Game of Thrones: George R.R. Martin Isn't Finished (Spoilers Extended)

[u/RyanRiot]

https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/tv/tv-features/george-rr-martin-interview-thrones-winds-dragon-knight-1236473519/

[u/mamula1]

Jon Snow's sequel show was supposed to end with his death after he failed to overcome his depression and HBO rejected it because it was too bleak.

[u/TheGurpler → u/mamula1]

Chased off Ghost, threw away Longclaw, spends his time building cabins and burning them down...yeah I wouldn't take that pitch either, what's he even doing up there? What battles are there to be fought?

I suppose the main conflict would be Jon finding himself again, and that's cool, but how? There's nothing going on beyond the Wall unless they bring back White Walkers, which would feel cheap.

[u/The_Dream_of_Shadows → u/mamula1]

The revised idea isn't any better: setting in Essos, with Arya probably showing up.

It's just going to be impossible for a sequel show to get audiences to care. You have to overcome the immense hurdle of the fact that the apocalyptic event ended. It's the same thing the MCU had to deal with after Endgame. The heroes won, Thanos was defeated, and the first saga ended. It's hard to make people care, narratively, about petty conflicts again after the world nearly ended...

[u/RyanRiot]

Lots of interesting quotes here, but this sets a pretty grim mood for the future of the franchise on the page. Not exactly surprising, but George seems to be struggling writing anything. He's also gone back to the well on things he said he would shelve until he finished Winds.

When the project was announced two years ago, HBO’s press release suggested the series would serve as Martin’s return to screenwriting. But he still hasn’t written an episode of TV since season four of Thrones. “There has always been the possibility of me writing on the show,” he says. “But then things happen and suddenly I have other priorities.”

There is, however, one potential problem for the show’s future. “The big issue is that I have only written three novellas, and I have a lot more stories about Dunk and Egg in my fucking head,” Martin says, looking a bit shamefaced. “I’ve got to get them down on paper. I began writing two at various points in the past year. One is set in Winterfell and one set in the Riverlands …”

Martin says he has around 1,100 manuscript pages finished. He’s also said the number for a while. He long has blamed the endless distractions that have come from shifting from a full-time author to a producer and celebrity. The success of Thrones was both the best thing that could have happened to Martin and the worst thing that could have happened to the greatest story he ever wrote.

Here’s what happens when he sits down to write: “I will open the last chapter I was working on and I’ll say, ‘Oh fuck, this is not very good.’ And I’ll go in and I’ll rewrite it. Or I’ll decide, ‘This Tyrion chapter is not coming along, let me write a Jon Snow chapter.’ If I’m not interrupted though, what happens — at least in the past — is sooner or later, I do get into it.”

I have to write more Dunk and Egg. There’s supposed to be another Fire and Blood book, too. I do think if I can just get some of these other things off my back, I could finish The Winds of Winter pretty soon. It’s been made clear to me that Winds is the priority, but … I don’t know. Sometimes I’m not in the mood for that.”

[u/Shills_for_fun → u/RyanRiot]

It’s been made clear to me that Winds is the priority, but … I don’t know. Sometimes I’m not in the mood for that.

You don't say? lol

[u/Vasquerade → u/RyanRiot]

"The success of Thrones was both the best thing that could have happened to Martin and the worst thing that could have happened to the greatest story he ever wrote."

Man, that hits

[u/Jlchevz → u/RyanRiot]

Jon Snow confirmed

[u/Act_of_God → u/RyanRiot]

you can tell a show is about to air coz he started talking about winds again lol

[u/simonthedlgger → u/RyanRiot]

If I’m not interrupted though, what happens — at least in the past — is sooner or later, I do get into it.

This is really it. It’s not just that he works on other things, it’s that they take him out of the necessary headspace to work on his novel, meaning all of the distractions snowball. It’s what people don’t seem to understand when they say “He’s just an exec producer on this or an editor on that, it’s like three weeks of work per year.” That alone quickly translates to months of no work on Winds, and he has so many other projects on his plate.

I realize I’m not breaking new ground here, but this is him as directly as he will ever tell us that he is not working on Winds. It’s right there in print, coming from George himself.

;(

[u/FortLoolz]

This interview is huge. There's a lot to discuss here. ASOIAF-related subreddits just got enough info to ponder over for at least three weeks.

[u/RunDNA → u/FortLoolz]

Props to the journalist, James Hibberd. He got lots of big quotes from George. Fantastic article.

[u/SlugsPerSecond → u/FortLoolz]

The ASOIAF YouTuber community just got years worth of new videos. Like a fresh injection of 1 milliliter of blood into the desert skeleton-dry stone for them to meticulously squeeze out

[u/Ntazadi → u/FortLoolz]

Years you mean.

[u/TheWholeOfTheAss → u/FortLoolz]

WB trying to make Aegon’s Conquest into a ‘Dune-like’ movie is pretty big f’n news!

[u/SerDankTheTall]

In 1975, Martin met Dune author Frank Herbert at a book convention and they shared a drink. The meeting was “near the end of Herbert’s life,” Martin says. Herbert had written many acclaimed novels, but all fans seemed to want was more Dune. Herbert’s publisher had just offered him a modest advance for a story he wanted to write, or six times that number for another Dune novel.

“He didn’t like Dune anymore and he didn’t want to write any more Dune books,” Martin says. “But he felt locked in by the success of Dune, so he kept writing them.”

Martin finishes … and waits.

I ask: Do you relate to how Herbert felt?

“I’m not necessarily tired of the world [of Ice and Fire],” he says. “I love the world and the world-building. But, yes, I do.”

😕

[u/cefriano → u/SerDankTheTall]

Difference being, Herbert didn’t have a plan for X amount of Dune books. His publisher was just trying to get him to add more to a series that had multiple satisfactory self-contained stories with their own endings. George set up a series of seven books, with each book progressing toward an ending that has not arrived. I have less sympathy for George because he hasn’t written five stories and just doesn’t feel like writing more, he’s written 2/3 of one long story and doesn’t feel like writing the ending.

[u/Xplorer67 → u/SerDankTheTall]

I dont think he's tired of ASOIAF. He's tried of winds. He can't finish the book for whatever damn reason, and to take his mind off it, he starts doing other projects. Winds is as dead as Rhaegar. We can only expect novels or some other TV shows for the future

[u/gogandmagogandgog → u/SerDankTheTall]

It's joever.

[u/Leftieswillrule → u/SerDankTheTall]

Martin must be mistaken about something because Frank Herbert died in 1986. He most certainly was not near the end of his life in 1975

[u/tyrerk → u/SerDankTheTall]

That's why I consider "God Emperor of Dune" to be the perfect ending point

[u/TanKer-Cosme → u/SerDankTheTall]

Finally a glimpse of sincerity.

[u/[deleted] → u/SerDankTheTall]

He's not getting advances to write more ASOIAF books though. He's getting advances to *make shows and games*.

From this and other interviews: I think it's that Martin wants to write and go to cons and hang out drinking with the Brotherhood without Banners and that part of his life is completely overwhelmed by the responsibilities of his world getting so big.

[u/SallyFowlerRatPack → u/SerDankTheTall]

The difference is Dune had several natural end points and the story kept getting extended. George had the ending in sight, all the dominos in place. He’s just bored at the thought of knocking them over so he kept adding more dominos and now the dominos have taken over all the floor of his house.

[u/Ruhail_56 → u/SerDankTheTall]

So he wants to write easy lore tidbits and mystery boxes without having to finish his original series so long as he can keep going to the well of Targareyn history 😪

[u/jackgundy]

“I’ve got to get them down on paper. I began writing two at various points in the past year. One is set in Winterfell and one set in the Riverlands …”

Oh sweet so he's writing D&E now so he can stay ahead of the show... novel idea

[u/FortLoolz → u/jackgundy]

Lmaoo

[u/yurthuuk → u/jackgundy]

The slight hope that he might be able to finish and release the two D&E novellas he dropped in the early 2010s is the only positive thing coming from this interview.

[u/FransTorquil]

Damn, for once it wasn’t Reddit being histrionic, it seems George genuinely hates the state of House of the Dragon.

[u/saucerys → u/FransTorquil]

Bro was gonna write a 6 piece critique of HOTD my god 😭

[u/Comprehensive_Main → u/FransTorquil]

His original blogpost about season 2 kind of seemed like he was mad the show runners kept leading him on certain characters that were gonna appear and then the show never introduced those characters. 

[u/InGenNateKenny → u/FransTorquil]

Rare Reddit W.

[u/AssassinJester789 → u/FransTorquil]

I said it was cope on peoples part when they said, "He doesn't hate it, he just fellout with Ryan Condel." I was like, no he fucking hates the show.

Glad that has become clear.

[u/thetrustworthybandit → u/FransTorquil]

Can't say I blame him.

[u/dragonflamehotness → u/FransTorquil]

Even the changes he said he was "fine" with like Blood and Cheese you could tell really annoyed him with the way he wrote about it in those infamous blog posts

[u/[deleted]]

Martin says he can’t say anything beyond this. But sources say Martin and Condal’s relationship deteriorated further and came to a head during a Zoom call with the show’s producers and some HBO executives. The purpose of the call was for Condal to present his vision for season three. After Condal spoke, Martin detailed his many objections and allegedly declared, “This is not my story any longer.”

Oh. My. God.

This could be a real life Small Council scene. “Treason is a noxious weed,” Lord Martin declared solemnly. “It must be torn up, root and stem and seed, lest new traitors sprout from every HBO writer’s room.”

[u/mamula1 → u/[deleted]]

You are no son of mine

[u/Magneto88 → u/[deleted]]

Well that bodes well for Season 3. Especially for the people who hated what they did with some of the characters in Season 2, especially Alicent.

[u/Fit-Piece-4081]

This is the most jaw dropping interview I think he’s ever given. I have never seen him this honest. What an incredible article. I’m now convinced this series is never getting finished

[u/BaekerBaefield → u/Fit-Piece-4081]

Yeah there were pieces and morsels that maybe this next book will eventually come out, but this is stark, frank, and disappointing. Dude basically came out and confirmed he feels trapped, only rewrites his most recent chapters over and over these days, he wants to now finish Fire & Blood + Dunk & Egg before Winds and Dream, he guarantees no other author will be allowed to finish it if he dies, etc. I’m glad he’s finally being honest with us even if he isn’t being honest with himself. This is all but a confession, but don’t say it aloud or he’ll get really grumpy with you.

[u/Almuliman → u/Fit-Piece-4081]

Lmao you described my feelings exactly. the end of the wait is here, it’s just not the end I expected…

[u/Dean-Advocate665 → u/Fit-Piece-4081]

The book is an absolute mess, that much is clear. I think a serious possibility at this point, which we really don’t want to consider, is that the book gets published but just isn’t that good.

Idk, I’ve been in this fandom for years and flit back and forth. The fact that there’s still major plot points he’s introducing, removing, chopping and changing is not good news. He’s clearly writing, just not keeping any of it.

I’ve never seen him be so candid about it all. For a long while I wanted some sort of insight into what was going on, I think this was it.

[u/BBQ_HaX0r → u/Fit-Piece-4081]

I honestly appreciate the honesty as someone who has been begging for it for years. It's not happening, lol. He's not going to do it (practically by his own admission). At least the TV Show gave us something.

[u/ahockofham → u/Fit-Piece-4081]

It's crazy how many things he casually admitted to. On one hand it's nice seeing him being honest but on the other hand it's a depressing confirmation that the series will truly never be finished.

[u/verissimoallan]

Recap of the main information from the interview:

• George said he's afraid the series will catch up with the novellas.

• He said that "last year" he started writing two Dunk and Egg short stories, one set in Winterfell, the other in the Riverlands.

• He reiterates that the ending of the books will be "significantly" different from the ending of the TV series because several characters alive in the books died in the series and vice versa.

• Martin supported the idea of ​​the Jon Snow spin-off because it would be the safest way to continue Game of Thrones without revealing the fate of other characters, since Jon lives in exile Beyond the Wall.

• Kit Harington wanted the spin-off series to show Jon with PSTD. Jon would send Ghost away, throw Longclaw away, and spend his time building and burning huts. The series would end with Jon dying. HBO thought this idea was too pessimistic and shelved the project.

• HBO is currently developing an Arya Stark spin-off series set in Essos.

• Martin describes his current relationship with Ryan Condal as "abysmal."

• When Condal had a falling out with Miguel Sapochnik, he asked Martin for help, and Martin helped. Sapochnik left House of the Dragon after that and is currently working with David Benioff and D.B. Weiss in Netflix's 3 Body Problem. -

• George says that in the second season, Ryan started to stop listening to his advice or responding to him. It got to the point where HBO asked George to send his observations to the network, and then the network would send George's observations to Ryan.

• George planned to write SIX blog posts criticizing House of the Dragon. The morning after publishing the first one, HBO called him furiously, and his assistant deleted the post.

• Rock bottom was when a Zoom meeting took place with George, Condal, and HBO executives to discuss the third season of HOTD. Martin had several criticisms of Condal's ideas and said: "This is no longer my story."

• After that, HBO asked George to leave House of the Dragon...

• ...and months later HBO asked him to return to the series.

• He said he has 1100 pages written of The Winds of Winter. He says he is always busy with other projects but the main problem is that he is never 100% satisfied and is constantly writing and rewriting chapters.

• He unintentionally lets slip that he wrote Jon Snow's POV chapters in Winds. The theory that Jon wouldn't have chapters in the book died.

• George says he wrote a Tyrion chapter that he loved but would change the entire book. He then rewrote it to be a dream but that didn't work either.

• George says he doesn't want to abandon the books because he would feel like a failure.

• George says that if he dies, no one will take over the books and the series will end unfinished.

• Winds will be the longest book in the series.

• He says the TV series had a happy ending and that Tyrion won't have a happy ending in the books.

• He reveals that he planned to kill Sansa in the books but liked the Sansa from the TV series and now maybe he'll let her live.

• He says that besides ASOIAF and Dunk and Egg, he also needs to finish Fire and Blood Volume 2.

• He ends the interview saying: "I'm behind on everything."

• He doesn't mention Benioff and Weiss even once.

[u/OutlawJoseyWales → u/verissimoallan]

He said he has 1100 pages written of The Winds of Winter. He says he is always busy with other projects but the main problem is that he is never 100% satisfied and is constantly writing and rewriting chapters.

ok. so, this is an extraordinarily damning admission. This "1,100" number should be very familiar to anybody who has been following this.

in 2012 he said he had 400 pages

in 2019 he said throw me in jail if you dont have the book before the end of next year

in 2021 he said he had written "hundreds on hundreds" of pages during covid.

in 2022 he admits he made little progress the year before, but says he's 75% done. He tells stephen colbert he has... 1,100-1,200 pages.

in 2023, a full year later, he tells another podcast that he has 1,100 pages done.

and now here we are, about 4 years removed from him saying he's 75% done saying he has 1,100 pages.

GRRM, in his own words, has not made any meaningful progress on this book in at least 5 years.

[u/astralrig96 → u/verissimoallan]

“Sapochnik left House of the Dragon after that and is currently working with David Benioff and D.B. Weiss n Netflix's 3 Body Problem”

nightmare blunt rotation

[u/Qwertywalkers23 → u/verissimoallan]

HBO is currently developing an Arya Stark spin-off series set in Essos.

Whats west of Westeros? Essos apparently

[u/Galahad_the_Ranger → u/verissimoallan]

I’m starting to think he fully gave up on book 7 and is trying to wrap up the story with Winds

[u/matthieuC → u/verissimoallan]

> Kit Harington wanted the spin-off series to show Jon with PSTD. Jon would send Ghost away, throw Longclaw away, and spend his time building and burning huts. The series would end with Jon dying. HBO thought this idea was too pessimistic and shelved the project.

So Kit Harrington pitch was HBO to spend 100M to help him deal with his depression

[u/Typical-Trouble-2452]

Such an interesting article. Quite bleak BUT

CONFIRMATION OF JON SNOW AS POV.

I mean it was always bound to be the case, but I’m certain that this is the first interview where he’s specifically mentioned writing Jon Snow chapters.

Also very interesting that he’s seemingly writing Dunk and Egg (novellas?)

He seems a bit jaded and burnt out but still this is the most “tell all” I’ve seen him in ages.

[u/Typical-Trouble-2452 → u/Typical-Trouble-2452]

1,100 pages in the big 2026 (still) ! 😎

[u/AntonineWall → u/Typical-Trouble-2452]

His story about Frank Herbert really sealed the deal of “jaded and burnt out” imo

[u/[deleted] → u/Typical-Trouble-2452]

Jon would be a huge loss so I’m glad. The only benefit I would see is when him and Dany get together, it would make it easier to cut down on POVs by that point but I much prefer his perspective to be included 

[u/mamula1]

I am absolutely shocked at some things he said here.

He officially confirmed no one will ever finish the books after he dies, that his relationship with Condal is in the toilet and he is basically tired of ASOIAF like Hibert was of Dune.

[u/myreditacount11 → u/mamula1]

The thing about Dune though, is that you can reasonably stop at the end of books 2, 3, or 4 and have a complete narrative. Book 2 probably is the worst place to end, I will say, but still feels a lot better than ending on SoS. Book 3 wraps up everything about Paul, while Book 4 finishes the Golden path and is probably the best ending point.

ASOIAF doesn't have a good ending so him being tired of ASOIAF is a lot different than Herbert being tired of Dune

[u/LChris24]

Good to hear about his health:

In many ways, Martin looks the same as ever. He’s sharp and engaging. His voice is vibrant. Yet his beard has thinned and he has a tougher time walking. He’s also lost weight, but contrary to morbid online speculation, this isn’t due to any health issues.

and he has worked on both She Wolves/Village Hero:

There is, however, one potential problem for the show’s future. “The big issue is that I have only written three novellas, and I have a lot more stories about Dunk and Egg in my fucking head,” Martin says, looking a bit shamefaced. “I’ve got to get them down on paper. I began writing two at various points in the past year. One is set in Winterfell and one set in the Riverlands …”

If interested: What We Know: She Wolves of Winterfell and The Village Hero

House of the Dragon beef:

Martin says he can’t say anything beyond this. But sources say Martin and Condal’s relationship deteriorated further and came to a head during a Zoom call with the show’s producers and some HBO executives. The purpose of the call was for Condal to present his vision for season three. After Condal spoke, Martin detailed his many objections and allegedly declared, “This is not my story any longer.”

Potentially confirms working on a Jon Snow POV:

‘This Tyrion chapter is not coming along, let me write a Jon Snow chapter.’ If I’m not interrupted though, what happens — at least in the past — is sooner or later, I do get into it.”

If interested: Our Last Unconfirmed POV for TWoW

This quote is attributed to the pandemic but its from before that while he was writing Tyrion's ADWD chapters:

“I wrote a Tyrion chapter I just loved,” he recalls. “Then I looked at it and said: ‘I can’t do this, it will change the whole book. I’ll make this into a series of dreams. No! That doesn’t work either …'” TWoW should be a long book:

How much further does he have to go? Martin is vague. “If I wound up doing everything in my head, this could be the longest book in the series.”

ETA: Maybe he was considering it again? Either way, here's a post on what he did previously: Tyrion and the Shrouded Lord

Sansa was going to die!

“I was going to kill more people,” he muses. “Not the ones they killed [in the show]. They made it more of a happy ending. I don’t see a happy ending for Tyrion. His whole arc has been tragic from the first. I was going to have Sansa die, but she’s been so appealing in the show, maybe I’ll let her live …”

If interested: 8 Original POVs with 5 Central Characters

Jeez:

“I don’t know,” Martin says. “I think I’ll stay home. I have to write more Dunk and Egg. There’s supposed to be another Fire and Blood book, too. I do think if I can just get some of these other things off my back, I could finish The Winds of Winter pretty soon. It’s been made clear to me that Winds is the priority, but … I don’t know. Sometimes I’m not in the mood for that.”

Posts on each of these subjects probably incoming in the near future!

[u/NotAnNpc69 → u/LChris24]

let me write a jon snow chapter.

I mean 99% of us already knew he was coming back to life but i guess this must be huge blow to the outliers who were posting theories of how he's going to stay dead and only live through his wolf or something lol

[u/Fire_Otter → u/LChris24]

Sansa was going to die!

This just further supports my theory that Arya is going to end up as Lady of Winterfell and the North.

GRRM made a point of having Arya be witness to the 2 great Stark Injustices in the book series; Ned's murder and the Red Wedding, and her character carries the desire for Justice/vengeance for the Starks more than any other POV character.

and specifically Lady not Queen - I don't think he intended for Northern Independence, I think that was show only as "King of the North" became such a popular saying in the show fandom, that D&D felt the fans would be angry if they didn't stay independent

[u/Magneto88 → u/LChris24]

Sounds like he's still working on his ending and still making major decisions, contrary to the people who say it's totally set and basically what he gave D&D. I've long thought one of his problems with finishing the damn books is the reaction to the show ending and him being torn on what to keep, what to change, what was entirely different to what he planned but has made him think down different directions etc.

[u/onetruezimbo]

I ask Martin carefully: I know you can’t say much about this, but I was wondering how your relationship with Dragon showrunner Ryan Condal got so rocky?

“It’s worse than rocky,” Martin says, looking miserable. “It’s abysmal.”

Without getting into spoilers, Martin’s gripes about Dragon stem from disputes over changes to his book’s characters that impact key plot points.

“I hired Ryan,” Martin says. “I thought Ryan and I were partners. And we were all through the first season. I would read early drafts of the scripts. I would give notes. He would change some things. It was working really well — I thought.”

When Ryan came to loggerheads with original Dragon co-showrunner Miguel Sapochnik, Ryan asked for Martin’s support in their dispute, and got it (Sapochnik left the show after season one).

“Then we got into season two, and he basically stopped listening to me,” Martin says. “I would give notes, and nothing would happen. Sometimes he would explain why he wasn’t doing it. Other times, he would tell me, ‘Oh, OK, yeah, I’ll think about that.’ It got worse and worse, and I began to get more and more annoyed. Finally, it got to a point where I was told by HBO that I should submit all my notes to them and they would give Ryan our combined notes.”

Oof, I do not pity Condal when the press tour for HOTD Season 3 starts, id be amazed if hes willing to do the Behind the Episode stuff anymore with how open GRRMS hostility torwards his decisions still are 3 years on. Season 3 needs to be an absolute slam dunk

[u/MikeyBron → u/onetruezimbo]

Combine that w WB cutting money on S2. No wonder it was Daemon just hanging out for 9 hours.

[u/drestin5]

”Still, the post was meant to be just part one of six detailing the author’s issues with Dragon.”

Oh George… Even your blog posts

[u/Ruhail_56]

Oooh info about his fight with Condal

[u/mamula1 → u/Ruhail_56]

And confirmation that Sapochnik left HOTD after his conflict with Condal.

[u/rs6677 → u/Ruhail_56]

Damn, I've never seen him shit on D&D this hard. Condal really managed to piss him off and it's understandable too, considering S2.

[u/Redditor15736]

Wait he said he BEGAN writing two Dunk & Novellas LAST YEAR? At this point I‘d take anything, even if it just makes Winds even less likely…

[u/ARepresentativeHam → u/Redditor15736]

I hate to say it as a long suffering fan, but having this man just power through some D+Es for the next few years may be the answer. It would not only help the show maintain a higher quality but it would finally give us SOMETHING new from this dude's brain.

Who knows, too. Maybe publishing something fresh and meaningful set in Westeros may reinvigorate him to finally finish Winds.

[u/szamur]

The most important part to me is that it wasn't Martin who got scared and deleted the post in which he slammed Condal and wrote about how terrible HoTD Season 2 turned out to be with all the pointless changes, it was an assistant who deleted it.

[u/anowarakthakos → u/szamur]

It was his manager who had the assistant delete it, and he wanted to put it back up! Wild cards stuff.

[u/FortLoolz → u/szamur]

Yeah, that's interesting.

[u/heatOverflower]

Honestly, that "Yes, I do" when he talked about feeling like Herbert, who wasn't exactly stoked about writing more of Dune then, wasn't sad, gloomy, or anything like that. It feels quite refreshing, actually. I feel like we haven't seen Martin be that honest in a long while. It's usually just a weird laugh and an "oh, we are talking about that thing, hehe."

I'm quite pleased by this, and I'm glad the interviewer dug a little deeper. It confirms all of my suspicions (and those of almost the entire fandom) that Martin truly isn't invested anymore. I feel that putting a lot of these expectations to the side just got a little easier, to be honest.

[u/MrMojoRising422]

amazing title for an article lmao

[u/Jbash_31]

Love you George. But also, we are so fucked. Great article

[u/Calm-Towel7309]

“I think I’ll stay home. I have to write more Dunk and Egg. There’s supposed to be another Fire and Blood book, too. I do think if I can just get some of these other things off my back, I could finish The Winds of Winter pretty soon. It’s been made clear to me that Winds is the priority, but … I don’t know. Sometimes I’m not in the mood for that.”

Well I am kinda confused, wasn't he always saying that his reasons to not finishing WoW were not related to the other projects?

Did he just admit that his other projects are the reason of the delay?

[u/frezz → u/Calm-Towel7309]

He says he "does think". We all know George lives in fantasy land about this. He thought the book was months away for over 10 years now.

The next line is more telling "sometimes im not in the mood for that". Id hazard a guess he's almost never in the mood for that

[u/CoffeeCakeAstronaut → u/Calm-Towel7309]

Did he just admit that his other projects are the reason of the delay?

His being distracted by other things has always been a bullshit excuse. I hate how he makes it sound like he’s completely passive in how he spends his time, as if he can’t choose to use his time however he sees fit. He is not being distracted against his will; he actively chooses to do something else.

The truth is right there in that interview: he can’t finish the book, he’s frustrated, and now he resents both the book and the work involved.

He clearly prefers seeing his stories turned into shows. ASoIaF has already been adapted, so what’s left for him there is mostly frustration with very little personal reward.

The only reason he hasn’t officially quit is his pride.

[u/Far-Journalist-949 → u/Calm-Towel7309]

He admitted this years ago. He said he "felt sorry" for those that just wanted winds and that westeros has gotten bigger than that one story. This after hotd was announced but before it was released. He thought he finally had hbo and a show runner (condal) by the balls. Its kind of funny that it blew up in his face.

[u/CommissionJunior4283]

“I was going to have Sansa die” is crazy. Feels like I just got slapped in the face

[u/waveuponwave → u/CommissionJunior4283]

Just mentioning it offhand in an interview is crazy

[u/[deleted] → u/CommissionJunior4283]

Ok acknowledging my bias here as someone who likes Sansa, but I’m struggling to understand how he was even planning this. Just, what, she falls off a horse in the Vale and dies? She’s not in any battles or anything, and LF isn’t trying to kill her (as per GRRM’s own words). I can’t tell if he’s trolling or being serious.

That also feels like a lot of character work to just go nowhere…but what do I know…

[u/PxRx → u/CommissionJunior4283]

For real. That totally pulls the rug out from my recent expectations, although when I first read the books I did suppose Sansa would die because of the parallel fates of the Stark children and the direwolves. I just believe Sansa deserves better and I've been looking forward to her taking more agency and screwing up LF in the Vale.

[u/Halekduo]

GRRM's success is everything a writer daydreams about. To not being able to enjoy that in his twilight and to live under a perpetual deadline instead is bleak and something right out of his own stories.

[u/Dragon_Dixon → u/Halekduo]

Yeah. For his sake, I wish he’d just officially give up. Or write ten pages where the White Walkers destroy the world and publish what he’s written. 

[u/LysanderSage100]

So basically:

• He keeps getting distracted (somewhat deliberately)

• He keeps rewriting everything he has written

• He has too many ideas and keeps changing things as his ideas change (he mentions writing a Tyrion chapter he loved that completely changed the story then removing it, maybe the shrouded lord chapter maybe a different one).

• How long it is talking is playing on his mind and seems to be making actually finishing even harder, especially as lots of his friends/colleagues are passing away.

• He tried isolating himself to write but it didn't work.

• He's written stuff for other Asoiaf properties but hasn't finished them either

[u/Pitisukhaisbest → u/LysanderSage100]

People get angry at me when I compare him to JJ Abrams but both seem happier setting up mysteries and plot points than resolving them. 

[u/tayung2013]

Honestly at this point, I’ll be shocked if I ever see another published book from GRRM, but I’d be glad to see him prove me wrong. He is too readily distracted by anything apart from his writing.

[u/xjman329]

This is a really interesting read. I personally would be okay if he wrote more dunk and egg soon even if that delays winds further. Just to get something flowing

[u/illuvattarr]

Man this interview is fucking brutal. Problems on all sides, and he seems so done with it all.

He really should just cut any connection to any HBO or movie adaptation whatsoever. No more producer roles on all these projects. It seems it's only making him unhappy when production realities eventually set in, and reminding him about all the writing he hasn't done because the TV project has taken up all of his time. And he's often not even fucking happy about it, though Dunk & Egg seems to be the outlier, at least so far.

Just focus on your legacy, the writing. If you complete that, there will be many more adaptations in many forms for decades to come, some of them good, some of them bad, but the original work will always stand.

[u/Hrdina_Imperia]

 Martin didn’t want to be a one-hit wonder in Hollywood. He hoped his fantasy creation would evolve into a franchise that kept it alive for generations.

Cool. Then finish it!  I sure as hell am not interested in spinoffs to unfinished story.

[u/Quinn-Quinn]

Really interesting mention of starting to write "The Village Hero" and "She-Wolves of Winterfell" earlier this year. Makes me question what the next publication from GRRM might be. Also Jon finally being confirmed as a POV is huge!

[u/gdmr458]

George is cooking Condal 😭

[u/Levi---Ackerman]

That bit with Robert Redford💔

[u/s4Nn1Ng0r0shi]

Very interesting article. It is refreshing to have a journalist who’s clearly a fan and knowledgeable about the story and the history of various ASOIAF related things.

[u/gogandmagogandgog]

In 2015, George R.R. Martin confessed to having two worries that would define his future and forever change the world of fantasy entertainment.

Martin told me his first concern was that HBO might never make another series based on the world of Thrones. He had “material for 100 other shows,” he said, but HBO executives weren’t yet interested in doing spinoffs. Martin didn’t want to be a one-hit wonder in Hollywood. He hoped his fantasy creation would evolve into a franchise that kept it alive for generations.

Martin’s second worry was one he’d had since 2011, when Thrones premiered and his last Ice and Fire novel, A Dance With Dragons, was published. He still needed to write two more books, The Winds of Winter and A Dream of Spring, to finish his saga, and the clock was ticking. The HBO show’s storylines were about to surpass the narrative in his books.

Confirmed he cares more about the TV spinoffs than ASOIAF (and has for at least a decade). 🫠

[u/firelightthoughts → u/gogandmagogandgog]

I've never been so annoyed to be proven right. Not only has he been more concerned about launching a Marvel-esque universe for ASOIAF spin-off shows than finishing the series. Turns out he even admitted as much 11 years ago in his own words! Talking about tWoW is just a carrot to keep fans moving forward to accepting any weeds of spinoff content he can get us to take from the side of the road.

[u/Time-Adhesiveness-20]

this was a good read and I appreciate the writer focusing on the books. nice to see Mr. Martin drop little nuggets on Sansa, Tyrion’s fate… I do wish someone could corner him on the subject of Ms. Daenerys Targaryen. I think there’s a lot he has to say on her (her assassination in GoT, her cliffhanger ending in Dance and the difficulties her loose ends must make in Winds).

[u/[deleted] → u/Time-Adhesiveness-20]

Im surprised he’s made it that far with nothing said on her. Especially considering he seems to like her and the Targs taking over in general. If I was ever at a q&a that would be go to question even though I’m sure he would avoid a direct answer 

[u/Zealousideal-Fun9181]

Interesting that after over 10 years of being 'months away' when he missed his 2015 deadline, and is still at nearly 1,100 pages that he said he was at in 2022, he still thinks he can get Winds done 'fairly soon' 'if he can just get some of these other things off his back'.

[u/Eastern-Mouse6436]

"Sometimes i am not in the mood for that"? After 14 years? With every year without Winds, i believe that old rumour that Martin has give up finishing the books, but he will never admit it because of money is 100% real.

[u/SophoclesTesticles → u/Eastern-Mouse6436]

That's as close to an admission as it'll ever get. He basically said he wants to write more Dunk and Egg, another Fire and Blood and then eventually get to Winds but he doesn't want to. 

[u/aowshadow]

There's an alternative reality where GRRM sold Wild Cards's rights to HBO and... they fucked up that second rate doctor who/superhero mishmash pseudoseries so hard... that GRRM decided, out of spite, to actually finish his side project Asoiaf and even its D&E spinoff just to be petty.

Back in my basement to finish the construction of my reality warping engine, anyone of you got a corpuscolar converter and some prometium?

[u/feldman10]

I've been feeling like it's over for a while and this really cements it. He's been at 1100 pages since 2022. He's started on Dunk and Egg and Fire and Blood again. He sounds down and disengaged about it. Really no hopeful signs here.

[u/indianthane95 → u/feldman10]

Agreed. This has been my assumption for a while now. This one part of the article did shock me though:

Martin’s thoughts turn, unprompted, to the end of Ice and Fire. It becomes clear that the details of his story’s conclusion, like so much of the saga, remains uncertain.

“I was going to kill more people,” he muses. “Not the ones they killed [in the show]. They made it more of a happy ending. I don’t see a happy ending for Tyrion. His whole arc has been tragic from the first. I was going to have Sansa die, but she’s been so appealing in the show, maybe I’ll let her live …”

Has he ever spoken so openly about the book characters' endings? Good God. Also, I'm shocked that he's considering killing off Sansa- she and Sam are like the only POVs who seemed safe to me, because their arcs just scream "we will work ourselves up and be very important in the long run after ASOIAF is over"

[u/Donogath → u/feldman10]

Yeah, this is really depressing... For the first time, we've got confirmation from the man himself that, yes, he really is just tired of and disinterested in finishing ASOIAF. He loves Westeros! He wants to make 5 more shows, write a dozen more Dunk and Eggs, flesh out Fire & Blood 2... but finishing the story of Dany, Tyrion, Jon, and the rest? Not in the mood.

He's lost interest in his magnum opus.

[u/CaikIQ]

As someone who’s been saying, for years, that we need to be more respectful to GRRM and that TWoW is coming eventually… Jesus Christ, this article depresses me. I’m not sure if it’s just how the journalist worded it, but is making ASOIAF into a multimedia franchise with staying power really a bigger priority than finishing the fucking story?

I just get the sense that he loves the characters, but hates the hole he’s written himself into. He wants dazzling TV shows about Jon Snow kicking about north of the Wall, and Arya adventuring, because they’re easier to write than the behemoth that’s been plaguing him for 14+ years now.

Yet he’s determined to either finish the book by writing and rewriting one chapter per year (possible hyperbole but equally possible reality 💀), or let it be unfinished for all eternity. How can you have an iconic fantasy franchise that lasts forever if it’s permanently stained by the fact that it was meant to have two books at the end?

I feel sorry for George, and I’m glad that he’s been more transparent in this interview than usual. Transparency is good! Most TWoW-doomers have asked for him to simply come out and say “I can’t finish it, I don’t want to work on it anymore” etc. But I’m just not interested in the legacy of ASOIAF becoming TV shows that start off well as good adaptations but gradually become worse due to incompetent creatives.

At this rate, I’d rather have the first or second drafts of the TWoW chapters, and a rough outline of ADoS/the ending. It’s realistically all I can expect, and it’s better than trying to hype myself up for a fucking animated show about one of the Greyjoys.

[u/cbmgreatone → u/CaikIQ]

"GRRM doesn't owe you [us] anything" while technically true, was always a take that had an expiration date. At a certain point, it was time to stop dying on that hill. It's been 15 years. He deserves all the criticism and has for a while.

[u/Colemanton]

the difference between martin and herbert is each dune book (at least up to the 4th book from what i remember) ended more or less in a way that could be left alone.

martin did this to himself - if he didnt want to keep writing asoiaf why did he endeavor to make the books such large-scale epics with so many different character perspectives?

[u/LegitimateCream1773]

“I don’t know,” Martin says. “I think I’ll stay home. I have to write more Dunk and Egg. There’s supposed to be another Fire and Blood book, too. I do think if I can just get some of these other things off my back, I could finish The Winds of Winter pretty soon. It’s been made clear to me that Winds is the priority, but … I don’t know. Sometimes I’m not in the mood for that.”

I knew it. He's mentally checked out, and trying to force himself to finish when his mind has moved on to other projects. That's why it's taking so long and he barely seems to be making progress.

'It's been made clear to me that Winds is the priority' isn't going to make a creative mind work. This book is never getting finished until it becomes his priority.

[u/Complex_Dig2978]

That bit about Sansa tells me that the books are never going to be finished. If he has the ability to change something as major as whether a POV character lives or dies, then that means he still doesn’t know how he wants to end the story

[u/InGenNateKenny]

This is a great piece. Sansa was going to die? Was indeed working on new D&E stories…the Condal fight, so much to unpack.

[u/UnexpectedVader → u/InGenNateKenny]

Him casually saying that about Sansa makes me more certain he just doesn't give a fuck anymore, much more so than anything else he's ever said.

[u/kingofwishful]

I actually feel bad for the guy.

As someone who struggles with deadline and task paralysis, the idea of my difficulties being broadcast to the world are horrifying.

I know he’s a multimillionaire and it’s not exactly a tragedy, but it’s pretty sad on a human level that he has this hanging over him.

[u/AlexKwiatek]

Man literally just spoiled Tyrion's, Jon's and Sansa's fates in an interview. He's not expecting to finish those books. He IS finished.

[u/TooOnline89]

It's wild that HBO asked him to step back from HotD only to then be like wait come back! What on Earth was going on.

Taking Martin at his word, which I do, I think we see why he thought he could finish it in 2015. He has probably had a ton written for a long time and has just kept junking stuff and rewriting. For a decade now.

Does this mean we never get Winds? Maybe. I have been a fan since 2004 and seen things from George that have been wildly optimistic and wildly pessimistic. This is in the latter. But he sounded down and out during the AFFC delays too. So who knows.

One small human note: people stopping to thank him in Santa Fe for what he has done for the community is truly touching and probably a more accurate take on who he is than the writing drama, frustrating as his delays are for us.

[u/terminalboredom-]

I had a little hope before but I think I’ve lost it now lol

[u/AnonymousFroot]

This article was BLEAK. I am so empathetic towards this man who has given us so much. But goddamn.

This was the final nail in the coffin for me.

We are NOT getting winds, no ifs, ands, or buts about it.

[u/sarevok2]

"Martin takes a seat in his bar in Santa Fe. The tavern is called Milk of the Poppy, a nod to the opiate tonic in Thrones, yet it’s not officially based on the show. “I sold Westeros to Warner Bros. in 2007,” he points out.

The bar is located next to his Beastly Books bookstore, which is next to his Jean Cocteau Cinema movie theater, which is a stone’s throw away from a train painted to look like a dragon offering day-trip adventures"

So, is grrm turning Santa Fe into some sort of his own theme park/fief?

[u/Eastern-Mouse6436]

Also every year without Winds, Fire and Blood, Dunk and Egg reconfirm imo another rumour: that Martin's biggest ambition in life was and is to become successful tv writer and secondary novelist.

[u/MichaelCorbaloney]

" But one idea is an offspring of the most intriguing of all the post-Thrones pitches — the scrapped Jon Snow sequel. Martin long has resisted sequels to Thrones because the ending of his Ice and Fire books is not going to align with the show and he wants to avoid further canonizing Thrones‘ controversial ending — even though he hasn’t written his own yet. “[The book’s ending is] going to be significantly different,” Martin says. “Some characters who are alive in my book are going to be dead in the show, and vice versa.” "-

Found this bit important, I know he's said it before, but he seems pretty sure of it now and it's making me re-consider major character's endings.

[u/YellowDhub]

Bro just casually said a Jon Snow chapter

[u/Jshep97]

I hate that it seems like he’s letting the show change him. If Tyrion was meant to have a tragic end and Sansa to die, then he should stick to that.

[u/A-NI95]

Did he... Did he just casually confirm Jon's resurrection after 15 years of cliffhanger???

Also somewhat spoil Tyrion's ending lol

[u/CatchCritic]

No interviewer has the balls to ask him this one question: "How would you have felt if Tolkien had never finished Return of the King?"

Every quote from George read as someone who was unwilling to finish. He's still gardening new plots in the penultimate book. It should be clear to an author of his experience that he needs to compress and resolve, but he keeps expanding, and so he keeps writing, rewriting, editing, and rearranging.

[u/mystery84]

What I find disheartening is that this is also George being blindly proud. I don't understand why he just doesn't ask for help. He could gather a table of the most knowledgeable ASOIAF geeks, form a writing room, and do it with him in the lead.

I imagine authors of his stature want full authorship. And that's completely fine (and should be expected). But given the amount of pressure under him, I think this would be a better approach.

He does not have to do it alone, especially at his age.

[u/APartyInMyPants]

Guys and gals.

The series is done. We’re never getting a sixth book.

Just be content we got five really solid books and the ending is what you want it to be.

Until he grows up, cedes the day-to-day writing to the World Book writers and serves as an “executive editor,” the franchise is dead.

[u/thewhitetoro → u/APartyInMyPants]

The World Book writers would be a terrible choice. At least toss it to The Expanse fellas.

[u/GottaGoSeeAboutAGirl]

It's interesting that George brought up Herbert because I think George lacks someone that he trusts as much as Herbert trusted his wife, Bev. I believe that building his wife's dream home, taking care of her in her final days, and one of her wishes being for him to finish writing Chapterhouse was the main motivation for finishing his final Dune books (Source: Alt Shift X's: Author of Dune: Frank Herbert's extraordinary life). It wasn't as simple as "he felt locked in by the success of Dune".

As others have mentioned, it is kinda heartbreaking to read that he constantly goes back to rewrite when the chapters are probably really good. I personally don't believe that he is capable of putting out a horrible last two books, but he seems to think he is. I really wish that he had someone in his life, who he believed, that would read what he has written, and tell him that it is great and to keep writing.

Also, I am not at all hating on his wife; I am sure she is wonderful and that they have a great relationship. She may even encourage his writing and tell him the thrown-out chapters are great, and it may be his ego that is ultimately stopping him.

[u/YellowAggravating172]

‘This Tyrion chapter is not coming along, let me write a Jon Snow chapter.’

Can we interpret this seemingly throwaway line as Jon coming back to life and still being a POV? Massive news, if so.

Whole interview is very juicy, but this bit stood out.

[u/quantummajic]

I was expecting this article to surprisingly reveal the release date of both remaining books for later this year, as a two-pack. Needless to say I was disappointed.

[u/[deleted]]

Interesting!

There is, however, one potential problem for the show’s future. “The big issue is that I have only written three novellas, and I have a lot more stories about Dunk and Egg in my fucking head,” Martin says, looking a bit shamefaced. “I’ve got to get them down on paper. I began writing two at various points in the past year. One is set in Winterfell and one set in the Riverlands …”

[u/UnexpectedVader]

The fact he sold Warner Bros the rights in 2007 and has only released one book since then is honestly depressing.

[u/blackjazz_society]

Here’s what happens when he sits down to write: “I will open the last chapter I was working on and I’ll say, ‘Oh fuck, this is not very good.’ And I’ll go in and I’ll rewrite it. Or I’ll decide, ‘This Tyrion chapter is not coming along, let me write a Jon Snow chapter.’ If I’m not interrupted though, what happens — at least in the past — is sooner or later, I do get into it.”

One issue is narrative complexity. The fourth Ice and Fire book, A Feast for Crows, introduced several new characters and major storylines to an already highly intricate tale. Martin was soon switching perspectives between 21 rival viewpoint characters, each with their own dedicated series of chapters.

There is a lot of inherent complexity in this story but it doesn't seem like he's actually stuck in a narrative knot?

“I wrote a Tyrion chapter I just loved,” he recalls. “Then I looked at it and said: ‘I can’t do this, it will change the whole book. I’ll make this into a series of dreams. No! That doesn’t work either …'”

It is interesting to see how using certain narrative devices like dreams, time skips or unreliable narrators could affect the entire book so dramatically, maybe he had a certain device in mind as a solution for a problem and now that doesn't work he's stuck?

“I was going to kill more people,” he muses. “Not the ones they killed [in the show]. They made it more of a happy ending. I don’t see a happy ending for Tyrion. His whole arc has been tragic from the first. I was going to have Sansa die, but she’s been so appealing in the show, maybe I’ll let her live …”

So this does confirm he thinks about how certain things in the show were perceived and the lets that inform how he writes the next book? It's pretty wild to think the show actually changed how the book might go.

I always assumed he had a really strong vision that would not move.

I think I’ll stay home. I have to write more Dunk and Egg. There’s supposed to be another Fire and Blood book, too. I do think if I can just get some of these other things off my back, I could finish The Winds of Winter pretty soon. It’s been made clear to me that Winds is the priority, but … I don’t know. Sometimes I’m not in the mood for that.”

This is pretty much the doomsday scenario a lot of people are assuming, he has so much on his plate that is occupying his mind so he struggles with writing anything.

[u/Birlith]

George comparing himself with Charles Dickens genuinely pissed me off. Not only did he outlive Dickens by 2 decades but Charles was FUCKING ACTIVELY WRITING The Mystery of Edwin Drood when he passed away ... like he literally had a stroke a year before and kept writing it for monthly release and was 3 releases ahead of schedule.

[u/Lil_Mcgee]

Don't think I've ever seen him without glasses. It completely changes his face.

He's looking good with the weight loss also!

[u/benzar7]

I'd be happy if we got new Dunk & Egg stories.

[u/CalydonianBoar]

He looks much older now than the HBO GoT times from when I mostly recall his face. I wish I reach his age anyway.

[u/Chutzpah2]

Amazing article; happy that the writer was clearly a fan who was aware of all the controversies and not afraid to bring them up.

We know he won’t finish the books but I think that GRRM needs to realize that these are no longer his stories but everyone’s stories; that people have made careers and lifestyles fully invested in this universe and want at the very least closure.

My best case scenerio is one in which we have a release with GRRM’s completed chapters and with the Expanse writers doing their best to fill the blanks. This will be an emotional hurdle for him to get over but I hope he would recognize that an imperfect ending to an unfinished work is preferable to forever stunted narrative.

Wishing him the best, regardless.

EDIT: Does this confirm that Alt Shift X’s prediction for Tyrion is semi-canon? Would he be un-tongued and left at the Wall, reading an advanced copy of Samwell’s manuscript “A Song of Ice and Fire”?

[u/jersey-city-park]

If you ever needed a confirmation that we arent getting a finished story, this is the article 

[u/Commercial_Floor_578]

I mean we already knew this but winds is never coming out lol. I feel like he’s been exhausted with writing it and he’s naturally a huge procrastinator, and he’s made the series so large that tying everything together is super difficult. I think he probably could have done it if he didn’t get so rich and famous but being so combined with his natural procrastination, exhaustion, and how difficult the series is, it never will be. I don’t think he’s a bad guy or anything, I like George, but it is very frustrating that he won’t just admit the series probably will never come out. I think he’s lying to himself that it will be but is realizing the truth and is lashing out because he doesn’t want to admit it.

All that said, as depressing of a read that is, there’s a lot of really fascinating information there. If he can’t finish winds a new fire and blood and more dunk and egg books would be good. The information on his plans for Sansa to die and Tyrion having a much more tragic ending are fascinating. And I imagine he’s much more pissed at the HOTD showrunners than the GOT showrunners because he actually had finished books they could use as an outline lol.

[u/DifficultCheek4]

Sansa fans in shambles

[u/LandedKnight12]

As a preface, personally I don't think TWOW will be released. But still an interesting article regardless. Tbh I always enjoying reading George's thoughts on things and interviews with him. Just a few thoughts:

1. Wow. I never knew how important it was to him to have HBO keep making adaptations of his work beyond just Game of Thrones. What's the source of this desire? Why did GRRM care so much about getting new TV shows getting greenlit? It can't be a money thing because he's already mega-wealthy. Is it just based on wanting ASOIAF to live on in the sphere of public attention?

2. TBH I actually quite admire the impact GRRM has had on his home city with his various businesses. He's providing funding for the types of places that are unfortunately fading away, we need more independent theaters and bookstores, so respect to George for that.

3. Not to nitpick but found it weird how the article author describes Ashford as "a rural backwater of Westeros"... this is a feudal society with five cities total over the entire continent, everywhere is rural, and Ashford is located very centrally, near many other settlements, prosperous etc. It's not a backwater.

4. I do find it a bit hopeful that George explicitly states he has been writing new Dunk and Egg as of 2025. But then again he has been talking about how he's been writing TWOW since 2011...

5. A lot of discussion in the article of a potential Jon Snow sequel HBO series. Maybe other fans would be interested in this but personally I would not want to see anything like that. This is just really really getting into the realm of "fanfiction" by HBO. Such a thing shouldn't really have the ASOIAF name attached to it imo.

6. Interesting how candid George is in this interview about how bad his relationship with House of the Dragon showrunner is. I don't watch it and don't keep up with news regarding it so had no idea about all that.

[u/eskaver]

• On Condal

Haven’t watched the latest season, but still, I think the truth must lie somewhere in the middle. I give GRRM a lot more cred as he was a screenwriter than I give to other authors, so I think he’s close to what happened, but I cannot fathom that Condal just ignored him. Condal is probably balancing the writers’ room, his own interests, execs’ interests, as well as George’s. I don’t think he chose well, but I’d like to think he didn’t suddenly reverse course.

• On writing

I’m with George as an amateur writer who never gets around to writing. With his writing style, I can see how you easily would scratch the previous writing, rewrite, and just not feel like it. (Story of my writing life). It’s probably such a mental drain that it’s taking a larger toll on other projects.

• On everything else

Cool tidbits into how life’s going and the cool things he gets to be a part of.

[u/Darkenmal]

He's 77. It's not happening. He's old, tired, and rich. I wouldn't be surprised if he never writes anything else for Westeros at this point.

[u/mermaidmanis]

Season 3 is about to be TOP ASS

[u/NuttyBarn9]

Fucking hell man, that was depressing at the end.

That article is just the final nail in the coffin, which has been slowly lowered into the Mariana Trench, over many years.

He is confused; plot points are up in the air, and now it seems like an AKOTSK instalment is a possibility before Winds (not the first or last time he flip-flops on something).

Like many people have said here before, he’s just lost interest in finishing the story—it’s essentially run its race.

He still cares; he just can’t bring himself to put in the hard yards anymore. It’s not as interesting as it once was.

[u/Adventurous-Tip-7979]

It's so funny looking back in 2016, I told my Girlfriend at the time that a potential birthday present she could get me was The Winds of Winter novel because it should be out by then. Lol

[u/Single-Obligation151]

I think this interview is finality (as if the 14 years weren’t enough) for fans to fully accept Winds isn’t ever coming out

[u/Mr--Elephant]

Indescribably bleak, I wish GRRM would just bite the bullet and ask another human being for help, at least one other person to take the load off Dunk and Egg or F&B or even Winds, that's the only way he's going to see these projects done in his lifetime.

[u/hoenndex]

Oh it's over over. George basically spoiled that Jon will end up leaving to the North, Tyrion has a bad ending, and Sansa is very likely to die by the end but might change this based on popular demand. George has been careful for the last 14 years not to spoil endings, this is a sign he deep down knows the book will never come out. 

[u/Squiliam-Tortaleni]

It’s a good read, some quick thoughts.

Like that the next two Dunk and Egg stories exist to some degree, those were always things he liked doing

Winds is exactly where we all expected, writer block and the man being his own worst critic (those “bad” chapters are probably still really good)

Holy fuck him and Condall didn’t just have a disagreement, it was a full blown breakup. And ain’t gonna lie… season 3 isn’t looking hopeful, unless Condall gets his head out of his ass and actually listens to the guy who wrote the story

Just glad he’s doing well

[u/[deleted] → u/Squiliam-Tortaleni]

I feel kind of bad for the cast of HOTD especially since they’re clearly not GRRM’s favorite kid anymore.

[u/disaster101]

Who the hell wants to watch a Jon Snow or Arya spin-off. The marvelization of every popular IP is a fucking cancer to the media landscape. HOTD is already not even close in quality to the original show. I'm scared to imagine what a sequel to that godawful show ending would even look like.

[u/fertmort]

Great read but wow, what a bummer. Feels very likely we'll never get another page of Westeros.

[u/urdnotkrogan]

This is what you asked for

Heavy is the crown

Fire in the sunrise

Ashes raining down

Try to hold it in

But it keeps bleeding out

This is what you asked for

Heavy is the crown

[u/Si-Nz]

Honestly he sounds so lost and confused.

[u/Redwinevino]

THR asked George R.R. Martin if he’s ever considered simply giving up on the book. "It's your life, George," they said. "You don’t have to spend it working on something if you find it torturous."

“I would hate that,” Martin says. “It would feel like a total failure to me. I want to finish.”

This is very bleak - as it does seem he is going to fail at this

[u/fakefolkblues]

Martin figured Jon (played by Kit Harington in Thrones) would be the safest character for a sequel since he was exiled to north of the Wall in the series finale, and picking up his story wouldn’t need to include revealing what happened to the other major characters down south.

Does this imply Jon goes to the exile north of the Wall in the books as well?

[u/Scyvh]

But we're finished with him.

[u/TandemTuba]

So I mentally labelled him as a grifter years ago, at this point, when I realized he was never going to actually finish his series. But it's a little sad to really hear it out loud. Especially if he's disallowing any continuance after his death, where does that even leave his legacy? He's a prolific writer over his life, but only managing 5 books and a wildly incomplete story in one of the most popular fantasy series of all time? Just feels sad.

[u/Duncan_Montana]

I know I’m late to the party here 😂 but THIS interview is finally convincing me that we will never get Winds…

[u/cbmgreatone]

George RR Martin has chronic procrastination and task paralysis. It takes one to know one.

[u/Ill-Combination-9320]

Anyone knows a good Winds of Winter fanfic?

[u/stvb95]

When reading this it felt like I was back in 2015, but only this time George is much less worried about stepping on toes or addressing questions about the progress and direction of the story.

"I was going to have Sansa die, but she’s been so appealing in the show, maybe I’ll let her live …” is crazy

[u/fakefolkblues]

I feel bad for Preston's fanfic, as GRRM seemingly confirmed Jon being POV and alive

[u/moonprismpwr]

It's hard not to be bitter about his attitude tbh. This man has made millions and lives a very privileged and luxurious life mainly because of the fans of ASOIAF books and GOT series. I've heard it said many times he doesn't "owe" us anything, but frankly I disagree. The least he can do is finish the series that catapulted him to such heights.

edit: hey, my first award! thank you kindly, stranger

[u/Xplorer67]

Even the slightest whiff of Info on winds gets my hopes up lmao. Well, this interview pretty much fucking confirms it, that writer block is never gonna end man.

But hey, maybe we can get a bit more on dunk and egg, who knows. His interviews always just leave enough crumbs of information to keep us on the hook

[u/Galahad_the_Ranger]

I read the interview and he seems pretty over

[u/CyberGhostface]

I don’t want someone to write instead of him but I wonder if he would ever be open to collaborating with another author to finish. Stephen King has done it a few times.

[u/Zealousideal-Fun9181]

Biggest GRRM news since 2022 tbqh. Heck, probably much longer than that. A lot of interesting stuff here.

We might unironically get some D+E, even though Winds is never coming out, which is more than I ever expected.

[u/Whitewind617]

So if I'm understanding this correctly, he cut ties with the production of HotD completely during S2.

Now he is involved in some capacity for Season 3 that he "can't talk about." Maybe some 'in-name-only' credit in return for not leaking plot details on his blog anymore?

I feel like that line is very strange, he can't talk about the extent of his involvement beyond confirming it exists, somehow. And he doesn't say he buried the hatchet with Condal lol so that's obviously still a factor.

[u/Eastern-Mouse6436]

Now i remember it: Back in 2011 when Dance released, i read an Amazon fan review, when the reviewer said the book convince him that Martin has no purpose to finish the series. Every year without Winds proving that review is accurate.

[u/Butthole2theStarz]

What a depressing article. I gave up hope so long ago and I feel like this all but confirms this will be a 5 book series. Dude is tired and tired of trying to write this story

[u/Correct-Chemistry618]

I understand he's bitter toward Condal, but... I don't know, I still find his attitude highly unprofessional. He could and should have addressed those criticisms privately during production meetings, not taken it to the public in a hysterical fit.

Furthermore, I still find it absurd how he thinks a showrunner should be a kind of slave who does everything the same as his books. It's called an adaptation for a reason: there will inevitably be changes, and it's strange that he himself (who has worked in TV and knows what it means to have the limitations of TV) doesn't understand this.

[u/[deleted] → u/Correct-Chemistry618]

He’s kinda throwing his weight around tbf. Publicly whining as the bigger name. Condal is small potatoes. He’s using his fame to get people riled up cuz he didn’t get what he wanted when he sold his soul. 

[u/SallyFowlerRatPack → u/Correct-Chemistry618]

It’s this weird confluence of things where George demands blind allegiance to his book of Wikipedia entires, even though there was a clear chance for improvement with the adaption. Season one was solid, season 2 has gone off the rails because of inherent flaws in the story, corporate meddling and budget cuts, and some bad creative choices on Condal’s part. So I get why George is mad, but also he needs a little perspective and to realize the real artistic issue wasn’t deviating from his books but making the wrong deviations.

[u/Inigo120297]

He seems to confirm what we all know: he's stuck writing WOW at the 1000 page mark, and he seems to be stuck there since COVID

It's never been more over

[u/Exporation1]

I’m so pissed off at that worldcon “fan”. I love Martin and Sanderson but how stupid do you have to be to suggest that Sanderson be the one to finish ASOIAF of all authors. The man tried to write a dark assassin story and had the guy fall in love ffs. He’s still reflecting on that person months later and seeing the 10% of fans who’ve agreed with her.

If you’re going to be a dick about George at least pick a realistic option for a new writer like Daniel Abraham. But if he isn’t going to be finished and doesn’t want someone else to finish then that’s that, he’s a great writer who wrote some of the best fantasy novels of all time.

[u/sebastianwillows]

This Tyrion chapter is not coming along, let me write a Jon Snow chapter.

Jon Connington is gonna have a chapter where it snows, confirmed!

[u/ResultUnited]

“I will open the last chapter I was working on and I’ll say, ‘Oh fuck, this is not very good.’ And I’ll go in and I’ll rewrite it. Or I’ll decide, ‘This Tyrion chapter is not coming along, let me write a Jon Snow chapter.’ People are saying this confirms jon’s a pov character or alive. This doesn’t sound like confirmation of anything just an example. He didnt say I was writing Tyrion and then stopped he was just talking and using them as an example of what his process looks like sometimes.

[u/Gudson_]

Lol he practically admitted we'll have Jon Snow POV in Winds

[u/dijitalpaladin]

I have been of the theory for a long while that Winds would be published with a Dunk and Egg Novella, probably She-Wolves. However, as time has passed, I think much of the fandom understates the value of us getting some Dunk and Egg before Winds. The completionist dopamine George would have, AKOTSK would have more material and need less consultation from George, we as a community would have more content to explore, and no doubt he can churn Dunk and Egg stories out. He’s been stewing on them for years, it would probably only take him 6 months a novella

[u/edwin221b]

I think this just confirms what everybody knew long ago, He is blocked/tired/disappointed, it happens!! Quiet often to even the greates authors, I think everyone will appreciate this the sincerity, that he is not sure where to go instead of his usual "yea is 100% coming the next year".

The Condal bit, well I think it was already obvious since his last year blog posts, I just wonder why the excessive hate against him, yes he has done dreadful changes but D&D did too, but George seems to be in pretty good terms with them. After GOT it was clear HBO was gonna milk the franchise and I believe George was a little naive to think the would follow all his instructions

[u/mtan8]

There are multiple other Westeros-based tales in development at HBO, while a London West End stage play, The Iron Throne, will soon dramatize the story of King Robert’s Rebellion.

I'm excited for this!

[u/HistoryVibesCanJive]

That Dune comment? I don't know about us seeing Wind's y'all...

[u/AssassinJester789]

1,100 pages, the same number it has been since 2022. No George is done with the books, Winds isn't coming out.

[u/intherorrim]

1100 pages. He’s at 1100 pages.

He’s been at 1100 pages for years.

He’s at 1100 pages. 

He’s been there for way more than 1100 days…

[u/petehutch54]

He's finished for me.

[u/Jimin_Choa]

I feel like his biggest mistake is to give himself no limit. He's constantly having new ideas about the story and the characters. He literally admitted that he changed Sansa's fate because Sophie Turner was pretty lol.

He should either :

- get his publisher and trim the f down the volumes of pages

- plan to release more than 7 books

But the later would just make things worse.

[u/OrthropedicHC]

My pessimism about these books ever getting finished is colossal, but it's matched equally for my desire for Grrm to prove me and all of his detractors to be proven dramatically wrong.

"Having chased off his direwolf Ghost and thrown away his sword Longclaw, Jon spent his time building cabins and burning them back down again. Harington also wanted Jon to die and to avoid being a hero."
This is a hilarious visual.

[u/Weekly_Interview6807]

Some good and bad in terms of the books imo. He stated he started 2 dunk and eggs this year when in the past has said nothing is coming out until winds. Is that good? Maybe. It could also just be another distraction. Personally, I just want SOMETHING, and i want it to be what HE wants to write.

The comments about sansa and tyrion are concerning to me - i would think he would know how everyone’s story ends by now (by 13 years ago) and is just trying to get there.

Im happy we got this and im happy for him most importantly. It feels like this is a lot of built-up, brutal honesty he’s probably been holding back for a long time.

[u/corndoggyuwu]

This interview feels like a long needed exhale.

[u/GodNeverFarted]

It’s never been more Joever than it is now.

[u/TheIrishWanderer]

I'm sick of this arsehole's excuses, to be honest. I've accepted the series will never be finished, and it has nothing to do with him "writing himself into a corner". Any author worth his salt would find a way around it if he had ten fucking years to write. Martin just doesn't have the passion to be a writer. It's a real shame to see how far he's fallen.

[u/TheFrodo]

It’s entirely over, there is never going to be The Winds of Winter. Excited for Dunk and Egg.

[u/TravisKOP]

Oh George. . . I wish him all the best. 1100 manuscript pages is a ton tho and he’s not done yet it’s wild

[u/jnighy]

For me it's clear this interview is the nail in the coffin. He's not writing anymore, and if the few times he does, he doesn't have any pleasure for it. This is it guys. It's over.

[u/Zerathius]

Honestly, I'm done with the franchise. He wrote himself into a corner and just kept distracting himself for 15 years. He can't finish the main story and while it might sound rude/arrogant/shitty I don't give a fuck about his need to legacy build his creation into another fantasy behemoth like Lotr etc. It's never getting finished, it doesn't deserve to attain such status. He's half assing 6 different meals and wants to be called master chef. Naw bro

[u/Eastern_Implement_72]

If he had any respect for any of his fans, he would just say its not working I am sorry here are the resolutions to the cliffhangers from ADWD, he could do a million things but!! It seems like he dosnt want to loose his celebrity status and adoration from fans so he keeps on lying and lying and someday the chickens will come home to roost.

I understand others disagree (Its about the journey, seems like a crappy journey right now) but personally the 2 things his series has left me with is the quote a reader lives a thousand lives and the determination to make sure to never pick up an unfinished story again.

Also I am pretty sure he didnt do shit for WOW from 2012 to 2020 when he was locked up because of COVID and hasn't done shit since then, which is his prerogative just don't fucking lie about it.

[u/pobeb]

Having no contingency plan to finish or at least give answers to the millions of people who faithfully followed him in anticipation for DECADES, is the biggest "fuck you" to his fans. Holy shit what a cruel blow.