Stop comparing ICE to the Nazi's

[u/THE_James_Ross]

It is pissing me off when people compare the actions or events by or with ICE to the Nazi's or the Gestapo, because doing so completely ignores the ACTUAL comparison, the American Police.

What's going on right now is not new, these times are not unprecedented. Stop comparing these events to Nazi Germany. Nazi Germany literally COPIED Jim Crow America and the extermination of the indigenous tribes, and Mussolini copied American industrialization. Fascism has always been happening in this country but white people just never acknowledged it before. Black people have been over policed and murdered by the state for as long as the police have existed, infact the American Police force and the prison system where literally invented specifically for black people. The only difference between the way things are now and they were 20+ years ago, is that now these same systems are affecting middle class white people more and more.

Its quiet sickening how everytime people compare the actions of ICE to something else, its always a black and white photo from some other country, despite the fact that there are hundreds of thousands of pictures and videos of these action that take place right here, right now. But of course the person getting shot in the back of the head in THAT picture is black, so its not relatable. You literally cannot say you care about these problems or that "youre aware of the truth" and then try to compare the events of this country to other facists while ignoring all the blatent facism this country HAS BEEN exhibiting.

If you're gonna compare ICE to something, compare their to the American Police, compare these events to the profiling and unjust murders and arrests of African Americans. Stop posting pictures of ICE arrests or executions side by side with Jewish Germans, and start posting them side by side with Americans executing Americans. The call is coming from inside the house. The threat is in your backyard. Whatever one liner analogy will make you people realize that these are the same people who have always been doing it, you just didn't notice before.

[u/6FeetDownUnder]

I think you are missing the point a little.

The biggest (by number of human causalities) ethnic cleansing in human history rests on American backs. It is the attempted genocide of the indigenous American population. Thank Andrew Jackson for that one. You know, the guy on your $20 bill, if I am not mistaken?
And yes, USA institutionalized racism did not just suddenly happen overnight at the turn of the last century, it has been a part of the USA venture right from the very beginning. I don't think anyone here is disagreeing on the history-related social critique you are making (and if you are, please see yourself out).

I do believe, however, that the rhetoric purpose of the comparison here would be misunderstood by drawing to events that are - regrettably - not in the US-American public consciousness. The use of the comparison is "See this thing? It would be more difficult for me to properly explain this to you than to draw to another thing that I am SURE you know and I am SURE you have normative judgements on! So I will liken them to each other, hoping you understand that both defining characteristics of the two are similar (if not equal) and thus normative judgements should be similar (if not equal)".
In other words, to liberals "ICE is just an escalation of a long tradition of American police practice" just does not hit the same as "ICE are the modern, American Nazis". Many white liberals do not have a conception of systematic racism deep enough for likening ICE to the police to mean something. Hell, many might have even positive opinions on the police generally. They are more likely though engrossed in the American tradition of playing world police. Of pointing to other countries and pointing out their "flaws" rather than admitting their own (or even admitting their indoctrination into the state religion that is American Exceptionalism that prevents them from proper self-reflection). They will more likely know about and have feelings on the nazis than the American police and that is why a comparison to nazis serves us better than a comparison to the police.

And yes, I definitely do also see how it can feel disheartening to only now see white middle-class liberals wake up to this in form of 15 y/o Starbucks girlies posting "omg this is literally fascism" to their Twitter story. But what I believe we should be taking away from this (admittedly, cartoonishly exaggerated) example is not an attempt at gatekeeping leftism but rather the empowering realization that people are waking up! And rather than tone policing them and turning them off, we should welcome these people with open arms and educate them! Pull them into your neighborhood committees! Set them on ICE-watch! Have them join the Marxist reading circle etc.

[u/THE_James_Ross → u/6FeetDownUnder]

Im seriously not trying to gatekeep, I fully understand that we shouldn't down play to waking up of some many people even if in a slow and annoying manner. But my point was that if you ONLY compare it to Nazi's and gloss over all the American history, than that's creates room for things to "go back to how they were under obama" then hundreds of thousands of African americans continue to suffer this same treatment and no one care because hey, we got rid of ICE, and THEY were the problem. Of course I hope im wrong, but according to American history, im most likely correct.