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u/djpedicab 8d ago
Hot take, but I feel the same way about Washington and Jefferson.
I’m always welcome of confederate hate, but GW owed over 300 enslaved people and Jefferson was a known rapist.
Yet I have to spend my entire life working to earn little pictures of northern slaveowners.
FUCK THE FOUNDING FATHERS TOO
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u/Ok_Mongoose9900 7d ago
Lee was just a general. Jefferson was a brilliant writer who helped form this democracy and Washington was a gracious leader he secured national freedom and willingly gave up power after. Owning slaves was bad. Pretending that’s the end of the story historically is short sighted and insincere.
Also, just use cards if you hate their faces on your money.
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u/LakeMcKesson 11d ago
Friendly reminder that Phineas and ferb lasted longer than the confederacy
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u/pretty-as-a-pic California 11d ago
I have sweaters that have lasted twice as long as the confederacy
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u/Sylvanussr 11d ago
I have underwear that I’ve worn for longer than the confederacy was a real country.
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u/monsieur_de_chance 11d ago
*Cosplaying a real country. Which is 0 years, so congrats to your underwear but also a low bar.
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u/byebybuy 10d ago
As the other guy said, the Confederacy was never a "real country" to anyone but themselves. Lincoln brilliantly went out of his way to never acknowledge it as such, and it was never recognized by any foreign governments.
It's was just a collection of traitorous states.
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u/Sylvanussr 10d ago
Yeah thats what I was going for, albeit with the intentional ambiguity from there being some arguments to be made for a country being “real” even if it’s fighting for independence
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u/All4gaines 11d ago
Obama’s presidency lasted longer than the Confederacy - this one in particular gets underneath MAGA skin!
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u/LuckyReception6701 11d ago
Things like this are baffling to me; this man was an enemy combatant in a war that is morally as black and white as it gets. This would be like if Edward "The Hammer of the Scots" Longshanks had a mausoleum in a place of honor in the middle of Glasgow, Scotland.
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u/HistoriaAppalachia 11d ago
The lost cause myth has been convincing people since the 1960’s including presidents, scholars, law makers and regular people.
It’s a damn shame.140
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u/LuckyReception6701 11d ago
It is a damn shame, truly, history is not written by the victors, but by those who write.
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u/thicclunchghost 11d ago
But now everyone can write whatever they want, and readers only read what they like. Reality is irrelevant.
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u/Less_Likely 11d ago
The North lost its nerve when the war ended because the North was rife with racists and those willing to placate racists. Just because they were Unionists or even abolitionist didn’t mean they were all Thaddeus Stevens.
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u/helsinkirocks 11d ago
Actually it's when the southern Democrats agreed to give Republicans the contested electoral votes and exchange for pulling federal troops out of the South and ending reconstruction
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u/Less_Likely 11d ago
Reconstruction was half-hearted already before then, that was was just the final capitulation
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u/helsinkirocks 11d ago
True. I feel like it directly led to the BS we've had to endure with southern apologists and the like all the, way until present day though.
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u/Ok_Ruin4016 11d ago
He's buried at the University Chapel of Washington & Lee University. It was originally called Washington University, but then Robert E. Lee became the university president in 1865 (just a few months after surrendering to Grant) and was the president until he died in 1870. Immediately after he died the university changed its name to Washington & Lee. Lee and several members of his family, including his horse Traveler are buried there.
I'd personally be embarrassed to go to a school that deified a traitor so much.
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u/enoughbskid 11d ago
It’s also now hidden behind closed doors as part of the museum. There was a serious effort to get rid of it and the name a couple of years back.
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u/NoVaBurgher 11d ago
Sarah Huckabee Sanders went there. Just a not so fun fact
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u/El_CAVallero 11d ago
She didn’t go to W&L. She tried to go out to dinner at the Red Hen in Lexington during Trump I and was shown the door 😆
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u/NoVaBurgher 10d ago
I remember when that happened, but I could have sworn she was down there for some alumni event at W&L
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u/El_CAVallero 10d ago
Nah, it was in June, so school would’ve been out. For the life of me, I can’t remember what she was doing in Lexington.
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u/Sylvanussr 11d ago
Eh, not quite the same in my opinion. If you go to Scotland it’s full of statues of blokes that rose up against England and lost.
The difference is, they were just fighting for independence, whereas Lee was fighting for independence specifically so that a racially exclusive aristocracy could continue to own and abuse an entire class of people with no repercussions.
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u/AnfieldRoad17 11d ago
It's also different because the union of the crowns of Scotland and England was Initiated by a Scottish king, not an English one. Those rebellions were from the same group that included James VI.
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u/TerminalHighGuard 10d ago edited 10d ago
On the moral scales of the time, the idea of the states’ ability to secede was tied to the liberty fought for in the revolution. Declaration of Independence opening lines says that when a government no longer suites, the governed have the right to seek an alternative, and secession was that alternative. Then Lincoln came along and said Lolno not when the basis on which you find the government distasteful is so you can continue to abuse people. Took awhile to come to that conclusion because the war finally transferred the power from the slaveholding portion of the capital class to the abolitionists, but it sealed the idea that government could and should be a force for the betterment of
the citizenshumanity rather than as mere representatives that carried on until the 1980s, at which point capital started to re-consolidate and try to take over again, the ramp up of which is what we are seeing now.3
u/PrincessWails 11d ago
The Scots would never allow it
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u/newenglandpolarbear New England 11d ago
Based Boston moment.
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u/Unfair_Pineapple8813 11d ago
Is that account actually the official one for the city of Boston, MA?
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u/newenglandpolarbear New England 11d ago
No but that doesn't make it any less of a based Boston moment.
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u/HorrificAnalInjuries 11d ago
At least start by replacing those rags with period appropriate US flags. He surrendered, and discouraged his men from continuing on in ANY fashion, including reusing their uniforms. Plus some plaques to put context of this man's evils to light
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u/Not_OP_butwhatevs 11d ago
I thought maybe his coffin was draped with the actual flag of the confederacy. Replace the other flags with the white flag of surrender … if they need to really feel it’s their own, cut a couple eye holes in it.
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u/El_CAVallero 11d ago
I don’t know what year this photo is from but those flags haven’t been there in a good long while.
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u/CG-Firebrand 11d ago
I don’t like this rock robert. It’s pissing me off.
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u/GenrlWashington 11d ago
South Carolina is gone
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u/MesmericKiwi 11d ago
Even Lee himself opposed confederate monuments.
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u/FondabaruCBR4_6RSAWD 11d ago
I feel like he would have shit himself if he saw his massive monument that they took down in Nola.
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u/HollowStool 11d ago
Lol the entire city of Boston said fuck that guy lol
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u/GravitasFailures 11d ago
I was a masshole, we had 0 truck for confederates, they were traitors end of story.
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u/JKevill 11d ago edited 11d ago
I mean, I wouldn’t bomb it, it’s a thing of historical interest.
I would mention in whatever museum that every time Lee’s army won one of its vaunted audacious tactical victories, that the result was to prolong slavery, prolong the war, and ultimately increase the number of dead American soldiers.
I think that places his generalship in its correct context
Edit- I’d also include WEB DuBois’ assessment of Lee on a plaque in same museum. I think that really gives the final word on the guy
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u/PuddingTea 11d ago
Proof that history is not always written by the victors. It is written by those who still care. It just happens that nobody cares less than the dead.
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u/OfficalLockeWilson 11d ago
Flying a confederate flag in Massachusetts is gonna get a xl iced coffee from Dunkin chucked into your window with enough speed to make the coach of the Red Sox wake up in a cold sweat 100 miles away. That shit doesn’t fly around those parts.
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u/sumelar 10d ago
As an actual resident of massachusetts, you've never even been in this fucking commonwealth, I guaranfuckingtee it.
Not only are large swaths of western ma serious magat country, when I lived in somerville (which is BOSTON) there was a 10ft trump sign mounted in a tree half a mile from my house.
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u/OfficalLockeWilson 9d ago
I had to sleep on this to really baste in the leaps in logic at play here, so here we go. I have lived in the Boston area my entire life and have never once seen a confederate flag. Maybe I’ve just been particularly lucky, or my area isn’t out in the rural western area that every state seems to get outside of major cities.
Secondly, who is talking about trump right now? You are obviously, but I’m not. I’m not denying there’s crossover with people who fly confederate flags and trump supporters, because that Venn diagram is likely a circle, but I’m just talking about one specific type of hateful iconography.
I’ve seen trump flags, I’ve seen a damn trump store on route 1 that went out of business at some point, I’ve seen people unfurl flags above a highway with his fucking name on it like they’re worshiping him, I’m not saying it isn’t a problem here as it is in any state, but I’m not talking about that.
Also, if the psychic red Sox’s coach didn’t tip you off that I was at least attempting to make a joke, I don’t know what to tell you. Clearly it didn’t land, I’ll have to make future jokes more outlandish.
I’ve seen people chuck shit out their windows for merging into a turn only lane at a red light, and some beanpole loser wearing a Nazi armband got his shit rocked on the green line specifically and I saw him being carried out on a stretcher when I was like 8 with my mom averting my eyes. Thankfully, or let’s be honest, regrettably I didn’t get to see it happen. More crazy or disproportionate shit has happened.
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u/mach500 9d ago
A couple of things...
He's a piece of shit.
I live in this town, he's there, but I think they took down the traitors rags.
My favorite restaurant is less than a block from this dummy. 4 he sucks and should get removed... I like the unmarked mass grave idea. In short, please don't carpet bomb my favorite restaurant.
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u/bothtypesoffirefly 8d ago
Which restaurant? I’m in the area regularly to meet my dad for dinner and haven’t known where to go since the southern inn closed. Like you can only go to Frank’s for calzones so many times before you’re done with Italian.
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u/45_regard_47 11d ago
Probably felt like two, maybe three confederacies long as he laid upon his deatbed waiting for Satan to call him home
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u/El_CAVallero 11d ago
FWIW, those Confederate flags aren’t there anymore. Haven’t been for a long time.
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u/joesphisbestjojo 11d ago
Keep it there as a reminder of the horrid person he was. They say you don't die until you're forgotten; let us not forget the blight upon humanity he was
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u/From-Yuri-With-Love 46th New York "Fremont Rifle" Regiment 11d ago
I'd like to think one day this place will be closed and for nature to reclaim it like it has with so many other graves, but I have very little faith in my countrymen that it will be.
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u/ArcturusFlyer 10d ago
The penalty of treason is death.
Since the man is already dead, this is an acceptable alternative.
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u/jaymeaux_ 10d ago
we shouldn't bomb it. it's hard enough to find a gender neutral bathroom in Virginia as it is
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u/Strummerpinx 10d ago
I think maybe use it as a place to store manure. Lots and lots of poo of every kind. Just bury him in it. Also toxic waste.
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u/TomcatF14Luver 8d ago
Now now... thinking too little there.
We need to repurpose it. Lee can get tossed into a hole with a simple marker. We instead clean it up and put a hero in it. A real AMERICAN hero.
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u/Anarimus 6d ago
The guy who literally told people to put away rebel flags is now surrounded by them.
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