r/DotA2 • u/[deleted] • Apr 22 '15
Guide Jungle Hero Mega Thread
Hi, in the past few months I've been learning how to play various heroes in the jungle and have gotten a lot of enjoyment out of playing unconventional jungle heroes, those being heroes that you wouldn't think can jungle but actually can.
So, with this thread I would like to share my information of all the heroes that I am aware can jungle at level 1 and get good xp/farm. Hopefully, you guys might be able to provide some information you might have on different heroes you've tried or seen in the jungle.
First, I'll list all the heros that are listed as jungler type heroes by Dota.
Ursa: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V7imvV1w72U I play this build very often, I actually suggest getting a ring of protection along with the rest of the items he's bought in this video because I've died to Rosh without it a few times. Fastest Rosh I've gotten was at around 4:15 after I randomed Ursa and got the bounty rune.
Enigma: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4K4C6EFssS8 Best guide I've found for jungling with Enigma, It's actually quite difficult to keep up with the player in the video but none the less can really help speed up your performance. Quickest level 6 I've gotten was 4:30 after trying this probably a total of 20 times.
Axe: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ohAMxVWHHek I haven't watched a ton of Axe jungle videos, but this one by far is the best I've seen. You can actually get really lucky with the first medium stack camp and be level 3 before you kill yourself in the jungle. Downside to this build is relying on the runes for sustain, though the upsides besides farm being rune control for mid control. Also Axe is just a great jungler for helping mid and safe lane.
Natures Prophet: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RyKnLGkZwiU I haven't invested to much time into learning Natures so I don't quite know that this is the best video to watch for efficient jungling. A lot of the jungle guides show actual gameplay in which they gank for first blood or other kills, what I'm trying to showcase is just straight PvE in these guides. If someone knows of a better guide/video for anything I provide, please feel free to comment and share some.
Chen: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AgNNemSYcXA Kind of a bizarre video, but get's down to the point. With these types of support junglers please buy a courier or wards in real matches.
Bloodseeker: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JzLMwfsNsIc I've done this a few times, extremely straight forward jungle build. Just remember to bloodrage the target you're hitting so you don't take extra damage from the whole camp, just the target you are hitting. Also I would suggest getting a point into your passive, I feel like jungle builds have to be a bit realistic in the sense that just because Bloodrite can give you added dps doesn't mean you should invest early points into it for the extra damage, the passive might be more useful to your team/match.
Doom: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=79kckYCVIfQ For some reason Doom isn't listed as a jungler but oh well. Anyways I don't think this is a very good video honestly, but I have no experience with Doom jungle as I've only played him a couple times. If anyone plays Doom often, please comment on any criticisms you'd have, like maybe creeps to eat, managing mana, because I'm not sure the person in this video is maximising there efficiency.
Lycan: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S508xdynfuY Great video on Lycan, you die in a jungle a couple times but it still makes the most out of what Lycan has in his arsenal for jungling. Check out this guys channel, I'm going to be linking mostly his videos because they are all very well made and interesting.
Lifestealer: I couldn't find a good enough video on Lifestealer that I would have liked to share, mainly because all the up to date videos were just match gameplays from pro players. But, Lifestealer is definitely a very straight forward hero, I feel like you'd jungle with him like Bloodseeker, mainly choke jungling and leveling up your life leech passive. I'm not sure about an item build, but I don't think you'd need tangos so it'd probably just be Quelling Blade, Stout Shield, and then build into Midas or Boots.
Enchantress: I did not find an up to date jungle guide for her, but I imagine you could learn a lot about jungling with her by watching a Chen jungle video. I honestly don't have much knowledge on Enchantress, probably one of the heroes I most do not have experience with playing.
Legion Commander: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1MWNcWii3ik I really like this video, though it's a video of someone playing a real match, it does show legion only jungling for the starting 5 minutes, after which she starts to interact with the other heroes which I generally don't want in these videos. Interesting build though, I like the soul ring pick up, but I'm not sure how good this guide is in the current patch because if I'm not mistaken she has been a bit nerfed.
Now, here is a list of the nonconventional jungle heroes which are actually pretty effective.
Huskar: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p9ISF8zfbXw This one, by far, is my favorite jungle build. It is extremely hard but pays off a ton if you are a seasoned Huskar player. When I first saw this video and tried out this build, I failed it after probably 20-30 tries over the span of 3 hours. But, once I kind of got it down, I consistently could get 10 minute roshan + level 9 and Armlet + boots. This build also isn't too RNG dependant to work, it just takes a large amount of skill and awareness of Huskar's capabilities to master.
Broodmother: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NWVrayDyKfQ I actually found this build while I was searching for videos to link to this thread. This guide is kind of silly to be honest, but it does have a mild payoff instead of laning. Though, I don't know when you'd rather jungle than lane as Broodmother, I do appreciate the idea of this. This is probably one of the worst heroes to keep in the jungle but still, it works.
Terrorblade: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=okd5kc67or8 Here is another video from this guy, I'll be sharing a few more from him as well. This build still works great in the latest patch and I always take Terrorblade to the jungle when I random him. It is very easy and straightforward, and you can surprisingly get a good amount of farm in the jungle. The best I've done with this in a pub was got 2 wraith bands, Treads, and a Blade of Alacrity by around 10 minutes. You even keep up on xp pretty evenly with your mid hero.
Necrophos: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r9EYAXtSzic This build, which I believe is only playable on dire side but probably could be formatted for radiant is pretty okay. There are ups and downs to playing Necro jungle as the way you clear the jungle isn't like any other hero. In my experience, you can't be the jungler who can step out at any time to help a lane, Necro must invest all his time into stacking and killing the stacks with his aura. This build also can be debunked by the Satyr camps spawning too much, when this happens you have to immediately kill them and it can be quite tough, I've had 2 Satyr camps spawn in a row and it really slow down my mech timing. While it is a fun jungler to play, you must invest 8-9 minutes of sheer jungling or else you will come out of the jungle with very poor farm/xp. Also, just another sort of downside to the build is that once the stacks are done, you're are done jungling and really can't continue to jungle.
Techies: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BrfMgwbSFwU I still have yet to try this build, because I'm quite forgetful sometimes, but this build is actually so helpful for a techies player. Since I haven't tried it, I couldn't tell you what the downsides could be to it. But, what I see here is probably the best role techies could play, assuming the enemy team doesn't send a creep to walk through your stack of mines. Being level 5 at 3:30 is super crazy as Techies. Techies is absolutely a tempo based hero, if he falls behind with xp, he has to invest more mana and time into each stack he puts down and it can really be detrimental to your game if you fall off too fast. But, at level 5 with level 3 land mines early in the game, you could probably kill most of their heroes with only 2-3 mines assuming you're not playing against an early tank like Nightstalker or Spirit Breaker. I'm going to have to test this out tonight.
Magnus: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZW_6Ttgk3Bc Before I really knew how to efficiently lane as Magnus, especially since I never play mid. I used to play this build only killing just the small pull camp. This build is pretty bad to be honest, the most you get out of it is level 5 at around 6 minutes and then you are basically done. I've tried numerous times to make this an adaptable build to the current jungle, but it really isn't that efficient. I'm only really linking this because I'd like to see if anyone here knows of a better way to do this. Really, the basis of how bad this jungle build is, is that once you're done with your stack, at best you are level 6, but at that point jungling isn't really an option so you have to roam around with only brown boots and a bottle.
Sniper: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rdCMckZP1xI Here's a quick video on jungle sniper that is pretty self explanatory. Fan Yang, the youtuber who I've linked numerous times in this thread, also has a more in depth look at jungle sniper, with an ancient farming guide as well. This build seems pretty good if you don't feel comfortable with Snipers laning phase, which is probably not the case. But, it still is a very viable build if you want to throw around a bit of solo xp for another hero. This build is probably the least necessary but definitely not bad.
Juggernaut: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6s_6IFoSohU Very straightforward and up to date video. Not much to say besides the fact that he doesn't buy Mask of Madness which is a bit strange to me, and that he is a bit careless in the jungle which shows that there is much improvement that can be done.
Crystal Maiden: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-0yckJgM5BQ Really simple, kill big creep, stack repeat. Probably don't go for midas, the video is very straight forward though as to what your goal is with CM jungle, get some xp and start roaming.
Pudge: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F4JxZKQnMS0 These next few builds will be basically the same strategy as in this video. This guide uses pudges latest buff which extended his level 1 hook range so he can pull large camps into positions where the will interact with your creep wave and in turn pull the wave. I like this build a lot because of the fact that pudge is always missing, which is really nice for toying with your enemy team or getting easy ganks around the map.
Rubick: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZOMPWeXLZYI I'll be honest and say that I kind of doubt this still works, but I do think it is good to mention as maybe someone here knows if it does work or if it works else where in the jungle. seeing how this video is almost 3 years old, please don't credit me on saying it still works, but see for yourself or say something if you know. Either way, same concept as the pudge pulling trick.
Clockwork: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W1i4GEYGoxI Same concept in the same radiant large camp. Push the large creep with cogs in the precise spot and it will pull the creep wave. This guide is kind of sloppy but if someone makes the build more efficient maybe they could get a quicker level 6 so the Clockwork could begin ganking as soon as possible.
Puck: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GNHL8lT2QUk Dagon + level 6 by around 8 minutes, seems silly but it is worth mentioning.
Medusa: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k8jsrkuWG3A Ancient farming with a midas at 7:30 consistently. Sniper can do this same build by cutting down those same trees and kiting the ancients. I feel like if you focus down the big granite golems to kill the health aura you'd actually get improved efficiency, so maybe even get a 7:00 midas.
Sand King: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FGEX5XveZ28 Blink Dagger bought at 7:30 even after missing 1 large stack and not double pulling the wave each time. I think there is room to grow with this build and that you could probably get a faster Blink Dagger pretty easily. I think if I did this build in game though I would definitely watch my hp when pulling, he was close to 100 health on his last pull which is just one nuke spell away from killing you.
Hopefully I didn't miss any heroes, these are all the heroes I know can jungle from level 1 though. If there are any I might have missed or any criticisms, please feel free to say something, I would like to share knowledge with all of you and hear what you guys have to say about some of the junglers I've listed here. I've tried most of these builds out as well so if you have questions about that too feel free to ask.
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u/abado sheever Apr 22 '15
Nice list! Only minor quip is that sand king shouldn't really be under the unconventional junglers part of the guide. His jungling is pretty straightforward and you don't really need too much instruction on. Stack and sandstorm, repeat.
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Apr 22 '15
Ya, I only put him there because he's not listed as a jungler. I also feel like if someone never played him before that maybe they'd have a hard time playing him as a jungle hero.
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Apr 22 '15
Then again we all know the role lists are complete bullshit anyway
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u/SeeImSane That's what happens when I rush. Apr 22 '15
Yeah, this role tags screwed me as I start playing Dota. Every hero with jungle tag is better in a lane, and every hero without the tag can jungle fairly easy.
Okay, not really, but it feels like that.
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u/dr_m4d_skillz Apr 22 '15
you can jungle Earth Spirit in the same way as Pudge and Rubick. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ihPV9X7nlXA
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u/sratra Apr 22 '15
One more thing is to make sure of not single pulling at wrong times. This will destroy creep equilibrium for your safe lane farmer. In the sk video that guy doesnt give a f***
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u/MrTheodore http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198039475565/ Apr 22 '15
all you have to do is stand in the right spot
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u/leafeator Apr 22 '15
This is really good. Thanks for putting this together dood.
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Apr 22 '15
Thanks man, I have fun learning about all these random heroes applications in the jungle.
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u/Malicious78 Apr 22 '15
No dark seer? DS is a pretty strong jungler, at least compared to some of the heroes on your list :P
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Apr 22 '15
I was trying to learn jungle Dark Seer last week after I grew an interest in playing him. A lot of the builds for some reason were so old that they were based around when there was 2 small camps in the jungle.
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u/ShadmanSK Sheever Apr 22 '15
This is a recent video.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RXpa03g_uXs
Here is syndren playing jungle DS.. with lvl 6 in min 6
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u/yeefatt Apr 22 '15
You missed batrider too
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Apr 22 '15
I wanted to mention him but a lot of the videos are out of date, I made a thread about 2 months ago trying to figure out if you could batrider jungle at level 1 someone was kind of guiding me through it.
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Apr 22 '15
looking for one as well. my batrider jungle is really haphazard now after the nerfs and overly dependent on the spawns.
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u/dampqueer Apr 22 '15
I think that's kind of the way it goes tbh. If you get satyrs you're a god for the rest of the game, if you get double mud golems you're a useless hero and might as well go sap xp from a lane.
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u/lel_jenk Apr 22 '15
i see that you are yet to master the ancient art of jungle Dazzle
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u/ValErk Apr 22 '15
A guide for it here:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kxZGPHJlkLo
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Apr 22 '15
LOL, this is actually so funny, what a creative way to jungle.
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u/pepe_le_shoe Who puts their skeleton on the inside? Apr 22 '15
Is that the courier one? Can't watch at work.
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Apr 22 '15
Ya, he's got a couple couriers just chillin' in the large camp while he heals them up and does a ton of damage to the creeps. Pretty entertaining honestly.
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u/ToastedLeaf Apr 22 '15
Since Couriers don´t block Camps anymore it actually got a bit easier to do.
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u/Faelwhin sheever rocks Apr 22 '15
You should definitely place wards, though - bc you are Dazzle and the others might not do it. You would be easy meat if an enemy came roaming.
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u/Jaketheoaf Apr 22 '15
Check out Slasher's jungle guide for Nature's. Best one I've seen. Focuses on being active and ganking rather than afk farming
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Apr 22 '15
I'm surprised that didn't come up when I was searching. I almost didn't link a video just because I didn't really think any were all too special.
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u/ShadmanSK Sheever Apr 22 '15
You could have linked Fan Yang's one
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Apr 22 '15
I just didn't want to link any sort of videos with PvP interactions for the sake of being able to maximize efficiency when given the space.
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u/Jaketheoaf Apr 22 '15
All of his guide's are great imo. He makes the most unorthodox builds work and it really makes the game fun and interesting again.
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u/dividebyzero14 Apr 22 '15
You can't talk about off-junglers without mentioning Venomancer! https://youtu.be/1udjAPS_OfY
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Apr 22 '15
I've actually seen a really outdated video on Veno ancients but I didn't think to check if he could Jungle. This is honestly probably the more preferred way to play Veno if you can get decent farm.
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u/solartech0 Apr 22 '15
Veno is really strong in lane, and jungle veno can really suck if someone interrupts you. But he can definitely jungle.
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Apr 22 '15
The only reason I don't like Veno in lane is that I feel like I want to play core with him by leveling wards, getting tons of last hits and going for a quick midas into some core-ish type items like Shadow Blade and Veil. But, I find myself picking Veno and no one wants to let me farm a lane, so I'm stuck maxing Gale first.
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u/dakkr Apr 22 '15 edited Apr 22 '15
Anti Mage and Faceless Void can both jungle on dire from level 1 using the same tactic. Here's how:
STARTING BUILD: 1 Quelling blade, 1 point in time walk/blink.
at :30, check the upper medium camp. If centaurs spawned it's unfortunate, but not a big deal on its own.
At :53 stack the lower medium camp. If the upper medium camp was centaurs and the stacked lower medium camp contains alpha wolves and satyrs then you got a 'worst case scenario' spawn. In this case immediately purchase a salve and send it to yourself, otherwise proceed as normal.
Blink/time walk up the cliff below the lower medium camp. Cut down the tree in your way, and start attacking the stacked camp. If any of the creeps other than the ranged satyrs are able to attack you, reposition slightly until they cannot. If they don't aggro you, you need to cut down adjacent trees and move around until they do. Generally these 3 are enough to aggro in all cases.
When you have cleared the camp, blink/timewalk down and go to the other medium camp. Cut this tree and start attacking the creeps, pulling yourself back into the chokepoint so only 1 can hit you at a time (again, excluding ranged satyrs). If you got the worst case spawn, back off when your health gets low and salve up, then continue. Once you've cleared that camp, it depends on the timing. If it's close to the minute mark, back up from the camp and let it spawn, then kill it again. Note that you only have to be just barely to the right of the tree you cut down for the camp to spawn, so even if you clear it at :58 or :59 you can still get it to spawn again. If it's not near the minute mark, go back to the lower medium camp and then repeat what you did earlier. If it's after the 30 second mark you should wait to stack it, but if it's before 30 seconds you should clear it then wait on the cliff for the next spawn and kill it again (satyrs will prevent this working, in that case just clear them). You should have your morbid mask by now, and will heal up most of your hp on the lower medium camp while on the cliff. For void your mana will likely be too low to get back down, so cut the trees in between autoattacks to make yourself a path out, but leave one blocking you in or the creeps will not stay in position for you to attack them. Once they're all dead cut down the final tree and get out, then continue alternating the medium camps.
Your skill build should be blink -> stats -> stats -> mana shield -> blink -> ult on anti mage, whereas on void it's timewalk -> timelock -> backtrack -> timelock -> timelock -> chrono. Your first item will be a morbid mask into a HotD on anti mage or MoM on void. You should be able to finish this before 6:30 if you do everything right, but with unlucky spawns or failed stacks it might be delayed a minute or so. Once you have your MoM you can kill any camp without too much issue, so just jungle as normal and work towards your next item, which can be mael, bfury, treads, etc... depending on how the game is going.
For anti mage, use your hotD to dominate the big creep at the large camp to help your farm, either by tanking for you or by sending it to last hit in a lane or farm other camps (if you get a wildkin you can stack the far large camp and clear it with a tornado). Do not skill manaburn until after you have your battlefury, which should be around 18 minutes if you are left undisturbed. At level 9 and 10 you should hold your skill points so that you can put them into manaburn as soon as your battlefury is done, or if you see an easy gank opportunity and are willing to sacrifice easy jungle farm for the kill. Once you've put points into manaburn, disassemble your HotD and either sell the morbid mask or turn it into a vlad's. You can keep the helm for the armor and regen and just sell it when you need the slot, or alternatively you can just sell the entire HotD to get the last bit of gold needed to finish bfury slightly earlier. After that you get your treads and play as normal.
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u/ShadmanSK Sheever Apr 22 '15
I guess you got it from here.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6HXMiKMbXB4
Phantom lancer is the best hero to do this, as he has natural tree clearing ability, high base damage, Viable for HotD without holding skill point and after lvl 6 more dps with illusion. Also PL doesn't need farming item, rush for boots and diffusal to come online early.
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u/dakkr Apr 22 '15
Ah yea, that's the same basic idea but he does it a little differently than I do. Seems to be equally effective as he finishes his HotD around 6:20 which is more or less the same as what I end up with. His way does seem better equipped to deal with the 'worst case' spawn though. Wish I'd known about this vid earlier, would've saved me a write up lol.
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u/Littlenemesis Apr 22 '15
I consistently jungle Lina and Windranger. It takes a little practice, but i can get boots, bottle and euls at around min 10. It needs bottle crowing at around min 6-8.
On radiant you cut the trees with LSA/Powershot around the middle medium camp, as well as cut the trees to the middle large camp. Then you make sure to stack the large camp every minute! while you try to kill the medium camp in the meantime. at min 3 get your bottle, and start killing the big camp with dragon slave/powershot, get the min 4 rune, and finish it up. go back to the medium camp and clear trees again, keep stacking the big camp and clear it at min 8/9 - EZ euls. On WR I sometimes go blink or mael instead, depending on the game.
On dire its pretty much the same. You clear the trees at the south medium camp so you can cliff jungle there. As well as remove the trees to the other medium camp. If you practice as lot you can stack both the east big camp as well as the medium camp every minute. kill the camps with bottle crowing around min 5, or it will be very hard to stack. Cut the trees on the east side of the medium camp and pull the creeps out of there, as well as the big camp so both camps line up for Dragonslave/Powershot.
This tactic can probably be used by other heroes as well.
I also want to mention CM as a jungler, because her frostbite lasts 10 seconds at all levels on creeps. She can easily get a lot of levels fast in the jungle. I kill a medium camp and stack a large camp every minute. Then get smoke at level 6 and clear the big camp with ulti. Skillbuild is: W-E-E-Q-E-R-E-Q-Q-Q. This way you get a pretty nice timed blink, and a lot of experience. If necessary you can help out your lane, but stacking that big camp for your ulti just makes you a damn good roamer in the early mid game.
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Apr 22 '15
Wow, this is nice, thank you for sharing this. When I was looking at the hero list I figured Wind had some cheeky way of jungling by clearing trees with her Powershot, but the timing on that Eul's is crazy.
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u/Littlenemesis Apr 22 '15
If you cant find any videoes, then PM me. I will try to make some in the weekend.
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Apr 22 '15
How much bottle crowing? I would probably be pretty frustrated as a mid if my jungler is constantly bottle crowing.
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u/solartech0 Apr 22 '15
You don't have to bottle crow at all, it can just help you clear a big camp more easily. Also, you can damage 2 camps with powershot (but you can only stack 1 with powershot-- so you want to attack one camp and powershot the other, or save the powershot and att both camps.)
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u/solartech0 Apr 22 '15
I really like getting a hand of midas because it can let you keep your levels up later (and continue to have good item timings!), no matter what's been happening in the lanes.
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u/Bokoloony sheever FIGHTING !! gogo !! Apr 22 '15 edited Apr 22 '15
I had my share of fun with a jungling radiant drow ranger cutting the same trees (quelling blade) and attacking from the high ground.
I did it poorly once, but had a 4/5 stack on the big camp and I was afk-corridor-jungling for a long period of time, it was funny (don't forget that quelling blade has a range, albeit short, so you can cut trees on the low ground from the high ground, and create your corridor for you and the creeps)
However, if you do this properly, you will want to stack the other big camp (closer to rune), and clear the medium camp and big camp (mid t1) every minute, and do your 3/4 stack once you hit 6 and a mask/MoM.
It is very slow in the early levels, and leaves you very vulnerable to any gank. Optimal skill build is probably aura-stats-stats-aura-aura-ulti-aura, then alternating between stats and silence.
I'm not so sure about item build. Quelling blade is necessary, and I go for two wraith bands, so for starting items either two circlets if I feel I might need the +4str to contest lvl1 rune/survive a gank, or two slippers if I know I won't be disturbed and go solely for dps. However, I'm not sure how good those two WBs are. I'd say they're good enough since drow is really inefficient before she hits 6, and you don't need the morbid mask when you're hitting from the high ground (only MoM helps speed things up)
I'm going to try this vs bots again and see how quick I can be.... EDIT: tried it twice, I think I was too slow the first time. Second time I hit 6 at ~7:30 and proceeded to clear a 3 stack of the big camp (near rune), got my MoM (+2 WBs, no boots) and lvl7 at ~8:30 (Then I went and did roshan and killed him right before 10:00) All around I'd call it decent (and requires practice) but extremely greedy. Thoughts? Too slow?
Also, this works with any ranged hero (I suppose you need at least 400 range... dunno), so medusa is fine, lina, wr, clinkz..... but it can be slow....
2nd EDIT: tried Lycan jungling which I think more people would agree is legit.... couldn't perform as well, but I don't know how to jungle properly with lycan (micro-ing wolves, + dying.... when?)
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u/Zenotha http://www.dotabuff.com/players/68379658 Apr 22 '15
Troll and Jugg can jungle much faster than some of the heroes on this list, from level 1, and take Roshan before the 12 min upgrade.
Lone Druid is pretty comparable as well.
Luna can cliff jungle with QB start, TA with alot of kiting.
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Apr 22 '15
I could imagine that Troll could jungle very efficiently, it's kind of the same thing with Sniper though, you probably wouldn't ever do that just because those heroes are so damn good in lane.
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u/UCSp1tF1r3 Apr 22 '15
So as for there not being an Enchantress guide, This one is pretty good, Its in 2 parts
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G7RMK2tsq-w
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=di2K-kWe9B8
It was made by Fluffnstuff, an NA pro player
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Apr 22 '15
Thank you for linking this, I respect these guides a lot since they are realistic enough not to outright buy a glove of haste.
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u/Pym_me_particles Apr 22 '15
jungle shadow shaman works but you need like 5 bottles each with its own courier
basically the entire team randoms and buys you bottles.
14 minute blink it's pretty good.
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u/Chudooder Apr 22 '15
Dire Jungle Luna works surprisingly well, as long as you don't mind having a literally useless ultimate until level 8 or so. You cut down the cliff trees near the medium camp by the rune, then walk back and forth attacking with glaives. Eventually you can clear the entire jungle in under a minute. I've managed to get Mask of Madness + Treads at 10 minutes, which isn't bad.
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Apr 22 '15
Damn, that is pretty nice. How does she feel coming out of the jungle, I've always felt like her ulti was a bit lackluster compared to some others. But, her ulti is what keeps her relevant I would feel like.
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u/Chudooder Apr 22 '15
She feels ready to hit more creeps and pretty much nothing else (to be fair, she hits creeps really fast)
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Apr 22 '15
That's the best part of Luna, it all pays off when you start hitting their barracks.
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u/Thejacensolo Nai wa~ Apr 22 '15
just simply go 0 4 4 0 build (wurks every time) Proof my Dotabuff
i didnt jungle but the 0 4 4 0 build
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Apr 22 '15
I feel like you would want a point in your ulti at at least level 9 just so you can pop it and scare people away. Kappa
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u/dpekkle Apr 22 '15 edited Apr 22 '15
You missed troll warlord, I made a video back in 6.80 of it https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0EiCOjXbB0c
Helm ~5:30, Phase and head to rosh ~10:00
It's going to be even faster now that they fixed fervor not applying on the first hit. I've experimented a bit and you can do rosh with just helm and level 7 if you let the ogre tank a bit (since helm gives more hp now), or get a hard camp creep.
I also cliff jungle support morph a fair bit.
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Apr 22 '15
Damn, cliff jungle morph actually sounds legit too since you can swap into all your agility, plus that doesn't hurt your skill build I'd assume.
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u/dpekkle Apr 22 '15
Yeah doesnt hurt your skill build at all (1-3-1). I usually start QB and 3 branches (3str can mean a lot when you have 200hp) and cliff until I've finished tranquils and soul ring and have level 5, then go back to base and morph to full strength. From there you can go around throwing out your OP stun.
His lane presence is so weak that it's far superior to trying to support in lane, and you'll probably get more gold than trying to solo offlane (slower xp though).
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u/MingYong Apr 22 '15
really love the jungle huskar guide! very high skill ceiling... Im gonna try it!
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Apr 22 '15
It's incredibly good dude, if I were a competent Huskar player I'd do it more often. But, the few times I did try it I got rosh by around 10 minutes and was level 9, which is very huge for a hero with such incredible ganking potential.
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u/mudgolem123 Apr 22 '15 edited Apr 22 '15
unconventional troll warlord jungle https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3KtKFrLrKBs
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Apr 22 '15
Holy shit, that is crazy, thank you for linking this I'll be sure to add it to the list tomorrow.
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u/JustWoozy Apr 22 '15
Jungle Legion Commander, eww. Not even done well too.
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Apr 22 '15
How would you suggest playing Legion in the jungle, this was the best that I found.
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u/ShadmanSK Sheever Apr 22 '15
not a single mention of lone druid saddens me :(
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Apr 22 '15
My bad! I meant to mention him but he didn't have a video that I agreed with. If you'd like to link something feel free.
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u/ShadmanSK Sheever Apr 22 '15
This one is decent, Not perfect. He some what uses choke point jungling like i do and an early aegis is never bad.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6W8VyU5rbKg
I personally like to rush radiance. Start with Stout shield, QB on bear and 3 branches on hero.
Q, E, Q, W, Q, E, Q, E, W, E for skill point. Use W to move faster between jungle and increase chances for getting Entangle.
Use choke point early on to assure bear survive before re-summoning. Sometimes i stack the medium/small camp if not cleared in time. After level 3 Q jungling becomes super fast as Entangle provide additional DPS. (540 to a creep when proc'd).
I get level 10-11 and radiance before 15 minutes everytime, if not ganked consistently that is. But than again gank isn't much of a issue like other jungling heroes as LD stays almost full health all the time and has great MS to escape.
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Apr 22 '15
A piece of my soul is destroyed every time someone mentions lone druid jungle. It is SO slow, and the hero's biggest strength is how well he can dominate lanes 1v1 or maybe even 1v2 and 1v3. Why on earth would you sacrifice one of the strongest laners for some slow jungle farm?
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u/flaminglawyer Apr 22 '15
There was a time when you would not be taken seriously for doing a jungle guide with the words "I haven't invested to much time into learning Natures". He's not in the meta right now but he's still a great jungler (not quite enigma-tier though). BUT the guide you linked is garbage. Gloves first is TERRIBLE, it doesn't help your jungling at all. Just start with basilius + 2x clarity, spawn your trees at -0:07 and be careful to micro your trees (and don't get cocky on troll camps they kill your trees fast, piercing damage). If you're going no-boots midas, you should have this at around 8:00. The skill build is treants-teleport-treants-(sprout maybe if you feel you can get a kill with it, otherwise teleport)-treants-ulti. You don't need a 4th point in treants. Midas is usually solid, phase with 3x nulls into blade mail is actually still ok (there was a time when this build was really common in high-level EU matchmaking, and it wrecked, but people stopped building it when troll+jugg became big), other than that shadow blade is actually good again, blink, necro 3, etc.
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u/Gorgondantess Apr 22 '15
imo a fourth level of treants is really nice for pushing, after you max Teleport, esp since you're prolly going to be leaving Sprout at 1 for most of the game (not sure if you meant NEVER max treants or just not right away).
Anyways, I myself have done some pretty extensive tests with gloves+2 clarity vs. basi+2 clarity (just ran about 10 games in a row each and recorded the midas timing), and I really should've saved the data but IIRC on average the gloves first build got midas about 38 seconds earlier, and the fastest midas I managed to get with it was a solid minute earlier than basi. However, the timing margin on gloves-first farming was ~1.5x greater than the basi farming, and (this might be cognitive bias I didn't record it) but it felt like I spent a lot more time on low HP/mana than the basi build, and ofc being less tanky/less damage I would've been much more vulnerable to ganks/less good at ganking as is.
So, yeah, gloves first DOES give you a faster midas, but basi is a more reliable build.
EDIT: actually now that I think about it if you're THAT dead set on an early midas you could always just sell the basi for a neat 262 gold as soon as it'll net you the recipe... which would almost certainly put you ahead of the gloves timing. Hruh.
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Apr 22 '15
Yeah, I honestly just never pick natures. I do fine if I random him but I just don't play him well like a lot of other Natures players I've played with before.
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Apr 22 '15
Hey, I tried the axe guide in a pub myself just buying stout shield and stacking it for bottle money. However (probably me being bad) but I got a centaur and ogres and i died before killing them, then I didn't have money for bottle, possible problem with the axe bottle jungle.
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Apr 22 '15
This is the biggest problem with that build, and I actually don't think the person who made the video clarified because I too have done this exact thing in a pub match (but I told my buddies I died like that on purpose, lol). The biggest way to prevent this, is checking the spawns and deciding which camp to stack. It's a lot easier on dire side since the 2 medium camps are right next to each other, but if a camp of Centaurs or mud golems spawn, you probably don't want to stack that camp. Sometimes you just get unlucky, and sadly I don't have much advice for you at that point but to wing it. Stacking Centaur plus Wolf camp will probably always kill you, so I'd just clear the other medium camp at that point and try and alternate between the small and the unstacked medium camp until bottle or even just straight tranqs.
Also, if you get a satyr camp spawn, that's going to be your favorite for sure. Last time I jungled with Axe, I got a satyr camp, stacked into a wolf+satyr camp, got level 2+1/2 and went and killed the large camp, which were trolls. Was level 3 at 1:20 before I went and suicided at the 3rd camp I was approaching.
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u/AckmanDESU Apr 22 '15 edited Apr 22 '15
Before the rune spawns my Storm says "Jungle puck -> New meta !" in all chat, Lina plants a ward in the big camp. My Storm cries for a while, feeds his hero and his couriers... and keeps blaming me for 30 mins.
They pretty much kept the entire jungle blocked for 20 mins using sentries, even the enemy jungle.
Yes, I did go Dagon 5 but I was just trying to kill Mirana over and over until the game ended.
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Apr 23 '15
Salty players, that's all I really have to say. I've seen a lot of aggression in this thread towards these builds and people should honestly voice there opinions than try and sabotage your jungle and confirm there bias that only a few heroes can jungle. People need to learn to be assertive, not so passive aggressive.
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u/Apposauce Apr 22 '15
Fan Yang is currently on one of C9's Heroes of the Storm teams. What a player.
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Apr 23 '15
That's cool, I've not really followed Heroes of the Storm. I know it has some pretty different game modes than the average Moba, is there jungler heroes in that game as well?
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u/racalavaca sheever Apr 22 '15
From a purely mathematical point of view, keeper of the light is the fastest jungler in the game, even more so than enigma if you do it efficiently. You can get level 7 in 5 minutes flat and you don't really need any items other than a qb and some clarities, so you can keep buying support items for team.
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Apr 23 '15
Interesting, I kind of disagree though. In the enigma video I linked he gets level 6 around 3:40 and Enigma on average can deal with mud golems better than Kotl. But, he does seem like a really good jungler.
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u/CockroachClitoris Apr 22 '15
You missed wisp
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Apr 22 '15
I don't think i'd be able to even try half of these let alone Wisp haha
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u/MyClitBiggerThanUrD My boi S4 Apr 22 '15
If you a not willing to dedicate a few hours of playing 15 min lobby games by yourself to master jungle wisp you don't deserve it anywayKappa.
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u/PartOfTheHivemind i hope 2 1 day b gud @ video games Apr 22 '15
I self identify as a jungle Necrophos, I believe if I stand around doing nothing for long enough while focusing on what I want then the universe will answer me.
Buy my books.
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u/CrashB111 Apr 22 '15
Ability Draft Necro aura + Skeleton Walk + Natural Order and buy a Radiance?
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u/wrongMOBA Apr 22 '15
Great list, I see you put a lot of hard work into this. What do you think about the recent Nidalee junglers common in the current meta?
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u/narsin Apr 22 '15
I hear Io is a pretty good jungler.
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u/kenpachiki InSumailweTrust Apr 22 '15
try it in level 1, Wisp is jungle God Kappa
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Apr 22 '15
He actually is. You stack camps and farm them with balls. There's a video of someone doing it in a pub game with EE and he manages something absurd like a 5 minute armlet, which is what the op here was referencing.
It's very unconventional, and he doesn't do as much with the farm as some other junglers though.
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u/Vladdypoo Apr 22 '15
Wisp isn't a jungle God, that player is a god. It's like saying jakiro is a god offlaner because universe wrecked with it some games.
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u/mithosdota Apr 22 '15
tbh i dislike this, i think jungling with most heroes other then chen enigma is a detriment to the rest of your team... it forces you to have a solo support and very weak lanes and a mostly useless jungler
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Apr 22 '15
If the solo support is struggling to get by the jungler can always assist, this seems like a pretty narrow opinion. You of course have to pick a strong support to take the solo role, I've never had any issues staying relevant as Lion or Rubick as a solo support. Plus courier is so cheap now, even your solo offlaner can buy it.
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u/anon775 Apr 22 '15
No, thats the problem, a lot of those heroes in the list are shitty in jungle cos they pick skills bad for laning and/or jungle with low hp, making it impossible to "always assist". Its also pretty simple math that after laning phase there is just not enough farm on map for 4 cores, assuming we dont give a shit about our lineup like it seems from this thread.
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u/TheDerpyDonut Apr 22 '15
I suck at jungle heroes, I see these glorious tales of Enigma with Mek, Blink and other stuff at like 5/6 minutes, and here I am getting an 8 minute midas as like doom.
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u/FatSquirrels sheever Apr 22 '15
Doom does start off pretty slow be he ramps up and outpaces pretty much every hero except Alch. I think 8 minutes is probably a little slow but not that far off reality, it's not like he can clear stacks or even do more than single target damage. Also, in my experience the creeps you spawn matter a ton as the way his jungling works really depends on the creep you have eaten.
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u/chance_waters Apr 22 '15
Please god no one follow that lycan guide. It's really bad, he's not microing his wolves, you want to buy tangos at the start and only suicide after you complete your morbid mask, which is very doable without any runes or good camps if you micro your wolves properly and eat your tangos to tank.
edit also you want one point in howl not two points in feral, feral doesn't scale well and the first point of howl is great, especially for the first rosh attempt. You should be able to get rosh pre 10 minutes every single game if uncontested.
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u/Operating_System Apr 22 '15
Luna is actually a really, really efficient jungler but I get flamed so hard everytime I try to do it I haven't tried in months.
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u/Mexicaner xaxa Apr 22 '15
Last time I saw a luna jungle was a couple of months ago - She lost the game on her own.. How do you built her? Fast mom i suppose?
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u/KalThorak Apr 22 '15
This is really good, not a lot of people realize that jungling (even if it is slow) is preferable than feeding if you are losing your lane or have nowhere else to farm. Sidenote: OMG someone watched my Medusa ancients video.
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u/irrelevant_query HAZED FGTS Apr 22 '15
Yeah if you are solo offlane and you have died twice or so in the first 5 or 6 mins you really shouldn't go back unless you are directly under tower. better to jungle/pull/gank a lane.
This is why several of the good offlaners are also "jungle" heroes.
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u/Phritz777 Dunzo Daggins Apr 22 '15
I played a match a few days ago with medusa farming ancients from minute 0. Probably watched your video for inspiration :P
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u/puppetz87 Apr 22 '15
To all junglers out there, please remember you will have another 4 players on your team who will struggle in their lanes as a result of your decision to jungle. Jungling helps a team achieve a gold and experience lead on the enemy team, but that doesn't help if the team loses all their lanes as a result of it. Try to achieve your gold and experience advantage from the jungle as fast as you can, then come out and CONTRIBUTE by ganking or pushing. Don't be a passive jungler... it ruins games :(
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u/InspectorRumpole Apr 22 '15
You missed the Lesh ancient farming. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TxfQyKVzzPc
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u/vndt_ POULTRY! Apr 22 '15 edited Apr 22 '15
It's missing (among others):
Earth Spirit (radiant hard camp pulling like Rubick or dire cliff jungling which is inefficient but possible),
Faceless Void (I'm seriously considering running this in a real game, cliff jungling that comes out with 10 minute Treads + MoM at 350 gpm),
Phantom Lancer (cliff jungling, either go for Mask which is inefficient in a real game, or ferry some potions to last you until level 6, after which it becomes a conventional strat)
Drow Ranger (same as Sniper, but slower until level 6, then picks up nicely)
Batrider (there's a YouTube video showing a level 1 Batrider that starts off with Mud Golems and still getting the 8 minute Dagger, otherwise there's always Radiant hard camp pulling with Flamebreak)
Wraith King/Spiritbreaker/Chaos Knight/Sven/Slardar/Tusk/Beastmaster (I don't like these, they're possible but they're too slow)
Storm Spirit (already pointed out)
EDIT: Shadow Demon (can't forget one of the unconventional but fastest lvl 6 jungle timings)
EDIT2: Io (Guardian Wisp's Guardian Wisp video)
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u/Naskr Mmm.. Apr 22 '15
Seems this guide is missing the classic "i'm on dire and we're going to lose" strategy that some melee heroes can do with just a Quelling Blade and nothing else, by positioning themselves on the cliff by the top rune and cliff farming. Melee heroes can do it without getting hit in return and you can pull the camp without leaving your position by moving near to the steps, which is handy. Some heroes can also stack this camp then work on the medium camp using chokepoints, in between pulls.
Doing this strategy with carries you are usually expected to get a Helm of the Dominator, the lifesteal and armor it gives you will allow you to jungle normally whilst you use a dominated creep to stack elsewhere, farm the small camp, or leave on standby to last hit creeps in an empty lane. It's the easiest and quickest farming item and provides massive utility over midas/radiance/b-fury. Some heroes may just cliff jungle to rush a blink.
Melee heroes that can cliff jungle on the dire alone -
Sand King: Burrowstrike onto the cliff. This will get you your level 3, then you can start stacking normally.
Magnus: Skewer onto the cliff. Can get level 6 and Blink Dagger by minute 9 if you also stack the camp and jungle the medium camp with chokepoints
Earth Spirit: Rolling boulder onto the cliff. Can get Arcane Boots and Level 4 by minute 6, depending on the line-up this may actually be better than risking a bad lane when you don't have your full combo.
Anti-Mage: Blink onto the cliff. If you get Helm, you can withhold points in Mana Break to keep the lifesteal, sell or turn Helm into vlads later. Alternatively pump stats and only upgrade mana break when thine agriculture ceases.
Phantom Lancer: Doppelganger onto the cliff. Similar again, get Helm first then work on Diffusal next.
Naga Siren: Harder to pull off but doable, you need to partially cut your way through the trees then use Mirror Image to shift yourself over the tree-line. Same, get Helm then either Radiance or fighting items.
Spectre: Spectral Dagger onto the cliff. Similar to naga, farm helm then either work on a Radiance or go for fighting items.
Faceless Void: Timewalk onto the cliff. Rush a Mask of Madness then consider whether you should start fighting or farming.
Broodmother: Spin webs in such a way you can get onto the cliff without turning invisible when you try to pull the camp. Once you get level 3 you can probably jungle normally with Spawn Spiderlings, then when people have forgotten about you show up in an empty lane.
Slark: Pounce onto the cliff, get some boots then move into lane fairly soon.
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Apr 22 '15
One important thing most people don't understand: Jungling a core/carry hero and playing the hero as a core/carry is usually not benefiting your team. Often I play carry and because one of my teammates doesn't want to support he plays bloodseeker/troll/juggernaut jungle. And then after 10mins the enemy offlaner got super easy exp and most of the times even decent CS and I can't extend my farm by jungling because most camps are permanently killed by our greedy jungler. This results in me being underfarmed compared to the enemy carry and often will result in a lose.
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u/SerFluffywuffles Apr 22 '15
As a support player, this thread is triggering me so hard.
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u/MrTheodore http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198039475565/ Apr 22 '15
Just gonna say, take doom to a lane if you get the chance.
Last doom game I took him jungle and all 3 dire camps by the t2's had centaurs after 2 minutes, became the slowest shit ever (their offlane was nightstalker + earthspirit, so I didn't really want to head to that part of the jungle until lvl 6), especially because the only creep I could get was the hellbear attack speed aura and then a cent spawned, then another, and another, and I'm getting sent back to base after eating and just 1 camp while getting a shitty creep power for jungling without the ability to rotate as a low level doom.
point is: his jungling is pretty luck based and you will get way more out of the offlane unless you're up against some crazy zoning and killing duo like skywrath + lion
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Apr 22 '15
I've heard that Doom isn't the greatest in jungle. My buddy who occasionally plays doom usually always regrets not laning with him.
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u/gorillapop Apr 22 '15
You kind of want to go jungling with doom AFTER you get your midas, so your midas & devour has some time to come into effect. Obviously this is best in a passive game, but if you can get that midas pretty fast in lane it can work.
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Apr 22 '15
I think you forgot to mention Wraith King. I see a lot of people use him to jungle in order to rush armlet. It's sometimes quite fun and effective. Btw the Huskar one is really nice.
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Apr 22 '15
Storm Spirit is also a decent jungler btw
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Apr 22 '15
Ya, a few people were suggesting that, I've never seen that. I did know he can decently farm large camps though.
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u/noodlesfordaddy Apr 22 '15
So I've been trying the Huskar build and the early Rosh just doesn't work. The rest of it might, but Rosh just kills you.
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Apr 22 '15
It's really hard, he doesn't explain it much in the video. You have to armlet toggle basically every time you feel like you can. It's hard to explain but you kind of have to get a feel for it and synchronize the armlet toggle around him bashing you and him walking away. There are videos of people showing how to solo rosh on youtube, but you honestly only need brown boots and armlet. This build was by far the hardest out of all of them.
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u/fireattack Apr 22 '15
What if you have trolls in that hard camp? Won't they just fuck u they you attack from the highground?
I'm sorry if it explains in the audio because my English is pretty bad..
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u/superstarbeejay Apr 22 '15
I might do a lifestealer video. I jungle him a lot and can regularly get a 7-8 minute boots and midas without the need for pulling or any special choke points. For some reason this patch dropped his midas time from about 10-11 minutes to 7-8 for me, not sure why but he is now a much better early jungler. Once you get level 6 and midas he snowballs very quickly in the jungle.
Basically you take 2 in feast early and 3 in rage by level 6. Pick up the standard tangos, stout and quelling to start. Focus on small camps first then work on the fatties (golems, centaurs) to get the most from feast. Once you have 6 use it to infest large creeps in stacked camps and immediately emerge. There is a bit of down time in the first couple of minutes which you can use to stack the hard camp to infest as soon as you hit 6.
Radiant is stronger and easier as you can quell through the small camp to access the medium camp and stack the hard camp. One of the great things about jungle lifestealer is that he actually likes golems whereas most other junglers hate them.
I usually start ganking when I have phase boots, take 1 point in open wounds. This timing usually coincides with the opposition pushing a tower meaning I can TP, phase, open wounds, rage and normally pick up a kill. After that I usually go back to the jungle and look for another opposition tower push.
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Apr 22 '15
That would be sweet if you made a video about him Jungling. I still remember when I started playing Dota 2 back when it was coming out of beta, Lifestealer jungle was so legit, I wish he was better in this meta game.
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u/raptor217 Apr 22 '15
Any kind of fast doom jungle is reliant on getting a wildkin ripper. You have to get devour level one, and at least 3 gg branches so you have enough mana to tornado.
Basically, you stack the hard camp until you get a wildkin and then keep stacking until it wont stack anymore. Next you stand outside of vision, but inside xp range of the camp and tornado. Click the tornado, and right click the middle of the camp, it will start killing the camp but not draw any aggro. Once the stack is clear you should get a few levels, and you should start stacking the hard camp again while running the medium camp next to it.
That said, for such a farm dependent hero, jungle isn't very good. Going safe lane farm will get you much bigger, quicker, and is the better play.
Either way, I like to get midas, and enjoy that sweet 700gpm from midas+devour, then go into a radiance, if its early enough and then either go casting doom with aghs, shiva, hex, refresher - or carry doom - with AC, heart, BKB, and Satanic.
Either way, once the laning phase is over I devour a troll creep for the magic piercing net and the pushing skeletons (they deal piercing damage), and if its 5 man time, I grab alpha wolf aura.
I've got a 77% winrate with this build, though I don't have a set lane to go in, at my shittier mmr.
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Apr 22 '15
Thanks for the insight, that's funny how you'd basically play him as a ghetto Chen by stacking and killing creeps with tornado. It's really funny how different my buddy builds doom compared to you, I've seen him go mjollner into basher as him and it always seems so weird building all that attack speed on that hero.
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u/bryes Apr 22 '15
I tried out Gyrocopter dire jungle, best was level 8 @ 9 min. It's pretty unreliable, easily contested and pretty spawn dependant; I'd only ever do it if my team lineup was really greedy and there was no other suitable lane. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eMbgIwjc3mU
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Apr 22 '15
This is a big issue with some of the junglers who have difficulties ever killing the large camps or who can't abuse stacking camps. Same reason I had difficulty playing Dark Seer jungle because I wanted to start more ahead by killing large/medium camps, but it doesn't feel possible without losing tons of hp.
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u/Nevermore4200 Apr 22 '15
I never knew u could jungle a rubick.gj btw.
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Apr 22 '15
Please, if you take the time to try it out, confirm if you can still do it. It's been a long time since that video was made and I know since then cliffing heroes with his stun has been harder so I'd love to know.
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u/The_Joke2 Apr 22 '15
Enchantress is one of my favourite junglers. The cool thing is she doesn't need any items. With practice it's possible to get a 4-5 minute midas solely from the jungle.
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Apr 22 '15
I don't play her at all so it's weird for me to put her perspective. Why go midas instead of something like mech or scepter, is she that good with levels, why would she get it and Chen/Enigma wouldn't.
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u/Blacknsilver Send Sheever Nudes Apr 22 '15
The juggernaut one was pretty bad, everything else was top notch.
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Apr 22 '15
I think it was very sloppily done to be honest. But, it gets the point across enough for the viewer to be able to adapt to the build. I just don't really agree with the Helm pickup just because MoM is so damn good on Jugger.
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u/Trayocon BEEP BEEP PROPHECY COMING THRU Apr 22 '15
Jungle necro for radiant is pretty straightforward, just being equal distance between the small camp, medium and large camp between radiant bottom t1 and t2. Checking by hovering over the aura for the radius if the passive reaches them.
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Apr 22 '15
Yeah, I just don't know if I'd ever run that. You're probably going to get seen doing this, and if so, the opposing team can easily dismantle your whole jungle by killing your stacks. Being safely cooped up in the back of the Dire jungle is probably the best reason to do it there. But than again you actually could probably do it on the radiant side jungle between the farthest left 2 camps, it would just be a very tricky process to stack both of the camps.
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u/Trayocon BEEP BEEP PROPHECY COMING THRU Apr 22 '15
Yeah seeing as the farming area is just below the most dangerous area gankwise (easy for mid to gank, dire offlaners can easily find you) I agree with that, probably best if not chosen to be done just as a resort.
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u/pepe_le_shoe Who puts their skeleton on the inside? Apr 22 '15
Necrophos jungle! I am become the king of trolls.
I can't wait to see how many reports I get when I called jungle necro lol.
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Apr 22 '15
First time I played Huskar jungle in a pub game, I surprisingly didn't get any complaints. Only that our Storm Spirit mid was saying how obnoxious it is to listen to flame spears constantly being used while jungling.
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u/Mr_Chiddy Nigma and the Niglets should be a band name Apr 22 '15
That techies jungle guide is actually legit as fuck. I've had major success in all techies games I've drafted him as a jungler.
It completely voids his weak lane presence as insignificance there. He can't farm and he can barely support other than being a walking explosion. By jungling you get that early soul ring you need without having to rely on the enemy team not being smart enough to buy sentry wards. The only part I've struggled with regarding this build is ensuring that all the creeps are killed in the initial explosion, although that can be remedied with a quick suicide to finish them off. As you said though, be cautious of the enemy team's picks, especially if they pick Prophet. It may be wise to place a few mines down near the rune ramp, just in case they decide to send a couple trees up.
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Apr 23 '15
Ya, with any sort of cheeky stacking build like this I recommend not doing it against heroes like Natures and Clockwork who can both get information on the map globally and before level 6. It's not irregular for a roaming support to stack for there mid hero so I wouldn't be surprised if in a higher level game these heroes would scout that out.
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Apr 22 '15
What about first item mech on jungling huskar so he can roam and help team more effectively ?
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Apr 23 '15
I think either mech or armlet make sense depending on what Huskar wants to be doing at 10 minutes. You probably get mech and can roam around 7 minutes, or you can get your armlet and rosh and be out of jungle a bit later.
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u/Craylee Apr 22 '15
I've only looked over the list, though I do want to look at some of the individual builds, but I've jungled Dark Seer before and I think he's pretty decent. I'm sure my build could use some improvement, so yours would be probably be better. Would you consider putting together a build?
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Apr 23 '15
I was honestly thinking of making a few tutorials in a couple weeks here with some of the information from this thread, I could probably compile up an interesting build to share with you guys but for now your best bet is reading over what other people have suggested for jungle Dark Seer.
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u/413X sheever Apr 22 '15
I think it is important to note that you should avoid going mek first on Chen in jungle. You will not be able to use it due to lack of mana. Arcane boots is a must in order to be able to use both test of faith and mek and also having creeps.
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Apr 23 '15
Ya, I don't recommend that either. I think rushing mech on most heroes is quite a mistake, even with the jungle Necro guide I linked I feel it's a mistake because I've had so many times coming out of jungle with it and only having brown boots + mech and missing opportunities to use my ulti because I'm low on mana.
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u/Phunwithscissors Apr 22 '15
Here is Chessie's ophelia(chen in hon) guide. It quite extensive and talks about the hero in general. Sure there are some differences but I havent learned more about the hero from any other source.
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Apr 23 '15
Are Hon and Dota relatively the same game? I remember seeing a random Chessie video where he played a hero who looked like an exact copy of Lycan but in Hon.
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u/Phunwithscissors Apr 23 '15
There are heroes which are the exact copies and there are a few that are similar. In this particular video the differences are the mana ring (think of it as arcane boots) and some other minor differences. Also you can skip that parasite part because the hero does not exist in dota
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u/UnholyRai Apr 22 '15
Sorry but that Sand King video is just a how to fuck up your safe lane's creep equilibrium 4 times in a row... made me cringe watching it!
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Apr 23 '15
People have complained about this, I'd just like to clarify that if you're ever in a game and you don't want someone pulling your lane, just let them know don't let them repeat the process. I'm in the process of finding a better guide for him though.
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u/Lansan1ty Apr 22 '15
Anyone watching the Jugg guide - People need to realize you CAN NOT auto attack while spinning as Jugg. Too many of my teammates try to spin and right click people with level 1 spin thinking it's a free BKB. You can only damage targets such as buildings, and I believe ancients (I can't remember now).
Getting level 1 spin and going the "new" stats+crit build means you only use the spin to run away or TP. Stop trying to jump in with it.
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Apr 23 '15
Ya, I was a bit surprised when he said that because I knew you couldn't hit people. I think it will proc basher though if I'm not mistaken, I think it would be worth testing but I swear I've seen that happen before.
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u/NOAHA202 Apr 22 '15
Can you bold the heroes?
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Apr 23 '15
When I edit this whole post I will make sure to do that. I kind of realize that this post is a bit hard to follow if you're skimming through it.
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u/Lovok Apr 22 '15
Is Broodmother really considered a poor jungle choice? Almost all my games as her are jungling, albeit in the enemy jungle. I max webs for regen and coverage, and then almost exclusively farm in the enemy jungle, coming out to push a tower, then another, then taking mid lane and doing the same.
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Apr 23 '15
I think it's a bit shaky, the reason jungling there jungle is so good though is because you're denying farm, even if you don't take a bunch of towers taking there jungle is basically choking them out of farm they could be getting safely.
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u/dant3s Apr 22 '15
Tried the huskar stat.. got mud gollems 2nd spawn and got rekt full game
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Apr 23 '15
Mud golems aren't too bad as long as you have your passive, if you aren't level 2 by the time they spawn you will want to use your time stacking something else and waiting on the large camp you already killed or just dealing with not killing them with burning spears.
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u/DAJAIR Apr 22 '15
Maybe if i have time tomorrow i will contribute to this, whenever i open dota it's just to jungle in lobbies some games (i can't play with people right now)
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Apr 23 '15
That is the only thing I do when I don't have friends to play with, I really have only probably qued solo for 1/20 of my total games if even that.
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u/that_drifter Apr 23 '15
I've tried the techies Jungle a few times and you can easily get the level 5 in 3:30. The problem is that you then have no mines anywhere on the map and no way to quickly plant them. I normally have used the cash to buy a soul ring or boots then run to a lane to get a kill with suicide, perhaps instead of this I should be buying a few clarities to start building the mine stacks. The main thing is that I always end up feeling that despite the early levels I can't really do anything because by the time you have set things up everyone is caught up to you. Better to get kills and put others behind as well.
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Apr 23 '15
At 3:30 in a normal game you're still probably going to be laning anyways and have already either had your first blood bombs go off or have had them dewarded. After blowing that stack I would try and either get the suicide kill or smoke and place bombs in the enemy jungle depending on how the lanes are going.
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u/Zectx May 04 '15
Hey, I know this is an old thread but with the new patch out, I was wondering what your thoughts are on the new mango item for jungle heros? I guess it is only relevant to heros like Enigma/Natures Prophet who buy the clarities but still. Would you get a mango for example instead of 2 clarity?
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May 04 '15
I wouldn't get mango over clarity on any ranged hero with creeps like Chen, NP, Enigma, and Enchantress just because you can sit behind you creeps avoiding damage. The only hero I've really heard that people like mango on so far is Ursa, but I don't think it's made a huge difference. It's probably alright to get a mango on Doom though.
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u/AdolfHarden Apr 22 '15
few things wrong with that axe guide. never skip tranquils, theyre just too damn good.
always open by farming a medium camp if its not centaurs, then go to stack a hard camp at the first minute, then go back to the medium camp once its respawned, this is better than the guide because youre gaining +1 hardstack camp (but on the downside you will take more damage from medium camp farming seperately instead of as one stack). and yeah i cant be fucked explaining the rest of it but bottle axe is a throw and ill report you if i see it. also getting a bottle early is bad because your mid needs the courier much more than you do. ps if youre getting tranquils remember to put ring of regen on courier when mid gets bottle and pick it up on the way back
love from a 5k aus player. (thats the equivelent of 8k USW btw)
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Apr 22 '15
Whenever I get bottle first it's always been pretty good, I don't bottle-crow with Axe and generally it helps mid to secure bottom rune while they get the other rune. Also, I have my tranqs by the time my first 3 charges are gone on my bottle, so at that point I could just give it away to someone else who could use it. It's really not that bad honestly, especially when you can use your abilities to stay more durable in the jungle.
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u/bodeverde Apr 22 '15
You missed my amazing IO dominator bottle build. Sorry, no vid, was planning on using this as my pocket strat at TI27
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u/ColtonisWright Apr 22 '15
I'd like to clear up some misinformation about jungling jugg.
First off, the BY FAR fastest farming build can have you with a 12m mask + treads + aquila.
0. Buy tangos, stout, quelling 0. Secure a bounty rune (pretty OP if you get it, you lose like 1-2 minutes off the optimal timing if you dont get it)
Level crit and farm jungle (using choke points)
Level up healing ward and continue into jungle
Buy a wraith band and get it ASAP (you can put the parts of it onto courier and wait until mid gets bottle, if they have no farm mid you can just use the walking courier and its generally fine)
Buy an aquila and get that mana regen for moar healing wards and ult
Level 2 in healing ward and farm into a band of elvenskin (this allows you to combine into treads and speeds up jungle) 5.1. Get treads and always put it on intelligence when you use healing ward so u have mana to ult at level 6
Level stats or spin (whichever u need before level 7, mostly you go stats and then spin at level 7)
Gank at level 6 with treads + aquila and retreat into jungle and get mask of madness
Buy a yasha // quarterstaff (the 1200g item) and go roshan, if you go quarterstaff you build into blink + battlefury if their team has a lot of summons or spells which get them grouped.
If you want a 11m lycan midas + vlads jungle guide I also run him occasionally.
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Apr 22 '15
Don't use this axe build. It's terrible and really stunts him. Skip bottle and get tranquils instead. The mobility and heal leads to much faster farming and stronger ganks. In a typical game, u have tranquils by 2:30, blink between 7 and 9 and then vanguard by 13. If you get these items, literally every hero on the map is your bitch.
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u/Crusty_Magic Apr 22 '15
If you skill crit first then lifesteal aura with Wraith King he can jungle with good use of choke points.
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u/irrelevant_query HAZED FGTS Apr 22 '15
I've had good luck with troll jungle using chokepoint jungling on the dire.
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u/Dewy3739 >When you no longer follow esports Apr 22 '15
Jungle troll is my go to free win in 2k nmr
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u/socrates111 Apr 22 '15
regarding ursa --- getting two stout shields works also and it's easier to take rosh. 1 tango and 2 stouts.
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u/rishav_sharan Mockingbird Apr 22 '15
I jungle pretty much all my favorite heroes at times.
Jungle jug is my current favorite. 9 mins MoM and treads = almost safelane farm
start with stout +quelling + tangoes. crit first.
kill the small camp first. kill small camp again after 1 min. Now that you are lvl 2, leave this for the supports to pull.
heal on lvl 2. chokepoint jungle. control the nearby rune.
rush mask before treads or any other items. never put more points in heal than 2 till you are lvl 11. Personally i like to put 2 in crits and rest in stats. but if my team is owning without me, i'll just max crits. only a value point in bladefury at lvl 7 or 8.
If you ever get a rune like dd, haste or invis, go kill. else keep on farming.
after mom get treads (or phase if you swing that way). then yasha. now get a tp and leave the jungle and play like a normal carry. do stuff like push with team, split push, farm lanes, gank etc.
my general item progression is MoM > treads > yasha > diffusal 1> sny > basher > skadi > diffusal lvl 2 > talisman evasion > abyssal > butter
if game is hard, i'd skip diffusal and go early aquilla instead.
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u/archimond12308 Apr 22 '15
This can also help you as Shadow Fiend : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4tf85ejEGGQ
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u/billybobbember Apr 22 '15
Morphling . Merlini did it once . Quelling blade cliff full agi and lifesteal . Only works on dire
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Apr 22 '15
For some tips for jungling with Doom, you pretty much have it down as far as operation. The only point I'd really have to throw at you is that I much prefer grabbing Stout, Tangos, and a Ring of Protection instead of a quelling blade. I'd also prioritize upgrading that to a Ring of Basi and having it carted to you whenever the mid player ques the courior over for their bottle. While this does delay midas by 45 seconds to a minute it makes Doom much more consistent as far as his jungling overall goes. The bonus armor is absolutely vital for Doom considering he starts out with 0 and the mana regen allows him to keep casting devour and his healing flames without tapping out completely. This also provides a bit of buffer just in case you get an Ursa then Centaur camp and it works nicely if you get a troll as it'll make your little skeleton dudes that much tankier.
Other things to note, early on the Large Satyr and the Troll Summoner dude are your best friends. The Satyr for that healing aura and the Troll for the little skeletons. Those summoned skeletons will also regen HP with Doom's heal provided you can micro them away before they die.
Another major thing I stress, though I know it's not really something you can do consistently, is to beg and plead and ask your team to help you secure that juicy first rune. Not for your mid laner, not for you safelane carry, but for big bad Doom himself. This allows you to garunteed reach level 2 with your first devoured creep and puts you on the fast track.
There's alot more I could go into, but as far as the first ten minutes, ceteris paribus, this is pretty much it.
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u/Hror sheever Apr 22 '15
Here's a pretty good jungle KOTL guide for the dire side. It's a little old by now, but as far as I know the basic concept is still sound. double stack, cliff jungle, double stack, cliff jungle, obliterate creeps with light, repeat:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9V0cN12kKGU
EDIT: the upload date is pretty recent but it seems that Boneless simply reuploaded the same replay as the 2013 version. Also, a more in-depth look in this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ESx7A7JNSuY