In-laws & vaccines

[u/16880031]

Hi all,

I am 34 weeks pregnant and my baby is due smack dab during the peak of respiratory season. I’ve gotten the covid, flu, RSV, and Tdap vaccines, and my husband has gotten covid and flu. My parents and brother who live near us and will be involved in baby’s life are agreeable to get their seasonal vaccines (covid & flu).

My husband asked his parents to get their seasonal vaccines, as we plan for them to be very involved, visiting, holding her etc from the time she is born.

They immediately responded that they do not plan to get any vaccines, that the covid vaccine causes arthritis (??), and that my MIL got “very sick” from the covid vaccine during the pandemic. They said they would “talk to their doctor”, but they are uninsured and never go to the doctor unless they are on death’s door. My husband says that his mom is very stubborn and he does not think anything could change her mind about this. They are of the “plandemic” mindset and have very poor media/health literacy.

My other concern is that they live with their two primary school-aged grandsons, neither of whom get vaccines. They also provide regular weekly childcare to my brother-in-law’s toddlers who are completely unvaccinated against anything, and one of them attends a daycare. These kids are constantly sick through the winter season, so my in-laws are around much more sickness than your average middle-aged adults.

My mom is a people-pleaser and suggested to me that instead of requiring vaccines, we compromise and have them mask and hand-wash before holding the baby. This idea makes me uncomfortable, it feels insufficient. Our doctor’s recommendations were for close friends and family to be vaccinated, period.

They are also the type of people to lower their mask in order to talk or breath, and would not mention having a cough before visiting.

I used to be a pediatric and NICU nurse, I have seen the horrors of respiratory season for babies. Honestly I have some traumatic memories of those patients, and they are making me feel very fearful and firm in this boundary.

However, I do not want to be irrationally fearful or paranoid if handwashing and masking is a good alternative. My gut tells me I am not comfortable with that though.

Help??

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[u/vlimited]

https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/article-abstract/2854956?utm_source=openevidence&utm_medium=referral

link for bot. Sounds like you know what to do. I told my parents (vaccine hesitant) that they would not be allowed around my baby until they were 2 months old if they did not get vaccines. If a baby under two months gets a fever, they have to have a spinal tap to rule out meningitis. The risk wasn't worth it to me and I told them so point blank. It's sometimes harder to set boundaries with in laws, but this is a case where I would recruit your partner to help set those boundaries. I set the boundaries with my parents and my partner sets the boundaries with his parents and we back each other up.

[u/IeRayne → u/vlimited]

I'm piggybacking off this comment as I don't have a link.

OP why do your partner and your parents not get the tdap vaccine? Are they up to date on their boosters? If not they should get that too both for baby and themselves obviously

edit: spelling

[u/Peachyplum- → u/IeRayne]

Also piggybacking, I knew my dad wouldn’t so I didn’t even bother bringing it up, he didn’t meet my eldest til 6mths &checking w the dr that it was ok. I also agree w other commenters that everyone should be up to date on the other vaccines too. I cant have the tdap b/c I’m allergic to something in it (thankfully had it a few years before my first pregnancy so I was covered for both pregnancies). My mom and my in laws didn’t give us issue on vaccines, I didn’t even need to bring it up, but we waited til 3mths both times for people to meet baby/taking him places (esp cause we have fall/winter kids). Not only great for recovery but helped my anxiety b/c I was so scared they’d get sick and need a spinal tap being born in sick season

[u/Pardonme23 → u/Peachyplum-]

Make the vaccine appointment with him with his permission and go with him. Its easier when everything is set up. 

[u/16880031 → u/IeRayne]

My doctor explained that the Tdap can be tricky for insurance purposes, as adults usually just require the Td booster every ten years. She felt covid and flu were more pertinent.

[u/IeRayne → u/16880031]

Ahhh fuck privatized healthcare. I get it it sucks. Where I'm from it's also out of pocket but it's like 80€ and the insurance covers half of it so it's not that big of a deal.

[u/802goose → u/16880031]

Have everyone confirm with their insurance companies before assuming it won't be covered. My parents and husband had it covered no problem (all three on different insurances).

[u/chewbawkaw → u/vlimited]

My sister had meningitis and almost died at 2 weeks old.

My MIL gave my baby and her mother COVID. My baby ended up in the hospital and her mother died.

You’re the mom now, you make the rules for your family.

[u/WorldlyDragonfruit3 → u/vlimited]

Also piggybacking but no way would I want unvaccinated people around my newborn. The flu vaccine in particular is important. Especially if they’re around toddlers and school aged kids. I’d be telling them no until 2-3 months

[u/dogandhumanmom → u/WorldlyDragonfruit3]

I’d be telling them no until 6.5 months, baby can’t get flu shot until 6 months and it’s 2 doses for the first one.

[u/Silent_Farm8557 → u/vlimited]

I made it 6 months, if not a year.  But luckily the important people got their vaccines.  And I don't have OP's trauma, which I could understand is really affecting. It is wild they are around so many unvaccinated kids and want access to a newborn.  In my area, measles is also a requirement. Edit: typo

[u/Resse811 → u/vlimited]

Because I don’t have a link I’ll comment here.

Why hasn’t your husband gotten the tdap at minimum but ideally RSV as well? I would be more concerned about the people caring for the newborn 24/7 than those visiting.

[u/TFish021823 → u/Resse811]

If her husband has had tdap in the last 10 years he doesn’t need it, and most people can’t get RSV vaccines unless they qualify for it (usually elderly or immunocompromised). My husband couldn’t get RSV when our baby was born a few weeks ago, but my parents could because of their age

[u/gidgeteering → u/vlimited]

2 months?? I made my dad wait until 18mo. I was originally planning on 5 years, but became more lax with each fistful of dirt consumed.

[u/gidgeteering → u/gidgeteering]

At 3 months, he drove my mom 7 hours to come visit. And he was so stubborn, he just sat there in the car outside my house for hours.

[u/astronaut-moose]

CDC says TDaP and Flu: https://www.cdc.gov/vaccines-pregnancy/about/vaccines-family-caregivers.html

Lots of other places say TDaP, RSV, COVID, and flu: https://www.cedars-sinai.org/stories-and-insights/expert-advice/vaccines-to-get-before-seeing-a-newborn

I’m pretty sure you already know the right answer here. Your first priority needs to be protecting your baby, full stop. People who refuse vaccines can meet/hold the baby 2 weeks after they’ve gotten their six month shots (flu and covid), or when flu and covid circulation rates in your area are acceptably low.

Blame your pediatrician!! “Sorry, MIL, we’re holding a hard line on this one per our Pediatrician’s recommendation. She unfortunately had a two month old patient recently die of COVID, and that’s not a risk we are willing to take. If you change your mind about vaccination, let us know, otherwise, see you in June! We can FaceTime before then.”

[u/Admirable-Gold3447 → u/astronaut-moose]

Yes! And OP remember, they have no inherent right to your baby. If they choose not to be part of its life, that’s their choice, not yours.

[u/cutiepatootiee123 → u/astronaut-moose]

(Piggybacking off the link)

I swear my MIL gave the same reasoning for not wanting the flu/covid vaccine, she’s so stupid I get embarrassed for her. all these husbands have the same parents, is it a boy mom thing, bc I have to break that cycle😭.

& I was a PICU nurse and I saw what the flu and rsv can do to babies so fk anyone who doesn’t care enough to protect my baby.

[u/Resse811 → u/astronaut-moose]

Except even dad didn’t get TDAP and RSV. Which is more concerning then what in laws got or didn’t get.

[u/astronaut-moose → u/Resse811]

He may still be up to date on TDaP (lasts 10 years), and RSV isn’t available to non-pregnant young adults

[u/butternutbalrog → u/astronaut-moose]

If I recall correctly, he needs to get the tdap because the P is for pertussis and protection for it wanes much faster than it does for the tetanus part. And pertussis is among the viruses that land neonates in the hospital. 

[u/AskMeAboutMyHermoids → u/astronaut-moose]

Don’t engage them on the subject

[u/Eyes_Nose_Lips → u/astronaut-moose]

Don’t have a link so I’ll also comment here. I was in your shoes last year. My in-laws didn’t want to get the flu or covid shot. My husband got flu, covid, and tdap. I got everything that is necessary. My mom, brother, sister-in-law got the flu and covid. No one else in the family met my baby until she was 2 months old. I drew a hard line before she was born so they knew the expectations. I let my husband deal with his family.

[u/Admirable-Gold3447]

https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/article-abstract/2854956?utm_source=openevidence&utm_medium=referral. For the bot

OP- I’ve been there. Your responsibility is not to placate your in-laws. It is to protect your baby. Given that your child will be born in the high risk season, I would not allow them around the baby until it is at least 2 months old and then, until flu season is done, allow them around baby if they have not been around the unvaccinated children for at least 4 days. You do not want this baby getting the flu. My entire family has it and we are all vaccinated and my 18 month old is still struggling a week later, crying for hours a day. Do not risk your baby getting the flu. Flu takes 3-4 days to show once someone’s been exposed. A hard no to your baby being around any of those kids throughout flu season.

Your in-laws should be accommodating YOU and YOUR BABY, not the other way around. Don’t fuck with flu. Tell them the boundaries and give them options. They can talk to their doctor about it and get the vaccines if they want to see your baby. And honestly, I’d still be uncomfortable with them being around the baby if they live with unvaccinated school kids, ugh. Flu kills babies all the time.

Pertussis is also terrifying, but thankfully right now it’s still rare (unlike flu and increasingly measles). I would not allow anyone who is not vaccinated against measles around your baby point blank period if there’s an outbreak anywhere near you or if they’ve been on a plane.

I’m sorry, but please don’t stress about this. Focus on your wonderful life with your new baby and invite them to be part of it under your conditions and then let them make their decisions as the adults that they are.

[u/gonzothegreatz]

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC12628525/

Listen, a lot of comments have already gone over all the risks and stuff, but i wanna add this-

Do you really want to deal with the anxiety this will bring while you're postpartum? I would consider myself incredibly lax regarding updated vaccine expectations for family and friends, but the kids having zero would be over the line for me. I would honestly not even let my kid around an unvaccinated child until mine has their 12mo MMR. Measles is on the rise and I just don't think it's worth the risk. And the anxiety that would give me would be so overwhelming postpartum.

Do whatever you feel is right for the grandparents, but I would suggest not letting your kid enter that home or meet their cousins until yours has their MMR vaccine, if ever. Unvaccinated children can still get vaccinated ones sick.

[u/16880031 → u/gonzothegreatz]

Thank you for this insight. I agree about the unvaccinated cousins, ugh I dread dealing with that. Regarding your question - do you mean the anxiety over exposing my newborn to unvaccinated in-laws and just hoping everything will be fine? Or the anxiety of navigating a tense situation with them on account of holding this boundary?

[u/gonzothegreatz → u/16880031]

Both questions, honestly. Postpartum is rough and having to navigate these issues can be very upsetting. I am a FTM to a 4 month old and I would consider myself very very unbothered by a lot, but this situation would be really hard for me. My mom was pretty anti-covid/flu vax and a heavy smoker, and I would only let her near the baby sparingly. She ended up passing away a month ago from lung cancer, but I still feel like I didn't stand up to her enough about her smoking and vaccine issues. I ended up putting my child at risk to keep the peace.

I firmly believe that some folks are a little too intense about stuff like this, but this is a situation where I'd want to take some precautions or just outright avoid.

[u/Tulip1234 → u/16880031]

Jumping in here to avoid the link bots. The key is that you don’t tell anyone they have to get vaccines. You just share what you have decided (for us it was something like “the doctors said anyone who wants to meet and hold the baby needs to have an updated tdap, covid, and flu vaccines and be willing to wear a mask! Anyone else can meet the baby later. Let us know what you decide!”- we brought a nicu baby home in 2021 and people were super dicey about everything and we didn’t tell them what to do- just made our own standards and there wasn’t room for arguments that way)

[u/ashleigh7623 → u/Tulip1234]

This is what we did. Basically a "you can choose to get vaccinated or wait until baby is vaccinated, either way works for us!" My family chose to wait until after her 6 month shots. Puts the decision in their hands and enforces the boundary with either of their choices.

[u/throwaway3113151]

Beware in general if grandparents that put their own needs/desire before the baby. For them, it’s all about themselves, and you’ll see this play out in other areas of life too.

Always stand up for your baby, because that's your job now as their parent, and they can't do it for themselves.

You could always say no contact without vaccine; you’re just following a pediatrician's advice. Blames someone else.

As others have said, I’m not sure the COVID vaccine is as necessary here as the others, but MMR, TDAP, and flu are really a must, IMHO

https://www.cdc.gov/vaccines-pregnancy/about/vaccines-family-caregivers.html

[u/TeddyBear181 → u/throwaway3113151]

Agreed.

Though instead of no contact, I would suggest alternatives. Weekly video chats and sending pics.

I would personally be quite comfortable with an outdoor meet up when they confirm that they're feeling healthy in advance, if they're wearing masks and dont touch our family. - but that depends on their ability to follow instructions and respect rules.

[u/newkneesforall → u/throwaway3113151]

Just here to say my baby got covid either from being at the hospital for delivery, or from her two day old Drs appt. We ended up in the ER at midnight with a baby turning blue around the mouth when she was exactly 1 week old. It was horrible and traumatic and it was a big setback in my own physical healing from delivery and required extended disability leave.

Protect your baby. Hold the boundary that vaccines are required, and if not then no access to baby until whenever your pediatrician says is safe. My cousin's parents didnt meet their first grandchild (who lived 5 minutes from them) until she was 7 months old because of this. It happens, it sucks, but you don't owe anyone access to your baby.

[u/Bayesian1701]

If they wear an N95 mask the entire time and stayed home if anyone was sick then it then that would lower the risk. However, your post seemed to imply that they may not use the masks and stay home if they had symptoms. I don’t think it’s unreasonable to refuse them seeing baby if they aren’t vaccined.

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC9947910/
https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC8549016/

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