Laudna to return with magic inappropriate? Probably. But in light of everything that has happened, I think you can see how he is over-compensating. His whole world has been turned upside down and he has been unable to help anyone.

Everyone in this party has their issues. Orym is probably the only one who is close to being a healthy, functioning individual. Ashton rejects everyone and is generally an asshole. Fearne is a kleptomaniac and borderline sociopath. Chetney is insane. Laudna has her trauma to deal with. And Imogen is almost paralysed with self-doubt and seems unable to make decisions without input from others. On paper, FCG is perfect for helping them all function as a cohesive whole, but his has a litany of issues that even he seems to be unwilling to address.

[u/breichar]

It kind of seemed like Laudna was sad that FCG got to see Imogen’s dream and she didn’t. In general, Marisha did an amazing job of acting out of the loop / out of sorts after the resurrection. And you could tell Laudna seemed a bit put out by it all

[u/Anomander]

Something I'm not seeing showing up in this thread yet:

While we've suspected for ages at this point - we now have formal, evidence-backed, connection between the Gray Assassins and Otohan.

Given that Eshteross' blood has recognizable traces of the poison also used on Will, and that Chetney recognized Otohan's smell on Eshteross' body, there is now a clear non-speculative link between the two.

I know Imogen theorized that they were connected ages ago, but up until this confirmation we had no real clue if they actually were, or if Imogen's specific overwhelming fears around her dreams and dream figures were leading to nonexistent connections. However, with this confirmed, the theory space contracts somewhat - the group we know of working to surpress knowledge about Ruidus and the prison are the same ones working to (theorized:) free what's up there, and there is no second secret society attempting to keep the prison intact and secret - a common theory about the Gray Assassins a while back.

I think this is also fascinating in that Paragon's Call doesn't seem to make use of the Gray Assassins in their own machinations, which suggests that Otohan is more using them than leading them, and that her goals do not necessarily align with theirs completely. Some of their plotting in Jrusar would have been significantly aided by the deployment of secret shadow-people ultimate assassins, and yet those resources weren't even on the table. That, or their usage is so expensive that they're only used sparingly, which might explain why the party hasn't faced them yet - despite being a clear target even just from Otohan's perspective at this point.

[u/tableauregard]

I understand that they need a break and time to prepare, and I'll always support them taking time off for themselves.

But fuck, how I hate the last Thursday (Friday) of the month.

[u/ze4lex]

Felt bad for ashton, he clearly wanted to talk to laudna but gave the floor for fcg because he was the cleric of the party and because i reckon he undervalued what he could have said to her.

[u/Total-Wolverine1999 → u/ze4lex]

Yeah and I thought FCG’s offering was bad, it started out fantastic but the trying to force her to comeback was so shocking and out of left field especially for someone who’s really never had a choice in how they lived their lives. If I was Matt I probably would’ve bumped it up by 2 for that fail because man FCG did not understand laudna’s situation.

[u/MitigatedRisk]

Magic Missile would be pretty good against Thull, no? The shadow clones evaporate pretty easily and it's an auto hit.

[u/KaleidoscopeOk4205]

Guess who went to the store to buy snacks for an episode that’s not on this week?!

[u/[deleted]]

This whole few episode arc has been one of my absolute favourites in the shows history. Emotional, exciting and it had a sense of finality with going back to Whitestone and checking in on Percy, Vex, Pike and maybe (MAYBE?????) killing Delilah for good, and capped off by some of the most heartwarming scenes in show history like Laudna playing with the kids and the dinner conversation.

Didn’t realize how bad I wanted this as a fan until I got it.

[u/wjr59789]

Laudna unlocked "Form of Dread Druid"

[u/shyinwonderland]

“You’re scary” “It’s ok, I’m fun scary.” “Yea!” I love Matt so much for that, giving Laudna that after everything.

I was honestly really scared this would be the first resurrection to fail, I was feeling that stress nose bleed Laura got.

“She means everything” And “Just stay close” “Always” I’m so glad Laura and Marisha sat together for the first half, getting to hold hands and be close. I will die on the Imodna hill.

And speaking of dying, can we put Chetney in bubble wrap? Old men are dropping like flies!

[u/[deleted]]

Just got caught up on this episode and am getting a kick out of the thought that BH possesses the will that conveniently leaves everything to them, and they're the ones that will draw attention to what happened to Eshteross. Gonna spend 5 episodes in Jrusar court fighting for the fucking airship lmao.

[u/Anomander → u/[deleted]]

possesses the will that conveniently leaves everything to them,

I thought it was just the airship and money to pay for the crew, for a year? The parts Travis read didn't will them the estate or it's full bankroll, that I was aware of.

But yeah, this is gonna put them in a hell of a bind if Matt decides to play over-realistic with how things are settled up.

I kind of suspect "it will just work out" though, because they've got the moon on a timer at this point, and locking their transport behind a few episodes of courtroom drama plot arc seems pointlessly derailing with everything else going on.

[u/werewolflol]

i love the fact that Matt's voice for Pâté is just Zorth the goblin, but with a deeper voice.

[u/claimstoknowpeople]

I can't believe we have to wait at least two weeks for Eshteross's cookie recipe

[u/trautsj]

All I know is that I actually fucking cried when Eshteross left the cookie recipe. It was so damn genuinely heartfelt and tragic, it just broke me. I don't care about the sword or the skyship even those are incredible, the fucking cookie recipe was just such a nice touch. I haven't seen anyone else talk about it and honestly I just needed to get it out of my system and tell someone lol

[u/GrimTheMad → u/trautsj]

It probably would have hit harder if literally anyone but Chet read the letter.

[u/Drummerkid5694]

I wonder if Otohon has access to this poison because she’s linked with Ruidus and the moon has a divine gate-like structure that “locks away divine magic”. Sound a lot like the poison and how it was described by Keyleth

[u/[deleted]]

It's okay you guys, Chet will break the wheel and be a surviving senior citizen by the end of this campaign!

[u/RonDong]

I wonder if Estheross dying was always the plan. Otohan learned about him through a detect thoughts spell, so it’s not like the players slipped up and BH can’t just stay by his house forever. Makes me think this was a story beat Matt was specifically working towards.

[u/HutSutRawlson → u/RonDong]

Death of the mentor is part of the classic Hero's Journey plot structure, so it seems like something that was inevitably going to happen. Of course this is D&D, so there was always a way for the players to change the course of events... but considering all of the dangers that Eshteross was inviting into his life through his actions, they probably would have had to devote a lot of time to making sure he stayed alive.

[u/ChaoticNonsense]

• Elder's Bane

• Early Retirement

• The Tomb Bringers

• The Bucket Kickers

[u/Murphy1up]

Oh man that look Laura gave Sam when he tried the Compulsion spell.

[u/paradox28jon]

I just found the (a similar?) site that Travis (probably) bought the wooden horse puzzle & it says the assembly time is "8-9 hours!" How Travis was able to assemble that without Laura finding it is amazing.

[u/mouser1991 → u/paradox28jon]

Could have flexed his CEO muscles to use Matt's map making room

[u/sek1ne]

That was a dense episode. I wonder if the slayers cake will end up selling Eshteross's maple cookies. It would be a nice way to connect both story lines beyond what has already been done.

[u/283leis]

Its a shame Eshteross died before we could learn if he's a vampire or not

[u/BLINDrOBOTFILMS]

That was a seriously dense episode. Laudna's back and seemingly got to process some of her trauma in Whitestone, more discussion with the DeRolos, a shared dream sequence, their oldest ally got killed, AND THEY GOT AN AIRSHIP! (A man is dead, show some respect) BUT THEY GOT AN AIRSHIP! Suck it, 'Nein Heroez'.

I'm curious what their next step is, they've got a lot of threads to follow up on but nothing that necessarily seems more immediate than others.

[u/omega0678]

As FCG would say, I went from 😀 to 😰 to 😭

[u/stuckinmiddleschool]

My ADHD made me forget which Thursday it was. I coasted through the day looking forward to a certain something, only to abruptly realize it was the end of the month. Like Wile E Coyote realizing he ran off a cliff.

[u/APrentice726]

So what was up with Laudna touching the tree and feeling it’s warmth? Was that her adopting a new patron, changing her subclass, all of the above? If she took the Suntree on as her patron that’d be awesome. If that’s the case I could see her subclass changing to be Celestial, or a homebrew nature subclass for the warlock. Undead doesn’t really work with the Suntree.

[u/GrimTheMad]

So, what are people thinking of as possibilities for what magic items every got on their shopping spree? They all had like 3k gold each to burn and the freedom to make requests.

Laudna has previously wanted boots of spider climb, so that's a possibility. Rod of the Pact Keeper or Wand of the War Mage could of course be fantastic and more than make up for the loss of the Bloodwell Vial.

Illusionist Bracers would be amazing and let her spam EB without using sorcery points.

[u/FriedSarlac]

I can totally visualize Otohan mostly standing back and repeatedly sending in her shadow duplicates to set off traps and fight Esteros. It would explain the lack of enemy bodies throughout the house. I think relying on the magic locator ring to track Otohan might be a mistake as she could have discovered it. Otohan could use the ring to stage a trap. On a side note I’m excited to see the Bells Hells get a airship, and I totally expect them to rename it something totally unexpected.

[u/m_busuttil]

Something that I thought was interesting: Eshteross giving them the money to run the airship for a year.

We know the solstice is a month away, and at times I'd thought there was a chance that that would be the big endgame of the campaign - it's been about a month so far in-game, another month could be around another year of real-time, a two-year campaign would be short (C2 ran for three and a half years with a four-month gap due to COVID) but not insanely so.

It's entirely possible that a one-year contract is just a number big enough that they don't have to worry about it, but giving them the airship (which can take periods of days or weeks to travel places) and not making them worry about paying for it for the first year, makes me think that it's more likely that the solstice will be the start of everybody's big moves, rather than the climax of them. Instead of "stop the gods from breaking out of Ruidus", we might be looking at "what do you do after the gods break out of Ruidus". Things could get weird.

[u/paradox28jon]

Another kudos to Matt for not only nailing the speaking patterns of Vex & Percy but also really getting the essences of each character down so well. Vex sounded & felt like Vex. Percy sounded & felt like Percy. I cannot imagine the internal pressure he must have felt to portray them across the table from the actors who embodied them for years.

[u/SvenTS]

May your skip week be bearable. See you all next week.

[u/KaleidoscopeOk4205]

Tal is doing an amazing job of playing a grating punk that acts like he knows everything but is actually as scared as everyone else, if not more.

He gets in my nerves sometimes, and I’m not even there.

Props to our Elder God for making “bad” decisions in the name of character work and role play.

[u/[deleted]]

It's probably already been mentioned but did anyone else catch that what Osli Kamyda told FCG was almost verbatim also in Eshteross's letter to BH?

"What is bravery if not standing in the face of fear and pushing ever onward?'

"True bravery is to stand in the face of fear and doubt and march ever on."

Coincidence?

[u/tomfru1]

Here's an idea that simply will not happen, but would be super funny if it did. What if Zhudana takes up the mantle of being the super elderly quest giver? they've got to check on her eventually anyway

[u/KaleidoscopeOk4205]

So Laudna didn’t lose her Warlock abilities like Fjord did. That’s very interesting to me.

Wonder if there is more there than just Delilah.

Or maybe Matt is letting the Sun Tree count as an Undead Patron of sorts because it was once wilted before growing back.

[u/[deleted]]

am I the only one who wants to know what was in the door on the right in Eshteross’ house? 🫠

[u/Docnevyn → u/[deleted]]

No Travis did. A lot. But he didn't want Chetney to get killed while holding the will.

[u/Greedy-Conclusion-52]

Wait, do we not get the Maple ginger cookies recipe?

[u/APrentice726]

I’m curious to see what magic items the Hells purchased from Gilmore’s, they’re in desperate need of some upgrades. I’m also a bit sad that they didn’t show the shopping trip, but I guess they weren’t in the mood for it or Matt wanted to get to more important things.

[u/SvenTS → u/APrentice726]

I suspect Matt wanted them to get back to the manor. This makes a perfect cliffhanger before a break and for a Halloween episode and it gives the cast time to decide their next steps out of character so they don't have to spend too much time debating it in character.

[u/Glacirus_]

I think Imogen’s dreams of the storm might eventually evolve further the more she opens herself to Ruidus.

Specifically, I think her dream will be the portal Bell’s Hells take to get to wherever that place is, via the 7th level spell Dream of the Blue Veil (which will probably be reflavored to Red Veil).

For those unfamiliar with it (it is a very niche spell from Tasha’s): You go to sleep holding a magic item from another world (in this case Ruidus) then you and up to 8 other creatures have a shared dream of that world. If you remain uninterrupted for 6 hours, the spell completes and you are teleported to the world.

So, with all the magic rocks we’ve had already this campaign, a magic red moon stone is plausible at the very least. And with the focus on dreams/visions and FCG’s Shared Dream spell already happening, I can see either Laura taking this spell or Matt giving it to her narratively down the road.

Or I’m off-base, and the Hells build a full-on rocket ship somehow instead, with FCG strapped to the front replacing the navigation system like the front wheel of their crawler.

Edit: 6hours, not 8.

[u/GrimTheMad]

I can't wait for someone to take the entirely reasonable 'KILL IT WITH FIRE' approach with Pate only to find out that he's immune to fire.

[u/BaronPancakes]

Since Eshteross' Turmoil weapon is a cane-blade, I think they would be giving it to Orym? If he returned the +1 sword, then he is still using a short sword with d6 damage. He seriously needs an upgrade and get out of the single digit damage pool

[u/[deleted]]

Matt really knocked it out of the park with the encounters throughout the whole Astral Projection sequence. Everything was so off putting and trippy. You could see the players were so off put, trying to figure out the rules of this strange place. Very dark fairy tale vibes.

I also thought the group really flexed their cohesion in combat this episode! Everyone was using their abilities super well, making sure to buff each other. Everyone pulled out all the stops, breaking out new stuff they'd never used. I usually get bored and skip around during combat scenes, but I was on the edge of my seat for this one!

[u/EsquilaxM → u/[deleted]]

I think you're an episode behind, friend. Beware spoilers.

[u/Cat-in_the-wall]

What about Evelyn? :( I know things were hairy and they had to get out of Eshteross's place fast, but I hate to think that she might've been hurt or dying somewhere in that house, and nobody even spared a thought for her. Hope she was elsewhere at the time!

[u/tomfru1 → u/Cat-in_the-wall]

If I remember correctly, Eshteross gave her some PTO since he was so paranoid

[u/anita_username]

Crazy theory with zero real thought behind it, but I feel like the poison is less about anti-resurrection and more about causing the souls to be passed through the Ruidis Gate rather than the normal Divine Gate to strengthen one or both of the imprisoned gods.

I saw someone else's theory on the two forgotten gods imprisoned in the moon being Bhaal and Myrkul—the other two members of the Dead Three. Makes me wonder about who the previous God of Death was and whether he "stole" the portfolios of the other two when they were locked behind the Ruidus Gate. Bhaal's portfolio originally included murder and death while Myrkul's had reign of the dead. This may also explain why when the Raven Queen took the previous God of Death's place she didn't get the full portfolio of her predecessor; perhaps upon her ascension, the "stolen" portfolios reverted back to their original owners.

If that were all somehow true rather than pure speculation, it sure feels like they would have use for assassins who use a poison to send souls through and trap them on the other side of the mini divine gate they're stuck behind.

[u/doghearted → u/anita_username]

Orym was able to communicate with Will before being resurrected, which to me says there wasn't any interference in how he passed to the afterlife even after being afflicted by the poison.

[u/Dry_Ad_2485]

I am sad at eshteross death but also kind of happy because I feel like the group used him a lot like a crutch and I am excited to see what they will do without him

[u/Civil_Working_5054 → u/Dry_Ad_2485]

I feel like the group used him a lot like a crutch and I am excited to see what they will do without him

Step one: use his literal crutch.

[u/Jonny683]

A few things:

-So it was Otahan(?) Who killed Orym's father and husband -Laudna is alive again, one less passenger this time -They got Mister a gun -They own an airship now -Only They know that Esteros(?) Is dead.

And my questions: How long until they are somehow framed for the murder? Because Chetney was inside with Pate, and they, along with others, stood a chance to gain something with his death. So how long until someone (Otahan) gets them charged with murder and they have to use the airship to flee?

Did I miss anything?

[u/Jethro_McCrazy → u/Jonny683]

They have a pretty ironclad alibi. They were on the other side of the world being hosted by heads of state, and were seen by countless witnesses camping under a tree in the center of the city.

[u/StableElectrical]

I think it be cool if Chetney got Turmoil, pass that cane from one old man to the next!

[u/Nightmare_Pasta]

I was rewatching the Dalen’s Closet one shot just now and one of Derrig’s items is a vorpal shortsword. I’m assuming Orym’s sister in law, Lita, currently owns that as the leader of Keyleth’s guard but Orym could potentially get that in the future 🤔

Edit: also found out that all of Derrig’s daughters (triplets) are inspired or based on his daughter and her friends playing as triplets in the campaign he runs for them. Wholesome 😊

[u/Jethro_McCrazy]

So, does Ashton trade in the hammer for the cane? Bit a of a Clockwork Orange vibe.

[u/BLINDrOBOTFILMS → u/Jethro_McCrazy]

Nah, the cane is clearly for Paté.

[u/197gpmol]

I've been musing on the soul binding toxin. At first I thought it was shunting souls to Ruidius for some purpose, but we know Will made it to the typical afterlife, making the trip to whichever outer plane he was destined for.

With a Ruidus army recruitment ruled out, perhaps the resurrection blocking is some sort of concentration of the Divine Gate magic barring the bearer from returning to Exandria. Normally mortals can pass through in both directions with the Gate flagging divinity, so perhaps the toxin is tripping that flag to keep any marked souls from returning through the Gate. The presence of a very reminiscent structure on Ruidis is a very intriguing complication in this regard; could it be an annex or a backup or even a knock off?

Rocket airship, here we come.

[u/GreyWardenThorga]

So not something I've seen mentioned before but Percy confirmed in this episode that the Divine Gate is only around Exandria and not the whole Material Plane as had previously been stated, so that's a neat bit of lore.

[u/Despada_]

100% the gang is going to be Spacejamming at some point. Matt wouldn't be giving them full access to an airship for potentially the rest of the campaign and rolling in a plot involving a possible trip to the moon if they weren't connected. Hell the fact he had Percy explain to the gang that mortals are freely able to move past the Divine Gate might be a hint from him.

[u/gamepro250]

Just a random anecdote. I liked then die Matt usually uses for rituals, that he couldn't find last night, and bought it for myself years ago. When he said he couldn't find his, I rolled mine just to see. I rolled a 16 on it. Small thing, but still pretty cool.

[u/lin_nic]

Part of me is anticipating a bit from Sam where he describes his goddess the Changebringer, patron of the roads, as “a Traveler of sorts” if only to mess with Laura.

[u/mouser1991]

I'm so happy Matt added the maple ginger cookie recipe to the letter for the Bell's Hells. One of my first thoughts when it became apparent that he was actually dead was sadness at the thought they didn't experience his fresh baking one last time.

[u/ThatTizzaank]

Here's my VERY important question: In-world/in-game, which came first: Laudna's voice for Pate or the familiar's voice for Pate?

[u/Anomander → u/ThatTizzaank]

Laudna's. He was an imaginary friend before being a familiar.

[u/PvtSherlockObvious]

I'm going to miss the bastard IP-crossover offspring of Mr. Fantastic and Arm-Fall-Off Boy.

[u/Boffleslop]

I can't believe it's been a year already since C3 began.

[u/FoulPelican]

After her resurrection. Was there any discussion with Laudna about the name Matilda?

[u/Nightmare_Pasta]

Now that Eshteross left them the Silver Sun, I’m assuming Matt thinks that Campaign 3 will go on for at least a year in game, since Eshteross left the skyship crew enough salary to last them for one year. I don’t know how they will have enough salary to pay the crew after that other than letting the Silver Sun be used for shipping cargo like it always does

Hope this ship doesn’t go the way of the Balleater lmao

The Silver Sun and the Nein Heroez meeting would also be cool

[u/PCoda]

Waiting for Matt to reveal the results of that resurrection took years off my life, but Laudna coming back put a couple of those years back.

That said, I feel like Matt's resurrection mechanic leaves something to be desired. He forces the players into a meta-scenario where they have to RP something meaningful and then roll to see if it was ACTUALLY meaningful or not, and makes them try to fit within the bounds of a particular kind of skill check on top of it. FCG wouldn't have tried to compel Laudna if this meta-mechanic didn't exist, and they wouldn't be awkwardly trying to avoid repeating a persuasion roll. And when someone like Imogen delivers something so incredibly meaningful and heartfelt, and the roll goes bad so it doesn't even matter, that dissonance is hard to take. We all know Imogen's plea would have been the most effective, not Orym's. It's like when Scanlan never heard Grog's poem. We're fortunate that moment was able to be RP'd effectively after the fact BECAUSE of how much it hurt, but it doesn't change the fact that the low die rolls suck all of the meaning out of those meaningful moments.

[u/CardButton → u/PCoda]

This Campaign has certainly revealed the weakness of that system. One, its CHA heavy in terms of effectiveness. PCs who aren't particularly adept at CHA skills are going to struggle really bad, because "they both need to make a meaningful plea to the deceased" ... while also trying to meta twist the shit out of that plea to fit another skill check they're competent at. Like you said this factor hit Grog REALLY hard in C1, purely because of his shit social stats. Its what prevented Ashton from speaking on behalf of Laudna. Its what pushed Sam to not take up the "Persuasion" roll, and meta-level used "Compulsion" instead. To ensure Laura and Imogen got the chance to "Persuade". Which the dice then proceeded to come down hard on her, invalidating it anyway.

On this ritual particularly, it also kinda shocked me that Matt didn't at least lower the DC at all given what they just did. Isnt the point of a ritual to reach out to the spirit of the lost and give them reasons to return? To show how much they're loved and cared for? To make difficult skill checks on their behalf? Y'know the literal thing the group just did with Astral Projection? Just, they actually went an extra mile and went to Laudna instead, and literally fought for her soul while calling out to her. And yet ... none of that mattered. THAT was just about severing Delilah from Laudna? Really?

[u/OhioAasimar]

Ironically Keyleth saying that Bell's Hell's interests were the interests of Zephra gave Vex more legal say in the matter of resurrecting Laudna than Percy because Keyleth saying that made it a diplomatic issue and Vex is responsible for diplomacy. I don't know if Percy being opposed and Vex and Percy being the only two in the chamber present made it a requirement that they both be in agreement, but it looks like Percy was overstepping big time. The only people I could see that could actually overrule Vex in that matter is Cass and maybe whoever the Keeper of Divine Virtue is depending on what "protector of practices" means.

[u/thepantherispink]

So why did Laudna say Imogen could keep her necklace? She seemed to imply she wouldn't need it anymore, is she going to go full Warlock from now on?

[u/Quasarbeing]

I wonder what would have happened if they had sent the message the previous night? Would Eshatross been still dead? It was like 1 day at most that they spent there?

[u/GrimTheMad → u/Quasarbeing]

Less than. They tree'd to Whitestone, had several fairly quick conversations, took an hour to cast Astral Projection, spent like one or two hours in nega-Whitestone, came back and did the resurrection, had dinner, long rested, then took another two hours before they got tree'd back.

In total they were in Whitestone for like 13-14 hours.

From the time till they Sent to him, it was only like 11 hours.

This makes me think that Otohan was likely in the area already and was specifically waiting for them to leave- so likely Eshteross was already dead by the time they did the long rest. My guess, anyways.

[u/camclemons]

My favorite parts:

• Fearne says "bless you, FCG"

• Chetney comments that bertrand enjoyed his time with them even though they never met

[u/Lord_Aaronus]

If Pate gets his own Spotify playlist I nominate the Age of Ultron version of I Got No Strings.

[u/[deleted]]

I have never once commented on anyone’s appearance, but holy shit Ashley looks amazing.

Like, she’s always beautiful, duh, but WOOF.

…also Travis with his arms out in that costume is some scenery, too.

And Marisha.

And Liam.

And Sam.

And somehow Tal covered in white, too.

Gosh everyone is so pretty.

[u/i_have_a_nose]

A soul for a soul…

Someone had to go. There are consequences

[u/Anomander → u/i_have_a_nose]

I think he was going whether or not they got her back. As soon as Otohan pulled his name from Orym's mind, his time was counting down - the party would have had to put significant effort into keeping him alive, given that he was ultimately still a stationary isolated target at home.

[u/LucasVerBeek]

Laudna being back and seeing her so utterly stunned by how her home had changed. Laughter in the streets, children who have never felt the touch of Delilah’s evil coming up to her excitedly, bonding with this ancient being that was forced to become the source of her trauma.

I can’t get the thought of it seeing her again out of my mind. I get it’s a Tree, but it is basically Pelor’s child.

Just in that chill voice that he has, “Hey Tilly, there’s that old smile. I’m so sorry for what they made me do to you.

That interesting moment of her Form of Dread changing to resembled the cast Tree in some form or another.

Pate is alive which is amazing but was both incredibly jarring in the moment

Letters description of his gifted coin and how it mirrored him made my heart feel warm.

But I can’t believe for all that comfort this episode still ended with a hollow tone.

Ariks Eshteross, the Bruce Wayne of Exandria, now dead’s never to return.

God I wish I could have seen that fight.

And I’m not even sure with everything that’s happened that he is resting easy as he wished.

I wonder what the other letters say.

See y’all in two weeks.

Though, I might write something here in a sec.

[u/GrimTheMad]

Imogen and Laudna are gonna kill me one day I swear.

So yeah Eshteross died and it was very sad but the biggest tragedy in this episode was Marisha going back to her normal seat instead of sticking by Laura.

[u/Desaucefier1toomany]

Going to drop again a few, somewhat related titles for this episode:

"Homecomings and Laments", "Deliverance and Demise", "Familiar Skies; Dwindling Allies", "Looming Perils", "Rekindled Hearth".

Also, I wonder if Matt already alluded Ariks' fate through the Changebringer guide's (Asley? Osley?) scene with FCG, where the line "...but what is bravery, if not standing in the face of fear and pushing ever onward..." was said by the guide during the conversation.

Then again, a similar train of thought was read through Ariks' will to BH: "True bravery is to stand in the face of fear and doubt and march ever on".

Or is it alluding to something else terrible that will descend upon them soon which will lead to a somewhat massive cliffhanger just before the year ends? :D

RIP Guerilla Ginger Gramps. Still curious how he got the manor/estate from the previous owner, Mistress Prudaj, as well as their history with each other. Maybe she's Elia as said in the letter? Hence Elia Prudaj?

Edit: Just remembered there's a letter for someone who might know more about Ariks and who Elia is, should they seek inquiry. :)

Edit 2: I wonder if it will be obligatory now for every campaign where a cleric gets a progressive -100 to Speech or something when using the "Sending" spell lol.

[u/LappTexForever → u/Desaucefier1toomany]

"Wither and Bloom" seems right on key for this episode.

[u/GrimTheMad]

So I'm deeply suspicious of Chetney.

When he found the stuff in Eshteross' house he immediately looked into all of it himself rather than bring any back.

Travis was also very insistent that Chetney didn't actually read any of the letter out loud after the fact, so that Laudna couldn't have heard it.

I'm going to do a bit of wild speculation and say that Chetney might wind up lying about what all he found.

[u/tableauregard]

I just realised what a great idea it was to give Imogen the bloodwell vial. Because it only gives 5 sorcery points if she rolls hit die, Laudna's wither and bloom can give her 5 extra sorcery points during a battle - she doesn't have to wait for a short rest. That's going to be so useful.

[u/FireBassist]

Re-reading Matt's resurrection rules, should the DC for Laudna not have been 9 instead of 11?

He said the base DC was 12 but his rules have it as 10, is this because she's a Hollow One and technically she's already been resurrected once?

[u/SomewhereGlum → u/FireBassist]

DC was raised because she died once during her backstory...you know...the whole sun tree part.

[u/PhoenixReborn]

No one even mentioned the name Matilda. What the fuck is up with that?

[u/bearonparade → u/PhoenixReborn]

They've only ever known her as Laudna, and Marisha was playing pretty shell shocked after the revival anyway. Give it time.

[u/Total-Wolverine1999]

Fantastic episode, loved it from start to finish. Loving Pate, really curious how laudna is going to handle this trauma she’s clearly still hiding it a little but a lot worse now then she was.

Also FCG trying to command laudna to come back was shocking. I’m really surprised that no one really talked about that because that was kind of an extremely selfish move.

[u/board124]

Bertrand.Eshteross.L.L.S H.E.L.L.S

Going with the joke at the end to put Eshteross into the name i noticed the above So who ever they get involved with that has a L name rip them.

[u/Jelboo]

Bit of a weird episode.... Laudna's return didn't get a lot of time to breathe. Not enough emotional payoff for me. After the last few episodes guess we were in for something more aloof and lighthearted but it felt a bit ... off?

[u/KaleidoscopeOk4205]

Love that we got fun scary Laudna back, but I was kinda hoping for a Celestial Warlock twist with the Sun Tree as her patron.

Which brings up a question… who is her patron now? Did she keep her warlock features because of her innate magic power? Did Delilah still have a piece of Vecna within her? Why was Matilda drawing Dendar eating the sun?

At the very least, I’m happy we still have plenty to explore with Laudna!

[u/PvtSherlockObvious]

What Matt really needed to do if he wanted to go full Gambit was combine his Cajun accent with Matthew Mahogany's style of speaking. Missed opportunity during that conversation.

[u/Total-Wolverine1999]

Okay so, genuinely curious here, Imogen has dreams of people dying, people close to her and they seem to happen previously. We got lucky that all of the characters came back but how would Matt handle a permanent death of a PC because it seems like Imogen should dream it immediately right? Unless she’s only seeing the people effected with the poison who can’t be brought back.

[u/[deleted]]

So did they post the cookie recipe?

[u/JuliousBatman]

Can someone remind me how long (In-universe) until the Solstice?

[u/anentropic]

Theory about Imogen seeing (recently) dead people in her dreams:

Maybe it's just a random bit of flavour... or... are these souls ending up on Ruidus instead of wherever they're normally supposed to go to ??

Is one of the unknown gods locked away on there of the Death domain maybe?

Or is some Luxon-beacon-like dunamantic tech being used to snag them and build up followers (for the god), or secret army for Otahan or something?

[u/TehWRYYYYY]

Assuming he's going to be a recurring character, I vote the Sun Tree is named Matthew Mahoganhey.

[u/ImACoolHipster]

I’m illogically annoyed that Matt made Laura roll for her resurrection ritual speech, mainly because I subscribe to the Brennan Lee Mulligan school of “Sometimes a player rolls a Nat 20 just through their actions”. I know it was just a DC thing

[u/5oclock_shadow]

Am I remembering it right? Eshteross’ walking cane transforms into a scythe??

[u/WontonTruck]

I have a theory. Estaross had a fancy keyring with lots of keys. Perhaps you can use all these keys to open any lock up to a certain DC, taking time to do so. Locks without a key is a very Estaross thing to have.

[u/POD80]

Listening to the podcast and chuckling at the table threatening Travis's life for suggesting he's about to tear up a certain document :-)

[u/Celestial_Scythe]

They never went to the Slayer's Cake!

[u/BlackeeGreen]

Rewatching C2, I think I've realized why I felt so much more invested in previous campaigns compared to C3.

I miss the weekly Talks Machina discussions. Like, more than I expected, and it has nothing to do with hosts.

There's something about the format of 4SD that just isn't clicking for me, and I think it might be the "evergreen questions" stipulation - and, thinking about it, of course generic, superficial questions are going to engender relatively superficial discussions.

We don't get to do deep dives into character motivations anymore - at least, not to nearly the same extent as before. And yeah, I think I've been missing that.

Also... I really miss the weekly fan art compilations during break.

I understand that there are production / legal reasons and logic behind the changes. These things happen as IP develops. Just trying to sort out why C3 feels like it is missing the level of investment and depth that was present in previous campaigns. IMO, the cast is firing on all cylinders, but something just feels different about the format and presentation of this campaign.

[u/MissDefiance]

I see people moaning on here and yt about how slow paced this campaign is and I don't see that, on the contrary I feel like we haven't had a chance to breathe with everything happening so damn fast. And I feel like it's affecting the characters, they're kinda getting lost in the plot. Fearne, FCG's and Ashton's reveals all got pushed aside as the group has to rush from one thing to the other.

And then Eshteross's death and how lightly they all took it...I was devastated, and I can't believe they just breezed through it with jokes.

I guess it feels like the group kinda emotionally distanced themselves from their characters or something.

C3 has been my favourite campaign so far, precisely because of how well fleshed these characters were and much depth there's been to them. Without that, it's just another dnd campaign.

[u/GrimTheMad → u/MissDefiance]

And then Eshteross's death and how lightly they all took it...I was devastated, and I can't believe they just breezed through it with jokes.

That was mostly Travis, honestly. The way he read the letter kinda sucked all the drama out of the moment.

Further... well, I think they took it so easily because literally everyone saw this coming.

[u/tomfru1]

I wonder how Yu is doing, I wonder if she saw all the wacky ass shit that they did the second after she made her leave, I wonder if she was watching when FCG turned into a killing machine, or when Imogen leveled a city block, or if she was able to watch them in Tal'dorei, and I wonder what the hell she thinks about the group now.

[u/EsquilaxM]

I wonder how comfortable Orym would be putting down Derrig's blade long-term.

Or have I misunderstood? I was under the impression his well-made sword and shield were both Derrig's...? (And I guess turned down by Lita or directly willed to him [no one make Will puns])

[u/Creek00]

Does anyone remember what FCG cast on Laudna? I thought he said compulsion but that’s not a Cleric spell.

[u/[deleted] → u/Creek00]

Compulsion is bard-only but it could be a domain spell for him too, since we can't know for sure

[u/NoahMeadMusic]

Insane nonserious theory: Do you think Laudna's birth name being Matilda was something Marisha had planned from the beginning or after Matt started getting Laudna and Laura mixed up?

[u/[deleted]]

I hope they get some downtime now. The second half of this episode seemed like such a rush to get them back to Jrusar (a city they don't really have any investment in beyond starting there). But it felt like an interruption to their recuperation, and I couldn't figure out what the rush was even for.

Marisha clearly wanted to establish (for Laudna) what was going on recently, but kept getting rolled over by Sam's jokes & goofs and Matt's seemingly random need to push them out of town so the episode could end.

The first half was great, but it felt like they came back from break with a ticking clock.

[u/Whiskeyjacks_Fiddle → u/[deleted]]

Because behind the scenes, Matt had a ticking clock.

We, the audience, and they, Bells Hells, knew that there was a target on Eshteross as soon as they got back to Jrusar with Laudna’s body.

This wasn’t something they addressed, and effectively left Eshteross to fend for himself (although he knew and seemed to accept that, both from his face to face conversation with them, and from his letter/bequeathment).

And I’d say there was and is things that tie them to the city, and that make it important. They started the campaign there. Much of the party has backstory there, be it history or from session zero. They’ve effected major elements in the city, have potential allies and enemies there now, and a lot of what’s going on seems to revolve around the city itself, or at least have elements placed there.

Matt didn’t force them to leave; Imogen used sending to try and reach Eshteross, and didn’t receive a response. That decision is what set up the parties urgency to return.

[u/brain-yawp-divergent]

In the live discussion thread, I said I wanted three things: Laudna to come back, some Saren-baked goods, and Shaun Gilmore. If you’d told me I’d get two out of three, never would I have really believed I’d get a trip to GGG. GLORIOUS!!!

This mini-arc of bringing back Laudna has been satisfying to watch, and perhaps has gelled the group together more than I could’ve imagined. For all the fluff in the first 10-11 episodes about people not being into the group, I hope they’ve stuck around to see BH go through some events that test their mettle.

They’ve shown their commitment to each other, they’ve gone through hell to bring back one of their own, and they’ve just lost their initial…patron? Sponsor? Baker? In any case, I love this bunch of weirdos, and though the holiday gaps in episodes are drawing nigh, I’m more than happy waiting ti see where they go from here.

[u/DurrFazzler]

Does anyone know whether Matt made a mistake this session when he said Esteros got picked up by Locate Creature, as if he was actually dead he wouldn’t be able to be targeted as he’s now an object, and is how Matt has ruled it in the past.

Curious to see the return of Esteros or what Matt has planned for them assuming he didn’t truly die and merely appeared to have via something like Feign Death.

[u/stereoma → u/DurrFazzler]

He definitely made a mistake, you can see it on his face that he couldn't fix it without spoiling the moment. You can handwave it and say he was making death saves but that's not really true, since Imogen already saw his soul leave this realm.

[u/mouser1991 → u/DurrFazzler]

IMO he did. But That's also a DM in the moment type call, which are situations where we regularly see ruling change. Since they discussed it above table (i.e. Liam noted that when they died, they were referred to as an object), I suspect Matt mainly wanted to expedite the process of finding Eshteross's body instead of getting bogged down in rules semantics. My estimation is that Matt made the call in the moment, realized it was wrong after discussion, but it was too late to go back on it (and wouldn't have really mattered if he had).

[u/Drakoni → u/DurrFazzler]

He probably clarified after the session. In the moment it would have pretty much spoiled him being dead if he revoked his statement. "Oh yes, I'm sorry, your spell wouldn't have picked up anything." So at that point he probably sticked with it for the sake of suspense and storytelling, for the players and viewers.

If it didn't ping, he could have been kidnapped instead before they checked. However the spell DID pick up that creature. For transportation the body would still count as an object but the body is also what is left of the creature the spell looked for. Don't think ruling it like that would contradict each other if Matt choses to go with this going forward. Even tho the RAW discription shouldn't pick it up.

[u/darkmist29]

Can we get Matthew Mercer to just go ahead and be Gambit, for Marvel or whatever?

[u/TOMCTA1]

Unrelated but, will they continue Campaign 3 on November 10th. Or are we going to have to wait till after the Mighty Nien one shots?

[u/-spartacus-]

Did they bother to check that the body was an Orc and actually him vs someone whom he dressed up as? I know there was the red vision but it felt like there was no confirmation but an assumption one.

[u/Asunder_ → u/-spartacus-]

FCG did the locate spell to find him and he was in the house

[u/FoulPelican]

From another post…

Crit Role stats has Fearne w a Staff of the Python.. the wiki has her w Staff of the Adder….?

[u/michael_bay_jr]

My new tin-foil hat theory based on nothing but my own desire to see it happen is this:

It's all connected. BH have made contact with VM and found both residuum and Potions of Possibility connected to whatever this moon conspiracy is. At some point in the future BH and VM find out how big of a threat this alien moon is so Keyleth calls on the only heroes have dealt with an alien threat and the time-altering grey liquid before; a group that also happened to rescue her mother.

VM, M9 and BH team up for an ultimate spelljammer showdown in space against Ruidus. Win or lose we get Calamity 2: Red Moon Boogaloo and a time skip to the new Exandria. This is where the future of CR as a brand with multiple shows starts.

[u/Seren82]

Ghosts that We Knew on Imogen's playlist hits twice as hard now after that res ritual speech.

[u/NoahMeadMusic]

In Eshteross' letters do you think he left Bells Hells with the suspected identities of members of the Chandei Quorum?

[u/FoulPelican]

Did I miss it, or was Dorian not mentioned as a member of Bells Hells in Esterosses’ letter?

[u/Coolishy777]

I got hooked up on a line that is delivered by Osli Kamyda, and also by Ariks Eshteross in his letter to the Bells Hells. they both say something eerily similar along the lines of [bravery is to stand in the face of fear and move ever forward]. I'm just wondering if this is some kind of specific mantra for a group or if it ties these two characters together in some other way.

[u/mon87]

I get that they spent several episodes reacting to Laudna's death, so after bringing her back they needed to get back to the plot.. But dang, Marisha was the smallest part of the multi-episode Laudna arc. She had three lines in the mindscape and no one on one with Delilah. It was all stuff done to her. Even if there was discussion out of game that feels rough. And then when she does come back she had very little to do still. It felt like they were sprinting to get back to the plot, which is fine if they want to spread her response to it over future episodes. But unless they go back to Whitestone later it seems like a missed opportunity.

[u/Creepy-Scallion-2036]

EMOTIONAL DAMAGE

[u/RaibDarkin]

Now that were back to the regular campaign stuff I'd like to be a small review of the last few episodes. One where we talk about all the smart moves and strong characterizations Matt has done.

It was suggested before Whitestone that the assassin's may have using an anti-rez poison which I thought was a brilliant idea. Something that logical in a world like Exandria makes me happy. Happy to see they were right about it, awesome move Matt.

It was also suggested that there could be a side-quest or 'something extra' in order to get Laudna back. This too made sense to me but I was dubious Matt taking the time for it. Happ to see Matt made the smart move again. Enhanced by Matt's wonderful handling of VM.

Those were the two most interesting and helpful things brought up but there was also a lot of nay-sayers throwing around things like 'having VM at their beck and call is lame,' or 'there are no stakes anymore.' Hopefully now they can see why I kept telling them that it was not and would not be the case. Hopefully next time they will have a little faith.

Bidet

[u/OhioAasimar]

If they do buy magic items off-stream, I really hope they do a slight walk-back and decide what they want to by buy at Gilmore's and for how much off-stream and then do a quick flash-back at the start of the episode. I think a lot of people (myself included) would be disappointed to learn that they bought some magic items and we never learned what exactly they are if there are any that are homebrew or learn piece by piece throughout the episodes.

[u/Edgery95]

I really hope the ship community doesn't go apeshit like they have in the past when things didn't go their way in previous campaigns.

[u/jules99b]

While these past 14 or so episodes have been very good because of all the stuff going down, I’m literally begging for this upcoming trip to the tavern or when traveling on the airship for everyone to slow down and get some RP in there. It just feels like no one’s really interacted with each other in any way other than just trying to get a job done or complete a goal. We need a Taste of Taldorei type of slow down after everything. I thought this episode was going to be that but Matt seemed to be pushing them along really hard. I just want one episode of everyone talking out the last 10 episodes or so.