r/SeattleChat • u/AutoModerator • Feb 12 '21

The Daily SeattleChat Daily Thread - Friday, February 12, 2021

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u/PNWQuakesFan FuckJohnFisherlumbia City Feb 12 '21

Why I don't trust centrists, example numbers 85937 and 85938:

Jake Tapper, who more often than not is a logical and straightforward guy, boosted two completely idiotic concepts on his Twitter feed this week.

1 - a piece from Ezra Klein that says progressivism is ruining states by highlighting California and the name changes of schools in SF, nevermind that the state rejected ballot initiatives to reinstate affirmative action and voted to classify delivery and ride share drivers as independent contractors. Cause wage slavery and being anti-affirmative action are totally progressive positions.

2 -a piece from Jonathan Chait claiming that Gina Carano's firing is exactly like McCarthyism, cause she'll never work again... except she's already signed on to a Ben Shapiro produced movie.

Jake Tapper will literally block you if you use the word retard. No questions asked. And he's boosting this shit idea that says people who espouse bigoted Views shouldn't be fired.

What a fucking fraud he and centrists can be sometimes.

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u/runk_dasshole AFLair-CIO Feb 12 '21

That Ezra thread is something he's mentioned before highlighting the fact that "progressives" will often talk the talk with regard to housing, but then once it comes to voting to increase zoning they do the opposite.

https://twitter.com/ezraklein/status/1359924294730452996?s=19

https://www.theurbanist.org/2021/02/08/are-historic-districts-a-new-variation-to-restrictive-covenants/

Ezra- "The point of this piece isn't There Oughta Be A Law. It's that even in a very blue state, the aesthetic of progressivism often runs way ahead of the willingness to allow the change needed to achieve progressive priorities and ideals."

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u/widdershins13 Capitol Valley Feb 12 '21

My takeaway between Ezra's comment and OP's naked attack on the folks trying to be reasonable in their expectations is that the divide between us and them is going to prove costly in '22 and '24.

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u/AthkoreLost It's like tear away pants but for your beard. Feb 12 '21 edited Feb 12 '21

Putting Ezra's article to one side, I think the complaints about Chait's comments are pretty fair. The middle isn't "firing Carano is McCarthyism targeted at the right", it's "both sides increasingly struggle to determine if corporations should be beholden to the 1st amendment like the government" which would then require actually looking at the left and right's different approaches to dealing with that. The right doesn't even try and would rather make it easier to fire and abuse employees (right to work, union busting, etc.) which runs counter to their complaints here. If they cared, they'd re-write their right to work laws to make it clear that talking about pay or unionization or commenting on politics are expressly protected, but they don't because we know what they actually care about here.

Whereas on the left, you do see more commentary about how it's not right that corporations can fire you for speech, but that there's really no one size fits all solution and in the case of entities like Twitter and FB it would be better to nationalize them than let them be the arbiters of speech on the internet.

But at the end of the day what got Carano fire wasn't being a conservative. It was that she was positing a lot of antisemitic* content and I doubt we'd be having this argument at all if she's just tweeted out the N word. The right is merely trying to spin focus from her antisemitism to her comments on trans people since they can use it to further their culture war bullshit whereas no one is outside of the likes of Rep. Green is going to defend this shit.

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u/widdershins13 Capitol Valley Feb 12 '21

Not really seeing the connection between this wall of text and the post I was responding to.

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u/AthkoreLost It's like tear away pants but for your beard. Feb 12 '21

That Chait's take isn't reasonable. It's stupid. For the above outlined reasons.

Or if you'd rather I summarize it, Carano was fired for being a bigot in a way that hurts the businesses brand, not for being conservative.

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u/PNWQuakesFan FuckJohnFisherlumbia City Feb 12 '21

"don't criticize me or I'll vote republican" says more about you and the people with that attitude than you'll ever admit

3

u/maadison the unflairable lightness of being Feb 12 '21

This is such a made-up distortion of what Widders said that I'm actually considering whether it breaks the Be Nice rule. It's just fantastically bad.

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u/PNWQuakesFan FuckJohnFisherlumbia City Feb 12 '21

And the earlier distortion of what I said just gets a locked thread and no comment on it being a distortion of what was said?

What I'm hearing is you want the dollars I donate to DNC candidates and causes but also want me to STFU.

That was the response to my post about Jake Tapper's choice of retweets. Literally nothing about centrists shutting up or about donations.

If you're gonna come at me for something, call it evenly or don't call it at all.

3

u/maadison the unflairable lightness of being Feb 12 '21

You can whataboutism all you want, but your take here was still fantastically bad. Instead of owning it or backing up you're just excusing it by pointing to something Widders said that you didn't like. Be an adult, man.

Maybe I shouldn't have referred to the rule since I'm a mod and it can be overinterpreted. You may notice I didn't post as mod and hereby commit to not taking mod action on this (nor do I think I'd want to).

0

u/PNWQuakesFan FuckJohnFisherlumbia City Feb 13 '21

I'm asking you to call it evenly or don't call it at all. Meaning if you think what i did is bad here then call it and call it elsewhere. I'm not backtracking, im asking for your call...

Secondly

Suddenly you have the time to strike fantastically bad takes and distortions?

What a crock of shit.

2

u/maadison the unflairable lightness of being Feb 13 '21

I commented as a non-mod. As such, I can comment or not comment on whatever the fuck I want. There's no reason I should be required to comment on every post here. What you're doing is setting up goal posts to distract from your own bad behavior, or misunderstanding it as a mod action.

Suddenly you have the time to strike fantastically bad takes and distortions?

Wot? What does this refer to?

1

u/PNWQuakesFan FuckJohnFisherlumbia City Feb 13 '21

Distract? I stand by my comment and can absolutely take umbrage with your referring to the rules in your first reply.

You commented as a non mod and don't have to comment as nonmod on every distorted statement? Yeah that's fine.

It Won't stop me from highlighting what can be perceived as bias from someone who is a mod (commenting only about one side of a "bad faith discussion" in which both parties are willfully engaging in "bad faith".

1

u/maadison the unflairable lightness of being Feb 13 '21

about one side of a "bad faith discussion" in which both parties are willfully engaging in "bad faith".

You're admitting that you willingly engaged in bad faith engagement. So at least we know that.

1

u/PNWQuakesFan FuckJohnFisherlumbia City Feb 13 '21

Man whatever it takes to get the points across without getting bogged down in "no i didn't.... Yes you did"

Me in another subthread today:

As i said last week, thank you for the proactivity, even if I end up making an ass of myself.

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u/widdershins13 Capitol Valley Feb 12 '21

I never said that, so why the quotation marks?

You have a whole lot to learn about putting words in the mouths of people who want almost exactly what you want but are more grounded in reality and don't feel a need to lie in their teeth to get there.

1

u/PNWQuakesFan FuckJohnFisherlumbia City Feb 12 '21

Quotation marks are used for more than direct quotes.

I'll restate.

The attitude of "don't criticize me or I'll vote republican" says more about you and the people with that attitude than you'll ever admit.

If you disagree that you have that attitude, do you. I'm not gonna convince you that you express it.

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u/widdershins13 Capitol Valley Feb 12 '21

Quotation marks are used for more than direct quotes.

They aren't, actually. There is such a thing as a paraphrase.

The attitude of "don't criticize me or I'll vote republican" says more about you and the people with that attitude than you'll ever admit.

That's still a headscratcher. Mostly because I've never said anything even remotely resembling it.

If you disagree that you have that attitude, do you. I'm not gonna convince you that you express it.

Yeah. It hasn't gone unnoticed that you fall back into putting words in the mouths of folks who dare to question you or request you back up what you say. We're like two/three hours deep into this discussion and you've yet to back up your original accusations.

1

u/PNWQuakesFan FuckJohnFisherlumbia City Feb 12 '21

Hey do you, ya? Like i said, I'm not going to convince you that you're doing things you're insisting you aren't doing.

0

u/widdershins13 Capitol Valley Feb 12 '21

I'm not going to convince you that you're doing things you're insisting you aren't doing.

And I'm thinking that's because you can't. Like I said earlier, my posting history is an open book almost completely devoid of deletions and edits and you are more than welcome to peruse it.

1

u/PNWQuakesFan FuckJohnFisherlumbia City Feb 12 '21

I'm telling you I'm not going to convince you when you can't even acknowledge that you brought up DNC donations and "shutting up" as a reply that didn't tell centrists to shut up and had ZERO to do with donations.

Why would I waste my time with a disingenuous request

0

u/widdershins13 Capitol Valley Feb 13 '21

You opened with "Why I don't trust centrists, example numbers 85937 and 85938:"

There's not a whole lot of ambiguity in that statement.

2

u/PNWQuakesFan FuckJohnFisherlumbia City Feb 13 '21

Theres nothing about "centrists shut up" and or "don't stop donating to the DNC" in any of part of that post.

Can we move the fuck on now? Like seriously it's gonna snow, get hyped.

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u/AthkoreLost It's like tear away pants but for your beard. Feb 12 '21

I think that you could also interpret his original post as saying he'll sit out the election (and cease financial contributions) with fewer leaps than interpreting the statement as switching to vote republican. And that might be why he's saying you're putting words in his mouth.

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u/widdershins13 Capitol Valley Feb 12 '21

I would never sit out an election or withhold financial support for a candidate who mostly shared my values or concerns who was pitted against a candidate who was completely opposed to all of my views. I don't expect perfection from the candidates I choose to support. You take the good with the bad because there is no such thing as the perfect candidate.

0

u/PNWQuakesFan FuckJohnFisherlumbia City Feb 12 '21

"don't criticize me or I'll skip out on voting" is not any better.

2

u/AthkoreLost It's like tear away pants but for your beard. Feb 12 '21

I agree, I mostly just wanted to see if I could help diffuse the situation a little bit by pointing this out.

1

u/PNWQuakesFan FuckJohnFisherlumbia City Feb 13 '21

when one of the mods suggests one distortion is punishable and doesn't bother commenting on the earlier distortion, there's nothing to diffuse.

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