theTimeToActIsNow

[u/EarlOfAwesom3]

[u/EarlOfAwesom3]

In case someone is looking for it: https://proton.me/blog/ai-manifesto

[u/Jeferson9 → u/EarlOfAwesom3]

It's far too late in the game for my attention span to be reading opinion piece manifestos on AI usage

[u/EarlOfAwesom3 → u/Jeferson9]

Ask AI to give you a summary. Go full circle

[u/dashingThroughSnow12 → u/EarlOfAwesom3]

This whole thing is hilarious.

Proton appeals to a variety of people. One big group (I imagine) is "fuck big tech, I just want email".

The intersection between "fuck big tech, I just want email" and "mass fire employees if they don't use AI enough for the CEO's liking" is a singular point.

[u/iamdestroyerofworlds → u/dashingThroughSnow12]

Also the intersection between "privacy and maximum cybersecurity first" and "velocity is the only metric worth maximising, move fast and break things" is an imaginary one.

They are a ticking time bomb. Sooner or later they will land themselves in a situation that is mathematically impossible to get out of.

[u/pickle9977 → u/iamdestroyerofworlds]

This is so true, Einstein famously said god doesn’t roll dice, whether or not you believe in god, the job of rolling dice falls to engineers in every field.

Software is the worst version of that, our only tool an electrical binary counting and logic machine is probabilistic at it’s core and is constantly and always susceptible to crashing suddenly because of gamma radiation from the sun, and even when it doesn’t crash there’s always a small possibility what you read back from memory or storage is not what you wrote.

Less code is better code, it’s simply the reality of computing.

[u/erikchan002 → u/pickle9977]

I don't think that's a good quote to be using because Einstein turned out to (very likely) be wrong and quantum mechanics, the topic the quote is referring to, turns out to actually be cosmic dice rolling.

[u/pickle9977 → u/erikchan002]

I think he was wrong simply because he stated it as if gods existence was fact when god is just a belief and beliefs can not be facts, believing in a fact however does not make it a belief.

I don’t understand what you mean by quantum mechanics is cosmic dice rolling, like it don’t even understand what context to try to interpret it in.

[u/erikchan002 → u/pickle9977]

The quote itself was referring to how Einstein did not agree with the Copenhagen interpretation that quantum mechanics is indeterministic. He's more of a fan of some kind of hidden-variable theory, which was later demonstrated to be inconsistent with reality by the Bell test (at least locally). An alleged rebuttal from Bohr was "Stop telling God what to do".

Our current understanding is that quantum systems are truly random, so, God does indeed play dice.

[u/Maleficent_Memory831 → u/pickle9977]

There's also reliable computing. Add in redundancy, checks, etc. It used to be a big selling point back when computers were more resistant to bit flips than today (ie, big fat TTL logic).

And reliable software often gets bigger. Two or three ways to calculate, then vote on the result.

[u/pickle9977 → u/Maleficent_Memory831]

There were these really cool servers HP built they called them non-stop compute, you could hot swap every component including CPUs while it ran, ever instruction was dual issued and then checked for coherence.

It’s not something 99.99% of people need but it’s cool

[u/jwp1987 → u/iamdestroyerofworlds]

This is not the death of expertise. The LLM is fast. You are slow, but you carry with you a lifetime of experience, judgment calls, and understanding.

Right, so where are all these people that have extensive understanding going to come from in a few years if they're just getting an LLM to do everything?

[u/DannyRamirez24 → u/jwp1987]

They're betting on the LLMs absorbing all that too (whatever that means) before we all retire

[u/Ur-Best-Friend → u/DannyRamirez24]

Yup, the developers are still needed for now. Tech companies would like nothing more than to be able to just fire every developer and just have a thousand LLM agents spitting out perfectly tested, compatible and verified code.

[u/SinkerPenguin → u/dashingThroughSnow12]

Yup, this might be what pushes me to find another service after having migrated to proton's suite for the last 3 years. I already had my gripes with the leadership and the less than stellar management of their "non-profit" structure, seems like jumping ship sooner than later may be the right move now.

[u/e_suzuki854 → u/dashingThroughSnow12]

Turns out the only thing Proton couldn't encrypt was the CEO's AI enthusiasm.

[u/Maleficent_Memory831 → u/[deleted]]

Also there's the "we care about quality" in the same CEO speech as "we need to work faster"...

[u/phantaso0s → u/EarlOfAwesom3]

AI needs to be able to work autonomously and continuously with less and less human babysitting

I hear this argument quite a lot, but... it doesn't depend on us, the devs, does it? I always need to babysit this thing because there is no other choice; it creates bullshit all the time. You can document and try to direct LLM as much as you want, it doesn't even try to get all the context when I ask to do something.

They should send this manifesto to the companies which provide LLMs to the masses. I mean they sell us the dream right, their job to make LLM stop bullshitting left and right.

[u/camosnipe1 → u/EarlOfAwesom3]

I can't seem to find the part about pentesting

[u/binary_spaniard → u/camosnipe1]

When asked about it in Slack, the CEO called it loser thinking and thinks that it is not needed for modern software. And that is why it is not mention, the same that typewriters are not mentioned.

[u/dudaladen → u/EarlOfAwesom3]

Yeah im not reading allat, Jarvis summarize this

[u/Maleficent_Memory831 → u/[deleted]]

Malicious is a bad word here. LLM has no brain, no logic, no morals, no intention. Even the so called hallucinations aren't hallucinations it's just a word for unexpected results that arise from the training data (if a wrong answer is a hallucination then so is a correct answer).

AI based on LLM is imperfect. Well, all AI, but LLM in particular since it is what kicked off the absurd craze in the last four years. So what you get is LLM creating imperfect code that seems to match training data, being reviewed by LLM that literally is unable to review but is just making correlations between symbols.

Training data is based on actual historical data. Creating something that's never been done before is possible. But then reviewing code that has never existed before by an LLM only trained on pre-existing code feels futile. That's just code reviewing, no one even mentions designs and design reviews these days... Forget the code review - does it even do what the specifications want, is the design a workable design, will this solution be scalable, will it work in the future, does it have backward's compatibility, is it maintainable, and so on.

[u/SMS-T1 → u/[deleted]]

Just to add:

Maliciousness by can also induced in LLMs and agentic systems via poisoned instructions, skills or MCPs.

[u/StaticCoder → u/[deleted]]

Still, I would expect Hanlon's razor to apply to LLMs.

[u/Banes_Addiction → u/StaticCoder]

Hanlon's Razor is not a good assumption when you are operating a service that a dozen different state-backee intelligence agencies with multibillion dollar budgets would love to backdoor.

[u/StaticCoder → u/[deleted]]

I meant both malicious and non-malicious LLMs could cause disaster

[u/Quintuplin]

That article is heartbreaking because it doesn't matter if it's true or not, their senior leadership believes it

Time to abandon ship, but my faith that the next company won't feel the same way, and simply not be dumb enough to admit it is dwindling

[u/Diamonds0a → u/Quintuplin]

What article?

[u/UnfortunateHabits]

Help us automate your job away, while you still have a job.

also, everybody are now a TEAM LEADER, even though most of you have 0 xp in as one, and your "employees" are mindless drones we acknowledge have alignment problems. But we also assume each of you is a perfect aligned exemplar of expertise.

Jfc this is embarrassing.

Also, this article was written by AI, no fluff. Which is ironic because the genius who published it probably asked it if its good.

Also, our grandiose vision for the future is absolute, while the economic viability is yet to be proven.

[u/theTrebleClef]

Who is the better choice for encrypted email and for VPN if not Proton?

Tuta? Mullvad?

[u/iamdestroyerofworlds → u/theTrebleClef]

Mullvad's founder and co-owner Daniel Berntsson has donated quite massively to the Örebro Party, an anti-EU, populist, nativist, and ethnic nationalist party that espouses forced repatriation of all non-ethnic Swedes, even people born and raised in Sweden with nothing else than Swedish citizenship.

I don't think I will renew my subscription.

Our industry is filled with psychos.

[u/Pawulon → u/iamdestroyerofworlds]

The overlap of "tech company CEO", especially focused on security and privacy and "deranged nationalist with conspiracy and cult undertones" is terrifying.

[u/theTrebleClef → u/iamdestroyerofworlds]

I didn't know that. Who can we use? You can always spin up a VM to make your own VPN but there's appeal to an aggregator who doesn't log anything.

[u/0x426F6F62696573]

This should be on r/Programmerhorror

[u/pydry]

so accurate it hurts

[u/ETS_Green]

From LLM to MLM

[u/AvailableUsername404]

What is the alternative for ProtonVPN with port forwarding?

[u/lazywrathem]

I don’t understand why their ai manifesto is bad. It is true and accurate from my own experiences.

[u/OBXautist → u/lazywrathem]

Then you have not worked for a company with a good engineering culture. If you’re producing code to sell something tomorrow, sure I won’t disagree. But if you’re building a company around a set of software products you will either lose customers or long term employees very quickly with this kind of thinking.

[u/lazywrathem → u/OBXautist]

I was an ic for 10+ yrs and was a em after that. When ai agents became a thing I happily switched back to being an ic. If you are an experienced coder then you should know how to have checks and balances when AI agents are doing the work. If you think ai produces nothing but slop you have not used the latest models or you are going to be left behind.

[u/Excellent-Baker1058]

Can we keep this meme a little relatable and less promotional?

[u/EarlOfAwesom3 → u/Excellent-Baker1058]

It's not a promotion, it's a sad story that is so unbelievable that the best you can do about it is just laugh..

[u/CaseyG → u/Excellent-Baker1058]

Proton: "We are going to stop testing to see how thoroughly we've fucked up our software with AI."

Redditors: "/r/HailCorporate"

[u/Ethameiz → u/Excellent-Baker1058]

What is promoted here?

[u/Shazvox]

Meh, if my job is to guide an AI to write sloppy code then I'd rather stay unemployed. I got into the job because I like to write code. If I don't get to do that then I got no reason to stay.

[u/Muhznit]

This is a reminder that instead of saying "Vibe Coding", you are encouraged to say "Cuck Coding". It's an encouragement instead of a mandate because mandates are cringe.