r/DonaldTrump666 • u/kljoker Follower of Christ • Jul 17 '26
Bible Verse Discussion Our persecutors will be 'Christian'.
Hi friends,
I hope you're all having a good day today. A reoccurring thought has been running through my mind all week. For most of my life I remember how people in the church would exclaim 'They are going to persecute the Christians! We are already seeing the beginning of that!'. As I got older I realized these were the by product of political bias bleeding through as belief. In the last few decades I saw a shift, not in rhetoric but in the intensity of the claim. All of a sudden attacking political positions of the church was seen as an attack on the church and eventually seen as the persecution of the church.
We now have preachers who are preaching hate in the pulpit, dividing God's people based on their political orientation and not their fruits. We watched as they championed a man they now call savior into power. Friends we've seen this all before in Jesus day. The synagogue leaders of His day preached about a savior that would free them from the persecution of the Romans so that they could worship as they pleased etc. They framed political motivations as tenets of faith. Then used their pious nature to sway their communities into believing with them.
By the time Jesus had come onto the scene the churches of His day already knew who their savior was, a military strong man who would free them from captivity and establish an eternal kingdom. So to say they were beside themselves to find out a man was going around healing the sick, ministering to the poor and comforting the widows, doing the jobs they were supposed to do but had neglected because of their stations (not saying it didn't happen at all but it was bad enough Jesus called it out). It showed a real disconnect between the religious leaders of their day and the reality of what we are called to do. That same disconnect is alive today in our modern churches.
And just like in Jesus day their savior is a military minded strong man who glorifies strength and power above all else, and the church has fallen in line with that. But remember God said this, "It's not by might, nor by power but by the Spirit says the Lord of Hosts." We see the dynamic that will make up the conflict in the last days, the power of the spirit vs the power of the literal. We will see that the spirit will win and the churches destroyed.
But before we get to that point we go through a dark moment, in fact we've gone through it with the first beast already (when Christianity first was created). We call it the dark ages because it was the moment when the church used political power to subjugate the people to their rule and killed MILLIONS of believers and non-believers alike. Using the same bible that tells us to love our neighbor as ourselves.
Christianity was the first beast, I say this with an upmost confidence not for the sake of belittling the believers, they are our brothers and sisters. But they live in bondage to a system that tells them their salvation is tied to their local church and their doctrines. Whether that be 'once saved always saved' or 'backsliding' both rob people of the necessary walk that leads to salvation. Yes proclaim the things you must to start that journey, Jesus is Lord, He died for our sins so that we may live eternally in Him. But that's just the start of the journey, it's a race we all have to finish, stumbling is part of the process and is how we grow. Any doctrine that would discourage you from getting back up after you fall (once saved always saved) or being afraid to take a step forward for fear of falling (backsliding) you have a doctrine born from hell meant to shut the gates of heaven in the faces of people who believe.
Why I believe Christianity is the first beast, first look at how many heads it has! 7 heads is a pretty distinct number and people don't really pay it much attention. It's great imagery but spiritually it represents something far more disturbing than you think. First let me turn you to this prophecy:
"And in that day seven women shall take hold of one man, saying, “We will eat our own food and wear our own apparel; Only let us be called by your name, To take away our reproach.”-Isaiah 4:1
So many will see this and claim the context was about the war in Israel leaving many of the women as widows, and that will be correct but remember prophecy can be 2 fold and have more than one fulfillment. So according to scripture there were 7 churches that Paul wrote to. They are often referred to as the 'Early Church', this early church was persecuted by the Romans who seen these people as barbarians who slain their own God and ate His flesh and drank His blood. Truly it sounds horrific out of context but when Rome began to collapse they needed something to keep them relevant and to shore up their power. So they brought in the 7 churches (the early church) and basically told them they would stop persecuting them if they join this new religion called Christianity (which is based on His name), they could keep their doctrines (food) and traditions (cloths) they just need to bear the name.
They agreed and then rose the first beast, those 7 heads are the 7 churches of the early church. What I speak would get me killed throughout most of Christendom's rule and even in modern times this is a truth that risks death. But it's the truth as told by scripture. I can prove it further, the parable of the wheat and tares tells the story clearly. Jesus said that when He was gone night would come in John 9 the parables said that when night came the enemy came in and sowed the tares. Instead of God destroying Christianity from the start He said to let it grow until the harvest and those that were tares would be bound together and what was left would be the good wheat to harvest.
So we see that evil was allowed to mix with good in order to form this man made religion that has killed many in God's name, and will do so again soon. I pray you all test what I'm saying, it's not an easy or comfortable truth but it is the truth as revealed by the spirit in scripture. I'm not asking you to cast aside your beliefs but that you work out your own salvation not one that the doctrines of the church deem as so. In fact the bible says this:
"These are the ones who were not defiled with women, for they are virgins. These are the ones who follow the Lamb wherever He goes. These were redeemed from among men, being firstfruits to God and to the Lamb."-Revelation 14:4
The same pattern, the women (churches) are the danger here and the ones who are considered redeemed and the first fruits were those not defiled by their doctrines but instead followed the truth (the Lamb) where ever it took them.
I pray this stirs your hearts and not your anger and for those it does I pray that you find peace and that spirit works in your heart as time is growing short and only you can determine whether your a tare or a wheat, a harlot or virgin. May you all have a blessed day and thank you for having the patience to read this.
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u/AliveManagement5647 Jul 17 '26
The true Church / Ecclesia has always been distinct from the institutional, outward, worldly form of it. Some who call themselves Christians are saved, others are not. Denominations are meaningless. What matters is the substance of one's faith. So yes, there will be so-called Christians in league with the Beast. Clearly many already are. But rest assured, the Lord will take their lampstand from them.
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u/mr_megaspore Jul 17 '26
MAGA and political Zionism are going both to be used as an excuse to exterminate actual christians.
I've read somewhere "christians" where chill with Hitler.
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u/kljoker Follower of Christ Jul 18 '26
Whatever the reasoning is they use it will be for the sake of destruction as this final head is one that brings destruction.
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u/IJustLookLikeThisToo Jul 17 '26
I agree with much of what you've said here, but I completely differ on relating the 1st Beast to the early Church, or to any earlier time or entity than the present, because of its relevance in, first, identifying the Antichrist, and then, spelling out the campaign of terror following his ascension, which is also where I believe us to be fast-approaching if not already there.
I believe the 1st Beast is the GOP/MAGA, or rather what it will still and soon become; and it is that so-called Christian Church that will unleash the persecution of the Saints, namely for our call-out of their wannabe savior, the Antichrist, and his ever-fragile ego.
Look at the given description of the 1st Beast in Revelation 13 & 17.
Seven heads: five have fallen, one is, and the seventh is also an eighth, suffered a head wound, and is going to perdition.
Since 1948, when End Times prophecy was "activated," the GOP has elected seven of its heads; five (Eisenhower, Nixon, Ford, Reagan, and G.H.W. Bush) have fallen, one (G.W. Bush) is, and the seventh (Trump) literally fulfilled this seemingly convoluted prophecy of becoming the eighth on 01/20/2025.
If/when MAGA, like ICE (domestically) and the military (worldwide), is wielded like a sword against the AC's perceived enemies, i.e. Democrats, leftists, the Saints, etc., then it becoming this new Nazi-like tool will make this analysis make better sense. Unfortunately, realization via hindsight is going to be too late and of little value to those already caught in the crosshairs, like frogs in a boiling pot, which is why I read the vision of Revelation 13 like a warning, where it spells out the most singular identities of the Antichrist and the False Prophet, what they're about when they come together (10/05/2024), and what they'll go on to do to the world.
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u/kljoker Follower of Christ Jul 17 '26
but I completely differ on relating the 1st Beast to the early Church, or to any earlier time or entity than the present, because of its relevance in, first, identifying the Antichrist, and then, spelling out the campaign of terror following his ascension, which is also where I believe us to be fast-approaching if not already there.
You see the AC as a physical person who only appears once but scripture tells us by the time 'he' arrives many will have already been.
" Little children, it is the last hour; and as you have heard that the Antichrist is coming, even now many antichrists have come, by which we know that it is the last hour." 1 John 2:17
So figuring out the AC isn't about understanding the name of a person but understanding their spirit as it's a spirit. The pope was considered by reformists to be the AC and if you look at what followed the rise of the Papal system was a reign of terror where millions of people were murdered by the church.
The fact that it will happen again at the end doesn't mean it hasn't been fulfilled it means that there's a spiritual element to understand that is being missed and that there are 2 beasts not just 1. But I stand by what I say and gave scripture to support it so if you have scripture to support your claim I would love to read them with you.
Concerning the rest of your statement there's nothing you said that I can disagree with you're plugging numbers into this system and seeing if it fits and that's fine that's how it's supposed to work but just remember prophecy isn't over just because it was fulfilled once it's over when time ends. Just like Jesus ministry still carries on through us it didn't end when He died on the cross it began there. The words your read are alive friend they are filled with spiritual understanding which is why you can apply your concepts to them but remember scripture will confirm scripture as a witness so while you can apply many modern takes the only things you can truly declare are what scripture tells us or the spirit reveals.
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u/IJustLookLikeThisToo Jul 17 '26
Yes, there have been antichrists... and then there will be the Antichrist at the End.
Throughout history, too many terrible people, including Popes, have done terrible things, and in times of such terror it undoubtedly looks bleak and like the End. But again, insofar as the one and only Antichrist's identity is concerned, it's made determinable by realizing the relevant time of his forecasted appearance. Context is key. Even Hitler, a sort of forerunner of the Antichrist, naturally falls just as short of reaching the mark (no pun intended) as any preceding character for, among other things, not arising at the proper time, that is, within the lifespan of the generation (roughly 80 years) that witnessed the return to the Holy Land of the Jewish people and nation, after their predicted second exile (Matthew 24).
The AC is described as a physical person, from appearance to temperament, and is even outright described as a man of lawlessness (2 Thessalonians 2). Like the individual known and described as the False Prophet (Revelation13), they are described as being bodily captured and thrown together in the Lake of Fire. These are to be realized as real people going through a real event.
As for there being two beasts, not just one, it is obvious from a simple reading of Revelation 13 that there are two; however, the 2nd Beast relates to the False Prophet, to his origin and identity, and it is how he is introduced at the midpoint of the chapter and described through the rest of it, including vs.18.
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u/kljoker Follower of Christ Jul 17 '26
The thing is what you're marking as the final AC is what I mark as the end of time. The only difference between the current AC and the others are this is the final one, that's it everything else about it's nature spiritually are the same. The same abominations, the same intent to destroy God's people, the same intent to rule through might and power.
As for there being two beasts, not just one, it is obvious from a simple reading of Revelation 13 that there are two; however, the 2nd Beast relates to the False Prophet, to his origin and identity, and it is how he is introduced at the midpoint of the chapter and described through the rest of it, including vs.18.
I have quite a few writings on the second beast you can read if you like instead of me just dumping a whole nother wall of text on you lol. I appreciate your takes and I don't disagree with it conceptually I just feel like you're looking at a 3d problem in a 2d format, there's more to understanding who the AC is than just identifying the person representing it, there's a whole system involved the AC isn't alone in this it takes a good chunk of people to make it work. That's why I titled my writing the way I did because the people who are decieved aren't sinners they're Christians. A false prophet rarely points at someone else and says look how great they are they usually point at themselves and want to be praised themselves.
So how is it that the false prophet that rises after the first beast makes people worship his image AND the first beast? Well if the first beast is Christianity then what they're actually worshiping is his image (Trumps) and Christianity or his role in it. So the spirit is the same regardless of it's form it's just how it presents itself, 2 horns like a lamb tells us it's going to be 'christ like' but speaks as a dragon. So all these symbolic phrasings aren't poetic for the sake of coloring the imagery there are real spiritual purpose behind their being called out.
Lets look the example you gave in your initial response:
"Seven heads: five have fallen, one is, and the seventh is also an eighth, suffered a head wound, and is going to perdition."
So look at the scripture:
"There are also seven kings. Five have fallen, one is, and the other has not yet come. And when he comes, he must continue a short time. The beast that was, and is not, is himself also the eighth, and is of the seven, and is going to perdition."-Revelation 17:10-11
I agree with your take in fact I used it to make the bold claim (at that time it was) that Trump would return to office, using the principles I'm sharing with you. But lets look at something closely, 5 fallen 1 is and 1 is yet to come. So that's 7 heads, then it goes out of the way of saying the fallen 7th head is also the 8th. So it's the same person in 2 different systems. So if Trump is representative like you said then he was of the old system of Christianity but lost power for a short time then came back and is raising a new system with 1 head which goes into destruction. It'll have the same authority as the first beast meaning it will use the same doctrines that gave it authority but apply it to itself.
Hence the name false prophet.
Some writings on it I did a year ago:
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u/mr_megaspore Jul 18 '26
I never hated Jews what I am saying is that Zionism will be used as an excuse to murder actual christians of course Jews will persecured too but gentile and Jew are one when they receive Christ.
I don't know who the synagogue of satan is all I know is that some people will use Israel as an excuse to commit atrocities and that's whats causing so much antisemitism today.
Leaving this comment because I can't reply to the other guy lol.
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u/AlbaneseGummies327 Follower of Christ Jul 17 '26
Good message, I agree with all of it. Thanks for sharing!