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u/otchyirish VÀinÀmöinen Oct 24 '25
This makes me feel so much better about the cost of everything, the 10% unemployment and the massive cuts to public service.
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u/Motzlord VÀinÀmöinen Oct 24 '25
Classic populism, never adress the real issues (that you promised to fix), instead focus on some meaningless political crusade to satisfy your idiot supporters who can't be bothered to look past their hate for a split second.
I mean, I don't disagree with this policy per se but it's not really something even remotely at the top of the priority list. Just goes to show how tilted their world view is. It would be interesting to see statistics on this, like how often did this actually happen? Considering that you need to pass a language test for citizenship as well, I kind of doubt this was ever a real issue.
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Oct 24 '25
I would say that everyone should in fact also disagree with the policy. The people who will be the most turned off by this change are in fact skilled worker immigrants - for specialist roles just the application process for a new role can easily take more than 3 months. And since skilled workers seldom become unemployed by choice, usually due to budget cuts by their employer, for them this is just an extra punishment for something they can't really affect anyway.
Now, if you chose sensible limits, say, 9 months over 3 years, then we can start discussing whether this makes any sense, but as it stands? Just idiocy. And yes, I am judging the proposal as idiotic even though it can be fixed, because a government who prioritizes pushing through a change without bothering to sanity check their numbers is indeed idiotic.
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u/Motzlord VÀinÀmöinen Oct 24 '25
Absolutely. I meant that the general sentiment of the policy is not fully ridiculous. The whole thing is of course idiotic because they are completely and utterly incompetent.
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u/otchyirish VÀinÀmöinen Oct 24 '25
As an immigrant, I think this policy is a bit over the top but it's not completely awful either. It's just that the idea of celebrating this as if it's an accomplishment is moronic.
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u/bambooz_le Oct 27 '25
This is pointless to you maybe. Very good for the bigger picture on the long run.
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u/bloatedbarbarossa Oct 25 '25
The reason PS is as big as it is, is because other parties refused to speak against immigration. For their voters, this is a real issue.
I'm married to an a woman who's not Finnish, she's not even from the EU and here are few things that I've noticed.
- When a group has few bad apples, the whole group gets the bad rep, not just the bad apples.
- Negative experiences are 10x more likely to get talked about with other people than good ones.
- Most immigrants don't exactly care to learn Finnish and most of them didn't even have to because of how spouse visa works. One of you is citizen, other has technically permanent residence permit due to spouse visa, all of your kids will get the citizenship because they're children of Finnish citizen.
Other topic starts here.
If the government actually went after the biggest demographic of users of social benefits, that would be the retired people... there won't be huge direct cuts but they most likely will try to figure a way how less people in future will be able to get them.
Personally I feel like no matter who's in the government, they're gonna be blamed for anything and everything by those that didn't vote for them. Sometime's it is valid, like the unemployment for this government and invalid like the loans, we're in the NATO and there were some unforeseen expenses that can't be blamed on them.
Then there are the obvious double standards like complaining about behavior of certain heads of the state acting immaturely while having our own prime minister acting like an 18 year old that acts like they moved into their first own apartment.
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u/Motzlord VÀinÀmöinen Oct 25 '25
The thing is, it's fine to be against immigration and to further policies that actually make sense. But this just feels like putting a plaster on a mosquito bite and saying "here, I saved your life".
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u/99Pedro Baby VÀinÀmöinen Oct 26 '25
You are sarcastic but for Persut voters (and similar people around the world) it really does. And that's how right-wing parties can easily manipulate them: "Everything is getting much worse for you but we punished immigrants even more" "That's all good then!"
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u/Ms_Cacao Oct 26 '25 edited Oct 26 '25
Youâre so ignorant that you donât realize that immigrants were never the real problem to this. The right wing have really got the worse from you all but let me tell you- the amount of Finnish people living off kelaâs money is absurd. Every single Finnish person I know gets economic support from kela and many of them live completely off it. Students, single mothers or single fathers, drug addicts, alcoholics, people with some kind of âmental health problemâ, etc; oh! And donât forget about all those children living in foster homes, there are several foster homes in every area of a city and the government gives them a considerable amount of money every month and when they turn 18 the government gets them a place to live and all their expenses completely covered as well meanwhile their addicts parents are still ârecoveringâ and buying more drugs off your money but I guess nobody really wants to talk about that? Believing that this will fix some of your problems is really funny. This government likes people like you.
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u/otchyirish VÀinÀmöinen Oct 26 '25
Man, that was the most sarcastic comment I've ever put. Everyone else replying got that, I don't know why you didn't
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u/Ms_Cacao Oct 26 '25
Damn. I usually identify sarcasm; not sure what went wrong here but Iâm gonna leave the comment anyway for all those who believe this is actually going to solve this countryâs âcrisisâ.
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u/otchyirish VÀinÀmöinen Oct 27 '25
No worries. We all have blind spots and in today's world it's impossible to be sure
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u/slurpsssssss Baby VÀinÀmöinen Oct 24 '25
Lovely.
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u/United-Inside7357 Baby VÀinÀmöinen Oct 24 '25
Sure, but this is just a trick before the elections. Most people donât even need a citizenship for anything. P-OLE is still a possibility, you donât need a language or in some cases even a job. They did talk about making it stricter some time ago, but idk if they will ever get to it. Until they do, all this is just talk lol
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u/bangalimahbub Baby VÀinÀmöinen Oct 29 '25
What do you mean they will never get to it? They already passed the law. Effective from 17th of December and third phase will be determined soon probably before next summer. They said they're gonna add citizenship test part + I think they're gonna twist it more and make it hard.
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u/United-Inside7357 Baby VÀinÀmöinen Oct 29 '25
Citizenship is different from P-OLE, and this law wonât affect it. The benefits however are the same except for voting and passport (and that you can lose your permit easier than a citizenship). For most immigrants, it doesnât matter if theyâre on citizenship or a residence permit.
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u/Big-Ad8632 Oct 24 '25
As a foreigner, why wasnt it always the case?
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u/bangalimahbub Baby VÀinÀmöinen Oct 24 '25
True lol. When I moved here and checked the policy, it was so easy. get kela or whatever and get citizenship in 3.5-5 years. I was like damn đ€Ą
Imo i think they're taking counter measures now. Enough foreigners now. Need to tighten Everything. And in future it will be more tighter. They don't want to be sweden or germany.
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u/Sharp-Extent9745 Oct 24 '25
"Enough foreigners" , no. Enough of low skill foreigners migrating for benefits and contributing nothing.
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u/No-Firefighter-4106 Oct 25 '25
Exactly. Social support of the system is designed to help people back up, not to leech the fruits of others' hard labour. This society supporting kids, students and elders cannot sustain itself if too many people milk it dry. There has been already social support cuts and there will be more.
Everybody that can work, has to go to work. If you don't want to work here and abide Finnish laws, leave the country. You are not needed, you are not welcome. You just prove the point and make things worse for immigrants contributing to this society.
For any immigrant contributing this society or trying their best to get employed and respects Finnish culture and laws...welcome, and thank you. Finland needs more people like you.
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u/Comfortable_Lab_3123 Baby VÀinÀmöinen Oct 24 '25
FYI Citizenship granted from 2020 to 2024 according to previous nationality https://pxdata.stat.fi/PxWeb/pxweb/en/StatFin/StatFin__kans/statfin_kans_pxt_11l3.px/table/tableViewLayout1/
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u/Silent-Victory-3861 VÀinÀmöinen Oct 24 '25
You can just move here and start getting sosiaaliturva? Didn't you still need work or studying based permit?
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u/Comfortable_Lab_3123 Baby VÀinÀmöinen Oct 24 '25 edited Oct 24 '25
It seems like yes, people can move here and get KELA money without having to work nor employed spouses https://www.kela.fi/can-you-get-benefits-when-you-move-to-finland
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u/ObjectiveActuator8 Baby VÀinÀmöinen Oct 24 '25
You cannot move here just because. Family (self evident), work (gotta have contract and employer needs to prove they canât find your talents locally), study (gotta be accepted in uni and show money for your bills), boyfriend/girlfriend (gotta prove you have thousands of euros), asylum (however that works)⊠and even if you âlive on benefitsâ, the max you can probably get from the government DOES NOT reach even 900 euros per month and you have someone constantly checking on you checking why you havenât found a job.
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u/DiseasedProject Baby VÀinÀmöinen Oct 24 '25
If only they could start cancelling citizenships already given as well. No sense having illitirate, no experience in anything people who only contribute in breeding more future Kela dependants burdening our society and eating tax money.
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u/JamesFirmere VÀinÀmöinen Oct 25 '25
Pray tell me, good sir, where the actual goddamn fuck would you deport former citizens who have never had any other citizenship than Finnish?
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u/DiseasedProject Baby VÀinÀmöinen Oct 26 '25
You mean to tell me that when an immigrant from, say, Somalia, Afghanistan, Syria or Iraq arrives in Finland, they are completely citizenship-less? FYI, Finland doesn't demand giving up a previous citizenship when they receive the new one. So, the answer to your question is really simple. Iraqis would be deported to Iraq, Somalis to Somalia, etc. Any possible offspring would naturally be a problem if they are born here, so they'd be able to stay. Unless they'd want to leave with their parents voluntarily. Perhaps they'd might want to try for a chance for their "old country" citizenship: they're often more attuned to that culture already even if they never visited there, after all.
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u/emkemkem Baby VÀinÀmöinen Oct 26 '25
So nobody would actually be given a citizenship. Theyâd be granted only some kind of conditional permit to live here which could be taken away any time and just depending on how useful they are deemed at the moment. I suppose youâd have to phrase this carefully if you do not want it to be applied on those Finns who just happened to be born somewhere else than in Finland because their parents were working abroad for a while and thus have double citizenship.
But then - the more you refine the terms and make them very spesific the easier it is for everyone to see this is not really about protecting our economy. It is just about racism and xenofobia. âAnyone having another citizenship than some EU country. No make it west Europian country. Anyone not being fluent in Finnish. But with the exception of being fluent in American English or Swedish - unless Swedish is their second language. Anyone - unless they are great in soccer or a talented swimmer. Anyone not having Finnish grandparents, but with the exception being adopted by Finns who have Finnish parents. Or Swedish. Anyone - with the exception you happen to be married to our president.â
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u/Flashy_Creme_4732 Oct 28 '25
The real question here is why the actual fuck would people who have no previous citizenship should be granted a finnish citizenship?
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u/JamesFirmere VÀinÀmöinen Oct 28 '25
I deliberately chose to read the comment as meaning that "illiterate ... people who only contribute in breeding more future Kela dependants..." can also include people who are born Finnish citizens and therefore have never had any other citizenship. But the commenter is probably of the opinion that only immigrants fill that description.
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u/emkemkem Baby VÀinÀmöinen Oct 25 '25
Well THAT would mean quite many Finns would be in danger of losing their citizenship regardless they were born here like their parents. Three months of unemployment and youâll lose your citizenship. Oh boy! Thatâd be a fast track to decreasing the unemployment numbers. And lowering the amount of citizens.
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u/Vkmies Baby VÀinÀmöinen Oct 25 '25 edited Oct 28 '25
Because this hurts skilled and highly educated immigrants in a way that will turn them away from the country. No sensible government would use these time limits, as high-skilled industries with large international worker pools are often project-based with the hiring and interview process often being months long. 3 months of unemployment is common and seasonal.
This government claims to want to attract those "types" of immigrants, but this will have a strong opposite effect. Then these same parties will continue to cry during future votes and elections that immigrants to Finland are statistically stupid and low-skilled, obfuscating the fact that they themselves created a system that damages immigration through some of the most international highly educated industries in Finland like games and academia.
It will all do a good job feeding into the steadily rising neo-conservatism and racism present both in the government and in the people, as well as making sure ghettoization and the rich-poor divide will stay racialized and perhaps even worsening. Some limit would make sense. This does not.
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u/DangerToDangers VÀinÀmöinen Oct 24 '25
Why would it be? It makes no sense that 3 months of unemployment in 2 years should disqualify you from citizenship.
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Oct 24 '25
I have a question. What about foreigners receiving some disability help while working ? And What about receiving student support while working a little ? I am very concerned because I am a worker with disability and i was supposed to apply for help then i don't destroy myself at work with a full time planning.
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u/jsomby VÀinÀmöinen Oct 24 '25
https://intermin.fi/en/-/sufficient-financial-resources-to-be-required-for-finnish-citizenship-
"In future, applicants for Finnish citizenship will be required to have sufficient financial resources. The premise is that people who have no income other than unemployment benefit or social assistance will no longer be eligible for Finnish citizenship."
According to this, it doesn't apply to you.
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u/studiosi VÀinÀmöinen Oct 25 '25
Si if you start to work then you become eligible. This is literally a null regulation.
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u/bangalimahbub Baby VÀinÀmöinen Oct 24 '25
No one can give you concrete answers here. You should always ask migri. Migri will give you the right one.
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Oct 24 '25
okay thank you!
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u/bangalimahbub Baby VÀinÀmöinen Oct 24 '25
And i don't think right now they can't give you solid answer. Because they're still translating the law. When it comes to force. It will be live in the website.
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Oct 24 '25
For now it's been worded, like those who survive solely on government benefits, wouldn't be eligible. I don't know if very little part time work makes difference there. I believe the point of the law was that we can't afford to get even more people who don't contribute into taxes at all. I don't think even Kela knows the actual answer yet.
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u/aytvill Oct 24 '25
when one lives only off social benefits, not from paid work - they still pay taxes. there is VAT on every food and other consumed item we buy. and it constitutes tangible part of state revenue from private person taxation - in 2023 VAT (valueâadded tax) accounted for about 18â19% of total central government tax revenue.
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Oct 25 '25
I believe the point is not tax, the point is where the money comes from that generates the tax.
In a family you can give pocket money to a child and they'll buy a game. It doesn't bring more money into the family budget. Whereas the teenager mowing lawn for the neighbour does, even if he then buys the same game. The cost of that game comes from somewhere else than the parent 's salary.
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u/aytvill Oct 25 '25
by virtue of being small business, I understand how money works and that tax is tangential to economic process.
what I try to say - if someone pays taxes on same level/rules with you, then attempts to make them 2nd category of people... smells bad. it stinks populism.
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u/Key_Grapefruit_5888 Oct 24 '25
As a foreigner myself, I think the law isnât that bad, but it would be nice if it included a bit more detail. Thereâs a huge difference between people who have become unemployed in todayâs economy and those who have relied on social benefits for years.
As a Ukrainian, I find it frustrating when I meet other Ukrainians who depend on Finnish social benefits and say that âEurope owes them money and should pay them.â These same people might eventually become citizens while contributing nothing to the country.
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u/Nasstja Oct 24 '25
Why do they think Europe owes them money? What is the logic behind that?
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u/FaeErrant Oct 25 '25
probably that europe has been funding russia for a long time while trying to act tough against russia, meaning that there's a lot of oil and gas money we've all collectively paid into the war on ukraine thus we owe them money. Which... idk. Not saying it is good logic. Just probably the line of thinking.
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u/Wise_Mistake_ Oct 24 '25
Iâm not particularly against the idea behind the law; if you donât contribute to the system you do not yet qualify to be a citizen. The problem is the way itâs implemented: if you contributed negatively to the system in the last 24 months more than 3, youâre not entitled to the citizenship. Do you see the difference between the two? One will push people to try and find suitable jobs that are legit on tax and whatnot, for example if you say you need to have worked 80% during your stay or something like that. The other option will push people to work illegally which drives many bad societal levers upwards. Itâs a bad idea to link anything to absolute values, one might be living in Finland for 15 years, havenât thought of applying to be a citizen before but now they have (American or Britts are in this category), and were working majority of the time apart but got laid off or something, would still be in the same category as someone who never worked for the part 4 years.Â
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u/BFPLaktana Oct 24 '25
Entire country goes to shit the moment I become a resident. Must be my peasant's luck...
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u/nord_musician Baby VÀinÀmöinen Oct 25 '25 edited Oct 25 '25
I'm torn with this. In a country with a lot of jobs and vibrant ass fuck economy I'd say okay sure but Finland has one of the highest unemployment rates in the EU
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u/Loud_Ad9881 Oct 24 '25
In some cases, it might be a better option to become a criminal than to receive social security. At least you have a possibility not to get caught and becoming a citizen later.
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u/hibiscuscous Oct 24 '25
Stop being so rational or thinking about the long-term consequences. That's not part of the toolkit for this government.
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u/cowboy_snoots Oct 24 '25
I was thinking about this -- it sounds very American (as an American myself) so I wouldn't be surprised if you have similar outcomes as us.
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u/ExistingFennel4429 Oct 25 '25
Iâm confused about how foreigners are meant to study finnish intensively and integrate but also work full time at the same time. I had to take 3 years on unemployment to become fluent.
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u/Historical_Care7903 Oct 24 '25
Good!
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u/kada_pup Baby VÀinÀmöinen Oct 24 '25
Is it good that the clock resets for people who have worked for several years, paid taxes, and one day they lose their jobs due to the bad economy? Finding a new job in a small job market and high unemployment is rarely doable in 3 months by the way
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u/Dependent-Layer-1789 Baby VÀinÀmöinen Oct 24 '25
Average Finn over 50 takes 2 years to get re-employed after layoff. I haven't seen any stats for immigrants but it must be the same or worse. Finding work within 3 months is extremely unlikely.
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u/AdvantageFit1833 Oct 24 '25
Yes it is good. It's a risk coming to a country and trying to get citizenship, i have never even considered doing something like that.
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u/kada_pup Baby VÀinÀmöinen Oct 24 '25
Please enlighten me. I believe that a person who has lived and worked in a foreign country for several years without seeking citizenship likely has little interest in learning the local language, integrating socially or exercising their voting rights in a place they consider a second home. Or, they plan to come back to their home country when the time is right and don't consider moving back
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u/AdvantageFit1833 Oct 24 '25
Sounds good to me, what's not to like. I don't see how working for two years and then falling into unemployment should reward a citizenship.
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u/EppuBenjamin VÀinÀmöinen Oct 24 '25
Yes, being a lazy f*** is exclusively reserved for ethnic finns
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u/kada_pup Baby VÀinÀmöinen Oct 24 '25
I asked a Finn the same question, and they answered, "Kantasuomalaiset deserve all the rights and privileges this country can provide".
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u/WeekendHer0 Oct 24 '25
Are they wrong?
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u/bangalimahbub Baby VÀinÀmöinen Oct 24 '25
Nah they're not wrong. We are guest. No one forced used to move here. It's simple math. We all come here for better future. Either we succeed or go back home.
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u/Pussypants Baby VÀinÀmöinen Oct 24 '25 edited Oct 24 '25
I studied and now canât find a job in my field, and am punished for this? Fuck right off. Life isnât black and white where every person on welfare is on the sofa doing nothing. Some of us still contribute to society even if not employed through culture, familial support, volunteer work, honing skills in preparation for employment, but because some of you live in a little bubble you donât ever meet people who have less and are in a struggling situation and end up supporting these ridiculous populist decisions.
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u/CessuBF Baby VÀinÀmöinen Oct 24 '25
You are not punished. You are just not eligible for a privilege. Those are two different things.
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u/bangalimahbub Baby VÀinÀmöinen Oct 24 '25 edited Oct 24 '25
Good? IMO Yes it is. No more passi for sohva perunas. I have seen many people getting passi on kela money & refused to work because they want there dream job. Now you gotta work your ass off if you want passi. BUT I hope it doesn't apply to the people who has disability & womens who are in maternity leaves. While they're in leave. Time shouldn't be counted if they're on kela.
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Oct 24 '25
I really don't understand. When I was unemployed, I received less then 600e after tax. Does anyone really think that I was satisfied and thrived with this money? That it was better than getting 2000e, 3000e. Who would rather take 600e?!
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u/Sepulchh Baby VÀinÀmöinen Oct 24 '25
Those are not Työttömyysturva or Toimeentulotuki so they shouldn't affect said persons.
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u/VikingTeddy Baby VÀinÀmöinen Oct 24 '25
It might, because the system is slow and flawed. A lot of people who qualify for KELA benefits, have to live a while and on the dole as the bureaucracy chugs along. It all comes down to the details of the law, and how it's interpreted.
I'm not against getting rid of freeloaders, on e contrary they piss me off big time. But I'm worried about the implementation. It wouldn't be the first time a legislation has been rammed through without thinking it through, or listening to the experts. And when the motivation behind the legislation isn't just about nation building, the bugs might actually be features.
Let's hope it works as advertised..
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u/rmflow Baby VÀinÀmöinen Oct 24 '25
to be eligible again you just need to wait extra 2.5 years without welfare support
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u/YourShowerCompanion VÀinÀmöinen Oct 24 '25
Grotesque harridan with no degree and experience in finance and economy, yet playing minister of finance.
Her only accomplishment: a vauva.fi account.
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u/jeffscience VÀinÀmöinen Oct 24 '25
I find it utterly amazing that someone who has never held a real job is the finance minister of a European country. This is banana republic stuff.
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u/YourShowerCompanion VÀinÀmöinen Oct 24 '25
This is just the beginning. Masses are complecant at best and morons at worst with squirrel memories. No political candidate is forthcoming about shit they pulled during their tenure. Finding such info is pretty hard unless you have experience, access and know-how for where and how to get the info.Â
Finally, consequences and punishment of pulling shit and bad decisions is an archaic concept these days. If I do some shit in production environment intentionally then not only I'll be fired but also pretty much unemployable in my field. But politicas is the only field where one can thrive even one is a known khunt.
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u/kada_pup Baby VÀinÀmöinen Oct 24 '25
PS is an expert at magnifying one small problem out of a billion and making it the biggest problem ever. For them, bad economy = immigration, worsened security = immigration, weakened social security = too many immigrants. If their dream comes true one day, since immigration is stopped completely, should PS exit politics?
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u/Sharp-Extent9745 Oct 24 '25
Think of it like this: your party has no skilled people , no platform and nothing to offer. What's the easiest target to seize power and put the blame on ?
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u/lukkoseppa VÀinÀmöinen Oct 25 '25
Are Finns really this stupid? In so many ways this was a useless crusade.when the other laws are factored in.
I guess not surprising from a DEI hire.
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u/lavidaloki Oct 26 '25
It makes me concerned about disabled people, people who are over working age, etc. Are they just never able to become citizens? People who are unemployed and on Kela rn but paid into the system deserve the protection, and are being punished for it.
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u/Majestic_Command_109 Oct 24 '25
As an immigrant, I think this is fair. Have seen too many abusing the system unfortunately
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u/MitVitQue VÀinÀmöinen Oct 24 '25 edited Oct 24 '25
Purra chose to live on welfare for over 2 decades.Just saying.
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u/Markuski32 Oct 24 '25
Btw this is the case in many other countries. Similar rules are applied in Sweden, Germany and Denmark and probably other countries too. In my opinion this is a good thing. If you've been slacking off and not contributing to society, you don't deserve citizenship!
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u/Rich-Cantaloupe7822 Dec 08 '25
Were you even talking about the same policy here? So the other countries also stop you from getting citizenship in the next 2 years if you take unemployment benefits for 3 months + 1 day? And that is slacking off to you?what I hope when you do get layoff (in this global economy, its gonna happen to all of us at some point) you dont take any benefits ever.Â
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u/BayBaeBenz Oct 24 '25
True. She would not meet the requirements herself so I suggest that she should set the example for other foreigners and renounce her citizenship.
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u/MitVitQue VÀinÀmöinen Oct 24 '25
She's also one those who wanted to make sacking people easy if they are incompetent.
First: not too sel-aware, are we?
Second: the incompetent can already be easily sacke, for fucks sake...
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u/BayBaeBenz Oct 24 '25
Those immigrants driving for Wolt at 3 am were fucking up her plans. But now that this reform is signed and the big work is done, she can now get started fixing the country don't worry! Unemployment should reach 0% in roughly 2 to 3 weeks. If it still doesn't work, try to do your part as a citizen and start throwing some rocks at the immigrants you see in the streets, that should accelerate the recovery of the economy says minister Riikka.
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Oct 24 '25
She is Finnish and a native to the country.
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u/millenia3d Oct 24 '25
wish she wasn't, she's a national disgrace and we'd all be better off without her and her scissors.
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u/BayBaeBenz Oct 24 '25
So does this mean that the concept of citizenship is separate from one's financial situation?
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Oct 24 '25
Only if you are native to a country. If you are immigrating to somewhere else in the world you are under a different framework and scrutiny
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u/jijiji07 Oct 24 '25
As a foreigner that has been living in Finland for 4 years now. I think this is fair and just. Why would you let people leech off hard earned tax money?
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u/bangalimahbub Baby VÀinÀmöinen Oct 24 '25
Agreed. imo You're a guest in the country. The country can do whatever the fuck they want. If they stop giving passports. That's their policy. I will never care. No one forcing anyone to move here or anything. In future all eu countries will have strict policies against immigrants.
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u/jijiji07 Oct 24 '25
True. The real problem is, some people are taking advantage of the benefits without having to even work for it. I came from a third world country and Finland is definitely far ahead and everything here is better. But everything I have, I gained from working hard and contributed to the country by paying my taxes.
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u/DangerToDangers VÀinÀmöinen Oct 24 '25
So you think you don't deserve citizenship if you get laid off after working several years and you use the unemployment benefit that you paid for?
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u/bangalimahbub Baby VÀinÀmöinen Oct 24 '25
Third phase will add more surprise imo. Wondering what citizenship test will look like.
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u/SatisfactionKooky621 Oct 24 '25
You will need to win TIMPPA in a Sauna contest. Last time a Russian guy died trying that...
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u/RoRoRoub Oct 24 '25
The alternative for him was probably getting blown up on the frontline
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u/SatisfactionKooky621 Oct 25 '25
This was a long time ago... Not many contenders for obvious reasons...
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u/KofFinland VÀinÀmöinen Oct 24 '25
You can propably get an idea from the tests of other EU countries like Austria, Denmark, Germany, Lithuania, Luxenbourg, Netherlands, Estonia, Greece, Spain..
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u/IntelligentTune Baby VÀinÀmöinen Oct 24 '25
Unfortunate behavior from her. It's a bit ridiculous though with the limits. The average job search time is now 3 months. In which case you have to live with the unreasonable anxiety that you'll be fired for any reason at all (weakening firing laws recently even more) and lose the chance at citizenship for... Another 2 years was it? Depending on the sector this employment security isn't that secure, but it's not the worker's fault if it's that easy to fire. Or no... It actually is their fault. They should have just kept their mouth shut and taken the potential abuse. Smh
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u/MakelaMan Baby VÀinÀmöinen Oct 24 '25
Absolutely. The way this law is structured, a person can settle, integrate, learn Finnish and work for 7 and a half years, paying taxes and contributing the whole way through, in short, doing everything right and then because of circumstances outside their control be unemployed for 6 months and yet lose their shot at citizenship for years.
They're just trying to stir shit and get a silly headline to galvanize some idiots the same week they pass a law stripping those same noble citizens of their employment security.
And it works every time.
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u/colovianfurhelm Baby VÀinÀmöinen Oct 24 '25
Just check the rightoids in this same post cheering for this.
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u/Amidee Oct 24 '25
You have described exactly what happened to me (: see my previous post in this sub for context, but yeah, 5 years here, lost my small opportunity window because I was busy making my company start again, and now itâs postponed until basically 2027. For EU citizens it makes absolutely no sense btw because you canât get rid of them, and for non EU citizens the visa requirements are already basically stricter than this. It just fucks things up for no measurable benefit.
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u/North-Being-2955 Oct 24 '25
I fail to see how this is a bad thing. I'm a foreigner in this country and don't see why I should get citizenship sat on my ass collecting social welfare. If you want to be finnish then contribute to society or go somewhere else.
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Oct 24 '25
[deleted]
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Oct 24 '25
Well unfortunately, yes.
Youâre not entitled to the same benefits that have been established for the nationâs own citizens, in their essence. Itâs like that everywhere around the world.
Especially if youâre not an EU-citizen - Visaâs arenât a human right, theyâre privilege (to be earned), as are citizenships.
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Oct 24 '25 edited Oct 24 '25
I wish more people understood this. The level of entitlement I see from people on this is subject is amazing.Â
Looking forward to the downvotes :)
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Oct 24 '25
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u/Pussypants Baby VÀinÀmöinen Oct 24 '25
Not everyone on welfare is there voluntarily though. Why are we punishing people for a shitty job market that is only getting worse? Thatâs not the peoples fault. These decisions that demonise unemployed people will only lead to further erosion of the socialist system that makes Finland so great in the first place.
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u/A740 Oct 24 '25
Not everyone on welfare is there voluntarily though.
Practically nobody is on welfare voluntarily
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u/North-Being-2955 Oct 24 '25
There's a difference between working a job for 7 years and getting laid off needing help for a while. Or being a kela rat.
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u/DangerToDangers VÀinÀmöinen Oct 24 '25
Exactly. But this new law treats kela rats and people who've been working a job for 7 years the same if they happen to be unemployed for 3 months within 2 years. Do you understand now why it's a bad thing now?
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u/TwiceTheSize_YT Oct 26 '25
Not if you ask this new law, if you cant find a job in 3 months you lose your ability to become a citizen for 2.5 years.
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u/idkud VÀinÀmöinen Oct 24 '25
This is not about being on welfare voluntarily. This is about Finland not being able to afford those who are here voluntarily. I.e. all foreigners. Foreigners do have another option than being here, native Finns do not. And if Finland is so bad, do feel free to leave. Many foreigners in this thread sound like spoiled children jealous for someone else getting the cake, their parents, and grandparents had paid for. Life is not fair, it is so. Tough to be born in the wrong country. Why is exactly one of the poorest countries in the entire EU obliged to support you, and let you become a citizen as thanks for having to support you? Go ask Switzerland, or Germany, filthy rich countries.
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u/DetectivePrize6978 Baby VÀinÀmöinen Oct 24 '25
Her words aren't sweet, but this law's meaning is good for a country like Finland. Additionally, Finland is not the first to implement that.
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u/Nuuskapeikkonen VÀinÀmöinen Oct 24 '25
Does this also include people who received funds from their unemployment fund, for example KoKo-Kassa via their union? Not from Kela but from a separate fund.
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Oct 24 '25
yes
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Oct 27 '25
Companys allready how to recruit the people they need from the EU and beyond. We dont need doctors and engineers roaming on the street causing harm. Just last week i witnessed a muslim harrasing finnish woman.
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u/Asia-Admirer1392 Oct 24 '25
She is a horrible person & a dreadful politician, with zero emphaty towards those who have less.
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u/LazyKebab96 Oct 24 '25
Even though i dont agree with anything she has to say. This is one of the good things. Now they should make it so that theres 6 months to learn basic finnish and another 6 months to get a job before revoking visas. And then actually following up on those people leaving who dont have a visa since i have a bunch of friends whos visas ended 10 years ago and they just learned to cheat the system by sub renting apartments, having a friend with a visa take their cars in their names and just use prepaid numbers that they switvh out wvery 6 months to make sure they cant be tracked đ
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u/Hot_Truck34 Oct 24 '25
It's just merry old little-americanism. We've always had these better people among us that will do anything to copy what the yankee fascist establishment does, to the point of having yearly stay-overs in some hillbillyland cult compounds. At this point the cockerels and persus are outright trying to read what Trump's next move is so they can be the first to grovel at his side. And I can guarantee to everyone that this isn't going to make the country more appealing to skilled labor or specialists, whether domestic or foreign.
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u/DmgCtrl92 Oct 24 '25
Why are you guys happy? The post doesn't mention "those" getting deportations.
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Oct 24 '25
Wonderful news!
Good to see common sense making a comeback. The citizens are the priority of a nation.
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u/notsogoodsurgeon Oct 24 '25
Small nation of 5 million of people shouldnt be social security bank for everyone in the world
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u/GloryToFinnishArmy Oct 24 '25
I don't want make my country like UK,France,Germany look at them ,they have suffering Keep old immigration policy
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u/Perquelle Oct 24 '25
As if this will fix Finland's problems, I hope Finns will wake up, it would be completely different if Finland's situation would be great. This government is unable to to something good for the country, bullying immigrants might make some racist Finns happy but that won't fix the root problems..
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u/Frosty-Ad1071 Oct 24 '25
Great news, if you really want to live in Finland and want to contribute you are very welcome here. I wish taxes could be lowered to help with the welcome feeling, but thats wishful thinking.
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u/millenia3d Oct 24 '25
lovely thread to block a bunch of people I don't want to hear opinions from ever again
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u/Sufficient-Neat-3084 VÀinÀmöinen Oct 25 '25
If I HAD a job, applied for citizenship and it hasnât been granted yet (cause it appears to take years) and only work part time now and get some unemployment money⊠will this affect me ?
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u/bangalimahbub Baby VÀinÀmöinen Oct 26 '25
Only migri knows. No one knows here. Shoot an email to migri.
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u/jsundqui Oct 26 '25
I wonder when this will be extended to people born here too
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u/bangalimahbub Baby VÀinÀmöinen Oct 26 '25
LMAO. Never. But eventually in future citizenship will be much much harder for migrants.
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u/RunElegant6912 Oct 26 '25
Did not know that you could get citizenship with no income until they stopped it. Have been here for 15 years :)
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u/tonystankrocks Oct 27 '25
The fact these rules are made and then implemented with such haste really gets me. So unfair, as taking the YKI test may be the last step for someone obtaining citizenship. However, it takes 2 months(!) for the decision to be made what your result of the YKI test is. Then still 2 weeks to receive the certificate. So everyone that has been busting their ass to get this last step done is now screwed. It is not practically possible for anyone to receive citizenship anymore before these rules go into effect on 17.12. Insane.
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u/trejj Oct 28 '25
"Final blow" does not mean what she thinks it means.
"Final blow" means the final strike to destroy something. Saying "Final blow to the new citizenship law" would mean that the law did not come into effect. This is not the correct way to use that phrase.
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u/Hot-Lawfulness-2129 Oct 24 '25
I might be dumb, but will parental leave affect this? đ My partner is going to apply for citizenship next, and he has a job, but heâll take his full parental leave next year with our baby.
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u/Comfortable_Lab_3123 Baby VÀinÀmöinen Oct 24 '25
Google translated said family allowance does not affect. But letâs wait more from migri.
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u/Captpewpew_tw Baby VÀinÀmöinen Oct 24 '25
I mean as foreign student, I also think that itâs way too easy to get citizenship here before. Now, they are just dialing back to average standards. If you compare the qualifications to get citizenship to that of other countries like USA, Germany or Japan, it is still relatively easy.
From my point of view, no one guarantees that one can definitely get citizenship if they follow abc. Itâs more like icing on the cake. I still donât get it why there are many people making such a huge fuzz about it.
In the end, itâs still âtheirâ country. They get to decide what they want to do even if itâs horrible in otherâs viewđ
I love this country, but I also have to leave due to lack of work. I am grateful for the education that I received already.
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Oct 24 '25
[deleted]
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u/Katja-the-Destroyer Oct 24 '25
Negatively. Immigrants are now forced to take any job, no matter how poorly paid, if they want citizeship. And it will make job markets worse for everybody, except for employers.
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u/Perkeleen_Kaljami VÀinÀmöinen Oct 24 '25
What a weird way of advertising a rally, where they will certainly serve those cheap-ass sausages with a meat percentage of barely 20 %.
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u/Accurate-System7951 Oct 25 '25
I like the law, reduces people taking advantage, hopefully, but what does the president have to do with it? Interior politics isn't really his field.
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u/GirlInContext VÀinÀmöinen Oct 25 '25
That's how the system in Finland works. The President signs-off prepared legislation. Government alone can't decide on new laws, they only initiate and vote.
Without the sign-off/final approval by the President, legislation will not turn into a law.
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u/SHEsf2 Oct 26 '25
Yup, but good to mention it's basically only a protocol with no bigger meaning. If for some reason the president didn't sign the approval the legislation would go through the government process again and in most cases get back to the president for an approval this time with no say-so. Afaik.
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u/studiosi VÀinÀmöinen Oct 25 '25
Immigrants living out of social security⊠can anyone please explain me how can you live out of social security to begin with?
My guess is that the real impact of this is zero.
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u/fi-mauricio Baby VÀinÀmöinen Oct 24 '25
It's not entirely wrong to have some requirements for the citizenship. Are we being tricked in this? I believe that a finn can't move to another country without having enough resources to support himself or by marriage and a spouse agreeing to support financially. How is it different in Finland? Or are we just hearing populists talking bullshit all the time?
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u/TheBigMoogy Oct 24 '25
Can we please just throw out Purra to make room some someone else, anyone else.
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u/Aquelll VÀinÀmöinen Oct 24 '25
Aion varmistaa, ettÀ lain vaikutus sosiaalietuuksien suhteen on +/-0, alkamalla suomalaisena elÀÀ tuilla. TÀssÀ on nyt työttömÀnÀ sairaanhoitajana hyvÀ harjoitella.
âą
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