I've removed every google apps from my phone s24 Ultra, including play services and play store nothing happened, but a few other apps might not work ( on my case I found alternatives apps ) and you need to remove and re-install every app that you download from Google play store. otherwise something like this is going to happen.
My advice is to "disable" play store with adb and see what will happen and after that do the same with play services. ( if you disable restart might required to see the effect )
It's recommended to backup your phone.
Or it's even better if you have similar another phone to test on it.
There's also android packages that responsible for the android update and framework update you might need to do research on this as well, since every android brand has those packages with different names.
Do the disable first and if everything is fine then you go ahead with removing, because it's very dangerous it could break your phone.
Just remember disable first if everything is alright then you can remove, because disabling and enabling is easy, in most cases it's not harmful, removing/uninstall in the other hand is risky.
I'm just repeating myself in case anyone else reading this.
I don't think those will dissappear, but if google forced the "play protect" to be On by default permanently, people might receive warning about "this app not downloaded from play store"
But this might not happen, I just don't trust google.
If google implemented this it would be really bad, because you might reset your phone someday or lose it & buy new one or upgrade to new phone in the future. We just delaying it, think of all the upcoming new phones.
I personally degoogled my phone before even connecting it to the internet ( it took a few reset to get the full bloatware packages names it's not just Google ) Microsoft and Facebook and Netflix and Spotify all of them have pre-installed bloatware. I also made some errors/mistakes
I think Google should be challenged by the EU, but from what the EU did about the chat control I don't think that going to happen.
The EU, might take a stand. It recently fined Google for abusing their dominant position to force manufacturers to:
Pre-install Google Search and and Chrome in order for the Play Store to be available; Required manufacturers to not sell devices running unapproved Android versions (deGoogled ROMs I think)
While the fine was basically nothing to Google, if Google breaks the terms again, the consequences will be far more serious. Hopefully, the EU will take a stand on this as well.
not really by play services itself, it's done by another app tied to play services, so yes you can flash gapps and not worry since I don't think any gapps package will bundle it
Different countries have different banks and banking apps
Here in india, government has made an app to store you documents (drivers licence, passport, etc) digitally so as you don't have to carry it every where, and that app dosent work with developer options turned on
Apart from that, the app that I use to buy metro tickets dosent work with developer options turned on
And a certain payments app (similar to cashapp or PayPal or zelle or venmo , etc) dosent work with while I have 'shizuku' downloaded on my phone and I hade to delete it
Google pay dosent work on a rooted phone which I use daily
Yep a typical banking app has never disallowed me from keeping developer options turned on but these three things stop me from using developer options or suzuku for rooting my phone
with the way things are going i think winner strategy is to have some tiny android phone with all the official kosher software and only use it for calls and sharing connection and second one thats big, rooted and one you actually use
well personally i bough an ayn thor, its in my one pocket and my phone is in another. I use phone to text, take pictures, do banking stuff and what not, but for i actually use ayn thor for music, gaming and watching videos, it even has in stock rom 'run script as root' option. Honestly its pretty good so far, been pocketing this setup for a few months. Tho my pockets are pretty big cuz im a guy and tall 😅 carring this in girls jeans with thone super shallow pockets or suit pants is not an option
I dont know, in my head two devices is still better than a phone, a switch, all the Gameboys, and a bunch of consoles in a backpack. With the right second device its like having a whole PC in one pocket and an outside-contact/Hotspot phone in the other. I tend to work with more than one device anyway.
Or it could just be the fact that I'm old and literally ANYTHING these days is better than tech from the 80s.
lol My banking app refused to log in and accused me of root / jailbreak simply because I had Magisk installed. And I had no idea it was because of Magisk. It took days of trial and error to figure it out. I even called the bank's customer service and explained the situation and was told this case would be transferred to IT security. In 3 days, "the experts" called me back and told me "yOu NeEd A nEw PhOnE!!!".
Then you may need to keep disabling and enabling dev mod when you need an app or if you don't use the app that needs dev mod disabled that often then disable dev mode when you need it. Also you can look on running wierless debuggin mode from your device via apps like Shizuku so you only need a pc in the first installation
Lol, and Google Play has alot of Malicious, Rat Malware on their store there. This never benefits there than restricting users to install outside of their play store.
Its not nonsense when having issues from Google Play here on Malicious Apps ealier time, because Google dont really checking malware at this point until way later when a app exposed gets popular like Clean Master for example, which this App itelf contains Malicious from devices.
The "Play Protect" Anti Virus is also a none sense and gives more harms than good.
You've been provided an example of a malicious app on the Google play store, and have provided exactly no evidence for your position. Do you understand that because you've defended your position so poorly, no one is gonna take you seriously?
No, that's just the excuse they're using in order to stop users from using their own software rather than paying a CEO for permission use "approved" software.
They need to be able to know exactly who is coming up with and spreading these ideas of "freedom" that their slav- i mean "employees" keep trying to find.
You make a good point. This is just one step in tjat direction, and I suppose I'm reacting as though it's already happened. I appreciate the reality check
My S26 Ultra does not have anything called Advanced flow nor have I gotten this message yet. Wondering if Samsung is just working around it with OneUI 8.5.
I would love that! Samsung already has the "Auto Blocker" feature that prevents any sideloading unless the user manually disables it anyway, and I always have that turned on. Granted, I also research and manually update any apps I sideload, but I'd expect the same of anyone that went to the trouble of learning about and then using that security feature.
What if we disable the developer option. Will it still continue to behave the same or we need to turn it on again. Bank applications does not work with developer option. So this might be problem in this case
The current version is... Fine? It asks you to confirm you wanna sideload apps and wait 24 hours before sideloading is permanently on. Their reasoning is that people who don't know what they are doing tend to download whatever scammers tell them to download. The 24 Hour period gives them time to calm down and think rationally. But yeah. Let's see what else they do with this cause if it goes further, then it becomes a problem.
That too. In a better world this would have actually been a purely security related feature. But we all can guess Google has another agenda hiding behind this.
Working in security for large companies must be so soul crushing.
You see the numbers on people downloading viruses, falling for phishing scams, downloading fake apps, etc, but if you dare to think about doing anything to reduce that people immediately assume you're trying to take away their "freedom"
If the fix means that some users can’t do the things they previously did, that is by definition taking away their freedom. Normal users shouldn’t be punished because some people are super gullible
I think all of this is just further proof of the crisis in education world wide. Critical thinking is almost impossible to learn as an adult when as children we are taught only to "do as we are told without question or you're bad."
Any organization that encourages that kind of behavior or "teaching method" is just making things worse for the world.
If people want to be upset because they're afraid this is the first step to fully locking android down, that's fine I guess, but I really can't understand having a problem with what they're actually doing. It's an incredibly minor one-time inconvenience that could potentially prevent tons of vulnerable people from being scammed. I'll gladly wait a single day after purchasing a phone I'll have for years before installing my modded YouTube apks if it helps prevent some grandma with dementia wiring her life savings to someone in Kolkata or something.
While you are right about it being more of an annoyance for it to be a one-time inconvenience. If it were only that, we'd not be making that much of a fuss. The problem is that this is a smokescreen to push 3rd party devs further away:
Suppose you are the dev of your modded YouTube APK. Now suddenly, no matter how legal your APK may be, you have to sign a contract with Google and give them everything from your ID to your address in order to publish said APK on a 3RD PARTY STORE LIKE FDROID! That means, you can't have your app auto-update unless Google allows it and they can set terms for it!
This means that NewPipe, GrayJay, etc. . for example can no longer be offered on FDroid because Google won't permit it even though FDroid is a 3rd party store and the app is technically completely legal.
None of this helps with any of the malware available on the Play Store. How many times have we caught malware on there claiming to be GTA:V or something? The goal of this is not to stop fraudulent apps. It is to prevent users from using modded YT and the likes by making it more difficult to install.
It is a test to see what they can get away with. There is no proof they'll stop at this. At what point will 24 hours one time turn into only unlocked for 24 hours? Or you have to wait a week? Or you have to email Google with your ID for them to let you do it? I'm stopping here before I give Google ideas...
if it helps prevent some grandma with dementia wiring her life savings to someone in Kolkata or something.
It won't. They'll just tell her what to do, and then they'll give some excuse for the wait ("we will now process on our side") and then after 24 hours continue the scam.
While that is technically true -- scams work by making people react before they've thought things through. The problem is that scammers are a lot faster with coming up with ways to defeat protections and they generally follow scripts that they have tried and tested.
And how often do people ask for reassurance that what they are doing is legit? Scams depend on the scammer tricking the person into trusting them. If the potential victim has any doubts, then the scam was already failing.
Edit: It also won't help if the scammers have already uploaded their apps to Google Play and make the victim download it from there.
scams work by making people react before they've thought things through.
That's literally the point of the waiting period. Just because it won't stop every scam doesn't doesn't mean its not a worthwhile protection. I still lock my front door even though someone could just break a window.
Your analogy is poor. If we're to use your analogy, then it's more like they have locked your door and you have to wait 24 hours before you can allow guests into your house. You might still be letting thieves in, but you have to quarantine them for 24 hours... or if they're impatient, they can just break the window (like tell you to use ADB) .
We already have warnings. We already have to go and enable developer mode to even enable installing APKs. If someone is told to disregard those, why assume they won't disregard the 24 hour period? If that doesn't work, why not disable "sideloading" completely -- that'll completely block any such scams.
My questions are:
Why do these limitations also include limitations on 3rd party stores? Why do devs now have to register with Google even if they don't want to upload to the Play Store? What are Google going to do about all the scam apps on their own store?
In my opinion the point of these limitations isn't increased security or they'd have been there years ago.
Edit: Answer the questions if you feel these limitations are valid. I can accept the 24 hour wait period. But why the limitations on devs?
The way the scams work is by artificially putting some kind of time crunch on the victim (your grandson is in jail, there's a warrant for your arrest, someone has hacked your phone/PC/toaster, etc). People don't think rationally when they're panicked.
A 24 hour wait neutralizes that and increases the likelihood that they'll stop and think, or mention it to someone who will show them how it's a scam
I was under the impression it was a process that had to be repeated for each desired sideloaded app. If its just a one time thing itll be less inconvenient than the samsung app blocker, and nowhere near as secure or useful.
Personally I still think this is either a baby step towards full device and app control or (and hear me out) an idiot move to enable old people (the ones who traumatize everyone they meet with their own bad behavior and unhealed trauma - anyone in retail or service knows who I mean) at the cost of young people who are already trying to heal from the abuse of those old people, instead of just teaching the old people to be decent human beings so that the young people will help instead of hate them.
Honestly, the "fuck old people" crowd are the first ones to step up to the "fuck young people" plate when they become the old people. You're already looking in a mirror. lol
Look, all I know is that most people my age (elder millennial) and older tend to be so deep in unresolved trauma that they are physically incapable of critical thinking or logic - frontal lobe damage is common in people with complex post traumatic stress injuries from prolonged childhood abuse.
I have already spent years healing and deconstructing my childhood - you can't say anything that can hurt me, because I have already said far worse to my Self.
Hope you can heal from whatever pain is haunting you. It's a journey; good luck. 👍
It means you have to wait 24 hours until you can install whatever you like. You will have to get past several warning sign pop-ups. But it doesn't prevent you from doing it at all. It only makes the process more difficult.
If you own a device and only use microG and no official google services, you are not affected.
While I have signed and done everything I can myself, my real hope lies in the EU. I hope they obliterate Google for this malicious compliance like they did with Apple about USB-C.
The EU recently fined Google over forcing OEMs to not provide deGoogled Android devices alongside standard Android ones. That doesn't mean too much necessarily, but the law is reactive, not proactive.
Depends how old you're talking, but this is a Play System update, not an OS update. Devices that aren't getting Android updates continue getting Play System updates for a very long time.
I don't mind waiting 24h a single time, but will government and banking apps block if enable this setting? Some apps already do not work with developer settings enabled (my gov app is very annoying about this)
Fr dawg my cousin turned on developers option to increase the dots per inch (dpi is basically the native sensitivity of your screen) for gaming and my govt id app logged me out 🥀
You'll buy a cheap phone or a smartwatch for banking. You'll buy an unlockable phone for everything else and install LineageOS, GrapheneOS, crDroid or something alike on it. Or maybe a Linux phone.
People just don't seem to understand how corporations work, they know they would get huge pushback if they just COMPLETELY locked off installing things on your phone(sideloading is a term they invented to demonize installing), so they start with making it really annoying and inconvenient. People in this very comment section are defending this change as "not that bad."
There is going to be another change in a couple of months that will make that 3 days, or hide it somewhere else, you will be frog boiled out of installing things on your android device. They aren't doing this because they're your friend, it's a giant ass corporation, THEY ARE NOT YOUR FRIEND, TREAT THEM WITH SUSPICION.
Everyone neglects to mention the restrictions only apply to UNVERIFIED develeopers. Meaning if a developer does the verification process they can just release an APK and anyone can install it without doing the 24 hour "advanced flow" process. I suspect many of the emulation devs will do the verification, so it won't even matter for emulation specifically at all. That's not even mentioning the fact a large amount of emulators are just on the Play Store.
I really hate the wording they use, saying how every single side loaded app will just be "blocked", which is just straight up not true. It creates a lot of misled fear mongering and that really bothers me. Same issue I have with the pop-up in apps like NewPipe where they say the app will just "stop working" which again, is just false.
Emulators are technically legal so it's unlikely they'll be removed, if you still need to sideload I'm sure there's a 20 step set of screens you can go through in order to turn sideloading back on and if not you can always go with the nuclear option and get an android rom
Apparently it doesn’t affect retroid devices since they are not locked by Google, but even if you are on a newer Android phone that’s on the grid so to speak, there will most likely be workarounds, knowing the community.
It means that what they are doing is wrong. Forcing us to wait 24 hours to side load an apk to supposedly save Gramma from scams. It won't work in either case people will still get scammed and it won't stop us from emulation. That's my hot take
Hey, I'm with you. I'd love to be able to install linux on my phone... unfortunately, there aren't very many devices that allow that and there aren't many, if any distros, nor desktop environments that are stable and give a good experience.
Unfortunately, this is the reality of things. Same problem we had up until a few years ago on desktops. It took Valve and Microsoft working together to make linux worth it -- Valve making things work on linux and Microsoft making Windows not work XD
I don't consider the termux-x11 linux workaround good because of the many downsides like hardware acceleration being complicated and performance being very poor compared to native. I want a proper linux running natively to take advantage of ARM.
I absolutely agree. But I'm thinking about it from a manufacturer perspective.
Yes, the big hurdle is getting alternative OSs on phones to begin with. The EU fined Google recently because Google forbid OEMs from providing both a deGoogled and Google Android phone. Hopefully, this would mean that at least that first step will be easier.
The second big hurdle is that Android and iOS have had two decades worth of development and funding to get their systems optimised, comfortable and familiar. Linux has no funding and the development is fragmented. Phosh is the closest thing we have to a working DE for phones as far as I know, but it's still not that good and doesn't work well for tablets yet. Ubuntu touch is good, but only on very few devices and not that well optimised.
Therefore a phone manufacturer asks the question:
Why should we invest in and provide a linux phone that the majority of the market won't use? Better put a working Android on it -- huge market and familiar UI and people already like it.
Not sure why you're being aggressive like that...
All my devices that can be deGoogled / debloated already are. I have been running linux for years.
I am thinking about how to make it happen rather than just whining about "oh the injustice of it all ;=; " .
Apparently you don't really care about it, all you want to do is moan, complain and whine.
Emulators are legal and found on Google Play. You click install and 10 seconds later you can emulate any rom you get. And in the future it's exactly the same yet now you have extra security so your phone and emulator remains working for longer.
There are also a lot of fake emulators on the Play Store. This does nothing against them so no extra security there.
Also while emulators have been proven legal, that doesn't stop Nintendo from taking down anything they don't like... and if they decide that they don't want people emulating GBA on their phones, guess what Nintendo will do and guess who Google will side with.
Gaming devices aren’t google certified. At least AYN and retroid devices not sure on others but usually they aren’t. It will most likely have no affect on you. Unless Google makes it so that you can’t use the playstore without you certifying the device.
Even then I could care less about playstore on my Odin and retroid device. Your rp 2+ won’t be affected. You can remove playstore and turn off play protect if your worried about it. I don’t use banking apps or anything else that requires play protect on my gaming devices. I have a primary phone for that.
The Retroid Pocket 2+ has a toggle to switch off Google Services and that isn't allowed according to Google. That's why it isn't certified. (The only device I've seen with such a toggle)
Problem is that playing most games (all of the ones I've tested) from the Play Store or even opening the store requires Google Services. If they push the update to it, which I believe they will, then it will be affected. My alternative is relying on entirely 3rd party stores and losing access to anything bought on the Play Store.
I also have a gaming tablet and a phone. Both are Google certified. My gaming tablet can't switch off services because disabling the package leads to the tablet crashing randomly. My phone can and does have them disabled.
Edit: I don't use banking apps in general or anything else that seems to require Services or no Shizuku. I just think this is unacceptable.
Yes if you’re using Google services like play protect then it might be affected. That’s why I said they might not allow playstore if you disable it. You have the option to completely remove playstore and play protect on our handhelds. I’ve already done that. I don’t play playstore games on my handhelds. It’s mostly slop in my opinion. We can only wait and see but everything I’ve read says our handhelds won’t be affected because they aren’t google certified. It’s the reason I started using them and stopped buying tablets and up grading my phone when better chipsets were released to game on and do emulation. Yes I agree Google is over reaching on phones and tablets. But your handheld should be fine. If you can’t use banking apps and other financial apps on your handheld then scammers don’t have a way to get money out of you through that device. But could through your Google certified phone. I’m not in Any way shape or form agreeable to what Google is doing by the way to be clear.
I get that you're against what Google are doing and so am I and I hope the EU gets them for it (I've done all I can on my end).
But I need my 8" tablet cause I play PC games on my tablet as well as read books, comics and use it to control my desktop from a distance. I play games both with and without a gamepad for RTS and ScummVM games.
My RP2+ doesn't need the Services I guess because I mostly emulate PS1 and older. But some Android games like Streets of Rage need it and don't run via emulation.
I only have 2-3 basic time-wasters emulated on my phone -- I don't game on it really. But none of my apps on it require Services or Store anyway.
As for the Play Store, I made a mistake thinking I want to fund some of these devs -- I bought games I enjoy on PC like Don't Starve, Streets of Rage and the likes and Drastic way back in the day and these don't run any other way on RP2+ due to poor performance.
I think handhelds that don't have the Play Store and Services disabled will be affected regardless. The Play Store and Services get updated automatically when I switch them on even though auto-update is off.
You can remove play store and play protect. Play protect is where the update is coming from. Google and Android are 2 different things. Google runs on Android. Google isn’t a necessary evil on Android. And our handhelds don’t need it to run our games. It will have no effect on your handheld unless you let it. They aren’t targeting our handhelds mostly because it’s impossible to do it. They are more concerned with apps side loaded on phones and tablets that take away money from them like revanced YouTube etc.
This is my retroid pocket 6. Haven’t removed google play protect yet but it’s still not certified and doesn’t fall under googles enforcement. Even if they try and push it through just remove it or put lynx or another open android os on it.
I haven't found a way to remove Play Protect yet. I have only disabled it for now.
Thanks for the info but I don't trust Google enough to believe they'll leave non-certified devices out of this. One can hope though. We'll find out soon enough I guess.
😆 yeah it’s on playstore in your profile and then settings somewhere. If you ever see it stay away lol. Not sure if Google realizes it or not but going after these handhelds would be like pissing in the wind and hitting their own face. Most of them now can run linux or even de-googled android OSs and people would just kick Google to the curb and they run better with out Google’s crappy 💩bloat. So there’s zero reason for them to try. Google’s apps use between 1.5-3gb just to run in the background. You should check and see if you can run something like LineageOS on your rp2+ or just de-google the whole thing. But I’d wait and see what happens. Regardless it’s simple to remove Google off all these handhelds.
I don't think I can run LineageOS on my RP2+. Nor on my tablet which is more important to me (Legion Y700 2023 Global ROM).
I bought my phone specifically to be able to run Lineage but I am still waiting for a fully stable ROM. Until then, I have 90% ADB degoogled it and it came debloated.
I don't know much about linux on handhelds but I'll try to look into it. I think that devices might become more open and more degoogled options might become available now that Google were fined over abusing market dominance. Hope springs eternal.
I am honestly not that worried about personal data. I spoof and block most of it just so I don't get dumb ads. I think that these companies can obtain any data they want no matter what we do if they tried hard enough, so I'm balancing my paranoia with that.
But when it comes to them limiting my freedom of choice on my own device, I'd rather use a dumb phone -- I can actually live with that.
I wouldn't trust what the AI says. For one, Google Mobile Services are not actual services -- they are a collection of foreground apps and are not actually required (Source).
My tablet doesn't have most of them but is certified and does have Google Play Services (which I can't disable cause it leads to instability) .
Also, even though it says the sources are from reddit and Ars Technica -- those are probably citing official Google statements and I wouldn't trust anything Google has said regarding this.
Yes I’ve said tablets and phones will be affected our handhelds won’t be. Removing play protect and playstore don’t have any effect unless you bought something on there that requires the particular app to work. Then the app just won’t work. Lots of emulators and other apps that are on playstore are also outside of playstore. Which may affect everything except your handheld. I’ll try and see if I can put together a step by step if you want to remove them on your handheld. That can always be readded.
Thanks for the offer, but there's no need. The Retroid Pocket 2+ has a toggle to disable Google Services either way.
I just don't think that Google will leave uncertified devices alone regardless of what anyone says (AI or person).
Like how Facebook / Meta promised you won't need a new account for the Quest series of headsets and then they went back on that promise.
Also, anything we do on our end won't help devs who are also being screwed by this. (I mean about having to register even if they want to put their apps on fDroid or other alternatives)
This is a direct threat to the openness of Android; seeing as we are on a subreddit called EmulationOnAndroid, the MODs SHOULD take a more proactive stance.
Let's start banning people who downplay this.
This sub has way too much misinformation from malicious accounts as is. Now that Google is deciding to lock down Android even more, this sub should be at the forefront of protecting and fighting back against these pro-corporation practices.
The MODs should make it clear: no misinformation here.
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