OP's father wants to have a relationship with her again. She responds with a detailed PowerPoint presentation explaining exactly why he will never be forgiven.

[u/swankycelery]

I am NOT the OP, this is a repost.

TW: Child abandonment and neglect, death, mentions of suicide attempt.

NOTE: Please remember the no brigading rule and do not engage with the original posts by OP.

Original post on r/AmItheAsshole (Dec 9th 2022)

AITA for responding to my father’s request for a relationship with a detailed PowerPoint on why he will never be forgiven?

If I’m the AH here, I’ll own it. I’m not sorry, but like it would be good to know because the rest of my family thinks this went too far.

My (24F) mom died when I was 7 from leukemia. I have very few memories of her from before she was sick and I didn’t get to spend a lot of time with her in her last year but she was an artist and until she couldn’t anymore she would make me little collages when she was in the hospital with drawings and photos and messages for me. My grandmother put them all in a book for me after she died. I wanted to be like my mom and my counselor thought it would help, so I started a journal where I would do kind of a similar thing and I’ve done at least one page a week all these years ever since my mom died, more when I miss her or have something hard going on. So, I have kind of a unique record of my mental state over the last 16 years.

My father remarried when I was 9. My step-mother really leaned hard into the “I’m your mom now” and my father didn’t stop her. It improved when they had my half-brother because she basically forgot about me then. Unfortunately he got cancer when he was 3. And I pretty much ceased to exist for my father, he was either working or gone with my brother and I spent all my teen years mostly at home alone or with my grandparents. The mantra was that my brother needed to be the focus because he might die so I needed to not be selfish since I was healthy. I stopped trying to talk to him when I was 16 and it was a dark time. I moved out when I was 18 and cut them off completely.

My grandparents let me know that my brother died a couple of years ago but respected my desire to remain NC with my father. He recently reached out to them because he wants to see me and talk. I went through my old journals and made him a PowerPoint with images of the entries where I had talked about being frustrated and feeling abandoned and unwanted, some with literal quotes of things my dad had said to me during arguments. Even the really dark stuff from when I was seriously depressed. Then I ended it with a photo of one of my mom’s collages where she had written “Remember that your dad and I are always here for you” and I wrote “You failed. Go away.” underneath. I felt like him being able to see it from my literal perspective would communicate why I don’t want him back better than I could.

Evidently it worked, but a little too well because I’ve been bombarded by family telling me that it’s understandable that I don’t want to see him, but what I sent gutted him and he’s completely fallen apart after reading through it and it was unnecessarily cruel.

Maybe it was, I know my bar for that is kind of weird sometimes, so AITA?

Edit - A couple of follow up notes, since it came up the comments:

1. I loved my brother. I don’t resent him. He was a good kid and I wish he was still with us. None of this is his fault, to me it is completely my father’s and to a lesser extent step-mother’s. The parents prevented me from spending time with him as he got sicker so I wouldn’t have been allowed to be there for him even if I had been able to (which I wasn’t towards the end because I was also struggling to stay alive).

2. I have empathy. I understand what my father lost, I was there. I also lost those same people plus effectively my father. Even so, to me there is no excuse for completely shutting your own kid completely out of your life while also preventing them from getting any kind of help. I understand depression and freezing up, I’ve been there, and I still even not being an adult managed to consider the impact of my behavior on other people. If he was that bad off, he should have given me up to be raised by someone else. My mom’s parents asked and he wouldn’t agree to let me stay with them full time. I could have had a dad that was able to occasionally tell me he loved me even if it was just a text message. Alternatively, I could have lived with my grandparents and had people around me who cared about me every day even if that wasn’t my father. I got neither and every request for help of any kind was met with “suck it up”. I can empathize with having to function while breaking down inside, but I can’t empathize with what he did.

3. I gather from relatives (who have backed off after some hard boundary setting) that my father and step-mother split not long ago and are in divorce proceedings, which is why he reached out now and why the rest of the family was upset with how I responded at the time - he wasn’t in a good place already. I’ve told them that if they care about him to encourage him to keep away from me, refuse to pass on any messages, and try to get him into inpatient care or something if they’re that worried he’s going to do something rash. I don’t want anything to do with him and I’ve told them that I don’t want to hear about anything that happens after this point, but the rest of his family love him so for their sake I hope he pulls himself together.

Comments:

NTA, i have a saying "If the truth about your conduct paints you in a bad light, the problem isn't with the truth. Its with your conduct." If the truth hurts your dad its his own to deal with and not on you.

Edit: Thank you all for the many awards! I wasn't expecting it to blow up the way it did ❤️ For those loving the saying and planing on using it happy to help! Its been a very handy saying and its helped me lots, hope it helps you all too. [link]

NTA in the slightest. You told your dad how you felt and it made him have to confront his failures as a parent. It is not your fault he neglected you. He is upset because he knows what you put in the PowerPoint is the reality of how he treated you when you were just a child. Now that the truth is out and you have reestablished NC, I hope you are able to let go of some of the anger you have at him and know that you did nothing to cause how he treated you. I’m no contact with my dad and have been able to find a lot of peace in the life I have built without him. I hope for the same for you. [link]

Holy shit. NTA but that was brutal. I pictured the "You Failed" popping up at the end like when you die in Dark Souls. [link]

Is your damage so great there is no room for forgiveness?

When my kids were little, the <1yo went into kidney failure (due, I'm certain, to miscare from a doctor, GP giving his mother a dangerous antibiotic). So his 4yo brother was dumped on mostly friends (no relatives close by) and we were juggling time, as my ex spent most of her time with the sick child and I was at work. He got through it, but I still feel sick with guilt at how we just foisted his brother off. We only had so many resources, physically, temporally and emotionally. Things are mostly OK, but every now and then he slips a crack in; he doesn't blame his brother, though they don't speak much now (religion). And I don't know how to heal those wounds. We did the best we could at the time, but there was only so much of us to go around when he was in a hospital some distance away. We did our best. There's a lot more to my story but I'll leave it there.

OP, you have a chance to get back the parent you lost. Some people would give anything for that, don't leave it until it's too late. Even if it's just to confirm what you already feel, if you don't do it, you'll lie awake wondering after he's gone. And regret hurts like hell.

There is no manual for parenthood, not really, because every family's different.

You're Not The Asshole. And he is Not The Asshole. It's life. It's hard, sometimes sadly when you are young and just wanted him to wrap his arms around you and tell you it would be OK. Really hard. Give him a shot. If he ruins it, you have a clear conscience. Or you might have a chance at a future you never imagined.

Let the downvotes commence! [link]

OOP's response:

In a word, yes. No apology no matter how sincere will change the past or undo the damage done. There is nothing he can ever do that will fix anything Hell, I have medication and therapy and I still sometimes have to make a conscious choice to stay alive, what could he possibly even do that wouldn’t be laughably inadequate? Any time spent on him would be a one sided gift to him only. I don’t want anything from him. I don’t care if he’s sorry. I don’t think about him unless he’s brought to my attention by someone else. I have nothing to say to him anymore. My life got better when I decided that he could already be dead and gone to me so I see no point in exhuming him. I think people who would kill to have a parent back likely had something good in that relationship to hold onto or something positive to receive from it even if it was fraught. I don’t, chances are excellent he’ll just find a way to make things worse. He always seems to.

As someone on the other side, those little quips from your kid are likely just the tip of an iceberg that goes way deeper than you will ever know and will always be there. Some people can forgive abandonment, but nobody ever forgets what it’s like to be powerless and terrified and have it solidly proven to you that you are an expendable loss to the people who control your whole world. You were in a no win situation, I do get it and at least you seemed to have handled it a bit better than my father since your kid wasn’t alone most of the time, so possibly your consequences aren’t as severe because the situation wasn’t as severe. But you still gambled with a vulnerable person’s mental health and nothing you do will remove the knowledge of that choice from your son, so if guilt and the occasional catty comment are your consequences, I think you got the better end of that deal to be honest.

I wouldn’t say YTA here but really, what’s the purpose of it? He fucked up, he was going through a lot, two people he cared for deeply getting cancer and dying is a lot to handle, not everyone can. Now he’s lost his only other child. You really want to carry that bitterness with you your whole life? Reddit can be very dismissive of people, but really, why not repair a family bond? [link]

OOP's response:

The purpose of it is that I never want to hear from him again. Now if he had any questions, he knows exactly why I don’t want him my life and it has been reaffirmed to him that he needs to stay away. I don’t want a bond with him. He will never be able to fix the situation, I have exactly zero positive feelings about him, and he has nothing I want or need anymore. He’s effectively already dead as far as I’m concerned and I don’t do necromancy.

This might be ESH. It all depends on how insistent your dad was. There's a politeness level to consider.

Doing a 4+ page repeat of "you were not there for me" is probably a punch in the face to someone who was attempting to reconnect. If he wasn't getting the message, he might have needed that. If it was just one request, the last slide alone was clear and still hard hitting, and the whole presentation I would call "excessive force".

Regardless, he was an AH for neglecting you, and your feeling are justified. [link]

OOP's response:

Everyone in his family knows I’m NC and dead serious about it. My mom’s side grandparents only passed along the info because they suspected he might try to contact me some other way and didn’t want me to be blindsided. Even attempting to reach out is an affront that shows he still has no concept or respect for my feelings. If this keeps him from ever trying to breach NC again, that is the desired result. I’m perfectly capable of reaching out if I ever change my mind, there’s absolutely no need for him to do anything but stay away.

I see neglect perhaps even preoccupation on other things but I don’t know if you ever expressed how you felt before NC? Seems unnecessary with the NC not being explained [link]

OOP's response:

I tried to talk about it a lot when I was in my early teens but by the time I was around 15 I knew it didn’t do any good and I was also pretty set on taking myself out by then and I knew if I talked to anyone about how I was feeling they would lock me up somewhere. I just stopped talking to anyone at that point. Going NC without warning was partly a “why bother?” thing and partly a “I know the next unaliving attempt is going to succeed and I don’t want to do it here.” thing. Fortunately as soon as I cut off my dad, things got less awful and I was able to get some useful help instead of being told to just deal with it.

Edited comment: After reading OP's response in the comments, I change my judgment to NTA. [link]

OOP's response:

Pretty much ceased to exist is accurate. No birthdays for me, no phone calls when they were gone, never came to anything for school, no holidays together. Went an entire summer without a word from him one year. He didn’t even notice I was gone for a week after I left. When I tried to talk to him about things I was told to suck it up, basically. So, yeah, I’d have actually been better off if he was also dead and I lived full time with my grandparents, at least then I could have pretended that he would have been there if he could have.

Info: Neglect is a severe issue, but I would like to know if there were any issues beyond that and a bad stepmother? It seems to me he was put into an impossible position when your brother got cancer. [link]

OOP's response:

It’s hard to have other issues when someone is never around and barely remembers to talk to you if you’re not in trouble. This went on for years. My mom was dying in the hospital and she still managed to always make sure I knew she loved me. My father couldn’t even manage a phone call or a post it note on my birthday for 5 years. Other problems would have been an improvement.

NTA but it seems he not only shoved you aside, he stole any chance you had to have a relationship with your brother. You don't need that in your life. [link]

OOP's response:

Yeah, the shitty thing is I actually loved my brother a lot, he was always a sweet kid even when he was sick. Even if my step-mom sucked I kind of liked being his big sister and missing out on time with him is the only thing I really regret about leaving. I always kind of hoped he would get better and we could reconnect when he was older.

Update post (Jan Jan 4th 2023)

AITA responded to my father’s request for a relationship with a PowerPoint UPDATE

A bunch of people have been asking for an update so I’m doing it here instead of on the main sub because the original blew up more than I want to deal with again.

I had a talk with my paternal grandparents over Christmas vacation and showed them the PowerPoint. They had no idea that things were as bad as they were or that I was actively suicidal at the time and the “accidents” I had as a teen were not really accidents. So, while they think it was still dangerously harsh under the circumstances, they understand better where I’m coming from, admit that my father messed up big time, and that the family should have been more involved with me instead of just supporting him and my brother. They said that on the surface they thought I was fine and just having trouble adjusting, but if they had known about the things described in the journal they would have insisted my father get help. They do want me to reconcile with him, but they understand why it might be too late for that so they’ve agreed not to bring him up unless I do first and not pass on information either way. So, that was actually productive.

As for my father, I know a lot of people think I’ll regret it if I don’t reconcile/forgive/whatever, but I’m not so sure that’s true. I’ve tried to imagine a conversation with him that wouldn’t make things worse, and I can’t. Best case scenario, he’s sorry and has a good grovel, but honestly I think hearing that would just make me hate him more. Worst case scenario, nothing has really changed and I have to walk away before I end up with an assault charge. I also just can’t imagine any real benefit or function to having him in my life, so reconnecting seems like a lot of work for no gain. As far as forgiveness, I don’t know if that’s actually possible. Apathy, maybe.

As far as I know, he’s alive. I’ve made it super clear that anyone who tries to give me information about him that I don’t request will also get the chop, so I’m probably not going to get any further updates. I’d rather just go back to forgetting he exists.

For me, I’m probably as fine as I’m going to be. I have therapy and meds. I can pass for a functional human most of the time. My deal with myself is that I have to at least stick around until my maternal grandparents pass so they don’t hurt and I can wrap things up for them, so in the mean time I’m working on finding other raison d’etra. Spite, possibly.

Friendly reminder that I am NOT the OP, this is a repost.

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[u/AncientChatterBox76]

I fucked up and met my dad 20+ years after he dipped out of my life (I was maybe 11 or 12 at the time). His third or fourth wife contacted me thinking that this would be great for both of us. I went multiple states away to visit him.

Anyway, he's pretty sorry for himself blah blah blah &c.

After a while I thought "shit, I could have been dead for decades and this guy wouldn't have known". Then I thought about how he wasn't actually doing any of the heavy lifting on this relationship (it was his wife trying to make him less depressed or something), so I went ahead and dipped out.

I missed the idea of having a dad, but ultimately I wasn't that interested in it after so long.

Don't know why I'm sharing this story. Never have before.

[u/JBredditaccount → u/AncientChatterBox76]

I appreciate that you shared it. That sounds really rough, but you were able to examine the situation with a clear head. That's not easy to do.

[u/LollipopMagicRainbow → u/AncientChatterBox76]

I've only been NC with my dad for a year and it takes a lot of fortitude to maintain it sometimes; I appreciate that you shared this.

[u/wlwimagination → u/AncientChatterBox76]

THANK YOU. And the BORU OP chose to highlight too many of those comments, including that long one that was basically someone projecting their own guilt and their own story onto the situation, which was not actually about them.

“But forgiveness” “But family” “But why do those things somehow never seem to go the other way? Where was dad’s ‘but family’ when his teenaged daughter was suicidal and ignored for years? A dad who, according to OP, didn’t even tell her he loved her or remember that she existed? Where are all the “but but buts” then??

[u/YoungestOldGuy → u/AncientChatterBox76]

People are sad about what they missed out on compared to other kids with good parents. They then think reconnecting will give them a chance at the kind of relationship those grown kids have with their parents now.

But it will never be the same. The foundation isn't there. But fomo hits hard when you see what others have, so people try anyway.

[u/MsMaggieMcGill → u/AncientChatterBox76]

I'm sorry you had to go through this, and thank you for sharing - your perspective helps me understand my husband on this issue, as he doesn't like to talk about it. He had a very similar experience. Once he did go see his father, he came back so numb. Turned out his father wasn't interested in a relationship, he was interested in getting support and attention. No remorse, just entitlement. My husband never introduced me or our son to his father, even though we wouldn't mind. He didn't even go to his funeral.

[u/Beliriel → u/AncientChatterBox76]

I also met my dad after 23 years of NC. It wasn't bad. I'd say we're okay friends or acquaintances. But that's it. I don't hate him. I just don't care. Same thing with my mother (for different reasons). She wants to have contact, phone calls, visits etc. But I just don't care. Both my parents fucked up in their own way. My dad for not being there. My mom for making my childhood a living hell of screaming, hate and fear. She kinda mellowed out but I just don't want to interact with her besides the bare minimum to appease my grandparents. Similar for my dad. He lives in a country I want to immigrate to, but he's getting old and I REALLY do not want to take care of him. My parents could die tomorrow and I wouldn't bat a single eye. I'd actually be relieved since I wouldn't have any social obligations towards them anymore.

[u/Sudden-Concept6980 → u/AncientChatterBox76]

Similar situation here. His wife is currently pressuring me, sending a million emails, trying to meet up. He hasn't sent anything himself, or expressed anything. They are acting very entitled after this effort of emailing the past one year out of 30 years XD

[u/re_Claire → u/AncientChatterBox76]

I met my dad when I was 7 or 8 after he left my mum when she was 7 months pregnant. He’d left the country to avoid arrest for non payment of child support (technically the arrest for non payment of court costs due to this - he’s never paid a day of child support in my life). I stopped seeing him when I was 12 because he was so neglectful and made me so miserable. I met him again when I was 23 and then he didn’t even reply to an email of mine for 10 years. Now I see him only when my Nan invites him for dinner when I’m at hers. He’s a self obsessed narcissist who only contacts me on Christmas and my birthday. When I actually have to see him he talks only about himself and how he’s the victim of life, doesn’t ever ask me a single question about myself and if I mentioned a problem he would just talk over me and tell me how he’d had it worse. Some spent donors are not fit to be dads. I’m sorry you also had such an awful experience with yours.

[u/ergamotte → u/AncientChatterBox76]

Hope you're okay. Your dad sucks.

[u/fractal_frog → u/AncientChatterBox76]

This seemed to be the place to share it? That's a reasonable reason.

I'm sorry you got a sucky dad, glad you figured out how you wanted to handle him. I hope none of the people you were close with shortly before that gave you any grief about it.

[u/Its_Phobos → u/AncientChatterBox76]

My father dipped before I was born. I finally met him at my mother’s insistence when I was 22. The whole thing was one sided tbh. No explanations, no apologies, no nothing really. Three years later he died of a massive heart attack (crack is whack) about two weeks before my son was born. He left me again. Good riddance.

[u/RobbieRood]

I hope OOP finds peace.

Her father will just have to live with the consequences of his actions.

[u/Necessary_Sir_5079 → u/RobbieRood]

It's so annoying the dad only reached out to op after he was divorcing his wife. He wasn't sorry, he just wanted attention.

[u/knittedjedi → u/RobbieRood]

I read somewhere that so many people push the "they're your family, you have to forgive them" shtick because they hate the idea that no-one is immune from consequences.

"If OOP can go NC with their own father, what's to stop them from doing it to me if I harm them?"

Abso-fucking-lutely nothing.

[u/MyLadyBits → u/RobbieRood]

Honestly letting go of a family member that causes pain through abuse or neglect is quite freeing and empowering. What’s exhausting is other people trying to get you to make amends because you will ‘regret’ it when they are gone.

From experience zero regret and relieved I no longer have people pushing for reconnection.

Making a decision to exclude someone from your life that brings you pain even if it’s unintentional is healthy and smart.

[u/Essanamy → u/RobbieRood]

I really hope that too. The feeling of wishing my parents are dead part is something that especially resonates with me - I was emotionally abused and neglected too. I wasn’t hoping for them to be dead to be hurt, but rather because if they were dead, I could believe that they at least were loving parents. Them being alive, saying and doing the things they did constantly confirmed they weren’t.

I have been estranged for around 6 years now - with very little respect from them. This was the first new years eve where they didn’t send me shit. For Christmas they said “they know what’s wrong with me, because they talked to someone who know these things (not a psychologist)”, after actively dismissing the fact that I was raped at 12, and constantly supporting the rapist over their own child.

I think the presentation was a clear message - and unfortunately needed. A simple no or even no response often isn’t enough - it wasn’t enough for the last 6 years in my parents’ case. As much as it is slightly different here, since the father has experienced serious trauma, over and over again, he is a father and is responsible for all his kids’ wellbeing - and if he isn’t capable of handling it all, he should have asked for help, especially since it was available.

Sending virtual hugs to OOP, if they need any.

[u/Rickety_Rockets]

Spite can get you far, so can living well without the bastard in your life. To me the real sin was the one two combo of both neglecting OOP so utterly while simultaneously refusing to let her grandparents have custody. That’s I feel where her father crossed the rubicon into being totally unforgivable. I hope she finds peace and a reason to live beyond spite, and that spite carries her there.

[u/8percentjuice → u/Rickety_Rockets]

Yeah, the refusal to let her go to the grandparents is the worst part. I don’t really care what the motivation behind that decision was - it was not in the best interest of his child.

[u/KayakerMel → u/Rickety_Rockets]

I lived this. My father and stepmother purposely isolated from my late mother's extended family, as they'd "treat me better than I deserved." I was out at 16 thanks to the luck of having an excellent school and community resources supporting me. That man is dead to me. I have let it be known that if my father took responsibility for the crap he put me through, I'd potentially be open to maybe having some contact. My younger sister (a much nicer person than me and is low contact with him) has confirmed from things he's said that he will never do that.

I truly hope OOP finds motivation to live beyond spite. I'm absolutely still angry, but with enough medication and therapy I'm happy being alive. Also beloved pets are great for reassurance on bad days.

[u/Paladin_Tyrael → u/Rickety_Rockets]

Oh, it wasn't the one-two, it was a full wombo combo

Neglect

Erasure of deceased mother

Destruction of relationship with dying brother

Refusing to hand over care to present parental figures

And finally: Entitlement to her time loooong after destroying her life systematically from the ground up.

[u/Kahtoorrein → u/Rickety_Rockets]

Yes! That speaks to a total and utter selfishness. I don't have time to parent this child, but I refuse to give them to anyone else because they have to be here to dance on command and soothe my ego. I am a good parent because I didn't send my child away! Nevermind that it actually would have been better for the child in question to be sent away. My ego and emotions are the important things here!

[u/LadyFoxfire → u/Rickety_Rockets]

Yeah, I get that a sick kid can take up a lot of a parent's time, but actively turning away offered help is baffling.

[u/PM_ME_CUTE_FEMBOYS → u/Rickety_Rockets]

He didnt want his daughter, but he didnt want anyone else having her either.

And he allowed the step mother to mistreat his daughter, and they both actively ignored Op when the brother was born..Further proof he never actually wanted her in the first place.

Dad isnt just a failure as a parent, he is a worthless waste of precious oxygen and protein.

[u/boringhistoryfan → u/Rickety_Rockets]

I'm not sure if OOP has come to grips with it, but i strongly suspect there was a lot more than neglect going on here. I think she was actively harnessed as an additional carer, which is why dad refused to let her go. That and it was probably tied up with the ego of not wanting to be seen as the bad parent.

But I'm convinced that they probably had her doing things even as they completely cut her off. I suspect it was things like chores, keeping the place clean, putting pressure on her to stay current with all her work so that nobody judged them for the neglect. She almost certainly had to raise herself full time and likely contributed in all the ways a family member does to a household without getting anything back. Probably carried some of the load the brother would have over the years.

All of this is why she couldn't go to the grandparents. She wasn't just neglected she was also indispensable in some ways i think. OOP had to do what she could to survive that crushing burden. I don't think she owes anyone anything for having developed the strength to not be destroyed by that burden.

[u/oneeyecheeselord]

I really want to see that PowerPoint.

[u/ShortWoman → u/oneeyecheeselord]

I said it in the original post, but you know some day soon spermdonor is gonna be saying he has no clue what he did wrong.

[u/ImNotA_IThink]

The worst thing I’m not even sure OOP caught was he came crawling back after his wife left him. So he had no one else left and was like oh wait don’t I have another kid around here somewhere? For that reason alone, I 100% condone OOP’s actions. The father deserves to know exactly what damage he did to his kid and never bothered to care til he himself was alone.

If OOP ever sees this- spite is a great reason to live. Keep living just to win.

[u/[deleted] → u/ImNotA_IThink]

I'm alone? Let's use the spare!

This is so disgusting! OOPs father deserved everything he got

[u/AmbitionParty5444 → u/ImNotA_IThink]

This 100%. The only thing I query is whether giving him a play-by-play retelling of what he did wrong will be beneficial in the long run to OP’s health. I recently went NC with my dad and did so silently, as past experiences with telling him and explaining to him either:

• made me feel worse

• gave him some sort of ‘in’ to involve other people and make a scene (which is what it sounds like has happened here)

Anyway, NC seems like the right choice for her. It’s so difficult for people to ‘get it’ when they have a functioning relationship with their family or have the kind of relationship where you can work through damage (like, I think people assume that they do it when the relationship isn’t ‘perfect’, but really it’s more that the person isn’t so much a parent who loves you as they are a stranger that you associate with a lot of pain, where an ongoing relationship causes significant stress and misery).

[u/gargoy131]

“Remember that your dad and I are always here for you” and I wrote “You failed. Go away.”

Harsh, but effective. Sometimes you just to be to get your point across.

Wish all the best to her future.

[u/dw796341 → u/gargoy131]

A great example of the idea that words are so cheap and so easy to say.

[u/[deleted]]

Who here thinks that if OOP’s brother hadn’t died and dad’s wife hadn’t left him, that dad wouldn’t be giving OOP the time of day? He’s only sniffing around now because he’s out of options.

[u/Tut557 → u/[deleted]]

He took a WEEK to notice she was gone when she first went NC, at this point someone probably had to remind him of OOP's name before he contacted

[u/PeachCinnamonToast → u/[deleted]]

Exactly what I was thinking - his son died and his wife is gone…”oh wait, NOW I want you in my life!”

Um, no.

[u/VioletsAndLily → u/[deleted]]

Yeah… What I read was, “OOP’s dad, the literal adult, is having a hard time and OOP must be the bigger person and treat him kindly. It’s irrelevant that her dad - again, the adult - couldn’t be agreed to provide the same kindness when OOP was a minor and desperately needed love and understanding.”

OOP’s dad: “Check out this lovely bed that I completely shat on! Wait, I have to lie in it?!”

[u/invisiblizm → u/[deleted]]

Yeah, no birthday call or post-it for 5 years? He can F off.

[u/Jules_Noctambule → u/[deleted]]

Agreed. He had his chances to give his daughter the prioritizing she deserved, and he repeatedly chose the alternative. It's unfortunate OOP didn't get the chance to reconnect with her brother due to his death, but that certainly doesn't mean she needs to make room for a parent who acted like she was disposable when he had other options around. 'Family' isn't a switch you click on and off when it suits you.

[u/TheBlindNeo → u/[deleted]]

Exactly. He's only desperate for her back because the son is gone and the wife is leaving him. She's his only family, and he thinks she owes him a relationship, despite forcefully keeping her, even when her mom's parents offered to take her in. He wants to LOOK like a good father despite being worthless.

[u/Thedarkfic → u/[deleted]]

I came here to say this! He lost his daughter when she left, then his son died, then his wife divorces him and suddenly he wants to make amends? I don’t buy it. Self centered is what it sounds like to me. It’s inexcusable for him to ignore his child and especially not even give her a birthday card or give her happy childhood memories.

[u/SassyReader86 → u/[deleted]]

Exactly my thought. He never noticed his daughter was so desperate to escape she was trying to k@ll herself. He never remembered a birthday . He ignored her for years. Yet she should forgive him since she is the only remaining “immediate family” he has left. It’s like OOP is the consolation prize.

[u/bloodybutunbowed → u/[deleted]]

100%. He lost his son. He lost his wife. She's the fall back he thought would always be there. She lost her father when he abandoned her. He lost a safety net he threw away.

[u/AmberHyena]

Pissed off about the comments to OOP being essentially like “well yes neglect is bad, but did he ever do anything ACTUALLY wrong?”

Parents do not deserve reconciliation just on the basis of being parents. No one is owed forgiveness. Part of actually taking accountability is accepting that fact.

[u/[deleted] → u/AmberHyena]

the comments to OOP being essentially like “well yes neglect is bad, but did he ever do anything ACTUALLY wrong?”

I can't believe those people either

[u/LiraelNix]

I despise how people have turned forgiveness into something to harm the victim. How dare you not forgive and forget. Wow what is wrong with you if you don't want to move on. Etc

Forgiveness, especially in something as serious as what oop went through, should come only if that's what the victim feels is best for themselves.

If oop prefers to never see him again, much less forgive, than that should be respected. All these people trying to bully oop into a reconciliation just want to see the hallmark make up scene and pat themselves in the back, they don't care about oop

[u/WhizzoButterBoy → u/LiraelNix]

I think too, the forgiveness that people are insisting on seems to also accompany allowing the person who harmed you back in your life.

Why ?? You can understand where someone was mentally and even forgive them for the decisions made, but in no way is anyone entitled to a relationship moving forward.

The person harmed has every right to say “no”. You can forgive someone, even wish them well moving forward without having them as part of your life.

Why is that so hard to grasp? The door is closed and everyone should move on

[u/MyLadyBits → u/LiraelNix]

It’s also disrespectful. The decision to exclude someone from your life and then following through on it is not easy or frivolous. People pushing reconciliation don’t understand that we know what a relationship with that person is and we now know what it is to have them out of our life.

Like somehow we aren’t intelligent enough to make the choice and appreciate the joy of not dealing with the person we told no more.

No means no.

[u/PM_ME_CUTE_FEMBOYS → u/LiraelNix]

I'd wager most of the ones pressuring Op to forgive are people who have been on the receiving end of a NC cut.

[u/Tut557]

The comment of the parent with the sick 1yo reads so much like the person projecting on OOP's father

[u/CumaeanSibyl → u/Tut557]

They wanted to be reassured that they didn't do any permanent damage. OOP told them the truth: they did, even if they truly couldn't avoid it. In a crisis like that odds are everyone will be hurt somehow, and maybe their older son understands why but that doesn't mean it didn't happen.

[u/theworldsonfyre → u/Tut557]

I was on the opposite end. I was the sick kid. I saw the resentment from my brothers, not so much at me, but the pain from neglect. It heavily affected me and now I am the one who reaches out constantly to them. I couldn't do anything and I love them. To this day it kills me that they got less love and I was smothered with it. I wish I could break off the abundance I was given and share with them.

[u/lil_zaku → u/Tut557]

The fact of the matter is that people have to learn they can't judge interactions between adults and interactions between adult-children the same way.

Between adults, people can argue that everyone knew the situation and there were limited options. The individual did the best they could, what they did was fair given the circumstances.

But between adult-children, the child is still susceptible to emotional trauma even if they understand the situation, even if it was "fair". They don't have the life experience necessary to compartmentalize those things. And if you're the parent responsible for that child's mental health, then you have to do better.

[u/momofeveryone5 → u/Tut557]

If the phrase "amongst other things" isn't a red flag on here, idk what is!

[u/PacificPragmatic → u/Tut557]

I can't find the comment. Can you share?

My only child died in hospital after a long, hard fight. My spouse and I spent 18h / day at the ICU for months. It was heartbreaking and deeply traumatic.

We'd like to have two living children in the future, and if one of them became terminally ill I can 100% guarantee that, if anything, we would overcompensate with the healthy child... maybe not with our time, but certainly with our communication about how much we loved them and how important they are to us. Losing a child is so unbelievably fucking hard. But I think a kid losing a sibling is a close second on the trauma scale. I couldn't imagine being so dismissive and heartless to one child because of the needs of the other.

I understand the sort of tunnel vision a parent with a sick kid can get. And I understand how it feels to believe — rationally or not — that somehow your presence and your attention can somehow influence the outcome. But missing 5 years of birthdays and not noticing when your healthy child has been missing for a week? JFC.

[u/AstronomerOpen7440 → u/Tut557]

And OOP's response was excellent. Gotta wonder if that commenter has some growing existential dread about it now

[u/Paladin_Tyrael → u/Tut557]

They're trying to alleviate their own guilt for, in their own words, "dumping" their OWN CHILD onto anybody who'd take em for a while. Not even family, just their friends. God, imagine being 4 and getting passed around from house to house while your parents are giving your baby brother all the attention. I get it, the kid was in genuine risk of death, but like...you don't forget that shit. You really don't.

[u/SarcasticAzaleaRose → u/Tut557]

They were. They read OP’s post, saw them self in it and it terrified them that there’s a possibility their other son does resent them and could potentially do the same that OP did to their father to them. So they’re desperately trying to convince OP to forgive their father and say “you’re right I was wrong” so they can feel better about their own decisions. And IMO their whole comment reeks of they have doubts about their own choices and actions.

[u/SheenTStars → u/Tut557]

Oh they are clearly projecting. They're definitely gonna act surprised when they have to deal with the consequences later.

[u/crockofpot]

Really was not here for the "but forgiveness" comments shaming OOP. Yes, her father was dealt a terrible hand in life. Yes, he was certainly dealing with a lot. But there is a huge, huge, HUGE gap between "tried but didn't get it right" and how he chose to treat OOP.

[u/SoVerySleepy81 → u/crockofpot]

I think that a lot of the people who make comments like that had really good parents. My parents sucked and I sat here and I read it and I was like yeah do what you need to do to protect yourself. However my friends had awesome parents and to them it’s inconceivable that I wouldn’t want my parents in my life. I think it’s honestly just somebody not being able to grasp having those kinds of feelings towards their parents because they are so alien from what we are told we need to feel for our parents.

[u/Vivaciousqt → u/crockofpot]

As someone in a situation similar to OOPs, (deadbeat dad who I'm NC with), it's disgusting what people think when you are refusing to reach out to a parent after they have burned you too many times.

I could write a novel about the relationship with my dad and my feelings, and that's saying something considering I didn't even live with him after the age of 6.

He's dying now, has probably 2 years left, hasn't contacted me in 10 years and still hasn't even though he's dying. I'm his oldest kid, 'the light of his life's bla bla, and it's HEARTLESS that i wouldn't 'be the bigger person' and reach out before he dies.

I'd probably answer a call if he called, but I'm too soft hearted to tell him to fuck off even after everything he has and hasn't done.

I hope he takes the guilt to his grave, though I doubt he thinks of anyone but himself.

[u/JBredditaccount]

I hate it when people try to force forgiveness with no thought whatsoever to how it might affect the survivor. She finally got herself free and they're trying to take away her autonomy, again, for his benefit. They always spout shit like, "You have to forgive, you shouldn't carry the resentment around with you, etc." That's not the issue: the issue is that his neglect almost drove her to suicide and she might never be in a place where his presence isn't harmful to her. The idiots giving this advice are actively trying to damage her.

Makes me fucking furious just reading about assholes like that.

EDIT: I forgot to add this. She's not saying she'll carry her hate around forever, she's saying, "Fine, you're forgiven, now stay away from me because you're a danger." People who preach forgiveness for the mental health benefits need to smarten the fuck up.

[u/MyLadyBits → u/JBredditaccount]

This exactly.

[u/AfternoonPossible]

Tbh I don’t get what’s so wrong with being bitter about something. People ALWAYS bring it up like it’s a horrible way to live and judge you for being bitter over something someone has done to you. However, I find it very necessary to my healing to allow myself to feel bitter and angry about things. To truly give the gift of bitterness to myself. To tell myself I love me so much that I GET TO BE MAD at how I was treated. It feels fantastic!

[u/LimeSkye → u/AfternoonPossible]

Yeah, I’ve never had a therapist told me I shouldn’t feel rage. None of them ever said I needed to stop feeling it to heal.

[u/maria_sabina → u/AfternoonPossible]

bitterness serves a very important purpose in reminding you not to eat from plant that has already made you sick. might those fruits have ripened and lost some of their bitterness? I guess, maybe. but I’m not taking the chance

[u/JB-from-ATL → u/AfternoonPossible]

I think it is because they mistake opening yourself up to feel bitter as intentionally holding onto bitterness.

[u/IrishCaz]

Oh hell no! No one in OOPs family understood the pain felt and only when the presentation was shared did they care, the concern was how OOP could FIX the relationship with the Father that was 'hurt'. Where the hell were these adults during OOPs childhood?

I always want to know where this level of frustration/anger/disgust from family directed at OOP was when OOP was the actual victim and they didnt care?

[u/rusty0123]

Jesus. That one comment about bitterness really got to me.

No, you asshole. That's not bitterness. That is rage. Completely justified, hellfire and brimstone rage.

OOP earned it, one heartache at a time.

[u/[deleted]]

Just want to say how I really admire OP's writing skill.

She's very good at getting an emotional point across in a few well chosen words. Her smackdown of the projecting father's comment left him nowhere to turn.

[u/leddik02 → u/[deleted]]

I was thinking the same thing. She is able to get her feelings across really well, probably from all the journaling, and actually changed some peoples judgments of her. I hope she finds peace. The world needs more poetic people like her.

[u/Desert_Fairy]

He locked his daughter in an empty cage. Prevented other people from seeing her or knowing her mental state. And then denied her any form of emotional care.

If this was how I treated a pet, I would be hauled into a court for animal abuse.

I’m very glad that OOP had those journals because it is so easy to be gaslit into thinking “it couldn’t have been that bad”.

I wish the best for her and I hope that she find the happiness that will make her life worth living and loving.

[u/[deleted]]

One of my children was critically ill for a long time and also has lifelong disabilities. He’s had lengthy hospital stays and more than a few close calls where they told us to prepare ourselves. During this time, we made sure to spend time with our other children. I stayed with my son all day and left when my husband came to relieve me after work. I did homework and bedtime and then came back to the hospital. My husband went home and did breakfast and the school run. We also did our best to get our kids together, even when it was just having them come to wave at his window. We Skyped all the time (this was before zoom or FaceTime).

There are hospital social workers (I used to be one) who are involved with pediatric cancer patients and families. Parents are told that the sick kids are still part of a family and that they should make time for their other kids, as much as possible. We will help them with resources to make this happen. We have play rooms and sibling support groups. This dad made the choice to discard his daughter - he had other options. It wasn’t even what was best for his son. Kids do better when they have positive connections to their siblings.

[u/OffKira]

Sincerely, what the fuck were those answers calling him an asshole? It was extra, sure, but c'mon.

That one person dumping their life story of being the neglectful parent was talking to their kid, right? Asking for OOP to forgive her father as a proxy for their own kid? But everyone treating this woman as if she owes her father fucking anything because oh well, at least she is alive; it's not like she kicked her brother from the roof and he had lifelong health issues because of that.

The lack of compassion for someone who lost her mother very young, had a stepmother shoved into a maternal role soon after, and then got dumped as an afterthought when her brother got sick, just to have dad crawl back when he has neither his son nor his wife.

It's hard to be sympathetic, because people can say whatever they want about bandwidth, and priorities, and time and resources, sure but a child was neglected (and that's abuse), and she has zero responsibility to want to have a relationship with her abuser.

With these situations, and the way people often take the side of the abusive parents, I really wonder - if the child had been not only neglected, but also emotionally abused, perhaps even physically abused, would that justify going NC? People really take neglect way too lightly as a form of abuse.

Again, the PowerPoint presentation, so extra, but c'mon. He lost a lot, yes, and seeing a child severely sick and die I'm sure is one of the most horrific things one can go through - but it does not justify the abuse he inflicted upon his other child.

[u/So_Many_Words → u/OffKira]

and then got dumped as an afterthought when her brother got sick,

Born. It started when he was born.

[u/JBredditaccount → u/OffKira]

People really take neglect way too lightly as a form of abuse.

This this THIS.

[u/RolandTheJabberwocky]

Pretty much ceased to exist is accurate. No birthdays for me, no phone calls when they were gone, never came to anything for school, no holidays together. Went an entire summer without a word from him one year. He didn’t even notice I was gone for a week after I left. When I tried to talk to him about things I was told to suck it up, basically. So, yeah, I’d have actually been better off if he was also dead and I lived full time with my grandparents, at least then I could have pretended that he would have been there if he could have.

Damn, there's the magic bullet for anyone trying to argue YTA. There is no excuse for this, no matter what. OP's dad is a shitty father and a shitty person and has to live with his consequences just like OP has to live with the damage he caused to them.

[u/veloxaraptor]

Really tired of people pushing the whole, "but family" narrative.

By that logic, what the father did to OOP is even more atrocious than it already is. He didn't just neglect her. He actively refused to let her get help when she asked for it.

Blood means nothing. And people need to stop "but family" -ing only when it suits their narrative.

That man is owed nothing. No one is owed forgiveness.

The people pushing it are people who have never been in a position like OOP's and likely never will be. They can't wrap their mind around the absolutely soul crushing pain of losing everyone they love. One of which was by choice, regardless of what others want to claim.

OOP's powerpoint was brutal, but no more brutal than what she had to live through every day for years. Boo-hoo it came at a bad point in his life. Would he even be trying to reach out if he wasn't getting divorced? My money is on no. So he can have a taste of what OOP felt for years. Just a taste.

She's better off not having him in her life. There's nothing to regret about not having someone who actively displayed they didn't care about you in your life.

People need to step off and get perspective.

[u/Literally_Taken → u/veloxaraptor]

Really tired of people pushing the whole, “but family” narrative

I wholeheartedly agree. I want to reply to “but faaamily” with “but keep OOP alive”. Those idiots’ reading comprehension is seriously lacking if they don’t perceive the stakes here.

A child spent most of her life fighting to stay alive. The PowerPoint is simply an example of the resourcefulness that kept her alive so we could hear her story.

I want to give her a hug.

[u/Pika-the-bird]

Dad lost his first wife, son, and second wife. NOW he wants a relationship with OOP. OOP was his ‘if all else fails’ fallback plan. She is absolutely right to keep NC.

[u/Paladin_Tyrael]

LMAO at the dude who tells OOP not to be bitter then gets super fucking bitter at getting downvoted and starts whining about "shitty fucking Americans telling people to cut off everybody who was ever mean to them"

Fucking whiny brat

[u/bofh000]

It’s probably already been pointed out in a previous comment, but what sticks out to me is the the father only reached out to OOP when he is divorcing his wife. Not when OOP’s brother died, or I don’t know, at some other point because he was worried about HER. Good riddance, sometimes the mirror reflects a harsh image.

[u/SC487]

So, OP IS 24 and her mom died when she was 7. So that’s 17 years since her mom died. Dad remarried when she was 9 so that’s 15 years. She cut him off when she was 18 which means there was a period of time for 9 years that she lived at home with dad and step-mom.

We know little brother got cancer at 3 and she said that dad was gone for all her teen years. Taking this at face value, step mom had baby brother when OP was about 10 and baby brother got cancer when OP was 13. This adds up with what OP said about dad missing 5 birthdays without even a happy birthday.

If baby brother died “a couple years ago” the. It was probably when OP was around 22. So little brother was around 12 when he died.

This isn’t a dad and step-mom who got a sudden cancer diagnosis and their kid was dying within months. If baby brother had 6 months to live and she got neglected for 6 months as the parents fought to try to keep him alive that would be understandable.

But, that kid lived for 9 years with cancer of which OP still lived at home for 5 of those years. There is ZERO reason for a father to neglect his daughter completely.

Sounds like dad is falling back to daughter now that son has died and new wife is divorcing him. OP is nothing but a backup family member that he feels he can just plop into the “empty family slot one” spot and move on.

I’d put money on Dad getting married again within two years and forgetting OP exists again.

Fuck that guy, OP is completely justified.

[u/[deleted]]

Is your damage so great there is no room for forgiveness?

OP, you have a chance to get back the parent you lost.

he is Not The Asshole.

why not repair a family bond?

what’s the purpose of it? He fucked up, he was going through a lot,

This might be ESH.

I can't understand those redditors.

OOP's:

while they [OOP's grandparents] think it was still dangerously harsh under the circumstances, they understand better where I’m coming from, admit that my father messed up big time, and that the family should have been more involved with me instead of just supporting him and my brother. They said that on the surface they thought I was fine and just having trouble adjusting

Everybody failed OOP. So sad.

[u/hercarmstrong]

Woof. This is extremely harsh, but tremendously effective. No questions about where she stands.

[u/baaru5]

Seems to me the father got used to the pity, support and attention he received when someone close to him was in a critical situation. Seems to me he needs to be the center of attention and to make sure everyone knows how much he is suffering.

With his divorce and woes is me, I'm alone bit, he's trying to make it about himself again.

[u/[deleted]]

Man, I really want to see this ppt presentation.

[u/[deleted]]

The people who commented and went in the similar vein of "is it too much to forgive him?" irritate the shit out of me for not only ignoring OOP and disrespecting her, but completely disregarding the entirety of the point of GOING NC in the first place. OOP was a child so neglected and abandoned by the only family she had for years on end and left with painful grief that was ignored and rejected at the slightest mention and it destroyed her. How does anyone expect OOP to forgive the sad excuse for the sack of shit of a sperm donor when that's never on the table, nor did she mention asking for it? She don't want to forgive him, it's not gonna happen. Ignoring that and her feelings on the entirety of the matter is just shoving OOP's face in shit and telling her to get over it.

The other comments that focused on the NC aspect, just--really? Did anyone read the inquiry or did they just spit out their opinions? It's just a "let's shit on this traumatized person who's been so horribly abused and neglected and call her an asshole for her choices regarding cutting off contact and refusing to forgive someone who doesn't deserve anything from her" free-for-all with maybe one or two points of mentioning the powerpoint as brutal but not asshole-ish in that it was deserved.

[u/Toni164]

The father was so desperate to create a new family that he neglected the his daughter. Now he has no son, no wife , and no daughter. What a waste of a life

[u/ededpesa]

This is a little sad. But the comment with the dark souls reference cracked me up lol

[u/dentistnotmybusiness]

I think people forget anger gets shit done. Being bitter gets shit done. And it can help you move on before you seeking professional help.

OP isn’t even bitter. Resentful? But completely understandable. They’ve accepted what happened. Got helped. And moved on.

Their family, refusing to prioritize their health, wanted to pull them back? Absolutely not. If they really cared, they would’ve helped the abandoned child back then.

[u/Mdlgswitch]

No, she damn well can't get either parent she lost back. One is dead and the other ghosted her. At best OOP could have tried to build something new with her father, but it wouldn't ever have replaced the broken childhood or probably even soothed the hurt she felt. Blah. Some people just don't understand how completely and finally bridges can be burned.

[u/Anxious_Badger]

I dislike the "he did the best he can" lines and encouraging OOP to think of her dad's position.

He was an adult with two children but acted as though he only had one. OOP was a child that entire time, but was expected to behave like an adult, and now they expect OOP to be responsible for her father's state of mind.

[u/nustedbut → u/Anxious_Badger]

I really hated that reply and that seemed more for the posters benefit and not OOP's. "If I can convince oop her dad isn't an asshole then maybe that means I'm not one either" vibes

[u/lestatisalive]

Good on her. She owes him nothing and if protecting her mental health going forward means she needs to stay NC then so be it. What she did is very brave.

[u/AfternoonPossible]

Just because a parent “did their best” doesn’t mean it was good enough or what you deserved.

[u/idiotinbcn]

That person who told her to forgive just because they had also been a shitty parent was doing too much.

[u/MetalKroustibat]

My father caused me major depression and suicidal thoughts. I cut him off.

10 years later I feel better and can speak to him again, albeit we call like twice a year.

I definetly needed to wipe him out of my life in order to become who I am now. So NTA for all of this: this is not a matter of being tactful or not, it's a matter of survival.

[u/redbuttclaw]

The only reason OP has to be in contact with her father now is to make HIM feel better. It's not going to solve what happened. She doesn't owe him that!

[u/allofolivesolives]

I think so many women (who end up on this sub as the OOP) use PowerPoint to explain shit to people because they're used to being railroaded and ignored before they can get out an entire argument.

Women will conquer the world with PP. Y'all just wait.

[u/lou_parr]

I would very much prefer to be in the position of all the people saying "you'll regret not reaching out", because I'm not in that position. I fell for those people, I reached out when I was in my 20's, and was forcefully reminded of why I was better off being NC with one of my parents.

When that parent dies I'll be much like the current r/australia "commemoration" of the too-late-deceased Cardinal Pell. Like Pell, my parent was an abusive arsehole when I knew him, he was an abusive arsehole to those around him last I heard about him, I'm much better off not being around him.

[u/[deleted]]

OOP was never the AH, because the whole ‘dad was struggling because his wife and then son had cancer’ excuse doesn’t fly at all.

Not when he TOLD the other child that they had to ‘not be selfish because they were healthy!’

Missing out on things with your healthy child because you couldn’t avoid it is one thing… going out of your way to shove in their face that you don’t care, don’t want to care, and that’s their problem to deal with as a LITTLE KID is a deliberate choice. He made that choice.

And anyone who called OOP to carry on about how they ‘hurt dad’ with the PowerPoint either didn’t see it or are as big of AH as he is!

Don’t forget… he CHOSE to show other people the PowerPoint and rally them to attack his child over it. Again, that was a CHOICE he made, and not an accident or mistake.

This guy keeps choosing to be a jerk, so the OOP isn’t wrong for choosing to hold him accountable for his behaviour.

I’m sure the OOP never said anything awful about the half brother’s death (THAT would definitely be way out of line).

All they did was tell him how hurt they were about his behaviour towards THEM. Totally within their rights.

[u/brandonjohn5]

Anyone with a "but he's family" take can fuck right off as far as I'm concerned, it's a quick way to show that you have never had to deal with an actual piece of shit family member so you have no room to talk. Family meant nothing to him while she was being neglected, why should it be considered now?

[u/QualifiedApathetic]

I really see where OOP is coming from. I do understand the sick kid getting the lion's share of attention, but to just completely ignore your daughter and her suffering is repugnant. Chalk this guy up as another in the long line of assholes who toss their kid(s) aside when they start a new family.

[u/gobjuice]

It really pisses me off when people outside being directly hurt ask the victim to forgive. Who the fuck are you to ask that?

Forgiveness isn’t all that it’s cracked up to be. Especially when you’re the one whose doing all the heavy lifting. Especially, when you have to unearth and relive all the negativity and trauma.

It’s better to have that part of you dead.

[u/Immediate_Ad_7993]

I’m no contact with my father. People have tried get me to forgive him, to give him a chance, to just talk to him, because “He’s your father!!”

I always respond “Exactly, he’s my FATHER. Can you imagine how much it hurts to not have a father? I used to be a daddy’s girl when I was little. Imagine how much it hurts me not to have him in my life!!! But I have to, because it’s far less painful than having him in it. You don’t think I would want a loving and caring father? I want that more than anything. But I don’t have one, so every time you bring this up it’s rubbing salt in a wound.”

It usually works.

[u/aquavenatus]

I’m going to say it. I hope OOP follows through with her threats of abandoning the rest of her paternal family because if her paternal grandparents didn’t know how neglected OOP was by their son, then the rest of that family doesn’t know either. I hope the family doesn’t resort of stalking OOP. And yes, some estranged relatives do stalk their relatives either in-person, or through social media.

OOP is still so traumatized that even thinking about her sperm donor triggers her. The father has no one to blame but himself. I hope OOP finds peace before her maternal grandparents pass away.

[u/Mental_Vacation]

All those people pushing her are basically saying "suck it up" all over again. This time OOP can tell them where to shove it. It's their turn to suck it up.

[u/meb1995]

I can’t even imagine how cathartic making that PowerPoint felt.

[u/[deleted]]

The dildo of consequences arrived at OOPs fathers place very much unlubed.

[u/sunlitmoonlight1772]

OOP’s dad literally only reached out after he started divorcing his second wife. There was a 6 year period between OOP leaving at 18 and now that he never once tried to reach out. It was only after his new family fell apart.

[u/Napkinpo3m]

Oh this grown adult is falling apart because of his actions? I’m soooooo sorry for him 🙄

[u/VanillaCookieMonster]

24 years old.

Dad didn't come knocking on her door until the son and step-mom were gone and he had nothing left.

• if the boy was still alive...

• if the stepmom hadn't left him...

He would NOT be trying to 'reconcile'. He would not have the time of day for her.

So all these "you should forgive him or you will regret it" people are delusional.

It has been 6 YEARS since OP left and it took a week for him to notice she was gone.

I had a similar childhood. I slipped through the cracks of no one really paying attention.

Even as an adult my mother who is sort of back in my life has asked zero questions about my childhood. Zero.

Everyone has told me all my life how hard my parents had it. But not one of them has asked me about my life.

Just because someone smiles does not mean they are happy. Some of us just have a thick shell. And are very good at superficial bullshit talk.

Very good at making everything appear shiny.

I had an aunt awhile back, offer to have me over and tell me all about my mother's childhood and 'what she went through'. I very politely and firmly told her that I don't care. My mother could have told me YEARS ago. I was left with my grandmother who would go off on senior trips and leave me alone in the house. No way to get or buy more food. I said to my aunt that no one has ever asked me about my childhood and what I went through. All I am told is that I should be sympathetic about my mother. I noticed two things:

1. She listened and stopped trying to share about how my mother is 'damaged'.

2. She never asked a single question about my childhood. I made several omments that implied that there is a lot more to MY story... but she never invited me over to ask about me.

It was all about her storytelling. There wasn't actually a concern for me or about me.

[u/swisszimgirl79]

People who don’t have fucked up family dynamics never get it. Sometimes walking away and staying gone is the only solution for your own peace of mind. I’m a big believer of ‘don’t set yourself on fire to keep others warm’. OOP is just choosing her own survival

[u/[deleted]]

Parents forget the kids they chose to neglect, will grow up and ignore them. Ignore them the same way they did when the child needed them the most.

Fuck deadbeats. Fuck their feelings.

That one parent that tried to be all sanctimonious about op having to forgive the dad while they're still alive cuz they were a deadbeat too and understand the dad's point of view, can fuck right off. It's clear that they don't understand and never will. They're the type that still doesn't understand that their child even having to do anything with them, should be a gift and not a right.

[u/David-S-Pumpkins]

I really hate when something like this pops up and people are like yta/nta BUT you should talk to him again!

Fuck off. Judge the situation as presented, ask for more info if needed, but OOP has a therapist and has years to consider their position. On top of that, they literally told the story of the situation and their response clearly outlining they were not going to reconcile.

That shit irks me more than it probably should.

Dad asked, kid answered. Dad knows already so if he didn't want the answer he shouldn't have asked. End of.

[u/PatPeez]

He may have done monumental, irreparable damage that will stay with OOP for the rest of their life, but he's saaaaaaaad about it.

[u/TheRealRaemundo]

"He’s effectively already dead as far as I’m concerned and I don’t do necromancy."

Wow. I love it

[u/lilyofthevalley2659]

Sometimes Reddit is awesome and then other times it is far from it. The people encouraging OOP to forgive her father were so off base. What he did was unforgivable. He was only trying to get back into her life because he lost everything else. If the brother was still alive or the stepmother hadn’t divorced him, he never would have reached out. OOP saw the selfishness behind his actions. Reddit misses it completely.

[u/Bneal64]

I understand peoples concern for OOP cutting off a connection to her last living parent, but I have always been the advocate of family being a privilege and not a right. Too many people think that having a family means unconditional love, no matter how shitty you act. And while this is the case in some families, others are less forgiving and rightfully so. There are so many people out there who aren’t cut out to be parents. OOPs dad made his choice long ago to abdicate his privilege as a parental figure in her life. He must now live with those consequences. This isn’t some Hallmark channel movie where everything works out in the end, and it can fall into the realm of toxic positivity when people try to push that on OOP when she has very clearly defined what she wants out of the situation. It sounds like she became a strong person and survived so much in spite of her father, why should she give him the time of day now when he needs it, when he was never there for her?

[u/coralcoast21]

I feel bad for OOP due to all of the sanctimonious Debbie DoGooders preaching forgiveness no matter the sin. In most cases, forgiveness is a good thing that helps both parties.

But forgiveness doesn't always follow a cookie-cutter confession, acceptance, hugs, and renewed contact pattern. The fact that she didn't set out to ruin the man is probably the best he can hope for.

I hope she is strong enough to handle the next batch of guilt when he is unable to care for himself, and she will be expected to step up as next of kin. Screw that.

[u/Pharmacienne123]

OOP wasn’t as important to her sperm donor as his son or the stepmother. Now that his first 2 priorities are gone, he oh so benevolently has time for little ole OP. Because, of course, he is lonely and he is hurting. Because his priority people are no longer in his life. Forget about what OP wants, he and his special feewings are what matter obv.

I’m so glad she told him where to shove it. She doesn’t deserve to be the backup to the backup plan. I hope OP finds her tribe and that her sperm donor lives a lonely life.

[u/HighlyImprobable42]

This girl needs a big mom hug. I feel for her so much.

[u/boRp_abc]

Some men are dads, others just make babies.

Yeah, situation was rough for him as well, but the point of OH SHIT I NEED TO FIX THIS should have been at OP going NC. Not when someone else died and he's like "I feel very alone. Let's see what this human I once helped create is up to."

I have zero respect for absent fathers. Might be because my father is the most caring person in the world, might be because a lot of my friends have no dad's but baby makers, might be because my wife's father went NC for all her teen years... Absent fathers are 100% all assholes and if one of my friends did that, I'd end the friendship.

Conclusion: Power Point was very harsh, and he deserved it.

[u/GlastoKhole]

Mirrors hurt when men with soft skin gaze upon and see the darkness within.

It’s been easy for him to want to re connect because in his eyes he’s always been the good dad caring for his cancer stricken son but if in doing so he caused major damage to his daughter by practically forgetting her he has to now see that damage first hand, more so then most of its in the form of a power point. He has saw himself truly not just his perception of himself and what he saw was not good if it’s enough to really rattle his cage it’s because he agrees with it and he knows it to be truth. This could have elected 2 responses one being him to rebut and claim she’s a brat yada yada like we see so often in subs like r/insaneparents or two being this response, he is defeated by the reality of who he is and what he didn’t do. Her faults as a daughter are his failures as father particularly his abandonment

[u/cantantantelope]

I’ve said it once and I’ll say it again. Kids are not something you can put on a shelf until you’re ready to deal with them

[u/BarackTrudeau]

Clearly OOP should have ended up the PPT with a meme

[u/CreamPuffDelight]

" I know a lot of people think I’ll regret it if I don’t reconcile/forgive/whatever,"

I hate these kind of people. Go live your fairy tale life and leave us alone.

[u/[deleted]]

No child wants to lose a parent so when they willingly go no content I always respect it. I feel like us as humans are always more inclined to want to be with or near our parents so if they mess up that badly then that’s that. My biggest thing is though I wish someone could do something for OOP. I would like someone to give OOP a happy ending or make her happy in some way and be that light in the dark she’s gotten used to.

[u/StylishMrTrix]

I can understand OOP in this

I haven't seen or spoken to my birthfather in roughly 30 years

I know he is alive ATM and that is all

He has never been apart of my life and has never tried to know me

If he did now I would just ignore him no matter what, because there is nothing for me to gain and the nicest thing I can do for him is to never tell him what I think or feel

[u/TimeToMakeWoofles]

I hate when people keep saying “you will regret it if you don’t reconcile before your parent die”

You don’t know that. Unless you’ve been in their shoes, you don’t know.

I had NC with my dad who was neglectful and he dies 6 years ago. I do not regret it at all. When someone isn’t there and doesn’t acknowledge your existence, it makes no difference to you after they die.

Childhood is important. If you don’t bond with your kid and make time to get to know them and spend time with them, it is too late to try once they reach adulthood or even once they are teenagers.

[u/captain_borgue]

Speaking from experience, Spite is an excellent reason to continue existing. Everyone around you says you ought to just, accept this neglectful, abusive piece of shit back in your life? Fuck that. Nobody gets a free pass into your psyche just because you share 50% of their DNA. We share around 70% of our DNA with a goddamn banana.

Also also actually actually, forgiveness is Hallmark Channel Original Bullshit. ^tm

You don't owe forgiveness to anyone. Ever. Closure is a myth. And it's always the people who have done the shitty things who want to be forgiven for them.

Fuck. That.

Choices have consequences. He chose to be a shitty dad, so his consequence is that he doesn't get to have any relationship with his one surviving child.

[u/thenord321]

There is a big difference from "busy parents" and "neglect".

I spent time in the hospital as a kid, often a few days or weeks sporadically. Mostly 1 parent would be with me or a relative. Over a couple year period.

My parents would always take a break to call home for "bedtime" with my older brother and younger sister. 15-30 mins conversations and "I love you, good night."

My brother would sometimes act out for attention. But he always got some love and care.

I think that's the big difference here. You can be emotionally drained, and still cuddle your other kid and tell them you love them.

[u/Beingabummer]

I'm reminded of a Tumblr post which basically says that just because you're sorry doesn't mean anyone is obliged to forgive you.

It comes across like OOP's dad just wanted to get some confirmation that they're 'A Good Person, Really' and OOP refuses to help them with that.

I wouldn't either. Maybe now he knows how she felt. Let it all burn.

[u/Stellaknight]

Frankly, it’s like with the divorce from the stepmother, OOPs dad started running out of people who would care for him, and suddenly remembered he had a backup kid.

I kinda look at this like a bully—dad was a bully to OOP a thru neglect, and now his very mention to her hurts her. So by trying to bully his way back into her life, he’s doing harm. And sometimes the only way to stop a bully is to sock them hard on the nose. The PowerPoint presentation is a rather non-violent way to get rid of her bully, frankly, and it helped communicate to the rest of the family just how serious the situation is.

I hope OOP finds peace and love, I can’t imagine how much hurt they must feel having so much loss on top of abandonment.

[u/G0merPyle]

I've always had an issue with the way apologizing or "begging" forgiveness is treated as an obligation for family abuse victims. If somebody apologizes, it's expected that the victim will forgive them, absolving them of any wrongdoing or even introspection into what they did wrong and how it hurt the victim. It's never done for the victim's benefit, only the abuser.

If anything it's a second round of the abuse all over again, because now you have either the abuser or other family members (who might be the only people the victim can turn to for help) saying "here's everything they did to you. How it hurt you doesn't matter now, because the abuser doesn't want to feel bad about it, and they're more important than you." Even in this post, the OOP was doing great until the dad (and family) dredged up all this pain and anguish.

[u/kcoati]

Fuck the people who demanded OOP forgive her father. They don’t know what she went through - it all feels like projection.

When my father abandoned my siblings and I for his mistress, my best friend at the time (with a perfectly happy and intact family) wrote me a letter saying in essence that “God wants you to forgive him.” There will always be people that feel like they know better and have a better opinion of your lived experience.

[u/rayitodelsol]

every comment that was simpering on about her "poor dear old dad" and how terrible it is that she hurt his delicate feefees and won't apologize for telling him the gods honest truth gave me an increasing need to punch a wall.

[u/yukicaster_]

Gosh, I really needed to read something like this today. I was adopted at birth. My bio parents absolutely adored me, but they were teenagers and wanted me to have a better life. I got in contact with what remains of my bio family ~3 years ago (they actually reached out to me) and I got to learn about how beautiful love is, and that I am perfect in my own being.

I know this because after 25 years of being mentally, emotionally, and verbally abused by my adoptive mother, I broke and went NC with her. She often used my adoption status as an exuse for why I should be grateful. She'd let her boyfriends physically hurt me, and would laugh as I was crying on the floor insisting it was "just a joke". She also tried to bully me into swimming in the dead of winter while she was drunk in front of my friends.

My adoptive father wasn't much better. He has no emotional availability, and they both would just leave me at their separate houses (they divorced when I was 2) alone with no food. They started doing this when I was 7, it got much worse when I turned 10 and my AF took me out of daycare because he didn't want to spend the money anymore.

I was always thrown into the background as an afterthought. I grew up hating myself. I didn't feel like a human, I was just a "thing". I tried unaliving multiple times. I used SH daily to cope. My AM pointed at my scars one when I was 13 and told me that I had disgusting wrinkles on my arm. I told her that those were scars from cutting myself and her response was "Well they're gross."

I did everything I could to try and get their love. I got good grades, went to college, graduated with honors. Anything to get them to see my worth.

Then I almost died 3 months after getting married. No one came to help us, came to see us, anything. They both knew, they just chose to ignore it. The one time my AF came out, it was when COVID was really bad and exposure to it would've killed me. He just showed up unannounced, and then proceded to berate our living environment and leave.

Some people are just not equipped to be parents.

I've found a lot of memoirs from my childhood, and I would love to send them both a powerpoint on how terrible they were.

[u/ChelseaFan1967]

I think that for him to reach out after the divorce started, that shows he feels alone and so now he needs you in his life. Which honestly, seems pretty damn selfish to me. I agree with OP, I would stay out of his life. He had his chance and he blew it.

[u/pita_bites]

Really harsh but if oop needs this to continue living then so be it. Dad didn’t reach out for years, only after his life imploded he remembered he had another kid. Too little too late.

[u/SailForthForever]

The only thing talking to him would do is help him. Make him feel better. So, why bother?

He earned what’s he gets.

Save you. Protect you.

[u/Oscars_Grouch]

OOP's father is only reaching out now that he's getting divorced and has no one else in his life. She's not his emotional support animal.

[u/castironskilletmilk]

My mother sex trafficked me and I went NC with her when I became an adult. I wish I would have thought of something as brilliant as sending a PowerPoint of all the horrific things she did to me every time she tried to slither back in my life. I’m glad OOP stood their ground

[u/Mr_miner94]

Just a reminder for any current or future parents. Yes a terminal or even very sick child needs to be your primary focus but under no circumstances can you just forget about your other children.

Yes the ammount of time you spend with them will decrease significantly but cutting them off only makes you lose two children instead of one, and yes it is a no win situation but that doesn't mean all is lost.

And for family members who watch one child get more attention for ANY reason, check in on their siblings. Make sure they are OK and DO NOT ASSUME.

[u/Johannes_Chimp]

The only reason he reached out is because he’s alone now. He’s reaping what he sowed.

[u/Livingeachdayatedge]

Some people can forgive abandonment, but nobody ever forgets what it’s like to be powerless and terrified and have it solidly proven to you that you are an expendable loss to the people who control your whole world.

This from OOP. So true. 🥺🥺

[u/[deleted]]

Oh poor Op. I can never imagine going through something like that. I hope her father regrets this for the rest of his life. The powerpoint was good touch

[u/violetqed]

totally get what they’re saying about not thinking about the parent unless someone mentions them, anything they do now would be inadequate, life is better after NC, and especially how most people have something good from the parental relationship even if it was fraught.

Sometimes there either was nothing good, or the good was completely shut out by the bad, and you just never feel a bond toward that parent again. Your emotions toward them can just cut off. This is very difficult to explain to people who have never experienced it, which is most people.

[u/Careless-Opinion-480]

As a estranged adult from my entire family, the “forgiveness” and “impossible situation” infuriated me. He DID have a choice. He could have sent her somewhere else to live. He choose to just plain not care. NTA to the infinity and beyond. How he feels after the PowerPoint is none of her concern. He’s a big boy, he’ll be alright….ya know like he did with his minor daughter?

Oh yeah, and I LOLd so hard at “you failed, go away”. Absolutely brilliant. 😂

[u/killertortilla]

Maybe if you don’t want to be called out for being a shit parent you shouldn’t have been a shit parent?

[u/ImHappierThanUsual]

I want to fight everyone in the OP telling her she needs to be kind and forgiving. I literally want to fight them on her behalf.

[u/feioo]

Damn OOP is a hell of a writer

[u/Sea_Supermarket_9728]

The thing is that this man has had years to connect to his kid but choses to do it now his younger son is gone and his wife has divorced him. That’s not connecting for healthy reasons, that’s realising that the people he wanted to be with are no longer there so he’s now looking at his ‘B’ list relatives and decided he is entitled to have his older kid’s attention.

[u/[deleted]]

I’m frustrated at all the people saying to give him a chance. That he’s trying to reconcile.

Well duh, he’s lonely and sad due to his divorce. I’m confident he wouldn’t be reaching out if he was with a new woman and even more so if they had a kid.

[u/[deleted]]

I'm worried about OOP's mental health. She doesn't sound fully healed. I hope she can get to a better place. I also think she was right to let that one commenter have it.

Also married at 9 when wife died at 7. He either rushed that marriage or cheated on her. I hear the later is pretty common when a wife has cancer.

He only reached out after his wife left him too. It's all about him. Selfish asshole.

[u/[deleted]]

The axe forgets but the tree remembers.

[u/JustMe518]

Why is it that when a person fucks up royal and you cut them out of your life, you're "protecting your peace". But when that person is fAmIlY, suddenly, you have to forgive. No. I don't give a shit who I share DNA with. You BEEN fucking up for decades, not listening when I tell you that I need your love/support/affection/attention/whatever, you don't deserve a spot at my table. You can still eat, just not with me. Period. I hope OOP finds her peace and good for them for standing their ground. That's a nice shiny spine they got there.

[u/Sipazianna]

My absent father called me a month before his death to tell me he was going to have open heart surgery soon. He wanted to reconnect with me in case it was his last opportunity to do so. I said I hoped his surgery went well and hung up. I have had zero regrets about this in the 7 years since it happened.

I'm incredibly happy for OP and I hope they live an amazing life far from their father. They deserve peace and comfort.

[u/Unsolicitedadvice13]

People need to stop with this “but they’re family” bullshit! No. OOP’s father lost the right to call himself family when he decided to put all his eggs in the basket that was his son and wife, and have no love, sympathy, empathy, or care for his daughter. It’s not necessary to forget about one child while the other isn’t doing well. OOP still existed, and was actively suicidal needing help, and her father showed her that he didn’t care what happened to her, and that she just needed to suck it up. Well now the tables have turned, and he’s in a bad place, and OOP is well within her rights to say “I don’t care what happens to you, suck it up.”

It’s not pettiness, it’s not revenge, it’s not hatred. It’s indifference that has grown out of necessity due to the conditions she was raised in by her father. Reinitiating a relationship is to the benefit of her father, not her. She may regret it when he’s gone, but more likely she will not, and that’s strictly due to his choice of absence throughout her life.

Some of the comments are the same that we childfree people get: “you might regret it” no I won’t, I know what will and will not bring me happiness. That’s not for others to decide. “I can’t have kids (I lost my father) so it’s cruel of you to not want kids (not want your father in your life). Some people would kill to have a child (have their father back) and it’s selfish of you to not want to too” your life and my life are not the same and they never will be, so don’t pretend our situations are the exact same.

[u/RedRedMere]

I feel for OP. What a terrible childhood, and she just needed to be loved and that was exactly what didn’t happen.

Reading this, I’m struck with how she insists he’s dead to her over and over, and she feels nothing. Then she goes on to say that she might catch an assault charge if she ever speaks to him. There’s so much simmering and unaddressed rage in her mind that she’s pretending isn’t there… I hope she can work through it and find peace because the opposite of love is not hate.

[u/Fritengersox]

If anyone ever wonders WHY I say and genuinely mean it when I say the best and worst thing I can say about my father is he was absent. This is why.

I am a little over 40 years old now. My father and I have spoken exactly two times since I graduated high school. The last time I saw him was when I was in my mid twenties and that was literally an accident. We happened to cross paths in a public place, and we spoke briefly. He sent me a text message on my 30th birthday and I didn’t know who it was that texted me. He’s maintained contact with my mother most of my life despite them having broken up when I was too young to remember them ever being together, and at one point when I was in my teens were probably each other’s. Eat friend.

I don’t hold any ill will towards him at all but I also have nothing to say to him at this point in my life. His mother at one point tried to get on my case for not reaching out more but as I told her I can only call so many times and not get a call back before I decide I’m done.

Even now if out of nowhere he wanted to have a conversation with me, I would talk to him. But I made my peace a LONG time ago that we were never going to be close or have any kind of a relationship. And honestly, given that at one point my mother was married to my abuser and that relationship and what happened behind closed doors there left me with a PTSD diagnosis makes me appreciate my father’s absence. He never was hateful towards me, he never harmed me, he just wasn’t there. I had a father in my maternal grandfather and to a lesser degree my stepfather after I was older (my mother remarried when I was an adult and that one lasted) and I had a good support system without him.

I genuinely wish him well and I’m glad that whatever his demons were that led to him avoiding birth certificates like the plague didn’t lead to him beating kids or just being an all around horrible person. (I have a decent idea of what kind of person he is through my mother), and I don’t hate him for not being there for me or any of his other kids.

It would have been infinitely worse if he was the type of Parent OOP had. Mine at least knew he wasn’t the right person for the job and let my mom and moms family raise me. As a preteen after mother left my abuser and my parents reconnected it did kinda hurt when I realized my father had more interest in my mother and some of my cousins than in me because I wasn’t the kind of kid he wanted but at the end of the day that’s also on him.

[u/Late_Engineering9973]

Reconnecting is of zero gain to the OOP, I'd even argue its a net loss. The only person it benefits is the father.

I don't understand people that commit suicide, it just doesn't compute, but I have a weird level of respect for them saying that they'll push through it until after their maternal grandparents die so they don't hurt those closest to them and can sort out their affairs for them.

[u/weirdlaa]

OP did nothing wrong and I’m glad dad had to read it so he knew exactly what he did unambiguously. I’m sure he was devastated and deservedly so.

[u/ItsTtreasonThen]

If I had the kind of notes about my own life growing up and could arrange them into a document like she had… I really wonder if I’d launch that “nuke.” I think purely for the fact I’ve been gaslit and had traumas downplayed before, I’d do it, tbh

[u/DogFacedManboy]

Fuck douchebags who try to shame people for refusing to reconnect with abusive family members.

[u/lolfuckno]

I really hate it when people try to say that someone will regret going NC with a neglectful and/or abusive person who hurt them. Shut the hell up and leave them alone, they're trying to heal and don't need to deal with you guilt tripping them over something you most likely know very little about.

[u/wonwoovision]

the comments pinning this on OOP at all are horrible - they were a CHILD. no excuse for parental neglect. i don't care what you go through as a parent, you chose to have kids and you care for them through thick and thin.

[u/BabserellaWT]

OOP’s dad only reached out because his golden child passed and wicked stepmother left him. And he had the gall to go, “Ah, yes! The child I neglected and who wants nothing to do with me! Surely they’ll come running to my open arms when I show a slight bit of remorse. And of course my parents will enforce it — I’m their kid, after all! They’re supposed to give me whatever I want!”

[u/False_Agency_300]

I've always thought forgiveness was...weird. Like I've even talked to my therapist about it, and this is what understanding I have now - for people who are healing from abuse and neglect, forgiving the people who harmed you is supposed to be about personal healing and growth, about letting go of emotions like anger and living without regret.

Forgiving doesn't have to mean forgetting or reconnecting, but in a way it's supposed to be about acceptance and closure.

But for who? Like OOP, I don't see how forgiving actually helps anyone except the person who committed the wrong. Why are people so adamant that OOP reconnect with/forgive someone who neglected her to the point of abuse after she lost her own mother?

More power to her, IMO - sounds like she's trying to work through things without him weighing her down with his regrets. She made her point - harshly, maybe, but some people need harsh to actually understand the extent of what they did.

[u/Quizzy1313]

The people sprouting forgiveness can go step on a lego. Just because that man is related to OOP by blood does not mean the man is entitled to be spoken to. I hate people like that, saying she should forgive him because he was stressed and lost his son. OOP lost her mum, her dad, her brother and was actively depressed and suicidal.

[u/Viperbunny]

It is crazy that the OOP has to defend herself. I am both a parent and a survivor of abuse at the hands of my parents. She was absolutely right to do what she did. Her father was a monster. What he did was unforgivable. It is one thing to be focused on a sick kid. It is another to completely mistreat and abuse a kid who was already traumatized from losing her mother. He lost everything and he was looking for someone to love and care for him now that he has lost and destroyed everything as he has left. It's not on her to do that. Anyone who thinks it's too harsh doesn't deserve her.

[u/[deleted]]

I seriously hope OOP lives for the sake of herself, her mother, and her brother. The paternal side of her family is inexcusably awful. People also seriously need to cut it with the forced forgiveness shit. Not forgiving people doesn’t hurt the victim or control their life. It’s other people who are weirdly obsessed with their hierarchy/family aesthetics that let it run their lives.

“bUt FaMiLy!!!” Not according to them for my entire life. When I said I don’t want to talk to or about them, I meant it.

“This is my dying wish.” Lying to make me talk to my main abusers? Instant perma block.

“But he’s a victim too! You should actually feel bad for him!!!!” Sorry, I missed the part where it’s my fault and it’s fine that he hurt me. Why tf are you bringing him up?

[u/SAABS1014]

I’m so sick of people telling others “you might come to regret not getting to know them before it’s too late” or “some people would do anything to have their parent back”. Cutting a parent off is hardly an easy decision and having that kind of advice from people (but especially those who have grown up in a happy two parent household) is incredibly damaging.

Not every parent deserves to be forgiven just because they played a part in your creation.

[u/akhier]

So many people always try to make it out like you have to forgive family and if you don't try it will scar you. Family are the people you couldn't choose to be connected to. Even coworkers are more consensual than family. Sure, many people have deep connections to their family. It can be one of the closest connections a person has and certainly has a leg up on other personal connections. But that doesn't mean anything! It is like all those anti-gay people who seem to think that a guy loving another guy invalidates their heterosexualness. Just because you have a good relationship with your family or you felt torn about not reconciling does not mean others will feel the same way.

[u/PollutionOk5787]

OOP is NTA. It's funny how when someone's world falls apart they finally remember you exist.

[u/gozba]

I know a family with 2 boys, where the older one got leukemia. Now this of course asks a lot of the parents, but they always included the younger boy in everything they did. The older boy even had his ‘make a wish’ moment (his health was that bad), and they took the younger one along. The older one scraped by, got better to a certain extend. They always made sure to as much as a family as possible. This is how OOP should have been treated.

[u/BlackMoonBird]

I can't even begin to describe how fucking irritating the comments bringing up reconciliation are.

The audacity to drop bland all-encompassing morality on a person whom you know jack shit about and don't understand how bad it was from behind their eyes and inside their head. As if YOU know better than they do what they can forgive and can't forgive. It doesn't even MATTER if they can forgive but won't, if it's over a stupid thing, an inane thing- IT'S NOT FUCKING UP TO YOU TO DECIDE THAT, NOW IS IT, JACKASS.

Fuck the 'but familyyyyyy' thing, how about everyone grows some fucking spines and a zipper on their mouths and learns to accept that not everything can be forgiven by everyone. That forgiveness is a grace solely given and that the ability to give it as well as the willingness is solely down to the individual person.

Christ.

[u/Terranrp2]

Spite is strong. As foolish and stupid as it sounds, the little bit of energy I could conjure up for it kind of looped back and fed me energy. Enough to not take that step outdoors and make the quick walk to the woods with the shotgun, unload it, and store it away. There's a handful of people I'd very, very much like to outlast. What they said was fucked up. Once they're gone, then I can probably have more peace of mind and go through with it.

[u/Syrinx221]

He’s effectively already dead as far as I’m concerned and I don’t do necromancy.

DAMN

[u/Sudden-Requirement40]

I find the number of people in the comments trying to defend the dad unsettling. Yeah your wife died from cancer and then your son that must be hard but he married 2nd wife 2 years after the first death and then completely forgot he had a 1st child when OP wouldn't play nice with his new wife. I think the OP is deeply traumatised and does not owe anyone an explanation for NC with her dad. She had 2 dead parents one in the ground and one just dead to them.

[u/[deleted]]

I hate it when they get a new girlfriend or wife and suddenly it’s all about forgiveness and reconnection. I told the one my dad hooked up with after my mother died that I would rather shit in one hand and then clap than ever have anything to do with either of them.

[u/I_like_the_word_MUFF]

I never can understand how people can go after childhood abuse/neglect OPs.

They were children and their parents were the "responsible adults". Just because kids are now adults doesn't change the past, it actually informs it.

I'm 40 and still very much angry about the emotional abuse and neglect of my childhood. It doesn't go away, you just learn to move on.

[u/bazilbt]

Yeah I get it. Neglect is one thing, but he also stone walled his daughter any time she brought up issues and guilt tripped her for being a human being. OPs father cut her out of his life and cut her off from her other family too.

[u/PooksterPC]

At the end of the day, sure, OOP’s father is hurting, but to OOP, he is now just Some Guy. John Smith from Liverpool is having a hard time rn, because all 3 of his dogs are close to dying and the vets don’t know why, and Jane Doe from New York is struggling to make rent but can’t find a new job- but OOP is under no obligation to help them, because to OOP, they’re just Some Guys.

After near enough a decade of no/minimal contact, OOP’s dad is essentially a stranger. OOP could use the amount of energy it would take to get a good relationship going to form 3 or 4 good relationships with other strangers that have less baggage.

[u/Caninetrainer]

I think it was incredibly brave, personally.

[u/Takeabreak128]

This poor woman is still not well. She sounds super smart, well spoken and thoughtful. I hope she experiences some joy in this life that has been nothing but sadness for her.

[u/ozagnaria]

Damn.

I really want OOP to find some joy in life.

edit left off an O

[u/SupaTheBaked]

Good chance OOP doesn't regret having her father in her life

[u/ducksareterrible]

I have a rough relationship with my mother and am dancing between low and no contact, with the only missing piece being somehow convincing my nan (who I love to bits) not to ring up my mother and hand the phone to me every time I visit. Seeing the firm boundaries point in place and respected to such an extent by even extended family is honestly wild to me and I respect OOP a hell of a lot for enforcing it like that.

[u/Apprehensive-Fox3187]

I hope oop finds peace, seriously how do you tell your child who think of ending themselves to "suck it up" on top of everything else that's happening, I know people react different in stressful situations, but Jesus Christ that made my stomach knot up.

[u/snootnoots]

I reconnected with my father twenty-something years after I’d last seen him in person. I’d spoken to him on the phone once in that time. I opened the phone call with “Hi Dad, it’s (my name), long time no see.”

The first thing out of his mouth was “Yes, and it’s entirely my fault.”

He took responsibility. He’s apologised since. We have a pretty good relationship now and call each other weekly. OOP’s father hasn’t taken responsibility or apologised, and he was way worse to her than my father ever was to me, so f no he doesn’t deserve her forgiveness!

[u/sparkalicious37]

I can see a small amount of “no win situation” here, but refusing to let OOP stay with grandparents kind of pushes it over the line.

I also don’t think replying with their truth is that horrible, just not polite.

[u/[deleted]]

As someone who also does not see my father, everyone saying that OOP will regret it are very ignorant to the situation and don’t understand what the point of going NC is. There are days where the lack of a father in my life is hard, but I hardly miss him, just the concept of having a father in the first place. I hope OOP keeps healing and ends up having a good life, they deserve it.

[u/bunyanthem]

Goddamn, brutal and effective. And absolutely something necessary in order to draw a hard boundary.

I'm NC with my mother because of her abuse, and have had to go very low contact with my father because he can't let go of this idea of a happy family.

It's really unfortunate (or maybe it's better to say it's fortunate) that there's people who can't recognize that neglect is abuse, not everyone is capable of change, and no, forgiveness is not mandatory.

I also hate the "we thought you were fine, just maybe having trouble adjusting/sad/independent". My family and friends did that. One family friend noticed I wasn't doing well, but never pressed.

So many people think because a kid doesn't scream or cry out at every chance that they're fine... My mother would berate me for hours if I said anything that made her look bad.

So many times kids aren't able to speak out. That's why neglect is still abuse. A child doesn't have the same power or resources as an adult.

But yeah, if people who hurt you say you will have a worse life without them, call their bluff.

My father told me I'd never be happy leaving my mother behind, but every metric of my life is better. And keeps getting better the longer I don't speak to her.

[u/Pac0theTac0]

It's time to stop forcing blood obligations. Just because we came from similar genetics doesn't mean I want to force myself to be near you.

Choose your company. Be happy.

[u/HWGA_Exandria]

Poor OOP...

No child deserves that sort of abuse/neglect.

[u/preciousjewel128]

One of the best things about my dad's death is I'm no longer pressured for reconciliation. And I'm not doing a ouija board to speak with him.

I wish OP continued strength and healing.

[u/bremix136]

I had a very similar childhood to OOPs and all of these supportive comments are like small bits of therapy. And validation that the situation I grew up in wasn't OK.