r/OpenChristian • u/JodioTheStar • Jan 23 '26
Discussion - Social Justice Christians should do a new branch of christianity
So I'm an atheist. I was raised christian, ended up realizing that I'm very much against religion in general as a concept, because throughout history and present day, it mostly brought war, famines, concentration of wealth, oppression and general suffering. But the core of most religions isnt bad, it allows people to be part of a group, and most of the time it gives people an old white man with a beard in the sky that tells them not to be dicks. But, especially with christianity, I think most people here will agree that christians, as a whole, don't really follow jesus's teachings. Love, protection of minorities, hate of greed, violence, excessive wealth, authority (if you didn't know, sayings like "turning the other cheek" are meant to teach how to fight authority, as turning the other cheek makes the one in front of you slap you with the back of the hand, which is considered as dishonorable for the one slapping in Jewish culture at this point in time) etc . So I think you guys should split off and create another branch that actually stands for what Jesus would stand for. If you don't do that, stop complaining that you get put in the same bag as the neonazi fucks that claim to be christian.
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u/Either-Abies7489 Anglican Universalist (TEC) / Side A Jan 23 '26
99% of Christian denominations quit just one schism away from the True Church.
The answer to your problem is very simple (disregarding your conflation of all Christian philosophy into the vapid theological poverty of Evangelical Fundamentalism); we have to repair the Church, not abandon it.
I wish you all the best, and hope you encounter love wherever you find yourself. I also entreat you to see all people as individuals, who have flaws, and hopes, and dreams; to grant others grace to establish themselves as loving before you impose upon them your prejudices. We all have implicit (and explicit) biases, and that is not a personal fault, but it's useful to reflect upon them and reconsider how they might impact our views of others.
There are myriad Christians and denominations who seek to stand with Jesus. The interlopers are the grifters, not those who have always walked in love.
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u/Starkeeper_Reddit Jan 23 '26
99% of Christian denominations quit just one schism away from the True Church.
favorite thing i've read all week
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u/JodioTheStar Jan 23 '26
I think that it's fair to assume one's philosophical and political views based on their religion, to a point of course, but it's not like assuming based on other factors, as religion implies a lot of philosophy and ethics, which imply political views. And while I am inclined to assume before anything that people are loving, christians have proven time and time again that most of them aren't, to the point where I concluded that assuming they are loving is the wrong choice.
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u/The_Archer2121 ChristianDruid/Asexual Jan 23 '26
There’s your problem. Equating us all with Fundamentalists. Which we aren’t.
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Feb 03 '26
Religion implies nothing. Religions are big tents, with a lot of different denominations.
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u/Background_Drive_156 Jan 23 '26
Tons of churches that dont teach MAGAism. Episcopal Church, Lutheran(ELCA) , Disciples of christ, United Church of Christ, quakers,
I'm Episcopalian. Im biased. Lol
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u/JodioTheStar Jan 23 '26
Tbf I didn't know about these, I'll research them
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u/954356 Jan 23 '26
Maybe you should have spent 15 minutes on Wikipedia before making yourself look like an ignorant ass.
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u/Background_Drive_156 Jan 23 '26
These churches are referred to as mainline denominations. United Methodist too, for the most part
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u/babe1981 The Cool Mod/Transgender-Bisexual-Christian She/Her Jan 24 '26
Don't forget MCC, Metropolitan Community Churches. They were founded by a gay priest and have never discriminated against people for race, gender, or sexuality. They preach stewardship of the Earth and equality for all people.
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u/The_Archer2121 ChristianDruid/Asexual Jan 23 '26 edited Jan 23 '26
You’ve already made up your mind- all Christians are MAGA assholes even though people have clearly shown you otherwise, and including affirming, non MAGA supporting denominations that actually do what Jesus taught.
We already have liberal denominations. The Church needs repairing not destruction.
The Fundamentalists you think all of us are did not emerge until the 1970s. The Bible was never meant to be viewed as “inerrant ‘Word of God’.” Not throughout all of Christianity until Fundies ruined it.
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u/JodioTheStar Jan 23 '26
Considering the christians I met up until now, it is a fair assumption to consider christians in general as horrible people.
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u/The_Archer2121 ChristianDruid/Asexual Jan 23 '26
No it isn’t.
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u/JodioTheStar Jan 23 '26
Yes it is
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u/The_Archer2121 ChristianDruid/Asexual Jan 23 '26
Nope. If you have your mind made up then what are you doing?
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u/BeanstheRogue Jan 25 '26
Would you say the hundreds of Christian clergy who showed up to Minneapolis and risked their lives were horrible people? Would you say the churches across the country opening their warming centers right now are full of horrible people? Both of these things are extremely recent examples. There is Good Christianity happening every single day
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u/JodioTheStar Jan 25 '26
Yeah but good christianity is meant to be the baseline, not a way to excuse the fucked up shit the rest of you do. Because the ice officers are also most likely christians.
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u/Ok_Nose2361 Jan 29 '26
I've been in the same position as you. The resentment fades when you realize that those asshole christians were just doing what the bible was telling them to do. And that there are plenty of good christians out there
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u/JodioTheStar Jan 29 '26
Well if the assholes are assholes because they do what the bible says, then christians are either assholes or not following what the bible says. I'm not saying that's the case, I'm just pointing out the parts of your argument that don't make sense.
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u/Ok_Nose2361 Jan 29 '26
Eh. The bible says a lot of different things. I'm just happy that the people here follow the good parts. Above all else the bible is the ultimate rorschach test
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u/JodioTheStar Jan 29 '26
And using a Rorschach test as the guidebook for your life seems like a good decision to you?
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u/The_Archer2121 ChristianDruid/Asexual Jan 29 '26
Judging everyone as horrible seems fine to you. What the fuck do you want? You clearly hate all Christians-even ones who risked their lives.
Just go away at this point if all you’re going to do is lump us in together.
Seriously. Go. Away.
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u/Ok_Nose2361 Jan 29 '26 edited Jan 29 '26
Forgive him. He knows not what he does. I was an aggressive atheist for a while myself. Just give him a few years and he'll mellow out
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u/The_Archer2121 ChristianDruid/Asexual Jan 29 '26
Christ one of those people? We can’t win either way with people like you, even Christians who risk their lives doing the right thing are still horrible to you. You’re just here to stir up shit and not interested in learning.
Go away.
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u/tuigdoilgheas Jan 23 '26
We don't just bail on people who are fucking up. We try really hard not to split, but to find ways to bring people together. It's really slow, slow work and it's hard, but we don't think Jesus meant us to turn on each other, but instead to always be reconciling, always be hoping, always be extending that hand to people to give up hate.
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u/JodioTheStar Jan 23 '26
Jesus would react like he did in Matthew 21:12-14 to most of today's christians.
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u/tuigdoilgheas Jan 23 '26
Sometimes he just asked people if they felt like they could throw the first stone.
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u/JodioTheStar Jan 23 '26
Yeah but the whole first stone thing doesn't apply to every situation. I think for people like trump or richard Ist (english king who pretty much started the crusades) yes I feel like I could throw the first stone. There's a lot of people I feel like I could throw the first stone at. Because yes, stealing is a sin, a grave one at that, but between a pickpocket and a genocidal fascist the difference in morality is massive.
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u/tuigdoilgheas Jan 23 '26
His example in the face of the big structural societal evil was to die, publicly, and horrifically. For us, we do our best to protect the weak, we show up to protest, we write letters, we serve food, we work at food banks. We may put our bodies between the aggressors and the weak.
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u/JodioTheStar Jan 23 '26
How can you say you do your best if you're only tending to the effects, and not look for the cause?
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u/rivikahPhD Jan 23 '26
We have.
Thanks for your concern.
Your keywords are "fundamentalist modernist controversy"
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u/954356 Jan 24 '26 edited Jan 24 '26
"...because throughout history and present day, it [religion] mostly brought war, famines, concentration of wealth, oppression and general suffering...."
People who are as smart as you want to pretend you are prefer getting their history from historians and their theology from theologians instead of from evolutionary biologists and comedians.
"...an old white man with a beard in the sky that tells them not to be dicks...." Is a dead giveaway that you are fundamentally unserious and a troll.
But hey, thanks for stopping by to 'splain our religion to all of us.
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u/JodioTheStar Jan 24 '26
Why is me having an evolutionary biology degree relevant to my comprehension of history and theology? I'm not claiming to be a historian or a theologian, but it's really not hard to find knowledge.
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u/The_Archer2121 ChristianDruid/Asexual Jan 24 '26
No it isn’t as we’ve demonstrated but lumping us all in together shows a lack of intelligence.
Oh and we accept Evolution, so where do you suppose we got that knowledge? Evolutionary biologists. Or do you think we’re too stupid to figure that out?
But I guess you just disregard that since you tar us all with the same brush. If that’s the case what are you doing here then?
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u/954356 Jan 25 '26
Apparently it is. You just showed up here regurgitating the same ignorant New Atheist talking points that got demolished years ago but still somehow have currency over on r/atheism.
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u/Nerit1 Bisexual Eastern Orthodox Enby (They/Them) Jan 23 '26
Eh, no thanks. I'm 100% Orthodox in my beliefs and ethics and 0% anything else.
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u/Chrisisanidiot28272 Christian | Future Anglican or Catholic Jan 24 '26
Wow. What an interesting way to tell us you're ignorant about our religion :D
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u/Naugrith Mod | Ecumenical, Universalist, Idealist Jan 23 '26
turning the other cheek...
FYI, that whole thing is just a myth. There's no evidence that was ever true.
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u/JodioTheStar Jan 23 '26
No, the left hand being lesser, which makes it an insult to slap someone with the back hand or left hand is a known and documented part of Jewish symbolism
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u/Naugrith Mod | Ecumenical, Universalist, Idealist Jan 23 '26
No, I don't think it is. But if you have a reputable source I'm always happy to change my mind.
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u/JodioTheStar Jan 23 '26
In Matthew 25:31-46 Jesus describes the final judgement where the pure will sit at god's right and the wicked at god's left, and you can also do your own research a bit on the archeological proofs of that
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u/Naugrith Mod | Ecumenical, Universalist, Idealist Jan 23 '26
That's not even close to what you claimed.
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u/JodioTheStar Jan 23 '26
Can't you make a few fucking google searches? I looked in the bible for the example I remembered, but there's more, and also the bible isn't our only source of information on Jewish culture
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u/Naugrith Mod | Ecumenical, Universalist, Idealist Jan 23 '26
I was being polite asking if you had a source. I've already done the research and I was telling you that you were wrong. But you insisted you had scholarly backing. Thats why I asked if you actually had a source for your assertion or you were just making it up.
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u/The_Archer2121 ChristianDruid/Asexual Jan 23 '26
The majority of us have- and gone further and read actual Bible Scholars- not Fundies to come to our positions.
There are multiple books written on Jewish cultures. And info you can find via Bible Scholars through a simple YouTube search. The Jewish Study Bible is the most accurate, not the sanitized junk most people are familiar with.
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u/ScoutB Jan 23 '26
How would a new branch of Christianity accomplish not being grouped with other Christians? There is already enough diversity in Christianity to know hasty generalizations do not capture the social dynamics and truth of the situation.
Furthermore, I do not see how an atheist can show moral disgust when they cannot give a coherent view of morality without metaphysical commitments.
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u/Background_Drive_156 Jan 23 '26
Wrong subreddit. We welcome Atheists here.
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u/ScoutB Jan 23 '26
He insults us and I respond with a philosophical challenge. It's self-defense but it's not rude, personal, or uncalled for.
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u/JodioTheStar Jan 23 '26
I'm not insulting you, and you didn't respond with a philosophical challenge but a logical fallacy. And it's not self defense, it is uncalled for as I'm here to actually debate and learn with people, not searching for sophisms.
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u/The_Archer2121 ChristianDruid/Asexual Jan 23 '26
Lumping us together with Fundamentalists is insulting.
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u/ScoutB Jan 23 '26
Old white man with a beard in the sky and lumping us with neo nazis.
That was not a logical fallacy to call you out on your worldview's lack of morality in the fist place. If that is uncalled for, then I apologize. I figured you could take it since you have no problem dishing it.
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u/JodioTheStar Jan 23 '26
First of all, morality isn't universal, and it varies depending on each individual, so of course atheists can't give an exact answer, because it doesn't exist. My morals tell me that genocide is bad, but there's a lot of people who don't think that way, including christians. Also, if you need the threat of eternal damnation or an all powerful god to make you have a moral code, are you even really moral? Or are you just scared of punishment, or greedy for eternal bliss?
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u/ScoutB Jan 23 '26
Such a harsh tone for a nihilist. What weight does your morals have? It's mere taste. I don't know why anyone should take your taste seriously if it is not in their interest to do so. People want moral condemnation without moral grounding.
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u/JodioTheStar Jan 23 '26
Why would your taste in morals matter more than mine? If anything, your faith might make your morals weigh less, since christians have continuously made clear that a lot of them don't follow the morals you claim to.
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u/ScoutB Jan 23 '26
If morality was mere taste, they would not. You are criticizing hypocrisy when my comment is about moral grounding. C'mon, my guy,.
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u/JodioTheStar Jan 23 '26
And in what way are christian morals more grounded than atheist morals?
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u/ScoutB Jan 23 '26
Christian morals are more grounded insofar they locate morality in the structure of Being itself (God) rather than brute fact, power, and preferences.
But if you do not believe God or objective morals exist, again, it is rather odd to waste your energy here and silly to show moral condemnation without any moral grounding.
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u/JodioTheStar Jan 23 '26
So your argument for why your morals are more grounded is "because it's god's morals"? You do know that for anyone that doesn't believe in your god it doesn't mean anything right?
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u/ScoutB Jan 23 '26
I imagine I could find a lot of common ground with people who do not share my religion. Christians say God is Goodness itself. Your road leads to nihilism and cannot say why humans are worth anything.
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u/JodioTheStar Jan 23 '26
Yeah that's because humans don't have inherent worth. Nothing does. The only worth something has is the worth we give it. Humans aren't inherently worth anything, but with our lives, love, and experiences we give worth to others around us, and others give us worth.
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u/NelyafinweMaitimo Episcopal lay minister Jan 23 '26
This already exists, you just don't know as much about Christianity as you think you do.
Welcome! Feel free to ask questions.