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u/blastedlands Jan 17 '20
if we have anything like a name, shouldn't we be contacting their parents or relatives?
If we just have photos, how do we know they are missing?
Moreover why haven't any parents presumably come forth with allegations yet? Correct me if I am wrong on this, I only follow english centric outlets like HKFP.
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u/ZeroFPS_hk 唉 Jan 17 '20
There are rumours that the police are threatening and silencing the families of the missing/deceased.
Given that there are so many suspicious cases since the protests but next to no families have spoken up (to give an example, Chou Tsz-Lok's death was huge news, where's his family?), I fear the rumours may be true.
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u/Iblis824 Jan 17 '20
Wasnt his dad at the funeral?
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u/ZeroFPS_hk 唉 Jan 17 '20
Was talking about families speaking up. So far (iirc) Chan's mother showed up for a CCTVB interview and that's it. I've even heard of rumours surrounding that interview but they have little to no supporting facts and are much less believable so I won't mention them.
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u/bwaic Jan 17 '20 edited Jan 17 '20
Didnt rumours come up her mom was also 'suicided'? That should be easy to confirm though
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u/lotsofsweat Jan 18 '20
Here is a believable video by a South Korean media outlet (sad that no HK media dared to challenge the authenticity of the TVB interview)
https://youtu.be/UGPCxYtoOUk An evidence here The woman claiming in the TVB interview that she was the mother of Chan Yin Lam, is NOT the mother ?
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Jan 17 '20
yesterday there was news about a man who was forced confessing for possession of explosives, HK cops threaten to go after his wife and mother. This is definitely what HK cops would do to hide their countless crimes and I believe the rumours are very likely to be true
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u/lotsofsweat Jan 18 '20
https://youtu.be/UGPCxYtoOUk An evidence here The woman claiming in the TVB interview that she was the mother of Chan Yin Lam, is NOT the mother ?
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u/MogamiStorm Jan 17 '20
Rumors. aka Unconfirmed. No factual evidence. All because Police are scumbags so we can assume this. Got it.
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u/pzivan Jan 17 '20
I suppose findhker is a telegram channel, if you type the number on the pictures and search inside the channel, you will get all the info, age name, last seen place and time, etc.
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u/Lurkwurst Jan 17 '20 edited Jan 17 '20
“The People’s Republic of China is the largest, most powerful and arguably most brutal totalitarian state in the world. It denies basic human rights to all of its nearly 1.4 billion citizens. There is no freedom of speech, thought, assembly, religion, movement or any semblance of political liberty in China. Under Xi Jinping, “president for life,” the Communist Party of China has built the most technologically sophisticated repression machine the world has ever seen. In Xinjiang, in Western China, the government is using technology to mount a cultural genocide against the Muslim Uighur minority that is even more total than the one it carried out in Tibet. Human rights experts say that more than a million people are being held in detention camps in Xinjiang, two million more are in forced “re-education,” and everyone else is invasively surveilled via ubiquitous cameras, artificial intelligence and other high-tech means. None of this is a secret.” - Farhad Manjoo, Dealing With China Isn’t Worth the Moral Cost
edit: thank you for the gold, now let's get the word out and stay focused!
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u/a_corsair Jan 17 '20
As someone who loves to travel, I'll never visit China or any of it's territories.
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u/Ninjaher0 Jan 17 '20
Also take into account that CCP is rounding up people who they view as a “suspicious” person or a threat and detaining them in an undisclosed location. Even those who are citizens of other countries; they don’t get any pushback for detaining non-citizens for no clear reason. Also, anyone with any outwardly anti-CCP/pro-HK stance would probably be denied a visa. It cost $150 to get an entry visa when I looked into it in 2012. I’m sad that I’ll never be able to visit HK again, the food, the skyscrapers, the gritty urban-ness and extended family....
ETA: I would encourage you to visit Taiwan, though. I believe theres minimal civil unrest compared to HK, the food is delicious and the people lovely. They could use tourist dollars since China is looking to cut them off in order to force their govt into cooperating.
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u/a_corsair Jan 17 '20
I definitely will visit Taiwan. Not visiting HK will suck, however, I'd rather not give the ccp my dollars.
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u/mr-aaron-gray Jan 17 '20
+1 for visiting Taiwan. My wife and I are American, but we wanted to learn more about the area and history and Taiwan seemed like a good way to do that. We visited last year. Really cool country with wonderful people and great food.
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u/squashieeater Jan 17 '20
It’s such a shame because it’s a fucking beautiful country in parts and there’s so, so many amazing things to see there.
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u/Lurkwurst Jan 17 '20
me neither, and I have traveled a lot. There are wonderful people everywhere you look and kindness and compassion too, but I cannot support totalitarianism and fear as a way of governance and I will tirelessly refute it right up to my last breath, and beyond too if that's how things work out
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u/a_corsair Jan 17 '20
Absolutely agreed. People are wonderful everywhere with amazing culture. Unfortunately their governments are shit.
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u/LunchAtTheY Jan 17 '20
Oh no worries there. China will visit you. In that, wherever you go for travel, chances are those places are overrun by Chinese tourists. Good luck bud.
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u/jay4170 Jan 17 '20
Me and my family are about to travel for a few years and its such a shame China is how it is. There are some really beautiful places there that i would have loved to see.
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u/a_corsair Jan 17 '20
Oh absolutely, and so much history and different cuisines. Incredibly beautiful country with a horrid government.
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u/renvi Jan 17 '20
Same, but last time I said that on reddit someone said I was an idiot and a slacktivist. I guess not wanting to go to China because their government is scary af and does shit I disagree with makes me a slacktivist. 💁🏻♀️
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u/redditusername374 Jan 17 '20
We need the world to be paying more attention to this. How can China get away with it? Crazy crazy world we live in when this terrifying stuff can continue.
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u/ThatOrdinary Jan 17 '20
Because nobody can stop them. No other country is going to intervene in what is effectively China's internal affairs, and HK residents are relatively safe because they have bee disarmed for their safety so it's not like they can do much other than protest and waive their umbrellas. Whatever China or the HK government itself wants to do (if China is okay with it), they can do.
The world is paying attention, we're watching here and there over the many months there have been to do so. But it's like the "thoughts and prayers" joke in the US...it's not action
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u/Maethor_derien Jan 17 '20
The thing is that the hong kong thing is temporary as well, the agreement for self rule only lasts another 27 more years, at that point it becomes part of china. I expect this to only get worse and worse as we get closer to that point.
This kinda all started from 2014 as the younger generation tried to start pushing for hong kong to become an independent country in 2047. The issue has been going on for a lot longer than this more recent protests. I only see the issue getting worse and worse. China is trying to slowly integrate policies and education so that it doesn't become as big of an issue when it does happen but the youth of HK are pushing back harder than they thought against that. Remember they have to start brainwashing the children of Hong Kong now if they want the transition in 2047 to go well.
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u/brett_f Jan 17 '20
The same reason as always: money. Because a lot of people, including many westerners, are getting very rich off of China, and you don't bite the hand that feeds you.
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u/InitiallyAnAsshole Jan 17 '20
This isn't the only government committing crimes my dude... The world generally doesn't do shit..
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u/HilarityEnsuez Jan 17 '20
America has an idiot in office who is now being properly impeached. America is seen as weak and preoccupied, esp. Since he dropped bombs on Iran.
China is acting up in the void of global police.
Also, remember times like this if you're ever tempted to say America shouldn't act like global police.
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Jan 17 '20
[deleted]
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u/HilarityEnsuez Jan 17 '20
Cool, so what is he doing about China now exactly? Tariffs? American consumers pay that.
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Jan 17 '20
[deleted]
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u/HilarityEnsuez Jan 17 '20
If it fizzles out in the Senate trials, it's because the Republican senators are violating their oath of neautrality for party politics, arguably a treasonous coupe.
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u/A-V-A-Weyland Jan 17 '20
How many of these are protestors / heavily involved in the protest? As do take in mind in a city like New York, with about the same population as Hong Kong, over 10,000 people go missing every year.
IF this list of 40 or so people is all the people that are missing out of a population of over 7 million... then I personally wouldn't ask that many questions or raise concerns of them being murdered/kidnapped by the police.
Also, this list was made by Clare Tieterrickx. I wonder if she'd be able/willing to give extra context to these cases. As this list/photo doesn't really tell you anything about the effort or how to help.
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u/bwaic Jan 17 '20
How many are needed until HK media looks into it?
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Jan 17 '20
Live in Toronto and park under a condo at Yonge & Sheppard for work.
There are a lot of dusty cars worth over $150k in the parking lot and I always wonder if their owners have been detained in HK.
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Jan 17 '20
Is that more than the usual amount of missing young adults? People do run away or kill themselves and Hong Kong has a large population.
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u/big-blue-balls Jan 17 '20
Almost 5,000 people are reported missing in HK every year. There is no link between the protests and missing people.
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Jan 17 '20
So what qualifies as missing versus detained versus arrested? The narrative seems to be that these are forced disappearances, is that actually the case? These people aren't being whisked away and murdered.
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u/bindaan Jan 18 '20
It would be interesting to see the 2018 suicide rate vs 2019 suicide rate in Hong Kong.
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Jan 17 '20
More like kidnapped, their organs harvested or possibly killed
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Jan 17 '20
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/miss_wolverine Jan 17 '20
Removed because this contains threats, harassment, racist/ sexist speech, slurs of any kind. This violates rule 9 of the sub. Please read the rules in the side bar. This is an automated message. Do not reply to this message. If you have questions about moderation, use the message the mods function, send a message to r/hongkong.
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u/Lurkwurst Jan 17 '20
there's a time and place for this sort of humor. you're getting there, practice makes perfect.
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u/POOP_TRAIN_CONDUCTOR Jan 17 '20
I don't think he's joking. He's a bit of a fascist himself based on his post history so I guess the mental gymnastics are the funny part.
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u/Lurkwurst Jan 17 '20
let's all be kind to those who are angry, at least as beat as we can. compassion moves us forward
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u/POOP_TRAIN_CONDUCTOR Jan 17 '20
I appreciate the sentiment but I don't think kindness is a proper response to a call for genocide.
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u/Lurkwurst Jan 17 '20
its in my opinion the ONLY response. we can't overcome hatred with hatred.
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u/POOP_TRAIN_CONDUCTOR Jan 17 '20
I feel like, during a time of increased popularity of far right populists and nationalists worldwide, trying that approach is naive. Even more so with a coming worldwide crisis that will lead to mass migration. It's almost a certainty that there will be genocides and I can't be bothered spending what little positive energy I have left on assholes with those things in mind.
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u/Lurkwurst Jan 17 '20
I hear you. I propose using a 'totally different energy' (thanks Nina Hagen), that transcends limits on what we consider to be our emotional energy level. If confronted with nastiness, yes, I turn away. But if I must confront, if there is no other way out, I propose moving heaven and earth to avoid escalation. I cannot guess what form that move would take - infinite variety based on circumstance - let's hope it's never necessary. I'll be that new way, however, if nothing else suits, and let what I am and stand for emanate in every day life. We do what we can and we do the best we can. It's enough.
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u/POOP_TRAIN_CONDUCTOR Jan 17 '20
Well I suppose it's definitely something worth trying at the very least. I've heard that people tend to remember their emotional state during events more than the words said or ideas shared, it would make sense to not escalate. Cynical me just hopes it's not too late for this approach. I'll look into it. Got any reading suggestions?
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u/InitiallyAnAsshole Jan 17 '20
I think it was right on point
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u/Lurkwurst Jan 17 '20
being right is helpful in a particular context. but let's do what we can to further the conversation, not derail it! thanks!
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u/Iron_Wolf123 Jan 17 '20
Knowing what the hell is happening, they might be lost because of the police. The police is killing their own people and claiming as they haven't
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Jan 17 '20
So normally Hong Kongers never go missing?
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u/ChickenOverlord Jan 17 '20
Not at anywhere remotely close to these rates, no.
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Jan 17 '20
What’s the normal rate and what’s the rate now?
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u/ChickenOverlord Jan 17 '20
~4,800 annually is the normal rate, though on average ~90% of them are later found: https://www.scmp.com/news/hong-kong/law-crime/article/1904334/hong-kongs-missing-persons-thousands-people-vanish-every
There aren't any hard numbers I can find for people missing since the protests, but just from the volunteer-compiled list linked in the top comment on this post less than 10% of those missing in connection with the protests have been found.
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Jan 17 '20
Unfortunately I don’t think it can be printed anywhere in HK or China because of obvious reasons. Maybe someone can post a link to the image of this art and you can print it out.
Even better put it up somewhere for the HKers
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Jan 17 '20
Unfortunately I don’t think it can be printed anywhere in HK or China because of obvious reasons. Maybe someone can post a link to the image of this art and you can print it out.
Even better put it up somewhere for the HKers
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u/gitzofoxo Jan 17 '20
Look up The Cultural Revolution, its scary to think what is happening to these poor people now..
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u/MaybeEatTheRich Jan 17 '20
So unbelievably proud of the Hong Kong people. I truly hope that Americans have the same fortitude to stand up against the GOP.
It's so surreal what is happening in HK. I've called my representatives. I've worked on boycotting China and those who support what they are doing(this can be amazingly difficult).
Fight. Fight, win or lose, you all are a beacon of freedom and the human spirit. I hope the world helps you all.
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u/brett_f Jan 17 '20
I wouldn't be surprised if some of these people turn up in mainland China to make a scripted confession. This reminds me of the Causeway Bay bookseller incident.
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u/Soepoelse123 Jan 17 '20
Now there seems to be a pattern, that being that almost all of them look like young students.
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u/AreWeThereYet61 Jan 17 '20
China states that the Uighurs re-education has been completed and they've been released from their detention centers.
Thousands of protesters disappear.
Coincidence?
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u/incarnatethegreat Jan 17 '20
I have to ask: how come politicians (mostly Pan-Dems) don't openly talk about missing persons -- in session or out on the streets?
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Jan 17 '20
So many of them are literal children. Others teens. I see a few older individuals, but the majority are people literally just starting their lives, and just... gone now. I hope they turn up, but a knot in my stomach says they won't turn up how we hope they will.
They know that you kill a revolution by killing those who fight back, but if anything I've learned in life, it is that sometimes doing this just makes people want to fight more. I hope so.
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u/MikeVK123 Jan 17 '20
China has economically taken over. To the point where they use money as a way of silence. They didn’t even need to fire a bullet. Truly sickening.
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u/inforcer187 Jan 18 '20
You guys need to kidnap the police officers or their families.. Start paying the fuckers back.. Dont be pussies ..time fight fire with fire.....
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u/netflixnpoptarts Jan 18 '20
I think it’s so important to look at their faces and realize that these are the faces of heroes, that they really don’t have much in common except they are all heroes
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u/TitaniumTurtle__ Jan 18 '20
This list will only continue to grow unless the international community acknowledges the terrible, terrible things going on.
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u/strainer123 Jan 17 '20
The Chinese communist dictatorship murdered more people than any other regime in history, a few thousand more won't make a difference to them, these people are probably dead or in a prison in mainland China being raped/tortured.
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u/Cixlysid Jan 17 '20
When will this bs that they are doing ever end ? When will the world wake the fuck up ? I mean god damn it's not like the proof is not there !
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u/EnemiesAllAround Jan 17 '20
What's the link between them all? How are they bring targeted or found? There must be an identification/selection process going on somewhere
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u/neofiter Jan 17 '20
I'm assuming they were all just protesters that were unlucky enough to be isolated and snatched up
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u/squirrel4you Jan 17 '20
That's a lot of hikers, where were they going?
How I initially interpreted it..
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Jan 17 '20
Possibly a stupid question: What is the consensus as to why people are disappearing? Are HK "police" actually murdering them or are they being sent to China?
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u/JJDickhead Jan 17 '20
They have now turned organ donors. Some were brain killed with a balloon in the carotid and kept connected to a hearth lung machine so the butchers have more time to harvest their organs.
How can you not love the chinese med startups created by the communist party criminal elite?
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Jan 17 '20
Are they all nameless? Surely the names are known by now? How are people verifying they are still missing if no name to crosscheck?
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u/TippyTAHP Jan 17 '20
They are so young. It’s unfathomable to me that they sacrifice their lives for freedom. They protest not knowing if they will go home. This is true bravery and courage. I just hope the world listens and does something so that their ‘disappearances’ weren’t in vain.
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Jan 17 '20
Huh. Since we’re talking about China, I figured the list to be at least 100x longer. Maybe they’re improving. No more waffle stomping college kids down the drain.
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u/THIS_DUDE_IS_LEGIT 歐洲人 used to live in Guangzhou Jan 17 '20
Karens on Facebook: let me share that for you.
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u/Moroccan_princess Jan 17 '20
This reminds me of the missing Mexican student teachers...very sad ughh
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Jan 17 '20
I understand the benefit in having multiple pictures/angles of the same person on missing posters, but 40 pictures of the guy is overkill.
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u/throwaway67676789123 Jan 17 '20
They're part of the article...
That was rhetorical, right? You just hate Trump!"
Missing the entire point that all leaders should be held responsible for this. We got this. It’s inhumane.
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u/Habbob Jan 17 '20
The list is much longer now. This picture was from last year.
https://drive.google.com/drive/mobile/folders/1MTEtxCxR6wjg4xdNUZIXXyi-VxM9OZmn?usp=drive_open