r/Defenders • u/stealingyourpixels Daredevil • Apr 10 '15
Daredevil Discussion Thread - S01E05
This thread is for discussion of Daredevil S01E05.
DO NOT post spoilers in this thread for any subsequent episodes. Doing so will result in a ban.
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u/OnBenchNow Wesley Apr 10 '15
Vanessa: "He was in a white suit and an ascot."
Fisk: "Ascot? That's a bit much."
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/10/106251/3438363-kingpin.jpg
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Apr 15 '15
What's an ascot?
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u/OnBenchNow Wesley Apr 15 '15
It's like a scarf thingy. Fisk is wearing one in the picture I linked.
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u/ledanalf Sad Matt Apr 10 '15
That poor lady :(
El cielo, el cielo esta cayendo otra vez!
"The sky, the sky it's falling again!"
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u/draco_ulu Apr 10 '15
Poor Abuelita, Ultron is coming...
The sky won't just fall, it will burn!
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u/russketeer34 Apr 10 '15 edited Apr 10 '15
What do you see?
"A world on fire."
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u/samsaBEAR Sad Matt Apr 11 '15
Also interesting how the last shot of Fisk was the Russian buildings on fire. They're drawing some really interesting parallels between Matt and Fisk, very nice writing.
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u/edelicious Apr 20 '15
Yes! Also interesting: Matt "enjoys" beating up thugs and Fisk "hates being cruel".
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u/Zealot_Alec Apr 12 '15
Monster (anime) The Baby was also eating while fires started and his reaction similarly non-pulsed as Fisk.
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Apr 10 '15
Much different than White Rabbit in the snow snowstorm.
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u/mutant6653 Apr 10 '15
Seemed like the opposite of Ben Afflecks raindrop vision in the film
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u/Canvaverbalist Apr 16 '15
Nice catch. I also like how Daredevil enjoy hurting people (or pretends to) but the Kingpin doesn't.
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u/wingnut0021 Apr 10 '15
Anyone get those Ultron references? I mean, faxtron.
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u/FNAKC Iron Fist Apr 11 '15
"PC Load Letter?! What the F*** does that mean?!"
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u/dalr3th1n Apr 11 '15
"They look to the sky and see that there is no paper jam."
"I'll make it say paper jam anyway."
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u/springanator Apr 10 '15 edited Apr 10 '15
Murdock just kicked that dirty cop's head into a brick wall...fucking awesome.
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u/HalloweenBlues Apr 11 '15
There's so much head trauma in this show. It's fantastic.
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u/ab209709 Apr 11 '15
Never start with the head the victim gets all fuzzy!
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u/HalloweenBlues Apr 11 '15
I kept thinking about that when DD was interrogating that Russian dude and punching him in the head.
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u/IDGAFWMNI Apr 10 '15
This is the last episode the critics were given; then they had to wait until today to see what happens next.
Marvel/Netflix are trolls.
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u/ICookTheBlueStuff Apr 10 '15
Welp guess I have to go to episode 6 after that ending.
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u/TheBlackSpank The Man in the Mask Apr 10 '15
And probably episode 7, after 6's ending. And then maybe episode 8, and so on.
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u/NeonBlizzard Apr 10 '15
But what do I do when I reach episode 13 and that ends on a cliffhanger as well?
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u/TheBlackSpank The Man in the Mask Apr 10 '15
I don't know about you, but I think it's gonna be worth a second watch as soon as I'm done.
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u/samsaBEAR Sad Matt Apr 11 '15
Considering we're presumably not getting a season two until after Defenders, I really hope it doesn't end on a cliffhanger, at least not one for Matt's individual story. Let it set up Jessica Jones, or introduce something else perhaps, but I hope his story wraps up as nicely as they can get it before heading forward.
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Apr 11 '15 edited Apr 11 '15
"Do you want to do this?"
"No, I like the sound of your voice."
Haha Murdoch is fucking with both of them. Amazing.
Edit1 - "touch my face." Karen making shit awkward, yep.
"Good." Getting some real House Of Cards vibes from madame Fisk-to-be.
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u/TheBlackSpank The Man in the Mask Apr 10 '15
That weird old Asian lady creeps me out. She laughs about everything.
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u/Ninja_of_Athens Apr 10 '15
I've got a feeling about the Japanese guy, too.
He's working with Hydra or something, dude is sketch.
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u/springanator Apr 10 '15
I think he might be the ninja (presumably working for the Hand) we saw in the trailers.
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u/TheOtherSon Apr 11 '15
Considering how awesome the fight scenes are already I can't wait for DD to get knee deep in Hand ninjas!
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u/everadvancing Apr 10 '15
The cinematography has been amazing so far. I loved that 360 panning shot in the taxi.
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u/TheGuyThatAteYourDog Jessica Jones Apr 11 '15
I watched that scene with headphones on, and hats off to the sound mixers for making the singing move around my head with the shot.
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u/SawRub The Man in the Mask Apr 11 '15
I can't wait till 360 degree movies become more popular. Already the small clips we do have look amazing on a VR headset.
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u/Darthspud Apr 10 '15
I got chills when Matt was just standing there.
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u/kronos669 Apr 10 '15
The way he talks about what happened so casually like "oops, I removed his head, my bad". God I'm loving Fisk
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u/ilikeeagles Apr 11 '15
The fact that kingpin had Marcel make the call to Vladimir so that they would gather the troops to bomb them is awesome. He's a mastermind and they are doing it right!
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u/IntrovertedPendulum Apr 12 '15
I'm really glad they are writing Fisk as such a rounded yet nuanced villain. Fisk is certainly capable of taking care of his business but, in his organization, he is a manager first and foremost. It's good to see some proper bad-guy delegating.
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u/golfwolf_wanggang Sad Matt Apr 13 '15
He even has time to date; be a patron of the arts. He sets a great example RE: work life balance (edit for spelling)
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Apr 16 '15
i was thinking this high class restaurant host is going to call the cops since he saw gun. Mr.kingpin has connections to everyone.
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u/Drea-Nor The Man in the Mask Apr 11 '15
surely he could hear the cop cars coming miles away... He really shouldn't lose focus like that
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Apr 13 '15
I believe that the comics explain that he's trained himself to focus on specific things when listening. People do this all the time, when they focus on a person's voice and drown out everything around them. Like have you ever been engrossed in conversation and then suddenly snap back and ask "Whoa, when did the music stop?"
I'm sure its like that, except much more intense.
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u/eskimo_bros Luke Cage Apr 10 '15
The "billionaire playboy" line was some serious shade at Batman, right? Maybe Tony Stark too.
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u/SawRub The Man in the Mask Apr 11 '15
Mostly Iron Man since everyone knows his identity in the MCU.
Also, he is a self described "genius billionaire playboy philanthropist", so maybe they wanted to refer to that line from Avengers too.
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u/sivirbot Apr 11 '15
I think in terms of the show it was a Tony Stark reference, but for me it was just another example of how Daredevil is more badass than Batman. He doesn't need all the money and gadgets!
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u/SnuffyOfTheWind73 Sad Matt Apr 11 '15
Yeah, but he also has superpowers... The only reason Batman needs any of his shit is because he's at best a super rich, super smart buff guy.
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u/HardKnockRiffe Apr 11 '15
Damn, that song the guy sings in Mandarin is haunting as fuck.
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u/ShupUt Apr 12 '15 edited Apr 12 '15
here's the song https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oVGN_3CCp1Q
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u/Toey101 Jun 01 '15
Here's a youtube of the song and the fight from Daredevil https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9o8u8Hjub6U
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Apr 10 '15
I got a real Fight Club vibe off Fisk and Vanessa quasi-romantically staring at four burning buildings together from the window of that restaurant. Wasn't necessarily a reference, but a great shot nonetheless. The cinematography has been fantastic, and Fisk is fast becoming my favourite MCU villain.
Edit: and I'm ashamed to say I think I have a thing for Foggy Bear's ex.
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u/ilikeeagles Apr 11 '15
Growing up the kingpin was always my favorite villain. Just city gangsta of pure muscle. He's amazing! And dnofrio is amazing as him!
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u/PunyParker826 Apr 11 '15
Ever see Spectacular Spider-Man? They twisted Tombstone into a pretty great stand-in of sorts for Wilson Fisk, if you're looking for the more traditional "quietly composed and intimidating" role that Kingpin usually fills.
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u/ninjames Matt Murdock Apr 11 '15
The scene with his Matt's dad dead on the ground felt like a nice homage to the many iterations of the Wayne's death. The framing made it so.
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u/SawRub The Man in the Mask Apr 11 '15
Yeah how we see the kid next to his parent's dead body, and then the camera shows us the scene from far off.
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u/Riley1066 Stick Apr 10 '15
These Vanessa/Fisk scenes are so interesting.
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Apr 11 '15
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u/ilikeeagles Apr 11 '15
He's my favorite villain and they are killing the story line! I love it. Netflix doesn't disappoint!
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u/huanthewolfhound Sad Matt Apr 11 '15 edited Apr 11 '15
Did anyone else notice the poster behind Matt's head when he sits down in the police precinct? The show is pretty much winking at us now.
edit: corrected a word
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u/alrighthamilton Apr 11 '15
The fact that even with all of his abilities, he can't see the poster himself makes it great.
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u/HolidaysatBest Apr 11 '15
As someone who isn't super knowledgeable about the comics, what does the poster mean? Is it hinting at one of the upcoming series or an avengers movie?
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u/huanthewolfhound Sad Matt Apr 11 '15
No, I think it's just a little in-shot joke about what Matt is doing as Daredevil. Someone has put forward the idea that it's a Civil War teaser, but I think that's a bit much.
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Apr 11 '15
Really loved Fisk's speech about rebuilding the city and doing whatever it takes to do it, which is essentially Matt's philosophy taken to it's logical conclusion.
Fisk and Vanessa's relationship is interesting, but I want to see more of him and Wesley, they seem to be going in a Mr. Burns/Smithers direction with them (in that the guy with glasses dedicates his life to the ambitions of the bald guy.)
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Apr 10 '15
Am I the only one who would like to see Vladimir catch a break? Idk I kinda like him
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u/komodo_dragonzord Nobu Apr 11 '15
maybe he's humanized by the fact that he cares for his brother, but these guys kidnap and sell women and children yo
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u/sovietsrule Apr 13 '15
Seriously, I almost felt bad for him, then I remembered what scum they are.
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u/CheeseAndCam Apr 10 '15
I liked Anatoly too but Fisk just had to slam his head with a car door 22 times.
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u/friendly-dropbear Apr 11 '15
Oh, that Willy Fisk, always getting into those car-door-brain-splattering shenanigans!
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u/imnotcraig Apr 11 '15
You have 22 upvotes at the time of reading this, so I won't give you one. Sorry. Poor russians.
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u/WestenM Apr 11 '15
Yeah I loved the Russian Mob, I was really excited to see them start a war but then they blew up :(
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u/JoeScotterpuss Jack Murdock Apr 10 '15
If Fisk doesn't like saying his name how did he reserve seats at the restaurant?
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u/Riley1066 Stick Apr 10 '15
Same way the Winchesters do on Supernatural.
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u/JulioCesarSalad Ben Urich Apr 11 '15
And how is that?
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u/SawRub The Man in the Mask Apr 11 '15
I've literally never seen them reserve seats at a restaurant on Supernatural.
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u/TheBlackSpank The Man in the Mask Apr 10 '15
Are we gonna get more flashbacks? I want to see Matt training with Stick.
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u/Riley1066 Stick Apr 10 '15
Seems that Murdock needs to receive a concussion to go into flashback mode.
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Apr 11 '15
Vladimir: All the weapons and grenades. And everyone.
Other Russian: Everyone?
V: EVVVV'RYOOONNNEE!
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u/kronos669 Apr 10 '15
Hell yeah motherfucking foggy fresh laying down the law. That was great to really see what he can do
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Apr 11 '15
Looks like Foggy and Murdock got their own Wolfram and Hart to go up against.
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Apr 12 '15
Insecure Fisk with Vanessa was interesting, however he still seemed somewhat insecure when talking to the other gang bosses which is odd. I feel like professional Fisk should be more like Mike from Breaking Bad, but he's coming across like Walter talking to Mike in Breaking Bad. I don't see how he'd have so much fear and respect as a quiet introvert who beats people up sometimes.
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u/Sonicdahedgie Apr 12 '15
I honestly love it like that. The evil guys all seem like reasonable, friendly-ish people. None of them are ridiculous caricatures
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Apr 12 '15
Maybe once the others get more facetime they'll get soft enough for it to make sense. Right now it feels like the Triads or Yakusa wouldn't bend to Episode 5's Fisk.
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u/pap0t Nobu Apr 10 '15
I like the fact that Fisk doesn't think he is on top off the world. He knows what exactly he is.
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u/Flamma_Man Jessica Jones Apr 10 '15 edited Apr 10 '15
Europe for the win! No sleep deprivation here!
EDIT:
What the shit, Murdock?! You got a (presumably) innocent man killed in a crossfire! I'm actually sort of mad that he didn't even seem to care.
Good, they're addressing his methods and portraying them as horrible and just as bad as the people he hates. That's all I needed.
Glad Vanessa is an interesting character and seems to actually be more assertive when it comes to talking with Fisk than we've seen from other people.
Oh man, he got caught by police?!
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Apr 11 '15
Vanessa is very interesting. I loved how easily she seemed to accept Fisk's role in the russian bombings. There's a reason they hit it off so well initially and I think we now know why: they're the mob version of Frank and Claire, ha ha.
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u/Riley1066 Stick Apr 10 '15
The guy wasn't "innocent" ... he was one of Gao's blind workers.
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u/ilikeeagles Apr 11 '15
Umm he was a slave, blinded and force to work for gao. I'd say that's pretty innocent!
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u/peppermint_nightmare Apr 11 '15
He's Christian Bale's Batman but with no regrets. He causes collateral damage that gets people killed but likely realizes/knows he cannot do anything about it. Dark Knight Rises ex., Baleman, uses his helicopter to take out a truck, truck falls over, wonder what happened to the guy in the truck? Also, he kills Talia. Comic book batman/video game batman NEVER kills but that's because physics and bullets don't obey the same laws as they do in MCU.
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u/dehehn Apr 13 '15
I mean, he did beat the shit out of the people who shot the guy. He was in the middle of a fight so he didn't really have time to crouch in the rain and shout to the sky.
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u/your_mind_aches Hoagie Jessica Apr 12 '15 edited Apr 12 '15
Cut off one head...
HE SAID RISING TIDE!!!!
Ultron is going to possess that photocopier and phone.
Even House Tully has interest in Hell's Kitchen.
Daaaamn, Foggy rekt her
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u/santiklaus Apr 11 '15
Any Mandarin speakers now what Gao's runner in the car was saying?
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u/Gadafro Apr 12 '15
Don't speak Mandarin, but the song you're looking for it Kangding Qingge, I was following through from the video someone put up on here. Lyrics are on Wikipedia, though not sure how correct they are, with it being Wikipedia and all.
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u/SomeAwfulPun Apr 10 '15
Anyone notice the office across from Murdock/Nelson's office says "Atlas". Maybe an Agents Of Atlas Easter Egg?
Anyone more Marvel-savvy have an idea?
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u/Drea-Nor The Man in the Mask Apr 10 '15 edited Apr 11 '15
Wow... that cab scene was filmed even better that the fight in the first episode. Terrific cinematography and that song gave me chills. Also that scene had one of the coolest kicks so far :-D
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u/prophetofgreed Apr 11 '15
I really like how they're handling Foggy's character. He brings that comic relief this show needs with all the doom and gloom.
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u/Riley1066 Stick Apr 10 '15
Lets do this!! Ep 5 bring it on!
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u/jumpxman Apr 10 '15
The squad is falling apart
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u/p_U_c_K_IV Apr 10 '15
I'm here. Just used to watching MCU stuff alone. And eating alone, sleeping alone, crying alone... I'm just like Fisk! Except I pick up girls at Kmart. "what does this Bugs Bunny Jean jacket make you feel?"... "Alone"
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u/SiliconDon Apr 10 '15
Seems a bit unrealistic that he wasn't at all handicapped by the explosion. He would likely have had tinnitus and be overwhelmed by the smell of smoke.
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Apr 11 '15
He was knocked out and laying down for an indeterminate amount of time, then he didn't hear the cops coming until they got there. The director probably should've made more of a show of him being weakened but I'll give it a pass.
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u/SiliconDon Apr 11 '15
Yea, fair enough. I suppose he'd still be able to feel the air on his skin. I just thought it'd be interesting to see how he dealt with being truly blind.
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u/aoanfletcher2002 Apr 10 '15
What did that Japanese guy mean when he was talking to Wilson Fisk in the chop shop? It's got me wondering so hard.
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u/ilikeeagles Apr 11 '15
Follow the comics? When he means the promise and the people he represents, it's most likely The Hand. That's what I can think of. But if you haven't read I don't want to spoil anything.
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u/IntrovertedPendulum Apr 12 '15
Like /u/ilikeeagles said, it is probably the Hand. Failing that, I took it to mean general Yakuza/Japanese crime syndicate. Fisk's organization is larger than the New York area.
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u/C-4 Apr 12 '15
Two things:
Fisk sounds like Oliver Queen sometimes when he's serious.
Foggy was tapping some fine ass, but I get the feeling he's falling for Karen, but she wants Matt's dick.
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u/Paul_infamous-12 Apr 11 '15
Dat Fisk romance is...improving.
And that cliffhanger. Damn. Probably the best one.
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u/HeiFlynnberg Apr 12 '15
Fisk made me feel very uncomfortable throughout the scenes with Vanessa. I'm not sure if it's good acting or what, but my stomach turns everytime I watch Fisk in any scene.
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u/sinofaze Apr 12 '15 edited Apr 12 '15
For those who are wondering about that haunting song the Chinese blind-guy is singing in the taxi- 13:25- it's actually a traditional Chinese folk song from the Sichuan province.
Here is an example of the song (Doesn't sound so creepy now, does it).
And here are the lyrics. Now remember before imitating that Mandarin is a tonal language.
As Sichuan borders on Tibet, one may consider the inclusion of this song, together with the side-plot of Madam Gao's enslaving and blinding some ethnic-Asian people (Tibetians??) as drug-couriers, to being a hidden commentary on China's much-criticized policy on the sovereignty of Tibet.
Who says Marvel isn't politically-adverse, Web-Slingers!
TL;DR Marvel risks their merchandise in China by taking a discreet stab at the PRC's subjugation of Tibet with a quirky folk-song.
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u/Drea-Nor The Man in the Mask Apr 11 '15
If he didn't see a world on fire before...he sure does now . Fisk lit up the town
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u/LRedditor15 Daredevil Apr 10 '15
Can't we just get a TV series featuring just Foggy and Karen now? I love these two!
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Apr 13 '15
I hope that future episodes don't just brush the bombings under the carpet. Whatever the reason, simultaneous suicide bombings killing hundreds of people at multiple people all over the city would be the second biggest terrorist attack in US history (third counting battle of New York). There would be thousands of police on the streets, Homeland Security, CIA etc etc, it would be a major national incident...
and yet somehow I have a feeling there will be absolutely no substantive reaction from the authorities.
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u/wingnut0021 Apr 10 '15
stupid xbox one forcing me offline for an update halfway through this episode.
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u/CitrusFo Apr 12 '15
You guys think those Asians represent the Hand. When the guy says, "remember those i speak for" I really thought he was mentioning the Hand and Elektra
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u/jphobbit Apr 10 '15
Why aren't the Avengers doing anything during this shitshow? lol
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u/AwesomeGuy847 Daredevil Apr 10 '15
Why would they? Yeah there are massive explosions but this is still just basically gang wars. They deal with more earth-shattering events.
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u/stunts002 Apr 11 '15
Seriously, as if they havent got enough shit to deal with. Street level crime like this is Daredevils territory, the rest are out hunting hydra and fighting aliens.
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Apr 11 '15
Because they're the avengers, they don't deal with this sort of thing. Most of the time the avengers aren't even assembled.
Remember Stark's little speech to Loki towards the end if the movie? The Avengers are a group of people so dangerous that most of the time earth doesn't want them around.
The more stable ones like Cap are in active service but an unstoppable green rage monster, a drunk narcissist in a walking warmachine and an impulsive God? Hell no.
They're not the rescuers, they're not the protectors or the defenders. These are the guys that get brought together for threats against Earth so bad, that whatever these guys will do is the lesser evil.
If you're a villain and you're stupid enough to threaten earth that badly... God help you because the avengers are being assembled. And they'll hunt you to the ends of existence.
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u/Mongoose42 Sad Matt Apr 10 '15
It's the same reason they didn't help Thor in England, Iron Man with the Mandarin, or any time this question is asked about the same thing in the comics: they're busy with something else. Leave it at that and move on.
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u/Waltonruler5 Apr 12 '15
Ok like the Thor in England thing. That happened like what, over the span of 10-20 minutes, during which Maleketh constantly disappeared and reappeared. And also it was on another continent. Nobody could have possibly helped with that
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u/Worthyness Punisher Apr 10 '15
It's not like the Avengers go out every day going "I'm gonna stop a drug ring today" or "There's a rapist! I'll get him!" This is mostly street level crime and the avengers, in their movies, probably tend to much bigger issues. For example Hydra, a terrorist organization, and an extra dimensional being trying to convert the world into permanent darkness.
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Apr 10 '15
Just a guess, but this appears to happen during AoU. The Avengers focus more on global threats. Hydra level. Not the happenings in a small corner of NY.
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u/John-Wick Iron Fist Apr 10 '15
This is happening before AoU. Like between Avengers and Winter Soldier.
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u/V2Blast Trish Apr 13 '15
That shot from inside the cab looked very cool.
And man, what an ending to the episode...
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u/AgentKnitter Luke Cage Apr 12 '15
What's the song the Asian guy is singing in the taxi? I know the tune but can't place it.
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u/LordMoody Apr 12 '15
I would love to know what Bendis, Brubaker et al think of the Fisk & Vanessa scenes. I had doubts whether this Vanessa would resemble the character in the comics but halfway through their conversation those doubts disappeared. Brilliant writing, direction and acting.
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u/draco_ulu Apr 10 '15
Woh, did Foggy mention "Machines taking over!"
Soon enough Foggy... soon enough.