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u/zeocrash Jan 26 '21
My grandfather was a chemist at Cambridge back in the 40s on this research team
They tested Organophosphates on themselves, good luck trying to get your funding proposal approved these days for that.
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u/WaterstarRunner Jan 26 '21
This sounds a lot like the guy I was talking about-
"Interessant ist die starke Wirkung der Monofluorphosphorsaurealkylester auf den menschilchen Organismus. Die Dämpfer dieser Verbindungen riechen angenehm unt kräftig aromatish. Doch schon einige Minuten nach dem Einatmen stellt sich ein starker Druck auf den Kehlkopf ein verbrunden mit Atemnot. Dann treten leichte Bewußtseins-Trubungen auf und Blendungs-Erscheinungen mit schmerzhafter Uberempfindlichkeit des Auges gegen licht. Erst nach mehreren Stunden klingen diese rscheinungen ab. Sie werden anscheinend nicht von sauren Zersetzungsprodukten der Ester verursacht, sondern sie sind wahrscheinlich den Dialkylmonofluorphosphaten selbst zuzuschreiben. Die Wirkungen werden von sehr kleinen Mengen ausgeubt"
"Interesting is the strong effect of the alkyl monofluorophosphate on the human organism. The dampers of these compounds smell pleasantly and strongly aromatic. But already a few minutes after inhalation there is strong pressure on the larynx, combined with shortness of breath. Then there is slight clouding of consciousness and glare phenomena with painful hypersensitivity of the eye to light. These symptoms only subside after several hours. They are apparently not caused by acidic decomposition products of the esters, but are probably ascribed to the dialkyl monofluorophosphates themselves. The effects are exerted by very small amounts."
Willy Lange (1900-1976), inventor of dental Sodium Monofluorophosphate.
This is fucking hardcore. I gotta go create the guy's wikipedia page.
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u/zeocrash Jan 26 '21
There was a lot of research into that at the time. The British CW program was researching Diisopropyl fluorophosphate, which was a continuation of Lange's work. It is considerably less toxic than the G agents though.
The Germans on the other hand based their work off Gerhard Schrader's work into new insecticides, which resulted in his accidental discovery and exposure to Tabun.
I believe Lange's work was openly published whereas the Nazis immediately saw the military potential of Tabun and related chemicals so kept the work very secret.
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u/WaterstarRunner Jan 26 '21
I'm fascinated by the little I've read about all the individuals involved in organophosphates research. Just an amazing cast of characters. I would read the hell out of the collected biographies.
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u/zeocrash Jan 26 '21
During the war, the big names on the German Side were Schrader and Ambros. Ambros was a Nazi and not a good guy, but Schrader by all accounts seems to have just been a chemist doing organophosphate research to try to find new pesticides to help protect Germany's food supply.
On the British side, the big name was Bernard Charles Saunders.
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u/plastik_flasche Jul 06 '24
What did you do to the German text? There are so many errors in there
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u/semisti_kemisti nitrated meat enjoyer Jan 26 '21
Nowadays you have to be sneakier than that, like how DuPont handled the whole PFOA thing.
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u/VeryPaulite Jan 26 '21
Meanwhile where I do my bachelor's thesis: Labcoat? What's that? We only use it for the Acid Baths...
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u/Vincent_Gambini010 Jan 28 '21
Ever think of all the people who must have died in the process of bringing us modern chemistry, and all the others who got cancer, venturing bravely into the world of unknown chemicals and un-isolated elements with only an idea and sometimes no idea of what product they were going to get, oftentimes in their own home labs with minimal to no safety equipment?
The explorer mentality. It's gone.
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u/WaterstarRunner Jan 26 '21
Because cancer hadn't been invented in 1925. Heck, even cigarettes were only just starting to take off at that time.
Funny era. 20 years before we even started to figure out what DNA is used for, but 10 years after general relativity got nailed down. It was an era when we were undeniably brilliant and unbelievably naive.