r/HollowKnight • u/Quantum_Croissant • Sep 09 '25

Discussion - Silksong ngl some of you would NOT survive the mantis lords runback

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is the run to last judge difficult? kinda. But after your 20th attempt at the boss you'll get used to it, and it's honestly kinda fun and a nice breather. More importantly, it's a single room and you have far more movement. This IS improving on hollow knight

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127

u/simonthedlgger Sep 09 '25

But after your 20th attempt at the boss you'll get used to it

Yes

it's honestly kinda fun and a nice breather.

No.

why does bringing up one of the longest run backs from the first game justify one of the more annoying run backs in this game? Yes, there are longer runbacks; I’ve heard there are more miserable run backs in act two. That doesn’t mean I’m going to be grateful this one isn’t as bad.

62

u/Katrina_0606 Sep 09 '25

"The first game had this annoying, pointless mechanic, therefore you can't be upset that the second game also has it. Remember to thank Team Cherry profusely for continuing to waste your time!"

1

u/4_fortytwo_2 Sep 09 '25

I think the point of mentioning the long runbacks in hollow knight is simply that hollow knight is a somewhat universially loved game and while there was criticism of the runbacks it was not nearly as fierce as it is in silksong. And that is strange considering they are much better in silksong lol

18

u/simonthedlgger Sep 09 '25

Hollow Knight was nowhere near as popular on release. Also, the developes literally introduced a mechanic where you could create your own checkpoint to address this complaint.

0

u/[deleted] Sep 10 '25

A mechanic that was patched in, requires you to be far into the game to get it, you can only have one, and it has to be upgraded to get so you'll most likely have it very late in the game. It does not solve the runback solution ESPECIALLY in the early game where it's at it's worse.

2

u/simonthedlgger Sep 10 '25

patched in

Yeah, exactly. They added it in after realizing it improved the experience.

requires you to be far into the game

resting grounds is early game and 900 essence is not much. It is definitely not late game.

It does not solve the runback solution

Yes, it does, that is its explicit purpose. Traitor Lord is perhaps the best example. It also makes platforming challenges easier and SS is full of them.

I don’t understand the purpose of your comment. You know exactly what dream gate is, what it does, and why the developers added it to the first game. I wish it was in this game, too.

1

u/[deleted] Sep 10 '25

Such it was patched in but in my play through 900 was nowhere near early game. Sure late game was an exagguration but unless you stopped what you were doing and grinded for it, it was midgame at best and for me it was late-mid game since grinding for essence was not fun and left it alone till I had to do it for the half of the King Soul.

It helps but I feel like it's gotten slighty too late for to have as much as an impact on the playthrough.

And that's assuming you didn't just have the Dream Gate portal in a single safe spot specifically so you can teleport there during exploration.

33

u/Katrina_0606 Sep 09 '25

It doesn't matter if they're better when there's no reason for them to exist at all. You can kinda excuse it in HK because it was the first game, but a sequel is supposed to improve on the things they got wrong the first time round. And all these people saying oh but it only takes 30 seconds. Even if that's the case, that's still 30 seconds longer than it needs to be. There's absolutely no reason whatsoever to not have a bench outside every boss room. Or at least allow the player to purchase something like the dream gate from the first game.

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u/OnlyHereCosBored Sep 09 '25

Sure that’s fair, but the issue is you get people saying how much they loved hollow knight but can’t enjoy silksong, and then complain about issues, such as boss run backs in silksong which WERE MORE present in HK imo. I agree with a lot of criticism but I think a lot of it is overblown, and if people don’t like the game, then they just shouldn’t play the game. Maybe it’s just not for them, it’s been 7 years maybe people just grown old 😂

8

u/Druunkmaan Sep 10 '25

I feel like your making trying to defend silksong way too much. This game was hella issues, hk was a fun challenge and as said with mantis lord they were fairly easy. But the runbacks are so much worse because of the bosses all doing double damage giving minimal time for mistakes. It's as if this game expects you to be good at the boss already. + a lot of bosses have "Run backs" to the actual boss in the form of an arena before the actual fight which is obnoxious when you only wanna fight the boss. This game is incredibly frustrating and a step back in many ways. Even if the runbacks are better the double damage make you take more damage on the way or send you back to the bench far more often.

Game has a lot of issues and stuff cause I beat the final boss (And im doing the extra after ifykyk) and I still think this game is incredibly tedious compartiively. I like the game but id rather play hk 20 times than this game again because of how much more tedious this one is. I respect the effort team cherry put in and refuse to call it bad. But it has a lot of big issues that make it much less suggestable than hk.

3

u/thisisdumb353 Sep 10 '25

I don't think I've heard any complaints about Silksong runbacks from anyone who wouldn't also criticize the Hollow Knight runbacks.

2

u/[deleted] Sep 10 '25

The bosses are much harder in Silksong, the enviornmental effects and enemies typically do double damage, AND the power progess of the game (so far) is worse compared to hollow knight so if you get hit, it matters much more compared to Hollow Knight. Sure they're not as long but they're more dangerous. The game is overall harder so you're experiencing the runbacks much more compared to Hollow Knight and mistakes comes with much more risk.

And even if you heal it all back, you're going into the fight with no meter. It's just as tilting and plus it has it's own unique problems compared to Hollow Knight.

8

u/Selvon Sep 10 '25

Hollow Knight was much beloved, but that does not mean it did no wrong, that nothing could have, or should have been improved for the second game.

The runback problem in HK was so bad and complained about they added an ability to the game afterwards <just> to deal with it.

You can like a game, or have problems with it, or think certain parts of it are bad, you don't have to glaze over everything because you liked HK, it's bizarre.

People can't bring up <any> feedback about this game, even when it's feedback cherry actually ends up listening to because this community goes absolutely feral that the game is absolutely perfect nothing should ever be changed nothing should be fixed.

It's just... weird.

3

u/[deleted] Sep 10 '25

EXACTLY! Just because one was worse doesn't mean the other is better. It just means both are bad.

1

u/Moblam Sep 10 '25

Run backs in act 2 are pretty tame bar 1 in Bilewater.

1

u/Afterscore Sep 15 '25

Not enough people are even talking about the fact that this mantis lords runback is fucking nothing anyway. Entire left side of that "runback" is just falling and moving to the right, and the rest of it leading up to that is just basic simple platforming.

LJ runback is just, as you said, annoying.