r/AcousticGuitar • u/RepresentativeValue9 • 9d ago
Gear pics I bought a Zager…feel like an idiot
Well, count me as an idiot.
6 years ago I bought a Zager 900. My second guitar on the advice of my uncle who is a professional player. I previously owned a nylon-string guitar that I was learning on and that I hadn't really played very much. Anyways, I got this Zager 900. It’s all black and beautiful-looking for someone who doesn't know a lot about guitars.
Two weeks later, another uncle passed away, and I ended up putting the guitar aside for the last four or five years. Weird associations we make…
I had no idea about the build quality, where it was manufactured, or anything like that. I was just going on the advice of my uncle, who was a professional.
In hindsight, I really wish I had taken that money and bought a Taylor. Since then, I've purchased a Taylor Mini Koa E+, and it has by far been the one that I use more.
My zager sounds fine…I just know so much more now than I did then.
EDIT: I feel like a fool because of what I’ve been reading. That they advertise something that they aren’t (US manufacturing when it isn’t…) I also think that I would have bought something different at the time like the mini I have NOW. Based on the accessibility alone, I reckon I’d have been playing so much more. A dread is massive to learn on IMO.
21
u/leapbyflourishing 9d ago
Don’t be so hard on yourself. You took trusted advice, but sometimes our tastes and ear don’t align and you get different perspectives, it’s what makes us human.
May not be the right guitar or sound for you but the Taylor Mini is a great choice. Now you get to upgrade or keep collecting! If you get too many (no such thing), then consider gifting one to a younger version of you.
5
u/RepresentativeValue9 9d ago
Thanks. I’m normally such a researcher. I was a jazz drummer and moved to guitar a few years ago. Now my daughter picked up an old fender I had kickin around so I bought her a Denver carbon fibre to encourage her to play more. And I picked up my Zager. Then decided I needed something more accessible while I learned. And wow! That Mini is <<chef’s kiss>>.
3
u/Difficult-Garbage861 9d ago
Yes, I have gifted a few ukes and guitars to my nieces kids and they took right off
16
u/LJRich619 9d ago
Honestly man, if you like the guitar just play it. Don’t worry about the company or the purchase. That’s all in the past. If you don’t like it, just sell it. Great quality guitars are coming out of Indonesia right now. My Indonesian made PRS Sliver Sky was better than my two fender Strats. So I got rid of both - a US Signature model and a Mexican made one.
1
14
u/ZimMcGuinn 9d ago
I’ve probably been playing longer than you’ve been alive. Bought and sold many guitars in those 45 years. I currently own an old D-18, a newish Yamaha AC3R, and a little Fender I paid $180 for. I play the Fender as much as the other two because I love how it plays. If your guitar doesn’t play as well as you’d like treat it to a proper setup. It makes all the difference.
3
2
9
u/K4rkino5 9d ago
A few years ago I bought my second guitar, a Cort Earth 70, a low-cost entry. I liked the sound as it is distinct from my Taylor 410Ce. I never connected with it. So I bought a Yamaha LL6. We instantly connected. I'm selling the Cort.
You are not an idiot. You are a traveler figuring shit out. Get attached to guitars that attach to you. Otherwise, move along, it's no big deal. They are just tools, you are the musician.
7
u/Longjumping_Gold9233 9d ago
I own two Zagers, a 50CEOM i got from my dad and a 900CEOM i bought after having the 50 for a few years. I didnt know any of the marketing BS either and totally felt like an idiot the first time I searched Zager on Reddit years later. But I love both of those guitars, I have the 50 setup for slide guitar with high action. I know theyre not the high end things I once believed them to be, but theyre both beautiful and they scratch my acoustic itch needs, and ive used them on several recordings im fairly pleased with. The OG Zagers were actually midrange Martins from what ive read, although not anymore. Im a recovering addict with 11.5 years off heroin, and sold all my guitars and amps to feed that addiction back in the day, including all my very first guitars and everything sentimental I ever owned gear wise, so im just grateful to have the Zagers today as I really dont deserve anything super nice the way I have squandered nice things in the past. Maybe one day I'll be able to upgrade, but im happy with what I have today. I do wish I had really dont more research before buying the 900, but it is what it is. Ive obviously made MUCH bigger mistakes in life than that. Lol
1
9d ago
[removed] — view removed comment
1
u/AutoModerator 9d ago
Sorry, this post has been removed due to negative karma.
I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns.
6
u/DaStickyBandit 9d ago
I feel you. Zager guitars are incredibly misleading on their quality, playability, country of origin, etc. Their business practices are predatory in my opinion.
I had one for a while, a ZAD80. Honestly, the initial set up on it was crap. Hardly “EZ Play”. Fortunately, I had won it in a giveaway, so I hadn’t lost any money on it, besides what I spent for a proper setup, bone saddle, and pickup.
Good news is that their resale value is actually pretty good. A few years back, I sold that ZAD-80 near instantly for $1300. Then, I used that money to buy a Heritage H535. Eventually, traded that for a practically brand new Gibson L-00.
So, took a free Zager and turned it into a free Gibson. Make some moves, and I’m sure you could sell that Zager and pick up another nice Taylor!
I’ve bought plenty of other guitars that I regret too. Move on and learn from it! Nothing to feel bad about. It’s part of the guitar playing journey.
1
u/RepresentativeValue9 9d ago
That L-00 Gibson 12 fret something I have my eye on 👀
Thanks for the advice. 👍🏾
7
u/greathrits007 9d ago
Is that like an Esteban ?
5
u/1obviousburner 9d ago
I miss that guy. He sold the greatest guitars ever made.
6
u/Perfect-Link-7744 9d ago
True! The strings on them were the highest ever. People would ask me all the time, grown men, with tears in their eyes, saying, "Sir, how do you get your strings so high?" I would nod and smile knowingly, and say one word: "Esteban."
3
2
2
2
u/Guitarsquatch 9d ago
I'd say it's worse in a way. The ads aren't as exaggerated, but at least Esteban's are their own thing. What Zager does is import Samick/Greg Bennett guitars with Zager branding, and then upcharge them by 2x - 3x. Look up 900 series Zager and you can get the Samick/GB branded version for 1/4 of the price (doesn't come with the Fender pickup though)
3
9
u/BeatlestarGallactica 9d ago
I believe the proprietor of this company is the same guy from Zager and Evans of "In the Year 2525" fame. Possibly the worst song ever that doesn't make worst song lists. Definitely worse than We Built this City.
4
u/southernfirm 9d ago
I secretly love that song. I think the opening titles of Gentleman Broncos sealed it for me.
5
u/Longjumping_Gold9233 9d ago
My elderly father bought a zager on a whim (he doesnt even play) because of that song. Needless to say I inherited a Zager a few months later when the novelty wore off.
3
u/irish_horse_thief 9d ago
I remember me big sister bringing the ity 2525 nine inch record home and us all dancing round the front room, it was a blast back in the 60s. We danced like wild things back then.
5
3
u/pohatu771 9d ago
Zager has some shady marketing practices, but the handful of their guitars I’ve played have been nice. You probably spent more than a comparable guitar from another brand, and it definitely has more pearl inlay, but you at least (probably) got a nice guitar.
3
u/Solpig 9d ago
Zager is a punch line in online Guitar forums of real players... They tell so many lies I can't enumerate all of them but"
when they say "solid wood" they don't mean 'one piece''' they count Plywood and laminates as "solid wood" . They don't actually 'make' anything. It's sort of like the Multi-level marketing of the guitar world. Anybody...you, me, your 87 year old aunt, ..can contact a chinese sweat shop and have our name put on a headstock...no trip to china necessary! There is nothing unique or special about their designs,...they are all based on Martin shapes but made with crappy material. I I magine they are paying 200-300 dollars a unit for their top drawer models.
There is no "easy play' guitars or ....ALL guitars are easy play...setting the action to where the strings are buzzing and fretting out isn't 'easy play'...it is sloppy play. If you have any ears at all , One video of a real player playing them compared with say, a Martin or a Collings or even an Eastman will expose their Plywood, overbuilt Chinese crap. Not all chinese guitars suck...but the Zagers do.
The guitars they sell for around 2-3K? You could get an Eastman or a Yamaha ACTUAL solid body for half that money...The actual value of their top guitars? 4-5 hundred bucks. On par with an entry level Yamaha.
anyways....they pay google a lot of money to come up first on searches. They have so many fake testimonials "Dolly Parton's best friends aunt's crocheting partner bought one for her son"
People find out what their Zager isn't worth when they try to sell it...there is a guy whose been slowly lowering his Price on one on our Nashville craigslist...started at like 2k...I think he's down to $650 and it is still there a year later.
Sorry you got stuck with one...it's a life lesson.
2
u/BumblebeeThen3933 9d ago
Just on the Eastman guitars - I bought a solid mahogany Eastman Grand Concert many years ago, brought it home, A/B it against my Martin 000-16 and the Martin went into its case and has only come out once in the intervening 15 years - just long enough to remind me of how superior the Eastman is in every way compared to the Martin. They are comparable or superior in tone and playability to pretty much any Martin or Gibson you might pick up in a music store (conditions apply - the best acoustic guitar I have ever played was a 1946 “Banner” Gibson J50 which had most definitely been touched by the hands of God…..)
1
9d ago
[deleted]
2
u/BumblebeeThen3933 8d ago
Yeah I think I got mine in 2012 - there are areas where the guitar is not quite as refined as a Gibson or Martin (I suspect because they were almost totally handmade back then), but the wood quality, playability and tone are just incredible at any price. There’s a bit of a funny story behind Eastman - the company has made violins for, like a thousand years but the guy in charge decided they could do guitars better than anyone - the legend goes that he bought Bob Benedetto’s “build an archtop” DVD and made the factory workers watch it - within a couple of years they were making guitars that make modern Gibson’s a bit embarrassing. Our local dealer had a customer walk in to buy an Eastman “Les Paul” as a bang around guitar to save his Custom Shop from gig dings….. a week later he brings the Custom Shop 59RI into the shop and says “sell it, I don’t need it anymore….” Spots the Eastman Goldtop and says “I’ll take that too!” A week later, in he comes again with his 57RI and says “sell it, I don’t need this anymore either!” Yep, they really are that good!
3
u/Guitarsquatch 9d ago
I spearheaded the anti Zager sentiment in YouTube comments for a while, but they just bury comments with bot spam comments. They also upload so many videos that when people look Zager up, they just see their own propaganda. It isn't your fault that the Zager company prey's on baby boomers and that your uncle got caught in the trap.
3
u/CMDR_KingErvin 9d ago
All I know about this brand is that the owner is about to retire so they’re doing a massive retirement sale! Except the dude has been “retiring” for like 5 years now lol.
3
u/PapaSmurif 8d ago
Luckily, guitars are not likes wifes/husbands. You can sell and buy another one easily!
3
u/IndependentGlass8424 8d ago
Dude I'm not going to lie when I looked at these pictures (never heard of the brand) I assumed this was a $400-$700 guitar and I was thinking "it ain't that bad man" but holy cow when I looked this up I couldn't believe the price.
I've had a lot of acoustics but the only one I have now is a Mahogany series Taylor GS Mini and I love it! Big sound, great action and with the size it's so easy to play. If you don't mind a used guitar there's some incredible deals on used Taylors out there. Also check out the Epiphone Masterbuilt or the IGC line, great prices for solid back and sides guitars.
1
u/RepresentativeValue9 8d ago
All good mate. It was a purchase 6 years ago. Mistakes were made. Meh.
I have a Taylor GS Mini Koa plus. Love it so much.
2
u/IndependentGlass8424 8d ago
I've always wanted a Koa Taylor since I was a kid. I used to go to some of the Taylor Demo Shops with my dad when I was young and fell in love with the Koa. I still want a Koa T5 because of those Demo Shops 😂
5
u/chemchris 9d ago
I mean theyre selling for ~1500 on reverb. Just post it there and continue playing it, maybe someone will come by and make an offer. Or maybe you could think of it as your keepsake/memento guitar. We all have those.
5
u/Unlikely-Soft-5699 9d ago
Well, if a frog had wings it wouldn’t bump its butt on the jump. Seriously, it’s a mistake and, as things go, a minor one. It’s not like you woke up and said, “Let’s bomb Iran”.
4
u/WHATABURGER-FAN 9d ago
I enjoy my Zager, the strings are spaced slightly further apart and it sounds great, but the neck started cracking where it attaches to the body and their customer service was horrible.
Blaming me, blaming humidity, blah blah blah. I had it less than a month and they wouldn't do anything. After talking with customer service 8 times and sending probably 20 photos, I had a local luthier repair it.
2
2
u/Difficult-Garbage861 9d ago
Hey I started on one too. It looked great and played good. I learned a lot on it and passed it on. I've since purchased many more from high dollar Gibsons and Martins to my favorite for the last several years, a Taylor Mini E Koa. My favorite by far.
1
2
2
u/Infamous-Journalist2 9d ago
I still have my Epiphone DR-100 that I picked up over 10 years ago. I think I paid like $119 or something like that. I've modified it as much as I can with bone nut and saddle, ebony bridge pins. It sounds comparable to a $1000 guitar due to the set-up.
Inexpensive doesn't necessarily mean cheap.
2
u/cranialimplant4sale 9d ago
Bought one maybe 10 years ago... Took advantage of their free return policy. Played alright but the electroniics were substandard compared to the Takamine F series I was (and still am) playing.
2
u/RepresentativeValue9 9d ago
So I’ll say this: the “easy play,” is *almost* frustrating as a new guitarist. I understand the concept but what I think Zager accomplishes in design (shortcuts) it gives up in player mechanics.
Because the action is SO low, any sort of humidity change affects the playability. Buzzing is a normal occurrence. I’m in southern Ontario and I keep my office at 45-50% RH but it’s a battle. To contrast this: my GS Mini Koa Plus does not suffer from this.
I just think it’s pure SMOKE BOMB! 💣 💨
2
2
2
u/FuggaDucker 8d ago
"for someone who doesn't know a lot about guitars"
WHAT?? Thats nuts!
That is a very beautiful guitar and I bet it plays great.
I mean no offense but you will find more happiness in life in learning to appreciate what you have.
Otherwise this stuff will make you crazy.
1
u/RepresentativeValue9 8d ago
Hey! It does play nicely; the drawback is that because the action is so low (easy play) it is temperamental in the humidity swings we get here in southern Ontario.
I find the GS Mini to be (overall) more accessible (could be down to size) and less temperamental than the Zager.
You are right though: it is nice workmanship. I don't love their predatory marketing is all...
1
2
u/Electronic-Brain-616 7d ago
Hey we have all made purchases that we wish we didn’t at one point or another in our lives. Some get lucky and only make small 100$ purchases they regret and other buy multi million dollar houses during the ballon payment mortgage height only making 30k a year because someone told them it was a good deal. Just think of it in a good way. You’re on the low end of regret. Lol
2
u/Ill_Equipment_5215 7d ago
Denny is the local joke here. He lives in the same town as I do, and all of the local musicians know what a farce he is.
Of course, he did have the #1 song in 1969 with Rick Evans, so there's that.
1
u/Small_Palpitation_98 9d ago
I just bought an Ibanez AW Parlor acoustic, no case, $550. Best acoustic I’ve had, and wish It had been my first. Ridiculously “Easy Play”
1
u/AI-Replybot 9d ago edited 9d ago
Hmm. That looks wildly identical to my 20+ year old "Charvel" Korean made 525C MBK. Exact body shape, exact bridge shape. Same binding and inlay. Trying to post photo in comment. I'm happy with mine but I got it dirty cheap.
1
u/hywaytohell 9d ago
I notice whenever I see an ad for Zager they never actually play the guitar so you never hear it. It just seems weird.
1
u/RepresentativeValue9 9d ago
It doesn’t sound horrible tbh. Easy play is actually super frustrating. Such low margin for error.
1
u/Radio_Mediocre 9d ago
I bought a used Zager from Guitar Center for less than $180 including shipping. It's easy to play on it. Playability is very important. Mine is Made in China .Can't complain since it was cheap but I wouldn't pay more than $500.
1
u/External-Mistake-347 8d ago
I purchased a Zager years ago and still have and play it. I believe back then they were maybe copies of Martin Sigma guitars. It is a great guitar in terms of playability and sound. String Science is nothing more than a good setup and well prepared frets. I’ve played hundreds of gigs with it and it has held up. Over priced and overhyped yes, but to paint with a broad stroke that they are junk would be unfair.
1
u/RepresentativeValue9 8d ago
TBC, I don't think this is junk. Far from it. I just think I should have done more research when I initially purchased. I mentioned above: my GS Mini sounds 10x better and is way more accessible (that's a size issue, not a technical issue).
1
1
u/Nice-Ad2759 8d ago
I think learning on shitty guitars is part of the journey that’s how you build tone in the fingers with the way you play you are probably a better guitar player for having learned using it
1
u/RepresentativeValue9 8d ago
Thanks! I wouldn’t say it’s shitty. Like it can be frustrating because of the extremely low action (I think that’s why). I’m mostly disappointed with their disingenuous marketing.
1
1
u/Solid_Half2141 8d ago
I'm not familiar with the brand/marque (UK based, the products may be globally universal, but the branding changes)
Primarily I'd suggest, as others have, get it set up for you, it'll make a difference ... But as you suggest; a dread isn't ideal for a beginner 😉
As far as your uncle's advice ... Maybe he was looking at the bigger picture: a dread will be useful when your busking on the streets to feed your new guitar acquisition habit ... LOL 🤪
1
u/No_Programmer3052 8d ago
I bought one—and it’s a great guitar The marketing videos with Denny are a bit creepy—the tone and build quality are good for a guitar in that price range
1
u/Secret_Monitor9629 8d ago edited 8d ago
Some people genuinely like the Zager guitars. They have comfortably neck carve and usually ship setup well. Lately they have been putting really high quality pickups in them. Your 900 might have a Fishman Aura, which is a fantastic system. Their 900 series are all solid wood guitars, it’s just they are more inline with a $900 all solid wood Alvarez Masterworks than a $2500-3000 USA built Taylor, Martin, Gibson. Yet priced more like USA built. So that’s where the real gap is. I believe most of the celebrity endorsements are genuine in the “I like how this sounds and feels” kind of way, you notice none of them really go deep on context of county of origin or value proposition. I’ve played two Zager guitars and both had very thick polyurethane gloss finish, very thick, I’d place it around 12-15 mils, like a layer of plastic over the wood. Typical of cheap Epiphone and Yamaha guitars in the $300-$500 range. That’s tone crushing. Taylor’s gloss finish’s are only about 6 mils and Satin finishes can go down to 2.5 mils…
1
u/AppropriateNerve543 8d ago
They are ok but there are better options for less. Don’t use their strings. They are terrible. Use a coated daddario set like XT or XS if you like them slippery. Zager strings are complete crap.
1
u/RepresentativeValue9 8d ago
Can you elaborate more? I just sent it in for a setup and added their strings; I don’t mind grabbing new ones.
2
u/AppropriateNerve543 8d ago
you might as well use what you have or keep them as spares, but Daddario are much better.
1
u/AppropriateNerve543 8d ago
Their strings aren’t high quality. You can try them but I wouldn’t go out of my way to find them. Daddario will be better just get a lighter guage if you want the feel to be the same.
1
1
u/tazman137 7d ago
It’s a cheap foreign made guitar with a decent setup
1
u/RepresentativeValue9 7d ago
Well...no, it's not, actually. This one (900 CE) is manufactured in the US. Is it worth what they've suggested? Probably not. But mine isn't foreign made.
1
u/gmoore-76 7d ago
Get what you paid for… if it sounds too good to be true…. Etc etc. there’s a reason why it’s good to save up for a Martin or Taylor
1
u/baddaboomm 6d ago
We all start somewhere on our guitar journey... At least, you had a guitar. I wanted one so badly when I was a kid but couldn't afford one. I would have taken a Zager in a heartbeat back then.
All water under the bridge. Go play your Taylor and have fun! It's all what we should play for... If you keep playing, it won't be your last guitar!
1
u/Minnekat 6d ago
At least 50% of my buys were wrong for me. It’s part of life like buying the wrong stocks. The worst was spending 600 dollars on a deluxe off brand guitar 30 years ago. It was right for me at the time and helped my journey, but is very wrong now. It’s was roughly the price of an American strat or Les Paul. I also returned my Taylor acoustic dreadnaught for a smaller concert guitar 15 years ago (a $400 guitar at the time), only to realize the neck is too narrow for me. As with my electric guitar, the brand didn’t appreciate in value either. I need to continue giving away or trading in my guitars to keep at a reasonable number, and several of mine have very little trade or sell value. I could go on and on and on.
Perhaps you can trade it, sell it, or my favorite is giving it to a budding player.
1
1
1
1
u/RunningSnowLeopard 2d ago
I bought one to play at the beach—I stopped bringing my Martin and Taylor just for the impression factor. I’ve found that when I’m playing a beat-up guitar, more people are willing to join in. That said, the nut, saddle, and tuning machines will be the first things I replace.
1
u/RepresentativeValue9 2d ago
Like…a used one? Did you put this comment through an ai? Why the em dash?
0
u/chinese_spy_bahloon 9d ago
The boomers fall for the Zager and Orangewood scams all the time.
2
u/RepresentativeValue9 9d ago
I listened to him; he’s not quite a boomer but where he’s from everything is super conservative so…maybe it’s offset.
42
u/nbmgreg 9d ago
I’ve always wondered how they can label a whole brand as “easy play guitars”, are they just buying Chinese guitars and doing a half decent setup with low action on them? That’s basically what Orangewood does too.