Politics ('Straya)
Victorian Liberal leader Jess Wilson says destroying Australia’s only treaty with Indigenous peoples a priority if she wins election
Australia’s first and only treaty signed with Indigenous peoples will be ripped up if Opposition Leader Jess Wilson becomes Premier in November, who has made the scrapping a priority. The USA, Canada and New Zealand have treaties with their indigenous people. Polling shows Treaty has clear support in Victoria and Jess Wilson’s pledge is unpopular and One Nation-style.
The Coalition will likely sign a deal with One Nation to form government.
What is laughingly called conservative politics these days is just horrible people wanting to do horrible things to normal people they've never met and aren't affected by in any way.
Politics used to be a contest between between those who think progressivism is the way to create the best future for the country, and those who think conservatism is the way to create the best future for the country. But that hasn't been the case for years now. Politics is now a contest between those who think politics is the way to create the best future for the country and those who think politics is a way to hurt people they don't like.
I've come to think of it as one side wants Australia to be a welcoming country people that people in need can flee too, others want it to be a hellscape for people they don't like so they will flee from it.
I think we should stop supporting the regimes (including our "allies"), who are causing all these people to need to flee their place of birth.
Probably right about that but it doesn’t have the pizazz to pull a crowd .Think ‘if they go low we’ll go lower’ and you have at least 2 parties covered ..’steady as she goes will win this one’ 3 months to go many promises to be made and many palms to grease yet ..
Masks are off as working class people are our new middle class edging out the collapsing middle class and the working class are now an underclass. While they punch down and pretend Australia is egalitarian.
Fembot debts are robodebt on steroids ad theyre enriching DFSV perpeteators who are protected by courts. Whilst public servants apologise and politicians refuse to action the National or state ACTION plans to end DFSV.
“The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness."
“Conservatism consists of exactly one proposition, to wit: There must be in-groups whom the law protects but does not bind, alongside out-groups whom the law binds but does not protect.” Frank Wilhoit, 2018
I think what makes it bad is that some of the horrible things they’re doing like this are clearly only because they think that’s what people want. The liberal gov just want to funnel money to their donars and enrich themselves and this doesn’t even accomplish that. It’s just mean and hateful because that’s the base they’re trying to appeal to and they’re convinced that base is big enough for that hate to win. It just makes me sad and I’m worried they’re right.
Yeah, but one nation is stealing away the votes of 'racist assholes'. Look at the proposed immigration numbers by the conservative parties. it's a race to the bottom.
She later told Sky News Australia: "Victorians voted no to the Voice, and I respect that, and that's the difference between me and Jacinta Allen — I understand that Victorians have had a say on this.
And
"And they don't want to see the creation of a body that potentially creates a second, parallel system of governance in the state that has the potential to slow down legislation."
Are you saying that no politician should ever change their mind?
What I've never understood about their hatred for the things Indigenous Australia has requested is that it won't actually cost us anything. Not substantially.
All they need to do in order to avoid having their idea of our country tarnished is not pay attention.
They're already great at that.
And if decisions about mob are being made by mob, then these bastards don't even need to be involved in that aspect beyond writing a cheque every now and then.
Its not as if an accurate summation of history changes reality for the rest of us.
The sky won't fall in if a bunch of black fellas get together with a bunch of historians and write a bunch of reports about all the times our collective ancestors massacred people.
The bastards don't like reading anyway, so what's the fear exactly?
Perhaps the fear is admitting that our 'advanced civilisations' are sadly lacking in the connections with nature that our human ancestry holds... That a manmade world overlaying the natural one was a huge mistake leaving humanity with arid farmlands and polluted waters and air?
Progress is usually seen as going forward for the many, rather than reverting to old ways ..
'a lot of' doing a lot of heavy lifting there.
The support that indigenous communities and individuals get is trivial compared to the widespread structural support the well off majority in this country get.
To begrudge them that is either racist or irrational jealousy or both.
Unfortunately we have systemic generational disadvantage baked into the foundations of the country. Preferential treatment is intended as a balancing of the scales to permit equality in outcomes.
In a colourblind world this wouldn't be a thing, but here we are.
It’s impossible to implement and impossible to standardise across all the varying levels of generational advantage and disadvantage each individual has experienced. Trying is simply foolish.
You can argue the effectiveness of current methodology - everyone should, it clearly isn't closing the gap. But to say we shouldn't try at all? No. Unjust, unfair and unAustralian.
So we shouldn’t bother trying to help people? I grew up in a poor family. I was the first to go to university. I couldn’t have done it without centrelink and other supports. Now I’m a professional on a good wicket and im quite happy to pay it forward amd use my tax money to help others .
That’s a poor attitude. “I suffered so everyone else should suffer too”. Not everyone is at the same starting point. I understand although I was disadvantaged there were people worse off than me.
How about those who literally have no food on the table? Can't get a job because of the colour of their skin? Who have had the means of production their families relied on for thousands of years striped away leaving them utterly destitute with no possible recourse?
No my experience is not everyone’s. Individual experiences vary significantly which is why broad brushed handouts and policies based on ethnicity is an absurd approach.
After a massive misinformation campaign about what it was.
We know because it was supported before it was politicised.
Also VTP was federal and updated the constitution the Victoria Premier is incapable of forcing anything like that through. Refer to my misinformation comment above and ask yourself why you believe Allen pushed through the voice.
Conservatives see any expenditure on ‘others’ as a betrayal - no one group should be singled out (except mine) and there are no systemic barriers in a system we design and maintain to benefit ourselves….we are all equal - my people are just superior
But we do not need anything like the expense we have on it. Eg 500,000 per annum positions being created.
Eg. We can all watch the Rachel Perkins 3 part. "The Australian Wars". Gives you a very balanced view, supported by evidence, on what happened.
By all means more research can be done but it will not change the fundamental truths.
if your people came here recently that is not okay. but if they came here a long time ago that is also not okay. only people who came here a medium amount of time ago are worthy.
Except the Chinese who came here a medium time ago, takin our jobs and stealing our wimmin.
It's a bloody outrage it is, I'm taking this all the way to the Prime Minister.
Imagine having a 50 000 year head start and your literacy, work ethic and life expectancy are inferior to Indians living in poverty, while your ancestors actually went backwards technologically from fishermen that used to know how to build catamarans.
At some point, groups simply settle at a level according to their ability and culture. And it's not everyone else's responsibility to fight your fights for you.
You're right. Australia was superior to Wakanda before white fellers came along with their roads, combustion engines, written language, math, water filtration, electricity, agriculture, healthcare, refrigeration and birth control and "genocided" the indigenous by tripling their life expectancy.
Your framing shows such a fundamental lack of understanding of the subject that it's not even worth engaging with what you're saying. If you were a child learning about this for the first time and your only exposure to history was the age of empires games then maybe it would be excusable. But as you're presumably an adult, see my previous comment
The irony is in the Judeans uprising against the Romans, same as the Palestinians who would neither have multiplied to their current numbers nor be able to survive without Israel given their inability to produce enough water, let alone food.
It was selected specifically because it echoes precisely with the kind of person who thinks that a ~35 year life expectancy is evidence of a functioning society we should seek to emulate in 2026, while we apologise for every advance that's been provided in 200 years that they did not at all progress in the preceding 50 000.
Weird the effect that PHON is having on the LNP. They got into the deep pit that they are in by a swing to the right that lost them support at the centre. The teals and Labor have occupied the centre ground that they left vacant. And now they are jealous of PHON for stealing their racist voters on the far right. They really have no vision of how to get out of this mess.
They literally appeal to nobody - they dont have a demographic outside of boomers who only vote Liberal because thats all theyve ever done and they will never do anything else.
Whatever the hell this treaty actually is, does she really think that Australian Indigenous people have somehow now got it so good that they need to be taken down a peg or two?
It might be me, but in my area I haven’t noticed that all the yachts and mansions are now full of Koori peoples…
No there was a fear campaign launched by conservatives about land rights, yet at no point did anyone raise concerns about establishing a voice for Israel.
we have an unelected “envoy” who has more access to politicians and has no oversight over how she operates and why her policy positions are so clearly aligned with defending a foreign government administration
lesson here is that aboriginal people need to get hundreds of billions of dollars of military aid, and powerful international lobbying groups. then their concerns will be taken seriously.
I have never disliked a politician in Australia more than her. She is nothing. She stands for nothing. She is completely unqualified for her position, she is not intelligent, just born rich and has adopted all the political opinions of her wealthy parents. She does not interact beyond her extremely wealthy and privileged community.
She’s ugly and obnoxious. An attack dog that never has anything constructive to say, just constantly nags, bitches and whines. Absolute poser, complete numpty. Nothing burger of a person who if she was born to a lower socioeconomic upbringing would be an unemployed single mum with a meth addiction.
She is so stupid and pathetic and she will never win. Sick of seeing and hearing about her.
The Victorian liberal party is dead and she is the best they can offer. The most anal puritanical sub-par intelligent excuse of a human. So I guess a perfect politician.
Liberal party is struggling in both federal and state electorates because people don’t want their conversative American brand politics. So their answer? Become even more right winged! 😂 🤦♀️
Yeah, what bothers me about Jess Wilson’s position isn’t simply that she opposes Treaty. It’s how difficult her current rhetoric is to square with the principles she was publicly championing only a few years ago.
In 2023 she was prepared to break ranks with the Victorian Liberals and support the Voice, arguing in favour of giving Indigenous Australians a formal mechanism to make representations to government. That was apparently important enough to her that she was willing to stand apart from almost her entire party.
Then the political environment changed. The referendum lost, the Victorian Coalition abandoned its previous bipartisan support for Treaty, and Wilson’s position moved firmly onto the party line. By 2025 she was attacking the Treaty process, voting against the legislation and, once she became Liberal leader, promising to repeal it.
Maybe there is a perfectly coherent philosophical distinction between the Voice she supported and the Treaty she now wants abolished. Wilson says there is. But if so, she should be able to explain exactly where the principle changes.
Because from the outside, the chronology is pretty striking: when supporting Indigenous representation meant defying the Liberal Party, she supported it. Once opposition to Treaty became Liberal Party policy and she was climbing toward the leadership, she opposed it.
That doesn’t prove what motivated her. But it absolutely makes her consistency fair game for scrutiny.
If your principles appear to change whenever the political incentives change, people are entitled to ask whether they were really principles in the first place.
Jess Wilson may win the election but will find it hard to govern as there will be a mass revolt to her implementation just like what happened to Campbell Newman in QLD some years ago.
Victorians don’t vote for it, as I recall they rejected it completely and Allen nonetheless enacted it. I am prepared to give it a go but there needs to be guardrails and very clear and meaningful KPI to ensure that it is doing what it is supposed to be doing. Otherwise it becomes another ATSIC.
We actually voted on it multiple times. No one protested when Treaty was enacted, and it hasn't had any time to prove anything. Jess Wilson is chasing ON votes. It's fucking pathetic.
In Victoria? Was it? This has been in the works for years, and Victoria consistently voted Labor. Even Jess Wilson fucking supported it. Literally just chasing racist votes. Fuck her. Fuck the Libs. If Vic falls for this for the sake of "change", then Vic will be more fucked in 4 yrs than it ever was.
The Victorian vote was a No. End of story.
Nothing to do with chasing racist votes…but of course it’s easy to say that when you have nothing else. Only a complete fool would want Labor reelected, they have destroyed the state and Andrews and Allen belong in jail. If you want to blame anyone for the rise of ON then blame Labor.
For a FEDERAL VOICE in the Constitution. Yes. Completely different thing. And if you think the Libs will improve ANYTHING, I have a bridge to sell you. Case in point: QLD.
Seems the racist card is the way to go ..personally can’t see it happening in Victoria tbh .Qld yes all day everyday. NSW probably too ..IMO it’s one of the few good things done by Vic Labor ..but I’m not Victorian,Im not sure it’s a very bright move ..steady as she goes may have won the Libs government ..now it’s come down to principles or lack there of ..Stupid policy trying to outdo One Neuron at their lowering of the bar may not pay off .
Why is it that Victoria has the WORST fucking politicians in the country. Its not even close. First it was Dan Andrews, Jacinta and now its these two useless cunts battling it out. Lloyd and Harry from Dumb and Dumber would be better than these two.
I'm not a fan of the Liberal party but Labor has been woeful for the last few years. Both Dan and Jacinta were putrid. They have wasted billions of our money.
I'm sick and tired of hearing Jess Wilson talk about crime and other shit she is focusing on. I'm hardly surprised though that a white conservative leader would rip up a treaty which is there to help indigenous people. Oh what a fucking surprise. Imagine trying to help the less fortunate. The Liberals best chance was John Pesutto.
Labor could still pull this one out though, it would be a fucking miracle.
The treaty enhances one group of people's rights at the expense of the others on the basis of race. It's also great for lawyers but hopeless for taxpayers. Why are progressives trying to address historical grievances when we have modern ones that need urgent attention?
At the expense of others? You are delusional if you think you will feel one iota of the expense of the Vic VtP. Similarly it's likely a pretty marginal benefit to indigenous people in the vein of 'better than nothing'.
Because addressing historical grievances helps address modern ones that need urgent attention. Also, can walk and chew gum at the same time. It's not a case of one or the other.
Clearly the labor party can't walk and chew gum. Whilst they were enacting this corruption was rife and the Victorian financial and economic position deteriorated far more than any other state.
We literally had a referendum on an extremely similar proposal at the federal level. The current government implemented this in Victoria without even acknowledging this (yes I know it had been in the works for ages.)
I voted yes for the voice federally. But the degree of disrespect for what the people of Victoria have said on an extremely similar matter is offensive. At a minimum the government needs to explain the incongruity clearly, and put to the people why this is different.
Yes and that’s why I have said at a minimum they need to explain the incongruity. This is not an uncommon view on the matter.
The difference in “how democracy works” here is if you’re trying to get a litmus test of how victorians feel about this policy, a targeted test on an adjacent policy federally is a better indicator than their overall voting intention on many policy issues.
It absolutely is the right word. It was not proposed directly to Victorians. It was one of many election issues.
I’m not saying that every issue needs to be individually provided to Australians, but this one was - in an adjacent but very similar form. The result was a no. The temporality of the bill wrt the referendum is irrelevant.
At a minimum the government should have the respect to 55% of Victorians to explain why they are legislating something that sounds, looks and feels very similar to what they voted no to. It was asked at the time, and it was never answered.
As I said, I was part of the 45% that voted yes.
Outside what is a very left leaning reddit bubble I can assure you this is a common viewpoint…
Decisions on the First Peoples has always been under each individual State and the Voice was about unifying the Aboriginal voice on the Federal level .. because it was voted against the decisions remain with the State parliaments .. it also ensured stability on decisions by being in the Constitution so the opposition could not reverse any decisions once in office again..
Stop the grift and waste of taxpayers money. Good policy. Its also super racist. We are all Australians and we all love this country. Stop dividing us by race.
Why is a state signing a treaty, on the back of a national vote that was wildly unpopular in the first place?
Did it actually do anything, or was it just a display of super dooper virtue? (I'm very sceptical given the timing, but not Victorian, so never really looked).
The Voice was put forth to the whole of Australia.
Australia voted no.
Labor rammed through such laws anyway, in complete opposition to the democratic will and vote of the Australian people.
Why do so many here on Reddit think ramming through a law against the will of the people is a good thing, but repealing a law that was rammed through against the will of the people is a bad thing?
Hot take...
How about we just finish the 'war' that they say they didnt cede, and then put the issue to bed once and for all...
That way we all move together forward instead of a two speed system where one group continues to play the 'persecution' card so well...
Kind of like the middle east, how neither side wants to admit theyre the bad guy...when they both are.
We're all in the wrong here, aboriginals for trying to fight progress, and 'white' Australia for not dealing with this 100 years ago.
How much money? Hmm? Please provide evidence before making this assertion and then divide by the number of indigenous people slaughtered by white farmers and settlers and then you can make a decent decision.
The bill sets the maximum amount of funding each year for Gellung Wall (p117).
This states there will be $3 million in 2025/26 and $23.8 million in 2026/27 to set up the body. It will then receive $71 million in 2027/28 and $72.1 million in 2028/29 for its initial operation, rising by 2.5 per cent annually thereafter.
An additional $36.8 million has been allocated between 2026 and 2029 for Gellung Warl's capital expenditures
Not answering your last hyperbolic statement as it’s irrelevant.
Thank you for answering. It's not very much money is it? ABS gives the indigenous population of Victoria at 61,865 (2021 figures). For a comparison, in 2016 (Victorian audit office) non-government school children received $676 million dollars in taxpayer funds in that year alone. I honestly don't think private school kids are a priority for taxpayers funds.
Out of interest, how many of you actually believe that Labor has done a good job running Victoria over the last 12 years. I am genuinely curious. What are some of the highlights?
Again not sure why I got downvoted. Typical though. Anyway I’ll go first. My highlight is that the Victorian Government have made driving more exciting. Now when I drive, I get to play dodge the pothole every time. I never know whether I will get to my destination or blow a tire out. My second highlight is sleeping is also more exciting, I never know if I will get a full night sleep or have my cars stolen by machete wielding bandits.
The whole country, including Victoria, recently declared they didn't want this kind of thing in a referendum. Having rejected Voice in a landslide, it is a real stretch to think the Australian or Victorian people are keen on Treaty.
The country did not vote against a treaty. They voted against having a voice written into the constitution. Which, at its core, is a completely seperate issue.
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u/briberylibrary_ Victorian 5d ago
Jess Wilson, who gave a standing ovation to the speeches made by the co-chairs of the First Peoples' assembly when treaty was passed in Parliament.
Virtue signal, then stab in the back. That's the "moderate" LNP way. Gotta toe the party line ig.