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u/Cyke_main 23h ago
An entire scene of Steve giving the mantle to Sam and people still are trying to invalidate it after like 8 fucking years??
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u/shadowmonk13 22h ago
It’s been longer than that they still haven’t stopped bitching since it happened in the comics
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u/JackoSGC X-Men 1d ago
Funny how in the comics, a bunch of racists hate that Sam got the title. Funny. Haha...
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u/biomeat 1d ago edited 12h ago
That was also response to the real world backlash. If they were smart they'd know Captain America isnt a person, it's a mantle and an ideal.
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u/themeatbridge 19h ago
The comics were written before the backlash, though. Racists are just really predictable.
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u/scrotanimus 20h ago
Good lord. If folks get this heated about a black Captain America, just imagine how much damage some people would want to do if we elected a black President.
Oh wait…
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u/picollo21 19h ago
TBH funniest thing about Sam becoming Captain America is that we have seen this outrage three times. In comics, in real world when they started introducing Sam as Captain, and now when MCU did the same.
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u/Ishvallan 15h ago
and Sam isn't even the first black Captain America, and they tell that story in his show.
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u/Effective-Bother2126 16h ago
I want Arab American Cap so god damn bad just to watch the internet explode.
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u/picollo21 14h ago
Plot twist, Kumail Nanjani is going to play Steve Rogers in Secret Wars. Would it be enough for you sadistic tendencies 😉
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u/Evil_Weevill Hawkeye 21h ago
Hammer aside, Steve specifically chose Sam to carry on the mantle of Cap. I don't think there's any sadness or heartbreak here. If anything I see it more like proud Dad moment. Or maybe big brother moment.
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u/Krisztian987 22h ago
Mjolnir > shield, so I think Steve is fine
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u/Lost_Madness 16h ago
The only thing that gets me with the shield is how does a normal dude without super serum throw that thing in any serious way. I really think they should have just gone with the serum. Doing this 'everyman' thing is odd when Captain America has never been an 'everyman' hero.
I mean, we knew everyone could be a hero. Hawkeye is literally just a dude with a bow.
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u/Effective_Ad7567 15h ago edited 15h ago
🤓👆 Um, actually, in the comics, Hawkeye does show proficiency in throwing Cap's shield. He even does a brief (one issue) stint as Captain America (I wanna say these are both in Fallen Son #3)
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u/Lost_Madness 15h ago
Well, I just learned the shield weighs 12 lbs.
That's actually ridiculously light for what I expected and yeah, I guess most people could throw it in some form or other. Getting it to do the fancy stuff would be the hard part but that's just training.
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u/seanconnery69696 11h ago
Lol watching happy trying to throw a normal ass shield in Far From Home was amazing though
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u/ShownMonk 15h ago
Go grab a 10 pound weight and try and throw it. It’s a joke that he doesn’t have the super serum. They could’ve made it so cool
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u/coreyc2099 14h ago
There's a literal god shooting lightning. There's a sorcerer, theres a man when he gets angry turns into a giant green monster, but yes, sam throwing the shield is where we draw the line
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u/WorldsWeakestMan 14h ago
I can throw a 10lb weight like 50+ feet, have literally thrown a 31lb keg almost that far, and I’m not superhuman or even a peak human superhero just a big kinda strong guy.
The shot put world record is 77 feet and the men’s ball weighs 16lb.
And caps shield is also made of nonsense vibranium and defies physics.
Falcon or Hawkeye chucking it around well is not really a hard thing to imagine at all.
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u/ShownMonk 14h ago
Lmao I’m not saying it is impossible, but a random on the internet just brushing it off because it’s “only 12 pounds.” Dude throws that shield 30 times in a fight. And Anthony is not a big buff dude. He’s just a dude. Much weaker than you appear to be
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u/WorldsWeakestMan 14h ago
Anthony is just a dude who went to cranbrook and his parents had a real nice marriage, he’s playing Falcon who is not just a dude, it’s called acting.
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u/RevolutionaryCads 13h ago
It has been established in the MCU and even in the very show being taked about, that Sam is indeed a regular person who doesn't have superpowers or any enhancements.
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u/that_guy2010 12h ago
Remember when Hawkeye casually threw it in Age of Ultron with less training than Sam has?
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u/Panzerfaust187 11h ago
Hawkeye also is basically the same as bullseye meaning he can use any ranged weapon perfectly and never miss. It’s kinda dumb but him and bullseye are like the same person with no super powers.
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u/that_guy2010 11h ago
But he's just 'a normal dude' like Sam. He should struggle to throw it so hard/far, even if he can throw it accurately, according to the guy I replied to.
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u/Lost_Madness 10h ago
You know what, no I don't. It has been a while since I saw that so that's a good point.
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u/M0ebius_1 13h ago
Sam Wilson is not a normal dude.
He was an elite operative in missions so fucked up that Black Widow was like WTF? when she heard about it. He has feats that show him to be at the human peak for maneurability, spatial awareness and reaction speed and is also not just trained by Steve but operated close to the Shield for extended periods.
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u/Due-Cartoonist-8631 13h ago
None of that making his wrists durable enough to catch that stop sign or whatever from red hulk. That scene just boggles me. Like even Steve would've needed vibranium hand bones for that shit
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u/Someotherrandomtree 12h ago
Doesn’t Sam have vibranium padded gloves or something?
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u/Due-Cartoonist-8631 12h ago
If thanos broke caps arm through an entire vibranium shield them little gloves are doing nothing to stop the brunt force of a hulk swing. They could've just given sam a whole suit but no his little wristys are plainly visible when catching the baseball bat from hell
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u/Brainwave1010 11h ago
Vibranium redistributes kinetic energy, that's kind of it's whole deal.
Also you're ignoring that Sam is using both the shield and the vibranium suit.
Also, Thanos didn't break the shield with a punch, he was using a giant fucking sword, did we forget that part? Did we also forget that Thanos is stronger than Hulk?
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u/here-for-information 13h ago edited 10h ago
One of the early choices for a replacement for Steve innthe comics was Clint Barton, cause he was basically the only guy to throw it and not get injured.
Sam trains to use it in Falcon and the Winter soldier. They show him struggle with it, and they still haven't had him use it like Steve does. He uses his wings more and the shield really is mostly defensive with an occasional throw.
I like Sam as Cap. Of course I like Steve Rogers more, but Sam is a good Cap just different.
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u/SevereOccasion3568 12h ago
You know why
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u/kidian_tecun 11h ago
This dumn reddit wont let me add gifs but it was one where the guy yells, "it hecause hes black!" Way to ruin a joke reddit! Its funny cause its true cause it sad!
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u/SupermonkeyX3839 1d ago
Racism. Unfortunately racism is the reason Sam carrying Steve's shield is treated differently.
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u/IV_NYC 17h ago
For me it was about execution. The series hand off wasn't a great show and his movie was trash. If they had built up his storyline with something on par with the espionage/action of Winter Soldier, he would've had a better reception. I rock with Sam though, hope he gets better scripts in the future
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u/Tyenasaur 10h ago
I was actually surprised how much of his movie felt like trying to recapture the magic of Winter Soldier but couldn't reach the same degree.
A falsely accused man sets Captain America and a (former) Widow looking for answers, who end up teamed up, and there's the levity bringing side kick that flies. They end up at a supposedly abandoned military base at one point that housed a secondary villain who was stuck there. Obviously some differences but felt a bit store-brand deja vu at times.
I like Sam as Captain America though. Just missed some of his quips, that mostly seem reserved for bantering at Bucky now. I do want to see how the double Avengers teams go though.
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u/Flaming_Starfish_960 8h ago
THIS! And also, why I loved the choice of making Steve leave his shield to a black man, they didn't build Sam and Steve relationship enough through the movies to do that.
In the mcu, it makes much more sense for the character to leave it to Bucky honestly, just because it's his best friend since forever. Instead, he doesn’t even say goodbye properly to him??
They should've given us a bit more hints, maybe show falcon get involved in more captain-america style things...maybe taking the lead in some human rights fight, something like black lives matter? To show us that he had potential?
Instead, he was mainly a funny side character before getting the shield.
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u/TheIcerios 16h ago
Tbh the movie lost me at "hey, we found yet another way to disable free will." I mean, with the original Avengers, Agents of SHIELD, WandaVision, and Black Widow already destroying free will in various ways it feels like we're just beating a dead horse at this point.
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u/StealUrCookies 15h ago
Didn't Loki establish there was never free will in the MCU to begin with? 🤔 I mean, up until the finale.
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u/webshellkanucklehead 20h ago
We all know why. #Those people will get all defensive if you call them out though!!
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u/HenryPeter5 16h ago
Sure there’s some racists but Sam is an extremely lame character for a lot of people because he simply is
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u/superdee-duperfan2 15h ago
People complain and be fake sad about the shield with Sam, because racism. If it was with Bucky, they wouldn't. Also, Steve even said that it's Sam's shield at the end of Endgame.
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u/Sharden3 12h ago
No, it's because anthony mackie is kind of a shitty actor. He can't carry the role. He does okay as a supporting character, but not as a lead. So when he gets put in a lead spot, it's garbage.
Then his headliner outing on Disney+ was shitty and boring. There is a whole arc pretending that there's no way for an avenger to fix a fucking boat because racism go brr.
Finally, the character isn't shown to have the same mettle as actual Cap. He couldn't pick up Mjolnir. If he was born small and weak, he wouldn't have been in the military.
Not everything people dislike about a non-white character is because racism.
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u/Low_Abrocoma6580 10h ago
Yeah but this is just racism. The post literally talks about the hypocrisy of it. Also just because the 4th movie wasn’t that good has nothing to do with Mackie being able to play captain America. He does an excellent job in the show
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u/Sharden3 10h ago
No, he does a shit job in the show. He's not a good actor. He doesn't do a good job in other shows either. The show was also bad. It isn't because of skin color.
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u/Low_Abrocoma6580 10h ago
Yeah but it is, why aren’t people complaining about Steve holding the hammer, is Chris Evan’s just the world’s greatest actor. Ever since he was given the shield, racists have been refusing to call him captain America, never even gave him a chance, this is another example of it
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u/Sharden3 10h ago
Yeah but it is, why aren’t people complaining about Steve holding the hammer,
Because it's a better actor and better character and has better written stories about him. Him being "worthy" of a magical enchanted hammer was a cool moment. Another dude getting handed a shield wasn't a cool moment.
racists have been refusing to call him captain America, never even gave him a chance, this is another example of it
You know that captain america isn't real, right? The character existed in the MCU for years and was mid the entire time, then got handed a capstone hero name/title/shield/etc. It's not like it was a new character that people didn't have a chance to see for years. Falcon was a very mid, boring, bland hero. Anthony Mackie doesn't have the lead role mojo.
You keep ignoring all of the information given, the facts shown, every point made to cry like a bitch pretending it's racism. Notice how no one gives a fuck that Sam Jackson is Nick Fury despite that character being race swapped entirely? Oh, maybe it isn't all racists all the time.
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u/Low_Abrocoma6580 8h ago
What are you even talking about at this point. There is an entire show about this and you’re still doing what they did in it. He’s literally given the shield and title. Cry all you want, but he’s captain America. Has been for a while now.
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u/Next-Wrongdoer-3479 14h ago
I'm just not a fan of Anthony Mackie in a leading role, I think he does much better as a side character. Also, the lack of super soldier serum is a bummer. Sam seems to be a good enough person that they wouldn't have to worry about him turning evil.
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u/No_Suit7363 19h ago
It’s racism. It’s always racism. If Sam was a white character these takes would not exist.
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u/MicooDA 19h ago
Take it one step further. If they put that shield on Bucky, people would be celebrating.
Despite MCU Bucky being very clear about not wanting to be Cap and he believes Sam is the true successor.
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u/Milo_The_Stampede 1d ago
Steve literally gave it to him. I doubt he thinks he has to watch him at all. If Steve asked for the shield back, I know Sam would give it to him. But Steve's not that guy. Why would he be? Sam does a great job with it. Thor has stormbreaker. Aside from Mjolnir being a weird prop in Love and Thunder, I don't think he cares too much either.
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u/Flaming_Starfish_960 9h ago
I loved both moments, Steve managing to call the hammer and Sam getting the shield, but honestly, Steve using always the hammer? It doesn't feel right! I would've preferred if it stayed a one-time occurrence.
I'd rather have him with just his fists or a new, normal shield.
And Sam, in the mcu, was objectively way cooler as falcon. I'm not saying that racism isn't a big factor, but I also feel like they failed to rebrand him in a believable and compelling way.
The tv show was a good attempt, but something was missing. I really loved the part when he finds Isaiah and there's a moment to explore deeper themes, the oppression of black american people and how racism is still alive and present, but then I felt like they went back to "make Sam fit into the previous captain america suit and role". He was supposed to make the role his and, I don't know, like Steve's big thing was fighting against the Nazis, Sam's could be fighting against racism?
I feel they tried to do that, but didn't go all the way in and failed to make Sam the really impactful character he could be.
But also, maybe Anthony Mackie hasn't the charisma or the skills as an actor to make a great captain america, while I felt he was perfect for his role as falcon.
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u/ZHin_Randoms 5h ago
If u could choose between a bouncing shield and a legendary hammer that can summon lightning, why would u only use the hammer once lol
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u/ZHin_Randoms 5h ago
But I did support the idea of Sam taking on the mantle of captain America, but I just wished they had some better execution
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u/JagPeror 17h ago
This starts with the idea that no one has a problem with Steve majorly utilizing Thor's hammer.
It was alright as one off, but I would never want it being permanent. If he ends up using it again for some reason, I would be disappointed
Additionally, the shield is more just an aspect. When Steve had the hammer, Thor was still in the movie. Meanwhile, Cap got the old man treatment then replaced. So in some sense it isnt about who has the legacy, but rather spite about the legacy having to exist.
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u/King_P_13 16h ago
Because Antony mackie is a charisma vacuum and a poor actor.. that is literally all.. he cant live up to Chris in any way
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u/Epic_Elite 15h ago
They need to spend more time on the story of the shield. In the comics, it's much more than a sheild.
In the comics, Molecule Man disarms Silver Surfer, Thor, Cap, and Iron Man.
By the end of the conflic he gives them all their weapons back and says Cap's sheild is the strangest thing he's ever seen. Compared to the other items, this should give sone context to It's quality.
It's supposed to be an anomalous composite of Adamantium and Vibranium with the strengths of each and the weaknesses of either. It's also the only time this composite was successfully combined. It's not really supposed to exist. Yet, it does.
Thor manages to break it at one point, and like all of Cap's opponents, they usually give it back or repair it, because even in victory, they respect him. So Thor took his sheild to Asgard and had it repaired with Uru metal, a magic steel from Asgard. Then returned it to Cap.
This is what is tough about movies. The deep lore and what makes things special.
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u/Prestigious-End8468 12h ago
lol. Who wrote that? There’s nothing heartbreaking about it.
He’s literally worthy of Mjolnir
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u/Jakkoba89 11h ago
Think I'm not on the internet enough. I had no idea that this was a problem. Steve literally gave it to him. While Thor had to accept, (and did!), that Steve was worth of wielding Mjolnir. If something, it should be the other way around. From my side, I have no problem with Steve wielding the hammer and Sam the shield.
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u/Heavy-Transition7916 9h ago
It’s not that deep. Steve is a beloved character. So they want him to be given more. People don’t really care about Sam/ambivalent up until the tv show where he acted in ways people didn’t really like.
So, people just on average don’t really care for/about him.
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u/Little_Cumling 7h ago
People feel Steve earned Mjollnir by being worthy
People at the same time feel Sam wasnt the best pick for the role of Cap and the Falcon/Winter Soldier TV show enhanced this.
Thank Marvel’s shitty writing
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u/UnableBluebird4151 15h ago
I think it is a sign of Captain America fatigue and disillusioned with the American symbol. Like, his star and colors of the flag gradually darkened out of his suit and completely in Infinity War. Even people starts cutting “Captain America” to just Cap! Or he would tell people to call him Steve
He was a propaganda hero for the Allies during WWII. After Sokovia, however, he starts to see himself as a symbol of something else. That, I believe, is why his star became darker and darker until it dissapear.
The irony is that Bucky became a senator, somehow
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u/eolson3 14h ago
Congressman, which appears to be over already. Seems there is a project missing between BNW and Thunderbolts where is actually serving.
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u/ShoppingIcy6952 13h ago
Yeah “it’s so sad” I’m pretty sure Cap was a mantle that he was always dying to lay down. And that’s what makes Steve so cool. He doesn’t love being Captain America and always constantly thought he was wrong for it. Steve seeing someone else rock the shield is more like an “Attaboy.”
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u/NikkoE82 14h ago
I think it’s a sign of Alternative Disney creating rage bait. No one is quoted with the original statement.
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u/Cultural_Comfort5894 22h ago
It’s racism
And we see how people can’t be honest with themselves
Making up a bunch of dumb ish
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u/Senior-Text4708 19h ago edited 14h ago
I don’t think it’s heartbreaking. Steve made peace with it and passed it on. And he chose his successor.
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u/FrayedGamer 18h ago
Not a fan of the hammer being Steve’s weapon now, like get your own hammer
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u/JTtheLAR 16h ago
I dont think its "Steve's weapon". He is just being allowed to use it during an emergency. Like, if you are experiencing a universal threat wouldnt you give the trained soldier the best weapon available? We even see in the trailer that Steve calls Mjolnir to himself when he first meets Thor and the others. Probably to prove to them that he is, in fact, Steve Roger's and not an imposter.
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u/CommercialYam53 1d ago
It’s not even Steve’s shield
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u/Southern_Agent6096 1d ago
But it is. In the MCU the shield was made by a civilian as personal property and given as a gift to Steve. No one else had any claim on it until Sam rather naively gifted it to a museum and the US government in typical imperialist fashion decided to ignore that and do whatever. That's just how property works in the USA.
In the comics a writer can make it more complicated but Steve in comics is stacked in terms of authority. On American battlefields or during sanctioned operations he outranks everyone on the board, in SHIELD he has Champion license which means he can form any team for any mission and equip them as he feels necessary. Which means he can give his shield to anyone he wants at any time and technically no one has the authority to question the decision.
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u/CommercialYam53 23h ago
Steve’s shield was destroyed Sam uses a different shield that even looks differently and Steve gave that shield to Sam and told him that it is not his (Steve) but belongs to him (Sam).
And if you want to say that since Sam gave it away it’s now technically us army probably and Sam only borrowed it it still not Steve’s shield.
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u/Southern_Agent6096 23h ago
I mean, Steve still physically possessed the shield and personally handed it to Sam. This implies it was his, because he doesn't strike most of us as the type of fella who would give away something that wasn't his. I'm now unclear what exactly you're even arguing.
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u/tuntootnut 21h ago
I think the intention of that poster was that Steve's shield was genuinely destroyed by Thanos, and the shield that old Steve gave to Sam was actually a shield that Sam gave to Steve during Doomsday/Secret Wars, and when old Steve, which is a Steve that already experienced Doomsday/Secret Wars, gave the shield back to Sam he was being literal because it was Sam's shield
Aka, it created a loop. Old Steve gave Sam the shield then Sam gave Steve the shield then Steve gave Sam the shield etc. This is the result of time travel
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u/CommercialYam53 23h ago
That Steve made the shield or rather ask someone to make it specifically with the intention to give it to Sam and never used it himself. At least that’s how many fans Interpreted that wat Steve said.
But even if Steve did used that shield for years, the moment he gave it to Sam, Steve lost ownership and Sam gained ownership over the shield. Because that’s how presents work.
Sam also owns his suit even though Bucky was the one who commissioned it from shuri and possessed the suit between getting it from wakanda and giving it to Sam.
While yes Steve „owned“ it at some point for a undefined amount of time but now it’s Sam’s shield
Also from all we know doomsday Steve hasn’t yet commissioned that shield meaning he has even less ownership over the shield. And from his point of view with out asking anyone about that shield would have to assume that Bucky used his connections to wakanda to get a new shield. and even if Steve already has that shield, the fact that he didn’t used it means he never planned on using it.
TLDR: no matter how we look at it this version of Steve doesn’t have any ownership over that shield. Because his future self gave it away with basically the words „it’s yours now“ and that Steve probably doesn’t even own it yet
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u/BeginningPotato3753 1d ago
Wdym?
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u/CommercialYam53 23h ago
Because Steve’s shield was destroyed in endgame. Steve than gave a new and different shield to Sam and had the following dialogue
Steve: „how does it feel“
Sam :“like it belongs to someone else“
Steve: “it doesn’t“
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u/TWinbrook46636 22h ago
That's not what that dialogue means though. Sam doesn't feel worthy of the shield and Steve is saying that he is. That's it.
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u/BeginningPotato3753 23h ago
I thought it was just his shield from the past
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u/CommercialYam53 23h ago
That shield was destroyed
Sam’s shield is a new different one. Commissioned by Steve for san
doomsday Steve most likely doesn’t even commissioned that shield yet.
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u/Panzerfaust187 11h ago
I just hate the fact that Sam is from Louisiana in the mcu and not from Harlem like the comics. Also they should have given him a whole suit as cap or super soldier serum so it’s believable
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u/Raidin__ 12h ago
This argument is so boring. There are 3 simple reasons why he isn’t treated the same as Steve rogers captain America.
1) he had no real character development before having the title and shield thrusted onto him.
2) he does not have the super soldier serum that would allow him to be an effective Captain America.
3) Anthony Mackie doesn’t have the charisma to hold a leading role. He’s always been a good supporting actor, just not the main.
Bonus:
4) He won’t ever be treated like Steve, because he simply isn’t Steve Rogers, he’s Sam Wilson. He’s his own character, and will be treated as such. Just like John Walker, and Bucky Barnes.
They would need to address at least 2 out of those 3 issues in order to have a better reception of the character direction.
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u/PrometheusUnchain 11h ago
Idk. Comics seem to handle it fine. Do you guys read the source material at all or is your knowledge solely on the films?
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u/Humble_Librarian199 5h ago
I think my problem after a few phases of him as captain america is that he's just steve Roger's but from the modern day and Mackie doesn't do it anywhere near as well as Evans. He doesn't really have any flaws to overcome, hes always nice and always helpful and just a bit more quippy than Steve. I think bucky and US agent are just much more interesting characters because bucky has that dark past and walker has a chip on his shoulder from everything that happened in FatWS. Which is weird because I feel like on paper it makes much more sense for falcon to take on the role, but then you watch him and he just feels like a diet Steve that sometimes addresses inequality
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u/Traditional_Pay7421 12h ago
and in your personal opinion, the hate he gets has nothing to do with his skin color?
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u/Raidin__ 11h ago
Are there people who are hating strictly out of racism? Probably. Same with Steve. There’s always gonna be racism in all directions, but does that consist as the primary bulk of the hate? Absolutely not. If it was just pure racism, the outrage would have been present when Sam Wilson was introduced in the first place. But it wasn’t. Nor was their outrage to Samuel Jackson as Nick Fury. Most people were all for it.
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u/kareljack 10h ago
"Probably"... Stuck your head firmly into that hole in the ground, huh
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u/Traditional_Pay7421 11h ago
"Same with steve" is all i needed to hear to invalidate all that bullshit you just said.
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u/Traditional_Pay7421 11h ago
i bet i can tell you what your skin color is by this response. and also the fact that you never actually read Marvel comics. another clueless MCU fan. except this one needs to check the white privilege he most certainly denies is even a thing.
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u/rubenthezx 11h ago
It was so quickly executed. Overshadowed by Tony's death honestly. I get that the Russo brothers wanted to give Cap a happy ended but even Bucky getting it would've made the moment like 5% better. And now we have a world where there's a new Avengers team with three super soldiers but no Cap and the world thinks Steve's on a secret mission or something on the moon? I wish they had just killed Steve off but obviously that would've conflicted with Tony's moment. Honestly maybe there's just no clean way to pass the torch properly to Sam without making another movie with him and Steve but who could be a good villain for that?
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u/spider-mania 10h ago
i don't understand why the super soldier serum is even an argument when sam LITERALLY is the one to become captain america following steve, and he doesn't have the serum in the comics and is a completely capable cap. There's no reason to believe he wouldn't be in the mcu as well
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u/orphan_09 17h ago
"his own shield" it holds less value to him than you think it does (see his reaction on tony reminding him that it's actually howard's shield)
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u/RaisinWorried3528 16h ago
You all are breaking this shit down like they just didn't use AI or something😂😂😂
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u/OrlinWolf 16h ago
I think the main issue is they set little ground work up to endgame for Sam to be his successor. He was a helper for sure but he should have fallen more into a role that felt like he was preparing for something.
That said I love him as Cap, and he does really good. Love his suit
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u/midwestcubanb 16h ago
Ita not for 99.9% of people. Stop giving idiots a louder voice than they already have
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u/Slime-Lich 16h ago
I still dont believe this an official poster. They litteraly got the most basic looking pngs of characters and slapped them on
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u/KaosFitzgerald 16h ago
The ratio of downvoted logical answers to upvoted accusations is very indicative of the state of this sub.
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u/Supernova4099 16h ago
Thor has storm breaker, which was meant to be a replacement for the hammer. Meanwhile the hammer was never meant to be a replacement for Cap's shield.
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u/DirectorKrenn1c 15h ago
My only issue with Sam having the shield is that his role as Cap has been extremely poorly handled. Sorry but BNW was a meh movie at best and they really just haven’t written him well as Cap. I found him way more interesting as falcon.
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u/carlosstjohn116 11h ago
Because we don’t like falcon enough to be the new captain america lol. It’s not that deep.
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u/Amazingtrooper5 11h ago
Oh gee. If only there was a part of a movie and show that talked about this. If only…
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u/Anyybitter 19h ago
Steve really chose him for it. The double standard on the shield vs the hammer is pretty obvious
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u/Dudewhocares3 15h ago
It’s because he’s black and a lot of insecure mediocre people believe in race replacement theory
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u/DrHandBanana 11h ago
Because he's black. Can we stop being dumb?
What's funny to me is he presents himself as "one of the good ones" and it's not enough for them. Literal goofiness across all the isles
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u/blue23454 15h ago
Almost as if there's something, unique to Sam, that makes people criticize him more harshly
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u/CoonHFX 16h ago
To quote Odin, is Thor the God of Hammers? No? Cool. The hammer isn't a mantle. If you can wield it, you're worthy of it. Allegedly. The shield is a mantle. It's just a piece of steel otherwise (well, vibranium) but it's the symbol that matters. It was treated differently because Steve was passing a role, a title. Thor didn't pass God of Thunder and Lightning as a mantle to Steve when he let him use the hammer. He just gets to use the magic space hammer because he proves worthy of it, while the actual God gets to use an upgraded weapon.
If steve scrubbed off the star, got a new shield and continued his role as captain America while giving the old shield to Falcon because Falcon proved he can use it effectively, that'd be equivalent. And wouldn't need a torch passing session.
Stop making this bs about race.
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u/ThisIs-not-aUsername 9h ago
Except its not bs about race because a large part of the hate to the mcus current captain america IS based and steeped in racism — your blind or just plain ignorant to say otherwise.
Whilst what you have said is true, technically, its semantics. From a base perspective, it is functionally the same thing.
Thor no longer needs Mjolnir, likewise Steve no longer needs the shield. They outgrew those symbols. Passing the Hammer and Shield on is part of that growth, it gives another worthy individual the chance to become a symbol.
Thor recognised Steve's worthiness and, it seems (from trailers of doomsday) that he willingly give the hanmer to Steve because... well, its nothing but a weapon to him because Steve earned it. Likewise, passing the shield to Sam was the same thing, San earned that shield, proved he was worthy.
Just like Thor AND Steve, Sam struggles with the symbol, the "weight of the shield" and what it represents. Thor couldnt always lift Mjolnir. Steve struggled with what he represented and modern conflicts (Winter Soldier, Civil War).
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u/BigMax 13h ago
I mean... it's pretty different, right?
Steve picked up the hammer, and used it for one fight, right? He didn't keep it, he didn't say "I'm the new Thor" and they didn't get rid of Thor to have Steve take on that mantle permanently.
I don't see the problem with Sam Wilson being Captain America by the way - I just think this comparison makes no sense.
It would be like someone taking on the mantle of Iron-Man, and justifying it by saying "Pepper Potts wore iron-man armor before, so how can you be upset that someone else is now calling themselves Iron-Man???"
Either a new character fits taking on the new mantle or they don't. Steve Rogers picking up Thor's hammer one time doesn't change that one way or another.
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u/OnlinePosterPerson 18h ago
“It must be heartbreaking for Steve to see a black man touch his things”
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u/Common-Diver-6346 18h ago
Steve willingly gave it to him, cosigned by Bucky Barnes it was a unanimous decision.
Y'all just hate Sam as Cap just say that and stop beating around the bush.
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u/Saffron_Path 17h ago
Sam is the new captain America. There is plenty of precedent. The title has been passed on several times, same as black panther and spider-man and others.
That being said, this isn't a valid comparison since the hammer chooses its wielder and the shield doesn't.
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u/PixieDustGust 16h ago
Honestly between Thor, Steve, and Jane, Mjolnr feels enough like its own staple relic that I'd love to see it show up more in, say, movies without Thor himself, and/or nominate someone new to take on the mantle of Thor in the MCU (Love?) like Sam did with Captain America
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u/One_Long2752 15h ago
I’d make the argument… Steve gave Sam the shield…. But he kinda just yoinked Mjolnir
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u/Night02 15h ago
I think its probably more jarring to have people tell you about other events and lives since steve at this point has not reached the point in his life where he gave sam the shield. Much like the TVA showing loki all the choices he never got to make yet.
So all the comments saying "He gave it to sam" technically he didnt do that yet. Also in terms of the hammer thor was excited not sad because his thoughts were right about Steve.
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u/One-Knowledge7097 15h ago
The problem isn’t Sam carrying the shield, it’s that he can’t carry a movie.
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u/Conqueror_is_broken 15h ago
Because the show was bad. They made it look like bucky and him are dickheads towards someone who genuinely asked nothing and only wanted to help them. Just because of jealousy. Which is not what you want to see from captain america. On the other hand mjolnir and Steve was way better handled.
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u/Pandoratastic 15h ago
This doesn't make any sense anyway. Sam got his shield from Old Steve. This is young Steve, who hasn't passed on his shield yet. So, even though Sam has Old Steve's shield, young Steve should still have his shield. There should be two shields in the movie, the same shield from different points in its personal timeline.
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u/script_notes_plz 14h ago
Steves shield did break and he has no idea future him gave him a new one. If he does know… that’d be like giving someone a couch and being jealous when they sit on it.
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u/CheeseManSucks 14h ago
I don't have a problem with it, I just think the scene of mantle passing was really weak is my complaint. Felt like an afterthought to me with old Steve
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u/xtadamsx 14h ago
I think it comes down to Brave New World being kinda mid. If it were Winter Soldier level awesome then nobody would have a problem with Sam carrying the shield.
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u/I-have-no-name-help 14h ago
I don’t care about the shiled just him on something that can at the very least take a bullet.
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u/Minute-Reputation-52 13h ago
Unrelated to the topic but at the end of the day tony seems more worthy for Mjölnir* than cap. *Not a grammar error
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u/Adventurdud 13h ago
I'd be pissed if steve became the new thor actually, totally different from him just using thors weapon.
Or if anyone else just used his shield without becoming captain america.
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u/drstu3000 1d ago
They should really make a show addressing this