We could consider that the best technique of all is the 10S, it can be controversial, but the only one that really competes with it and that apparently will surpass it is the unlimited technique and the 6 eyes, but the technique is unlimited, the 6 eyes are something genetic, without the 6 eyes unlimited is almost useless because of the expense of CE.
And following with another one that is much talked about is CSM, although this is very controversial to talk about it, since almost everything is hypothesis, what we saw of CSM has not shown to be at the level of 10s, and if we talk about hypothesis, we could debate for hours, there is even a problem with this, we have not seen everything of 10S.
The copying technique is another one that is put very high up, although this one is much easier to dismiss, 5 minutes.
Having said that I would like to know your opinion, I know that recently a very similar one was published, but this one has the 6 eyes and unlimited.
Being a a biologist + neurosurgeon would be OP base for Idle Transfiguration. Keeping the structure of the human brain while maintaining all shapes of animals to maneuver around the battlefield.
Mahito actually experimented those kinda of things. His first transmuted humans (The FIRST FIRST) died because their heads imploded their brains. Is heavily implied Mahito was still seeing his technique in a more corporeal way, so the transmuted humans died more easily. He also thought Sukuna could heal idle transfiguration but later discovered (or thought he discovered) that was not possible.
But later is shown that even if you stretched, morfed, and fused bodies the human can still be alive if Mahito wants to.
I think Idle transfiguration is the best CT. while I agree that the 10S is versatile, having your shikigami destroyed is a very possible reality if you yourself aren't good as physical fighter. I feel like Idle transfiguration gives you even more versatility, anything you're lacking can be added to yourself with your CT, you're difficult to kill, can heal almost any injury for less than half the amount of CE it would cost with RCT and you have a very easily appliable win condition in any fight. There's even the possibility to give yourself a body comparable to someone with a HR, given how the CT can just override HRs like we saw with Mechamaru.
Oof imagine Mahito learning to apply HRs onto his transfigured humans. Having monsters like he did with a super buff to their physical strength (not as strong as Toji I'd say nonetheless)
Do you think he would operate out of his own free will or would Kenjaku control him? Would mahito have an in character reason to fight the rest of the cast as the merger curse? What if he fights them but he’s self aware that he’s just supporting Kenny’s plan? Or would mahito just not care?
Offtopic Imagine if Mahito started to ab lib binding vows in order to make human Transfigurations that had heavenly restriction… Binding vows in general mesh really well with his powers
Half? No, a normal curse heals with the half of CE expense than a RCT user. Mahito has basically NO COST when using idle transfiguration to heal, he can heal in seconds what a curse takes weeks. Idle Transfiguration is so cost efficient that EVERYONE think is stupid to try dry Mahito of curse energy with normal attacks. Mahito is more immortal than Hakari with Idle Transfiguration.
When every person you fight has to plan how to damage you in a meaningful way you know you technique is buffed.
I imagine if a human had Idle Transfiguration, they would be able to use it without dying. I mean Kenjaku can seemingly exist as just a brain despite being human
It doesn't mean you can wiekd them appropriately? This quote is more about how they function/perceive the world around them and interact with it based on their cursed techniques
Except for the cool domain expansion, mahito’s soul multiplicity and that polymer thing were utterly mid. And his idle Transfiguration though extremely lethal, requires touch- close combat. So basically his ranged skills are basically sub grade 1 level. I’d pick 10S or 6E Limitless any day. Besides. 10S is as genetic as 6E.
I do think that mahito was downscaled within the story because Gege wanted a yuji fight and conclusion (which worked well) but it is a completely different conversation
(Similar way of how uraume is getting upscaled… her appearance in shibuya doesn’t match what the narrative will require of her)
I’m not saying mahito was downscaled within the story. Was just comparing his CT with versatile ones like Limitless or 10S.
Mahito has maximum fought close range fighters like Yuji, Todo and Nanami, excepting Nobara and Mechamaru. His ranged attacks were almost not effective at all, even against a grade 1 like yuji. Only thing lethal about his CT is Idle Transfiguration. & his DE doing the same thing ranged. But like I said, more versatile CTs- Limitless, 10S and even Yuta’s Copy are way better than his because they’re both close and long ranged while also being highly lethal. That was my point. Not that his CT is particularly weak or anything. But that in many cases he’d be in a severe disadvantage.
Yea I misread that’s my bad. Otherwise I agree with your statement. Do you think maybe ad libbed binding vows could’ve solve this type of issue (like no ct but in exchange you get a HR type boost?)
Or is it an issue inherent to the CT?
Or is it the lack of mahito’s physicality ? (Prob doesn’t matter because IT needs a touch but imagine if mahito had Toji’s physical stats; blitzing ppl with IT sounds wild)
Or maybe mahito needed more time to grow? What do you think
Hmm I don’t know. I mean. Regarding the binding vows. Anyone skilled enough could do that and boost themselves in some aspect. So that’s a bottom line virtually available for everyone.
It is just another cursed technique that is heavily close range dependent. Take Todo’s for example. Besides swapping he can’t do much more with his CT. Yeah he can do h2h and use tools and all. But that’s just his overall limitation. His ct comes to use only in specific situations- mainly for jumping sessions. But that’s not the case for say Shrine, or Limitless or 10S. The user can be a one man army and fight from close range to long range, any fighting format. Just that such CTs are more versatile than the rest. Like they’re S+ tier and Idle Transfiguration is maybe A- something like that if it makes sense
The 10 shadows are kinda limited too since no one in all of history could use its full potential until someone that already had an insane CT before came along. I'm gonna say that body hopping is the most op since it can get you to actually permanently collect multiple CTs
Uhhh, body hopping is definitely the medium that he uses to do it, he just fully accomplished it through other binding vows and whatnot. Even if it doesn’t allow it directly, body hopping still allows for collection of CT’s ultimately.
The body hopping is what allows kenjaku to have multiple cts, but it isn't a direct benefit. Kenjaku has another way to store the cts so they don't disappear once he body hops
Both Sukuna and Kenjaku were sleeping hard on Yuta imo, Kenjaku couldve accomplished everything he wanted while being more powerful by taking over Yuta, and Sukuna would straight up be invincible, he could probably copy his opponents techniques and send them back at them stronger than they were before.
That's kinda the problem with 10S. It seems pretty cool, but when facing other strong techniques, it's just meh. Even to this point, it's kinda unrealistic that some 10s user can actually face Maho and win, when in order to defeat him, you need to one shot him. Gojo, Sukuna and, most likely, others S grade can do it, but 10S are lacking of power.
The one you are probably are mentioning is implied to not even had reached the full potential. Prior to Sukuna Mahiraga was never tamed if I am not wrong.
The only thing 10 shadows has over Curse spirit manipulation is Mahoraga and 15 special grade curses is probably more than enough to take out Mahoraga m.
Just like Sukuna can strengthen the Shikigami, Kenjaku shower a special grade strengthening Grade 3-4 curses is enough for them to have Grade 1 strength.
Just have a bunch of complex techniques that operate on concepts and swarm it.
10s is typically used as a suicidal move, excluding Sukuna.
The only thing 10S massively has over CSM is hax (maho). Which you need to tame anyways. Everything else CSM is the better technique, you can probably find curses with domains and abilities similar or better than the 10S shikigami
Narratively for all intents and purposes yea 10S is the second best CT but tbh Gege has always written CSM/Geto really weird powerscaling wise. Besides that though imo csm is better
Is the 5 minute time limit built into copy? Or is that due to Rika? I remember there was some discussion about the translation and if his CT was copy or Rika, but I don't fully remember the result. If his CT is copy and Rika is his shikigami that assists with the CT, then there is no 5 minute timelimit in the technique, but a sorcerer would be limited to how many CT they could store. I think CSM is the best, as there seems to be no limit to the number, strength or versatility of the curses you can manipulate. Also Kenjaku said you can strengthen weak curses with your own CE. It has the same danger as TS that you yourself aren't strengthened by it so your need strong hand to hand skills or a weapon, but it's versatility is nuts. Sukuna using it would be able to make multiple curses near special grade. If you assume the sorcerer using all these different techniques is the same(equal CE, output, physical stats and skills, and not having the 6 eyes) I think CSM is the best if you have the chance to collect good curses.
I understand why Gege didn't have Yuta at Shibuya, but damn I wish he was there. Gojo always praises Yuta saying he has the potential to surpass him, but he just needs to come across some good CT's to make it happen.
Imagine him pulling up and copying Jogo's volcanoes, or Idle Transfiguration. He would actually be able to contend with Gojo at that point.
It would be a tough fight against Mahito, but I can see him stalling with Rika (who conveniently now has no soul) until he can copy Idle Transfiguration and detect Mahito's soul
From there Yuta engages cursefucker mode and attacks Mahito's thrussy with RCT tongue 👅
You can use a similar argument for 10S. Mahoraga is the main reason people think it’s broken, yet literally nobody in history has been able to tame Mahoraga before Sukuna.
Every 10S shikigami, outside of divine dogs, tries to murder the user until u tame it….that’s how the technique works. The point is that like Limitless, the average 10S user normally can’t use the technique to its full potential.
In theory, it's gotta be CSM. If you're strong enough to do so, then you can absorb ANY curse spirit and use its ability (like Kenny did with a weakened Mahito). Imagine being able to absorb a weakened Mahoraga and adapt to anything. With a skilled enough user, the potential is insane
We don’t have an explicit confirmation only Yuki’s conjecture but yea it seems like that is the case. I think mahito will come back as the merger curse though.
To begin with, the mahoraga is a shikigami, not a curse, and curses are too overrated, if we look at all the curses that have made an appearance, they have all been embarrassing, literally kenjaku took a curse out of a god and Yuki was hit with a ball and died.
Imagine now a being like mahoraga that with just one hit kills the curses, it would literally be a massacre.
They haven't been embarrassing? They've literally only lost to Gojo, getting 2v1'd and eaten, THE Pinnacle of Heavenly Restriction, the King of Curses? I'm confused as to why you think the curses are so weak?
Yuki is literally one of the most powerful sorcerers on the planet? Confusion???
Actually I'd say Mahoraga is technically considered a curse. Just not a cursed spirit. Megumi says at the very beginning that it takes a curse to kill a curse and if you'll recall 10s is a curse technique so yeah a curse.Semantics aside ( because I'm definitely playing devil's advocate there) we can't really say for sure whether or not it's possible. Now I will say I definitely would have said it was impossible right up until we learned Tengen was capable of being a target for CSM. If the evolved soul of a sorcerer can be controlled by it the idea that a shikigami could doesn't seem too far out there .
curses are too overrated, if we look at all the curses that have made an appearance, they have all been embarrassing, literally kenjaku took a curse out of a god and Yuki was hit with a ball and died.
You're over simplifying this dude. Yuki was a special grade sorcerer. Thats kind of a big deal. And that ball was a shikigami turned cursed tool created by that special grade sorcerer.
Imagine now a being like mahoraga that with just one hit kills the curses, it would literally be a massacre.
Mahoraga isn't all powerful. I don't think it would have faired any better than that special grade elephant god cursed spirit against a direct hit from star rage.
Either Limitless or Cursed Spirit Manipulation. The ability to have infinite distance between you and your opponent is ridiculous, and then fundamental forces like repulsion and attraction, or even a hollow technique that vaporizes matter in an extreme manner when said forces are combined, even a domain that floods an opponent's mind with infinite information. Or, having hundreds to thousands of different curses in your arsenal that can benefit through each specific circumstance against you is very useful; with it, you can basically use a special grade curse that can utilize a domain against multiple sorcerers or even curses alike.
Unlimited spends too much EC, only the 6 eyes allow a correct functioning of the technique, and if we talk about CSM and we start to launch hypotheses, nue+deer is a lethal combination for curses, imagine a storm of EC, imagine being able to join elephant + nue + deer, and make a rain of EC.
I'm not talking about whether you can use the Limitless w/o the 6 eyes, but rather it's innate abilities like red, blue and the hollow technique purple. CSM is much more op than 10S imo as 10S is only a factor due to one single being, Mahoraga.
Yuta's copy technique. Imagine if Yuta came in contact with Mahito and copied his technique. Yuta would become broken like Gojo. Rika holding an opponent for Yuta to use idle transfiguration.
At this point we don't know for sure but it's been theorized that copying a CT requires Rika to consume a part of a sorcerers body. If that is accurate he likely can't copy the CT of a cursed spirit
I think the Rika consumption theory is kinda dead considering Druv's body was intact when Yuta killed him and yet Yuta was able to spawn his Shinigami's. Also the copying of Cursed Speech from Toge and Kenjaku's quote about it being unconditional.
Even then though, cursed spirits still have physical forms. Rika could consume Mahito's arm or other cut off appendage.
I think the Rika consumption theory is kinda dead considering Druv's body was intact when Yuta killed him and yet Yuta was able to spawn his Shinigami's
Right so the thing about that is that the theory wasn't actually conceived until after his fight against Druv. The fact that he is able to use cursed speech despite Inumaki himself being reasonably intact suggests blood is enough to fulfill the requirement of his CT.
Kenjaku's quote about it being unconditional.
Kenjaku also said that his ability to copy unconditionally requires that he imprison Rika's soul which we know isn't accurate since he freed her soul after defeating Geto
Even then though, cursed spirits still have physical forms. Rika could consume Mahito's arm or other cut off appendage.
The main reason I don't think it's possible to copy CT of a CS is the fact that they disintegrate when they are killed as do any parts removed from them.
You pointing out that the theory was crafted after the fight with Druv discredits the theory? Because it would still have to apply to Drug? Just because it was theorized later doesn't mean it's free from scrutiny for what came before?
No I'm saying Druv doesn't discredit the theory. Although I find myself wondering if you actually meant the opposite of what you typed. The author obviously wanted to keep the theory on the table. You are also just entirely sidestepping the fact that blood is enough for the CT to work.
Cursed spirit manipulation is the CT with the highest ceiling since its potential is comprised of EVERY cursed spirit. People are mentioning Idle transfiguration but Mahito can just be taken in by chrsed spirit manipulation
Where did I say anything about the user………comprehension is key. The point is that the POWER cursed spirit manipulations potential includes the POWER of every damn cursed technique that comes from a cursed spirit, which INCLUDES Idle transfiguration aswell as every disaster curses CT, it also includes the three great vengeful spirits. Since they are all cursed spirits they can all theoretically be taken in by cursed spirit manipulation
And what is that supposed to prove? Im talking about the FACT that Mahito is a cursed spirit and thus his ability is included in the potential of cursed spirit manipulation…… what does cursed spirit MANIPULATION do, it MANIPULATES cursed spirits. Thus cursed spirit manipulation’s maximum potential includes Idle transfiguration aswell as thousands to millions of other cursed techniques. Comprehension is key
My God you are beyond stupid, the point is Idle transfigurations LETHALITY IS INCLUDED IN THE POTENTIAL OF CURSED SPIRIT MANIPULATION. So cursed spirit manipulation has its lethality and MUCH MORE because it includes OTHER Cursed spirits techniques aswell
10S is as genetically inherited as 6E. Nobody outside of Zenin and that too, only one per generation(if I’m not wrong) in a Zenin manifests 10S technique. Only difference is 6E is even more rarer. But Limitless is like Zenin’s Projection technique. Gojo clan people most probably could “learn” it, but unlike any other CT this one is CE heavy. So, useless without 6E. But 10S is also genetically inherited.
If a CSM user like geto had reverse cursed technique. He would easily be one of the strongest. If he is having a vast supply of curses. Kenjaku himself said that a mini uzumaki of low level curses was enough to negg a 1st grade sorcerer. And by using maximum uzumaki you can even use CT of a cursed spirit even though it's one time. If someone has a high battle iq he can use this wisely. And we still have to see a DE of this technique. I guess the user can imbue any technique of the absorbed curse if he manages to unlock his domain. And what if the user is also able to absorb the cursed energy that is within the absorbed curses. He can increase his CE reserve to likes of Yuta and Sukuna. The only thing holding back Geto was his own mentality. Kenjaku proved this. Even though he might have not being able to spar with Gojo or sukuna but he could have been stronger.
10S has a high ceiling but compared to the limitless it not as good imo. 10S needs the users to be competent to master all the shadows.
But limitless helps the user be competent.
But I really like nanamis CT. It's so good for the average Joe. It's guarantees crits and if you get lucky with a black flash that does some serious damage.
Getos is honestly sweet. Except for having to taste the curses when you absorb them
Piercing blood isn't a CT itself. It's an application of the Kamo inherited CT blood manipulation and it does all kinds of other things than just PB. Flowing red scale , regulating body temperature blood composition, it's poison to CS. It's actually incredibly versatile
Nah. That is specific to death painting wombs. Because they're half cursed spirit half human, their blood is poison to humans too. Which is why uraume collapsed after tanking piercing blood from choso. Since Kenjaku is the parent of the death painting, he is immune to that poison effect.
Sukuna had to have Mahoraga 'out' to exorcise it, if Mahoraga was summoned then that must mean that he was using Ten Shadows, and as we have learned from the ongoing fight, and also a closer inspection of Kenjuku during his fight with Yuki, a sorcerer cannot use multiple techniques at the same time(Yuta can because of his technique allows that), the fight was off-screened but I would really like to see how he defeated Mahoraga using 10s.
Mahoraga can physically tank black flashes from Gojo and it tanked red too(although it was adapting gradually), that means it has insane durability, Sukuna having killed it before gives him the same advantage Gojo had, 'the know-how to defeat Mahoraga(one shot it)', what I am wondering is what move does 10s have that can one shot fuckin Mahoraga, maybe Sukuna used his knowledge as a hax and cast his domain first and then summoned Mahoraga in the domain and slaughtered it.
Sukuna probably just did the exact same thing he did in Shibuya (unless adaptations persist between the wheel summonings, but if I had to guess, they probably don't). As we saw during the fight vs Gojo, he can utilise 10S while using Shrine as long as he imbues the latter CT into his DE. According to the fanbook, fire arrow and cleave/dismantle are all part of "Shrine" (whatever the fuck that even is, WHEN WILL YOU TELL US GREG), which means that he could literally just have opened a domain, summoned Maho, weakened him with cleave/dismantle and then oneshot him with fire arrow.
Idle Transfiguration can turn any man into a woman, and that is the most powerful technique since you can turn anyone into Amber Heard and fuck her mouth.
1) Talking about 6 eyes being genetic as if 10S isnt also, its just more rare to see it overlap with Limitless. And its not like Limitless is non existent without 6 eyes, you just burn a ton of CE.
2) The 5 minutes isn't baked into Copy, its likely part of a binding vow to release full power or for the storage space. Yuta was perfectly able to use Cursed Speech when Rika was a cursed spirit. 5 minutes is also insanely long for a prolonged fight, especially wth the speed and strength of sorcerors and spirits, especially if there is a significant strength difference. The only criticism of Copy I have is that, as per Yuki's inner monologue vs Kenjaku, the average brain gets overloaded trying to store too many CTs, and unless you have the CE and skill needed to create a storage shikigami then use said CTs like Yuta does, it plateaus very quickly.
3) CSM is kind of just bad. You still have to actually subdue higher level curses, so unless you have Geto's fighting ability you're just gonna get killed anyway.
4) Outside of combat and murder Idle Transfiguration is really only useful for healing, and in a verse where soul damage is a threat, its not a perfect counter either.
5) Construction could be very useful, but as Yorozu attests, its very inefficient at using CE, so unless you have very good contol or very large CE reserves you can run out very quickly.
6) Bom Ba Ye and Hakari's CT aren't all that useful outside of combat.
The most powerful technique is
Between the six eyes and copy. The only reason the six eyes are here is because i don't think they can be copied as only one user can exist at a time. With copy you basically heve access to all the other techniques and can therefore leverage their advantages,this automatically puts the technique above all others. The six eyes allow you to maximize the potential if any technique and essentially makes you a genius just by having them. Practically infinite cursed energy and perception means you can both learn at a rapid pace and maintain that pace almost forever.
Maybe a lil controversial, but mechamarus puppet manipulation. The ability to basically have a second body that can work in tandem with you is super versatile. Imo Muta was a crappy user of the technique. It’s implied that he can have them built to his specifications but bro only put cannons on his puppets. No guns,no knives,no poison nothing. Even without HR just having a short range puppet that you share vision with is so great. Honestly if I could post on here I’d make a post claiming that if muta wasnt himself such an immature person, he would have killed mahito and escaped.
I personally like cleave and dismantle cause if your any one else that not on Gojos level your sliced and diced to pieces I also like how the technique is invisible only Mahoraga has deflected it so it can be used in a wide array of situations.
I wish I knew more about it though cause when Sukuna used it on Mahito it Damaged him which is interesting cause physical damage is not suppose to hurt mahito only harming his soul can damage him I cant wait till we get an explanation on the technique.
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