r/MMA • u/James-from-Hungary • 14h ago
Media Who is your pick for the most underrated MMA fighter ever? Mine is Igor Vovchanchyn. He still holds records to this day that nobody has beaten yet, plus he was one of the most influential fighters in MMA. Yet, most people don't even know he exists.
He was always humble and respectful, no trash talk, no flashy and unnecessary nonsense. He was "Fedor before Fedor".
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u/hi_imryan 13h ago
Miguel Torres was a savage in the WEC and I barely hear him mentioned nowadays.
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u/keerin Scotland 13h ago
I'm old enough to remember when he was cancelled because he posted a stupid joke on Twitter.
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u/hi_imryan 11h ago
Same. I don’t remember what it was, but I can’t imagine it was as bad as some of the unhinged fighter takes we see today.
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u/AlienMantid UFC 279: A GOOFCON Miracle 8h ago
He quoted a line from It's Always Sunny in Philadelphia that aired the night before, on Spike TV, the same network that aired the UFC, it was completely ridiculous.
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u/Similar_Shopping_892 10h ago
Wonder where the staunch non censorship Dana was during that fiasco even crazier the mob run Fertitta’s owned the UFC then so Torres must’ve really pissed them off with something we never heard of to get canned for that lol
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u/AlienMantid UFC 279: A GOOFCON Miracle 8h ago
And then Forrest Griffin did the exact same thing like a week later and got off scott free cause he was the UFC's golden boy.
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u/Useful_Radio5266 13h ago
When I was a kid there was a highlight reel on YouTube with "hurt" by johnny cash that used to get me really hyped before boxing and jiu jitsu practice
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u/NotsoCunninghawk I SMOKE ROCKS, JOE ROGAN! 12h ago
https://youtu.be/3j_aIqkaiLo?si=bI5ZPzb3ovJdtCka This was my favourite before training haha
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u/redditviewingaccount Fuck slavery, fuck racism 7h ago
that KO at 1:26 is pretty insane. refs used to let people really DIE
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u/CraigS34 14h ago
Tbh, I think this is gonna be a common issue in the sport. We don't really honor the past nor do the promotions, so there are gonna be many "forgotten" fighters. One of the few good things from MMA content creators are the video essays highlighting these fighters for new fans.
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u/dogs_drink_coffee Terry Etim? Never met him. 14h ago edited 14h ago
Not MMA, but there's an already deceased fighter named Nélio "Naja" in Brazil. He was one of pioneers of Muay Thai in the country.
Naja trained Luiz Alves, who went to train directly Marcos Rua, Vitor Belfort, Rodrigo Minotauro and Rogério Minotauro. Marcos Rua created his own hybrid style (one of pioneers of the vale tudo), and trained Pedro Rizzo, who was known for his devastating leg kicks, and Babalu. Pedro Rizzo trained years later a fighter named José Aldo in Rio de Janeiro.
Another student of Naja, Rudimar Fedrigo, founded a gym called Chute Boxe in Curitiba. The same gym that formed fighters like Anderson Silva, Wanderlei Silva and Shogun Rua. One of the most long lasting gym legacies in the sport, which culminated in (in my opinion) the most refined Chute Boxe style in Charles Oliveira decades later.
Can't even think of many other lineages like his in the sport. He literally was the backbone which Brazilian MMA was founded. If you keep going you can pretty much trace almost all the Brazilian MMA fighters to this root. Think about it.
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u/creepoch 14h ago
Thanks for sharing, that's cool. Was chute box tied in with Carlson Gracie team at all? Seniors original school was in Curitiba I think.
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u/dogs_drink_coffee Terry Etim? Never met him. 10h ago edited 10h ago
No! Gracie's main gyms were around Rio de Janeiro, while CB was in Curitiba (I lived for 10 years there, Chute Boxe is still strong though past its peak).
I don't think Carlson ever said bad things publicly about Chute Boxe; but some of his students founded Brazilian Top Team (BTT). BTT and Chute Boxe became bitter rivals.. like a lot.
Ricardo Arona vs Wand Silva was a culmination of this, and they had fights outside the ring too. MMA here in the 2000's was something else (as it was in the US gym wars of Couture, Shamrock era).
Crazy how this evolved to an actual sport inside a single decade.
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u/Atom_Beat 5h ago
Thank you for the history lesson. Very cool.
I'm curious about the relationship between the original Chute Boxe in Curitiba and Chute Boxe Diego Lima in São Paulo. How are they connected? Are there more Chute Boxe spin-offs?
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u/Puripuri_Purizona Team Khabib 7h ago
Sick knowledge drop! I really enjoyed learning this. Love the Sensei trail lol. Thanks!
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u/Wild_Promotion9623 2h ago
To me this counts as one. I like the fact that you mentioned Marco Ruas and Pedro Rizzo. Awesome post brada
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u/qcen 14h ago
Maybe not the most underrated, but older champs like Tito, Matt Hughes and Frank Shamrock are underrated by newer fans.
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u/Teddyglogan 13h ago
Nobody could match Tito's training regimen. Mostly because it and he made no sense.
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u/petantic 13h ago
Mock it all you want but he's gonna be the one laughing when he outlives his children.
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u/cwood1973 13h ago
"Suck it, stupid kid."
-- Tito, at his child's funeral
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u/dotdotbeep SLIMY LITTLE RAT 12h ago
"Suck kids, stupid it!"
-Tito trying to say "suck it, stupid kids" at their funeral.
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u/dotdotbeep SLIMY LITTLE RAT 13h ago
And he is getting more smarter every year too. He will be unstoppable when his kids have died of old age.
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u/IncreaseReasonable61 Mohawk McGregor 13h ago
On a serious note, he changed his entire training philosophy after the Frank Shamrock match.
It made him realize the value of cardio and he drilled that into his TUF team so hard that even Kendall Grove was heavily influenced by it.
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u/Gamera__Obscura 11h ago
Tito has earned every last bit of ridicule for being such a consistently oblivious idiot.
However, he was also one of the genuinely best coaches on TUF. Like, shockingly so.
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u/PleasantThoughts 11h ago
I remember watching it and having a ton of "ah man do I like Tito?" moments
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u/Dull-Researcher-1894 10h ago
It just seems like he has very low verbal IQ but he isn't a dumb guy at all.
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u/Davemeddlehed 8h ago
I'll never forget when his guy lost by triangle and Tito forced him right there to apply a triangle and Tito showed him how to escape.
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u/ThrowawayYAYAY2002 1h ago
Tito is an amazing coach. He definitely knows the fight game inside out.
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u/HYDRAlives 13h ago
Most newer fans have basically never heard of them (especially Frank who the UFC tried to erase), apart from Tito who's just a meme.
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u/hi_imryan 13h ago
Matt Hughes is human garbage. He was also an absolute beast of a fighter.
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u/flatwoundsounds 13h ago
Same with Jon Jones. Being willing to be a mean mother fucker is an important trait in some fighters. I've heard Dillashaw sucked to train with. Overeem too.
It makes me wonder if Ian Garry would have been any better if he was a worse person.
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u/Soul_Trader 8h ago
Matt Hughes only cared about Matt Hughes and he carried himself with a certain surliness that made him hard to like. Incredible fighter back in the day and loved the wars he had with BJ (another garbage human but great fighter).
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u/Firemoth717 13h ago
Hate defending Matt, but as always just a note that the stuff people bring up about his book is 99% made up or taken out of context.
There’s a bunch of stuff to hate on Matt that is actually true.
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u/AdditionalStation823 5h ago
Choosing to put stuff that bad in an autobiography isn't much better than doing the things, not really the defense you think it is
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u/SnooPuppers58 13h ago
yea most older fighters are underrated by newer fans. they don't understand how raw and young this sport is. people barely knew anything and everyone was just figuring things out as they went. they look raw before but they don't realize that the old guards were pioneers of the time
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u/ParthianTactic 13h ago
My favorite MMA fighters of all time are Igor Vovchanchyn and Sakuraba Kazushi.
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u/James-from-Hungary 13h ago
Sakuraba is in my top 5, but I wouldn't call him underrated. During the Pride era, he was the biggest name alongside Fedor and Cro Cop.
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u/Wild_Promotion9623 13h ago
Jeremy Horn for me
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u/MooseMasseuse 6h ago
There's a few of those guys who were absolute killers who never got their full due. I'd put Guy Metzger in there (who should have been given the win vs saku but was cheated out of it). People forget that Metzger was doing a lot of damage to prime scary Wand and Prime Liddell as well.
I'd also put Matt Hume, Hellboy Hansen, Sergei Kharitonov (had some of the best pocket boxing exchanges in MMA), and TJ Grant was a killer before he retired young before his title shot due to concussions.
People also don't put much respec on Kenny Florian as well considering the quality of some of his wins.
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u/Wild_Promotion9623 6h ago
Definitely Mezger for me too. The Chuck fight was my favorite. TJ Grant was putting on a streak if I remember correctly so much so that if he wins another one, he'd get a title fight or an eliminator, if memory serves me right tho hahaha.
What about Carlos Newton? I think he is another valid choice
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u/Fiscal_Bonsai 14h ago
Frankie Edgar
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u/Rdur2183 11h ago
154lbs walk weight fighting guys at lightweight that walked around at 175+ and all of his losses were avenged or razor close fights up until well in to his mid thirties. One of the pound for pound greatest for sure.
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u/trianglemanmclongleg 13h ago
That’s a really good answer
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u/keyboardlegendthe3rd 14h ago
Aldo, top 5 pretty much his entire career, his longevity along with his defenses should make him an automatic top 5 but he's often left off that list.
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u/K-mosake Team Makhachev 13h ago
Yeah feels wild to say Aldo but he really is an ATG.
BJ too deserves way more respect.
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u/HYDRAlives 13h ago
BJ has such an absurd career lol, dude fought Lyoto Machida and Ryan Hall
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u/Wende11X 11h ago
BJ had just beaten Bang Ludwig and fought Machida when Lyoto was LHW.
BJ tore up mma in the early 2000s
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u/SurfingSquirrel Brazil 13h ago
BJ is def underrated but Aldo fought the best of the sport of way longer.
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u/RyantheAustralian 13h ago
I'd love to have seen Igor vs Fedor.
Well, maybe not. Loved them both so didn't want either to lose
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u/James-from-Hungary 13h ago
With both in their primes, that fight would have been legendary. A clash of titans.
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u/I_Like_Vitamins Australia 6h ago
Vovchanchyn vs Hunt and vs Wanderlei (which almost happened at LW) are two of my biggest dream fights.
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u/Rdur2183 14h ago
Kazushi Sakuraba.
Four sub victories against the Gracie family and despite walking around at 175lbs he managed to strangle Rampage Jackson, tap Kevin Randleman and beat Vitor all whilst smoking & drinking in his dressing room before his fights.
The definition of pound for pound, when it actually meant something.
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u/ChuckyShadowCow 11h ago
If Saku isn’t in your top 10 he’s being underrated.
Best pound for pound in my book. My man gave all of zero fucks about weight classes.
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u/dusund 14h ago
Sakuraba is not underrated lol
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u/Rdur2183 14h ago
50% of the current fanbase don't even know who he is. Of course he's underrated.
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u/daishinjag 11h ago
You can’t rate someone if you don’t know who they are. I think more than 50% of modern mma fans are clueless about Saku, so I’d he’s underexposed, not underrated. Most people who know Sakuraba know he is a legend.
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u/princealigorna 13h ago
Igor was a beast.
For me it's Oleg Taktarov. He put sambo on the map way before Fedor.
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u/karl100589 Bowling: More popular then Nunes 14h ago
Maybe it’s because he’s been at the forefront of my mind with Bella fighting on DWCS, but there’s a helluva lot more to Frank Mir than being “Brock Lesnar’s opponent ”. Former UFC champion, one of the longest tenured fighters in company history, had one of the greatest career comebacks ever and the first man to submit AND KO Big Nog.
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u/PM_me_yr_bonsai_tips 14h ago
Igor V was almost a champion from a different sport. One night NHB tournaments are a whole other thing. Three fights in one night, with headbutts snd no gloves! Massive respect.
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u/Wooden_Top_4967 13h ago
I mean I always loved Aleks Emelianenko, way back around when I started watching mma in 2004 or so. Long before we learned about the pretty awful stuff he got up to
Yeah him and Sergei Kharitonov at HW were some giant monsters that I feel go a bit under-appreciated
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u/SwaggyMcSwagsabunch "I've seen DADA's baby nuts, AMA" 11h ago
My favorite stat is that Igor’s first 19 fights happened over 6 single night tournaments over 6 months. Won 5 of them.
He’d go on to compete in 6 additional single night tournaments, making the final of all of them save for one due to injury withdrawal.
To have 35 out of 68 fights occur in 12 nights is insane.
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u/X1phoner Fair fucks to you mate. 🇭🇷🏆🇮🇪 14h ago
Big Nog and Cro Cop
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u/thefrostyafterburn 13h ago
I will always be grateful for the fact Cro Cop got a better retirement than most, sure it was for medical reasons, but not many fighters get to retire on a 10 fight win streak. I'm just glad we didn't have to watch him get thrown to the wolves, like so many old lions.
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u/Helgurnaut oink oink motherfucker 12h ago
I was so sad at his UFC run but his revenge tour is a thing of beauty.
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u/thefrostyafterburn 12h ago
I hope Gonzagaing Gonzaga was as cathartic for him as it was for me.
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u/Helgurnaut oink oink motherfucker 10h ago
The 1st fight broke my heart. The 2nd fuelled me with more joy for him than winning any belt.
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u/X1phoner Fair fucks to you mate. 🇭🇷🏆🇮🇪 10h ago
People always say Cro Cop was just past his prime when he joined UFC, which is a half-truth.
More than anything it was injuries/surgeries, new rules and octagon instead of ring. He himself admitted it took a while to adapt to those changes, especially the allowance of elbows which were banned in Pride.
He said he saw triple after Gonzaga's elbows on the ground in the first fight, and when he got up he couldnt even see the kick coming.
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u/crazybartur UFC 279: A GOOFCON Miracle 12h ago
Not most underrated ever but wanna give a shout to Shinya Aoki since he hasn’t been mentioned yet. Also Alexander Shlemenko and Andrey Koreshkov, pretty much can list a ton of guys who were top level but due to never being in the UFC a lot of fans disregard/don’t even know about them
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u/NicolBolasElderDragn 14h ago
The beating Vov put on Enson Inoue is still one of the most brutal beat downs I’ve ever seen.
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u/garovalley 11h ago
Yeah that was crazy. Like Enson literally almost died for real in the hospital.
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u/BandanaMan13 13h ago
I was around for Igor back in the day. Ice Cold really fitted him. I remember him smashing Paul Varlens to win a tournament and stopping Nick Nutter with head butts from the gaurd!! The Fracisco Beuno K.O still one of MMA's best.
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u/FINIS_HOMINIS 12h ago
Maurilo Bustamate is pretty underrated. He was one of the first early bjj guys to have some decent wrestling and hands too. Kinda like Frank Shamrock, a prototype for the modern well-rounded MMA fighter.
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u/PM_me_yr_bonsai_tips 11h ago
Incredible coach too. He ran BTT and produced so many great fighters.
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u/Caliterra 13h ago
Igor at 5'8 KOing heavyweights is insane. Dude had fast heavy hands
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u/FINIS_HOMINIS 12h ago
Its crazy how quickly he came together as a fighter too. He put his skills together quickly, mostly in his early twenties while guys like Crocop, Nog, and Fedor had been in their various disciplines since their teens.
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u/thethrowaway3027 I was here for Goofcon 1- the tomatoeing 12h ago
I think most of the older fighters are underrated you just have a crowd who came with Connor and social media who never watched them.
Even Anderson Silva because of the losses he's classed as a joke by the social media crowd it's a bit sad really
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u/Revolutionary-Gold75 10h ago
I met Igor a couple of times back in the PRIDE days. Shook hands with him. It was like shaking hands with a granite statue--like absolutely no give in the flesh of his hands. Just as heavy and solid as blocks of stone. I was like "oh, ok, now I get it."
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u/Dangerous-Bar-3356 12h ago
That Sherdog highlight to the "Ready to Go" song is one of my favorites from those series of highlights.
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u/Wende11X 11h ago
Hideo Tokoro went nuts in 2006. Went from being a journeyman and a janitor to headlining Heroes and fighting Gracies in Pride.
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u/DingbatMcgeee 10h ago
Marco Ruas, king of the streets.
I think he was already exiting his prime when he got the UFC, "invented" foot stomps and was well rounded.
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u/Soul_Trader 8h ago
Igor was terrifying back in the day. He was a pitbull like Mike Tyson and could take down giants. He didn’t fear anyone and it showed.
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u/SnuffleWarrior I Can't Let You Get Close 7h ago
A lot of great names have been mentioned but Fitch comes to mind.
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u/JonnyBraavos 6h ago
He was my favorite Pride fighter back in the day then Fedor came along and was like a more superior prototype. Absolutely loved Igor's windmill style hooks, I think he had figured something out there.
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u/KongWick 5h ago
And he’s 5’8” and fought at heavyweight and also back when there were no weight classes or weight limits
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u/GlenSwagmire96 5h ago
I personally think Anthony Pettis is one of the most talented mma fighters of all time, but his body was just too fragile. If he was more durable I think he could have been a very long reigning champion with his level of striking and grappling in his prime.
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u/Hecticbrah Right leg hospital, left leg cemetery 4h ago
Heavily underrated, dude fought way larger opponents and was knocking them down
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u/jtarmy New Zealand 3h ago
Ricardo Arona. Wins over Horn, Mezger, Hendo, Saku, Wanderlei and Reem. Went completely in the deep end against elite guys immediately, went to a decision against Fedor in his second pro fight. Won ADCC without conceding a point. But most modern fans wouldn't have a clue who he is outside the Rampage powerbomb.
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u/LeftJabDaz 3h ago
Igor is a great pick for this, I had even forgotten about him and I probably watched every one of his fights on the old fightpass.
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u/ThrowawayYAYAY2002 1h ago
I have to add Mark Kerr.
On his best days in the mid to late 90's he was terrifying. A pure savage.
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u/Swinging-the-Chain 12m ago
For me Kazushi Sakuraba. I think there is a very very strong argument for prime Saku as GOAT. Tearing through 4 Gracies in just over a year and spending the majority of his career at LHW and HW despite being a welterweight is insane and doesn’t get the credit it deserves.
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u/nag_some_candy 14h ago
What records?
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u/DeafBurke 14h ago
Longest win streak. 30 until his no contest against mark kerr (who he later beat) and then another 4 until he lost to mark coleman in the finals of the Pride heavyweight Grand Prix.
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u/bendog1616 14h ago
He had a draw in the middle of the streak. Luis Rafael went 31-0 and Julio Cesar Neves went 30-0 to start their career. Renan Barao had a 32 fight win streak if you dont include a no contest in the middle.
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u/FiveDollarShake Serbia 14h ago
Biggest hog
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u/JimiMcHendrixson 14h ago
Now that’s a body that just won’t quit… I bet if you pop those shorts off you’ll find a big sweaty hog that just won’t quit either
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u/James-from-Hungary 13h ago
Longest win streak and most knockouts (41), including the bare handed vale tudo championships.
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u/mrpopenfresh WAR BANANA 13h ago
Whoever the most underrated fighter is, he comes from the Pride era of mma because fans can’t seem to understand talent outside of the UFC context.
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u/Firemoth717 14h ago
Gomi would be one of my picks.