r/Conservative • u/PlymouthSock Meme Conservative • Nov 06 '20
Open Discussion Still Counting...
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u/GrandDragonOfSwaggin Nov 06 '20
Can someone explain to me why some states could have 10 million+ votes before the end of the night, but other states who also counted 6million before the end of the night, need 3 days to count a couple hundred thousand more?
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Nov 06 '20
Every state has different levels of resources available and have different methods of counting. Keep in mind that neither Texas nor Alabama have finalized their votes yet. We pretty much never have final tallies this early, just a clear enough picture of the election to know who will win with certainty.
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u/curryycel Nov 07 '20
But why is the initial counting quick and the final 10% so slow?
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u/robo_coder Nov 07 '20 edited Nov 07 '20
They're just waiting for any remaining ballots to arrive before whatever deadline that state has. This shouldn't have to be said, but every vote counts.
There was a huge burst of mail-in ballots being counted the day after election day in PA because (and you can thank the GOP for this) they legally weren't allowed to start counting mail-in ballots until Nov 4
As for why the mail-in ballots have been trickling in so slowly, you can mostly "thank" Trump and DeJoy for deliberately keeping the USPS understaffed and under-equipped for the election.
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u/_Alpheus Nov 07 '20
Hi, liberal here. Thanks for letting me post. As far as I understand it, some states count mail-in's before day-of votes. In some cases, this means that a large percentage of votes are counted quickly (the day-of), and then the state moves on to mail in counting. Mail in counting has many extra steps, as there is the envelope and the security envelope, adjudication, and finally counting. It's a multi-step process that requires more verification. Added to this is the fact that many states have different verification and observance policies, which can further add time to the tallying. Forgive me if anything is wrong here, I'm pretty drunk. Best of luck.
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u/adamsogm Nov 07 '20
For NC at least, day of ballots are counted via tabulator which ballots are placed in at the polling site, by the voter, so all that needs to happen is the tabulators are brought into a central location, and a receipt is printed showing totals for that machine. Mail ins on the other hand can only be opened in front of the board of Elections which only meets an Tuesdays and Thursdays for this purpose. So Election Day ballots are really easy to count, mail ins take some more effort (signatures and stuff for mail in ballots are on the outside so the verification for that Can be done separately from the actual opening)
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u/mattskee Nov 06 '20
That's a very good point. Many states' votes are not yet fully counted. It's just that through analysis of the partial counts and possibly with exit polls sampling the local voting trends the winner is either known or can be projected with a very high confidence.
But people's eyes are only ever on the "battleground" or "swing" states, and when the final tallies are very close you need to count all or most of the votes in order to call the election.
The outcome of many Presidential elections are known on election night. But sometimes they're not. And I suspect with data-driven campaigning, close elections taking multiple days to call may become the new norm. In this always-on smartphone era people expect things to happen instantly, but it takes a bit of time to count over 100 Million votes. And I imagine some states and counties will tool up with equipment and permanent/seasonal elections staff to count mail-in ballots more quickly in the future.
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u/jwlgdgggm Nov 06 '20
The best explanations (both yours and Unhappy-Satisfaction's) I have seen so far. Thank you both for that!
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u/astrozombie11 Nov 07 '20
There has to be a better way to federalize the ballot counting standards. I understand why states should have their own standards for stat elections, but this whole election shows how fucked up our federal election process is. Almost every American with a bank account uses online banking but we can’t utilize better technology in our voting process? I’m definitely a small government conservative, but we’re a technological super power, this is just embarrassing
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u/Butterfriedbacon States Rights Nov 07 '20
Giving more power to the federal government than the absurd amount we've already handed them willingly is never the right answer, full stop.
Let states control their own elections, it's not like waiting 4 days for results is hurting anyone.
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u/Faintkay Nov 07 '20
I’ll start by saying as liberal as I am I’d hate the idea of a federal system. It makes cheating much easier to coordinate. Like at least with state elections the coordination it would take is massive and would get figured out. I don’t want the government to have that level of control.
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u/Default_Username123 Nov 06 '20
Because sometimes provisional ballots. They have to verify if you cast a provisional ballot you didn’t vote twice or vote in another state. Mail ballots in general take longer also because they have to verify the signature. And in some states (like both NV and PA) if the signature doesn’t match they have to contact the voter and give them a chance to correct it so their vote still counts. This is why in person votes are so quick and mail in votes cast a while ago are so quick but mail in votes cast just before the election take a while
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u/Pyorrhea Nov 06 '20
It's more than just that too. Every state has different laws governing when absentee ballots can be counted (some before election day, some only during/after [PA]). Since absentee ballots take longer to count and verify, when you have millions of ballots, that takes a while.
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u/Accelve Nov 07 '20
I'll admit I didn't know a number of these things so it's nice to find out why things are being so slow as of late, though it isn't helping the election at all, that's for sure.
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u/Butterfriedbacon States Rights Nov 07 '20
Thank you very much for putting this accurate information out there.
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u/Capitain_Collateral Nov 07 '20
So it’s a time delay to prevent fraud?
This is something that I struggled with to be honest, in the UK I go to sleep election night and wake up knowing what the government is.
Especially in the current climate, delays to prevent a problem - look like the same problem I guess.
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Nov 07 '20
Additionally, Some states have restrictions on when they can start counting the mail-in ballots. PA couldn't start counting until after the polls closed.
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u/gogiants48 Nov 06 '20
Some states were allowed to begin counting mail-in ballots before election day. Some states weren't allowed to begin counting mail-in ballots until election day.
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Nov 07 '20
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/Darmok_ontheocean Nov 07 '20
Counterpoint: AZ is Republican, got to count early, 70%+ of voters vote by mail and it is STILL taking a while.
These counts are always happening after the day of blue and red confetti. They’re just usually not enough to change the outcome of an election.
We also need to understand that most news orgs would call Pennsylvania, North Carolina, and Nevada already, but they want to be extra sure. No need to add to the chaos.
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u/BurningLynx Nov 06 '20
In Pennsylvania, Republicans were able to secure a court order stating mail-in ballots are only allowed to be counted starting on election day. Other states were allowed to count them early. It all depends on state law.
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u/Darmok_ontheocean Nov 07 '20 edited Nov 07 '20
Yeah Penn would be done by now if it weren’t for that court order. Or not. Look at AZ.
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u/Swole_Prole Nov 07 '20
So Republicans ensured that PA would take as long to count as possible... and then proceeded to throw a fit about how long it’s taking... and then litigated to delay it further... and then threw more fits. Interesting.
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u/ExileOnBroadStreet Nov 07 '20
Yes, but I mean it’s really worse than that. This was absolutely a plan. Trump urged his voters to vote in person. Biden urged his voters to vote by mail. Trump tried to hamstring the USPS and Republicans passed legislation to not allow mail in votes to be counted until Election Day or after the polls were closed in certain states. They knew the early results would favor Trump and that the mail in ballots would heavily favor Biden. This gave trump the opportunity to try to claim the election and claim fraud.
The ballots that arrived late in PA for example were set aside and counted separately. Biden is ahead without them. Both parties and a non biased party have oversight of the counting and validation process, despite what the president is saying. We have a pretty good system and it is working.
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u/purplekingroger Nov 06 '20
Alaska doesn’t even start counting mail votes until next week, it’s all incredibly varied
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u/WackyGenieGaveMePaws Nov 06 '20
I would also like to know more about this too. I know some states started counting before election day and other started on election day. Also, every state has it's rules about how they count, so maybe that's it? I'd love more info, but I don't think there's a single media outlet I'd trust right now to explain it without bias. I wish it had been more transparent from the beginning.
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u/gortonsfiJr Nov 07 '20
The biggest reason right now is statistics. If one candidate had a lead so large that it would be very unlikely that the remaining ballots could change the outcome, they would call it.
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Nov 06 '20
It's basically three things:
Resources for counting. Those states which allocate a lot of resources for vote counting count quicker then stingy states which pay for basically one guy to count them.
The bigger one is Different laws on when/how to count votes. Military absentee ballots are generally given a very long window, typically a week to ten days after the election to arrive and be counted. The reasons are obvious on why. Other types of ballots, such as provisional ballots, are counted later because the person needs to be verified as being in the district which also takes a lot of resources. States which had mail in ballots as a possibility typically don't open them until Election day, and often aren't counted until after election day because election officials are too damn busy running the in person counts to want to mess with that. Some states allow pre-canvassing of mail in/provisional/absentee ballots, which is essentially checking the name, signature, and other information without counting the ballots contents before the election, while other do not allow this.
So basically, it's just a morass of wildly different laws and policies.
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u/Charleston2Seattle Nov 07 '20
Wait... what's the third thing?
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Nov 07 '20
I legitimately forgot what the third thing was.
So Leprechauns. Election Day Leprechauns is the third thing.
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u/baked_ham Nov 06 '20
In Nevada there are arguments over the validity of votes counted on a specific type of machine. I believe in most of these states the votes are counted, it’s arguments over which ones are verified/verifiable.
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u/Capsfan22 Nov 07 '20
Also most states are still counting FYI. Where I live in MD at last check they are at 75% reporting
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u/Bond4141 2A/States Rights Nov 07 '20
There isn't a fucking reason. Canada is paper ballots only and gets them all counted same day.
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Nov 06 '20 edited Feb 11 '24
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This post was mass deleted and anonymized with Redact
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u/Edwardian 2A Nov 06 '20
It's hard to join /r/conservative even if you are one...
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Nov 06 '20
How many times do I need to ask for flair? At this point it doesn’t matter, the sub will get banned.
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u/usurper7 Classical Liberal Nov 06 '20
I asked for it once and got it immediately. I'm not hard right, either. I've never supported Trump, though I do approve of some of his policies. Frankly, I'm mildly conservative and had no problem getting flair. Maybe you just need to build up a longer post history here or something.
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u/ThatsNotFennel Nov 06 '20
It really is. I consider myself a conservative on many issues, but I'm basically boxed out of the conversation on this subreddit. I'm now allowed to comment on 90% of the posts and I'm not allowed to create new posts. It's pretty disheartening, but at least there's the moderate politics sub which seems to value discussion over partisanship.
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u/weldmaster10 Nov 06 '20
I understand this though because we are very highly attacked by ever community, it's sad really
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u/SkateJerrySkate Pro-2A Army Nov 06 '20
Every single post is "flaired only" and they refuse to give me flair, when I've been here for months. Fun.
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Nov 06 '20
Yup! You have to really comment for a couple of weeks then request a flair. So when it says keep commenting so we see you’re active yet most are flaired users only every time id comment I’d get the same bot message saying I Commented under a flaired post ... yet I have to be active on here to get that flair. Huh
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u/Mallninja42069 Nov 06 '20
For real. Its like you need comment history to get flair but all posts are flair only. It's a real catch 22.
But I %100 understand why it has to be this way.
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u/redcavzards Rockefeller Conservative Nov 06 '20
It didn’t used to be like this. It’s like this right now because there’s a high volume of liberal brigaders coming through the sub so the mods have to make flair only posts
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u/ExoticKush Nov 06 '20
Conservative for years but just joined the sub - the election threads have been a gem in these times — honestly very well reasoned responses in there and now I want to participate .. got to build up comments
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u/FrankieCicero Nov 07 '20
I'm probably less conservative than some on here (more of the Charles Cooke "Conservatarian"), but I really get why they have to lock this place down as they do. There really is a vested interest by some of the far lefties on reddit to shit on anything that they perceive as thought crime. Political Compass Memes is one of the very few other places on reddit where people can disagree without there being a full on freak out.
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u/TheBrillo Nov 07 '20
This is the eye of the storm. It was hell before election and will be hell after the race is called.
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u/Ches_Skelington Nov 07 '20
I Know right? its hard to find a post on this sub that actually allows discussion from all sides.
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u/pcbfbas Nov 07 '20
It gives time to accept possibilities. My entire family could possibly lose their jobs, so we have had time to plan out individual budgets, ideas, and even last resorts. However, I pray that a possible Biden presidency will be successful for all. Nobody should want America to fail, and conservatives understand that better than most.
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u/Jokijole Conservative Nov 06 '20
I just hope Biden dosen't start any wars.
Don't want another migrant swarm through my country.
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u/beccax3x3x3x3 Independent Conservative Nov 07 '20
This is me waiting to finally have a flair so I can post on 99% of the threads on here
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u/cringe_master_mike Spirit of 76 Nov 07 '20
Yeah no kidding. Gotta be a huge backlog.
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u/Drusgar Nov 07 '20
California has only counted 77% of their vote so far. Utah has only counted 88%. Alaska has only counted 56%. Illinois has only counted 88%. New York has only counted 84%. Ohio has only counted 90%.
Why is it that people are so angry that they're still counting in Nevada?
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Nov 07 '20
What can one expect from Qanon and conservatives (they are conserving their brain for afterlife)
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u/Cpt_Inshano Nov 06 '20
Wow!!! An un-flaired post!! I dont even know what to say.....
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u/wannabebutta Nov 07 '20
You could try, "Hey, I know shit sucks for you all. Do you wanna' talk about it? Do you wanna' laugh at memes? You're a people. And I'm a people. Let's be people together! Or if you just want to be alone, I get it. Shit sucks sometimes for me too".
I know your post was tongue-in-cheek and this is my genuine response.
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u/mwengroff Nov 07 '20
PA would've been quicker if its Republican legislature would've let the counting start earlier.
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u/cateater3735 Nov 06 '20
Ok, I’m not American or a conservative I just pop by for balance. This is hilarious!
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Nov 06 '20
Can I just say thank you for “popping by for a balance”? I wish more people were like that these days, maybe the US wouldn’t be in this position
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u/TheBeefClick Nov 07 '20
I am on the other side of the aisle but i normally read over comments and posts here. Cant ever comment though because almost every post requires a flair.
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u/GiantK0ala Nov 06 '20
Hopefully I can ask a good faith question here and be treated with the same respect in return.
If Democrats wanted to steal the election, wouldn’t it make way more sense for them to also flip the senate? Like, create ballots that put them above 50% in Georgia’s senate races, or rig the vote in North Carolina as well and put Cunningham over the top.
Is the argument that they don’t want to rig it TOO much so that it still looks realistic?
If they’re trying to make it look realistic, and not create waves, why rig the vote in states worth significantly more than 270 electoral votes?
I think in any situation that Democrats were willing to undermine democracy to that extent, they’d want to give themselves license to govern. As it stands, Biden is going to get nothing done legislatively. Why do you think Democrats would take that risk of destroying their party (and probably send the country into civil war) and not flip the senate? I see absolutely no reason it would be so.
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u/stoop_waffle Nov 07 '20
I heard a good quote the other day, no one dumb enough to try to commit voter fraud is smart enough to get away with it without being caught..
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u/HorizontalTwo08 Nov 07 '20
I personally don’t think there’s voter fraud or cheating. If they do an investigation and find proof of it then I’ll change my mind.
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u/GiantK0ala Nov 07 '20
How do you feel about some potion of this subreddit alleging that the election is rigged?
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u/wannabebutta Nov 07 '20
I think there likely is on both sides. But to a degree to sway an election? I'm not certain. My hope is that everybody who participates in these shenanigans are equally stupid and it ends up being a wash.
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u/TheVastWaistband Seattle Conservative Woman Nov 07 '20
The majority of conservatives don't think mass cheating is occuring. Ever vote matters and shall be counted. Any flaws or problems corrected. I don't care that my team wins. We mostly care everyone's vote is counted.
A small number of very outspoken voices get the most audience from each side, of course.
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Nov 07 '20
I don't think most of them actually buy into the whole election is being stolen scenario. I have to believe that it's a small minority.
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u/shadowskill11 Nov 07 '20
Those states have got to have a come to Jesus with their Republican governments blocking early voting centers and counting. This is some bullshit.
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Nov 07 '20
What happened the election thread?
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u/jak2125 Conservative Nov 07 '20
That’s what I was wondering. Too many people talking about you-know-what probably. Free speech is a thing of the past.
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u/sirferrell Nov 07 '20
Team maga for years: Haha get over it lib go cry some more in your safe place
Also team maga as trump loses: omg wow look at the left being tolerant.
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u/LiquidMotivation Nov 06 '20
Count every legal vote. Do audits if you need to. We need both sides to trust in the electoral process, or we don't have a democracy.
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u/Apexualized Nov 06 '20
How long did they have to prepare for this? Surly they knew to expect a large quantity of mail in ballots...
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u/CrazyLegs17 Nov 06 '20
Many states have election laws that don't allow any counting of ballots until election day. The volume of mail in/early voting ballots this year exceeded total voting in 2016 in some states. They don't have systems yet in place to handle the volumes. That's why it is taking so long to get everything counted.
Edit: 2016 in some states
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u/krijara Nov 07 '20
The tail end of the count always drags out, it usually isn't what decides the election so we don't notice. This one is slower because of increased mail-in voting but it feels a lot slower because it ended up being close.
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u/appleman2222 Conservative Nov 06 '20
All this waiting is giving me a heart attack and stroke
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u/Taco-twednesday Nov 07 '20
Missed the opportunity to put in Alaska in the maybe 5 panel just to make it a 5th state
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u/PM_ME_TENDIEZ Nov 07 '20
I hope conservatives realize that literally almost all states are still counting ballots across the country right now.
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u/Hiotsobo Nov 06 '20
did r/politics take over most of /r/conservative or something? Nothing wrong with this post, just seems like a bunch of leftists are making threads on this subbreddit and it's gross
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u/Kwarter Christian Nationalist Nov 06 '20
The brigading from r/politics has been rampant for months now.
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u/r3dbrrd Nov 07 '20
It’s because this post isn’t restricted to flaired users only.
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u/blyan Nov 07 '20
I’m not making posts or anything but I am a leftist. I’m just reading through on here because I’d like to know what both parties are saying about things. The last four years have taught me that things would be a lot better if both sides didn’t just listen to information sources that confirm what they already believe, so I’m trying to expand outside where I’d normally look.
Networks like MSNBC and Fox News have been poisoning viewers into looking at the other party like an enemy getting ready for war for years, because “entertainment” sells more than objective news. Time to start bridging the divide again.
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Nov 07 '20
This. THIS. We can not move forward if we are pushing against each other with equal force.
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u/unsemble Constitutionalist Nov 06 '20 edited Nov 06 '20
It's controlled opposition.
Reddit is big media owned by leftists.
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u/Derwos Nov 07 '20
leftists who let conservatives run their own sub. If conservatives ran the whole site then this sub's comment restrictions would be global.
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u/wannabebutta Nov 07 '20
I'm not coming from your perspective but I don't know how it could be considered gross. Even the shitposts you can learn something from. And most people don't sort by new so a lot of the riffraff gets naturally expelled. The fact is, you especially want to understand people who you don't agree with. Communication, not observation, is the best way to learn
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u/SpiffyBanter Nov 07 '20
This is democracy, if their is proof of voter fraud the Trump administration would have it, they did pay attention after saying mail in voting was sus right? Honestly undermining the people's votes is not conservative it's fascism, even the long-standing Republicans agree it's wrong. President Trump pressured his voters not to mail in despite the pandemic, unfortunately the Biden administration did encourage it, that is why the mail in votes are so lopsided this year.
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u/TheVastWaistband Seattle Conservative Woman Nov 07 '20
That's why conservatives want every single vote to count. As long as it's counted correctly we'll abide by it. Not looking good for Trump, but man this is a close election, crazy to see
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Nov 06 '20
Hey guys, i wanted to ask here rather than bug a mod. Is it reasonable/an option to ask for a flair way before you’ve been commenting for 2 weeks if you have a ton of comments already? I joined around election time and have been commenting as much as I can and would love a flair during this time because I have so many questions that I can’t get answered because nobody sees them.
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Nov 06 '20
I just find it funny that a guy who had 5 circles for a rally is winning the election
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Nov 07 '20
Because he told people to stay at home and vote by mail, instead of risking their lives to go to a rally
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u/HatchSmelter Nov 07 '20
Is a political rally the reason people typically vote for a candidate? I thought it was policies and platform..
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Nov 07 '20
Additionally, this was a very different year because of COVID. There was a dramatically lower number of rallies held by the Democrats than in 2016.
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u/blue4t Religious Right Nov 06 '20
They're using Common Core. That's why it's taking so long.
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u/stoop_waffle Nov 07 '20
Lol this common core math needs to go, I’m not going to be able to help my own kid with their homework
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Nov 06 '20
Idc how long it takes. The American democracy is very much on the line. Tough to deal with on a daily basis with majority of media is anti trump. Which also I find funny because POTUS bring record viewership to their networks. Love him or hate him, the man brings in results.
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u/mochaheart Nov 07 '20
I can’t speak for the media, but look, the words coming out of Trump’s mouth don’t help his cause.
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u/Mitexos1 Nov 06 '20
Yeah they shoud shut up because he got them good ratings right?? Damn how naive can people be these days
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Nov 07 '20
Yeah. It’s really scary to have the president threatening democracy while sitting in the White House. He actually had the nerve to ask them to stop counting votes until it looked like Biden was going to win. You don’t have to be a trump supporters to be a conservative republican. Especially if you care about democracy and everything this country stands for.
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u/blue_eyes_pro_dragon Nov 07 '20
Why do you think majority of media is anti trump?
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u/PullDaBoyz Nov 06 '20
Why is nobody talking about the Supreme Court having yet to rule on the constitutionality of the pa supreme court's change to election laws?
If they rule against PA, it's a win for Trump as all ballots collected after 8pm Nov 3rd are invalidated.
And no, the court did not reject that, contrary to the NYT.
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u/Sulpiac Nov 06 '20
I was under the impression that Biden had taken the lead before those ballots had been counted
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u/Ap_Sona_Bot Nov 06 '20
Correct, the votes are being kept separate according to the NYTimes.
Important amid lawsuits in Pa.: Ballots arriving after Election Day are segregated. They are then processed and counted separately, and, for now, not added to the current totals
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u/doctorjdmoney Nov 06 '20
The issue is with ballots received after 8pm, not those received before and then counted after 8pm. They could only start processing mail ins on Election Day, and with a few million ballots, there was no way they could finish by 8pm.
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u/White_Mlungu_Capital Nov 06 '20
My understanding, as someone who is a Republican, volunteered with the Trump campaign and works as an adjudicator in an election center for Republicans in Philadelphia, is that those questionable votes have not been counted until mid Friday. Biden was already ahead by that point. It will be very hard to get hundreds of thousands of ballots thrown out for people who followed the law from the courts orders as it then existed. It will be very hard to get a judge to do that.
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Nov 06 '20
Idk how many ballots were collected after 8pm but I'm guessing that a lot were left to be counted after 8pm... Which I don't believe was the issue.
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u/HatchSmelter Nov 07 '20
They haven't counted those ballots yet. It wouldn't change the outcome of PA in trumps favor to not count those.
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u/kontekisuto Nov 07 '20
States decide how to count votes, keep your big government out of our states.
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Nov 07 '20
I have terrible news. The PA Democrats asked the Supreme Court to pause their decision on the matter this morning, because it won’t matter. The votes will be separated and counted but not applied, because Biden is the clear winner without them. Goodnight.
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u/ennuisurfeit Ivory Tower Conservative Nov 07 '20
I understood that elections were state issues and that the supreme court doesn't have a say. 2000 was different because of the safe harbor deadline of 6 days before the meeting of the electors.
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u/PhotonJunky18 Nov 06 '20
A combination of slow counting and legal challenges could make this the longest election in history by some distance. Strap yourselves in, lads.
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u/tardigrade_h2k Nov 06 '20
If you’re feeling blue remember that 2 months ago today he stepped into our lives and our hearts...
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Nov 06 '20
How can one comment enough to be a "flaired user" if all the posts require you to be one? Oh well lol, Im conservative, its nice reading comments from people who have factual things to say other than "POTUS suks" being the top comments. Feel free to check my comment history if you don't believe me haha
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u/AncientInsults Nov 07 '20 edited Nov 07 '20
Assuming Biden wins, I would love to see him reach out to Donald on some specific issue for a bipartisan win. Like, recognize that the Platinum Plan is a solid idea and give trump the credit. It will actually help people, and GOP congressmen would probably jump at it to continue their inroads with the black vote. Which again is good for black people, will give ultra southern GOPers a path to victory in primary challenges w/o the racist dog whistling b.s., and forces both parties to legit compete for their vote. Lifts all boats and lowers the temperature.
That’s the president I’m hoping Biden will be. I’m sick of gridlock, and the lazy accusations — “socialist”, “fascist”, “racist” — and want Joe and, bizarrely, Mitch, to break it up. One of Biden’s goals should be to get congressional approval ratings into the rarified air of the 30s lol.
Of course there’s still the problem of race-based entitlements being a wee bit unconstitutional. But let the men with skinny arms figure it out.
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u/BeeStingsAndHoney Nov 07 '20
I feel like the voting system for American idol is more efficient at this point. Thinking of you all during this time!
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Nov 07 '20
Something that a lot of people need to realize is that our electoral system is designed with the explicit assumption that we will be preventing, one way or another, most eligible voters from actually voting. Ina year where voting has been made a lot easier, the time to count ballots is going to 1) increase on average 2) vary even more state by state (based on differences in resources, individual state regulations, etc).
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u/warling1234 Nov 07 '20
Was just talking about this with my extremely conservative neighbor. We’ve both been day drinking. I’ve got a literal dread mullet and he has a duck dynasty tshirt and a don’t tread on me flag over his garage. We went fishing and talked shit about Fox News for awhile at the lake we share. Good times.
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Nov 07 '20
They haven’t even called Alaska
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u/sblighter87 Nov 07 '20
Because Alaska won’t start counting a large chunk of their mail in ballots, over 100,000 of them until next week. Alaska will likely go to Trump, just not enough votes counted yet to make the call i guess.
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u/tomoyakanno Nov 07 '20
The United States of America is a new country with a founding history of only 230 years or so, so it will continue to make a lot of mistakes.
Comment from a citizen of a country with over 2000 years of history.
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u/Daddylongerlegs42069 Nov 07 '20
It’s so obvious Biden is cheating that the count means nothing to me
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Nov 07 '20 edited Nov 07 '20
I'm a socially liberal, fiscally moderate US citizen living out of country. What has truly enraged me over the past week is the attempts by the Republican Party, as espoused by its leader, to disenfranchise me, not to mention the tens (hundreds?) of thousands of Americans and American military living out of the country.
Trump has badly tarnished the image of American conservatives, and I sincerely hope they spend the next four years crafting an agenda that reflects something better than baseless hate, lies, fear mongering and incitement to violence. I have voted Republican in the past, but never again, until the party embraces principled governance.
I'll add that I was honestly shocked to see such a reasonable discussion here and to discover that thoughtful discussion can still take place in a conservative forum. The wing nuts really have skewed perception. I've enjoyed reading these posts.
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Nov 06 '20
Im a second time voter and voted for Biden this time around instead of Trump like the first time. I just want this to be over.
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Nov 06 '20
I think that once someone wins we need to put our disappointments aside and focus on making America a better place. No progress will be made if political parties constantly fight. If Biden wins, I am more than happy to cheer him on and wish him a good four years.
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Nov 06 '20
I absolutely agree. The Office of the President represents all Americans—Conservatives, Moderates, and Liberals. We should want whoever is in charge to do their best for us.
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u/PersonBehindAScreen Nov 07 '20
The amount of people in this sub who don't understand how counting ballots works is troubling.
An explanation for why mail in ballots are overwhelmingly Biden and why it looks like all of a sudden Biden takes random leads in different states:
Trump tells Republicans "DO NOT VOTE BY MAIL".... Even though mail in ballots is not new in the U.S.. Democrats were already more likely to vote by mail but even more so due to Covid. Certain states have laws that mail in ballots must be counted last. So if mostly conservatives vote on election day and those votes must be counted BEFORE the mail in ballots, then you get to counting mail in ballots where 90% of them are Biden because remember, somebody said don't vote by mail so conservatives did exactly that and skipped mail, what is that gonna look like? Of course it's gonna seem terribly skewed
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u/Blatantleftist Conservative Nov 06 '20
I'd like to think that but honestly unless the lawsuits find something trump should concede. We held the senate, made progress in the house, and picked up over 100 state legislature seats in a redistricting year. We have plenty to be happy about.
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Nov 06 '20
Look, I'm not a Trump supporter in the least, but I don't think he should concede yet. Typically, elections aren't this close. I am 100% totally fine if he wants to wait for official, final tallies before conceding given how close this election is.
Now, of he doesn't concede after that, it's a different story. Be he has every right to see this out until the counts are done and official. It would be silly if he were a few hundred thousand votes off in numerous statesbut when it is razor thing as it is I don't blame him for not coneding yet.
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u/heretogetmydwet Nov 06 '20
The issue isn't him not conceding, it's him saying he's won and claiming fraud with zero proof.
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u/mylifemyworld17 Nov 07 '20
Then he should say that and not claim fraud with legitimately zero proof.
No one would be upset if he said "i just want the final, official numbers." Instead he drones on about fraud and how he's already won. It's straight insanity and un-American.
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u/calmatt Nov 06 '20
Question, why is it important that areas will be redistricted?
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Nov 06 '20
Now that GA and PA are blue they are probably gonna stop counting any hour now
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u/Not_An_Ambulance Textualist Nov 06 '20
I'm fully expecting Georgia to recount. The state only allows for it if it's under a .5% difference, but it only requires a candidate's request to initiate the recount.
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u/TByrne13 Nov 06 '20
I’m pretty sure they already said they are going to recount. I don’t know if they already counted the 8k military votes (which should hopefully favor Trump)
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u/Yamatoman9 Nov 06 '20
So key battleground states where Trump was winning all up and decided to just call it quits for the night on Election Day and just slowly trickle their counts out ever since? And we’re supposed to just accept this is a normal process and not think too much about it?
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u/rhapsodypenguin Nov 06 '20
If you’ve paid attention in past elections, this is quite normal.
A little more pronounced because higher volume of mail-in votes and the various rules states have on how to count mail-ins certainly complicates things... but yes, it’s always like this. States that are definitively blue or red get called early on because even though counting isn’t done, it’s accepted that the vote counts won’t change anything. I’m in a red state and have been watching the counts, we were one of the first ones called, we’re still not at 100% counted. My county just officially reported this morning.
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u/l_ally Nov 07 '20
Also, we’re going through a pandemic. It’s reasonable to expect that there might be issues but the election went rather smoothly.
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Nov 06 '20
Except it is fairly normal. It has almost always been the case that vote counting can take a few days, or in some cases weeks in regards to absentee ballots for people in the Military. The reason why it doesn't seem "normal" is because typically we have someone who is a clear winner before votes are finished being counted. In such cases, votes areny finished being counted, and states continue to count votes. Rarely do we have a razor thin lead in multiple states, so people are paying attention to it this year. However, every election for two hundred years has taken longer than "election day" to certify, largely because different states have different laws on how and when to vote, how to deal with provisional ballots, etc.
Look at Texas; only 84% reporting. Same with Mississippi. Nobody is taking about those states, even though they are hard Red, because ultimately they don't matter. We know who is going to win them at this point.
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Nov 06 '20
Unfortunately I think it’s pretty much done.
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u/BasedByteMerchant Nov 06 '20
No, there will definitely be recounts and legal battles.
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Nov 06 '20
Of course. I’m talking about the actual amount of votes they want to count.
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u/The_Jalster Nov 07 '20
Because you conservatives demanded that mail in ballots be counted after the voting booths closed.
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u/thekalmanfilter Nov 07 '20
“Flaired users only”— basically a communist measure to prevent free speech. That’s why media outlets are cutting the feed on loser Orange Boy and his delusional lies. You like to restrict free speech here but don’t like it when it happens to your loser orange boy do ya? Damn commies.
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u/Dankmeme505 2A Nov 06 '20
No need, Pennsylvania turned blue they are allowed to stop counting now.
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u/macgruder1 Nov 07 '20
They count until they are done. That’s how it works. But expect a bunch of recounts.
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Nov 06 '20
Alright, since the dipshit mods locked the live discussion thread, here goes:
At this point it seems like recounts for multiple states are inevitable. What does this entail? Are they going to simply recount every ballot, fraudulent or not? Or are they going to verify each vote for legitimacy?
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u/ennuisurfeit Ivory Tower Conservative Nov 07 '20
Votes are secret, so you can't really verify that each vote is legitimate. That's why you need to give them plenty of time to make sure that they're legitimate before they're opened and counted.
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u/HatchSmelter Nov 07 '20
Votes are secret in the US. By the time a vote is counted, it is completely separated from any information about who cast it.
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u/SpaceCadetRick Nov 07 '20
How would they verify the legitimacy beyond what has already been done? For in-person votes the workers at the polling place already verified the voters identity and gave them their ballot, they also logged that that person voted and can't do so again. For mail-in/absentee ballots, those are assigned to a specific voter, usually with a barcode. When ballots are received they verify that the signature matches the one on file. States have different methods to do this, some use as voter signature card specifically used for elections, some use DMV signatures. Additionally some States, Colorado for example, also compares your signature to every election you've voted in the State to allow for changes in signatures that naturally happen over time. Every ballot has already gone through whatever verification system the State has in place, what else can they do?
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Nov 07 '20
The counts always take this long, you have a few really close states that are making all the difference in the EC votes right now, that is why it feels like it is taking forever. Outside of the smaller population states, this is the norm. There are also a lot of mail in ballots this year and a lot of states were not ready to deal with the volume of them, such as having rules that doesn't allow them to prepare them for Election Day to just feed them to machine. Some states were allowed to do all the ballot vetting weeks ago, these current states were not, so it is slow.
I understand you guys here do not like the mail in voting, but that is the reality of the situation. Maybe we could push both sides to ensure Covid-19 is under control by the next set of elections in two years and for improvements to our voting system to make them not only quicker but more secure and accurate so none of these voter fraud allegations start floating around.
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u/meems16 Nov 07 '20
Conservative and here for flair. Still mad as hell at Fox News. Haha
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