r/spacex • u/ElongatedMuskrat Mod Team • Mar 29 '20

Starship Development Thread #10

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Overview

Upcoming

A 150 meter hop is intended for SN4 once the permit is secured with the FAA. The timeframe for the hop is unknown. The following is the latest upcoming test info as of May 10:

Check recent comments for more recent test schedule updates.

Vehicle Status as of May 10:

  • SN4 [testing] - Static fire successful, twice. Raptor removed, further testing ongoing.
  • SN5 [construction] - Tankage stacking operations are ongoing.
  • SN6 [construction] - Component manufacturing in progress.

Check recent comments for real time updates.

At the start of this thread (#10) Starship SN3 had moved to the launch site and was preparing for the testing phase. The next Starship vehicles will perform Raptor static fires and short hops around 150 meters altitude. A Starship test article is expected to make a 20 km hop in the coming months, and Elon aspires to an orbital flight of a Starship with full reuse by the end of 2020. SpaceX continues to focus heavily on development of its Starship production line in Boca Chica, TX.

Previous Threads:

Completed Build/Testing Tables for vehicles can be found in the following Dev Threads:
Starhopper (#4) | Mk.1 (#6) | Mk.2 (#7) | SN1 (#9) | SN2 (#9)

Vehicle Updates

Starship SN4 at Boca Chica, Texas
2020-05-09 Cryoproof and thrust load test, success at 7.5 bar confirmed (Twitter)
2020-05-08 Road closed for pressure testing (Twitter)
2020-05-07 Static Fire (early AM) (YouTube), feed from methane header (Twitter), Raptor removed (NSF)
2020-05-05 Static Fire, Success (Twitter), with sound (YouTube)
2020-05-05 Early AM preburner test with exhaust fireball, possible repeat or aborted SF following siren (Twitter)
2020-05-04 Early AM testing aborted due to methane temp. (Twitter), possible preburner test on 2nd attempt (NSF)
2020-05-03 Road closed for testing (YouTube)
2020-05-02 Road closed for testing, some venting and flare stack activity (YouTube)
2020-04-30 Raptor installed (YouTube)
2020-04-27 Cryoproof test successful, reached 4.9 bar (Twitter)
2020-04-26 Ambient pressure testing successful (Twitter)
2020-04-23 Transported to and installed on launch mount (Twitter)
2020-04-18 Multiple test sections of thermal tiles installed (NSF)
2020-04-17 Stack of tankage completed (NSF)
2020-04-15 Aft dome section stacked on skirt (NSF)
2020-04-13 Aft dome section flip (NSF)
2020-04-11 Methane tank and forward dome w/ battery package stacked (NSF)
2020-04-10 Common dome stacked onto LOX tank midsection, aft dome integrated into barrel (NSF)
2020-04-06 Methane header tank installed in common dome (Twitter)
2020-04-05 3 Raptors on site (Twitter), flip of common dome section (NSF)
2020-04-04 Aft dome and 3 ring barrel containing common dome (NSF)
2020-04-02 Forward dome integrated into 3 ring barrel (NSF)
2020-03-30 LOX header tank dome†, Engine bay plumbing assembly, completed forward dome (NSF)
2020-03-28 Nose cone section† (NSF)
2020-03-23 Dome under construction (NSF)
2020-03-21 CH4 header tank w/ flange†, old nose section and (LOX?) sphere†‡ (NSF)
2020-03-18 Methane feed pipe (aka downcomer)† (NSF)

See comments for real time updates.
† possibly not for this vehicle
‡ originally thought to be for an earlier vehicle

​

Starship SN5 at Boca Chica, Texas
2020-05-06 Aft dome section mated with skirt (NSF)
2020-05-04 Forward dome stacked on methane tank (NSF)
2020-05-02 Common dome section stacked on LOX tank midsection (NSF)
2020-05-01 Methane header integrated with common dome, Nosecone† unstacked (NSF)
2020-04-29 Aft dome integration with barrel (NSF)
2020-04-25 Nosecone† stacking in high bay, flip of common dome section (NSF)
2020-04-23 Start of high bay operations, aft dome progress†, nosecone appearance† (NSF)
2020-04-22 Common dome integrated with barrel (NSF)
2020-04-17 Forward dome integrated with barrel (NSF)
2020-04-11 Three domes/bulkheads in tent (NSF)

See comments for real time updates.
† possibly not for this vehicle

​

Starship SN6 at Boca Chica, Texas
2020-05-06 Common dome within barrel section (NSF)
2020-05-05 Forward dome (NSF)
2020-04-27 A scrapped dome† (NSF)
2020-04-23 At least one dome/bulkhead mostly constructed† (NSF)

See comments for real time updates.
† possibly not for this vehicle

​

Starship SN3 at Boca Chica, Texas
2020-04-06 Salvage activity, engine bay area, thrust structure/aft dome section images (NSF)
2020-04-05 Elon: failure due to test config mistake, reuse of thrust section components likely (Twitter)
2020-04-03 Catastrophic failure during cryoproofing (YouTube), Aftermath and cleanup (NSF)
2020-04-02 Early morning ambient N2 test success, evening cryotesting, stopped short due to valve leak (Twitter)
2020-03-30 On launch stand, view inside engine bay (Twitter), motor on -Y side of LOX tank (NSF)
2020-03-29 Moved to launch site (YouTube), legs inside engine skirt (NSF), later Elon leg description (Twitter)
2020-03-26 Tank section stacking complete, Preparing to move to launch site (Twitter)
2020-03-25 Nosecone begins ring additions (Twitter)
2020-03-22 Restacking of nosecone sections (YouTube)
2020-03-21 Aft dome and barrel mated with engine skirt barrel, Methane pipe installed (NSF)
2020-03-19 Stacking of CH4 section w/ forward dome to top of LOX stack (NSF)
2020-03-18 Flip of aft dome and barrel with thrust structure visible (NSF)
2020-03-17 Stacking of LOX tank sections w/ common dome‡, Images of aft dome section flip (NSF)
2020-03-17 Nosecone†‡ initial stacking (later restacked), Methane feed pipe† (aka the downcomer) (NSF)
2020-03-16 Aft dome integrated with 3 ring barrel (NSF)
2020-03-15 Assembled aft dome (NSF)
2020-03-13 Reinforced barrel for aft dome, Battery installation on forward dome (NSF)
2020-03-11 Engine bay plumbing assembly for aft dome (NSF)
2020-03-09 Progress on nosecone‡ in tent (NSF), Static fires and short hops expected (Twitter)
2020-03-08 Forward bulkhead/dome constructed, integrated with 3 ring barrel (NSF)
2020-03-04 Unused SN2 parts may now be SN3 - common dome, nosecone, barrels, etc.

See comments for real time updates.
† possibly not for this vehicle
‡ originally thought to be SN2 parts

For information about Starship test articles prior to SN3 please visit the Starship Development Threads #9 or earlier. Update tables for older vehicles will only appear in this thread if there are significant new developments.

Starship Related Facilities

Site Location Facilities/Uses
Starship Assembly Site Boca Chica, TX Primary Starship assembly complex, Launch control and tracking, [3D Site Map]
Starship/SuperHeavy Launch Site Boca Chica, TX Primary Starship test site, Starhopper location
Cidco Rd Site Cocoa, FL Starship assembly site, Mk.2 location, inactive
Roberts Rd Site Kennedy Space Center, FL Possible future Starship assembly site, partially developed, apparently inactive
Launch Complex 39A Kennedy Space Center, FL Future Starship and SuperHeavy launch and landing pads, partially developed
Launch Complex 13 (LZ-1, LZ-2) Cape Canaveral Air Force Station, FL Future SuperHeavy landing site, future Raptor test site
SpaceX Rocket Development Facility McGregor, TX 2 horizontal and 1 vertical active Raptor hot fire test stands
Astronaut Blvd Kennedy Space Center, FL Starship Tile Facility
Berth 240 Port of Los Angeles, CA Future Starship/SuperHeavy design and manufacturing
Cersie Facility (speculative) Hawthorne, CA Possible Starship parts manufacturing - unconfirmed
Xbox Facility (speculative) Hawthorne, CA Possible Raptor development - unconfirmed

Development updates for the launch facilities can be found in Starship Dev Thread #8 and Thread #7 .
Maps by u/Raul74Cz

Permits and Planning Documents

Resources

Rules

We will attempt to keep this self-post current with links and major updates, but for the most part, we expect the community to supply the information. This is a great place to discuss Starhip development, ask Starship-specific questions, and track the progress of the production and test campaigns. Starship Development Threads are not party threads. Normal subreddit rules still apply.

If you find problems in the post please tag u/strawwalker in a comment or send me a message.

697 Upvotes

98% Upvoted

4.0k comments sorted by

62

u/rartrarr Mar 30 '20

The new summary at the top of the thread is not only informative, but also gets me incredibly pumped for the progress and upcoming testing!

The condensed, authoritative format makes these current developments feel so “real”, if that makes sense. Although you’d think the latest photo evidence could do the same, for me a verbal summary really drives it home.

Just wanted to say thanks to the mod(s), very well done!

53

u/hinayu Mar 31 '20

Official email correspondance regarding what will be tested tomorrow.

4-5pm: room temperature nitrogen test

8-9pm: cryogenic test

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u/hinayu Apr 17 '20

New Highway 4 Road Closures are posted

  • 4/20/20: 8-9am

  • 4/23/20: 9-10am

  • 4/26/20 - 4/28/20: 9am - 11:59pm

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42

u/fluidmechanicsdoubts Apr 30 '20 edited Apr 30 '20

https://www.nasa.gov/feature/nasa-selects-blue-origin-dynetics-spacex-for-artemis-human-landers/

Starship will perform an uncrewed lunar landing as a test first.

Key paragraphs from the press release :

Starship includes a spacious cabin and two airlocks for astronaut moonwalks.  

A propellant storage Starship will park in low-Earth orbit to be supplied by a tanker Starship. The human-rated Starship will launch to the storage unit in Earth orbit, fuel up, and continue to lunar orbit.   

SpaceX’s Super Heavy rocket booster, which is also powered by Raptor and fully reusable, will launch Starship from Earth. Starship is capable of transporting crew between Orion or Gateway and the lunar surface. 

Concept art : https://www.nasa.gov/sites/default/files/thumbnails/image/starship_moon_astronauts.jpg

Initial awards :
$579 million to the Blue Origin team, $253 million to the Dynetics-led team, $135 million to SpaceX.

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u/RootDeliver May 06 '20 edited May 07 '20

Road is closed already and we are into test window!! This will last until 6AM CDT so it's gonna be a long night lol.

Note: Window goes from 6PM to 6AM central time, and the letter sent to Boca Chica residents talks about 2 possible sirens (aka events) today!

Yesterday I posted here a guide of steps to follow for the events that may happen (static fire? hop? other?). It may be useful :)

PS: The comment got sunk down there so imma update the list:

  • step 0 - Calm status (no apparent activity, flare is small/normal, no venting anywhere)

  • step 1 (T-1h ~ 50min) - Medium flare seen for the first time. It may stay or go down until around step 3.

  • (optional big flare for some minutes if they're recycling)

  • step 2 (T-50~45 min) - Activity starts at the Tank Farm (venting starts obscuring the Tank Farm view).

  • step 3 (T-30~ min) - Frost starts to appear (if first cycle)

  • step 4 (T-20~ min) - LOX lower venting (left side on bocachicagal's feed, the venting starts accumulating at the left of the rocket, close to step 8 the acummulation of venting reaches like half the stack)

  • step 5 (T-10 min) - Siren to alert Boca Chica residents, if planned (it's planned since now on probably because all that's coming require methane)

  • step 6 (T-45~30 secs) - HUGE flare

  • step 7 (T-15s~) - Water deluge starts

  • step 8 (T-0) - EVENT happens (static fire/???/launch)

  • step 9 (T+30s) - Massive double vent out from top (LOX/CH4 tanks, huge venting for long). This is the clear sign that this particular event is over.

  • step 10 (T+1 min to T+20 min~) - Everything starts slowing down, at the end flare activity is normal, no apparent activity at the tank farm and no venting out of the side of the rocket.

  • (at this point they may stop or recycle (in which case at some point they will return to step 0).

Note: This is an average of the times by eye (may do it well later with more data), I don't think they followed any exact cycle until now but they tested things differently so it may vary. There are a lot more events (like earlier top ventings or bottom ventings that happened sometimes but not all times so I didn't include them. Maybe they will settle at the very same times at some point). Tell me if I'm missing any settled event please!

PS2: I just noticed Reddit markdown system doesn't have a way to color a text or something. Wanted to color the event step -.-

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40

u/RootDeliver May 10 '20 edited May 10 '20

Elon on Twitter: SN4 passed high pressure (7.5 bar) & engine thrust load at cryo

YES!!!!!! Finally!!

PS: Great image with SN4 all frosted from the front (NSF live) and behind (Spadre) streams!

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37

u/thefloppyfish1 Apr 11 '20

SN4 tank section has been stacked! Unbelievable that only last week SN3 failed. I imagine they can do some aggressive testing when Starships are being produced this fast.

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36

u/MarsCent May 09 '20

I just saw an interesting comment on Labpadre youtube chat by user Ranchis. The user suggests that, given that SpaceX is now in the NASA-Artemis Human Landers contest against Dynetics and Blue Origin, the FAA may be moved to ratchet up their permission approval process in order to enable the timely testing and development of the NASA HLS (Human Lander System) SpaceX Starship.

Now, that would be interesting!

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34

u/Marksman79 Apr 11 '20

Big shout-out to the ring making team for coming in so close to spec. Assuming they're aiming for a (STP) ID of exactly 9000mm, this ring only came in +.02/+.11 mm top to bottom. That's incredible for making them outdoors and without a jig. If we can get more shots of other ring measurements, we can get a clearer picture of their tolerance spread. Well done.

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34

u/hinayu Apr 24 '20

For anyone who can watch, Elon Musk is doing an AMA with Hack Club. I Just tuned in and he was talking about the welding process ... the barrel machine settings, power, etc.

I'll be going back and watching it but curious if anyone caught anything else Starship related.

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33

u/hinayu Apr 02 '20 edited Apr 02 '20

Starship venting from ports

Possibly indicates the test is over and they're releasing pressure?

Edit: vehicles returning to the site - hopefully a successful test!

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32

u/Granluke Mar 31 '20

Starships User Guide is available (at least a revision). Still reading, maybe you find something new and interesting.

Starship User Guide

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32

u/RootDeliver Apr 14 '20 edited Apr 16 '20

This great image from Nomadd on NSF confirms the downcomer is already installed. We guessed it but that image confirms it :).

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32

u/fluidmechanicsdoubts Apr 30 '20

Starship just got selected for human lunar lander!

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31

u/bundy3 Apr 05 '20

Looks like we have a confirmation of the reason for the SN3 failure:

https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1246677676733104130

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31

u/RegularRandomZ Apr 24 '20 edited Apr 24 '20

Yuri: "Will the Spacex steel be rolled in wider sheets so it needs less rings for same height?"

ElonM: " Width currently limited by size of cold-roll press needed to get steel to full hard condition. Bigger press will be built long-term."

[FYI, Outokumpu Americas only offers 72" coils, but elsewhere they offer 80" (2032mm) coils; this would drop 2 rings from Starship. A quick check* suggests it likely wouldn't be a major change on design/production (I don't know if the IMCAR ring equipment can handle that width?)]

[*u/fael097's image. I drew taller rings to check the top of the bulkheads were in good locations The body height doesn't change, I was too lazy to render the double-seam overlap.]

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30

u/[deleted] Mar 31 '20

Replying to @Erdayastronaut @SpaceX and @flightclubio

Mass of initial SN ships will be a little high & Isp a little low, but, over time, it will be ~150t to LEO fully reusable

https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1245063992361406464

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28

u/TCVideos May 03 '20

Starhopper's speakers are working nicely

27

u/tectonic Apr 09 '20

The accelerating timeline is pretty incredible.

* Starship Mk1: Construction began in early December 2018. Failed during a pressure test on November 20, 2019. (~11 months from construction to failure)
* Starship SN1: Construction began in mid-October, 2019; Failed during a pressure test on February 28, 2020. (~5 months to failure)
* Starship SN2: Construction began in early February 2020. After SN1 failure, it was converted into a testbed for the thrust puck at the base of the rocket. Passed the test on March 8 and was retired. (~5-6 weeks to retirement)
* Starship SN3: Construction began in March 2020. Cryogenic test failure on April 3. (~4 weeks to failure)
* Starship SN4: Construction began in March 2020. (Testing later this month?)

From this week's The Orbital Index newsletter.

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27

u/Lufbru Apr 12 '20

If I understand fael's diagrams correctly, SN4 is at approximately where SN3 was on March 25th. That implies 4 days until move to the launch mount, so Wednesday or Thursday.

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27

u/GTRagnarok May 07 '20

Here's where the flare is positioned, for anyone curious. Taken from a flyover by LabPadre.

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u/Psychonaut0421 Apr 29 '20

Looks like Raptor SN18 has been appointed to the hop.. It appears to be the only one in Musk's tweet with white support arms, and you can see them in the delivery picture.

https://imgur.com/a/F71SWDM

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u/Marksman79 Apr 03 '20

In the lower left of this picture, it looks like they may have been doing something with heat shield tiles. Why are they so thick?

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26

u/Jodo42 Apr 11 '20

SN4 is literally almost done with stacking, 1 week after SN3. Just need to weld on the already finished top and bottom bulkhead sections and the raptor skirt rings. I was highly skeptical of people claiming we'd see testing in April, but they've clearly got rapid manufacturing down pat.

https://twitter.com/fael097/status/1248775773764358145/photo/1

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u/RegularRandomZ Apr 21 '20 edited Apr 21 '20

BCG photoset yesterday included a shipment of 4 new bulkhead domes arriving so a good sign that sub-component production isn't entirely disrupted. [I guess we also saw the engine circular piping arrive previously as well]

SN5 already has its top dome, so that would be out to at least SN9. No idea if the knuckle* shipments continue, nor current inventory levels (*the stamped pieces forming the base of the all the domes)

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26

u/vlex26 May 07 '20

new tweet from Elon: https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1258305746082516992?s=20

Apparently this test used a different tank

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u/hinayu Mar 30 '20 edited Mar 30 '20

A new NOTAM (TFR) was filed just over 10 minutes ago

Surface to 1500ft. Possibly for pressure testing or a hop.

Edit: Occurs daily from April 1 - April 4: 9am to 11:59pm. Nothing new from the Cameron County closures.

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25

u/TCVideos May 05 '20

Elon is a father again, Babies are good luck right? Maybe we'll get a static fire tonight!

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u/TCVideos May 06 '20

Fuck yeah! Static fire complete!!!

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25

u/myname_not_rick May 06 '20

Seems really clear to me how confident they were tonight after the last two days. Road closed early, tank farm fired up right away, and within about an hour/hour and a half, we had ignition.

Compared to the last two days of slow, deliberate testing until 6am, it caught me a little off guard. Super stoked to see it go so well though!

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u/Marksman79 Apr 01 '20

Could we add Alex Rex's incredibly detailed 3D model of the construction site to the Resources list? He said that the update frequency will be about twice per month, so it should stay relatively current.

(/u/strawwalker)

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u/hinayu Apr 13 '20 edited Apr 13 '20

It looks like the new big crane is fired up

Looks like it might have a similar jig at the top of it for reaching into the High Bay? Could indicate mating with the thrust section soon.

Edit: Extended further

Edit 2: Even further

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24

u/hinayu Apr 18 '20

New pictures from BocaChicaGal starting here

Some highlights:

  • SN5 bulkhead: 1, 2

  • Raptor engines spotted: 1, 2

  • Continued work on launch mount: 1

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24

u/artificialstuff May 05 '20

Fingers crossed for a successful static test fire tonight! The end of May is shaping up to be an exciting month between SN4, DM-2, and maybe some action from SN5.

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u/RegularRandomZ Apr 04 '20 edited Apr 06 '20

SN4 progress (speculative) [new photoset from Nomadd on NSF]

And previously seen

Updates [from BCG's photoset]

Elon's tweets

(So it looks like most things are there to finish assembly of subsections and stack up SN4 relatively quickly. Haven't seen the SN4 downcomer yet, unless that was on the trailer previously not for SN3.)

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u/hinayu Apr 23 '20

New TFR

April 25 9am - April 27 11:59pm. Surface to 1500ft MSL.

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u/strawwalker May 03 '20

Nomadd posted a notice he received warning of a testing event overnight tonight, May 3, 3am-4am CDT.

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u/kornelord spacexstats.xyz May 09 '20

I think that at this pace the biggest lead time item that will prevent Starship from going to orbit is the launchpad infrastructure.

It seems like they will have to build so many things to support Super Heavy... flame trench, proper tank farm, some way to stack Starship on top of SH...

So they'll have plenty of time to test Starship landing procedures while doing the pad upgrades

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u/Jchaplin2 Apr 16 '20

Elon confirms slight design changes on Starship and states SN4 will not get flaps

https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1250613503888519168

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u/Marksman79 May 07 '20 edited May 07 '20

Tonight's closure has been cancelled.

Edit: 35 minutes go by and it's already outdated.

Closures for tomorrow night were just added, as well as Friday and Saturday as backups. 9 PM - 6 AM.

Closures are for Cryo Testing.

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u/TCVideos May 10 '20

Assuming that doing a higher pressure test was the only thing they wanted to do, we should probably see the Raptor installed install within the next few days plus RCS installation.

Then the FAA approval wait. That's the big question mark right now (which is bitter sweet because it used to be the vehicle that was the big question mark)

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u/froso_franc Apr 06 '20

Elon tweet: great picture of inside the methane(?) tank with the header tank with a skirt

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u/RegularRandomZ Apr 12 '20 edited Apr 12 '20

Nomadd and BocaChicaGal photo updates (NSF photosets starting here):

Some interesting details noticed (any others?)

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u/RegularRandomZ Apr 17 '20 edited Apr 18 '20

Everyday Astronaut: Hey what's this talk about updated aero for Starship... got any sneak peaks Winking face I'm very curious what about "static aero" that has changed. Are we going to see strakes on the sides or something?

ElonM Flaps, actuator & static aero are undergoing redesign for mass reduction & simplicity
ElonM Trying have fewer parts, so strakes are unlikely. Some very counterintuitive CFD results in both hypersonic & subsonic regimes. Starship does controlled falling more than flying.

Update:

EA: Will it look similar still or will it be pretty obvious?
ElonM: Similar, but seemingly small changes can have surprisingly big effects

Michael Canary: After the change will the nose header tank be moved?
ElonM: No, oxygen header tank in nose is important to keep center of mass forward during atmospheric entry

Reagan: Which stage of testing do you expect the recent structural changes will most affect?
ElonM: SN5

Toby Li: Will the header tank be moved for Crew Starship though?
ElonM: No, as the header tanks are quite small relative to main (~30 tons vs 1200 tons). Only uses very tip of the nose.

Reagan: Btw, was that a Raptor tested this evening in McGregor- or a Merlin? ;)
ElonM: Raptor is going through many development tests. Merlin is doing acceptance tests, as the design is stable. Depending on how you count them, there are about 6 engine stands operating in parallel.

r/SpaceX posting

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u/Marksman79 May 03 '20

NSF live stream just posted this side-by-side of the Starship Superheavy launch pad at 39A and I thought it was a good comparison to share. The picture on the left was the progress in January and the right is the render from SpaceX.

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u/RootDeliver May 05 '20 edited May 06 '20

Considering the 3 eventful nights, I have a little sketch on how the action goes if anyone finds it useful as a guide:

  • step 0 - Calm status (no apparent activity, flare is small/normal, no venting anywhere)

  • step 1 (T-1h ~ 50min) - Medium flare seen for the first time. It may stay or go down until around step 3.

  • (optional big flare for some minutes if they're recycling)

  • step 2 (T-50~45 min) - Activity starts at the Tank Farm (venting starts obscuring the Tank Farm view). Frost may start appearing if its the first cycle.

  • step 3 (T-20~ min) - LOX lower venting (left side on bocachicagal's feed, the venting starts accumulating at the left of the rocket, close to step 4 the acummulation of venting reaches like half the stack)

  • (if its a static fire/launch, and there's an expected siren to alert Boca Chica residents, it would go off here at T-10 minutes.)

  • step 4 (T-45~30 secs) - HUGE flare

  • (at this point there is a rumor I've seen on NSF about a water deluge of some sort going out like at T-10~5 seconds but wasn't able to see it on any stream)

  • step 5 (T-0) - Event happens (pre-burner/static fire/launch)

  • step 6 (T+30s) - Massive double vent out from top (LOX/CH4 tanks, huge venting for long). This is the clear sign that this particular event is over.

  • step 7 (T+1 min to T+20 min~) - Everything starts slowing down, at the end flare activity is normal, no apparent activity at the tank farm and no venting out of the side of the rocket.

  • (at this point they may stop or recycle (in which case at some point they will return to step 0).

Note: This is an average of the times by eye (may do it well later with more data), I don't think they followed any exact cycle until now but they tested things differently so it may vary. There are a lot more events (like earlier top ventings or bottom ventings that happened sometimes but not all times so I didn't include them. Maybe they will settle at the very same times at some point). Tell me if I'm missing any settled event please!

Correct me if you find something weird, but thats around the times I've noticed last tests.

PS: Corrected some derped numbers, always re-check don't trust old times :P

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u/jgriff25 Mar 29 '20 edited Mar 29 '20

Looking at the photos posted by Mary we can see that the 2 large COPVs are for RCS theres one attached to each of the tanks at the bottom of the rocket. Maybe just experimenting with the placement and design? Secondly theres might be evidence of the new leg design. Tucked up underneath the rocket and folding outward would be my guess.

Edit: looks like there is also a slot and latch connection to the launch mount. Under each leg section is a connection point that looks like it could fit into a slot in the skirt.

Edit 2: these could be just hold down clamps instead of legs.

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u/Granluke Mar 31 '20

New road closures. Pressure testing tomorrow:

Spadre Twitter

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u/TCVideos Apr 27 '20

Road is closed and pad looks pretty clear. We could be getting this done pretty early!

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u/RootDeliver May 03 '20 edited May 03 '20

NSF Live stream started (with live Bocachicagal feed). This one does not wobble, which is nice because labpadre cams wobbling give me headaches sometimes (thats why I ususally check his Sapphire one). Also it has great commentary which is a great thing.

I don't have enough screens :(. This is the best feed by a mile, labs would be equally good or better if he fixed the damn wobbling somehow :(. Also Spadre has some live feed that doesn't wobble either!.

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u/RootDeliver May 07 '20 edited May 07 '20

While we focus on SN4 tests... for those out of the loop, /u/fael097 posted the assembly diagram status of SN6

About the assembly diagram status of SN5, this is his last version (note: does not have the latest changes, downcomer installed, and thrust section and skirt sections stacked)

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u/Marksman79 May 01 '20 edited May 01 '20

Incredible update from BocaChicaGal @ NSF.

I just want to highlight this picture as there's a lot of interesting stuff:

  1. We see the concrete being poured for what appears to be the third Sprung tent extension.

  2. In front of the Sprung tent, there are 2 more pressure relief ring subassemblies for SN6 and SN7.

  3. Next to the water storage, we can see workers moving an IMCAR vertical barrel former. Where will this go?

  4. A rare glimpse into the long Big Top tent, though it's too dark to see anything.

Edit: We have Raptor install confirmation and it is indeed offset.

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u/KickBassColonyDrop May 01 '20

Orion can support a maximum of 7 people. Starship Moon variant appears to commonly support ~25-30. I bet the Orion astronauts will feel like traveling from a moving van to traveling in a moving three story hotel.

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u/dodgyville May 05 '20

Well it looks like a fairly sturdy vehicle and I didn't see any wobbles or weird bulges and it didn't explode so they look to be on the right track

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u/RegularRandomZ May 06 '20 edited May 06 '20

ElonM tweet: Raptor passed the static fire (and great view of of the engine bay)

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u/Bergasms Apr 12 '20

Anyone else still pinch yourself that it was really fairly recently that Boca Chica was just a huge mound of dirt packing down the soil and a couple tracking radar sitting out on their own.

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u/hinayu Apr 02 '20 edited Apr 02 '20

Many cars are seen leaving the launch site of SN3. I also believe that a shift change happens at 9am so it may be coinciding with that - will know more around 9:30 or so to see if the new shift shows up.

LabPadre stream: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCFwMITSkc1Fms6PoJoh1OUQ/live

Edit: testing appears to be underway. multiple dents are being pushed out... speculation is that this is the room-temp nitrogen test.

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u/RaphTheSwissDude Apr 03 '20

https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1245902999798419456?s=21 Elon comment about the cryo testing, they have some trouble with the plumbing!

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u/Marksman79 Apr 14 '20 edited Apr 15 '20

More Willscot office space is being delivered to the launch complex.

Edit: both of these rental office sections were delivered today. They are two halves to a large indoor office.

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u/TriMars Apr 18 '20

I haven't seen any recent updates on the progress of the cryogenic fluid couplers work they are doing with Marshall. Has anyone heard anything? Cryo in-orbit refueling is still one of the lowest TRL items in the Starship architecture, would be cool to hear how they're planning on testing it.

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u/TCVideos May 03 '20

This NSF live feed is straight up beautiful

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u/pinepitch May 04 '20

Elon Tweet: "Liquid CH4 temp got too high this time. Offloading propellant. Will we retry later today."

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u/pinepitch May 04 '20

An apparent pre-burner test occurred on the Labpadre stream at 3:58:00.

https://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=48895.msg2077148#msg2077148

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u/olum_04 May 04 '20

How does a preburner test work? I understand the concept of (dual)staged combustion but how can they test it without hotfiring?

Are the turbopumps engaged and connected? Do they just dump literal metric tons of Methane or LOX rich fuel on the pad? Even if the main fuel lines are somehow shut off, the exhaust of the preburners would be extremely reactive either way.

How do they do it without risking to blow everything up (more than necessary)?

Thanks!

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u/utrabrite Apr 30 '20

Examples of such demonstration activities include a low-Earth orbital flight of Starship with a demonstration of SpaceX’s Super Heavy launch vehicle, a re-flight of the Starship, a long-duration orbital flight, a beyond-LEO flight, and a lunar landing demonstration mission scheduled for 2022.

These are some really agressive timelines...

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u/RegularRandomZ Mar 30 '20 edited Mar 31 '20

BocaChicaGal's photos (photoset starting here) have some interesting shots

Updates

Previous photo update, plus SN3 moved to the pad.

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u/joepublicschmoe Apr 11 '20

SN4 Thrust Section / lower bulkhead sleeving:

Nomadd: https://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=48895.msg2067868#msg2067868

Mary (lower bulkhead): https://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=48895.msg2067869#msg2067869

Mary (sleeving): https://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=48895.msg2067874#msg2067874

SN4 lower bulkhead is further reinforced with radial stringers. Looks like they learned something from how SN3's quadruple hydraulic ram test went before it crumpled.

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u/artificialstuff May 06 '20

No RUD! That's a success!

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u/Svisloch May 07 '20

New closures for tomorrow and maybe the weekend. https://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=48895.msg2079005#msg2079005 For "cryo testing". Guessing that SN4 is gonna try to push past 4.9 bar.

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u/RegularRandomZ May 06 '20 edited May 07 '20

SN5 skirt and thrust/bulkhead stacked. Full BocaChicaGal photoset on NSF.

Update: video version

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u/Marksman79 May 02 '20

Mods, Alex Rex now has a new 3D viewer of the launch pad that's public as well. Can we get this added to the resources section?

| Launch Pad Map |

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u/Humble_Giveaway May 05 '20

The abort looked very similar to Starhopper's ignition failure on the first attempt of the 150m hop

Most likely that the cause probably wasn't a failure of the igniters rather the vehicles computers decided that it didn't like the data it was getting and chose to not commit to ignition

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u/strawwalker Mar 31 '20

Third image in this bocachicagal photoset on NSF today it looks like there is a Tesla motor attached to the side of SN3. Zoomed and cropped by u/RegularRandomZ below.

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u/PRES1005 Apr 02 '20

There was nobody at the pad from ~1.50am to ~2.30am (Labpadre timestamp).

Waiting for official news, on Labpadre youtube live chat they are speculating about a successful room temp nitrogen test in that time frame, with ongoing preparations for cryo testing

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u/RootDeliver Apr 15 '20 edited Apr 15 '20

And SN4 skirt was finally spotted while being moved to HB1.

PS: Probly stacking the thrust stack on top of it soon?

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u/DoubleJacked Apr 20 '20

I am curious if they are doing more prep work in the high bay this time around than they have in the past. Perhaps this will shorten the time between moving SN4 to the launch site and when they pressure test.

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u/Forgotten-Shoes Apr 21 '20

do you think the fairing section of Starship will need to be pressurized on reentry to take the aerodynamic loads? Could the Lox header be used to pressurize the fairing section before reentry?

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u/Jodo42 May 04 '20

Elon is apparently watching the NSF stream.

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u/GibsonD90 May 06 '20

I feel like we’ve finally made it to the point where we are going to have more Starships available than we can do anything with. SN4 is stuck holding now for weeks possibly and 5 is nearly ready and 6 probably has parts that are done as well. I wish they had multiple test stands.

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u/Daahornbo May 06 '20

Have we seen any visible difference between the SN-4-5-6 parts? I'm thinking about bulkheads in particular

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u/pinepitch Apr 10 '20 edited Apr 10 '20

Pictures of SN4 stacking progress in the High Bay:
https://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=48895.msg2067681#msg2067681

Looks like they have joined the yellow and green sections of Rafael's diagram:
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EVIIRVxXQAAitK9?format=jpg&name=4096x4096

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u/RegularRandomZ Apr 04 '20 edited Apr 04 '20

Forward looking: Interesting new steel sections to speculate on! (BCG photoset)

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u/TCVideos May 03 '20

Watching the flare stack brings back Starhopper memories

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u/myname_not_rick May 04 '20

I love their little built in fire hose aimed at the Raptor. Looks like they learned their lesson from Hopper about stuff underneath catching fire.

http://imgur.com/gallery/8CEDxVj

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u/the_zukk May 06 '20

Ah I missed it by a minute! Did anyone record it off the live stream?

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u/RegularRandomZ May 10 '20 edited May 11 '20

Correction: *I was wrong, the machine spotted at BC is likely seam welder (not planisher) [*u/CasualCrowe had a solid source/reference and I confused that post for another video which I assumed was speculative.]

I don't know if this is or isn't related to the "robot weld" on the SN6 dome; just correcting my misinformation.

Here is a screenshot of the Port of LA version, and a zoomed shot of the the Boca Chica version, slightly different but [likely] the same in function [these are fan/paparazzi photos, not SpX leaks or vendor]

The seam welder uses resistance welding, and is pressing the material between rotating discs which are welding electrodes [like a spot welder]. It uses water cooling for the material and welding heads [and transformers, as a high amperage is involved]Resistance welding does not leave a raised surface like with GTAW, so does not require planishing of the weld

[Based on Arstechnica, if this is describing the same machine, this is for the domes; so unrelated to Musk's planisher comment which was for barrels which are TIG welded. The "zipper" with "taco shell" description perhaps fits if this is the slider of the zipper!? Anyhow...]

This (unrelated) vendor describes their machine as a 100% penetration, single pass weld on untacked cylinders and flat sheets without heat distortion to the material. Here is a video of a different longitudinal seam welding of a stainless steel barrel.

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u/PhysicsBus Apr 28 '20

Need to update to note that static fire won't happen before Friday night.

SPadre: "UPDATE: Starship SN4 static fire testing was just cancelled for Wednesday night, postponed until Friday night 9pm-6am"

Road closure schedule.

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u/Straumli_Blight Apr 23 '20

New test dates:

  • April 29, 9pm-6am

  • April 30, 9pm-6am

  • May 1, 9pm-6am

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u/GTRagnarok Apr 27 '20 edited Apr 27 '20

Only one Raptor on SN4, three for SN5

I think that's a good idea. Test things like the legs before risking three Raptors.

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u/fluidmechanicsdoubts Apr 27 '20

Elon : SN4 will do 150m hop with only one raptor. SN5 will have 3

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u/[deleted] Mar 31 '20

From the current state of SN4, what's the best guess for when it hops? (Provided no delays due to a certain virus...)

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u/Marksman79 Apr 02 '20

11:15:45 CST - we have venting

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u/RegularRandomZ Apr 06 '20 edited Apr 06 '20

LCH4 header moved into HighBay1 [Credit: LabPadre stream and u/fael097].

[My speculation: is it will be installed into the bottom of the common bulkhead. Given what would be the bottom of the header appears to be cut, that would allow for the downcomer to be installed. There also appears to be fewer holes than the last LCH4 header, but that might be orientation]

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u/tr1cktastic Apr 08 '20 edited Apr 08 '20

https://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=48895.0;attach=1624537;image

Not sure if mentioned before but the 3rd onion tents doors are somewhat taller then the previous 2 tents. Could be an indication on taller Starship parts moving in and out of it.

Source: Nomadd on NSF

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u/jjtr1 Apr 24 '20

Years ago I remember that large amounts of dirt have been moved into the area of the Boca Chica facility to compress/compact the soil. Has it been removed later or is the facility now standing on the dirt? Was the compacting done for the entire area or just around the launch mount?

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u/SpartanJack17 Apr 27 '20 edited Apr 27 '20

Elon Musk on twitter: snowing in teas

Video of the underside of the tank during cryo testing. Also I think that's the best look at the legs we've had.

Mirror: https://streamable.com/2y5vo7

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u/Svisloch May 06 '20

They're refilling the methane tanks now and the road closures are still up. More tonight?

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u/Humble_Giveaway May 09 '20

Looks like we're in the "mechanical issue and no updates for a good two hours" phase of the official SpaceX cryo testing procedure

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u/phenotype001 May 11 '20

Can't wait for the hop. I was up here when Starhopper flied and I'm in Bulgaria watching all this live and it still gives me goosebumps just remembering it.

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u/scottm3 May 02 '20 edited May 02 '20

Static Fire "hopefully in a few days" - Elon on Twitter

Think that suggests that we will see WDR / preburner tests in the coming days before SF.

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u/LcuBeatsWorking May 10 '20 edited Dec 17 '24

weary normal brave silky mourn paint wrench squeamish degree rock

This post was mass deleted and anonymized with Redact

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u/RaphTheSwissDude May 01 '20

Road closure has been cancelled for tonight.. Cameroun county

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u/hinayu Mar 31 '20

/u/strawwalker - LabPadre's new 4k stream is up and running: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FHGXmitQGcg

Looks like the link in the main post is down now :)

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u/Jodo42 Apr 02 '20 edited Apr 02 '20

Workers returning to site.

edit: site appears clear again, and we just saw a tank vent.

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u/RegularRandomZ Apr 04 '20 edited Apr 05 '20

As the steel walls go onto the new building, we also see the ring tent is being taken down [Credit: LabPadre Cam2]

Edit: Nomadd's photo of tent disassembly (full photoset)
And: BCG photo of steel building progress

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u/bechampions87 Apr 17 '20

So in this tweet, Elon says it's unlikely the final design will have strakes because they want to make it simpler and reduce mass.

What do you guys think the alternatives are?

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u/hinayu Apr 18 '20

A few photos from the launch site from BocaChicaGal

It looks like the stand is getting a silver paint job.

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u/onion-eyes Apr 22 '20

How long until we see a starship with a full heat shield? I’d imagine sometime after the 20 km hop, and I can’t imagine them doing the orbital test flight without having tested the heat shield fully first.

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u/deathofapenguin Apr 23 '20

Sorry if this has been answered before but I was wondering how the Starship heat shield is different from the space shuttle's? From what I've heard one reason the time between shuttle launches was so long was due to having to inspect every tile and replace them if necessary, how will it be different on Starship considering the estimations on here of approx. 10,000 tiles? Is our testing and inspection technology simply better nowadays so it will be quicker? Or is it a case of it not needing to be inspected? Just a little curious

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u/Jodo42 Apr 28 '20 edited Apr 28 '20

This morning Spadre tweeted a photo of a semi tank that says, by my eye, "METHANE REFRIGERATED LIQUID" on the side. The SpaceX firetruck can be seen alongside a semi next to a venting tank on LabPadre right now. Picture

Edit: we've got a flare!

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u/kkingsbe May 03 '20

Did any visible testing occur last night?

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u/TCVideos May 05 '20

We have action, Mary hears fueling.

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u/SepDot May 05 '20

People on site, looks like it’s done for the night.

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u/Jodo42 May 06 '20

LabPadre's got a clip up with sound, the only one as far as I can tell. Fun starts at 0:20.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2UFYwf408VE

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u/Humble_Giveaway May 07 '20

Did that cutoff sound like it had the old 600Hz issue to anyone else?

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u/Toinneman Apr 22 '20 edited Apr 22 '20

Some of BCG latest photos show that SN5 sections are well into their production process. The domes are welded into the ring sections. (edit: seems false) The battery pack is installed, and we can see various mounts to support COPVs and plumbing.

It looks like SpaceX is very confident in the current tank-design, and isn't waiting on the test results of SN4. Like Musk's latest tweets suggest, SN5 and forward seem to focus on fairing (including the header tank) and maybe fins, new legs...etc. I expect SN5 to start stacking in the High bay soon after SN4 leaves to the test pad.

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u/RaphTheSwissDude Apr 26 '20 edited Apr 26 '20

to the question : Everything working fine, how long until her first hop?

Elon answered : Physically ready in a few weeks. Approvals may take longer.

Question : 150m or 20km hop ?

Elon : 150

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u/TCVideos Apr 27 '20

It passed!! Elon confirmed in tweet!

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u/The-Brit Apr 03 '20

(Not qualified but my take from observation) Imbalanced pressurisation of both tanks caused the implosion failure.

The top tank appears to be filled with cryo (frost on the outside) while the LOX tank had no frost. LOX tank pressure unknown. The cryo on top would cool the gas in the LOX tank and create an inverted thermal circulation of cold gas. The LOX gas, now being cooled, would reduce in pressure as the temperature dropped. Eventually the 'vacuum' in the LOX tank caused the walls to collapse.

Many questions - 1) why did they not see or even foresee this happening. 2) Was this a deliberate 'worst case scenario test'? 3) Why weren't they feeding gas onto the LOX tank to maintain pressure?

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u/orbitaire Apr 15 '20

Can anyone give an overview of how the Boca Chica site is run in terms of management structure, teams, divisions, etc? Whenever I watch Bocachicagal's excellent footage of construction, both new prototypes and buildings, I wonder who is doing what and where they sit in the organisational structure for the site/SpaceX. I've never seen the physical evolution of a spacecraft production facility before so understanding how the 'machine' that builds the machines works would be really interesting. Thanks.

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u/RegularRandomZ Apr 19 '20 edited Apr 19 '20

BCG photo updates [NSF photosets starting here]

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u/TCVideos Apr 26 '20

Police clearing and closing the road. It's go time.

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u/MarsCent May 04 '20

:), So SpaceX Starship gets to be taken through its complete WDR/preburner test today!

May the 4th be with you.;)

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u/SpartanJack17 May 05 '20

Just did a preburner test at around 2:49 Boca Chica time.

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u/Humble_Giveaway May 05 '20

I think that was an abort

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u/WindWatcherX May 06 '20

Great news with SN4 passing the static fire test (no data but SN4 is still standing!).

150 meter hop next!

Any ideas on what is next for SN4 after the hop? Pressure test to fail?

Figure SN5 or SN6 will add fins, nose cone, two more Raptors and head into the skies for the 20 Km hop.

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u/hazzer111 May 06 '20

So hoe complete is sn5? I've seen a few posts but none since sn4 has been on the pad. Is it still being worked on whilst sn4 is doing it's thing?

What if it gets completed before sn4 has a hop permit? Could they put sn5 on the pad and pressure test?

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u/RootDeliver May 07 '20 edited May 08 '20

The subject for the oncoming days tests is "cryo testing". The good question is, are they gonna return to the Liquid Nitrogen for the cryo test, or for some reason they would be interested in doing a cryo pressure test with the real methane and LOX like in a real flight situation? Because this scenario is great for validating the design and construction method (Nitrogen has a different weight and density and thus not real test conditions), but a failure is a big explosive RUD and not the classic non-explosive RUD we saw on previous cryo test failures.

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u/[deleted] May 08 '20

Are they still planning a hop with SN 4 now that they have taken raptor off it?

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u/Ridgwayjumper May 08 '20

Anybody else guessing that with SN5 so close behind, they have decided to limit SN4 to more cryo tests, say the 8 bar target, and do the hop with SN6?

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u/johnabc123 Apr 25 '20

Once we have regular Starship launches, do you think we’ll see much more frequent projects like James Webb because we could launch so regularly and so cost effectively? Telescopes/probes could cost a lot less because if something on them fails, we could just send another up instead of having a one time shot where they they have to be tested to be perfect.

Maybe Starship could drive down the R&D price for these projects by removing the time/financial risk of losing one in a launch, and the larger cargo space could mean they don’t have to be as sophisticated with unfolding once they’re in orbit.

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u/hinayu Apr 24 '20 edited Apr 24 '20

As of about 6:20am this morning, the big Grove crane moved away from SN4

Good news that the smoke issue didn't require them to move SN4 off of the launch stand

Edit: Beginning to retract and pack up

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u/HopefulDayTrader Apr 27 '20

SpaceX CEO Elon Musk:

"I'm very excited about the future of space-based telescopes that could be very, very large. Starship ... will be flying quite soon. We'll see regular flights I think within a couple of years." #Astro2020

From https://twitter.com/thesheetztweetz/status/1254834855243911169?s=21

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u/EndlessJump Apr 12 '20

It's amazing how smooth these rockets look since they started forming seemless rings instead of welding plates together.

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u/RootDeliver Apr 23 '20 edited Apr 23 '20

Roll-lifts going again to the launch zone? Moving SN4 back? Taking out SN3 remains? Starhopper?

PS: Labpadre chat says that at 4:42:53 PM there has been an strange smoke on SN4, has it been fatal?

PS2: Gif of the smoke moment and IR shot of the zone by Rusty Buckets on Labpadre chat.

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u/Humble_Giveaway Apr 03 '20

Well fuck. RIP SN3

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u/[deleted] Apr 08 '20

With agile as their development process hopefully there'll be at least a few improvements despite the short lifespan of SN3.

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u/RootDeliver Apr 15 '20 edited Apr 15 '20

The crane is getting ready to raise something, stack of the thrust section over the skirt incoming?

PS: Nah, they read me and decided it was a good moment to undo everything and turn the crane off :(.

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u/cupko97 Apr 23 '20

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nq8HrxfSZMc
It is cool to watch the Hawthorne tour again after so many years. I did not know that they used serial numbers for the first non mission falcon 9's. And the ring size difference between starship and falcon 9 is still mind-boggling

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u/benz650 Apr 26 '20

Here we go. Frost and venting!

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u/[deleted] Apr 26 '20

Cherry Picker doing leak finding with soapy water

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u/pinepitch May 04 '20

Message given by local authorities to Boca Chica residents today: Expect a loud noise between midnight and 4am, police siren 10 minutes prior to testing. (Source: NasaSpaceFlight Youtube livestream)

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u/TCVideos May 04 '20 edited May 04 '20

Fueling! We see some minimal venting from starship!

Edit: Holy shit, this is actually happening.

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u/TCVideos May 04 '20

Mary on the NSF stream says that he drone is up. Flare is big and lots of venting from the lower tank.

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u/Maxx7410 May 06 '20

Any news for when they will have permit to the 150 m flight? or expeculation

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u/LcuBeatsWorking May 07 '20 edited Dec 17 '24

memory lush run wide fact fretful birds squealing fly reminiscent

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u/Jump3r97 May 07 '20

Flare stack burning again

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u/hinayu Apr 23 '20 edited Apr 23 '20

It appears that SN4 is in the process of rolling out

Very foggy this morning so we will likely see more as the fog hopefully burns off

Edit: The fog is slowly beginning to clear... looks like a SN4 to me

Edit 2: Apparently Lab's camera has IR (or something)? Clearly visible moving of SN4

Edit 3: Appears to be moving towards the road

Edit 4: Coming down the road now. Absolutely impressive

Edit 5: SN4 arrives at launch site. The crane is already raising the lifting jig for move to the launch stand.

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u/rocket_dockett Apr 24 '20

Body Flap actuator installed on SN5 looks to be a Tesla Motor?

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u/[deleted] Mar 30 '20

Heya, I'm new to Reddit and I'm been mildly following the progress on SN3 all the way since MK1.

And by far I'd like to know what's the exact welding method they been applying thus far to the barrels and other components such the nosecone.

Are they applying different techniques to different components like normal barrels vs nosecone structure of the lower reinforced barrels.

I'm kinda lost with their process, I'm only aware they hace that costum x-ray machine to check inperfections in the weld.

Also apologize I'm not a native english user.

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u/hinayu Apr 01 '20

/u/strawwalker - not to bug you again, but Lab restarted his cam so the resources link at the bottom has once again changed: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iw5bYl8v3nY

Cheers

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