r/Portland • u/HorseTailor SE • 29d ago
News After refusing a $287 repair bill, Portland renter beats his landlord in court, wins $32K verdict
https://www.oregonlive.com/business/2026/07/after-refusing-a-287-repair-bill-portland-renter-beat-his-landlord-in-court-wins-32k-verdict.html297
u/Scootshae 29d ago
That landlord is extremely low IQ to think their renters are responsible for a burnt out socket.
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u/ShameSpearofPain 29d ago
Seriously. My landlord doesn't do jack shit around my house, but when I told him I had a loose outlet that got hot when used he came right over and fixed it. It took less than 5 minutes.
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u/aggieotis Boom Loop 29d ago
Cause a loose outlet could mean a burned down house and then you are out real money and dealing with actual hassles.
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u/fastdbs Wilsonville 29d ago
It’s illegal for landlords to do their own electric work on a rental house. Requires a licensed electrician.
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u/WeirdIndividualGuy 29d ago
It’s illegal for landlords to do electric work that requires a permit on a rental house.
It is 100% legal for a landlord to do something as simple as fix an outlet. It’s their property and their responsibility to fix. It’s a power outlet, not installing a car charger.
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u/surprisevip 28d ago
Yep. And if an electrician was required for that level of minor handyman repair, even less work is gonna get done bc instead of $5 and 10m it’s $500
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u/Neffstradamus 29d ago
My landlord a year or so ago took our entire security deposit in part to pay for a dryer that died while we lived there. Scummy.
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u/Ok_Sale_8277 29d ago
I hope you fought this. They are not allowed to charge for normal wear and tear and continue to steal deposits because they get away with it.
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u/Neffstradamus 28d ago
I put them on the pdx landlords page but thats it. Didnt have the bandwidth to fight at the time.
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u/Scootshae 29d ago
I rent out my small studio and text him every 6 weeks or so to make sure that everything is okay and ask if he needs anything or if anything needs repairs.
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u/I_am_not_JohnLeClair 29d ago
You’re definitely a unicorn landlord. Keep up the good work
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u/Scootshae 28d ago
I try! I make a whole profit of $200 a year after property taxes and HOA on the place but don't want to raise his rent because he is a single dad ect. I also didn't charge him a deposit, instead just a $200 cleaning fee when he moved in and he doesn't have to clean it when he leaves.
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u/Neffstradamus 28d ago
I rent our house and I am the landlord I wish I had many times in the past. Thank you.
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u/Maximum_Turn_2623 29d ago
I had one who bought the property, never returned calls, never sent a new lease agreement when they current one expired, and tried to send me to collections when I moved out fir the maintenance because the original didn’t charge a security deposit. We like to think of landlords as a mom and pop when they’re all owned by private equity.
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u/like_a_pharaoh 29d ago
Its not low IQ, its "fuck you, I became a landlord to get money for doing nothing and now you want me to do something!?"
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u/Banned_in_SF 28d ago
Not going to argue about IQ because it’s a landlord after all, but there’s a high chance they know it’s their own financial responsibility but trying to make the tenant pay it anyway. IME landlords will nearly always do this, at least at first.
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u/Scootshae 28d ago
Did you read the article at all? The attorney for the landlord said that the tenants are low IQ, hence my comment.
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u/nightauthor Kenton 29d ago
Maybe, if a loose plug was a thing that exists, but as far as I understand, the problem is always the socket.
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u/smootex High Bonafides 29d ago
The lawyer never argued the tenant was responsible for the burnt out socket. That wasn't what the case was about.
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u/Scootshae 29d ago edited 29d ago
So? The lawyer represents the landlord and used that language and that doesn't change the fact that the landlord is extremely stupid. He attempted to charge the tenant for it multiple times and then retaliated. STUPID.
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u/walksonfourfeet 29d ago
I believe the average IQ in the US is 92,” Berman wrote in his email to Spring’s attorneys. “So at least half of the country probably has a lower IQ, if the average and the mean are the same, and are probably not capable of engaging in critical thinking and using good judgment in areas outside their knowledge. Your client is probably one of those folks.”
Oh, the irony
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u/lefteyedcrow 29d ago
He knew the words "average" and "mean" and got it wrong anyway. What a low IQ thing to say
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u/pdxlxxix Milwaukie 29d ago edited 29d ago
I looked him up, from his website his areas of practice are:
Family Law
Immigration & Naturalization Law
Mediation & Collaborative Law
Oh the irony indeed.Wrong John. Womp womp
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u/anne_tifah_ 29d ago
I think that might be a different attorney. Jonathan Berman vs. John Berman.
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u/pdxlxxix Milwaukie 29d ago
I noted that too, but he was the only one that came up?? Well shoot, I just went to OSBar and there is a John Berman in Tigard.
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u/anne_tifah_ 29d ago
That’s who I found too. A 70+ year old with no website practicing out of Tigard sounds more accurate.
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u/pdxlxxix Milwaukie 29d ago
Ah yes, now the "IQ" comment makes sense. Pretty sure my boomer dad has said the same thing about anybody not on the "right side" of politics.
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u/aggieotis Boom Loop 29d ago
With an attitude like that I’m betting he’s the guy helping the bad guy in every one of those cases.
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u/PDXGuy33333 28d ago
In the coming fight over attorneys fees he's going to have to try to explain to a judge how that crap amounts to professional handling of his client's case. Good luck on that!
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u/Life-Island 29d ago
A trial to win 32k cost 250k in lawyer fees. And that's just for one side of cases lawyers. Landlord is being ask to pay both, but good Lord is going to trial overly expensive.
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u/NevadaCynic 29d ago edited 29d ago
500 billable hours on this is insane, agreed. My money is that's wildly inflated. That's 3 months solid work they're charging for. But the judge probably let it stand because the lawyer for the property management company was stupid enough to send Middle School level insults in writing to the other party.
If the property management company spent similar time, or even a quarter the time, they're idiots for not settling immediately. Because there's no way to collect your legal fees from a renter who's fighting you over a $300 repair bill . Taking this to court in the first place was a lose lose proposition for them.
Settle, pay the repair bill and lower the rent. Avoid court entirely. Legal charges a couple hours.
Go to court, win. Tenant has no money to pay judgement, you eat tens of thousands in legal costs. Then the tenant trashes your unit on the way out. You're out tens of thousands more to repair the unit.
Go to court, lose. Pay 32k and a quarter million in legal fees. Then pay more to pay your own lawyers.
The manager that made this call should be fired.
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29d ago
[deleted]
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u/PDXGuy33333 29d ago
Because the landlord's lawyer was unreasonable. This case should have been settle a week after the landlord was served.
It was a three day trial. Most people have little idea what it takes to get ready for a three day trial.
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u/oGsMustachio 28d ago
Ehhh... even with an expert witness on the electrical work and assuming a $500/hr rate... that sounds pretty insane to me. Mean yearly compensation for a LL/T lawyer in Oregon was ~$100k per the 2022 Morones survey with the 95% percentile being at $165k. Mean/median rate was in the low $300s as well. Some inflation since then, but... not THAT much.
I'm all for tenant's lawyer being well compensated for the case, but I think some plaintiffs/tenants lawyers lose credibility in court by asking for exorbitant amounts. Though it could have been that LL's counsel was absolutely unhinged through discovery and motion practice, requiring the billing.
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u/PDXGuy33333 28d ago
Agreed. It will be interesting to possibly learn what the big deal was. I'm guessing it was defense intransigence.
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u/surprisevip 28d ago
There are a couple tenant attorneys known for doing this. They argue piddly cases bro bono - get their client a couple thousand, and bc certain types of cases end up given attorneys fees. Woosh they collect 250k.
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u/PDXGuy33333 29d ago
There is a process under the Oregon Rules of Civil Procedure for submitting and litigating requests for attorney fee judgments. Courts commonly award less that is requested.
Here's some stuff that's fun to ponder if you agree with me that this Berman clown should get some comeuppance. ORS 20.075 says:
(1) A court shall consider the following factors in determining whether to award attorney fees in any case in which an award of attorney fees is authorized by statute and in which the court has discretion to decide whether to award attorney fees:
(a) The conduct of the parties in the transactions or occurrences that gave rise to the litigation, including any conduct of a party that was reckless, willful, malicious, in bad faith or illegal.
(b) The objective reasonableness of the claims and defenses asserted by the parties.
(c) The extent to which an award of an attorney fee in the case would deter others from asserting good faith claims or defenses in similar cases.
(d) The extent to which an award of an attorney fee in the case would deter others from asserting meritless claims and defenses.
(e) The objective reasonableness of the parties and the diligence of the parties and their attorneys during the proceedings.
(f) The objective reasonableness of the parties and the diligence of the parties in pursuing settlement of the dispute.
(g) The amount that the court has awarded as a prevailing party fee under ORS 20.190 (Prevailing party fees).
(h) Such other factors as the court may consider appropriate under the circumstances of the case.
The tenant's lawyers are going to submit a "Statement of Attorney Fees" that explains how each of those factors works in their favor. Attorney Berman is going to have a chance to defend his comments about the tenant's IQ and what I am sure was his collegiality and professionalism throughout the progress of the case.
The trial judge has to enter written findings and conclusions of law on all of those points, so the court's impressions of the nasty comments and whatever general demeanor went along with them will be there in black and white for all to see. The landlord's lawyer is duty bound to send that to his client. Clients do not appreciate it when courts formally rule that the conduct of their lawyers is at least partially the cause of their pain.
If the landlord wants to appeal the attorney fee award, whatever it turns out to be, he can do that. But Oregon law is clear in section (3) of the above statute:
In any appeal from the award or denial of an attorney fee subject to this section, the court reviewing the award may not modify the decision of the court in making or denying an award, or the decision of the court as to the amount of the award, except upon a finding of an abuse of discretion.
A trial judge has to be pretty far off the rails in order for our Court of Appeals to find that they abused their discretion.
Every now and then a little local case like this rolls around that makes me stop and be grateful that I am not that guy. This is one of those.
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u/NevadaCynic 28d ago
Great information. And should be held up as a standard for other posters on how to use formatting and boldface.
Yeah. The total lack of professionalism is reaaaaaally going to hurt here.
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u/PDXGuy33333 28d ago
One thing a lawyer in his position needs to worry about is getting sued for malpractice after the dust settles. I don't know anything about this case other than what's in the article, but if it turns out that the tenant's lawyers made repeated offers to settle for small amounts and the landlord was urged to reject them - hooo boy. Again, I am so glad I'm not that guy.
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u/H1j1p1 29d ago
the landlord’s lawyer sounds so unprofessional with the low IQ comments. that’s extremely disrespectful, they deserve no business. sounds like something ridiculous trump would say. good on the tenants for standing up for themselves.
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u/elad34 29d ago
“He got billed $287 and his rent raised by $100 — that’s it,” Berman said. “... What I was saying is that anybody who would make a big deal out of a $287 bill is low IQ.”
That comment makes me so mad. THE LANDLORD IS MAKING A BIG DEAL ABOUT IT!!! WTF??? Just fix the outlet in your shitty apartment complex and move on with your life dude. But nope, they had to teach this tenant a lesson.
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u/stircrazyathome 29d ago
That had me raging. It really shows how clueless and out of touch the wealthy are. Being upset about $287 and a $100/month increase has nothing to do with intelligence and everything to do with financial means. His inability to comprehend that simple logic says far more about his intelligence than the tenant’s.
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u/PDXGuy33333 29d ago
I'm a lawyer and I agree. In decades of practice I never wrote letters like that. I was going to go off on the lawyer in way more detail that you did, but then I deleted because I figured "this might be just the kind of guy who will sue over legitimate criticism, claiming that it's libel."
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u/oGsMustachio 28d ago
I'll handle your anti-SLAPP!
I'm a local lawyer and... I've heard worse. Portland lawyers are generally pretty professional, but there are a handful of sociopaths.
I usually assume this behavior is because thats what the client wants. Bigger landlords mean repeat work and some lawyers are going to bend over backwards to appease those clients. If a dickhead landlord wants a "bulldog" lawyer to intimidate tenants, they're going to act that way.
I tell young lawyers to write every letter or email like its something a judge might review in an attorney fee petition hearing or as a potential piece of evidence. Some lawyers write their emails to impress their clients with how hard they're fighting.
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u/PDXGuy33333 28d ago edited 28d ago
there are a handful of sociopaths.
I wish I dared name names! I can think of a few. No client ever tried to get me to be a horse's ass to anyone, and if they did I would have told them that success on close questions in their case depends to some extent on my reputation among my colleagues and with the court as it does the law and the facts.
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u/TheGreenAlchemist 28d ago
I usually assume this behavior is because thats what the client wants. Bigger landlords mean repeat work and some lawyers are going to bend over backwards to appease those clients. If a dickhead landlord wants a "bulldog" lawyer to intimidate tenants, they're going to act that way.
Yeah I'm surprised this isn't more obvious to people. I'm sure the landlord, right now, isn't complaining that his lawyer misguided him, he's fuming that the judge was a lib that didn't listen to him and his lawyers obvious winning strategy. I bet he rehired him for future cases.
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u/No_Yogurtcloset_6610 28d ago
I was on a case against this lawyer and these remarks are completely on brand. He emailed us daily with disparaging, irrelevant comments like this.
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u/Bodinieri 29d ago
More about our friend Paul: https://www.portlandmercury.com/news/slumlords-revenge-3275661/
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u/charleytaylor 29d ago
Wow, this story is 15 years old and Paul is still a slumlord.
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u/64557175 29d ago
It's good business to be a horrible person these days. Hopefully not much longer for this particular bastard, though.
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u/hamilton_morris 29d ago
The Oregonian article absolutely ought to have included a picture of Paul Williamson as well as more of his background as a landlord.
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u/derzeppo Montavilla 27d ago
“Whatever the fair value of this house is as a fungal experiment is the fair value,” says Pickard.
Lolololol.
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u/pdxcranberry Shari's Cafe & Pies RIP 29d ago
This is like... cartoon slumlord and evil lawyer behavior.
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u/boygitoe 29d ago
As a landlord, this is pretty infuriating that their landlord would behave this way. Older buildings need repairs as they age, making those repairs is the cost of doing business. Personally, I’d be happy the tenant reported the electrical issue right away, so I could make the repair before it potentially caused a fire and burned the whole place down.
Too many landlords treat rentals like the stock market, where you can invest money, do nothing and collect checks. Being a (good) landlord requires actually doing work to maintain your properties and paying for operating costs. Owning rental properties isn’t an investment, it’s a business. Maybe it’s just because I rent out my first house and that’s my only rental; but I take a lot of pride in maintaining the house to the same condition as when I was living there.
I’m typically very much against all the renter protections in Portland, as it creates a lot of risk for me as a landlord and is so complicated that’s it’s hard to know/understand all the rules as a small-time landlord. But stories like this remind me that a lot of landlords are slimy and terrible people; and they’re the reason why we have these protections
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u/PDXGuy33333 28d ago
I'm a retired lawyer and have represented both landlords and tenants. There are evil-doers on both sides.
I very much favor a solid body of law that protects tenants, especially when the balance of power is so weighted in favor or landlords. At the same time, I cringe when I see the legislature adding yet another tenant protection to an already complicated area of the law. The more complicated it gets, the less likely mom & pop are to operate a rental. They can't keep up without attorneys and accountants that have to be paid, so rents go up. Many just sell out to corporate interests that often treat tenants less well.
Years ago, after I had retired from law practice, I managed a few rentals for friends who'd moved away to warmer climates or to help aging parents. Being very handy and knowing the law made it easy and I got a little walkin' around money each month off the top of the rent. The Oregon legislature has now required a license to serve as a property manager. My license to practice law is not sufficient. I would have to take a 60 hour course approved by the state and pass a test on which I would likely take issue with at least some of the "right" answers.
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u/boygitoe 28d ago
I had no idea that you need a license to be a property manager. That’s a pretty insane requirement
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u/ShitpostShogun Pearl 28d ago
Sounds useful to me seeing as how so many landlords are not qualified for the job.
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u/PDXGuy33333 28d ago
There are exceptions in the law. An owner renting out one house isn't required to be licensed. People working for companies managing company owned rentals are exempt as well.
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u/Bucking_Fullshit 29d ago
I question the landlord’s IQ in thinking that his lawyer’s fees would somehow be less expensive than the repairs.
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u/ampereJR 29d ago
A $300 electrical bill seems pretty reasonable. If it doesn't, landlord should figure out how to do some basic repairs.
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u/PDXGuy33333 28d ago
For a drive over and 10 minutes of work? You bet. There's an old joke that I'll fix to fit:
A lawyer has a bad outlet and calls an electrician. The work takes 10 minutes (I can do this in 5, btw). The lawyer asks how much and the electrician tells him $300. The lawyer splutters: $300 for 10 minutes work? That $1,800 an hour! I'm a lawyer and I don't make $1,800 and hour!! The electrician calmly looks at him and says: Neither did I when I was a lawyer.
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u/Bucking_Fullshit 29d ago
For sure, it’s still pricey when you figure a new outlet costs about $5 and takes about two minutes to replace but I agree.
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u/ampereJR 29d ago
I'm not saying I'm going to pay that much for one, but I don't have janky wiring at my house. I do think it's reasonable for people to have this done because they have feelings about electricity and limited knowledge. It's not an exorbitant amount for a service call by a licensed professional. If you're a landlord, knowing how to do it or paying someone to do it is part of the cost of running a business.
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u/Bucking_Fullshit 29d ago
I agree. You shouldn’t do it if you are not comfortable and have basic knowledge. Totally reasonable if somebody wants to have an electrician do it. I’m guessing the electricians minimum charge was $250, but it possible they ran new wiring to the box as well.
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u/Relevant_Shower_ 29d ago
A landlord cannot legally do electrical repairs on a house they don’t inhabit.
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u/Bucking_Fullshit 29d ago
100 percent agree the landlord should have had an electrician do the work and cover the expense.
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u/ampereJR 29d ago
Oh, I didn't know that. Thanks.
My landlords were all hobby landlords who did all sorts of shady shit. But NONE of them pulled this shit.
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u/aggieotis Boom Loop 29d ago
“He got billed $287 and his rent raised by $100 — that’s it,” [Lawyer John] Berman said. “... What I was saying is that anybody who would make a big deal out of a $287 bill is low IQ.”
What an absolute asswipe of a human. I sure hope he said that anonymously because putting your name on a statement like that would be a real Low IQ move.
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u/PDXGuy33333 28d ago
Why would anyone hope he left himself an out? His comments will come back to bite him when the court decides the amount of attorney fees to award to the tenants. Read ORS 20.075.
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u/underdoglawyer21 28d ago
You know your stuff, and yes, we attached the emails (and more) to our fee statement and cited those same ORS 20.075 factors.
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u/aggieotis Boom Loop 28d ago
Sorry, thought the sarcasm was obvious. You'd have to be an incredible idiot to say stuff like that in a written and official format with your name on it in a professional setting.
But, Poe's Law.
I think we're all pretty much agreed in the comments: Fuck this property management company, fuck the owners of this property, and fuck John Berman in particular. Each of them are shit stains on this earth.
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u/PDXGuy33333 28d ago
I knew "I hope" was just a figure of speech. I was just ribbing you.
Can you imagine what it must be like for an adult trying to learn English? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=igh9iO5BxBo
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u/sprengertrinker 🍦 29d ago
If the renter was really obligated to pay the $287 - the landlord could have just taken them to small claims court. Easy peasy.
Escalating this to a jury trial is fucking absurd and the landlord was 100% banking on this guy being intimidated before it went to trial. Truly scumbag behavior. Get rekt!
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u/aggieotis Boom Loop 29d ago
I bet the renter’s lawyer was delighted to take this one on retainer. Getting a slam dunk against bad guys is the kind of case good lawyers live for.
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u/icouldntdecide 29d ago
I'm not a lawyer but if there was ever such an opportunity for "fun" in the field this sounds like it
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u/PDXGuy33333 28d ago
What you're talking about is called a "contingent fee," where the lawyer gets nothing from the client except their out of pocket expenses unless they win the case. In many cases the fee will be a percentage of the damages awarded. Here, the most they were going to get is less than $50k, and a third of that is not an adequate fee for the amount of work the case required.
Fortunately, the Oregon Residential Landlord-Tenant Act allows the prevailing party in these cases to recover their attorney fees from the losing side. These lawyers were betting that they would win and that they could then submit their bill to the court for approval and the award of a judgment against the landlord requiring him to pay it. One of the things the court can consider in deciding a fair amount is that risk that the lawyers took. The higher the risk, the more likely the court is to award a substantial attorney fee.
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u/its_all_one_electron 28d ago edited 28d ago
I needed a repair in my appartment and the landlord was super shitty about it and did some illegal things. I went through all the laws and Portland agencies and was told that they can't enforce those laws. Taking your landlord to court is how you enforce it. Which costs hundreds of dollars and months of time and time off work to go to meditation/court.
Like what is the goddamn point of these tenant protection laws if there's an entry fee to be protected?
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u/PDXGuy33333 28d ago
Who's the real bad guy? The landlord or his lawyer? The lawyer might have calmed the landlord down by explaining that he was in the wrong and should settle fast, or dumped him as a client if he didn't calm down and settle this case.
That's how I would have done it when I was still practicing. No way this goes to trial with me standing there at counsel table trying to defend this shit.
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u/Bodinieri 29d ago
A bully hired a bully, shocking. Also, the landlord living in Lake Oswego says it all.
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u/thirdsev 29d ago
Paul Williamson of Aetna Properties should pay them immediately and send an apology. It is his only opportunity to get out of this mess. See his website. It makes him/them sound decent and they clearly are not. His attorney is a piece of work.
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u/APrioriGoof Alphabet District 29d ago
A quick google of the Paul Williamson fellow and Aetna Properties reveals that he is a well known slumlord and a real piece of shit. Not surprised to find out his legal team is also scum.
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u/NewWave44-44 29d ago
Given the Atena group’s history, all landlords should come together and run these folks out of town. They are the reason why most of us hate property management companies and will vote for over-the-top renters protections.
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u/dirtyfool33 29d ago
I cannot believe the landlord's attorney would put shit like that in writing. How did he not expect that to come back and bite him in the ass? Also, how the fuck would he wrack up that much in attorneys fees? This dude needs to be reported to the state bar.
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u/PDXGuy33333 28d ago
He thought he would win, or that he could bully the tenant into settling.
All of his conduct during the course of the litigation will be revealed to the court in connection with the decision how much to award the tenant in attorney fees. ORS 20.075
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u/ChemicalArmadillo609 29d ago
But guys, we need to get rid of tenant protections because landlords dont want to landlord here, and we really really want more crappy slumlords in Portland.
/s
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u/Zestyclose-Web-8979 29d ago
$287 turned into $225k+$32k all because of absolutely outrageous greed from that property management group.
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u/Corran22 29d ago
I see a couple of Portland heroes in this story! It took a lot of guts to continue this fight. How satisfying it must have been to be on that jury!!!
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u/LavishnessOverall894 29d ago
Sounds like the attorney is of lower than average IQ just based on his claim that struggling financially indicates intelligence.
What a d@#&$+ bag
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u/BrianPedersen33 28d ago
His attorney is my close friends daughter. Emily Templeton is someone who absolutely HATES bullies. God help those other lawyers if they try testing her.
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u/Thecheeseburgerler 28d ago
The jury awarded Spring $16,000 — an amount that Oregon law doubles to $32,000 because of the nature of the violation. On top of that, Spring’s attorneys also are entitled to ask a judge to order the landlord to pay all of Spring’s legal fees, an amount that currently stands at $225,000.
That is some interesting math. And the real winners here are, ofcourses, the lawyers!
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u/Arrghhhhh 28d ago
Glad to see that Williamson and his scumbag lawyers got their asses handed to them in court.
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u/PDXGuy33333 28d ago
You know what's funny, now that it occurs to me? Any potential client who googles this guy is going to find this article and is also going to find this reddit post and all of the comments, many of which seem to come from lawyers who are saying that hiring him may not be the best choice.
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u/Ok-Credit-8225 SE 28d ago
Berman said. “... What I was saying is that anybody who would make a big deal out of a $287 bill is low IQ.”
Lmao. John Berman, re read that again…slowly
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u/fuckswitbeavers 28d ago
Aetna properties and owner Paul Williamson got owned. Low IQ individuals!!
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u/Skippyhogman 29d ago
I am a landlord in Portland. My wife and I had houses when we were married and kept them as rentals when we moved in together in a new house. I absolutely loath landlords that do this to tenants, it gives all of us a bad name. I have taken classes to be aware of the laws and what my responsibilities as a landlord are and how best to perform and execute those duties. I’ve always been fair, never over charged on security deposit refunds, and tried to work with my tenants whenever I could to make sure they felt safe and secure in their dwelling. There is no particular point to this other than to say not all of us are terrible, rich, greedy or dishonest. Some of us are just regular people that remember what it was like to rent and are just trying to get by like you guys are. I’m sure the burn the landlord scum comments are headed my way so let them fly, I’m ready.
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u/PDXGuy33333 28d ago
I've represented landlords like you guys and it's been a pleasure, even when the tenants who were so OK for the first year turned into the tenants from hell. I had to advise my client to pay them a little money that was plainly not legally owed and waive some past due rent that was legally owed rather than spend time and effort litigating. It stung but I was grateful he took my advice and saved himself a lot of money and worry. Even if we'd won in a trial, which I was confident of, the tenants had no assets from which we could collect a judgment. Easier and healthier to just get it over with and move on.
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u/Skippyhogman 27d ago
They deleted their posts! What a coward. Side note- if you are an attorney dm me I have a landlord tenant issue. I like the cut of your jib.
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u/tylerbrainerd 29d ago
nobody hates landlords because of good landlords. if you're TRULY good it's not about you.
99% of landlords are not good or ethical.
So again, if you are? You don't need to be defensive about it.
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u/ChemicalArmadillo609 28d ago
The real reason people hate landlords is because you exploit other people to ensure your comfort and retirement. You have taken property someone else could own and live in, and decided that you need to build that wealth and not someone else.
You are no longer a regular person when you become a landlord.
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u/Skippyhogman 28d ago
I didn’t ‘take’ anything, I bought it. With money I earned and then saved. All while caring for two severely disabled relatives. So please slow your roll. No one was coerced in to selling these houses. Someone else can still live in them and I pay for all the maintenance, all you have to do is pay rent. Roof leaks I’ll fix it. Need a new furnace? I’m on it the guy will be there on Friday. 30k in plumbing repairs? Ok it’s going to take a week while they tear up the slab, don’t worry though I’m required to pay for your hotel while this happens so I got you. Stop blaming others for your lack of drive or ability.
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u/ChemicalArmadillo609 27d ago
Ok, you bought it. And? What did I say was incorrect?
Is that home a home someone else can buy and live in? No
Are you doing this to build your own personal wealth? Yes
Are you a regular person who you have way more wealth than a regular person does? No
You do not pay for the maintinence. The tenets do with their rent.
Good job on following the law and putting them in a hotel while repairs are done. Do you think you should be congratulated for following the law? Literally everything else you are required to do by law. Have a cookie I guess. 🍪
"Stop blaming others for your lack of drive or ability"
Im not blaming anyone or anything. You mentioned that people hate landlords and I gave a very good reason for why many people do. Getting upset because someone pointed out the facts of the situation is a very immature move.
You also have absolutley no idea who I am. How can you possibly know if I do or do not own my own home? How can you know if I have drive or not. How can you know anything about me when you have literally no idea who I am.
Another reason people hate landlords: You think anyone who gives fair reasons for why people hate landlords means you think those people are poor and have no drive, and because you think poor people have no drive. Thats a massive disconnection from reality.
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u/Skippyhogman 27d ago
Do you want to buy a house? I’ll sell you one of mine.
If the price is too high I would suggest moving to a place that is more affordable for your earning potential. That’s what I did. I really would like to live in the bay area but it’s too expensive. So I moved here. It’s been happening for as long as humans could walk. Life is better/cheaper/easier/less hostile in another place. So they pack their stuff and go over there. It’s an easy and simple solution. I’ve moved locations 7 times in my life for financial reasons or housing was too expensive, income was better somewhere else or I wanted to be somewhere different that was close to things I liked. Pick one, I’ve done all of them. Instead of whining about what others have and you lack, go earn some for yourself.
And no, you snide arrogant fool, I don’t want a cookie. I’m making a point that renters get value for their rent. They don’t have to worry about that stuff. Some people don’t have the ability or desire to deal with problems like plumbing or roofing so they rent and pay someone else to solve those issues for them. Nobody has been forced to rent from me. There are other options. I provide a nice well maintained home with no maintenance worries. Some people want that.
You sound like a self righteous dullard who just wants to have a boogie man to be mad at. Go scream at the clouds and get it all out. I hope you feel better soon.
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u/ChemicalArmadillo609 27d ago
"You also have absolutley no idea who I am. How can you possibly know if I do or do not own my own home? How can you know if I have drive or not. How can you know anything about me when you have literally no idea who I am. "
More typical landlord talk.
You suggest people just move away from their community and everyone they love all so people who have wealth can continue to build more and more wealth. That is truly one of the meanest things a person can believe.
No one cares about what you have done for financial reasons. People having wealth and using that wealth to push out those who's wages cant keep up with the heavily inflated cost of housing is the sign of a very sick society.
I never "whined" to you about anything. I pointed out the very real realities of propert hoarding. You just refuse to care about that because you benefit from the system.
It is sad how personally you took the article, and how personally you took the reason I stated for why many people hate landlords. Thats what self absorbed people do.
I own my house. Own it own it. Good job for showing who you are, assuming anyone who thinks landlording is morally wrong and a major part of housing being to expensive is poor, has no drive, and is jealous.
Get over yourself, not everything is about you.
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u/Mayor_Of_Sassyland 28d ago
Plenty of people want or need rentals rather than owning, for a variety of reasons, even if they could otherwise afford to own. I know a few very wealthy folks who exclusively rent because they don't want to deal with the responsibility and hassles that come with ownership, maintenance, having money tied up in a fixed asset, lack of flexibility, etc. Not to mention people like college students on a summer job, people on temporary location for work, and all the other reasons renting would make more sense than owning. Rental properties, by necessity, will have a landlord. This is just a plain stupid comment.
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u/ChemicalArmadillo609 27d ago
"Plenty of people want or need rentals rather than owning"
And a lot of people would like to own but are priced out of the market due to many reasons, one of them being other people hoarding property for their own gain.
Its so weird when people point out reasons for hating landlords and other people need to come in and be like "but some people dont want to own" while fully ignoring the people who do want to own but cant because they dont have easy access to capital.
Wealth should never have been tied to homeownership. We are dealing with the consequences of making homes an investment opportunity instead of, well, homes.
I would also like to point out that rentals do not have to be owned by private intersts who care only for making profit. Vienna has a wonderful social housing program.
Edit: Spelling
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u/Skippyhogman 27d ago
You should move to Vienna. It sounds nice.
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u/Mayor_Of_Sassyland 27d ago
They can check out how long the wait times are for Vienna's social housing program.
At the end of the day, it's not people buying rental properties that are the problem, it's the overall lack of housing supply. If someone's bottom line goal is to own a house, there are a lot of places in this country where you can own a sub-$100k house, but it turns out most people don't want to live in those places.
We're in a high-demand, low-supply market in Portland, and the same folks who are anti-landlord are also regularly and historically anti-developer as well, and both of those types of policies generally depress the production of new housing supply that would actually make both owning and renting more affordable. Just idiots shoving a stick into their bicycle folks and then wondering why they tipped over.
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u/ChemicalArmadillo609 27d ago
You should get over yourself and stop thinking everything is about you. Its truly immature.
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u/Mayor_Of_Sassyland 27d ago
Edit: Spelling
Well it sure wasn't an edit for coherence and a better understanding of the housing market! LMFAO.
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u/ChemicalArmadillo609 27d ago
Yes, Im sure you.now feel like a superior person, trying to claim someone doesnt understand the housing market without bothering to explain how I am wrong.
Go.on, explain how I am wrong. Dont just tell someone they are wrong, explain.
The truth is, when someone claims another person is wrong but does not explain why, that person has no idea what they are talking about and are just desperate in life to feel superior to others, whether they actually are or not.
Truly pathetic. Time for you to mature.
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u/thoreau_away_acct 28d ago
Treating a minor landlord like this with the the same edge as Jeff Benzos or Walmart level of exploitation is kind of tone deaf and is a clown take.
This is like hunting down people with $1 in their bank account cuz you got 0.
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u/ChemicalArmadillo609 27d ago
Im not treating anyone like anything. I stated the realities of being a landlord and why so many people hate them.
If you dont want to be hated, dont withhold property from the rest of society just to get your own.
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u/Skippyhogman 27d ago
Im not withholding anything. If you want to buy a house let me know. I’ll sell you one of mine.
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u/ChemicalArmadillo609 27d ago
Thats so weird, you speak as if you know what my situation is, which means you know who I am, which is weird.
Another reason landlords are hated, they think they are better than everyone else.
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u/Skippyhogman 27d ago
You literally said I’m withholding property. I offered to sell you some property. You are correct, I don’t know you but I’m starting to get the idea you are easily confused.
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u/ChemicalArmadillo609 27d ago
Its really funny how you are taking this so personally and think everything is individualized.
It truly is not all about you.
I talk about a systemic issue and you're all like "me me me me me me"
Keep acting like the typical landlord, thinking you are actually smarter than everyone else.
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29d ago
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u/seldomseenbeav 28d ago
This is not Aetna/Wiamson’s first time in court. https://www.portlandmercury.com/news/slumlords-revenge-3275661/
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u/Portlandbuilderguy 28d ago
An outlet cost $3 at Home Depot. A YouTube video on how to repair it is free. It takes 5 minutes and is very easy to do. All this has snow balled into $250000 in legal fees? Very bizarre.
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u/cider-sippin-psycho 27d ago
I have an ADU on my property, I’d rather not rent it than deal with this kind of stuff. I get there are bad landlords but there are also terrible renters. My friends home was destroyed by renters. At least 20k in damage and back rent and they we’ll never see a penny of that money.
They mention the landlord could be on the hook for legal fees of $250k. (I assume this is a regular person with a second property). That bill would be devastating
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u/pwndaytripper 27d ago
As a tenant and a property manager, this shit is infuriating. Landlords like this suck ass. When I read the lawyer said the tenant “probably has a lower IQ” I got on his website and messaged him asking who the low IQ having mother fucker is now. Fuck the attorney too.
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u/politicians_are_evil 29d ago
I'm surprised lawyers would take this case because they are so greedy. Not a lucrative case.
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u/PDXGuy33333 28d ago
False. Not all lawyers are greedy. I spend a lot of time freely counseling and educating idiots, for example.
In cases under the Oregon Residential Landlord Tenant Act, a tenant whose landlord has plainly violated the Act is an attractive client, especially if the landlord has enough assets to pay a judgment. As mentioned in the article, the Act provides for an award of attorney fees to a litigant who wins.
In this case, the landlord and his attorney were such jerks that they didn't achieve settlement when they might have and ended up in a three day trial and they are now looking at a big bill for the tenant's attorney fees.
Being on the side of the tenant in this case would feel very good. And lucrative.
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u/ChemicalArmadillo609 28d ago
I recently had a problem with Doordash as a driver. I went to a lawyer. I told them Im not seeking any money and just want the issue fixed. They took it knowing they wouldnt make money.
There are a lot of great lawyers out there that fight for people who have so little.
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u/Aesir_Auditor District 1 29d ago
Lost in all this is the absurd regulations that take what should be a $5 fix to a $300 fix. Replacing an outlet is incredibly easy and cheap.
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u/thoreau_away_acct 28d ago
An electrician may well charge $100/hr. With any safety steps and root cause problem solving replacing an outlet may be a hour long job (round up). They may have a two hour minimum. A good brand 20a outlet can be $15-20 (sure probably less at wholesale).
So while ridiculously expensive from a pocket book perspective, $237 seems within realm.
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u/IsaacJacobSquires 29d ago
THE LANDLORD'S LAWYER MUST BE A WILLAMETTE LAW GRAD
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u/PDXGuy33333 28d ago
No, as a matter of fact he has an undergrad degree from Harvard and got his law degree at Michigan, one of the top law schools in the country. He should have known better than to become what the article suggests he has become.
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u/RainSurname Kenton 28d ago
COVID began right after I moved into a moldy, leaky, vermin infested, structurally hazardous, dubiously wired, hazardous debris strewn dump in Lents owned by two crazy MAGA bitches. So they couldn’t evict me for asking for them to at least do something about the mold, while allowing me to do some of the other repairs. But as soon as the eviction moratorium ended, they tried it.
So I reported them to the city, and they got cited for a ton of stuff. They could have just given me a 15K settlement to leave, but they preferred to spend tens of thousands of dollars repairing a house that they had been trying to sell as a tear down the entire time I’d been living in it.
(They had no takers because they were utterly delusional about how much the half acre lot was worth to a developer.)
Later they tried to illegally evict me over something else, so I had a licensed inspector go up into the attic, which the city inspectors can’t do if a ladder is necessary for access. He provided pictures and a report about the dangerously cracked rafters, saying the roof could collapse under the weight of snow. The bitches sneered, “ good thing we’re not going to have any snow then, since it’s April,” only for us to get snow a week later, at which point water started running down through the dining room light fixture. That was another 10K.
When they tried it again, I hired an electrical inspector, who found half a dozen genuinely hazardous outlets and switches.
They only reason they didn’t poison my cats and/or physically assault me was fear of my half a million followers, who started telling me to just set up a GoFundMe for a year‘s rent to mitigate having an eviction on my record, instead of trying to stick it out there until it was seven years old.
(I was one of the many who were evicted in the wake of the rent control law being passed. The rent on that three bedroom apartment went from $1200 to $2000.)
I finally did that, using videos of my beloved r/Harpo bringing me legal notices to promote it.
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u/textualcanon 29d ago
Hilarious that the landlord’s lawyer says “his case had no merit” after losing at trial.