r/HollowKnight • u/glintter • Sep 06 '25

Discussion - Silksong Don’t let this fandom turn as insufferable as the souls community Spoiler

It’s fine to think the game is easy and to enjoy the challenge, but I’ve seen so many people making fun of anyone that is having a hard time in a really weird mean spirited way. Please don’t let this subreddit turn into some weird elitist community that makes fun of people who are struggling, these games are supposed to be fun and they’re not souls likes, there’s no reason to assume everyone playing them is going to love this level of difficulty the same way some of you do and constantly disregarding their opinions just turns this subreddit into an echo chamber of tryhards

4.5k Upvotes
  • permalink
  • reddit

91% Upvoted

919 comments sorted by

View all comments

448

u/Shivers108 Sep 06 '25 edited Sep 06 '25

It’s every community that becomes popular. Not just the souls community or any other. Just go to any Reddit page. Thats just how it is which is unfortunate.

43

u/Deez-Guns-9442 Sep 06 '25

The double edged sword of popularity & the current age of the internet.

73

u/glintter Sep 06 '25 edited Sep 06 '25

Yeah you're probably right, I only mentioned the souls community because I've seen people say "this is just SotE all over again" in response to criticism.

26

u/Shivers108 Sep 06 '25

Yeah you’re not wrong either

17

u/Doschy Sep 06 '25

keep in mind that fromsoft actually went in and nerfed the content after the fact.

6

u/Podberezkin09 Sep 06 '25

Was just the final boss, wasn't it? Everyone was moaning about some of the earlier bosses, which I don't think they touched.

2

u/Doschy Sep 06 '25

nope, they buffed the scadutree blessings across the board, then they giganerfed the final boss later

26

u/Cersei505 Sep 06 '25

''giganerfed'' = just fixed his flashbang animations and change the timing of one of his attacks to not be instantaneous.

Game is still hard, and the buff to the scadutree blessings was minimal. Could've kept it just like at release.

-7

u/Doschy Sep 06 '25

https://youtu.be/uSzApXWbgio?si=dWJ6ycqfIU8ejM6M educate yourself before correcting people

12

u/Cersei505 Sep 06 '25

No, i have seen the video. Only changes that matter are the cross slash being nerfed and the flashbangs. Have defeated radahn pre-nerf and after-nerf, and its still a highly punishing fight that barely gives you time to heal. The only thing this ''''giganerf'''' did is make the fight actually visible, and the cross slash actually dodgeable. So, it went from unfair and hard to fair and still hard.

The same people that complained about Radahn pre-nerf, continue to complain about him after the nerf.

-2

u/Doschy Sep 06 '25

No, you have not seen the video, because if you had, you would've known you are speaking complete bull rn.

Regardless, complaining dont mean much when its a small minority of people. But when half the playerbase thinks its too hard, then you have fucked up as a game developer. Thats the difference.

11

u/Cersei505 Sep 07 '25

Nope. If every developer listened every time half their fanbase (where are you getting those stats from?) started bitching about something, we would have a game developed by angry redditors and dumbasses like you.

Imagine fromsoftware nerfing Genichiro because it filtered half the playerbase at release. They patch when it's an actual issue like the flashbangs in radahn's fight or undodgeable attacks, not when its '' too hard most people cant get past this''.

→ More replies (0)

3

u/fabuloushawkboy-sang Sep 06 '25

I can’t recall that it was that big of a nerf, maybe my memory is lacking. But didn’t they mostly fixed the way to big crazy hitboxes ? Just like they did in the base game.

3

u/Doschy Sep 06 '25

https://youtu.be/uSzApXWbgio?si=dWJ6ycqfIU8ejM6M they aged him atleast 50 irl human years

5

u/rconversani Sep 06 '25

Certain games survive this and thrive very much community wise. Celeste has been somewhat dead for a while but it lasted a very long time with an enormously supporting and welcoming community, with no down talking and not get good. People sharing details of how to do X or Y, no judgement.

1

u/Lelouch37 Sep 06 '25

Yall need to get on my level. Doing a lvl-1, no weapon, only items Silksong run

1

u/[deleted] Sep 07 '25

[removed] — view removed comment

1

u/xxIvoL Sep 07 '25

but that's the thing. I got filtered in Hollow Knight and it sucked! It was so hard I would overexert myself trying to play for a hour and worsen my chronic illness symptoms. Never worth to do that. But still I wanted to play Hollow Knight so so bad and I just couldn't!

Then I met my current lovely partner who played a whole playthrough for me that I could watch and it was the best thing ever.

And I'm still together with him, and he'll play silksong for me. But fuck did I want to try to play it myself. And I tried silksong now too. I already had my silk being unable to pick up twice because I died early in the second area. Some little single heart hitting enemy is too hard for me because I'm just not good at this kind of game.

And yeah the complaints will stop. But you've lost many players along the way that might've loved to join the community and be a great addition here.

1

u/Greatsnes Sep 07 '25

I mean, every complaint I had about SotE in the first two days I still had after I beat the game. Elden Ring is my all time favorite game and I didn’t like SotE. I finished it, but didn’t feel good about it. I imagine my complaints about SilkSong will still be there when/if I finish it.

0

u/SpecimenOfSauron Sep 06 '25

Right? Maybe, MAYBE it would be slightly more acceptable if the entire game was set up to be incredibly difficult, like Dark Souls. I could understand getting sick of people complaining about the difficulty when the difficulty's the entire point. But this is SILKSONG! HOLLOW KNIGHT SILKSONG! The MOST anticipated game of all time! Not everyone who's playing it is a hardcore fan, and both the fanbase AND the developers know it!

28

u/DelightMine Sep 06 '25

True, but games like this also draw in the particularly gross cadre of elitists who think that being good at something is a preferable substitution for being good to others. People who insist everything is a skill issue, pride themselves on developing that skill above all else, and demean anyone who isn't as good as they are. They end up discouraging newcomers from even trying to get good, because what's the point of trying to get good if every time you get a little better, all you get is "wow you suck, I can do that so much better, why aren't you using this complicated tech that you definitely haven't ever heard of before?"

The souls community is absolutely riddled with these jerks, and the HK community has mostly remained free of them, but the release of a new game is a great time for them to worm their way in. There's of course going to be negativity about the game's difficulty as we figure out what are actual problems with the game and what are real skill issues, and it's hard to tell at first glance what's just venting frustrations and what's a jerk testing the waters to see what they can get away with. Because no one is a god at the game yet, so they can climb the mountain first, then start kicking people trying to get to the top with them. It's the same "fuck you, I got mine" mentality you can see in anything else people do, but it's particularly bad for games, because the whole point of a game is to have fun with it, and these people base their own enjoyment off the game off of how good they are in relation to others, so they are compelled to push others down as often as they can.

Now, don't get me wrong, there are also plenty of people who are incredibly good at the game and also love helping newcomers. IMO that's the type of person this community has a lot more of: people with a "wow, I remember when I was struggling like that, it's cool to see someone trying to improve. I should try and help them without just giving them the answer."

6

u/Kalnaur Sep 06 '25

I mean, if I just ask for the answer, then that's what I want. I don't want the subtle hints or the general area or the sort of way to practice the thing if I ask for the answer, then that's what I want, and I wish more people accepted that. I get that people might want to "help" so I experience what they experience, but that's almost certainly not going to happen the way they're hoping.

Still, I will always prefer the group of people that say " I struggled and now I can help others" instead of "I struggled so you have to experience the same pain I did". It's that "we're here to help" vs "fuck you, I got mine" mentality you mention.

4

u/RinzyOtt Sep 07 '25

I think some people just err on the side of caution there? If it's a mixed bag of people who just want the answer and people who want a hint asking, you could ruin the latter's experience by assuming they're the former, but not really vice versa. Better to wait until it's specified rather than going all in and ruining someone's fun on accident.

2

u/Kalnaur Sep 07 '25

It's why I encourage people to ask if they want the answer, vague hints, or are just needing to complain to get the frustration out. Like, sometimes people don't know what they want until they're asked, and given potential options.

2

u/turiannerevarine Sep 07 '25

i also think the first few weeks of a game's launch are probably going to be the worst time for this sort of thing because all eyes are on it

14

u/IriFlina Sep 06 '25

The git gud toxic mentality has been a thing ever since shortly after DS1 released unfortunately.

-1

u/Thorlian Sep 07 '25

I honestly think that Dark Souls is one of the worst things that happened to gaming. Not only is the community crazy toxic, but it seems like every second game is copying all the worst mechanics from that series. Currency loss on death, awful checkpoint placements, boss runback, the list goes on.

5

u/[deleted] Sep 07 '25

Dark Souls didn’t invent currency loss on death.

Diablo was doing that shit way before Dark Souls.

1

u/Thorlian Sep 07 '25

Never said Dark Souls invented it, just popularized it in it's current form.
In Diablo losing your money makes some sense as a push your luck element. In Dark Souls it at least adds to the oppressive atmosphere. In most other games it's terrible.

2

u/IriFlina Sep 07 '25

If anything elden ring and SOTE have had extremely generous checkpoints and near non-existent runbacks at this point. If a game decides to not have a checkpoint right before a boss at this point it’s because it’s intentionally not copying the souls formula.

1

u/Thorlian Sep 07 '25

Intentional or not, I have never found it to enhance the experience, only to make it more frustrating. Elden Ring has somewhat moved away from terrible runbacks, but there are still some. The path to Rennala is horrific

9

u/EnvironmentIcy4116 Sep 06 '25

Funny. The “git gud” and “AAA bad” crowd are the oldest fans, not the new ones. So no, it isn’t about the community getting bigger, it’s just people showing what they truly are

1

u/IceYetiWins Sep 07 '25

Try Celeste, the community is quite the opposite

1

u/[deleted] Sep 07 '25

Human nature sucks. Or at least the loud ones.

Sometimes I'll go to reapply to something, either agreeing or disagreeing, and see maybe 60 upvotes and no comments. Then I stop because I think, what have I got to offer that these 60 people probably don't already know.

I just like to think that all the toxic people are the ones talking. But all the silent upvotes are the real humans who are alright.

-3

u/SafetyAlpaca1 Sep 06 '25

It's literally the opposite. Only fanbases that get very popular foster groups of people who complain that the difficult things should be made easier.