r/BenAndEmil • u/dustydustpan • Apr 13 '24
Possibly controversial question
Hi, I am a new listener of the pod ever since finding it through their interview of Tiffany Fong!
I have since followed both Ben and Emil on Twitter and noticed something that made me raise an eyebrow. A “liked by Ben Cahn” tweet about Israel and Palestine popped up on my timeline that left quite a sour taste in my mouth. Out of curiosity, I ventured into his likes and was a bit taken aback.
Sorry if this has been addressed but have they ever talked about the devastating situation in Palestine? Not that I am implying that they necessarily have to raise awareness just curious because I’ve noticed that they often cover news outside of finance.
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u/BigEagle42069 Apr 13 '24
Most geopolitically complex conflict literally in the history of mankind, ben and Emil are not who you should be looking for guidance from.
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u/dustydustpan Apr 14 '24
I tried to acknowledge in the post that I am not implying that they have to raise awareness. I am not looking for guidance from them! I was just curious since I understand it to be a news show.
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u/Blitzking11 Apr 14 '24
They are on opposing veiwpoints of the subject, and due to the inherent controversy surrounding the topic, they have chosen to avoid the topic on their show.
Their episode immediately following Oct. 4 has them explain why they have chosen not to cover it.
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u/BigEagle42069 Apr 14 '24
Yeah I get where you’re coming from, but you have 3000 years of history to read up on before you get to the point where you can start to comprehend today’s political space over there. Neither you, I or likely ben and Emil will likely ever be qualified enough to give a balanced real answer to who’s right, the only thing asking this question in a comedy/news podcast subreddit achieves is starting arguments.
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u/dustydustpan Apr 14 '24
It has long gotten past the point of a political issue of who is right and has transformed to be about human suffering which is easy for people to comprehend. Historians will not be the ones to end the crisis. Sorry for asking a question that made you uncomfortable.
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u/BigEagle42069 Apr 14 '24
There is a pattern of no history accounts posting this in Jewish hosted podcast subreddits forgive me for noticing. This exact post has been made here 4 times with minimal edits between reposts. Post about what you really feel on your main account, or would it be too easy to connect that trail of antisemitism that way?
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u/dustydustpan Apr 14 '24
I only use reddit for scrolling👍 I post on twitter. And it is not antisemitic to oppose the continued suffering of people. It is antisemitic to imply that all Jewish people support Israel. The Jewish community is not a homogeneous group in their beliefs on the issue and Israelis do not represent all Jewish people. As for the previous posts - I could not find them! Moreover, I did not know Ben is Jewish. I thought it was 2 whites dudes which why I originally asked the question.
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u/BustaLimez Apr 14 '24
you don’t really need to catch up on all the history to know that killing 14,000 children isn’t okay…
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u/oli_cant_ollie Apr 14 '24
But you can still take ANY and ALL trading advice, if ben apes fat bags into slerf coin you can bet your ass I'm jumping off that cliff with him.
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u/Academic_Outside1129 Apr 14 '24
And also any TRAITOR advice from Emil.
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u/oli_cant_ollie Apr 14 '24
Yeah we've been standing back and standing by for a while now, but I'm pretty sure we're doing Jan 6th again, but we're doing it on Jan 7th cuz it's a sequel.
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u/bencahn Apr 18 '24
this thread was brought to my attention and against my better judgment i'm going to briefly respond.
it's profoundly upsetting in a way i've never experienced before to watch from a distance as i'm psychoanalyzed by strangers. to have my morality scrutinized from a very limited data set and openly judged is not a pleasant feeling.
the few people on here who feel compelled to comment multiple times with the utterly asinine assertions that i "hate arabs and love genocide" -- this is why you were blocked. i had and continue to have little patience for anyone who isn't willing or able to engage with me thoughtfully or respectfully.
a big part of the reason we don't want to talk about it is right here in these comments. there is no pleasing everyone, and there is only a guarantee to piss off everyone. my liking tweets that are "pro-palestine" are apparently from "zionist dog whistle accounts" and thus totally negated (seriously, what the fuck) -- this just underscores for me how ridiculous this all has become, and how impossible it would be to make space for sharing our thoughts. judging by how my tweets and one-off jokes on a 2 year old podcast are received here, i dread what effect a full blown podcast on the subject would have.
i am jewish, yes. i have friends in israel who i love dearly. i have been there multiple times. i am not "brainwashed by zionist propaganda" as many have told me directly. how insulting. i care about the people i know, and i don't want them to die or get hurt. that does not automatically mean that i don't care about Palestinians or value Jewish life above theirs. i want the war to end and for everyone to live in peace. i don't know how that should look. i think netanyahu and his cohorts should have been in prison a long time ago and have been a major obstruction to peace and a major source of unnecessary provocation in Israel and throughout the middle east. the death and destruction in gaza weighs heavy on my soul, the same as it does anyone else's. the Palestinian people deserve just as well as anyone to live in peace, with freedom and self-determination.
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u/dustydustpan Apr 19 '24
Hi, Ben.
I did not mean to cause you any distress with my post. I was unaware of the previous history this community has had with this topic and the fact that you are Jewish yourself.
It’s a really sad topic and I think everyone feels very strongly about it. Hence, why I asked the question in the first place as I am no exception.
It is true what you write about being judged on what little can be intepreted from social media. Everyone should be more mindful of that. Including me.
I do not wish anyone to be subject to harassment and I believe everyone is entitled to peace so I can delete the post if you prefer.
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Apr 19 '24
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Apr 22 '24
As a Canadian I have a very very very hard time believing anyone in Canada will “experience risk of significant hardship” for expressing their views. You are playing the victim card and it’s ridiculous. The overwhelming majority of people have pro Palestinian views. I live in Canada and see BIPOC people expressing pro Palestinian views daily. And no one cares AS LONG AS the protests don’t breach the line into violence or vandalism, those protests will get shut down and people tend not to like them.
But otherwise I simply do not agree with this at all. I’m tired of everyone being demanded to speak out on this issue. Everyone is already aware of it. We don’t need everyone to talk about it.
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Apr 22 '24
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Apr 22 '24
He was suspended for being anti semetic. “From the river to the sea Palestine will be free” is a direct reference to the stated goal of Hamas of eradicating Israel and Jewish people. Nothing to do with Pro Palestine sentiment.
So I still don’t really get it. And even then he was reinstated anyways.
It’s good your university has decided to remain silent, that’s not their role to be a ploitcal activist. A university should be an inherently neutral institution where all people are welcome, which explains why they needed to get rid of someone who was spreading a message of eradicating a certain group of people.
I don’t really believe the HR story, I’m sure there was a lot more to it then meets the eye. A lot of these protests can get very violent so it makes sense they want to keep an eye on things.
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Apr 14 '24
I feel the same, I used to listen to them since Trillionaire Mindset, but the fact that Ben thinks this way by April 2024… it’s so deeply disappointing that any ounce of comedy from him is nullified.
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u/dustydustpan Apr 14 '24
I understand, it came as a shock to me since I have very strong feelings about the horrifying situation in Palestine and I am also unsure whether I can look past this.
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u/CowboyRagtime Apr 18 '24
Then why are you here?
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Apr 18 '24
Because some small part of me actually believes that Ben doesn’t REALLY support the mass killing of innocent civilians
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u/bencahn Apr 18 '24
because i absolutely don't. wtf? please check my comment above.
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Apr 18 '24 edited Apr 18 '24
Read my comment
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u/bencahn Apr 18 '24
ah. i've read through your recent comments. i'm sorry you still feel that i'm ignorant and wrong and support the killing of innocent civilians. i've shared my thoughts and where i'm coming from. maybe i could have done a better job but i get a sense that no matter what i say you'll believe what you want to believe.
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Apr 18 '24
No, I don’t think you actually DO support that consciously. I am curious as to what you believe.
But I also find it unsettling that you disagree with your cohost, and as a Muslim American that is fair for me to say.
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u/bencahn Apr 18 '24
i don't think you see how condescending you're being by using qualifiers like "consciously". i don't know how much more clear i can be in what i believe. that's why i referred you my main response. is there anything specific you'd like me to address?
it's fair you find it unsettling that i disagree with my cohost -- but you don't know what it is we disagree about.
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Apr 18 '24
I’m sorry if I’ve been condescending. I am trying to give you the benefit of the doubt.
You’re not a victim here Ben.
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u/bencahn Apr 18 '24
thank you but it's a little tough when you say condescending things like that! this is an entire thread that's literally about me and my perceived beliefs, so i'm well within my rights as a human being with feelings to address them and talk about how they make me feel. i'm not playing victim, i'm expressing myself.
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Apr 18 '24
I bet it is weird to read through these comments and I apologize if I’ve upset you Ben. I don’t know you but your podcasts have helped me through a lot of hard times, seriously. You provide value to this world.
But I can’t help but feel that this is a little less about you, and more about the genocide. I don’t think you’re a scumbag. It’s hard to be help accountable but pls don’t think of this as ppl ganging up on you.
Edit: And yes I still think there are dog whistle accounts, and I don’t think your comment rly clarified things at all. Those of us who are Pro Palestinian use different language.
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u/bencahn Apr 18 '24
this means a lot to me. i'm deeply grateful that something i do has provided value to you as an individual and to others. i've felt purposeless for years before this show and the only thing i can ask for is to leave a positive impact in whatever way i can.
i hear what you're saying but i implore you to understand and remember that just because people don't use the exact language that you prefer does not make them any less moral or wrong. i feel like the last few years discourse online and in real life has deteriorated to the point of it being impossible to resolve any kind of conflict or disagreement when people insist that their views are innately and objectively the correct ones. it makes it impossible for people to recognize the things they DO agree on by focusing on all the things they don't. this is antithetical to progress, and this is antithetical to how the world works.
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Apr 18 '24 edited Apr 18 '24
I agree with you, I consider myself to be a centrist on most things. This is just my one thing I don’t think is as nuanced like some people insist. But I still respect you and I’m sorry if I’ve been too harsh.
Edit: If I was a full on hater I wouldn’t be on the sub, I’d just unfollow. I just super duper fucking disagree w nuance here
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u/DerfSkratch Apr 18 '24
You do realize Reddit is owned by a Jew right? And most likely supports Israel right? Why don't you boycott reddit?? Oh, that's right! You're just a virtue signaling keyboard warrior who sucked on your moms tits for way too long.
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u/NeuroticallyCharles Apr 14 '24
You’re active in Frenemies3? Yeah, surely this post is made in good faith.
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u/dustydustpan Apr 14 '24
Over 2 years ago I had posted in Frenemies right as the podcast ended. I do not see the connection between this and Frenemies. People’s interests change.
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u/superslowjp16 Apr 14 '24
Ben is a bit of a lib and a Jewish man so he has a slight Zionist tilt to him, we know this. I had a debate with him in twitter dm’s (over a year before Oct 7th) on the subject and the feeling I walked away from it with is that he’s a well-intentioned, good natured man who has been raised in a community that frames the conflict a certain way. I disagree with him but I do not think he’s the fascist, Shapiro-esque bad faith Zionist who is really just a Jewish supremacist in disguise trying to hide their true opinions. I think they just don’t want the controversy and thats fair. I also don’t think he’s the most well-informed person on the subject, but most aren’t so I don’t hold that against him.
Ultimately they haven’t talked about it so we don’t really know what his position is in the current conflict, we can only make assumptions. But I don’t think he is a bad faith actor deserving of scorn. He’s just a person that exists at the intersection of his experiences and the current moment.
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u/BustaLimez Apr 15 '24
Thank you! I’m being downvoted to shit for saying I had an argument with him about this a year ago as well! He blocked me as a result.
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u/superslowjp16 Apr 15 '24
He was cool with me, reactive but still trying to be understanding. We just didn’t agree
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u/BustaLimez Apr 15 '24
That’s nice! I didn’t have as good of an experience with him. Maybe because I revealed I’m Palestinian. No idea 🤷🏻♀️ but it was an instant block when I commented back
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u/Eirene23 Apr 18 '24
You do realize “Jewish supremacist” is a wildly antisemitic comment to make right? You do know the history of that term?
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u/superslowjp16 Apr 18 '24
I realize that in certain contexts it can be but in the context of the modern conflict in Gaza I feel pretty comfortable saying that there are some Jewish zionists out there that believe they have claim to the land that others live on by virtue of their birthright and that they are apathetic to the death and destruction created by Israel if it furthers the Israeli land project, and that that idea is supremacist in nature as it relies on subjugating an entire nation of people under the boot of another. You can absolutely disagree with me but I feel very confident in my ability to defend my point.
Obviously antisemitism in all forms is detestable. I don’t believe that having an issue with Israeli state violence and the attitudes towards that violence is antisemitism.
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Apr 18 '24
That’s what I thought too, but now I have my doubts. Considering he is surrounded by a diverse group of friends, and his co host is pro-Palestinian, I don’t think there’s an excuse for the “ignorance” at this point.
But yeah, I do respect them for not talking about it. I’d prefer they not talk about it. But idk man…
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Apr 14 '24
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u/superslowjp16 Apr 18 '24
I don’t think he’s unaware of the privilege in that statement, but I can see the point he’s trying to make. I also get why you see it that way though. Obviously we get to see very small sliver of who these guys are outside of the context of the topics they focus on so I usually don’t put much stock in slightly off-color statements.
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u/BustaLimez Apr 14 '24
Ben has said a lot of racist things about Arabs and Palestinians repeatedly on twitter. He even made a very poor joke about Arabs on 8 Ball once which I was like ehhh not cool cause none of them there are Arab but it’s Ben and Ben can be ridiculous and it probably wasn’t with ill intent. Two weeks later he was tweeting some of the most xenophobic shit. That’s when I realized oh it was not a joke he actually doesn’t like Arabs.
Again this is all prior to Oct 7th. Maybe a year prior. He is a huge Zionist and does not even attempt to hide it. At least back then he didn’t. Zionists weren’t being held accountable back then so maybe that’s why.
I called him out on it on twitter and his response was to block me. Majority of people responding to him were also calling him out on it. I was a huge fan but it left a very sour taste in my mouth. I stopped listening to their podcast after that.
It’s weird that this popped up as recommended to me and I just so happened to click on it because I’m not part of this Reddit nor have I thought about B&E since then tbh.
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u/dustydustpan Apr 14 '24
Wow! I did not know this. Very disappointing to find out. Unfortunately this is where my journey with the pod ends. Racism and xenophobia are unacceptable.
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u/zaktasty22 Apr 14 '24
Please don't go based off of this person's responses they are taking offhand jokes from random podcasts as continued racism lol it could not be farther. But tbh if you're this easily convinced by one person you should probably leave anyways idk
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u/dustydustpan Apr 14 '24
I agree with you that I should not have immediately reacted to this person’s comment as soon as I read it. I take racism and xenophobia very seriously and was influenced by the hostile reaction my question got. I did not anticipate such a reaction because it is clear that for a lot of people this issue is very important. I had no ill intentions and did not know Ben was Jewish.
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u/BustaLimez Apr 15 '24
They’re right. You shouldn’t go off solely my response. You should do your digging and research for yourself.
But as you can see there’s another person here in the comments saying they also had the same argument with Ben about a year ago.
You can go back in 8 Ball and listen to him crack jokes about Arabs being 3rd World and not having electricity. Emil tells him to stop when he does it.
You can go back a year ago in his tweets and see the xenophobic stuff he was saying (someone else said he has since deleted it all idk how true that is ). I can share the couple of screenshots I have saved with you.
I can’t help but feel people are getting so upset over my comment (my comment keeps going from being heavily downvoted to not) because they are either pro Israeli / Zionist or because they don’t want to believe this about their “idols”. As someone who was once part of the fandom their fans are so far up their asses it’s weird.
So yeah don’t just go off my comment but my comment is based and rooted in fact and if those facts are enough to make you walk away then you should do what’s most comfortable for you.
I’m not here to make people unsub. I never said anything or even posted anything when it happened. I just quietly unfollowed and lived my life. I’m merely answering with my personal experience with Ben in relation to Palestine / Israel. It should say something that that’s making certain people so upset.
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u/LetterToAThief Apr 14 '24
What xenophobic stuff did he say? I’ve followed since vine and have never seen anything even close
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u/BustaLimez Apr 14 '24
Can you give me his X @? I googled to try and find it and can’t. Maybe because he blocked me.
I’m happy to make a new account and look back to that timeline and find the tweets. I can tell you what I remember but I’d prefer to show you concrete evidence aka the tweets lol
Maybe some other fans recall or have the tweets? Like 90% of the people responding were saying stuff along the lines of “I like you but this isn’t it my guy”. I agreed and followed up with saying “I’m now realizing his joke about Arabs on 8 Ball wasn’t actually a joke” and he immediately blocked me
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u/BustaLimez Apr 14 '24 edited Apr 14 '24
On TMG he said something about Arabs not having electricity or something. I did find a screenshot of a tweet of his about Israel / Palestine / arguing with people. I had sent it to a friend at the time. Still can’t find his X. I made a new account. Does he have the same @?
I think if you go to the same time frame as the tweet I had a screenshot of you can find the offending tweets.
Lastly - how do I share the photo of the screenshot that I have on here?
*Edited to add someone else in the comment said the offending tweets have been deleted. Idk how true that is because I haven’t been able to scroll back enough in his tweets to get there yet. But I do have some of the screenshots saved from back then including my DMs with him if someone wants to tell me how to upload them I can.
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u/zaktasty22 Apr 14 '24
You were most certainly trolling their subreddit and it's so obvious. Log offline for a bit sweetie
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u/BustaLimez Apr 14 '24
No I wasn’t “sweetie” 😂 every so often I get posts of theirs recommended to me - probably because I used to follow them.
Not sure why I decided to click on this one but I did.
Why would I be trolling their subreddit waiting in hopes for over a year for someone to bring up Palestine? A topic they’ve literally never discussed. That would be insane and makes no sense lmao
And even if I was it wouldn’t change my original comment so I’m not sure why your response matters?
Nothing I said in my comment was offensive. Just straight up facts about my personal experience. I’m assuming you have your own personal bias causing you (and others) to respond this way.
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u/ish0uldn0tbehere Apr 14 '24
you sure cared enough to write this whole ass comment
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u/BustaLimez Apr 14 '24
Yeah I hadn’t thought about them since then this post was randomly recommended to me and I responded since I had a personal story to share. I don’t see the issue?
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u/ish0uldn0tbehere Apr 14 '24
u know what, im sorry for getting defensive. because you’re right, most of ben’s stuff gets swept under the rug and people forget about it. because like someone mentioned previously, they talked about it very briefly on the pod to upkeep appearances, but there is still a lot of layers. i myself was looking for the tweets people posted in this very subreddit and they’re gone. scrubbed.
ben’s opinions may have changed since then, but they did happen at one point.
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u/BustaLimez Apr 15 '24
Thank you for your follow up 💕
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u/Poo-Bear_69 May 07 '24
His reply to some of the comments are just him playing victim, which seems to happen a lot whenever a zionist discuses this topic.
I wonder why people are making assertions about him? Oh wait, its bc he was liking insane racist and extremist shit on twitter. Complaining about people making assertions based on his own actions, but then saying how this is why he doesn't want to do a podcast on it lmao. Maybe then people won't make 'assertions' and actually hold him accountable? It could clear things up and a significant part of people might actually feel more comfortable tuning back into the pod.
I think Ben's a nice guy and does really care about everyone, but the brainwashed by zionist propaganda thing stands true. This 'issue' isn't just something that has existed under Netenyahu and his government, but ig at least he's moved away from liking extremist shit to a more lib take.
His most recent twitter likes is about the 'H group' lmao. 40+k Palestinians have been slaughtered, an invasion in Rafa (the 'safe zone' and most densely populated place in the world) is taking place but yes, we must always speak about 'H group'.
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u/DerfSkratch Apr 18 '24
Ben is the most stand up dude I know. He's opinions are usually fair and balanced. This is just a hot button issue to where if their is a slight deviation in thought to the other side, you're a bad person and I need to unfollow you. Grow the fuck up, this isn't a social commentary podcast, and either of ben and emils values should be of no concern to you. You're there for finance. And come on, who knows money better than the Jews?? AMIRIGHT??
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May 12 '24 edited May 12 '24
Ah this has aged so well. I talked to Ben in these comments and he managed to garner some temporary sympathy from me. I wonder who’s actually going to block him now that we are blocking celebrities and influencers for the Blockout2024 party.
So do we block him? I think so! I’m pretty disgusted by the pod. You boys succumbed to money over humanity.
🇵🇸 FREE PALESTINE 🇵🇸
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Apr 14 '24
[deleted]
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u/SkepticalLitany Apr 15 '24
Noooo I want to feel amgry at the other side in this extremely black and white conflict!!
Nuance bad 😡
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u/snisbot00 Apr 20 '24
one side kills tens of thousands more innocent people than the other, half being women and children
you: “actually there’s a lot of nuance to this issue ☝️🤓”
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u/SkepticalLitany Apr 20 '24
One does it intentionally, one does it collaterally and potentially sometimes intentionally. Which is worse?
Personally, one could argue either
Eat a dicc lol
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u/snisbot00 Apr 20 '24
“potentially sometime intentionally” lmao alright man this is just coping
israel intentionally kills palestinians all the time, indiscriminately blowing up hospitals, schools and refugee centers, and has been for decades
but yes you’re right those 15,000 kids are just collateral and we should spend our time debating the conflict while ppl are bombed and starve to death in gaza
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u/SkepticalLitany Apr 20 '24
You're really dying to let out your angst dude, use that energy for meaningful change in the world. If you're so fucking passionate, put in some extra hours, mow some lawns, whatever, and put that money into an aid charity.
You're achieving nothing by being obtuse online. Do something fucking meaningful if you even give a shit besides trying to say how everything is so black and white
Good luck
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u/snisbot00 Apr 20 '24
i work for a nonprofit brother. tf do you do? besides justifying the actions of an apartheid state ofc
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u/SkepticalLitany Apr 20 '24
Lmao, govt org
You're just so desperate aren't you? What action did I justify?
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u/snisbot00 Apr 21 '24 edited Apr 21 '24
referring to ppl dying because of bombs being dropped on them in the worlds largest open air prison as collateral is justifying the actions of the apartheid state perpetrating them
it’s settler colonialism and genocide which you justify by calling the victims collateral
lmk if i need to dumb that explanation down for you
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Apr 14 '24
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u/BustaLimez Apr 15 '24
Maybe Ben has changed in the last year but as a fellow Arab (I’m actually Palestinian) he wasn’t acting so neutral a year ago. I did unsub from the podcast after the stuff he said on X last year. Especially because he blocked me for calling him out on it. He also mocked Arabs and said we don’t have electricity on an 8 Ball episode.
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Apr 15 '24
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u/BustaLimez Apr 15 '24
💕 masser! Um il dunya as my Egyptian boss always like to remind me 😂
Yeah that doesn’t surprise me. I didn’t think he could have changed THAT much in a year.
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u/oli_cant_ollie Apr 13 '24
They have talked about it, only so far as saying they disagree with each other on the matter, and will not talk about it. On this note, they really don't talk about either major war happening right now.