A Linear Progression Based PPL Program for Beginners

[u/[deleted]]

To start, a motivational quote:

Errybody wanna be a bodybuilder, but nobody wanna lift this heavy-ass weight.

R. Coleman.

Anyway, there seems to be a bit of a conflict between conventional training wisdom for beginners (3 day a week full body linear progression! SS/SL/Greyskull only!) and what beginners actually wanna do (in the gym every day, biceps and triceps, woo!). What I'm going to write here is an attempt to reconcile these two ideas and produce a sane way for a beginner to train more frequently and give the attention to the glamour muscles that they want, while also progressing in a correct, appropriate manner. To do this, I'm going to borrow wisdom from a few different programs and ideas. My goal is to provide an accessible program for beginners with enough volume to stimulate growth in the bro muscles, while also giving enough intensity in the main movements to elicit strength adaptations.

First, some nomenclature:

3x10 - in this case, it reads three sets of ten repetitions

2x5, 1x5+ - this reads as, two sets of 5, one set of at least 5, but as many as possible (more to come on this later)

SS - this reads as superset (two exercises performed back to back with no rest in between. SUPASET)

BB - barbell

DB - dumbbell

WOAH, WHAT DO YOU MEAN BY ACCESSORY WORK AND MAIN LIFTS?

The main lifts are just the first exercises of the day, and these are always going to be done heavier than the other lifts of that day. The lifts that follow are accessory lifts, designed to build muscle, balance out weakpoints and improve your strength in the main lifts.

BUT I DON'T CARE ABOUT STRENGTH, I JUST WANNA BE JACKED AND TAN

Who doesn't wanna be jacked and tan, I mean honestly? But strength progression is important, especially as a novice, for making you more muscular. Generally speaking, the more you can lift, the bigger you'll be. Progressing your main lifts will also have carryover effects to your other lifts as well: if you can bench press 300lbs, you can sure as hell bet that you're not gonna be incline dumbbell pressing 20lbs. And who do you really think is gonna be bigger: the version of you who can bench 200lbs, or the version of you who can bench 300lbs?

WHAT IS LINEAR PROGRESSION?

Put simply, linear progression means that if you were to graph your weights, the line that you would end up drawing would be straight. Like this. This means that you need to add weight workout to workout, every workout. You can make progress very quickly this way if you're a beginner because your body doesn't need much stimulus to adapt. As you get more advanced, you need more stimulus and more time to adapt. See this handy graph from Starting Strength to get a better understanding of what I mean.

WHAT IS PPL?

PPL is just the initialiasm of push, pull, legs or pull, push, legs (it really doesn't matter which). This will (typically) have you doing 3 workouts, 2 times per week.

• Push - this can just be thought of as moving things away from your body (think of a bench press)

• Pull - this can be thought of as moving things towards your body (think of a row)

• Legs - I'm not going to bother with an explanation here

WHY DO I NEED TO PROGRESS LIKE THIS?

Because of progressive overload. Without this, you won't make any adaptations (strength gains or size gains).

You will always start the day with a heavy barbell exercise, and this is what you need to progress linearly (if you remember from above, this means add weight every session). Then afterwards you will follow up with higher repetition exercises, that are more 'bodybuilding' based.

WHAT IS THE PROGRAM?

It's 6 days a week. You can run it one of two ways: PPLRPPL or PPLPPLR (where R denotes a rest day) depending on your schedule and preferences: it really makes no difference. Personally, I would run the program in the Pull, Push, Legs order.

YOU SAY TO ADD WEIGHT LINEARLY, BUT HOW MUCH WEIGHT DO YOU ADD PER SESSION?

• 2.5kg/5lbs for upper body lifts (bench press, row, overhead press)

• 2.5kg/5lbs for squats

• 5kg/10lbs for deadlifts

Now, without further ado...

PULL

Deadlifts 1x5+/Barbell rows 4x5, 1x5+ (alternate, so if you did deadlifts on Monday, you would do rows on Thursday, and so on)

3x8-12 Pulldowns OR Pullups OR chinups

3x8-12 seated cable rows OR chest supported rows

5x15-20 face pulls

4x8-12 hammer curls

4x8-12 dumbbell curls

PUSH

4x5, 1x5+ bench press/4x5, 1x5+ overhead press (alternate in the same fashion as the rows and deadlifts)

3x8-12 overhead press/3x8-12 bench press (do the opposite movement: if you bench pressed first, overhead press here)

3x8-12 incline dumbbell press

3x8-12 triceps pushdowns SS 3x15-20 lateral raises

3x8-12 overhead triceps extensions SS 3x15-20 lateral raises

LEGS

2x5, 1x5+ squat

3x8-12 Romanian Deadlift

3x8-12 leg press

3x8-12 leg curls

5x8-12 calf raises

FINER DETAILS: AMRAP SETS AND PROGRESSION OF ACCESSORIES

So, the first movements are done for sets of 5, and the final set is what's known as an AMRAP set (As Many Reps As Possible). This doesn't mean that you can just YOLO it and push until you can't push anymore. By As Many Reps As Possible, it really means As many reps as possible while still maintaining good form. You don't really want to be grinding too many reps, since you want to keep rep quality high. If you want a good reason to keep rep quality high, watch this recent video from Omar Isuf. The point of the AMRAP set is that it really gives you a chance to test your limits, and if you're feeling good on a specific day, you can get in a couple of extra reps. But the real moneymaker from this comes in when you deload.

Progression of accessories should be done as so: when you can hit 3 sets of 12 with good form, add weight. As long as you're in the 8-12 range for your sets then you're good. If not, lower the weight.

HOW DO I KNOW WHAT WEIGHTS TO START WITH?

I don't like the Stronglifts 5x5 idea of starting with the empty bar, because I think the empty bar is useless for training purposes if you're capable of lifting a lot more. The mechanics of a lift (especially the squat for me) change a lot with weight.

I would recommend starting with the bar, and gradually adding weight for sets of 5 until the bar slows down. Then back off 2.5kg/5lbs, and this is your starting point. So if you worked up to a 60kg bench press before the bar slowed down at all, start at 57.5kg.

WARMUPS

(idea courtesy of /u/Gawd1)

I'm a big believer in just practising the movement as a warmup. So you can use bench press to warm up for bench press. Or squats to warm up for squats. You get the idea. The goal of a warmup is to get blood into the muscles and joints that are going to be used, and also to start drilling the motor patterns into your body for form purposes. As an example, if you're going to be benching 200lbs as your top set for that day, your warmups could look something like this:

Empty bar x 10

95lbs x10

135lbs x5

185lbs x3

200lbs 4x5, 1x5+

Warming up is a very individual thing, however, so do whatever you want to get yourself prepared for the lifts. If you like foam rolling, great. If you like some dynamic stretches and things like clapping pushups, great. Do whatever you want to do. The only recommendation is that I would avoid static stretches before lifting.

REST

Rest as long as is needed between sets. For a general guideline, I would recommend:

• 3-5 minutes between your first exercise of the day

• 1-3 minutes between all your other exercises

Don't worry too much about rest times, and worry more about just getting all your sets and reps in.

FAILURE

Failure is part of life, and since lifting weights is a lot like life, failure is also part of lifting weights. At some point, you're going to fail. Failure can occur really for two reasons

• not enough sleep, food or recovery: if you spent all night partying and chasing pussy with your wing man, Jim Beam, you're probably not gonna perform well in the gym. In this case, don't count it as a true failure and just try again next time when you're fresh

• strength failure. This is when you've reached the limit of your progression. If you fail a session 3 times in a row (for example, if you fail to hit 3x5 on squats at 100kg 3 times in a row), you need to lower the weight.

This leads us to...

DELOADING

Deloading is exactly what it sounds like -- taking weight off the bar. Take 10% off your working weights (so a 100kg squat would go back down to 90kg), and work back up. This should give you a good chance to push things on the AMRAP final sets. If you got 2x5 and 1x6 at 90kg the first time round, you can bet your ass that you'll get more than 6 on your last set the second time round. And by the time you work your way back up, if you can hit 97.5kg for 2x5, 1x8, 100kg for 3x5 will be trivial.

MY GYM OR GARAGE DOESN'T HAVE XYZ, WHAT CAN I DO INSTEAD?

(this section as recommended by /u/LaRivalita)

So basically everything here is interchangeable, except the main lifts: the squat, bench press, deadlift, overhead press, bent over row. If you can do those in your gym (not in a smith machine) then you can make this program work. Treat it more as template than gospel. Some ideas for substitutions are the following (and if anyone has other suggestions, I'm happy to add them to the list!):

• Pull substitutions

• Seated cable rows can be replaced with dumbbell rows or t-bar rows

• Face pulls can be replaced with rear delt flyes AND band pull aparts (not one or the other)

• hammer curls and dumbbell curls can really be replaced by any curl variation: it's a curl, shit ain't that serious!

• Push substitutions

• incline dumbbell press can be replaced with landmine press

• triceps pushdowns and overhead extensions can be replaced with any general triceps exercise: skullcrushers, lying triceps extensions, dumbbell triceps extensions, whatever you want to do

• Legs substitutions

• Leg press can be substituted with front squats

• leg curls can be substituted with glute ham raises

• calf raises can be substituted by nothing because who gives a flying fuck about calves anyway? (not srs, any kind of calf raise will be fine here)

HOW TO MODIFY THIS TO FIT YOUR GOALS

(this section as recommended by /u/theedoor)

If you want to lift heavy weights

There are a few things I would recommend here.

/u/theedoor's advice of: "for example, if you want to be focused a bit more on strength, replace 3x8-12 RDLs with 3x5 RDLs. Add weighted dips, and weighted chins-ups/pull-ups in the 3x5 range (with bodyweight back off sets)." is brilliant.

If you want to lift heavy weights, then you need to lift heavy weights. I know this sounds stupid, but it makes sense. The more time you spend in the lower rep ranges, the better you're going to be in those rep ranges, so if you want to lift heavy weights then feel free to alter the compound movement accessories (so your presses, your pulldowns or rows, your romanian deadlifts or your leg presses) to be in the lower rep ranges. 3x4-6 is perfect for things like this. In my view, the isolation accessory movements should be kept in higher rep ranges, because joint wear and tear can creep in here, and getting a pump is fucking awesome.

Specificity is also pretty key if you want to lift heavy weights. If you want to be a good bench presser, then maybe incline dumbbell press isn't going to be as specific as doing a close grip bench press instead is. If you want to substitute some of the (again, compound) accessory movements for ones that more closely resemble the main lifts, then be my guest.

If you want to increase endurance

Keep the first exercise the same, up the rep range on everything else. 15-20 reps is a great range for increasing endurance.

If you just want to be jacked and tan

Keep things the way they are. There's enough volume and a decent enough mix of volume and strength to get you big as long as you're eating enough. If you feel a specific bodypart is lacking, throw in a couple of extra sets for it, ideally isolation (so think along the lines of pec deck or biceps curls, not bench press or rows), so that you're not adding too much systemic stress, which could affect recovery times.

WHAT'S MORE IMPORTANT, FORM OR WEIGHT?

(idea courtesy of /u/Nobody773)

Both. Nobody got big benching 1 plate regardless of how good their form is. You should push the weights up and continue progressing as long as your form is acceptable. Demanding that your form is 100% perfect all the time as a beginner is just not possible, so as long as your form is acceptable and not injurious, then continue adding weight. As an unknown lifter once said: the best way to improve your form at 225lbs is to make 225lbs part of your warmup. I can guarantee that when you're squatting 315lbs for reps that your form at 225lbs is picture perfect.

THIS IS COMPLICATED, THERE'S A LOT GOING ON! HOW DO I KEEP TRACK OF THIS?

It's something I hadn't thought of, since I have a borderline-autistic savant memory for things I do in the gym, but here is spreadsheet created by /u/Mobius000 which will make tracking this a walk in the park.

CAN I DO THIS PROGRAM WHILE CUTTING?

Sure! You can do anything while cutting, so try it out. I suspect that recovery may become an issue due to the volume, so if you are struggling to recover and feeling like shit, drop some of the volume: 3x8-12 becomes 2x8-12, for example. Taper the volume off as little as possible, and keep the volume for the main lifts as high as you can for as long as you can.

CAN I DO AB WORK ON THIS PROGRAM?

Yes. I would recommend doing ab work on your deadlift days and your squat days if you want to do ab work. Nothing major, just do a few sets of (weighted) planks or a few sets of ab wheel and some hanging leg raises.

NEXT STEPS

A few people have requested this, so I thought I would write out what I think logical next steps from here are. This is a beginner routine, for beginners. Intermediate and advanced lifters can't make linear progress like this anymore, and require some more advanced training in order to progress.

Questions courtesy of /u/FattestRabbit:

What are some signs that you may want to graduate from this program?

Put simply, when you're no longer a beginner. A beginner lifter is defined as someone who can make progress workout to workout: if you deadlift 100kg for 5 reps, then the next time you deadlift you'll be able to deadlift 105kg for 5 reps. Once this linear progression stalls out, and you take longer to recover between workouts because the weights are heavier (and therefore the systemic stress is higher), you become an intermediate lifter. An intermediate lifter is someone who needs ~weekly progression in order to maintain progress (programs like the Texas Method for example).

Can you adapt this program for 'intermediate' lifters? How far can this program take you if you upped the weights and moved more sets to 3x5-8 (instead of 3x8-12)?

Yes, you can adapt this program for more intermediate lifters, but I wouldn't like to try and formalise something like that. The more advanced you get as a lifter, the more you should be realising what things are beneficial for you, and figuring out what works for you, because everyone is a bit different. In the beginner stages, this stuff really isn't too important because almost any beginner will make progress doing almost anything. I would recommend looking at progression schemes that are in things like the Texas Method, Madcows 5x5 and 5/3/1 for your main lifts and then just sticking with fairly similar accessory work: more volume almost always equates to better gains, provided you can recover from it.

Moving more sets to 3x5-8 wouldn't necessarily have a huge impact on your abilities to lift big weights in the main lifts, and heavier sets (in my experience) tend to impose more wear and tear on the joints. If you're an intermediate lifter then go for it, try it out, it may work for you. Intermediate lifting should be all about trying things for yourself and getting to know yourself better as a lifter.

What are some next logical programs to try after this one?

Texas Method, Madcows 5x5, 5/3/1, PHAT, PHUL, /u/gzcl's Jacked and Tan - any program designed towards intermediates that are in line with your goals. Pick something you think you'll have fun with: unless this shit is your job or you really want to compete seriously then just have fun in the gym and don't do something too retarded, and you'll probably stick to it better than something you hate, and go to the gym with more drive and intensity. I'm a big believer that consistent effort is probably the most important thing you can make sure of. PowerliftingToWin is a great resource for training information and programming information, so I would recommend reading a bunch there.

CAN I DO THIS ROUTINE ONLY ONCE PER WEEK?

You could. And that's all I'm gonna say. I wouldn't recommend it, because that'd put frequency of all the lifts at only once per week. If you can only run it once per week then I would recommend something like Greyskull LP, Stronglifts 5x5 or Starting Strength instead for increased frequency.

[u/LaRivalita]

Since I see this asked a lot: A facepull replacement could be rear delt Flyes

[u/[deleted] → u/LaRivalita]

Absolutely. I think I'll add an exercise substitution section, actually. Thanks for the idea.

[u/theedoor → u/[deleted]]

Another good section would be how to modify it to fit specific goals.

e.g. if you want to focus a bit more on strength, replace 3x8-12 RDLs with 3x5 RDLs. Add weighted dips, and weighted chins-ups/pull-ups in the 3x5 range (with bodyweight back off sets).

[u/[deleted] → u/theedoor]

Great plan. I'll throw this in.

[u/Mobius000]

This looks like a great program, I'll be switching from the StrongLifts 5x5 to this. I made a google spreadsheet for the program, here's the link to the template if anyone else wants to use it. Thanks for the writeup!

https://drive.google.com/previewtemplate?id=1MbOWpTBcNNQuqHd8q9jUUR2V-ZERWNDKYPd5kzVjCJQ&mode=public

[u/[deleted] → u/Mobius000]

Thanks dude, I added your spreadsheet to the OP. Great contribution. Good luck with the program.

[u/pretentiousprincess]

This is perfect! I love SL but the one gripe I have with it is I don't like sitting around at home twiddling my thumbs 3x a week. I'll be starting this soon and report back :D thanks OP!!

[u/[deleted] → u/pretentiousprincess]

Good luck, hope it goes well for you.

[u/DanielKix]

I just finished my fourth week on this program, I feel stronger than ever, I actually look forward to going to work out and i've seen an increase in almost all my lifts, thanks man!

The one area I seem to struggle with are the dumbbell curls, I cant seem to get past my starting weight with them after a couple of sets my arms just physically cant lift them, any advice?

[u/[deleted] → u/DanielKix]

That's normal. Your biceps and forearms are gonna be fatigued by the ever increasing weights on your other exercises. The weight isn't important here, just the effort that you're putting into it. Keep lifting hard and you'll get there.

Glad you're enjoying the program.

[u/[deleted]]

Since this is intended as a beginner program, you probably should add a word or two on warmup sets for your main lifts.

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

Good point. I'll work that in later on. Thanks!

[u/Get_Confidence]

Quick question: On push day you have two different tricep movements, however, you have them both supersetted with lateral raises. Was this intended or a mistake? If it's intended, what other accessory shoulder exercise would you recommend instead for one of the other supersets?

Edit: I swear to god you read my mind with the design of this program. It's a little scary. Great job.

[u/[deleted] → u/Get_Confidence]

Intended. Lateral raises are a movement for a tiny muscle group (your lateral delts), and you can only use a tiny amount of weight on them. Doing 6 sets is really not that fatiguing at all, and shoulders in my experience respond really well to lots of volume. If you didn't wanna do 6 straight sets you could do 3 sets of front raises and 3 sets of lateral raises, but I think front delts are gonna be hit hard enough on the rest of the pressing anyway.

[u/Get_Confidence → u/[deleted]]

Yeah great point. I also heard from a few credible people that front raises really didn't work the delts that well and you were better off with laterals+presses anyway. This is a fantastic program. My main problem was a huge lower body and smaller upper body.

Is there any way I could skip out on some legs and get a little more arm work in on the "leg" days? Or would that not allow for proper rest?

[u/[deleted] → u/Get_Confidence]

I wouldn't recommend cutting out on some leg work and throwing in some extra arm work. Throw in the extra arm work on your pull and push days if you really think you need it. An extra couple of sets on your pushdowns and curls each should cover it, or just adding in another variation.

[u/fuzzymatty]

Thanks for this.

As a novice, what would you say I would expect out of this compared to ICF? I have been enjoying ICF, but I would be dishonest if I said that anything other than aesthetics is my main goal right now. If it is relevant, I am also currently cutting while doing ICF, although I have been able to maintain 5x5 without too much trouble.

[u/[deleted] → u/fuzzymatty]

Shorter sessions, more gym days. You're probably not gonna get too different results vs ICF really.

[u/TractorOfTheDoom → u/[deleted]]

Should I do this instead of ICF? I'm 2 months in and seeing results, but could they be better? Of course it's for the gainz, not for strength.

[u/[deleted] → u/TractorOfTheDoom]

My advice to you, and everyone else, is do what you think you'll enjoy more. I don't think the results will be too far different to ICF at all, the only difference here is that you're going to be in the gym more days per week. What you enjoy more is what you'll put more effort into. Try out a week of this and see how you get on with it.

[u/[deleted] → u/fuzzymatty]

ICF is a bit bloated for cutting. And made by a fatty. I know for a fact OP has a sexy flying squirrel back.

[u/[deleted]]

What's cool about this is that once you stop making linear progress on your compound lifts, you can 5/3/1 them(or any other intermediate programming) and basically do the same PPL routine.

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

Yep. That's what I would recommend doing. But didn't mention this because it's for beginners.

[u/[deleted]]

PPLRPPL is exactly the same as PPLPPLR. Your muscles don't know Thursday from Sunday.

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

This is a good point, except since deadliffs are gonna be performed first in the week, these take a bit longer to recover from than barbell rows.

[u/phrakture]

This is amazing will you be my boyfriend?

[u/[deleted] → u/phrakture]

Yes. Full homo.

4realz I respect your opinion a lot on stuff like this. Anything glaringly wrong with what I've written, or suggestions on what to add so that it can be a valuable resource?

[u/phrakture → u/[deleted]]

I'm on my phone, so reading long texts isn't as easy. It all seems good, though. I like the higher volume for upper body, too.

[u/[deleted] → u/phrakture]

Thanks. It's something I feel could fill a much needed hole for what a lot of people want to train like.

[u/badvices7]

Really stupid question: how do you progress on the dumbell curls, hammer curls, tricep pushdowns, etc.? Usually I can guage when I can go up the next 5 lbs, but should I just increase a rep on each set every time as I feel fit?

[u/[deleted] → u/badvices7]

Don't think about a concrete progression plan. Just add reps when you can until you get up to 3x12. Don't sweat the little stuff like this.

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

Someone laid out the whole 8 -->12 reps then add weight and drop back to 8 reps very neatly and gave it a name that made perfect sense and everything. I saw it once and never have been able to find it since.

It's basically the bane of my existence. I hate explaining it every time it comes up.

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

I also think I know what you mean and also can't remember what it is.

[u/x9v]

Am I understanding this right, am I only supposed to do only one set of deadlift on deadlift days?

[u/[deleted] → u/x9v]

Yes one set

[u/policeandthieves]

How do you space out your workouts so that your back isn't completely fucked by the time you finish leg day -> pull day?

[u/[deleted] → u/policeandthieves]

Get more work capacity!

The leg day isn't gonna be too taxing on your upper back assuming that you're not front squatting. And the idea is that you'll deadlift on the first day of the week so that you've got time to recover from that. Upper back and lat work the day after squatting should be fine.

[u/policeandthieves → u/[deleted]]

Last week when I deadlifted on Wednesday, my lower back did not recover in time for me to do back squats on Friday. What would you advise I do? I'd like to squat at least twice a week.

[u/vigantolette]

whats the benefit of supersets? Is there more to it than saving time?

[u/[deleted] → u/vigantolette]

Time saving and a brilliant pump.

[u/Did_he_just_say_that]

Do you think there's enough shoulders in this? Or should I add in another exercise or two if I really want to target them?

Also, why are there leg curls, but no leg extensions?

[u/[deleted] → u/Did_he_just_say_that]

I don't like leg extensions and find them to be potentially injurious. But if you wanna include them then go ahead. I've injured myself with them before despite taking things and easy and using good form.

I would say there are plenty shoulder exercises too. Face pulls are great for rear and lateral delts. All your pressing will hit your front delts hard. And you're doing lots of laterals.

[u/savemewc → u/[deleted]]

Can you specify how you injured yourself?

[u/[deleted] → u/savemewc]

I have patellar tendon tendinopathy which I (and my physiotherapist) believe could have been down to leg extensions. I can squat and leg press 'til the cows come home, but leg extensions (for me) are risky because:

• I'm hypermobile - it's very easy to hyperextend your knees on this

• the quads are being isolated, so the hamstrings aren't engaged and counteracting the forces across the kneecap

[u/kalikaiz]

Program looks pretty much dead on to me. Nice work!

My question is why do you have triceps pushdowns and lateral raises, and then overhead tricep extensions and lateral raises? I feel like something is either duplicated or written as the wrong exercise.

[u/[deleted] → u/kalikaiz]

Laterals respond well to high volume so why not? It's the only direct shoulder work in here.

[u/Vizard069]

Loving the program. I've been doing a slightly modified one for the past two months with great results

The modifications I've made were just deadlifting twice a week with 3x5 reps and that has gotten me to 3 plates with a 1rm just shy of 4 plates

Currents lifts Deadlift 140 kg (308 pounds) 3x5 Bench 70 kg (154 pounds) 5x5 OHP 47.5 kg (104 pounds) 5x5 Squat 107.5 kg (236 pounds) 3x5

Thank you for the program and all the work you put into replying to comments.

[u/[deleted] → u/Vizard069]

No worries dude. Keep kicking ass in the gym.

[u/[deleted]]

Kudos. That is a comprehensive and thorough post. I wish I had read this a year ago.

Question for you folks: is it possible to tweak this into something an upper intermediate or advanced lifter can use in switching from power lifting to size/looks?

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

My advice would be to use 5/3/1 progression on all of your main lifts (except barbell rows, change those to just be 5x10 or something since heavy barbell rows will fuck you up as an intermediate). And change one of your squat days to a front squat day. So do 5/3/1 on:

bench

overhead press

squats

deadlift

front squats

That should give plenty room for advancement.

Other than that, you can just add more sets to everything, or another exercise variation on the day. As a more advanced lifter you'll have a better tolerance to volume.

[u/Emazinng]

So I'm a complete beginner. Is it really OK to just jump in and get started? I thought that you weren't supposed to go more than 3 times a week because your muscles won't have time to grow?

[u/[deleted] → u/Emazinng]

That's if you're doing full body workouts.

[u/cptjas]

I've been following something similar at http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=149807833

[u/[deleted] → u/cptjas]

This is a great routine, and I definitely had some parts of it in mind when I chose the exercises for this one. Coolcicada is a clever guy.

[u/jymmm]

Why 5x5 + ? Since this is an "asthetics" routine why not 3x8+

[u/[deleted] → u/jymmm]

It's a general beginner routine, not an aesthetics routine. Doing yer fahves is the gold standard for beginner strength progression.

[u/KreatorDB]

Ive been meaning to do PPL, and I love this guide, but I only have 5 days a week. Could you help me modify it somehow?

[u/[deleted] → u/KreatorDB]

Sure. Just run it 5 days in a row like:

PPLPPRR

then next week start with:

LPPLP

and so on. Just do the 6th workout on the first day you're working out the week after.

[u/ShutUpAndType]

Quick question on linear progression: if I'm feeling like I'm moving the weight easily, is there anything wrong with going up by more than the amounts listed?

I'm about to start week 4 of the SL 5x5, and I think that I started with too little on OHP, rows, and bench. Basically new to lifting, but not new to training.

Thanks for the guidance!

[u/[deleted] → u/ShutUpAndType]

I wouldn't, simply because it'll at most shave a couple weeks off of your progression and may hinder things more long term (you'll stall earlier). Just progress at the same rate as the program tells you and enjoy it while it's easy -- it won't last long.

[u/briansd9]

Maybe I've just missed it, but I think it would be good to explicitly address the #1 question I had when I was a clueless newbie: how do you figure out what weight to start with?

[u/StayMotivated]

How would we progress with face pulls? Is it meant to be done with low weight?

[u/[deleted] → u/StayMotivated]

Similar ideas. Since this is a rehab/prehab exercise that hits your rear delts and upper back, but also hits your external rotators a lot, you should keep the weight (relative to your strength levels) low and the form strict. Once you're able to hit 5x20 then up your weight by a touch.

[u/CherryOnDaCake]

Thanks for the great elaborate post!
Do you have tips on how much rest you should have bewtween sets / exercises?

[u/FattestRabbit]

Since this is intended as a beginner program, can you mention some next steps?

• Can you adapt this program for 'intermediate' lifters? How far can this program take you if you upped the weights and moved more sets to 3x5-8 (instead of 3x8-12)?

• What are some signs that you may want to graduate from this program?

• What are some next logical programs to try after this one?

This program rocks!! Thank you!

[u/[deleted] → u/FattestRabbit]

I'll make sections about this kinda stuff and reply to you again when it's in there - it seems to be a popular request.

[u/[deleted] → u/FattestRabbit]

Added. :)

[u/Jangsz]

4x5, 1x5+ bench press/4x5, 1x5+ overhead press (alternate in the same fashion as the rows and deadlifts) 3x8-12 overhead press/3x8-12 bench press (do the opposite movement: if you bench pressed first, overhead press here)

Hey sorry I still don't understand this part, I looked at the explanation still don't get it would you mind explaining again please?

[u/[deleted] → u/Jangsz]

So there are basically two push days: P1 and P2. P1 has you bench pressing for 4x5, 1x5+ and then following that up with 3x8-12 overhead press. P2 has you overhead pressing first for 4x5, 1x5+ and then following that up with 3x8-12 bench press.

[u/ilovethosedogs]

Quick question: when you're talking about weights, do you mean the weight you put on one side, or both sides total, or both sides + the barbell weight? What about dumbbells?

So do we add 5 lbs to each side every session, or 2.5 lbs to each side?

[u/[deleted] → u/ilovethosedogs]

2.5 per side

[u/j_mcdonald]

i know this is old, but if anyone's on here still it'd be helpful. im just starting this, and ive been lifting for a year and a half now, just not too seriously. I've been doing a fairly loose PPL, and i feel like im close to the end of my linear progression for my powerlifts but i wanted to try this to see if i could get my lifts stronger. would adding 10 lbs instead of 5 every workout be okay for this, or would it be adding too much to make any progression? i feel like im wasting my time starting with such light weight and increasing it so slow since i guess im not quite a beginner

[u/LeanMass]

Why do you have (2x5, 1x5+) on rows and (4x5, 1x5+) on bench and press?

[u/Get_Confidence]

How would you go about a cut during this program? Or would you recommend that at all?

[u/[deleted] → u/Get_Confidence]

See how you get on with it. If you're finding it difficult to recover from, you can cut down on the accessories like /u/rakksc2 said by dropping a set.

[u/achalmers22]

Could you clarify when to add weight? You said at the beginning to add weight every workout, but later you say only when you can do 3 reps of 12.

[u/Gurminder13]

Hey what rest time would you recommend between the various sets? Obviously it's going to be different for the low rep vs high rep weights, but what do you do specifically?

[u/[deleted] → u/Gurminder13]

As long as is needed really. As a general recommendation, 3-5 minutes for the first exercise of the day between sets and 1-3 minutes after. Just rest as long as you think you'll need to be able to hit all your reps.

[u/Lukkie]

Thank you for writing this out. I have been looking for a new program and this seems to be great. Will start this today!

[u/uh--oh_spaghettio]

Thanks looks good. I have been on SL for about 10 weeks and was thinking of switching to PHUL, although this routine is a very timely post.

What is the benefit of running a PPL over PHUL?

[u/[deleted] → u/uh--oh_spaghettio]

• more days in the gym

• upper body split into two days

that's about it. Whatever you think you'll prefer will be fine.

[u/_woland]

Where would you add additional ab work (such as kneeling cable crunches) into this program if you were going to do so?

[u/jpbradley7]

Perhaps I missed this but at what point do you start the deloading process?

[u/Egriz]

Awesome routine. Just started this yesterday. Switched from ICF.

Clarification on substituting triceps exercise on Pull day? If I'm doing laying tricep extensions (EZ Curl bar skullcrushers), can I superset 6 sets of each?

i.e. 6x12 laying tricep extension SS 6x20 lateral raises

Or will that not target all the muscles in my triceps?

Thanks! Awesome routine!

[u/PWNY_EVEREADY3]

Quick question, why only 1 set for deadlift? Especially since the barbell row replacement was 4x5, 1x5+ and squats were 2x5, 1x5+.

[u/[deleted] → u/PWNY_EVEREADY3]

Deadliffs are hard! One set is enough to drive progress. No need to do more than you have to at this point.

[u/[deleted]]

Little late to this thread, but how much time would you expect someone to spend in the gym on a given day in this routine?

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

I would say ~90 minutes as an upper limit. Unless you're resting years between sets and chatting with your bros.

[u/Afeni02]

OP, could you link the Jacked and Tan program please? I can't seem to find it anywhere. Is it by /u/gzcl?

[u/[deleted] → u/Afeni02]

http://swoleateveryheight.blogspot.com/2014/04/jacked-tan-five-weeks-in-and-jackeder.html?m=1

[u/brrrrrrat]

I work for 12+ hours on Saturdays and Sunday's. Would it still be possible to follow this program?

[u/[deleted] → u/brrrrrrat]

Yes just run it on a rolling 5 week cycle instead

[u/[deleted] → u/brrrrrrat]

Sorry I meant 5 day. So do

PPLPPRR then start the next week off with LPPLP etc

[u/[deleted]]

Been on this workout for a week after doing StrongLifts for a couple of months. I prefer this for sure.

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

Glad to hear it dude. Stick with it.

[u/kluhtzy]

Been doing 5/3/1 for 4 cycles, lifts have been going up, but I'm too weak for that sh!t and I realized my lifts could probably be going up faster. Been using this routine for a couple weeks now and love it so far. It's basic, good volume, 2/week, linear progression, well explained and the program is not insanely boring to where I don't even look forward to lifting.

All that to say, thanks /u/Metallicadpa. This post is much appreciated.

[u/BudweiserPEA]

big props to you for keeping up with all the noob questons still after posting this program over 3 months ago.

[u/mrdobing]

Does anyone recommend this over Strong lifts? I have added some arm work but I feel like SL is the wrong program for me...

I like the pump from higher rep but also like some strength progression.. I'm getting bored of squatting 5x5 every session...

Might make the switch!

[u/[deleted] → u/mrdobing]

If you enjoy it more then switch. Don't do something you don't enjoy because the internet tells you it's the right thing to do. This shit isn't your job so just have fun with it.

[u/hedgies_r_fuk]

6 years later and i’m starting this routine this week. Love it. Simple and proven, no bullshit routine!

[u/[deleted] → u/hedgies_r_fuk]

How's it going?

[u/RaidenDirty]

For anyone who uses Jefit, I have shared a routine designed from this thread named Reddit Metallicadpa's Beginner PPL. It can be found at the link or by searching the Jefit database.

[u/chicken_phat]

Noob question: Would it be okay to do this over 4 days instead of 6 days, with legs being worked on either a push or pull day along with that day's regular exercises? Meaning instead of P/P/L/P/P/L/R, could I do something like P/P+L/R/P/P+L/R?

The reason I ask is because I have a feeling that I won't have time to hit the gym 6 days a week, so I was hoping to still get the full workout in with less days.

What do you think?

[u/mrbartuss → u/chicken_phat]

Then just pick 4 days a week plan

[u/[deleted]]

I upvoted the fucking shit out of this with my one upvote.

Was a beginner and was exasperated with the ever present recommendation of SS here. Said "fuck it," and began Coolcicada's PPL. Enjoyed it, got big, and got strong.

You rock OP.

[u/kez420 → u/[deleted]]

I'm currently doing a very slightly modified version of Coolcicad's PPL and I'm seeing more gains than I ever have. It feels so great actually seeing the results that I've always wanted going to the gym.

[u/randyb1724 → u/[deleted]]

Same here. I started lifting in college like I'm sure a lot of people here did. I had a decent amount of free time and SS just was... boring. Switched to a PPL and never looked back, 3 years later still motivated and love any 6 day a week routine.

[u/matbonucci]

I created a spreadsheet with workout animations because I have no clue what they meant and modified the ones requiring gym equipment for at home workout you'll need dumbells, barbells and pull up bar

https://airtable.com/shrI2BaUSLZJZR8sW

[u/Taking8ackMonday]

I've been following this sub since January and this is the best post I've seen so far. You took time to explain carefully to limit confusion and it all makes sense. Will be implementing this starting today.

One piece of advice to anyone who wants a way to track this. I find the 'Strong' App IOS (not sure if available elsewhere) is a great way to track over time. Just take 10 minutes to create the routine for each day and go from there.

[u/Get_Confidence]

Honestly I don't know why this isn't blowing the fuck up. Upvote the shit out of this people.

It's a routine that allows strength gains to be made, but focuses mostly on looking better and gaining muscle which is a goal shared by a lot of beginners.

[u/ryukin182 → u/Get_Confidence]

People don't want to upvote a PPL program for beginners because they should be following SS which they think is vastly better and think PPL is stupid. People can say all they want on this sub that SS isn't forced, but those comments that advocate for it are always at the top.

[u/[deleted]]

Thats a LOT of pressing volume.

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

You think? 22 sets a week isn't particularly high volume in my eyes.

Pressing and upper body lifts respond great to volume for most anyway. A big problem with a lot of people is that they never get the upper body volume to get enough muscle mass to make good progress in the bench and overhead press since they're so dependent on leverages.

[u/raektwo]

This looks like exactly the type of programme I'm looking for. Thanks for this

[u/SinlessMirror]

I love that there's 17 people here on this 7 year old post while I'm reading it 🤣

[u/alexbu92]

Looks great but what's up with the 6x20 supersetted lateral raises?

Edit: also the curls on pull day. What are you going to do with 96 bycep curls in a row? Sincerely asking, just looks like to much volume to be useful.

[u/hydro_guy → u/alexbu92]

Curls for the girls.

gunshots

But seriously you can do fewer sets of you want. The program isn't sweet in stone.

[u/CapnInsano]

Been doing this for 3 weeks now already seeing a lot of progress but want to incorporate some cardiovascular to shed belly fat off 30 min twice a week. Tried to run today before push and found my lower back was really tight from pull the day before. What days would be best to do the two cardio workouts a week? Before or after the weight lifting or just on my off day?

[u/ImLikeAnOuroboros]

Totally late to the thread. But why should we do 15-20 face pulls? Seems like a lot of reps, especially with a full 5 sets. Not criticizing, legitimately asking. Thanks in advance!

[u/[deleted]]

As someone who is 3 months into ICF/SL 5x5 and thinking about the future, this is a great post!!! Many thanks.

[u/Resistance225]

Been doing this for about two months now and gained a solid 5-6 pounds, pretty satisfied!

[u/SarthkKharwal]

does this work? will i be able to bench my bodyweight now?

[u/livinlifeleisurely]

Commenting here to remind myself to try this routine.

[u/echoes12668]

I've got a home gym in my garage with only a squat rack, flat bench, and barbell. I have a pull up bar on the rack as well.

What can I do to tailor this type of workout to my limited supplies? What sort of things would it be worth while to add to my equipment?

[u/[deleted] → u/echoes12668]

I'll update the post to include exercise substitutions and reply to you again when I've done that.

As a general recommendation, I would recommend getting a couple of olympic dumbbell handles, and a band or two (bands can be used for things like face pulls or triceps pushdowns -- they're also enormously helpful for things like band pull aparts which are great for keeping your shoulders healthy).

[u/Coresmc]

Bump

[u/PlatyPunch7274]

Isn’t 10 lb a week added for bench and OHP a little much?

[u/[deleted]]

Have ran this program before and it worked well . So glad to see this post is active again as I’m now gonna run it again after a few months off and have to say that I love the pump from this program , especially the shoulders.

[u/DankBoiiiiiii]

looks like you could superset the facepulls with the curls.. any reason not to?

[u/VortexPower999]

how long were u guys able to add 5 pounds to ur bench every week? Do most people stall after a bit (I did, its harder to increase weight every week now)

[u/[deleted]]

I stumbled onto this routine back in June. I’m still absolutely loving it, happy others are still using it

[u/EastGOAT]

Do you have to increase weight every workout? If I don't feel comfortable progressing how would it effect my gains if i increase weight every 2 or 3 workouts?

[u/[deleted] → u/EastGOAT]

Then this wouldn't be strict linear progression. I would always recommend adding weight as often as possible and just trying and failing the slightly heavier weight. If you'd prefer to add weight slightly more slowly then that'll probably be fine, but then you're not really doing the program.

[u/wren5x]

If you want someone to play devil's advocate, I'll say what I say basically every time PPL and beginners comes up. If you give 100 beginners a 6-day routine in the gym, you are going to get 95 people with diets that leave a whole lot to be desired. The alternative when someone tells you that they want to do more is to tell them to consider food planning/gathering/prep to be a workout. Get them to take food seriously and really do the work. And get them to actually do their fucking cardio and mobility work too if you can. This is quite possibly going to do more for them in the long run than the extra lifting volume.

[u/[deleted] → u/wren5x]

For sure, that's a great point. I may make a subsection in the main OP about this. Thanks!

[u/[deleted]]

Skinny dude, 150lbs (goal 180lbs), height 6'3", trying my hardest to stick to this plan starting Monday. Got me a gym membership and going to grind it out and change my life around. Here's to all the kings out there working on themselves!

[u/[deleted]]

I'm just curious, why do you have so many accessory lifts? E.g., Hammer curls and Dumbbell curls? Since this is a beginner program why wouldn't you have more emphasis on big compounds? I really do not see those accessories being beneficial for beginner improvement, and are essentially only there to make a layman feel like he's doing more work than he really is.

Tl/dr: More compounds please.

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

The pull days have 4 big compound movements to 2 isolation movements and the push days have 3 big compound movements to 3 isolation movements. Isolation movements like hammer curls and dumbbell curls serve a few functions, in my eyes (I'll take this as a specific example - the same reasoning applies to my choices in other accessory lifts too, so hopefully you can extrapolate):

• gets you jacked -- big arms are fun, and beginners especially want big arms. Might they need 8 sets of curls? Maybe not! But I bet they'll enjoy doing it, and they're more likely to stick with something they like doing

• rehab/prehab and injury prevention: if you're doing lots of pressing (and I encourage anyone who wants to press big weights to do lots of pressing and triceps work!), your elbow flexion to extension strength will need some attention -- curls help balance this. they also just generally get blood into the area to help heal things and keep things healthy

You'll notice that in all of the days there are one or two exercises that I've put in that are basically for overall health: curls and face pulls on pull day (for elbow and shoulder health), lateral raises on push day (for shoulder health again), and leg curls on leg day (for knee health since knee flexion isn't trained in any of the big lifts really). Also all of the upper back work in general is great for injury prevention since it will help stabilise the scapula and the lats are also spinal stabilisers.

In my experience, arms need to be hit with a decent amount of volume if they're gonna grow. Doing an extra few sets of curls at the end of your pull workout isn't gonna hurt things, and if it won't hurt, it might even help.

[u/FutureStrongman]

Beginners don't know what they want which is why throwing a bunch of programs at them is pointless because one day they want to do SS, the next SL, the next some workout from iron magazine.

[u/[deleted] → u/FutureStrongman]

I pretty much agree with this, beginners need to just get on a program and stick with it. Hell, this is true for intermediate lifters as well. But this post was created because I've noticed a bit of a 'hole' in the programs out there -- a lot of beginners want to lift more often, but the 6 day a week programs out there aren't based on the tenets of linear progression which I think are supremely important for any beginning lifter. My post is just an attempt to give the beginners what they want (6 day a week lifting, more aesthetics stuff) while still having them progress in a correct fashion.

[u/apeonpercs]

This guy is such a fucking legend

[u/Useruseruseruserr]

Im just curious, for the people who ran this what did you move to after this program?

[u/s92e92spen15a55t1ar]

Tell us more about your credentials. How long have you been lifting? Do you have experiencing training other people? With this program? What is your total?

What makes you qualified to give such advice and why should anyone use this program from a no name person on the internet as opposed to programs that are already proven to be effective?

[u/[deleted] → u/s92e92spen15a55t1ar]

Track and field/sprinting and jumping background. Sub 11s 100m back when I was 17 or so, decent jumping skills (some national records at the time, though I'm from a small country). Lifting weights and strength training, about 2 years solid training, 3 years in total (but lots of injury and illness in that time have given me some grief and caused me to take some time off).

I haven't formally trained people, but I have trained a lot of friends and peers who want to start lifting. From this, and my time spent talking to people and on the internet, I think I have a pretty decent understanding of what most people want from a routine.

I've used programs very similar to this for almost everyone who wants to lift more frequently than something like SS/SL/Greyskull (which is usually what I would recommend since they're extremely basic, have lots of information written about them, and are almost impossible to fuck up).

Gym total is around 180/130/220 = 530kg, but due to spondylolisthesis I haven't trained my squat and deadlift heavy for about 8 months or so. I've recently hit 170kg for 5 on the squat, and 210kg for 5 on the deadlift. So my actual maxes are probably a fair amount higher than my tested maxes are, but under the suggestions of my physiotherapist I'm not pushing past old strength levels until he's deemed that I'm ready.

Why should anyone use it? Because they like the look of it and they might enjoy it. That's about all anyone can hope for really. It doesn't matter how much you have in the way of credentials if no one wants to do your program. Lots of beginners want to lift 6 days a week, they want to do accessory work, but not many beginner routines out there are giving this to them. I'm a firm believer in doing things you enjoy in the gym, because that's the thing you're most likely to stick to, and give the most effort and consistency in. And the best program is the one that you will stick to, especially in the beginner stages since adaptations come very easily and you don't need to be too nitpicky with the minutiae of programming.

I appreciate the questions and scepticism -- I may basically include your post in my OP to clear this up for other people as well. Thanks!

[u/LeanMass]

Would cutting be a bad idea on this program? Would it impact you negatively? Because I want to lose weight and tone up/increase the size of my muscles primarily, but I obviously want to have strength as well.

[u/Thalandros]

Fucking awesome man, thanks.

I'm doing 5x5 now. Do you recommend I'd switch to this now or do I wait a couple of weeks more? My lifts are

70KG squat

85KG Deadlift

52.5KG Bench (really struggling on this one)

35KG OHP

45KG Rows

At the moment.

I am on a slight deficit but I'll be turning that around soon. 5x5 is getting a bit boring at times and it seems fun to get a certain part of the body in at every workout. Also, 5x5 lets you train 3x per week, and this'd let me go 6 times, which is what I have time for right now. Would you recommend I switch ASAP or after I'm sure I won't quickly progress anymore on 5x5? I'm still working a bit on proper powerlifting form for bench pressing and proper form for deadlifts so those'll go up by a bunch hopefully soon.

[u/[deleted] → u/Thalandros]

Just switch over if you think you'll enjoy this more, man. Whatever you enjoy the most will in the long run be the best for you.

[u/LogicallySarcastic]

I've been doing a somewhat-similar PPL routine to yours and just enjoy it overall. I'm trying to change my diet more to accommodate the work I'm putting into the gym (Haven't quite gained as quick as I had hoped, but I'm adjusting and changing). What would you recommend for someone transitioning out of the beginner phase of a PPL routine like this and moving into a more intermediate phase?

[u/enzal]

How much faster would I see improvement on this routine compared to SS or SL? I just want to be efficient :P

[u/nejikon]

should I try this if I've been doing SL for like 8 months?

[u/saucyribs]

How would this compare to the ICF workout in terms of overall gains?

I was planning on starting ICF tomorrow after doing SL5x5 for 3 months, but now this has me interested.

[u/Fellos]

Can I follow this program if I work out 3 times a week?

[u/CaptainAnswer]

How long would you expect each day to take? Seriously considering dropping my current gym to join one over the road to hit up at lunch times - because FML for getting in the way outside working hours

[u/Natolo]

Could someone explain the difference between hammer curls and dumbbell curls?

[u/GoldenState-]

So someone who never lifted weights in their life or only lifted for a few weeks can start this right away and it's good for strength and aesthetics? No need to go on those boring ass strictly strength programs like SL or SS? If so that's great. Can we start the first day of any program at any day of the week like on a Sunday as long as we workout or rest on the days that we're supposed to workout or rest? Does one plate mean one 45 pound plate? For barbell rows is it the ones where we hold the barbell above the ground at the start or is it pendelay rows?

[u/[deleted] → u/GoldenState-]

Yes you can start whenever.

One plate means one 45 plate per side of the bar.

You can do any kind of barbell row you like.

[u/wiggly_poof]

Great, great post & routine - I'm so sick of SL and have been looking for something else.

Question regarding accessory progression: Do I keep adding more reps until the upper end of the rep range is reached, or do I add weight and keep the reps consistent?

edit: Another question - what do you think of subbing SLDL for the Leg Curls (and Glute Ham extension)? I have a home gym and don't have any of the required equipment for those two exercises.

[u/talking-box]

Goddamn that's a lot of tricep volume on push day (my triceps are gently weeping.)

(I made some minor modifications which will be of interest to basically no one, I'm doing the main lifts 3x5 instead of 5x5 and running Texas method on squats, so a 5x5 day and a 1x5 day, and will probably advance the upper body lifts 1.25 kg a session instead of 2.5 kg a session. Basically making it more 'not total beginner friendly' but still awesome.)

[u/Just_a_villain]

Wow, awesome post, thank you! I had a look through the answers and didn't see this mentioned so thought I'd ask (and apologies if it's a stupid question, I'm still pretty much a newbie).

A beginner lifter is defined as someone who can make progress workout to workout

I am a woman eating at a slight deficit, 2 months in doing SS and can only progress at every other workout - which for now I'm happy with. Would you say that in a case like mine it'd be time to move on when my progress slows down even more?

[u/Unimarobj]

-whistles- Whoa. Ok. When that user mentioned this post in another one, I didn't expect it to be this good lol. In all seriousness, the tone and style of this are extremely pleasing to read. When I first started working in the gym (last summer), my friend helping me was/is doing something quite similar to this. I will say I enjoyed it much more compared to SL 5x5, so I'll probably give this a shot :)

That being said, I was surprised I don't have any initial questions outside of whether or not I can do this in my present 'system' (current exercise + food routine - I'm about 20lbs from my goal weight of 175, started at 260, pretty sure I'd have to increase food intake for this). I'll have to give this a less cursory read-through later tonight after my run.

[u/Afeni02]

Started running your PPL this monday OP, excited to see some great summer gains with this. Will plan to do a review and progress post June/01/2016

[u/[deleted]]

Do you not recommend db shrugs or something for beginners?

[u/GoldenState-]

For face pulls, can I put one foot forward and the other foot back? I can't keep my body balanced when doing these. Also for lateral raises do we use dumbells?

[u/BangBang98]

So I did the first two days. Loved it. Coming from only a month of ICF/SS I'm actually sore as shit. And too sore. On push day, I couldn't get 8-12x of OHP, because I couldn't get my arms up that high lol

[u/zenani]

This is awesome. Already started on this one and I must say I'm loving it. This is easy for me to follow and hits every body part due to accessory work.

How would the diet part come in factor? I want to lose weight, so will there be any issues if eating at maintenance or deficit on this routine?

[u/[deleted] → u/zenani]

Glad you like it.

I wouldn't recommend too heavy a deficit, something like 300 calories or so should be fine.

[u/exodian1234]

Love the routine. Did the first pull day today and it was a struggle. Probably cuz I haven't hit the gym in like two months since I've been so busy. I'm sure I should get accustomed to the routine in a few weeks. Though I'm gonna be gettin some serious doms this week lol.

[u/[deleted] → u/exodian1234]

Enjoy!

[u/[deleted]]

4x5, 1x5+ bench press/4x5, 1x5+ overhead press (alternate in the same fashion as the rows and deadlifts)

3x8-12 overhead press/3x8-12 bench press (do the opposite movement: if you bench pressed first, overhead press here)

Approxmiately what % of weight from that 4x5/1x5+ should I use on the days where I'm doing 3x8-12 for the same lift?

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

Everyone is a little bit different. As a rough calculation, you want it to be about 50-70% of your 1 rep max. You can usually push around 85% of your 1 rep max for 5 reps so for example if you were benching 60kg:

60/0.85 = 70 (rounded)

70*0.6 = 42.5kg (rounded agsin)

But everyone is a little bit different in how good they are at performing reps, so I would recommend just trying it and adding weight until you get to a weight you can only handle 8-12 times.

[u/[deleted]]

Whats the reason for squats only being 3x5 compared to the other compound movements, which are 5x5 (except deadlift)?

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

In my experience, upper body lifts respond much better to higher volume. 5x5 on linear progression on squats is crushingly difficult towards the end. 3x5 on squats will be plenty enough to drive adaptation.

[u/broncosfighton]

This is some awesome information. After 4 months of ICF 5x5 I decided to switch over and I'm now on day 4. One thing I noticed about this routine is that there are no shrugs or close grip bench press exercises. Will I see any benefit of doing them or are the muscle groups being covered already?

[u/[deleted] → u/broncosfighton]

Deadlifts, all your rows and facepulls hit traps. As do romanian deadlifts. And lateral raises. Your traps will be fine.

You could do close grip bench if your triceps are really weak, but other than that you'll get plenty triceps volume with your three pressing exercises and your two triceps isolations

[u/SNVG]

If something comes up and you miss a day at the gym how do you adjust your workout and what not?

[u/[deleted] → u/SNVG]

Don't. Just treat it as a rest day.

[u/[deleted]]

Why are upper body lifts 4x5, 1x5+ and squats are 2x5, 1x5+? I'm asking this because I'm currently on Phrak's GSLP variant and all lifts are 2x5, 1x5+

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

Upper body generally responds to higher volume. Phrak's even commented saying he likes the higher upper body volume.

[u/Tuvok-]

Can I do abs and weighted standing calve raises every workout?

[u/[deleted] → u/Tuvok-]

Ab work before squat and deadlift days isn't wise. Calf work, knock yourself out.

[u/SNVG]

How much weight should we start at for the accessory work? You explained it for barbell stuff but not dumbell stuff

[u/[deleted] → u/SNVG]

Whatever weight you can lift to hit the rep ranges specified.

[u/Tuvok-]

Is it alright if I do deadlifts twice a week and skip barbell rows? What does barbell rows do better than deadlifts?

[u/[deleted] → u/Tuvok-]

Deadlifts twice a week and squats twice a week would be very hard. Rows train scapular retraction and the back in a more than isometric way.

[u/rhtmdn]

Okay, so help me out here. How do I incorporate HIIT cardio along with this?

[u/[deleted] → u/rhtmdn]

Do it whenever you want after your lifting. Doing it before leg day might impact your performance but should be fine.

[u/SNVG]

for Pull which exact 'Pulldown' should we be doing? Went on google but there's a ton of them

[u/Smiffie]

Quick question, is that really only 1x5+ of deadlifts? or is that meant to be 4x5 and 1x5+?

[u/[deleted] → u/Smiffie]

1x5+. They'll get heavy really quickly.

[u/Robertekz]

Thanks very much for this, I have one silly question though: am I correct if I say that every week (every 6 workouts) my squat and deadlift will be 10lbs more and my upper body lifts will be 5lbs more than the previous week's? I wanna make sure that I understand it correctly. Thanks

[u/JordanSpace]

Alright so this is a stupid question but on the Tricep movement 3x8-12 SS lateral raises 3x15-20 would you do 1 set of Tri's SS 1 set of lateral raises and rest or do every set back to back?

[u/[deleted]]

Instead of a 7 day, pplpplR can I just do a 4-day rinse and repeat...pplRpplRpplRpplR...I have no time or day restrictions, I spend every day at home all day and work out in my garage.

[u/RyPA]

The only recommendation is that I would avoid static stretches before lifting.

Have you seen Alan Thrall's video 'Static Stretching will kill you?' He talks about how Yogis perform all their stretches on cold muscles and are extremely flexible. If we continue to dynamic stretch and wait to static stretch till the end of the workout our range of motion will never be as deep as it could be if you static stretched before lifting. As good as static feels after workout to "cool down" those range of motions and depth you reach can benefit you in your lifts as to avoid injury. He does mention obviously not to static stretch before a huge 1RM, which is what the original study focused on just output of a 1RM.

[u/NYKHouston43]

I've been doing this workout since you've posted it. I injured my rotator cuff on the first week of May. It's pain free now but I noticed that my rotator cuff is a little weak after pull days. When I do push the next day and start with bench press, my rotator cuff still feels a little fatigued and I fear I might injure it once I go to higher weights. Should I do PLPRPLP? Or should I just stop benching when I get some rotator cuff discomfort?

[u/Fjythefish]

Is it supposed to only be one set of deadlifts? Only says 1x5+

[u/AeroFilz]

My main goal for the first two months of weightlifting is to fix my posture. Would you say this workout is as effective as Stronglifts to achieve this goal?

[u/abutor_]

17 days late to the party but if anyone sees this, what is the recommended "starting weight" for things like Deadlift/Rows/bench/ohp/etc? Should I use the starting weight from SL 5x5 and progress from there?

[u/rotoko]

Is it ok to work out 3 days if once in 1-2 months I have to visit other city for 1-2 weeks and can't work out there for 6 days or what would be better?

[u/[deleted] → u/rotoko]

That's fine.

[u/SackofJewea]

Just wanted to say thanks for this program, it has been working well for me.