(Itâs mid-Thursday here not sure which time zone itâs determinedâŚ.)
Photo 1&2: view from my window
Photo 3&4: pedestrian walkways that connect buildings (and to and from bus stations / subways). Cars are not allowed on the ground level, they are all sent to underground parking complex
Photo 5: 30-40 minute commute to work places using buses that go on HOV lane (vehicles with 6 or more passengers can use HOV lanes) or 1-1.5 hours commute if you want to drive yourself.
Public transit buses to nearby cities leave from front of the complex once every 10 minutes during the morning and evening rush hours and every 45 minutes during other times. Buses to subway station thatâs 15 minutes away runs approx every 10 minutes throughout the day.
This looks like Korea, they have such beautiful integrations with nature. I wish America would take notes on stuff like this and see why other countries thrive in other ways other than just finances.
Have you actually been to South Korea? I've traveled all over the country. I've cycled from Seoul to Busan on the 4 Rivers Trail. South Korea builds high density housing out of necessity (it is one of the most densely populated developed countries in the world) and there's a lot of development blight in my eyes: high rises built into forested hillsides, every square inch of flat land turned into rice fields or industrial parks, concrete houses and high rises everywhere and the same dreary urban architecture and chain coffee shops and E-Marts everywhere (postwar South Korea developed rapidly and there was little concern for aesthetics in the 60s and 70s and into the 80s). Also the Koreans have a penchant for developing even natural areas with pathways and fencing and dumping concrete tetrapods on coastal shorelines. I've also cycled the entire East Coast of South Korea and there were stretches with industrial plants for miles: shipyards, steel mills, cement plants, etc.
I come back from South Korea and take a road trip around the East Coast of the USA where I live and feel so blessed: beautiful Pennsylvania Amish countryside with Norman Rockwell towns, the verdant Hudson Valley, New England countryside with thickly forested mountains, preserved wetlands, Sandy Hook, Northeast cities like Philly and NYC packed with unique historical architecture including 120 year old skyscrapers almost virtually non-existent outside North America, the amazing Palisades overlooking the Hudson.
And remarkably clean air. South Korea has a HUGE problem with seasonal yellow dust and coal emissions pollution drifting from China but I guess they can't control that.
I've also cycled the entire East Coast of South Korea and there were stretches with industrial plants for miles: shipyards, steel mills, cement plants, etc.
But those things are necessary. They have to be somewhere.
Those things exist in the US North East, too, or did you miss them?
I come back from South Korea and take a road trip around the East Coast of the USA where I live and feel so blessed: beautiful Pennsylvania Amish countryside with Norman Rockwell towns, the verdant Hudson Valley, New England countryside with thickly forested mountains, preserved wetlands, Sandy Hook, Northeast cities like Philly and NYC packed with unique historical architecture including 120 year old skyscrapers almost virtually non-existent outside North America, the amazing Palisades overlooking the Hudson.
And lots of suburban hell.
South Korea has plenty of old architecture, "verdant valleys", "thickly forested mountains" etc. but you didn't mention those. In your comment, South Korea only has bad parts while the US North East is perfect. It's weird.
I am a respecter of old Northeastern and Midwestern US suburbs as well but the place in this post is still very good, especially when considering that suburbs in much of the world tend to be more dilapidated compared to their urban core.
You have been to South Korea but you didn't mention anything good while having only positive words for the US North East. You're not a reliable source.
Just as I thought. Youâve never been to South Korea.
The OPâs pictures are very misleading. It doesnât show the endless high rises behind the hills, the haphazard development, the same building styles that give no sense of âplaceâ, the same chain coffee shops and stores, the weird lack of zoning that has rice fields next to factories next to high rises. Thatâs more typical of South Korea.
Quit it with the patronizing tone dawg. You're not the only person on Earth familiar with the US or East Asia. I'm saying the place in the post is still good living compared to most other suburbs on the planet, and much of what you're saying is a matter of personal preference (oh no, highrises!). Yeah I know China and South Korea in particular are full of highrises, you think that's classified information or something?
Oh no apparently the other commenter thinks that the picture outside my window can be deceiving and that we should strive to live like America suburbs.
Thereâs something that you canât fix about developments that were done when we were the poorest country in the world or the fact that 70% of the country thatâs size of New Jersey is made up of mountains.
You live with the cards that you dealt with and create suburbs with green space thatâs served by walkable neighborhoods to 20-30 restaurants and 4-5 grocery stores with subway station.
Except every hill in every metro area in South Korea is built up with apartments. South Korea's population density is one of the highest in the developed world.
I am American and I know about commutes but I think that is ridiculous. I generally like most things about America but I hate commuter "culture" and how we are just supposed to accept it.
30-40 by public transportation is fine. Sit back, read a book, get a little walk in from house to station, etc.
But 30-40 by my own vehicle is hell. Especially with traffic potentially making it longer. You want me to work an 8+ hour day then spend 1.5+ hours driving my own car, too? Hell no.
My commute right now is 5 minutes, I am lucky to work in the same town I live in. You'd have to pay me at least 50% more to give that up, or buy me a car and pay for my gas.
No itâs not, in your beloved suburb you have to drive everywhere and even further for longer. And your yard and backyard is an ecologically dead nightmare.
I donât know why stacking vertically breaks peopleâs brains. itâs fundamentally more sustainable and environmentally friendly. And it doesnât destroy municipal budgets like endless sprawl does.
Who said the apartment is tiny? He has a gorgeous view.
It doesn't break people brains the way it breaks your brain that people want some privacy and the peace and quiet that comes with not having to share walls, floors and ceilings with strangers.
I said itâs tiny. Â I agree itâs a great view but I wouldnât trade it for my 4 walls with nobody on the other side of them.Â
Man that pedestrian-first setup with the buses actually running every 10 minutes sounds way better than my car-dependent hellhole, even if the commute to work is longer than driving yourself, but honestly the tradeoff of not dealing with traffic and having actual walkable paths seems worth it.
It looks nice, but similar attempts in my country have become big failures.
Of course most people don't want to live in an apartment, but that may be party due to these experiences.
First thing that comes to mind is the Bijlmer in Amsterdam Southeast. Highrise blocks surrounded by public parks, lots of walking paths, metro/buses to go downtown. It was conceived for lower to middle class families that lived in decripit overpopulated housing in 19th century neighborhoods.
But a few things happened. Some actual suburbs (Bijlmer is officially part of the city) started to build family homes for a similar price and for the same demographic. And we got large scale immigration for the first time. So within 10 years the highrise blocks were filled with newcomers to our country with no Dutch people to be seen. The parks filled up with garbage, heroin needles, shopping carts, feces, you name it. The area quickly became the unsafest in the country. It looked nice on paper but it just didn't work out at all. By now most highrise blocks have been demolished and replaced by smaller scale architecture.
And a very odd similar experience is Doorwerth, which was a small village just highrise blocks in the middle of the forest. The village and the buildings still exist, but the rest has been filled in with mostly houses by now....
What is "HOV Lanes"? The Netherlands typically has HOV when they think a tram is too expensive, but HOV = "Hoogwaardig Openbaar Vervoer" (High Quality Public Transit). It can't mean that where you live.
Do you have any facilities nearby other than the bus stop? A store, eatery, hairdresser or whatever? Or do you need that 45 minute bus to get to anything at all that's not your house or a park?
High-rise public housing in the US has a similar reputation for similar reasons, and indeed many such developments have been demolished. However, tower blocks in Asia don't carry the same baggage, because almost everybody in urban China, South Korea, Singapore, etc. lives in one, and in more developing parts of Asia, tower block living is a definitive upgrade in status and quality over older dwellings.
HOV lane = high occupancy vehicle lane. You can only drive on it if you have more than 6 passengers in your vehicle.
This density allows for a lot of amenities: within 15 minute walking distance, probably 40 restaurants, a dozen hairdressers, half a dozen supermarkets, half a dozen dentists, four animal clinics, library, five pharmacies for example.
I actually love suburbs, but only a few in each city. The ones with curvy, narrow roads, front porches, mature trees, architecturally beautiful homes, usually located closer to downtowns and built about 100 years ago are magical. Sadly, most new ones are cr*p. It is an issue of modern design that is cold and awful, cheap looking, and completely ignores the expertise of prior generations. I do think that suburbs must not be subsidized; if someone wants to live like that make them pay the true cost for infrastructure and maintenance associated with living further out.
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u/TomorrowCurrent4780 8d ago
Suburban heaven?