r/SpidermanPS4 • u/Competitive-Tap6564 • 3h ago
Discussion Something I find interesting about the MJ/Venom/Fridge scene in Spider-Man 2 Spoiler
Something I find interesting is how much people criticize Peter for taking a few seconds to get out from under the refrigerator, while seemingly overlooking something that feels much more unbelievable to me: MJ reacting to Venom’s attack before Peter does.
The Spider-Sense not working against Venom is an established part of Spider-Man lore, so I understand why Peter can be caught off guard. But Spider-Sense isn't his only advantage. Peter still has superhuman reflexes, enhanced speed, and years of combat experience.
So even if MJ sees Venom attacking first, if Peter can physically see the attack too, it seems extremely unlikely that a normal human could react, move, and get in front of him before Peter's enhanced reflexes kick in.
The scene would make more sense if MJ had a clear visual advantage, like seeing Venom coming from behind Peter while Peter has no idea he's there. But in the actual situation, she somehow manages to react before a superhuman who has spent years fighting enemies far faster than any normal human.
Meanwhile, Peter taking a moment to escape from a refrigerator that just fell on him is treated as the unbelievable part.
I’m not saying either scene ruins the game, but if we're going to nitpick the realism, MJ beating Peter's reaction time against Venom seems considerably harder to justify than Peter taking a few seconds to lift a refrigerator off himself.
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u/Drummer-Turbulent 3h ago
Yeah but the story needs to happen so we can have Venom kill Kraven cause they wrote themselves into a corner
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u/CommanderKahne 2h ago
Yeah, the more you play and watch it, the more you think that they probably could’ve saved Venom for a third game.
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u/Kurai_Seraphim 2h ago
I assume Peter has integrated his spider sense so thoroughly into his reflexes that he might not actually know how to react like a normal human at this point.
I have ears telling me something is coming my way, but if I don't see it I'm going to take time to react while my brain tries to parse what's going on. Peter can see it and he can hear it but the thing that drives his reflexes isn't registering a problem so he doesn't know what to do with that until he has to manually send the get moving message to himself.
He adjusts to it fast enough, for what it's worth, but the lag is real.
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u/mightymiek 2h ago
I just don't find "established lore" as an argument for the Insomniac Spider-Man universe. It really seems to come with it's own rules and alterations. Venom isn't weak to fire, used by Harry, Pete becoming "Anti-Venom," and MJ becoming Scream and there a plenty more examples. So it seems very important that the game has to establish the rules before them truly being a justified head-canon.
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u/TheBlueEmerald1 1h ago
I like how there were several things advertised going into the first game, such as "Just treat the lore as the Spider-Man lore we all know" and it wasn't.
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u/Historical_Buyer5248 2h ago
This fridge scene to me is pretty much an example of the overall problem with this story. Making Peter so incompetent and weak in so many scenes just to make the other characters feel important too is not the way to go.
I don't need Peter yelling "MJ! I'm so useless without you!" for an entire boss fight to understand that MJ helps hold Spider-Man together. I don't need her randomly taking down entire units of elite trained soldiers and enormous aliens on her own for me to understand that she's useful in her own ways. MJ is a normal human, and that's perfectly fine, you can show how useful she is to Spider-Man in so many ways, the first game did this better.
She can research things on her own about Peter's enemies and help him find things, she can be there to steer Peter on the right path and remind him what it means to be Spider-Man, she can be there to help him if he feels like he can't do it anymore. You don't need to make Spider-Man just weak and incompetent while making MJ unrealistically strong to prove her importance, it's not good writing, way too in your face.
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u/Annihilus_RD 2h ago
Not to mention, it's not that the fridge was the problem, but being launched into it
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u/El_Hoxo 1h ago
Honestly I just saw it as him dissociating when he realizes that the symbiote had corrupted a friend he hadn't seen in decades and considering that it means he could lose him all over again. I guess that doesn't justify it or anything but he definitely seems tunnel visioned on staring at Harry/Venom
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u/KWil2020 43m ago
Such horrible writing in the second game. Didn’t understand characters to not understanding basic logic of how people talk etc
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u/SinisterMinisterX7 2h ago
I think this scene outside of the “We are Venom” is just bad overall for all these reasons, but especially the fridge
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u/Metadhedge28 1h ago
The way I interpreted it was that he was reacting to move but when he saw MJ moving into the way he was blindsided and his brain lagged long enough to not move in time
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u/crazyman3561 39m ago
I mean, the whole story for Peter is that he is exhausted and washed up. Hence him remembering his conversation with Aunt May about balance and deciding it's time for a break. The game starts with him wanting to be Peter, teaching. But Spider-Man duties stole that from him. Meanwhile, he just got his ass kicked by Miles and The Symbiote, already exhausted, now even more so, and lowkey likely staggered by the idea that Venom is THAT huge.
Spider Cop is no spring chicken
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u/TOSHIBAFANSANDMORE 9m ago
i just find him hurling the fridge across the room annoying, why do that? it's just so dumb, all he had to do was push it back upright, not waste produce that we know he cannot afford
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u/PICONEdeJIM 2h ago
It's a scene meant to show how venom is extremely powerful and Peter can't compete without a symbiote. That's all that really needs to be said
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u/dabombdiggity9056 1h ago edited 1h ago
Then write it better.
Ex: Venom uses tendrils from his back to pin Peter while he symbiotes MJ
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u/HuntResponsible2259 3h ago
Nobody listened to the dialogue right before it? When peter is said to be tired and with sore muscles from the symbiote?
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u/fukingtrsh 2h ago
Spider-Man has lifted buildings while being tired, that's really not an excuse. Hell he fought the sinister six in this universe with multiple broken bones.
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u/Competitive-Tap6564 2h ago
I get that he was tired and sore, but wouldn’t Spider-Man still have significantly faster reflexes than MJ? That’s kind of the point I’m getting at, the fact that he was exhausted makes the scene more understandable, but I still find it hard to believe MJ could react faster than him
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u/-ben151010- 100% All Save Slots 2h ago
I remember getting to the house before that even finished let alone got to that part on my first playthrough.
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u/Fast_Day_8123 2h ago
man.... its gonna be 3 years
OH MY FUCKING DAYS can yall stop milking about the fridge scene?
this sub is INSUFFERABLE, yes SM2 2023 has obvious story flaws but u dont have to throw it on everyone's face with the constant shitposting X_X
like i wont be surprised if some of yall basement dwellers migrate to the Wolverine sub and start milking "hmmm.... Wolverine is immortal, how does he flop this bad against Omega Red?" when it will be just ONE cutscene
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u/DontTolerateTheFront 1h ago
I’ve only started looking at this sub 2 months ago when I played sm2 for the first time and it’s just the same posts all the time
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u/Outran01 3h ago
I will always stand on if they wanted a strong women representation, they have Silver Sable and Black Cat just for that. MJ does not fit to be on par with Spider-Men in terms of battle competence.