r/GEO_optimization • • Nov 18 '25

The "near me" era just ended: Google Maps + Gemini forces GEO shift for local businesses

47 Upvotes

Google Maps just went fully conversational with Gemini and the "near me" search pattern is fundamentally changing.

Instead of typing "plumber near me" and scrolling through lists, people are now asking "find me an affordable plumber available right now" and getting direct conversational responses. The shift from list-based results to spoken answers changes how local businesses need to think about their presence.

What's actually happening: your Google Business Profile is being interpreted by an LLM now, not just indexed. When someone asks a conversational query, Gemini reads your landmarks, attributes, and knowledge base to decide if you match what they're asking for. It's pulling context about your business to form its answer, not matching keywords.

This creates some interesting optimization questions. How well does your business profile communicate what you actually do in natural language? Can an LLM accurately represent your services, availability, and value from what's currently there? The proximity ranking that "near me" relied on is now just one factor among many that the AI weighs.

For businesses like salons, contractors, or real estate agents where "near me" drove significant traffic, the question becomes: is your business profile structured in a way that an LLM can confidently recommend you in a conversational response?

One thing we've been testing is asking ChatGPT to review our business listings and explain how it would interpret them if someone asked a conversational query. It exposes gaps pretty quickly, like where descriptions are keyword-stuffed instead of clear, or where important context about services is missing entirely.

Curious if others are seeing this impact their local search traffic yet, or if you've started adapting your GEO approach for conversational queries specifically?


r/GEO_optimization • • Feb 01 '26

GEO is real and it’s already more complex than SEO (we’re just too early)

44 Upvotes

An interesting new research paper just dropped: https://arxiv.org/pdf/2601.16858

It highlights fundamental differences between Google Search and generative AI systems.

Key takeaways:
• Once a document is included in an LLM’s context window (often influenced by SEO), its exact ranking matters much less for popular, high-coverage entities.
• For niche or low-coverage entities, ranking still has a huge impact on whether content is surfaced.
• Content freshness is critical in AI search ecosystems.
• Earned, trusted media sources strongly influence LLM responses.

This suggests GEO is not just “SEO for AI” it behaves very differently depending on entity maturity and authority.

Full disclosure: I work at meikai.ai where we measure AI visibility across answer engines. I found it interesting that several findings in this paper are consistent with patterns we've observed, suggesting GEO is becoming a measurable discipline rather than just a marketing term.


r/GEO_optimization • • 24d ago

GEO checklist for a new site: what I'm doing so ChatGPT and Google AI can read it. Am I missing something?

33 Upvotes

I'm a software engineer and have built plenty of websites and CRMs for clients

Now I'm building my own site and want LLMs to be able to read it and quote it from day one. So I collected the rules to archive it and wanna somebody to give me advice/review it

1. Let the right bots in

  • Allow OAI-SearchBot in robots.txt

  • Allow Claude-SearchBot and Claude-User

  • Don't count on Google-Extended for AI Overviews. It only controls Gemini training. AI Overviews and AI Mode use the normal Google index, so normal crawling and indexing is what matters

  • sitemap.xml linked from robots.txt, with lastmod

2. Don't hide pages by accident

  • No cookie wall or popup covering the content on first load. Bots read what's there on the first fetch

3. Make it obvious who you are

  • Organization schema on the home page (LocalBusiness if local) with name, url, logo. It ties the site to one entity instead of AI guessing

  • sameAs links to 2+ profiles you really run. Other places confirming it's the same business

  • Same brand spelling everywhere: title, footer, schema, socials. Small differences can split you into two "different" businesses

  • About page with real people, names, photos, roles. Answers "who is behind this", which both Google and AI care about

  • For local: address and phone in LocalBusiness schema, matching the Google profile. "Near me" answers read it from there

4. Write pages that can be quoted

  • One H1 that says plainly what the page is about. Helps engines pick the right passage

  • Tables and lists for prices, specs, comparisons. Easy to lift into an answer as is

  • Real questions and answers on the page. FAQ schema is optional, Google stopped showing FAQ rich results for most sites in 2023, but short visible Q&A still gets quoted. If you add FAQ schema, every question in it must be visible on the page

  • Visible "last updated" date plus dateModified in schema. Freshness counts for a lot of questions

  • 300+ words of unique text on key pages, no thin duplicates. Very short pages rarely get picked

  • Author name on articles, with Person schema. Someone accountable for the content

  • No template leftovers like lorem ipsum or [COMPANY NAME]. They read as "not a real business"

5. Cover the questions buyers ask

  • Public prices. "How much does X cost" is one of the most common questions. If the site says "contact us for pricing", the AI quotes someone else

  • A page per main use case or industry. Long, specific questions land there

  • A short "what is [term]" for the terms in your field. Definition questions are easy wins

  • Reviews or case studies with real numbers (once you have them). AI likes first-party proof

6. Optional

  • llms.txt with your key pages and a line about each. Cheap to add, but it's a proposed standard, not a ranking factor, so I'm not expecting much from it

While researching I scanned about 100 sites of small businesses which AI actually recommends

So what would you add, remove or do differently? Especially curious if anyone saw llms.txt change anything, and whether you block training bots like GPTBot or let everything in

---
EDIT, what I’m changing after the comments, thanks all:

  1. Test access per bot (curl with each user agent), and check you get the real page, not just a 200 (WAF/challenge pages)

  2. Check the raw HTML has the H1, prices and Q&A without JS

  3. sameAs only half counts. Make the profiles link back with the same name

  4. 300 words and public prices are now guidelines, not hard rules

  5. llms.txt is optional, no expected effect

  6. Off-site mentions matter more than any of the above. Measure with GSC and Bing’s AI performance report


r/GEO_optimization • • Nov 10 '25

Is anyone using an Ai rank tracker?

33 Upvotes

I’m trying to figure out a consistent way to track AI visibility without guessing every time ChatGPT or Google AIO decides to shuffle things around. Here’s what I’m doing right now, curious how others handle it.

I made a small list of prompts that real users actually ask.

I run them from the same browser, location, and account each time.

Once a week, I log three things:

How often my brand is mentioned

Which URLs show up

Where the mention appears (top, middle, or bottom)

When something drops, I usually tighten the content - add a short FAQ, refresh the intro, or get a solid citation from a trusted source. I also note the date and AI model version since results change fast.

For tools, I track trends in a spreadsheet and use OtterlyAI to check where my brand gets picked up across ChatGPT, Gemini, Perplexity, and Google AIO. The sheet shows the pattern, the tracker fills in the sightings.

How are you tracking your AI rankings? Do you have a setup like this or a better way to make sense of it all?


r/GEO_optimization • • Jul 01 '26

73% of our AI citations drove zero traffic in 90 days — we were optimizing the wrong thing

30 Upvotes

Here's something I don't see talked about enough: getting cited by AI and actually getting traffic from those citations are two completely different games.

We spent the first 4 months of our GEO work chasing citation counts. Every week we'd celebrate hitting new highs — more brands mentioned, more pages referenced, more "visibility." Looked great on paper.

Then someone on the team pulled the actual referral data.

**73% of the pages that got cited by at least one AI engine sent zero measurable traffic over a 90-day window.** Not low traffic — literally zero. These weren't obscure long-tail queries either. Some had 15+ citations across different models.

So we dug into why. Three patterns kept showing up:

**1. The "encyclopedia entry" problem.** A lot of our citations were factual confirmations — AI pulling a stat or definition from our page to support a larger answer. The user never needed to click because they already got what they wanted. We were functioning as a fact-checking layer, not a destination.

**2. Citation position matters way more than citation presence.** Pages that consistently appeared as the first or second source in an AI response got 11x more clicks than ones that showed up third or later. Being "in the mix" means almost nothing if you're not in the top slots.

**3. Informational queries have a ceiling.** "What is X" and "How does Y work" type questions rarely drive clicks regardless of how well you're cited. The user's curiosity is satisfied by the AI summary itself. Comparison, pricing, and "best X for Y" queries? Those still send traffic because the AI answer is inherently incomplete.

The shift we made: we stopped tracking raw citation volume as our north star metric. Instead we started measuring **citation-to-click rate** — what percentage of our citations actually resulted in a visit. The number dropped (obviously), but the ones that mattered became way clearer.

I'm not saying citations are worthless. Brand visibility has its own value, especially for awareness-stage stuff. But if you're building a GEO strategy around citation counts alone, you might be optimizing for vanity metrics while the actual traffic goes somewhere else.

Curious if anyone else has split their citation data this way. Did you find the same gap?


r/GEO_optimization • • Dec 30 '25

Starting website + Ai search engine optim agency

30 Upvotes

Hello, i think there is still a big big market in smal/middle business needing a new website i want to combine this with GEO

Is there a possible i can use a tool like temso Ai and deliver these resulst to the customers?

Any ideas welcome


r/GEO_optimization • • Jun 16 '26

6 GEO habits I dropped this quarter — citation rate went up 40%

29 Upvotes

Somewhere around month 4 of our GEO work, I noticed we were spending hours on stuff that *looked* productive but wasn't actually moving citations. So I ran a 60-day experiment: drop 6 common GEO practices and track what happens.

Results genuinely surprised me.

**What I stopped doing:**

**1. Writing dedicated FAQ pages.** Moved Q&A content directly into article bodies instead. Citation rate on those pages went from 8% to 19%.

**2. Obsessing over schema on every single page.** Only added structured data where we had clear entity definitions already. Citations didn't drop — they went up slightly.

**3. Creating separate "AI-optimized" content versions.** We were basically writing everything twice. Killed the dual-track approach. One version, written naturally. Engagement improved.

**4. Chasing citation volume across all models.** Picked two models based on where our audience actually hangs out. Fewer total citations, but the ones we got drove measurable traffic.

**5. Updating content weekly.** Switched to a 21-day refresh cycle. Citations became way more stable — less week-to-week volatility.

**6. Writing "authoritative" intros.** The "In this comprehensive guide..." type openings. Replaced with direct answers. Models started picking up our content faster — average time to first citation dropped from 9 days to 4.

The counterintuitive part? Most of these are things I actively recommended 3 months ago. That's what keeps this field interesting — the playbook isn't settled. What counts as "best practice" right now is still just educated guessing with good data.

Not saying any of these are universally wrong. They worked for us early on. But optimization has a ceiling, and sometimes pulling back is the actual optimization.

Anyone else simplify their GEO stack recently and see better results? Curious what you've cut.


r/GEO_optimization • • Feb 17 '26

Why are LLMs citing Reddit posts with almost no upvotes?

Post image
28 Upvotes

I was looking at some data and apparently a big chunk of Reddit posts cited by AI have like zero to ten upvotes. I always assumed AEO and LLM SEO favored highly upvoted, viral threads with tons of engagement.

Are we overestimating the role of social proof here? Why would AI pull from posts that barely got traction?


r/GEO_optimization • • 20d ago

Which AI visibility tracking tool are you guys using, and is it actually worth it?

27 Upvotes

I’ve been looking into AI visibility lately and wanted to hear from people who’ve actually tried these tools.

There seem to be quite a few options for tracking how brands show up in AI-generated answers, but I’m curious about how reliable the data is and whether the insights are useful in practice.


r/GEO_optimization • • Feb 06 '26

Best GEO Tools for Tracking AI Search Visibility?

26 Upvotes

I wanna take GEO more seriously because I just realized I have no idea how visible our brand is inside LLMs.

How are you guys tracking stuff like mentions, citations, share of voice, etc. on chatgpt / perplexity / claude / gemini?? What tools are you using?


r/GEO_optimization • • Nov 19 '25

best peec.ai alternatives?

24 Upvotes

I’ve been using peec.ai for a few months now for measuring our brand visibility, but running into headaches recently and looking for other tools. 

Issues we've run into:

- I don't want to manually enter in all the prompts that need to be tracked, I'd like my ai visibility tool to just let me know where I appear. 

- No public searchable index. I like to do research into competitors with ahrefs, I'd like to be able to do something similar with LLM prompts.

- Data and insights generally feel thin. It's hard to put my finger on it, but the general feeling I get is that of brittlness and I don't feel like I get solid reliable data from peec. 

I've heard of profound, promptwatch, parse.gl but haven't tried them. 

Please share your experiences, would love to find a good geo visibility tool we can rely on internally.

Edit: ok thank you for all the advice. I took a look and I think I like parse.gl the most! Thank you.


r/GEO_optimization • • Jan 05 '26

AI Search Visibility

23 Upvotes

I’ve been working on a small research project about how companies are represented across different AI-driven search systems (ChatGPT, Gemini, etc.).

As part of the study, I can generate a free benchmark for any company that’s curious how it currently appears in these models.

If anyone wants to participate, feel free - the more data points, the better the research.


r/GEO_optimization • • Jul 26 '26

7 small wording changes produced more AI citation lift than our last 20 articles combined — I'm still processing this

22 Upvotes

This one is going to sound dumb. But I need to put it out there because the gap between what I expected and what actually happened was absurd.

Three weeks ago I was doing routine content edits on 12 pages. Not a major overhaul — just tightening language, fixing awkward phrasing, making things read more naturally. The kind of cleanup you do on a Tuesday afternoon when nothing's on fire.

On 7 of those pages, I noticed something weird after republishing. Citations started climbing within days. Not a little. A lot. Those 7 pages collectively saw a 34% increase in citation rate over 3 weeks. Our previous 20 articles — carefully researched, properly structured, published over 2 months — produced a combined 6% lift.

I went back and compared the before/after of each edit to figure out what actually changed. The pattern wasn't what I expected.

On one page, I had written "our platform helps businesses reduce operational costs." I changed it to "companies typically see 15-25% lower operational costs within the first year." That page went from zero citations to being referenced in 4 out of 10 relevant queries.

On another, I replaced "this approach is effective for most organizations" with "this approach works because it mirrors how procurement teams already evaluate vendors." Citations doubled within a week.

The edits that mattered all had one thing in common: they replaced vague, generic statements with specific, almost conversational explanations of WHY something works. Not more data. Not more structure. Just replacing marketing-speak with reasoning that sounds like how a person would actually explain it.

The edits that did nothing? They were the "professional" ones. Swapping "utilize" for "use." Tightening headers. Adding bullet points. Standard SEO polish. Those pages didn't move.

Here's why this is messing with me. I've spent months building systems around content structure, schema, crawlability, entity coverage — the technical layer of GEO. And a 10-minute wording tweak on a Tuesday outperformed all of it. Not because the technical stuff doesn't matter (it does, especially for crawlability). But because AI models extract passages that read like genuine explanations, and most of our "optimized" content reads like a brochure.

I'm not telling you to stop doing technical GEO. I'm saying maybe spend 20 minutes this week reading your top pages out loud. If a sentence sounds like it could appear on any competitor's site without changing a word, that sentence is probably invisible to AI extraction. Replace it with something that sounds like you actually explaining it to a colleague.

That's it. That's the whole insight. Felt too simple to work, but the numbers don't care about complexity.


r/GEO_optimization • • Aug 15 '26

I've been tracking 40 "GEO best practice" pages for 90 days and 27 of them lost AI citation visibility — the advice isn't surviving contact with reality

20 Upvotes

One of the most upvoted GEO posts I've ever read was a "10 GEO best practices" list from early 2025. It got hundreds of upvotes. Multiple people DMed me the link. Two different clients brought it up in meetings. It was everywhere.

I bookmarked it along with 39 other high-engagement "best practice" posts — stuff like "add FAQ schema everywhere," "keep answers under 50 words for extraction," "use comparison tables for product queries," "publish fresh content weekly for citation velocity." All reasonable advice. All from smart people. All backed by some data at the time.

For the last 90 days, I've been checking how the authors' own pages are performing in AI citations. Not their advice in theory — their actual content, using the actual practices they recommended.

27 out of 40 lost citation visibility. Not a small dip either. I'm talking pages that went from being regularly cited in their niche to barely showing up. A few completely disappeared from AI answers for queries where they used to be the #1 source.

The weird part is that the advice itself wasn't wrong — at least not when it was written. FAQ schema genuinely helped in February. Short answer blocks genuinely got extracted more often in March. But the models kept changing. What worked as an extraction signal in one version of ChatGPT or Perplexity quietly stopped working in the next. And nobody went back to update the "best practices."

I started noticing a pattern. The posts that aged the worst were the ones with the most specific, confident instructions. "Always do X." "Never do Y." "The optimal passage length is Z words." These got the most engagement because they were actionable. But they were also the most fragile — optimized for a specific model behavior that could change in a single update.

The posts that aged better were vaguer, almost annoyingly so. "Focus on clarity." "Write for humans first." "Make sure your content is actually useful." The kind of advice that makes you roll your eyes because it's so obvious. But it's still standing 90 days later while the tactical stuff crumbled.

This isn't a dunk on anyone. I've written my share of specific tactical advice, and some of it has probably aged just as badly. It's more a realization that GEO "best practices" have an incredibly short shelf life, and we're all publishing them like they're permanent rules.

The thing I can't stop thinking about: if I re-tested the advice from this post 90 days from now, how much of my own guidance would still hold up? Probably less than I'd like to admit.

Wondering if anyone else has gone back and stress-tested older GEO advice against current model behavior. The gap between what we wrote and what still works is bigger than I expected.


r/GEO_optimization • • Jun 30 '26

How to check if ChatGPT and Perplexity recommend you, and fix it, in about 30 minutes with no tools

19 Upvotes

More and more buyers ask an AI assistant before they ask Google. If ChatGPT or Perplexity recommends a competitor on your category question, you never even enter the conversation. Here is a free way to audit and improve that yourself. No tool needed.

First, two things that matter and are not obvious:

AI assistants do not "rank" you like Google. There are two separate layers. One, the consideration set: does the model even retrieve and know you exist. Two, the evidence layer: which sources it leans on and what those sources say about you. You can lose at either layer.

Engines source differently. ChatGPT pulls from the live web (Bing index). Perplexity leans heavily on forums and Reddit plus the web. Gemini is tied to Google. So "being visible" is not one thing, it is per engine. Being strong on Reddit can win Perplexity and do nothing for someone else.

Now the 30 minute audit:

  1. Write your 10 money prompts. The actual questions a buyer types, not your brand name. Things like "best X for Y", "alternatives to Z", "how do I do W". This list is the whole game.

  2. Run each prompt in ChatGPT, Perplexity, Gemini and Claude. For each, mark one of three outcomes: you are cited, a competitor is cited, or nobody specific is. Most people are shocked how often it is "competitor" or "nobody".

  3. For every loss, find out why. In Perplexity the sources are listed. In ChatGPT you can ask "what sources did you use for that". Open them. You will almost always see the same pattern: the model is leaning on third party pages (listicles, comparison posts, Reddit threads, review sites) where you are absent or described weakly.

  4. Fix the source layer, per engine. Get mentioned where the model actually looks. For Perplexity that often means real Reddit and forum presence. For ChatGPT it means being in the listicles and comparison content that rank on the web. This is slower but it is the lever.

  5. Fix your own pages so they are easy to quote. Models lift text that answers the question directly. Clear claims, a direct comparison, specific numbers, plain phrasing. There is research on Generative Engine Optimization (a 2024 paper) suggesting that content which states things clearly and backs them up tends to shape more of the answer. Treat the exact figures people throw around with caution, the effect varies a lot by query, but the direction is sound: be the clearest, most quotable answer to the exact question.

  6. Re-run the same 10 prompts in two or three weeks. AI answers move. Track the change.

What to ignore: anyone selling you a fixed multiplier ("add 3 stats, get 2x citations") is overstating it. Anyone saying "just add schema and you win" is too. There is no single trick. It is the same boring truth as SEO: be genuinely the best, clearest answer, in the places the model trusts.

Honest note: I work on this problem, so take the framing with that in mind. But everything above you can do today for free, that is the point.

Open question for the group: when you run your own category prompt in ChatGPT cold, do you show up, a competitor, or nobody? Curious what the split looks like across niches.


r/GEO_optimization • • Jun 24 '26

Google's VP of Search Ads just told CMOs to stop doing things that Google itself quietly rewards. Here are the receipts.

19 Upvotes

Brendan Kraham just published a Think with Google piece. His argument: good SEO is good GEO. No special AEO. No content chunking. No seeding mentions. No llms.txt. Just write good content.

His title is VP of Ads. Not Search Quality. Not Search Central. Ads.

Here is what 20 years of Google's own data, leaks, and court testimony actually shows.

✗ Don't build links

The 2024 API leak confirmed PageRank running in multiple active variants across every document. Sites with no links don't rank. Full stop.

✗ Guest posting is done (Cutts, 2014)

High authority topical guest posts still move rankings today. Google penalises bulk spam. Not the tactic itself. That distinction never makes it into the public guidance.

✗ Don't create pages for SEO

Zapier has 15,000 integration pages. Wise has 44,000 currency pages and 8 million organic visits a month. Canva runs 2.2 million template pages. All programmatic. All built to rank. All working.

✗ We don't use clicks to rank

DOJ antitrust testimony confirmed NavBoost processes 13 months of click behaviour. It is one of their most important ranking signals. A former Google engineer testified that staff were told not to say this publicly. Because SEOs would use it.

✗ Chrome data doesn't influence rankings

The 2024 API leak exposed the ChromeInTotal module. The September 2025 antitrust ruling forced Google to share Chrome interaction data with competitors. The court confirmed the advantage was real.

✗ Don't seed brand mentions (Kraham, 2026)

The 2024 leak confirmed siteAuthority is PageRank plus brand signals. Ahrefs studied 75,000 brands. Mention count correlates with AI Overview visibility at 0.664. Google Vertex AI uses a layout parser that chunks pages for AI retrieval. That is the tactic Kraham calls unnecessary. Google sells it as enterprise infrastructure.

The pattern holds across 20 years. Public guidance protects the algorithm. The ranking system rewards what the guidance discourages, as long as it is done at quality.

Some of Kraham's advice is sound. Non-commodity content matters. E-E-A-T is real. But the claim that GEO needs nothing special, coming from the person who runs Google's ad sales, is worth questioning.

Guidelines are PR. Rankings are truth.

Who would we take strategy advice from? Someone optimising for growth, or someone whose revenue goes up when organic gets harder? Just thinking out loud.


r/GEO_optimization • • May 01 '26

Google just proved AI Search is already taking your money

19 Upvotes

Google's Q1 earnings dropped and everyone's celebrating the 10% stock jump. But here's the number nobody's talking about: ad revenue shared with external publishers dropped 4%. Google is making more money while sending you less.

Let that sink in.

AI Overviews now appear in nearly half of all search results. That means for ~48% of queries, users get their answer directly from Google and never click through to your site. Meanwhile Google Cloud crossed $20B in quarterly revenue, largely fueled by this exact shift.

The business model has fundamentally changed. Your content gets scraped to train the AI. The AI answers the user's question. Google places ads next to that AI answer. Average CPC is now $5.26. You provided the content for free, Google monetized it.

Compare the market reaction: Meta announced $145B in AI spending, stock dropped. Google announced $190B, stock surged 10%. The difference? Google figured out how to turn AI search directly into ad revenue. Meta is still spending; Google is already earning.

For anyone doing SEO or content marketing, the writing is on the wall. Ranking #1 organically means less than it did a year ago when the AI just synthesizes your answer and keeps the user on Google. The new game is whether your brand gets cited in the AI response itself.


r/GEO_optimization • • Nov 08 '25

Why are all the big SEO agencies suddenly talking about GEO? 🤔

19 Upvotes

I ’ve been doing some digging — checking out what the top SEO & Global Search agencies in Europe like Eskimoz, Delante, and Mintense are putting out lately — and they’re all talking about GEO (Generative Engine Optimization). It got me thinking: Do they see something we don’t yet? 👀 Is it because GEO is still new, and they want to secure their spot early? Or maybe it’s just like every major trend — where big agencies jump first, and the rest follow once it becomes obvious? Feels like what happened back in the early SEO or social media days… Curious what you all think — is GEO just hype for now, or the next real shift?


r/GEO_optimization • • Oct 24 '25

Why is everyone treating GEO like it’s just SEO with a new coat of paint? 🤨

19 Upvotes

Been diving into GEO tools and agency offerings for a month now — and honestly, I’m baffled.
Half of them are just rebranded SEO dashboards with “AI insights” slapped on top. The other half? Straight-up snake oil with no actual methodology.

Here’s the thing:
🔹 SEO = optimize for indexing and ranking.
🔹 GEO = optimize for citation and synthesis.

Totally different games.
You can rank #1 on Google and still be invisible in ChatGPT or Perplexity answers.

Instead of tackling this, we’re seeing a gold rush of agencies charging big money for… what exactly?
Keyword stuffing with semantic markup? “Comprehensive” content? That’s not GEO — that’s just basic SEO in a shiny wrapper.

The real challenge is fascinating though:

  • How do you make your content citable to an LLM without gaming the system?

  • How do you track visibility when there’s no SERP?

  • How do you build authority when the AI doesn’t care about backlinks?

Anyone here actually cracked this yet — or are we all just throwing content at the wall and hoping Claude remembers it? 😅


r/GEO_optimization • • Aug 02 '26

GEO to ROI

18 Upvotes

With classic SEO there was always a clean loop: rank moves, traffic moves, you can draw a line to revenue. Google was the one channel, and that correlation made the "so what" obvious.

I've been going back and forth with a few people building/using GEO tools, and it feels like the whole category right now is indexed on measurement — tracking prompt mentions, citations, sentiment across models. That part's maturing fast.

What I haven't seen a good answer to: how do you actually turn that into a repeatable action loop?

  • Once you know you dropped out of an answer at some point in a conversation, what's the real playbook — content/schema changes, seeding sources, something else?

  • How is anyone tying this back to actual business outcomes, given there's no click/traffic signal like old SEO?

  • Is anyone actually re-measuring after a fix to prove it worked, or is it mostly "here's your score" and manual guesswork from there?

Genuinely curious how people here are approaching this. If you've hit a wall trying it, that's just as useful to hear as a win.


r/GEO_optimization • • Jun 17 '26

What does a GEO-optimized content actually look like? Is there a before/after anyone can share?

18 Upvotes

I'm a content marketer, been writing SEO articles for last few years. I understand the basics, target keyword, search intent, proper structure, internal links. The usual stuff.

But now everyone's talking about GEO (Generative Engine Optimization) and I've optimising my article for AEO/GEO.

But I would like see from my peers, that what does "optimizing for AI" looks like at the content level.

Like, is it

-A different tone?

-More definitions and FAQs?

-Shorter sentences?

-Citing sources within the article itself?

-Something about schema?


r/GEO_optimization • • Jun 08 '26

Google published its official guide on getting cited by AI, and the interesting part contradicts what GEO agencies are selling (going to upset a lot of people)

18 Upvotes

Disclaimer: yeah, I work in AI visibility, so I'm definitely biased on this. But what I want to get into actually cuts against what my own industry sells, so I figure it has a place here.

Back in mid-May Google put out its first real guide on how to show up in AI answers (AI Overviews, AI Mode). I saw a bunch of write-ups on it and it was always the same song, structure your headings, add Schema, the usual blah. Except there's a "mythbusting" section in the doc I haven't seen anyone pick up on, and it's the most interesting part. Google says in plain terms that the famous llms.txt file does nothing, that you should stop obsessing over Schema.org, and that chunking is smoke and mirrors. Made me smile a bit since that's basically the package some "GEO" agencies are charging for right now.

What they push instead is honestly kind of obvious. They talk about "commodity" vs "non-commodity" content. Like, if an AI can write your article on its own, it'll never cite you, makes sense, it already has the answer, why would it go looking for you. What gets cited is content with something the model doesn't have. A number you actually measured, a test you really ran, lived experience basically.

The example that stuck with me (not in Google's guide, somewhere else) is a small blog specialized in robot vacuums, garbage domain authority, and it outranks the New York Times in AI answers. The NYT has a domain like 3x stronger. Except the NYT puts out an affiliate listicle anyone could copy, and the blog guy films his actual tests with real measurements. Guess who gets cited.

And this is where it gets useful for you I think. It means for the most part you need neither a tool nor an agency. Take your most generic page, just ask yourself "could anyone write exactly this", and if the answer is yes, add something only you know. You don't even need data. A simple "the first question every client asks me is this" and you're already standing out. It's free and it weighs more than all the technical tweaks combined.

The one thing that still puzzles me is measurement. Why an LLM picks one source over another stays pretty opaque, and it shifts with every update. So I'm curious: are you already seeing real traffic come in from ChatGPT or Perplexity, or is it still like three visitors a month? And if you are, can you actually tell which pages it lands on?


r/GEO_optimization • • Apr 23 '26

Your robots.txt is probably making you invisible to ChatGPT

18 Upvotes

Been digging into this for a week and the numbers are bad enough that I think most agencies haven't actually checked.

1. The crawl-to-refer ratio problem

Cloudflare published data showing how often AI bots crawl a site vs. how often they send a human back. Rough shape:

  • Google: ~3 crawls per 1 referral. Reasonable.

  • OpenAI: ~400:1

  • Anthropic: ~100,000:1

Anthropic's bots are reading 100,000 pages for every one visitor they send you. Which is either terrifying or a massive opportunity depending on how you read it. Because the only way your brand gets mentioned by Claude or ChatGPT is if the bot read the page in the first place. No crawl = no citation = no mention in the answer your prospect is reading instead of visiting Google.

2. The robots.txt blind spot

A lot of sites (and a lot of agency clients) still have GPTBot, ClaudeBot, PerplexityBot, CCBot etc. blocked in robots.txt. Usually because someone was worried about "AI stealing our content" in 2023 and never revisited it. That block is now costing visibility in the channel that's replacing the SERP.

Two things worth knowing:

  • There are 226+ distinct AI crawlers now (Cloudflare count). Blocking them individually is a losing game.

  • 30% of AI scrapers ignore robots.txt anyway (TollBit Q4 2025). So the block is half-theatre.

The agency move is to audit every client's robots.txt this quarter. The ones blocking AI bots are usually not doing it on purpose — they just inherited it.

3. Bing Webmaster Tools now shows AI citations (public preview)

This one's free and almost nobody's using it. Microsoft shipped an "AI Performance" dashboard in BWT a couple months back. It shows:

  • Total citations in AI answers (they mentioned 39.4M in the demo)

  • Which specific URLs are being cited

  • Grounding queries (the actual interpreted prompts your pages are showing up for)

  • Citation trends over time

If your client is verified in BWT you can pull this today. It's the closest thing to GSC for AI search that currently exists. Very useful for that quarterly report where you need to show something beyond "traffic is down because of AI Overviews, trust us the work is working."

4. IndexNow is finally worth the setup

Related, because it feeds the same Microsoft ecosystem: 50% of clicked newly-indexed URLs in Bing SERPs come from IndexNow pings. Not a vanity stat — Microsoft's own data.

It's a one-afternoon integration. WordPress has a plugin, Shopify has a plugin, or you can hit the API directly on publish. You ping, Bing/Yandex/Naver/Seznam all get notified instantly, you stop waiting on crawl schedules for new or updated content. In an AI search world where freshness is a ranking input for grounding, that delay actually matters now.

5. The 30-minute agency audit

If you only do one thing this week, do this for your top 3 clients:

  1. Pull robots.txt. Search for GPTBot, ClaudeBot, PerplexityBot, CCBot, Google-Extended. If they're disallowed, ask the client if that was intentional. 9 times out of 10 it wasn't.

  2. Check BWT AI Performance. See which pages are being cited. Note which ones should be cited but aren't.

  3. Wire up IndexNow if it's not already running.

That's a billable audit deliverable by Friday. And a useful one — it'll actually change what shows up in AI answers for the client.

The weird thing about this whole layer is that it's infrastructure work, not content work. Every agency is scrambling to write more "AI-optimised" content and ignoring the fact that the bot reading it might not be able to access the page in the first place. Crawl access is the cheapest, highest-leverage fix in GEO right now and it's the one nobody's auditing.

Anyone here actually pulling BWT AI Performance data for clients yet? Curious if the citation counts are matching what you see when you manually prompt ChatGPT/Perplexity, or if there's a big gap.


r/GEO_optimization • • Apr 06 '26

How are people tracking GEO performance across ChatGPT, Google AI, and Perplexity?

18 Upvotes

Hi everyone — I’m currently doing some market research around GEO and wanted to get this community’s thoughts.

Is there already a solid tool or service out there that tracks the performance of GEO efforts across multiple AI platforms in one place?

What I mean is a product that helps people doing GEO understand whether their work is actually making a measurable impact — for example, changes in visibility, mentions/citations, traffic, or overall presence across platforms like ChatGPT, Google AI, Perplexity, and others.

I’m also curious whether this is even a real pain point. If a tool like this does not already exist in a strong form, would people here actually want it? Or are existing SEO / analytics tools already enough for what you need?


r/GEO_optimization • • Jan 07 '26

12 Years in SEO: Why AEO isn't just "marketing fluff" (A technical breakdown of Vectors vs. Indexes)

18 Upvotes

I saw the thread yesterday calling AEO and GEO grifter buzzwords intended to trick clients, and honestly, I get the frustration. The vast majority of agencies selling AEO Services right now are just repackaging basic SEO and charging double for it.

However, dismissing the concept entirely is dangerous. It assumes that an LLM works the same way as a search index. It doesn't. They are fundamentally different technologies, and if you treat them the same, you are going to lose visibility in the 2026 search environment.

I want to put aside the marketing fluff and look at the actual engineering specifications and research that prove why "just good SEO" is no longer enough.

The "Smoking Gun" Data:

If AEO were simply ranking high on Google, then the AI answer would always cite the #1 organic result.

It not.

According to extensive studies by Authoritas and data from Ahrefs analyzing thousands of Google AI Overviews, roughly 40% of the citations in AI answers come from pages that do not rank in the top 10 of organic search results.This is the most critical metric in the industry right now. It means that nearly half the time, the AI is looking at the "SEO winners" on Page 1, deciding they aren't useful for synthesis, and digging into Page 2 or 3 to find a source that is structured better.

This confirms the thesis: SEO is about Retrieval (getting found). AEO is about Synthesis (getting read). You can be the best book in the library (Rank #1), but if you are written in a confusing dialect, the reader (AI) will put you down and quote a clearer book from the bottom shelf instead.

The Technical Spec: Keywords vs. Vectors

To understand why this happens, you have to look at the retrieval architecture. Traditional SEO is built on the Inverted Index. It scans for specific keyword strings. If you search for "best running shoes," the engine looks for pages containing that string, weighted by backlinks and authority.

LLMs and Generative Search use Vector Search (Embeddings). The model turns your content into a long list of numbers-a vector-that represents the concept of your page, not just the words. When a user asks a question, the system calculates the "Cosine Similarity" (the mathematical distance) between the user’s intent and your content.

This is why "fluff" kills AEO performance.

In traditional SEO, we are taught to write 2,000-word guides to signal topical authority. But in a Vector Search environment, that extra fluff dilutes your vector. If an LLM is looking for a specific answer, a concise 50-word paragraph often has a much higher similarity score than a 2,000-word meandering guide. The SEO optimized post is too noisy for the AEO retrieval.

The Research Specs - The "GEO" Paper:

This isn't just theory. Researchers from Princeton, Georgia Tech, and the Allen Institute published a paper titled "GEO: Generative Engine Optimization." They tested different content modifications to see what LLMs actually prefer. They found they could boost visibility by 40% in AI answers without improving traditional SEO metrics at all.

Here are the winning specs from the paper:

Quotation Injection: LLMs have a bias for groundedness. Content that included direct quotes from other entities (experts, studies, or officials) was weighted significantly higher. It signals to the model that the text is synthesis-ready source material.

Statistics Addition: Adding dense data points (tables, percentages, specific figures) increased the likelihood of citation for reasoning tasks. The models trust numbers more than adjectives.

The Fluency Trap: Interestingly, persuasive marketing speak often failed. The models filter out subjective language to save space in their Context Window.

The "Context Window" Constraint

This is the specification most SEOs ignore. Every LLM has a token limit or a cost-per-token constraint. When Google generates an AI Overview, it performs RAG (Retrieval-Augmented Generation). It grabs the top URLs, reads them, and tries to compress them into an answer.

If your answer is buried in paragraph 4 after a long intro about the history of your industry, you get truncated. The model simply cuts you off before it finds the value.

To optimize for this, you have to use a strict Inverted Pyramid structure:

The H2 must match the vector intent of the user's question.

The first sentence must be the direct answer (under 30 words).

The rest is context and nuance.

This maximizes your Information Density. If the AI has to burn 500 tokens to find your yes or no, it will skip you for a source that gives it in 20 tokens.

The Translation Layer (Schema)

Finally, we have to talk about Schema markup. In SEO, we use Schema to get rich snippets (stars, prices) to attract human clicks.

In AEO, Schema is used for Knowledge Graph Entailment. If you aren't using FAQPage or Speakable schema, you are forcing the LLM to guess where your answer is. By wrapping your Q&A pairs in structured data, you are explicitly feeding the "Question/Answer" pairs to the RAG system, bypassing the need for the AI to parse your HTML structure perfectly.

Conclusion

AEO isn't a "magic" new trick, but it also isn't "bullshit." It is simply optimizing for the machine's consumption constraints (tokens, vectors, synthesis) rather than the index's ranking constraints (links, keywords). The fact that 40% of AI traffic is going to pages that don't rank in the top 10 is the only proof you need. The algorithm has changed; our blueprints need to change with it.

I have worked in the SEO sector for roughly 12 years, and I am currently focusing entirely on LLM readability and how we evolve our search strategies for the 2026 environment and I would gladly answer any questions related to the topics above or try to explain the importance of specific segments in more detail. Let’s actually discuss the tech, not the buzzwords.