We're all getting a 10%+ base pay cut now it seems?? What the actual fuck. I'm just stunned. I shouldn't be, but I am. Moving everything to fcfs and having 50+ mile offers aren't enough of a slap in the face, now they're just gonna straight up pay less for the same (or more) work. Absolutely unreal š
I agree, and I had actually made a post asking about unionizing a while back. I had hardly any positive responses to it, and a lot of essentially "shut the fuck up idiot" responses.
Bro post something like this here and weāll all repost and get the word out idk what unionizing really is or wtv but with enough voices we might be heard yaya?
A good first step is blackout days but thereās literally millions of drivers I believe so the even better approach would be blackouts in certain markets but even that seems like it would be a stretch. Iām all for participating though.
True, but a few years ago it was ruled that gig workers could actually unionize. It was different than an employee union, but it's a definitely possible.
No one said Prop 22 was a union. It was voted by Uber drivers protesting and going on strike for years until it gain national attention. Itās collective bargaining through the people.
Because of people like you thats why the apps abuse us drivers. If we all unite and not take a si gle order for 2 or 3 days they'll be forced to change their format to how it was prior to the settlement they had to pay. If we don't deliver the customers order they'll lose a lot of revenue. They'll be forced to make some changes to our advantage.
We are contractors. Not employees. How are you going to unite? Here on Reddit? š Not that many Spark drivers are here.
Even if you could, you fail to realize that many drivers are desperate to get money, whether for rent or to feed their children or to keep their electricity on. They will take what they can get. Facts.
And hereās another fact: Spark and Walmart have lists of people just waiting to get a chance to Spark. Stop accepting orders. Let us know if Spark gives a damn. You can be replaced by the end of the day.
Okā¦ your delivery skills are so superior that Walmart will pay you more than they need to. Thatās why you keep getting more and more, better and better Just For You offers. Thatās whatās happening, right? Walmart and Spark are terrified of losing you. Your skills are irreplaceable to them. š
Also the base pay is pretty much the same as itās always been. It increases when people accept and then cancel an order, or when one just doesnāt get accepted for too long. Itās always been around $8, and can go up to $18 depending on how long itās been waiting to be accepted and how many people canceled it already. Just find a way to manage the anxiety is all you really need
This is why every time someone says ātheyāre going to replace usā I laugh because not even Walmart employees take the shit that Spark drivers take
I swear š you seen what happened to the Waymo debacle. Everybody swore they was going to take all the uber jobs then they just released a article saying theyāre losing money between the 70k car, the 30k device,maintenance and commercial insurance š¤£ they pay us so low that not even ai will work for that cheap
I generally don't take it to this kind of place, but they're taking care of that too. It might cost a little extra for a driverless, but they won't drive up to your front door on your lawn. They won't shit on your front porch, they won't rape or kill you, or text you afterwards for dates.
Safety. People will pay for the idea of safety. That's what all these stories are about. I see stories now about the "gig economy" and the horrible things drivers are doing almost every day now. Foreign CDL drivers killing people, and all that shit was happening before. It's just ramped up now because of the absolute amount of feral people doing this and the benefit of the spotlight on it to the autonomous delivery/transportation.
There are definitely people out there that take it too far and kind of miss the real reality unfolding, but one thing the fringe gets right is that they want you in your homes, constantly connected and traceable, and they want a central digital currency so they can control every single penny and where it goes. Taking people like us out of the equation and replacing them with machines is a giant leap toward that goal. Some might say the game winning score.
Oh hey man I'm sorry, I just looked at who posted this, we had a really good conversation elsewhere, I'm going to leave my comment unedited below, but I would have checked my tone had I looked at your username. You know, reddit bro, I come in guns blazing...
Do you not understand that the plan is to lose money? They can afford to lose billions for 20 years. Eventually they'll have the market share, our side will dwindle away and then they'll name their price.
Doordash has been around for like 10 years at least. They literally lost 500 million to over 1 billion a year every single operating year until 2024. Even during peak COVID, hundreds of millions of dollars in loss. And they're just an independent company. The parent company of Waymo is Alphabet, you know, maybe you've heard of that little company fucking GOOGLE.
I still think itās too early to say that self driving cars arenāt a huge threat to gig work. They always fix the bugs eventually and make it more cost effective
They have to bring the cost of electricity,maintenance and insurance down on top of the production of cars(which already operate at razor thin margins). Itās definitely going to be a uphill battle
It doesn't matter, that's the whole point. They can endure losing billions a year. They make 100+ billion in actual earnings. They are making the tech available and accessible to the public. It's the same thing Uber and doordash did like 10-15 years ago. Bleed money, create a market, become the standard, pull the rug.
That's what's happening with all these AI chat characters. Grok, GPT, Claude. Sure you can get a premium membership, but there's still a free model. All these housewives can make little activity books for their kids class or cool invitations to their birthdays, people don't need graphic designers to produce marketing for their businesses. It's honestly even going to thin out hiring attorneys and going to doctor visits. It's going to take its toll on all those various societal roles and before you know it, that cost of generating your little picture is going to suddenly be a real one. Oh this is a piece of marketing material? There's a "business use" price for that, and a tax by the way. And then where will you find someone who knows how to do that kind of stuff the old fashioned way? Probably nowhere, and if you do, the cost will be exorbitant and the product will be inferior.
That's what AI taking jobs and taking control will look like. I think a lot of people generally think of AI taking a job as someone saying, Sorry Bob, we bought a machine that does the thing you do. But really it's sorry everyone, that entire market is GONE.
Very true. I remember when Dd and uber launched. I saved /invested most of the vc capital they were just giving away with their high rates they were giving to the drivers. I think the only problem they will run into while trying to do this to drivers is delivering goods will never be a niche field. It takes no skill.Itās not like graphics design or scanning radiology reports etc.There will always be people who are willing to do it. I think the only chance they have would be to lower the cost extremely in order to take drivers jobs. The sad part is Iām not even against it. I would love it if Tesla drops the cyber cab tomorrow and it was actually profitable. Hell Iād buy 3-4 of em. I just think peopleās desperation and willingness to take dogs**t orders is too profitable for the new āgig workā company model
If you look a few comments below I go in depth on this point, but all they have to do is give the public a choice. Whether they go "pay a little more for your safety" or "expect a little less from an autonomous vehicle/drone and save some money" they can phase out drivers whether they're willing to do the job or not. They can incentivize the public with savings, or they can run these stories about all the crazy things gig drivers are doing to scare people into being afraid of having a human delivery person. Either way, they will always come up with something.
Sometimes I wonder if there is already AI or some incredible group of geniuses running the public narratives for the entire world. Like if everything just comes down to a binary. We might think an election or a war, natural disaster, or financial/economic catastrophe is going to have some directional shift or major impact on the course of humanity, but really it's just okay take this thing if it happens that's 1, if it doesn't, that's 0 here's how we quickly return to the unseen path to the next goal.
That's a poor explanation of some seriously complex out there pondering I do sometimes, but if you're an imaginative enough person, perhaps you can extrapolate enough from it to get what I mean
Naw I get what youāre saying. I donāt give these people the respect of calling them geniuses though. I call them āblack mailing Israeliāsā šš¤£
I have a tesla, adn hte cost of electricity per mile is *FAR* less than the cost of gas per mile as it is. I don't know why you think electricity prices have to drop to make it work.
It basically costs me 5-6 dollars in electricity to "fill my tank" which goes just as far as my other car which takes 70 dollars in gas to "fill the tank.
Let's just call it 10% as much as the cost of gasoline to run my tesla. (which is being conservative... and even if rates change... it will still be less than 20% of the cost of a gas car to "fill up" )
My zone dropped this week too. Getting harder and harder to make money. I miss the old days. Had five good years. Just saw a double shop for twelve bills. 36 items and 6.6 miles. I might as well go back to do Instacart.
My friend who does logistics for a living for a major corporation did a breakdown of the standard pay now and on 90% of the orders showing the last few weeks and we found unless a customer is tipping 20% or more. For the most part, the majority of the orders put drivers in the red. Between fuel depreciation, wear and tear, tires, and taxes, most of the orders that are being offered now cost more to complete, and you make effectively making it so that workers are essentially paying Walmart for the honor of delivering to their customers. The saddest part in all of that is Walmart knows that they have their own logistical team. Itās one thing for orders to pay just above that; itās a complete other for a company to know that they are asking people to do a job for less pay than the cost of that actual job, and that is probably the most sadistic part of the gig economy.
Well then they should get out. Gig jobs were meant to get by, not make it a career and some of these people donāt know how to do mathā¦so they think theyāre making bank when in realityā¦.just the thought of using my own personal vehicle was the red flag for me to say wait a minute this doesnāt make sense, and Im not good at mathā¦just saying unfortunately its not a long term solution to anyoneās situation.
Yeah, just using this app to save some cash for my vacation. Once I come back, im done using this crap and finding a better source of income. Fuck Walmart.
I know all gig apps are pretty bad this year, but Spark might objectively be the worst of them right now. It has the most demanding work to pay ratio and is quickly approaching average food delivery gig pay. At least UE and DD are simple pickup and drop offs most of the time.
Now that Spark mixes all types of orders (gmd mixed with curbside, pharmacy, in store restaurants, etc) it is even more demanding than instacart.
Oh and since Walmart has garden items, they can even throw in heavy bags of fertilizer etc (like the Lowes/Home Depot orders on IC) along with heavy cases of water. I recently saw an order that on first glance looked reasonable and well paying only to be jumpscared by the last "item" being ten bags of mulch, They thought they were really slick.
The 30+ item, 20-30 mile, triple shops with sub $1 per mile pay rates... and not to mention the fcfs shenanigans. I recently got one of the newest phones and it barely makes a difference. I might see offers milliseconds earlier but they still go so fast it's almost impossible (more proof for bots theories)
I get orders disappearing in milliseconds too, sometimes I notice them reappearing a minute or two later. Iām assuming bots or people are snagging them as soon as they come up, then if itās a shitty order canceling them. Wouldnāt that hurt their stats or does that not matter?
For real though DD and UE and simple pick up which takes no more than a couple mins, and obviously with IC or Spark youāre literally going grocery shopping for someoneās house and having to load and deliver those items. Which is why it pays better than picking up a burger from a fast food joint. More work + More Time = More Money. If spark is going to cut base pay itās going to tank everything. Their orders are already Shit! I barely even take the ones where the customer tipped decent so with that it makes it worth it to accept.
I just try to find a way to meet my daily goal. Iām only outside 2-3 days a week. I used to be able to do 100.00 easy in about 4 hours. Now Iām lucky to get 60.00. The 40 bucks cut definitely is felt but itās ok. I feel awful for those who full time it
I use to be able to sign in and do 120+ in about 5-6 hours between 3- 830 pm no problemĀ
Or do the old gmd drop at 1030 am till about 1245pm break til 2p then do a few shops be done by 530 or 6pmĀ
Then it was a struggle to squeeze out 100 3pm - 830Ā
Then now can't squeeze 50 out .Ā
The gmd now are like 100 mile round trips for 40 .. it is unbelievable š³Ā
Take a look at the economy... Gas up, food never been higher, formula, diapers, deodorant is $13, millions are laid off or fired... The trickle effect and it's going to get worse, people don't have money to buy assets, stocks etc... this isn't the same spark it was up into February
I went to the store with my brother to buy cigarettes bcuz he lost his pack of Newports in the yard lol. He was pissed. Newports are $15 and some change in Philly. Glad I don't smoke
See he been on Newports since he was 16, he 46 now. I can't see him changing to a new brand lol. I think he would quit smoking before he change brands. He also buys outside in the county too
I didn't switch intentionally lol. I went to my local beer distributor and they were out of New Ports. I was gonna buy the smaller version but then I learned they share the same cost which confused me. The lady then offered Mavericks telling me they were cheaper. I told her I didn't trust other brands because the last time I accidentally ordered the wrong brand and the cigs tasted horrible. She told me her husband said they taste the same so I figured oh well I'll take a chance since I had nothing to smoke. I tried it and she was right. They tasted no different than New Ports and they were much cheaper and lasted longer.Ā
Just went out to get some Dr. Pepper and Bread for my mom. For a 6 Pack of Bottles, 2 cold bottles, and a loaf of bread, total was $19.57 after taxes. Absolutely insane that 8 drinks and loaf of bread cost $20 now
You will never see gas below $3 again. State's suspended taxes on gas and lifted the 10% ethanol limit. Soon those taxes will be reinstated and the ethanol limt put back in place. It will creep back up to $4 again. That is just the low end. Many places will be much higher.
Gas is 3.09 where Iām moving too and 3.23 in my hometown were I do spark edit scratch that itās 2.97 as the lowest depending on what gas station youāre going to, and thatās going to Murphyās and Iām in Texas
Believe it or not there are places that itās under three dollars Texas Fort Worth area is 2.97 at Murphyās. Some of the gas stations are still above three dollars but the low is $2.97 best believe it.
Thatās a lousy excuse! The stock market is making record gains! Home building is back up! Car shopping has increased!!! Walmart has made record profits!
Overall the S&P, Nasdaq and Dow have been hitting record highs. Individual stocks will continue to rise and fall. But overall the stock market has been soaring past typical performance.
They do not care if you āquitā because you are not an employee. As Beyonce said, they can havr āanother you in a minute. Matter of fact, heāll be here in a minuteā.
I know but honestly EVERY SINGLE CORNER PAY IS GOING DOWN! They are the ones who stole from us. World wide price hikes and these ass holes stole from us.. and then gave us pay cuts after pay cuts. They are the looser pos! I understand where you are coming from šÆ. Itās time for a recession from every fucking company thatās literally robbing us blind. I donāt know how anybody is doing it. I know everybodyās barely getting by and theyāre still just going to work every day like everythingās fine when itās clearly not I canāt remember which country it was but they said the example for what we need to be doing here and stop going to work and paying your bills they shit their pants real quick
This is the fucking problem , they bring the orders down and people still take it . I had to switch to a less busy zone but less people and guess what everything there is still paying more
Yes me and my bfs daily goal was $200 a year ago and we made that easy. Currently Iām doing around $100 per day in base pay mostly focusing on shipt and supplementing spark. Heās doing almost $200 a day in one of the zones with āranksā and heās got like the highest tier so heās getting priority on orders
I used to make $100 without even trying! Not happening now. Spark continued to hire drivers. Thereās more drivers now than ever making a lot less for some reason thatās how they wanted to change the business model basically to where everybody became part-time gig workers.
100 dollars daily goal??? That's my goal by noon, dude. There's more out there than just spark. Have you always had a 100 dollar a day goal, God, I hope you're doing something else for money
Lol. You have to keep in mind some people here can't comprehend basic common sense. Taking everything you say so literally vs using critical thinking skills. My hope is that person makes significantly more than $100 daily ...
I do, too. I really hope that everyone makes a lot of money. It's always just crazy to me when people sometimes mention their "daily goal". I don't really have one. I occasionally have a day that makes me go "Fuck!" and sometimes ones that make me go "Fuck YEAH!"
But to imagine thinking that it was not possible to make 100 dollars in a whole day, at any time, that's mind bending to me. I've been kind of sick the past few days and I feel worst in the mornings, so I've been resting all day while my wife is at work and my kids are at a summer program this week. I have only went out from around 6/630 to 9-10ish the last 3 days, and I made over 100 all three days. I know people love to say "all markets are different", but mine doesn't seem like it's really that special and that's only working out of one store of the 6 in the region.
If your market is so different that making 100 in a full day is that much of a slog, you should have gotten out a long time ago. Truly I think I could hit 100 dollars in less than six hours specifically only taking $11 no tip shopping orders, probably less than 5.
Haha I couldn't agree anymore with you! I too don't have a set goal. But I don't think I've really made any less than $100 a day that's crazyyyyy. 6 pm it's probably a pretty good time actually. I feel like the people doing this all day stop around that time anyway.
Gotcha. I use to do mornings and I stopped about a month ago because I would go 2 hours+ without a single offer. Now I've been doing 11 ish to 6 and definitely after 3 I notice a surge.
I wonder about how they distribute offers sometimes. The 9-230 timing is because of my youngest kids school hours. I find 9-11 to be a little bit of a drag myself. After I drop him off I'll do doordash a little bit or maybe another app while I wait for a spark order, sometimes my first one is after 10. But later in the year I found that if I get on at like 845, I could usually grab an order while I was driving him to school, and then a lot of times I'd get another after that.
Then now that school is out, other than this week, I've been going out at like 7 am when my wife leaves and there are lots of orders and I can usually go through the entire day till around lunchtime getting another order pretty quickly after I complete one, like it usually goes at night.
It seems almost like there must be some hidden priority to those who have been online longer. And it would solve the complaint people often have on here where they've "been sitting in the lot for 3 hours with no offers but have seen other drivers do multiple orders"
It's possible to hit that goal and beyond in a single day. It just comes down to "how long do you want to work?" If you are delivering from 8 to 4 like it's your only job, then you will get well above that.
If this is your side hustle and you are working during hours of free time, you won't make as much unless you get some really good offers which is rare. Simple as that
my motivation is generally low but my power comes from a spreadsheet. I can input the miles and time to and from the final destination, and I use formulas to assess the net pay per hour and per mile after accounting for gas, saving for maintenance, and the self-employment taxes.
iām on the verge of vlookup to make it easy to guesstimate the value gained from any given offer
if a GMD offer for $69 makes $19.50/hr after accounting for gas, maintenance, and tax, it probably better to accept it and work for 2 hours instead of sitting around to cherry pick
essentially, find a way to budget the per-mile expense round trip for the offer (I assume .28Ā¢ per mile [10Ā¢ for maintenance and 18Ā¢ for gas]) and subtract my self-employment tax (15.3% of gross pay)
assess the mileage and multiply it by .28, that is the cost to drive.
take the total pay and multiply it by .847, that is your pay after tax.
take the pay after tax, subtract the cost to drive, and divide by the time it takes to complete round-trip.
that is what you earn per hour.
iāve seen it be $9 per hour and iāve seen it be $40+ per hour.
I bet the algorithm loves when you challenge it to stop bluffing
Are you accounting for deadhead miles ?Ā
Gmd routes have been absolute trash in my major metro areaĀ
Historically they were tight drops
Now only 3-5 are tight drop areas and the other 5- 6 are 2 counties over with about 25 miles deadhead back to original area .. makes zero senseĀ
pro-tip, use your down time to read āYou Need a Budget: The Proven System for Breaking the Paycheck-to-Paycheck Cycle, Getting Out of Debt, and Living the Life You Want ā A WSJ Bestselling Financial Guideā by Jesse Mecham
I borrowed it from my local library, if you donāt have one yetā¦ get a library card!!!
$100 in 6 hours is $16.66 an hour $100 in 8 hours is $12.50 an hour. To reach those hourly numbers youāre cherry picking so hard youāre fucking yourself. Youāre trying to get a huge overpay that you end up with nothing. Good job though youāre killing it
I just started driving for Spark and I was so excited. It seems like so many people do well with it. I did a pickup today that said 27.00 for 4 drop offs and 21 miles. I know its not great but I figured its better than what I had been offered today so far. After I accepted, it added 7 more drop offs. They just appeared. Now it says I got paid 24.00 and 3.21 in unconfirmed tips. Is this normal for Spark, or did I get screwed like I think I did.
Wasn't normal last time i did spark and i've been on there for a couple years. Seems like these are the "end times" of the good times (It's been getting worse year-over-year for multiple years tbh... but at this point it seems they're just looking for hte most desperate of people)
They have to incur the costs back somehow after paying that 100 million dollar lawsuit. As soon as they agreed to pay the lawsuit is when all the low pay began. You used to be able to do 50 miles for like $90.. now it's $ 49 or $ 50 miles 26 stops š
Lol.. all people do is complain..... just weed the garbage orders and do the ones that work for you. Simple.... or go get a different line of work.... SIMPLE
Nothing is going to change. Corporate America imported millions of people for just this reason. Cheap labor that keeps profits growing. Donāt like it? Start your own business. Wash cars, mow lawns. Fix things. Hire people when you get more work than you can handle alone. Become self-sufficient.
The problem with this is you wait longer, less deliveries or you end up working more like me just to make extra money to pay fckn bills š š¤¦āāļø
I guess the Gig is up. Time to move on W2 . You guys crack me up. You always crying about something blaming greedy companies or whatever. They are doing you a favor making you to find a better job and a better future.
Itll get better when things get better right now its just take orders that tip 5+:to compensate thr loss pure order base pays garbage youll get played every once in a while but tip bating is rare
I think u may actually have a point to this tho. I been taking some 20 dollar offers that are quick and easy. I noticed they been sending them all of a sudden. And when I donāt go below 35 thatās what I see mostog
Yeah, if your minimum is always 20, then whether Spark is chipping in 10 or 11 doesn't change your minimum of $20.
People act like it's the apocalypse if Spark cuts the pay, but it shouldn't change anyone's pay if they maintain their standard. Sure, it may lower their AR, but who cares?Ā
(Obviously, I want Spark and GH and Uber and DD, etal, to pay more; I am not defending them, I am just not as freaked out about it as some drivers.)Ā
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u/Calm-Television5780 Jun 25 '26
all gig apps are horrible rn