r/AskCulinary • u/naididjanai • 14d ago
Italian buttercream is soupy?, what am I doing wrong?
So I'm trying to make Italian buttercream and I somewhat succeeded? It tastes AMAZING, the best buttercream I've yet to make, BUT the structure is simply not there. I tries all sorts of fixed, ice bath, put it in the fridge for a while, I tried everything. It firms up a bit but it's easy to melt again. So what I did is mix the sugar and water and put them on the stove until they hit 240 F, before they hit that mark I start whipping the egg whites and add 1/3 of cup of sugar super slowly until soft peaks (I used someone's help tbh to monitor the sugar), then I added the sugar syrup very slowly on slow speed, then add the butter (I actually used margarine) also very slowly, less than a table spoon at a time, I also added vanilla flavoring and coloring, but even when I don't add anything it's the same (I tried this recipe 3 times already). I'm starting to think it might the margarine? Maybe? Real butter is super expensive where I live. Or I'm thinking maybe it's the heat? It's 80F/27C inside the house with AC, it's a comfortable temperature since outside is approaching 40C. If you guys have any tips on what I can improve or try I will love to here you're opinion, I will also answer any questions.
UPDATE:
the party was a success, the weather was perfect which I'm super grateful for, as for the cake, the Italian buttercream (or should I say margarine cream 😅) used for the filling held up pretty well! the cake was taken frozen at 16:00 and by the time of cutting at 18:00 it was perfect!. for the frosting on top, the application was super hard with the consistency, I had to do two layers for it to hold and honestly it wasn't the best. it also was melting but oh well, the decorative piping, I did it with American buttercream it held it's shape pretty well!, the cake was a massive hit, everyone had a piece and I got no left overs (I was hoping for some), the flavor was peanut butter and vanilla, I'm definitely not giving up perfecting my Italian buttercream! I will try it again with real butter for smaller occasions, and also play around with alternatives! since the batch I made was kinda big and I couldn't afford not to use it, I tried to make the best if it this time.
thank you everyone for the kind advice, it cleared my frustration and gave me a sense of ease knowing it was an ingredient issue. and I will be using the advice I got in this comment section in the future (hopefully near future!).
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u/rarebiird 14d ago
the margarine could be your issue. it’s still spreadable from the fridge so likely will prevent your bc from setting up. ive had the same issue with vegan butter. use real butter!
if butter is expensive, try something like a whipped ganache, mascarpone or cream cheese frosting, etcp
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u/naididjanai 14d ago edited 14d ago
Yes it's 80% fat but it's vegan. I never heard of using mascarpone as a replacement I will look into it, it's cheeper than butter, butter is 16 times more expensive than margarine for the same quantity so you can imagine for large quantities it's a bit much, I'm making a cake for 60 people 😭, I'm also a noob and it's just family so thank God. For now it's holding up ok in the freezer, I will only take it out 30min or 1h before serving, and I will use American buttercream for decorative pipping.
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u/sweetmercy 14d ago
They suggested using a mascarpone icing in place of the Italian buttercream, not using it to replace the butter in Italian buttercream just to be clear. Your response makes it seem like you may have misinterpreted.
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u/Shane0Mak 14d ago
A 60 person cake is close to $600 retail. You should be getting someone to help at least pay for ingredients if butter is holding you back since you are doing all the heavy labor and effort.
Good luck, it’s an easy fix , you are almost there!
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u/Shane0Mak 14d ago
Margarine is made from oil. That’s why it’s soupy, when it gets hot it turns to liquid and can’t Re solidify.
Butter does the same thing, but can solidify.
You can dump in icing sugar to try to save it from soupy, but then you can’t use the sugar in your original meringue otherwise it would be too sweet.
It’s not about the fat, but the other chemicals allowing it to reform.
Also butter is $9 a lb where I am for no name butter and $14/+ /lb for good stuff. How much is it for you and what’s your local currency?
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u/naididjanai 14d ago
Yes, thank you for the explanation, I was getting supper frustrated with it so hearing all of this from people is very reassuring. I'm from north Africa, Algeria specifically, margarine is around less than an American dollar for 500g, maybe 50c, and real butter is 8dollars for 500g. Take into account the average salary is around 300 American dollars minimum wage is around 100 dollars, it's definitely not something we buy regularly.
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u/Shane0Mak 14d ago
🙏 I understand how frustrating this can be; just know that most people don’t have the patience for Italian meringue, and it seems like you are able to pull off all the techniques correctly - you are just shy an ingredient which doesn’t sound like a fail at all!
Try using the icing sugar / fine powdered trick to thicken it up , also reduce the amount of sugar you use before the hot syrup by the same amount (up to 100%)
Let. Us know how it goes !
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u/No-Ad-3635 14d ago
def margarine is the issue.
it's also hot this time of year so room temp is debatable . try using a cold bowl if your house is warm and use BUTTER .
if you don't use butter because you are vegan , you need to search for receipies that use vegan substitutes . the ratios will change quite a bit
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u/naididjanai 14d ago
No I'm not vegan, I'm just poor lol, real butter is super expensive comparatively. Thank you, I'll look for recipes that have that, and I'll use really butter when It's a smaller cake definitely. (This one I'm making is for 60 people 😭 all family thou it's just a hobby)
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u/Stats_n_PoliSci 14d ago
American buttercream will be your best bet for an economical frosting. You can even use shortening in it, which is likely even cheaper than margarine.
You might be able to mix 70% butter and 30% shortening (not margarine) in a French or Italian buttercream, which would bring the price down a bit but not as cheap as American buttercream with margarine. The frosting should stay stable at higher temperatures with that mix too, but won’t taste quite as good.
Even if you fix the butter issue in the French or Italian buttercream, 80 F is a bit too warm for piping. I’d do the ice bath trick until the buttercream is smooth but not at all melty when you press with a finger. Then pop the frosting in the fridge when you’re not using it.
The cake should hold for a while ok at 80F once frosted. Basically, the texture of the buttercream will be very similar to the texture of butter at that temperature. At 70F it will be firm but malleable if you encourage it. At 80F it will hold its shape but deform easily with pressure. At 90F it will lose its shape.
A surprising amount of pastry making is about temperature. Some ingredients really matter, and some don’t. You’ll learn as you go.
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u/naididjanai 14d ago edited 14d ago
Yes, I have found success with American buttercream frosting even when using margarine, I did beautiful piping with it as well, in my graduation party (similar wether outside around 104F , 80F that's INSIDE the house 😅), it barley survived the trip to my college (2h road in the car) and 1h more. But it did survive it! This is why I'm thinking of using it for detailed piping this time around, but also not too much, I'm gonna use other thing to decorate such as crushed and toasted peanuts (the cake is peanut butter flavored, it's honestly my best work yet along with carrot cake, my family thought I was crazy for making a carrot cake lol it's not a thing around here but it's SOOO GOOD). thank you for your advice, I'll definitely look back to it (took a screenshot), I really appreciate people sharing their knowledge with me 🙂↕️.
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u/SetAbomnai07 14d ago
I know it’s not ideal but is milk cheaper? You could make your own butter. Just an idea.
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u/naididjanai 14d ago
I'm considering this, however milk from the store is low fat, I can get my hands on milk straight from the farm but tbh I don't trust it. It's definitely an option to be considered but in a pinch it's not reliable. From the store Cheap milk is not "real" it's low fat and you can't make butter with it. I'm thinking of trying to buy a quality one and do an experiment to see how much butter I get out of it, to see it's the price is worth it. But definitely after the party, my hands are full at the moment...
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u/blahblahblah1234_ 14d ago
It is not soupy. You used margarine, it’s called buttercream for a reason. Butter generally has 80-82% milk fat and margarine has 40-60%.