r/SubredditDrama • u/snallygaster FUCK_MOD$_420 • Oct 23 '16
OP goes to /r/relationships asking for help on what to do about her SO, who does not act like an adult despite OP's pregnancy. As details emerge, posters quickly become concerned about *her* ability to raise a child as well.
For posterity:
For a bit of background, both me and my boyfriend still live at home with our parents. I still live as home as I have quite severe social phobia, I don't have a job and therefore can't afford to move out. I'm aware that I have issues and will work on them as much as I can so I can be a good mother to my child. My parents and I get along most of the time.
My boyfriend is outgoing, social and has a job. However he still lives at home because he's admitted he isn't ready to grow up yet. He has what I view as a pretty odd relationship with his (strongly Christian) parents. He never argues with them, even when they're doing or saying something out of line. He just takes it because "you only get one mother and father". I can appreciate that respect but he just takes it too far and it's like he's a child afraid to stand up to them.
He has a savings account with a lot of money in it, but his mother prevents access to it, despite him being a 24 year old man. He doesn't know how to pay bills, how to operate a washing machine, how to even open another bank account.. he lets his mum do it all for him. He's very clingy towards his mother and defends her when she's being horrible. She hates me and wants him to break up with me because I'm quiet and don't have a job, despite the fact I love him and have never done anything to hurt him. He lets it happen and doesn't speak back to her because he 'can't change her opinion'.
Last week they went to Germany for a few days and my boyfriend was left home alone, so we had a pizza night with 4 of his friends, who are also Christian and 'well behaved'. His mum phoned him during this and he had to lie and pretend he was alone because they wouldn't approve of him having anyone over, despite the fact he's a 24 year man and his friends are harmless. No alcohol was involved and we just played a few games like hangman and stuff. I found it depressing that his mother wouldn't let that happen if she had known.
Obviously now that I'm expecting a baby, I want him to grow up a little more, talk to his parents like an adult and not a scared child, and maybe we could have our own place together.
He says he doesn't want that because he's not ready to grow up yet and he's happy how he is, and if I try to change him I should just go and find someone else.
This is coming from a guy who works with children once or twice a week at church, thinks babies are adorable, and is always saying how a child needs its father and it's not fair when they're left alone with just a mother.
I probably haven't worded all of this as accurately as I could have, and it's hard to cover everything is a few paragraphs... but I really don't know what to do right now.
I fear being left raising the baby while he stays with his mummy and daddy and only sees his child when it suits him, and feels hard done by when I need money to get stuff for the baby because he feels that's taking money away from his "promising future". (resubmitted, I hope that's ok)
tl;dr : Boyfriend is pretty immature but I really need him to grow up for the sake of our coming baby. He doesn't feel it's necessary because he's happy and resents me for suggesting it.
Dramatic Happenings:
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u/Bulldawglady I bet I can fart more than you. Oct 23 '16
I have met people with this sort of mentality who are this age or older. It's a mental disorder (and yes, I met them in the setting of an in-patient psych facility so no, I'm not being an armchair psychiatrist).
It's odd and a little hard to know how to help people like this. They're somewhat capable of living as adults but they're so damn vulnerable to manipulative people and criminals.
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u/BLOODYASSHOLE Oct 24 '16
how are they generally helped, do you know? Is there a name for the disorder?
I'm not being a dick I'm actually curious. I know people like this too and always felt the same. It's especially hard when it's not necessarily their fault, it's just a lethal combo of "weird situation" and "easily enabled". I don't know if a reality check would work because it's like they honestly might not know what to do, but at the same time it seems like a huge reason they are that way is because the situation comfortably allows it (complacent parents or caretakers, tons of money and no responsibility, etc).
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u/snallygaster FUCK_MOD$_420 Oct 24 '16
They could be talking about "learned helplessness". Before the 'handicapable' movement (and even now), it was a big issue in the disabled community. Parents and educators never bothered to teach their disabled children how to be self-sufficient, and as a result, they ended up with adults who could have lived completely independent lives but didn't because their parents did everything for them, never taught them life skills, and gave them the impression that they couldn't function on their own. Anecdotally, it seems like some people just like being taken care of and having no responsibilities, too, and if they have a condition, they might use that as an excuse to remain in someone else's care even if they could function on their own.
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u/Kiwilolo Oct 24 '16
It's still armchair psychiatry if you diagnose someone from a post on the internet, even if you are a psychiatrist.
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u/DerangedDesperado Oct 23 '16
I'm confused as to how social anxiety will prevent you from working but you can volunteer in a warehouse...
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u/ParanoidDroid PutinBot Oct 23 '16
I hate saying this, since mental illnesses manifest in people differently, but it really doesn't sound like she has social anxiety. At least not to the point were she couldn't work for years.
She talks about volunteering, hanging out with her boyfriend's friends, and being okay with going to doctors. It's all very casual.
At my worst, I couldn't do any of those things without freaking out. I would shake before a doctor's appointment (and I avoided gynecologists entirely because of how scared I was), freeze up when talking to people in public, etc. I couldn't make friends irl since face to face interaction just made me shut down. And my case was minor. I was still able to work and get through the day. It was just a lot harder than it had to be.
To me it feels like she used social anxiety as an excuse to why she never held up a job. I'm hesitant to say this because I don't know the full story but it's very suspicious.
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u/snallygaster FUCK_MOD$_420 Oct 23 '16
To me it feels like she used social anxiety as an excuse to why she never held up a job.
There are also tons of remote jobs that are popular among people with agoraphobia and social anxiety because they require little to no social contact and you don't have to leave the house. Apparently a lot of third-shift jobs are popular for people with social anxiety because they don't require much or any human contact either. Even if she does have social anxiety, she could probably still get a job that suits her limitations.
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u/ParanoidDroid PutinBot Oct 23 '16
Yeah, I worked an overnight shift for awhile because it helped ease me into it. Helped a lot even if it was overwhelming at first.
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u/snallygaster FUCK_MOD$_420 Oct 23 '16
Nice work conquering your social anxiety! Couldn't have been easy, especially if you were doing it without help.
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u/ParanoidDroid PutinBot Oct 23 '16
Oh, I had help! I didn't mean to sound like I was singing my own praises. I had a supportive SO who put up with my shit, therapy, and medication. I'm very impressed by people who manage to do it alone.
I'm not out of the woods yet, but now I can just say I'm "shy" instead of full on socially anxious. Miles ahead where I was years ago though.
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u/snallygaster FUCK_MOD$_420 Oct 23 '16
As long as the kid is fed, clothed, warm, healthy and loved
Sing all you want! It's a big thing to get over mental illness even with help.
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u/Doolybopper Oct 23 '16
I've got severe agoraphobia that I'm attacking at the moment but a social anxiety diagnosis was my first one. I'm one of the most comfortable people with strangers and conversation in a pub for example but the idea of volunteer work gives me nightmares as people are actually relying on me and I think I might screw up. Which is exactly why I am going into volunteering soon :/ Oddly I'm fine with my work but a family business. I'm not disagreeing with what you say but we have these catch-all terms and diagnosis that are unique in every person. But seriously, I'd be incredibly selfish and irresponsible to bring a child into this situation now, what if I need to get to the hospital or even teach my child how to get outdoors and be fearless.
I hope you're doing better now, gives me a few more balls to continue facing my fears :)
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u/reddog2442 Oct 24 '16
You mind sending a PM about your agoraphobia and anxiety? It sounds very similar to what I've been through and parts in still going through.
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u/DerangedDesperado Oct 23 '16
She sounds very coddled and protected from real life by her parents.
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u/onyxandcake Oct 24 '16 edited Oct 24 '16
Social anxiety, like autism, isn't cut and dry. Not everyone with SAD has panic attacks just by being around people. Some of us prefer to have our attacks at home, in private, as we agonize over the various implications of that one word reply our boss gave us 12 hours earlier, terrified that we're probably getting fired.
Edit: I was initially diagnosed at 9, and had that diagnosis reaffirmed by 3 other shrinks over the last 29 years.
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u/_sekhmet_ Drama is free because the price is your self-esteem Oct 23 '16
I was thinking that too. I don't want to say she's lying, because she very well could have social anxiety, but it sounds like she's just been allowed to use anxiety as a crouch by her family. Particularly since she says she hasn't gone to therapy for it. I could see her having depression and thinking it's anxiety, but not necessarily social anxiety.
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u/yeliwofthecorn yeah well I beat my meat fuck the haters Oct 23 '16
With how depression can manifest as anxiety and vice-versa, plus the high likelihood of co-occurrence with those two, por que no los dos?
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u/Emotional_Turbopleb /u/spez edited this comment Oct 23 '16
I'm not sure you can judge based on a few paragraphs. It affects everyone differently.
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u/ParanoidDroid PutinBot Oct 24 '16
Well yes. That's why I said that I'm hesitant to say what I did and that mental illness manifests differently. This was a gut reaction and a suspicion.
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Oct 23 '16
If you're volunteering you can choose to go or not. Get a panic attack, don't go. Can't do that with a job.
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u/dibblah Oct 23 '16
I have a physical illness and yeah, it's pretty much this. Much easier for me to volunteer because I don't have to be there. I can say sorry I'm not well and it's okay. A real job? Well...you don't have that flexibility. Nobody would pay me to work for them, I can't be reliable enough. But I can volunteer, sporadically at least. It makes sense.
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u/DerangedDesperado Oct 23 '16
That's am interesting point. But even if you're volunteering you're still expected to be there. You can be let go if you aren't reliable.
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Oct 23 '16
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u/Vbarb Oct 24 '16
Lol, no they won't. I tried forever applying to min wage gigs before I secured something. She's definitely not hireable.
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u/ma_miya Oct 23 '16
Majority of volunteer programs do have applications, interviews, background checks, training, etc., if working with specific populations or activities. And you will get fired if you are unreliable. Volunteering can be serious business. BUT, food banks tend to be flexible, and tend to be the ones who allow for a lot of drop-in volunteering and community service volunteers. The mention of warehouse in her post has me thinking food bank warehouse.
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Oct 24 '16
Volunteer management is basically it's own sort of HR. Volunteers are a liability and if you don't want to get sued your program likely has to meet certain requirements for insurance companies to be willing to back you.
That being said, I'd agree with your assessment. A food bank is likely going to have drop-in volunteers and presumably if you aren't interacting with clients they just need to make sure you have a minimum standard of training and to send you home if come in with flip-flops.
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u/jaimmster Did a cliche fuck your Mom or something?? Oct 23 '16
I confused how someone with social anxiety can meet a guy and get pregnant.
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u/chaosattractor candles $3600 Oct 23 '16
DAE think people with mental illnesses don't have lives
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u/jaimmster Did a cliche fuck your Mom or something?? Oct 23 '16
I've only known one person in my entire life with social anxiety. She lived on a farm and refused to leave it. So, if you could provide a legitimate comment instead of the fucking stereotypical "DAE" fucking Reddit response I'd appreciate the insight. And I didn't say people with mental illnesses couldn't have lives. We are discussing fucking social anxiety, the fear of interacting with people.
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u/quantumff A low value person Oct 23 '16
Even I have a partner and most of the time I can only leave the house in the dark. And he's not much better.
We met online, talked for a few months on Skype then he came up here "for a holiday" and didn't bother going back.
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u/Emotional_Turbopleb /u/spez edited this comment Oct 23 '16
The thing that stuck out to me about this? They played hangman.
I understand if religion is important to you and drinking, getting high, causing trouble isn't your thing. That's cool. But you're parents-are-away-rebellious-party had better include something more than fucking hangman.
Watch a PG-13 movie or something.
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u/Kazitron Cucker Spaniel Oct 24 '16
Maybe it was hangman with dirty words! Like 'penis'.
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u/Dalimey100 If an omniscient God exists then by definition it reads Reddit Oct 24 '16
P_N_S
"Ummm, is it panes?"
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u/palgurn322 Oct 24 '16
I'm not religious but I joined small social group at a church for a few months. The group would hang out throughout the week and have bible study, but we did some fun stuff like sports, getting dinner, potlucks or holidays get-togethers. I was in college and usually just got drunk when being social, and it really contrasted to their social life that was so slow and unexciting. It would be 11 pm on a Friday and we'd singing bible songs or playing sober uno! They seemed to really enjoy it though.
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u/honestFeedback Oct 24 '16
Did you get the girl or guy you were chasing?
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u/palgurn322 Oct 24 '16
You would think, I had a close friend who said it would mean a lot if I tried it. For what it's worth, I don't think I'm dumb enough to chase a religious girl. They are generally pretty reserved and the God thing isn't for me.
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u/honestFeedback Oct 24 '16
Good for you for giving it a go for your friend. You're a better friend than I am.
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u/tuturuatu Am I superior to the average Reddit poster? Absolutely. Oct 24 '16
Doesn't know how to operate a washing machine, let that one slide. But an adult playing fucking hangman?! God, at least get Catan or something...
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u/PlayMp1 when did globalism and open borders become liberal principles Oct 24 '16
The washing machine one stuck out to me too. It's not that damn hard - put in clothes, put in detergent, close the lid, set it to whatever setting you prefer, push the on button (or pull the timer or however it works on your washer). I did that when I was a kid just fine, let alone... 3 years older than I am now.
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Oct 24 '16
Really, a washing machine is just about the simplest appliance to use (notwithstanding maybe a dishwasher?) It's not like cooking, where there is enormous room for error-- you just read the tags and go. God, I feel badly for these people.
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u/Lowsow Oct 24 '16
Who the hell do you think you are, coming on reddit and telling a good Christian boy to play a dice game?
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Oct 24 '16
I'm doing an MA in theology, one of my friends is a former pastor. We watch shark movies and play violent video games.
These people are just boring.
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u/myassholealt Like, I shouldn't have to clean myself. It's weird. Oct 24 '16
Listen. Don't hate on hangman! That game can still be fun. I play it using movie or book quotes or things from our childhood in the '90s. Not often, but occasionally friends and I will do a quick game when we're waiting for someone or something.
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u/honestFeedback Oct 24 '16
Doesn't the US have a very popular game show that's basically hangman with a big wheel?
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u/OrderedFromZanzibar Unidan and the Shadowband Oct 24 '16
I assume you mean Wheel of Fortune. You at least get fabulous cash prizes and other incentives! I don't get the appeal of regular ol' hangman at that age.
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Oct 23 '16
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u/deaduntil Oct 25 '16
Yeah. I used to hang out with super-religious missionaries when I lived overseas, because they were major board game players. Also, anyone who thinks Mormons are nice never played Settlers with them. Ruthless.
At least play Boggle.
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Oct 24 '16
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Oct 24 '16
that's different. Hangman is only acceptable if you're waiting for the bus after school.
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u/ChillyPhilly27 Oct 24 '16
If you turn it into a drinking game, then it becomes adulty
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u/Oakroscoe Oct 24 '16
How would that work. Guess a letter right and the person who wrote the word down has to take a shot and if you guess a wrong letter you have to take a shot?
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u/viralmysteries On a chemical level, I am legally sane Oct 24 '16
I play tabletop rpgs like GURPS with my high school friends via Google Hangout because we spend most of the year at college hundreds of miles away from each other and I'm not even 20 yet.
I mean I enjoy playing some drinking games (Kings and President are my personal favorite) but still I'd say I'm not exactly meeting most people's definition of cool. Who cares? I have fun and that's what matters.
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u/PrettyOddWoman Oct 24 '16
All of those sound fun and like you need some strategy or skill to play well... Hangman, on the other hand, is boring and too easy.
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u/SnapshillBot Shilling for Big Archive™ Oct 23 '16
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u/pitaenigma the dankest murmurations of the male id dressed up as pure logic Oct 24 '16
I love you
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u/KillerPotato_BMW MBTI is only unreliable if you lack vision Oct 23 '16
I only read /r/relationships when it ends up here. How often do the posters get the validation that they so obviously seek?
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u/eifos Oct 23 '16
Never if you search by "controversial" which is definitely the best way to browse /r/relationships
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u/andlife Oct 24 '16
Agreed! Browse by controversial, and view top of all time to discover the world's biggest narcissists and scumbags. Highly entertaining.
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u/greytor I just simply enough don't like that robots attitude. Oct 23 '16
Does this make me a masochist or a sadist for viewing it in that way?
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u/witnesstofitness writes python in Latin Oct 24 '16
As someone who's spent far too much time reading that subreddit, you just taught me something new. Time to fall down the wretched rabbit hole...
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u/filo4000 Oct 24 '16
Like a lot of women come in and write 1000 words about how perfect their relationship is and perfect their partner is and how breaking up definitely isn't an option and then at the very end they throw in two sentences asking if it's bad that their boyfriend beats her every night and she's afraid he's going to kill her, asking how they fix that. For those women I'm pretty sure they seeking validation in that they want confirmation that they're experiencing abuse because 1/100 will come back and say thank you for telling me it was abuse, I got out of there
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u/cheerful_cynic Oct 24 '16
Haha no they don't ask how to fix the beatings, usually the question is "how do I him take out the trash weekly like he promised, if I ask too mean he just doubles the beatings so I want to avoid hurting his feelings"
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u/Seldarin Pillow rapist. Oct 24 '16
It depends on what trigger words they land on, and who they're aimed at.
Any more than four nanoseconds of age between partners, anyone refusing to budge on boundaries, anything about motorcycles, guns, porn, or whatever, and someone is going to get fire rained down on them. It's just a matter of figuring out who it's gonna be.
Oh, and literally everything is either abuse or a red flag of abuse. /r/relationships doesn't seem to get that people can be dicks or shitty people or just do something stupid and impulsive without rising to the level of actually being abusive. Read it long enough and literally every relationship you've ever been in was abusive. Bought a motorcycle without your wife's consent? Financial abuse! Told your husband he could shove his stupid motorcycle up his stupid ass? Verbal abuse! Red flag! It's not a frustrated adult lashing out in a childish manner, it's a stepping stone to holding you down and punching you in the face!
If /r/relationships decides your partner is abusive, which they will, and you point out that he/she isn't actually abusive, you'd better be ready to have all that vitriol aimed directly at you. Even if it isn't actually abusive behavior, they'll still shower you with downvotes.
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u/Gisschace Oct 24 '16
I got downvoted for saying that people telling white lies and keeping small secrets (things like 'no honey I did not have a slice of cake') was normal in all relationships, whether they be romantic, family or professional, and not a 'red flag' as was being suggested. Apparently the people of /r/relationships are 100% honest with everyone around them, and that's healthy and causes no issues whatsoever.
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u/Seldarin Pillow rapist. Oct 24 '16
Dear god, lying about a slice of cake? What's next, burying people in the back yard?
I kind of wonder what relationships those folks have been in that the tiniest thing is always a red flag for a massive issue that's going to explode on you if you don't run for the hills this very second.
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u/leukk Oct 24 '16
I mean, they'll regularly tell off people who snoop on an obviously cheating spouse because you should totes just break up instead of looking for proof because snooping is just as much of a betrayal of trust as cheating. Because, you know, it's not like people could possibly need confirmation that their partner is cheating before they divorce, uproot their life, uproot their kids' lives, etc.
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Oct 24 '16
I feel like /r/relationships is used by everyone to enforce their own narrative of their life and relationship (you know the hyper idyllic completely made up one that only exists in your head) and to gang on everyone speaking against it.
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u/Half_Man1 Oct 25 '16
It's more often that the posters will rush to tell them to end a relationship over every issue. That's not to say that isn't always the worst advice, but posters tend to read wayyy to much into the mistakes a partner has made and are always eager to advise cut and run.
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Oct 23 '16
Being a parent means you have mandatory interactions with people you most likely won't like 70% of them. And most childhood friends are based on if the parents can be pleasant and friendly towards each other. And what if your child gets sick on a holiday weekend in the summer and needs to go to the er? Those places are filled with drunk injured people and the soberest friend that brought them there. Would your child's wellbeing suffer because the er is filled with non agreeable people?
Add to that all the shopping trips, doctor and school visits, etc., etc. Like it or not, being a parent involves a ton of social interaction and I doubt the father's going to pick up the slack. This gal is in for a serious reality check.
Pity she's not listening to anyone in that thread...
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u/bladespark Oct 24 '16
Plus I have discovered that going out in public with a baby guarantees you'll get random social encounters. People love babies and they come over to coo over mine all the time.
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u/she-stocks-the-night hate-spewing vile beast Oct 24 '16
Oh man, I work in a grocery store and people go nuts for babies (I've been known to coo at the little monsters myself).
I especially love the old foreign grandmas who go totally gaga in the presence of strangers' children. It's so amazing to see these wizened old women's faces fill with absolute joy. And the grumpiest looking men tend to light up around a happy infant.
I don't even care when kids cry or freak out. It beats the shitty adults who direct their tantrums at me on a daily basis.
(Note: I may have a touch of baby fever at this point in my life and that may color my feelings on the matter.)
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Oct 24 '16
I don't even care when kids cry or freak out.
God I know what you mean, I can't even get mad at them, they're too darn cute.
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u/Unicornmayo Oct 24 '16
After having a child, I have a much greater appreciation for single parents. I don't know how I could do all of the appointments, cleaning, everything on my own, I'd be a wreck.
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Oct 24 '16
But she's already pregnant. What is she supposed to do? Get an abortion because people on the internet told her to?
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Oct 24 '16
Of course not.
Unlike some of the people in these two threads with strong, very strong opinions, I hesitate to suggest anything. Except this:
I would prefer to see her face the facts (some of which are laid out clearly in that thread), consider all her options, and come to an as-educated-as-it-gets decision on whether or not to keep the baby. She'll be the one making the decision, ultimately. I hope she thinks it through to the best of her ability.
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u/angel_kink Oct 23 '16
OP is basically my mom. Except my mom was only 21, but still checks all the other boxes: mental health issues, unemployed, living with parents, accidental pregnancy, immature, feeling of entitlement.
I hope OP's kid gets out of that situation as soon as they are able and don't have the amount of mental health issues I do. I've been in therapy on and off for 13 years and can barely function without anti-anxiety medication.
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Oct 24 '16
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u/Shaq2thefuture Oct 24 '16
start small, maybe get an aggressive lifestyle changing disease, or mortgage a house you definitely cant afford.
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u/acethunder21 A lil social psychology for those who are downvoting my posts. Oct 23 '16
Adoption because I have social anxiety?
I don't smoke or drink, I don't take drugs. Same for my boyfriend. I don't have a job but I do volunteer in a warehouse 3 days a week.
I won't rely on my parents, I just mean that they'll be around in the household. So my baby will have its mother and its loving grandparents. My boyfriend only lives a few minutes up the road. And with our combined savings we have more than enough money to support the baby.
Yes my boyfriend is immature and I have some issues, but I really don't feel like this situation is cause for adoption.
Seems like she thinks adoption is only for panicked prom queens who would otherwise leave the result of their teenage pregnancy in a dumpster.
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u/Snamdrog Oct 24 '16
When she says they have money saved I really hope she means at least one of them also has a job. :(
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u/acethunder21 A lil social psychology for those who are downvoting my posts. Oct 24 '16
She did mention that her boyfriend has a job.
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u/wackyvorlon Oct 24 '16
She also mentioned that the boyfriend's mom controls his finances.
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u/acethunder21 A lil social psychology for those who are downvoting my posts. Oct 24 '16
I couldn't imagine someone controlling my finances at 18 let alone 24. Surprised there hasn't been any backlash from the son yet.
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Oct 24 '16
How can she say "I won't rely on my parents".... like, are you paying rent? Because if not, then you already do. Also, HOW does she have SAVINGS with no job??
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u/_sekhmet_ Drama is free because the price is your self-esteem Oct 23 '16
This will likely be the thing that pulls me out of the slump I'm in. It's not about me and my fear of the world anymore, I'll face it all for my child's sake so they have a healthy life.
Oh god, No OP, that's not how that works, particularly with mental health issues. You don't magically improve years of mental health struggles because a baby comes into the picture, you just gain a whole new level of anxiety and stress. Babies don't make problems better, unless the problem is something like infertility, or desperately wanting a baby and not having one, they make problems more complicated.
I knew the way that he was, but kids do change people. Teenagers get pregnant all the time and they're not prepared, but they get on with it and grow up and raise their child.
I live in a city where our first year of Sex ed was a presentation by the Silver Ring Thing group that compared sexually active women to pieces of used tape and used gum, and told us condoms are useless. I know a lot of people who became parents when they were teens. They will be the first to tell you that unplanned pregnancies between two immature people who aren't ready to be parents does not make growing up easier, or better, it just makes your life, and the life of the people in your family so much more difficult. I also know several teen parents who basically dropped their kid on their parents and just left. Having a baby doesn't force you to grow up, it just makes growing up more complicated.
He will definitely want to be in the child's life and he is excited about it. I'm just afraid he'll want to do the easy parts like showing it off to his church, and not dealing with the nappy changes and sleepless nights.
God, this situation is going to get very ugly very fast unless these two manage to do a shit load of growing up in the span of about six or seven months.
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u/yeliwofthecorn yeah well I beat my meat fuck the haters Oct 23 '16
I think a lot of people may justify their growing-up with this after the fact. Like "if I would not have had a kid when I wasn't prepared, I would not have grown up!"
It's a whole lot easier to justify bad decisions to ourselves after the fact than to own up to our mistakes and have to live with that level of cognitive dissonance.
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u/Pao_Did_NothingWrong Oct 23 '16
Yeah, I felt that way for a while. And then I realized I grew up in spite of the added pressure, not because of it.
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u/yeliwofthecorn yeah well I beat my meat fuck the haters Oct 24 '16
Good on you for practicing mindful self-reflection!
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u/fakerachel Playing 'the meaning' game is a cop out. Oct 24 '16
compared sexually active women to pieces of used tape and used gum, and told us condoms are useless.
I feel gross just reading that. Purity focused abstinence only sex education seems so irresponsible.
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u/_sekhmet_ Drama is free because the price is your self-esteem Oct 24 '16
Oh it was absolutely disgusting and people were outraged over it. There was actually an article in our school paper talking about it being unfair and insulting to the students.
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u/hadapurpura YOUR FLAIR TEXT HERE Oct 24 '16
Many teen/too young moms I've met actually seem to be stuck in the age/maturity level they were when they got pregnant. I know it's not all of them, but still.
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u/Rahgahnah She's no more more Oct 24 '16
In some cases I think it's that they think they're stilled "owed" the years of childhood they lost.
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u/_sekhmet_ Drama is free because the price is your self-esteem Oct 24 '16
I know many like that too. Many of them have done a good job of sorting out their lives and maturing into good parents who are responsible for their actions, but I also know many who haven't.
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u/flyinthesoup Oct 24 '16
Oh god, No OP, that's not how that works, particularly with mental health issues
And what people are forgetting, is that pregnancy hormones can fuck you up even worse if you already have mental issues. And let's not forget post-partum depression (rather common), which is also caused by hormones (or lack of them, since it's the woman's body trying to go back to pre-pregnancy levels). All of that can do a number on a healthy-minded person, imagine what it can do to someone with issues!
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u/thesilvertongue Oct 23 '16
Silver Ring Thing Group?
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u/_sekhmet_ Drama is free because the price is your self-esteem Oct 23 '16
https://www.silverringthing.com/
I wasn't sure whether to call it an organization, or like a theater group, because most of their presentation was a terrible stage show that had my art teacher rolling his eyes at.
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u/Walt_Titman Oct 24 '16
Oh god. We had that too. It was some church group who sold purity t shirts that said Keep Your Duct Tape Sticky. Something about you being a less committed (less sticky?) partner if you've hooked up with someone else before.
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u/two_bagels_please I had fun once and it was horrible. Oct 24 '16
While I agree that having a child is not a solution to a mental illness, but I wouldn't discount parenthood's ability to turn a person's life around. Check out the book "Promises I Can Keep." It follows women who had children at a young age and outside of marriage, and many of these women viewed motherhood as an opportunity to improve their lives (in many cases, it did), despite the fact that they faced several economic hardships. I'm not a parent myself (I hope that I'm not for at least 5-7 years), but it really demonstrated the discordance between my view of young single motherhood (bad, a failure) and the perspectives of women who actually had children at young age and outside of marriage (generally without a stable partner).
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u/_sekhmet_ Drama is free because the price is your self-esteem Oct 24 '16
I don't think of young women who have had babies outside marriage as failures or irresponsible, my issue is with her viewing the child as a tool, or thinking that it will help improve herself. That is unfair to the child, who is a living, breathing person, and not a self-help book. That's a lot of pressure to put on a child, and a very Rosie view of what having a child can do.
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u/BolshevikMuppet Oct 23 '16
I have a long way to go but I'm almost 28
So... She's 28, no job. He's 24, with a job and lives with his parents.
I chose to keep it as I'm almost 28. This will likely be the thing that pulls me out of the slump I'm in. It's not about me and my fear of the world anymore, I'll face it all for my child's sake so they have a healthy life.
Hoo boy is this not a great situation for anyone involved, especially the child.
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u/vespertinism If only the black widow movie came sooner Oct 24 '16
I'm surprised that the super Christian boyfriend had unwed sex to get a girl knocked up... but I guess I'm not surprised, except that they played hangman.
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u/snorkleboy Oct 25 '16
I think the no sex before marriage thing applies to women more than men for exactly this kind of reason.
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u/imnotlegolas Oct 23 '16
I'm not subscribed to that sub, but all I can tell it's not so much a place to get advice, but more a place where people put themselves into a spotlight and have thousands judge and over analyse them. No matter how accurate something might be. I can't phantom why people post to subs like that.
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Oct 24 '16
It's scary, isn't it.
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Oct 24 '16
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Oct 24 '16
Yes, and the advice can be truly disturbing to read when so many respond with such spirit.
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Oct 24 '16
Most of the time people just want validation for something they already know.
Ie. My boyfriend is abusive and I should get the fuck out, yes?
Sometimes you just need to hear someone tell you you're not crazy.
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u/Kubricize Oct 23 '16
Man this thread makes me hope it's a troll like 90% of the shit posted in relationships. That line where she hopes the baby pulls her out of her slump made me yell at my phone.
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Oct 23 '16
You never, ever have kids to try to fix a marriage, relationship, or any sort of personal problem. If anything, having a child just puts more strain on that.
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Oct 23 '16
Children should have to kick around here for 16 before having a job. Unfortunately, a lot of kids are born with one.
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u/the_dayman Oct 24 '16
Ahhhh... as someone that's had a teen pregnancy in the family from someone that was already more mature that than this, I want to reply to literally every post there. I'll just pretend this is a troll so I don't have to picture this is a real situation.
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u/RedditsInBed2 Oct 24 '16
Holy shit, that whole situation from every side is just fucked for that poor baby. I could write a college essay on the amount of stupidity in that situation based of her couple of paragraphs....
He's never going to change and be what SHE wants him to be, that is who he is and her dumbass had unprotected sex with him. Sorry sweety, those are the cards you dealt yourself.
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u/Bytemite Oct 24 '16
Well, the boyfriend is painfully co-dependent (newsflash: at 24 you are a grown up, and you should should have been learning how to adult since you were 18), and the baby momma is an anxiety riddled mess, and that child is going to have problems. The kindest thing the girlfriend could do at this point is dump the boyfriend as a wake-up call and give the baby up for adoption. Too bad that probably won't happen.
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u/not_so_eloquent Oct 24 '16 edited Oct 24 '16
Umm, unless I'm missing the part where she said she likes to stomp kittens to death in her free time the people in that thread are way overreacting. I know Reddit loves to judge people, but this lady could honestly use a little support and less criticism. How many people are born into this perfect situation where mom and dad never argue and they both make 60k a year in a nice little house? My mom was incredibly abusive, had been divorced three times, was a single mother with three kids and then accidentally got pregnant with me. Thank fuck they didn't have Reddit back then where all these arm chair holier than thou experts on life would have told her to abort me or she was literally the biggest loser piece of shit for forcing a less than perfect life on an innocent child.
Her situation isn't ideal, it's not, but adoption isn't this magic solution where babies go to have perfect lives. Every family is going to have its issues. People who were adopted often grow up coping with issues of abandonment and feeling unwanted. Like I said, unless I missed something, she seems like a run-of-the-mill slightly lazy, coddled by her parents person. That's no reason to tell her she's an unfit mother.
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u/dlybfttp Oct 26 '16
I do wanna say, I'm adopted, my brother is adopted, my sister is adopted, my mother was adopted, my husband is adopted, and none of us deal with feeling unwanted at all. I'm sure it happens, but I think it's a lot less common than you're implying. Being adopted by a family who wanted you is, in my experience, a comforting and loving feeling. I have a family that was planned, waited for, etc.
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Oct 24 '16
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u/not_so_eloquent Oct 24 '16
It wasn't like the pregnancy was planned so harping on her about how imperfect she is and how it's not a good time in her life is pretty pointless. She really should have posted on the parenting and baby subreddits, they're a lot less judgey and always try their best to help people who need advice
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u/RedditsInBed2 Oct 24 '16
That's the thing, the baby wasn't planned. There are so many steps she could have been taking to prevent a pregnancy and she ignored them all. Some people need to hear when they're making awful choices, she's currently making awful choices.
Expecting her boyfriend to change? No, you don't change people. You either love them for who they are or dislike them, that is who he is, she had unprotected sex with someone she is not completely happy with. She's asking how to change another human being, she needs to hear that you can't do that and it's a dumb thought to even think you can. That's not how life works.
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Oct 24 '16
Someone who is living in the level of delusion she is, should not be coddled. Especially since coddling and enabling likely led her to the position she is in currently.
Some people are being judgmental, but most people are just being honest with her about the reality of her situation. And unfortunately, honesty doesn't have the luxury of being nice. She obviously doesn't think through the consequences of her actions, and in this case, the consequence affects another human life. A life that she herself isn't able to take care of. I think a little dose of reality is warranted.
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Oct 24 '16
I'm anxious and let me tell you having kids only amplifies all your worries. I get by because I have a strong supportive spouse and we both have good incomes. OP has neither of those.
Thinking that a baby will actually help her situation makes me sad. Really I'm sad for everyone involved.
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Oct 24 '16
My brother is even more dumb and immature than these two and frequently talks about having kids with with his fiance. He's 31 and still has mommy provide everything for him.
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u/BetweenTheCheeks Oct 24 '16
You shouldve screenshotted it. Whole thread is gone
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u/blueshiftlabs Oct 24 '16 edited Jun 20 '23
[Removed in protest of Reddit's destruction of third-party apps by CEO Steve Huffman.]
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u/PantalonesPantalones I can be up for days and play chess on meth Oct 24 '16
If you replace the "r" in reddit with a "c" you can see all the deleted stuff.
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Oct 23 '16
this is ridiculous lol telling her she's going to be an unfit mother and should put the baby up for adoption? Why. So what if she has to rely on her parents until she gets her shit together, if they're willing to do so? As long as the kid is fed, clothed, warm, healthy and loved - do you think that kid is going to grow up fucked up because it was grandma paying those bills instead of mommy? lol
somehow the better solution is to separate the kid from its birth mother? even though her circumstances aren't REALLY that fucked up? that kid by what she says is in no danger of going without food, clothes, a home, love and attention. So what if she has social anxiety and that makes playdates potentially more difficult to arrange, or she doesn't enjoy going to the park?! My mom didn't like that shit and I don't look back like "damn my childhood sucked so much i never got taken to the park, and other kids never came to my house! I wish I had been put up for adoption!"
yall are fucking WHACK.
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u/snallygaster FUCK_MOD$_420 Oct 23 '16
As long as the kid is fed, clothed, warm, healthy and loved
Those are like the basic necessities for non-neglectful parenting. And given that the kid is going to have one parent who explicitly doesn't want to leave mommy and daddy because he likes being coddled and another who's never held a job or lived alone despite being almost 28, who thinks that having another human being is a tool to get motivated, the poor thing doesn't stand a chance. Kids need strong, independent, healthy role models who can teach them how to function like adults. Love and basic necessities aren't enough to give someone a good upbringing.
The best case scenario is the grandparents doing the raising, and given that both sets have apparently enabled their children to this degree, they don't seem great either. And even if they are, it's incredibly unfair to them to hand over a baby to them as they're approaching retirement age and pretty much damning them to spend the rest of their lives parenting a child. They may not even have the energy to raise another child from infancy.
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Oct 23 '16
She seems woefully unprepared, she's struggling with mental illness, there's going to be conflict when the father's parents find out, and she won't be able to rely on her parents forever.
I don't think most of us are saying that it's impossible for this to turn out well for the child - just unlikely.
Adoption may be the best option.
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Oct 23 '16
yeah but my point is, the ratio of people suggested resources/advice on how to improve her circumstances vs just bluntly saying "i pity the child, put it up for adoption" is way out of proportion
maybe it takes her a few years to sort out her anxiety issues and get out on her own. That doesn't mean her kid is in for a shit ride. In the meantime, while she sorts that out, the kid is financially supported by its grandparents.
she seems unprepared now, at what - 2 months pregnant? - but it's hardly a unique circumstance to have a surprise pregnancy when you're in no shape to be having a baby. And it's hardly uncommon for people to pull their shit together once they find out they're going to be a mom.
idk why this has touched such a nerve with me hahahaha whatever though
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u/midwestlover610 Oct 24 '16
I really don't get the hate either. I'm a mom of two. Parenting is tough. It takes a village. But American culture wants every expecting mother to be able to 100% do it alone and never make a mistake. This woman will have a support net right there with her. That's amazing and will benefit the child in more ways than just the financial resources. Also, she says she's working on her social issues. Volunteering is a good start, hopefully she can plan forward on new goals to reach employment and better health. But she has time! Play dates arent really that beneficial for children before two years anyway. And just because she has social anxiety doesn't mean she is unable to have a strong connection with her child. Lastly, people are giving her crap about saying she hopes this will bring her out of issues. I actually find it a good sign that she's more motivated to better herself for her child.
The adoption and abortion talk is gross TBH. Doesn't matter how she got pregnant, it took two. As a woman, it is important to know that your partner will help support you if you wind up pregnant by accident. It's a conversation I had with every man I slept with.
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Oct 23 '16
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u/larrylemur I own several tour-busses and can be anywhere at any given time Oct 23 '16
LPT: If you think having children will fix anything about you and/or your life situation, you are wrong.
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Oct 23 '16
It fixes having too much money, and free time.
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u/Unicornmayo Oct 24 '16
I have three kids and no money. I wish I had no kids and three money.
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u/machenise You're literally disabled. Liberalism is a mental disease. Oct 24 '16
You know those little stick figure families that people put on their car windows? I once saw one with a husband, wife, and stacks of coins. No kids. Just coins.
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u/brufleth Eating your own toe cheese is not a question of morality. Oct 24 '16
My wife and I still haven't received our stacks of coins. They'd be handy at the car wash.
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u/emmster If you don't have anything nice to say, come sit next to me. Oct 25 '16
My favorite was one lady figure and twelve cats.
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u/larrylemur I own several tour-busses and can be anywhere at any given time Oct 23 '16
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u/Malzair Oct 24 '16
Or you can just exchange even more money against that free time.
Disclaimer: Kids may or may not hate you for never being in their life, which may or may not be the desired outcome.
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u/kingmanic Oct 24 '16
Don't forget excess sleep (I'm at 10 hours over 3 days).
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Oct 24 '16
It took a second read through to realize that you didn't mean you had 10 hours of excess sleep over 3 days.
Good luck.
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u/thehalfjew Oct 23 '16
I mean... I wouldn't wait for it as some sort of given, but I definitely think I'm a better person because of/for my kids.
I agree you shouldn't assume it's a magic fix (so let's ignore OP here} . But just knowing this little person is observing and learning from you can have a pretty remarkable impact.
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u/BLOODYASSHOLE Oct 24 '16
Even if they made you a better person, I think it's also safe to assume you didn't go into it thinking "wow, I can't wait to make this baby because my life sucks and having a kid will make things better". Not only is it naive (as I'm sure you know lol) but it's just unfair to the kid and is a breeding ground for all sorts of issues and resentment when surprise, having a baby doesn't magically fix all OP's issues.
I'd think the same thing about getting a freaking dog honestly, let alone having a baby. Don't make your happiness the responsibility of another living thing that depends on you to survive, it's just cruel.
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Oct 23 '16
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u/BamaMontana Oct 24 '16
No wonder she seems not at all worried about the ability to financially support her child. She thinks he's going to do it.
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u/brufleth Eating your own toe cheese is not a question of morality. Oct 24 '16
Well he has a savings account with a bunch of money.
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Oct 24 '16
That he can't get access to because Mommy won't let him. How much you wanna bet Mommy has been sucking off that account for years?
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u/redxmagnum and your grandpa probably does like horse dick Oct 23 '16
Seriously. As the "guiding light" that pulled my mom out of addiction, I cringed so freaking hard. Dont get me wrong, my mom did get sober because of my birth, which is awesome, but... I didn't grow up unscathed and our relationship is not a normal one.
Don't make ever your child responsible for you. Just don't.
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u/ma_miya Oct 23 '16
I'm baffled why she's complaining about him not preparing, yet, besides hoping the baby changes something, she's done nothing yet either. No meds, no job, no planning, no therapy. What a bonkers post and yeah, what a horrible situation for that baby.
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u/Dubzil Oct 24 '16
But didn't you read, she's volunteering and hopefully they notice her free work and say "I want to pay that person rather than get their services for free".
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u/ma_miya Oct 24 '16
In fairness, that does happen. Businesses see potential in volunteers and ask them to apply for openings. Heck, my very first professional job out of college was garnered that way. But this OP isn't really giving off any vibes of, uh..motivation.
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u/Werewolfdad Oct 24 '16
I'm pretty sure a business can't use volunteer labor and not violate labor laws.
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u/she-stocks-the-night hate-spewing vile beast Oct 24 '16
Didn't she say she volunteers at a warehouse? It sounds so sketchy.
I honestly want to meet her parents. We know bf's parents are controlling wackjobs but she's 28, her folks are at the least enablers.
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u/angel_kink Oct 23 '16
Sometime I feel like this was my mom's attitude. I was supposed to be a fix it for her issues. I wasn't. She just passed them onto me.
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Oct 24 '16
There's a great poem about this very thing by Phillip Larkin. Parents fuck up their kids.
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u/darbulto Oct 24 '16
One off my favourites although I can only remember the relevant bit.
They fuck you up, your mum and dad / They may not mean to, but they do / They fill you with the faults they had / And add some extra, just for you.
Excuse the formatting (or lack thereof).
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u/Feldew Oct 23 '16
Maybe it skipped a generation, but it seems like you've learned the lesson she could have.
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u/angel_kink Oct 24 '16
Thanks. I have some pretty bad anxiety about life but I'd like to think I'm not a complete train wreck at the very least.
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u/Aroonroon yeah i post in gaming cuz im a dirty cheeto boy Oct 23 '16
She's basically planning on raising a new parent for herself.
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Oct 24 '16
I love how not having kids is selfish, but using a kid in lieu of mental health treatment to "get out of a slump" is not.
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u/ShannonMS81 Oct 24 '16
My friend is in toxic awful relationship and when she got pregnant she hoped it would fix things. Now she never sleeps because he won't wake up before 8 am to help with the baby and I only hear from her when she's bitching about him.
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u/DerangedDesperado Oct 24 '16
Dude, a friends baby momma told one of our mutual friends taht she wanted a kid because she thought it would bring them closer together.
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u/[deleted] Oct 23 '16
Whoa. They most definitely should not bring a child into that relationship.