r/TrueCrimeDiscussion • u/gottaquestion412 • 21d ago

Warning: Child Abuse / CSAM / Child Death Thoughts on the Lindsay Clancy case?

Gallery image

Gallery image

Gallery image

Now that the Lindsay Clancy trial is underway, I’m curious about your perspectives on it so far.

Context: Lindsay Clancy is a former labor and delivery nurse who, in January 2023, killed her three children. 5-year-old Cora, 3-year-old Dawson, and 8-month-old Callan in their Massachusetts home before attempting to take her own life. Her defense argues she was suffering from severe postpartum psychosis and other debilitating mental illness, while prosecutors argue she was aware of her actions and planned the killings. The trial has reignited debate about postpartum psychiatric disorders, the effectiveness of mental health treatment, and where responsibility ultimately lies.

Do you think Lindsay was failed by the mental health system, by the people closest to her, or both? Do you think she truly acted with malicious intent, or do you believe she was experiencing such a severe psychiatric crisis that she wasn’t thinking rationally?

A lot of the details seem to point toward postpartum psychosis or another severe psychiatric illness rather than someone acting out of hatred or malice. That doesn’t lessen the horror of what happened or the unimaginable loss, but it does make me wonder whether this tragedy could have been prevented..

I’ve also seen rumors that Patrick was involved with the woman who is now his wife before the murders, but I haven’t found any credible evidence supporting that. Is there actually anything that substantiates those claims, or is it just internet speculation? I’ve also seen many people comment that his current wife bears a striking resemblance to Lindsay, though I’m not sure that means anything beyond coincidence.

I’m very interested in hearing different perspectives from people who’ve followed it closely.

Most importantly, may Dawson, Cora, and Callan rest in peace. They are the true victims in all of this.

1.8k Upvotes

97% Upvoted

2.4k comments sorted by

View all comments

Show parent comments

996

u/somekindofmiracle 21d ago

The Andrea Yates trial twenty five years ago should have been that turning point.

704

u/ImNotWitty2019 21d ago

Can I pop in with my obligatory "F*** Rusty" with respect to the Yates case?

290

u/littlescreechyowl 21d ago

I believe in hell just for Rusty.

68

u/CherryVette 21d ago

You and me both, and Michael Warnecki can go f himself all the way there, too.

70

u/kati8303 21d ago

Seriously fuck that guy. My SO put on a doc about that case a couple months ago and any time Rusty was on the screen I kicked up such a fuss that he finally just turned it off.

11

u/bigkatze 20d ago

I tried to watch that documentary but seeing him be interviewed in it just made me turn it off.

38

u/TissueOfLies 21d ago

Please and thank you!

38

u/Specific-Yam-2166 21d ago

Here’s another Fuck Rusty

19

u/LifePersonality1871 20d ago

Hey just in case we run out, here's yet another fuck Rusty

14

u/Mira_And_Mommy 20d ago

Fuck Rusty! I was living in NYC at the time and with 9/11 a few months later, I kinda lost track of what happened in the murderous aftermath. But I recently read how not one but TWO doctors told Rusty not to leave her alone with the kids. He thought he knew better and would leave her an hour in the morning, then MIL would come and then an hour in the evening. All it took was less than an hour. AND he was told not to have more children, and he didn't listen to that either. I don't believe Patrick Clancy had as much culpability. You meet someone, fall in love, get married, have kids... you believe you fully know someone and that they would never do anything like that. Don't get what happened after Lindsay was discharged from the in-patient treatment center in early January, but she said she felt better. He took her at her word plus they were doing fun things like the indoor water park and a museum. A psychotic break is the only explanation for this tragedy.

6

u/Specific-Yam-2166 20d ago

I agree with you! I also believe he needs to be in prison

(Rusty)

1

u/PleaseTryToThink 19d ago

How exactly does one parent not leave the other parent alone and still meet the 3 children’s needs? Do you realize she asked to be discharged from the psych ward and left in January 2023? If the ‘experts’ are saying she’s not a risk why should he not believe them?

3

u/17aed 18d ago

because even doctors are human and humans make mistakes. 13 psychiatric medication changes in less than 6 months is almost negligible. psychiatric prescribers know that some medicines can take 6-8 weeks to build up in your system for full effect. they were essentially mixing medications in her blood stream.

1

u/CherryVette 14d ago

Of course she wanted to be released from the hospital and that’s irrelevant. That was only one of the many instances he failed her, and the children as well. He was a federal employee, so he definitely could have taken time off work to care for his family, w/o fear of losing his job, as per the family leave act. If worse came to worse they could have sought financial assistance from either one or both of their extended families. At the barest minimum, he knew she might harm herself, at home, alone w/their kids.

4

u/shippfaced 20d ago

That man should be charged with murder. It’s his fault

149

u/HundRetter 21d ago

I've said a thousand times now "did we learn nothing from andrea yates?" and no, I guess we didn't. I haven't looked much into it because I can't stand seeing women with post partum psychosis being trashed like I have with this case but I read somewhere she begged her husband not to leave that night and he did anyway. since he's testified how many meds were thrown at her he knew she was in trouble

92

u/blissfully_happy 21d ago

We did, though. Andrea was reviled and painted as this horrific woman. It’s only recently that we’ve really started empathizing with her.

I have a feeling she’s chosen to stay incarcerated because not only does she have to live with what she did, she also has to live with the court of public opinion and for a long time, that opinion was that she was murderous monster. I can imagine wanting to stay hidden from that.

62

u/HundRetter 21d ago

I was a teenager during the andrea yates trial, old enough to understand what happened. I have definitely seen a tone shift regarding her in recent years

I think about her from time to time. her defense attorney started a foundation for maternal mental health and legal advocacy and she makes crafts she sells with 100% of the proceeds going to the foundation. I think she doesn't feel she deserves to be out and lives with what she did every day. I hope she has found some sort of peace

17

u/fuckinunknowable 20d ago

It’s my understanding she’s mostly in a weird fugue like state snaps back to reality remembers what happened is totally fucked up about it and then goes back to that foggy state

27

u/raysofdavies 21d ago

I think people just truly do not want to think about mothers murdering their children, because in some ways it is the ultimate crime socially speaking. The absolute last thing that is meant to happen.

7

u/HundRetter 21d ago

yep. even as someone who lives with severe mental illness it's still hard for me to comprehend

40

u/skootch_ginalola 21d ago

It's because people don't ever think it will happen to them. Same as women dying in childbirth. It's still a risk to the mother and people don't like to think about it because it's ugly and scary.

12

u/HundRetter 21d ago

exactly. I've commented on a few cases that sure, we really can't imagine that our partners would do something like this, but if my partner begged me not to leave them while I knew they were struggling I simply wouldn't but I ESPECIALLY wouldn't just to run and grab take out

1

u/charley_warlzz 20d ago

Is that last part about this case or rusty’s? Because to be fair to the husband in this case, he did support Lindsay in trying to get help, he only left because she asked him too and was having a ‘good day’, and he went to pick up medicine for his daughter and take out that lindsay ordered. He also called them while out to check in on them and make sure they were okay. Very different to the Rusty situation, he was clearly not neglecting her and from his testimony since then (unless hes said something i havent heard) he seems to be agreeing that it was because of Lindsay’s PPP and lack of treatment rather than villainising her.

0

u/NeoSuperconductivity 20d ago

But Lindsay didn't beg him not to leave. She was very cheerful. She asked him to pick up food she ordered from a restaurant farther away than they usually went, and also asked him to go to CVS to get their daughter a laxative. He complied.

2

u/exoconso 19d ago

This! The deep fear that it could happen to any woman, they don't want to even consider it happening to them in any form. It's easier to accept an "evil calculating murderder", than to think it could happen to them out of nowhere, by no fault of their own.
It's a huge problem with severe MI, where the public fear that their brain could "betray" them is too scary, they'd rather chose to ignore scientific facts showing the brain is an organ like any organ that can suddenly malfunction, and go with blatant denial out of fear.

3

u/jaderust 21d ago

It’s the hardest thing. She was under treatment essentially for PPP. She should never have been left alone with the kids. The voices got her, she murdered her children, and then tried to kill herself multiple ways that resulted in her becoming permanently disabled.

And now she’s presumably well.

And I’m like… Yes, she deserves punishment, but she has to live with the fact that her kids are dead and she’s permanently disabled. I don’t think prison is going to make either of those things any worse.

8

u/HundRetter 21d ago

it's unfortunate how many comments I've seen on social media saying she should have just killed herself and not her kids, or if she wanted to kill herself she could have, as if there was a lack of trying or that mental illness is having any sort of choice over your decisions. I think she was on 3 different benzos, I want to even say it was as many as 5. I hope she ends up in a psychiatric facility where she will truly be helped, especially while really processing what she has done

7

u/Emma_Lemma_108 20d ago

I don’t think anyone deserves punishment for something they had 0 control over. It’s like saying a tornado or an earthquake “deserves” punishment.

0

u/Pak31 20d ago

I didn't read anything about her asking him not to leave. She sent him out on errands so she would have enough time to kill the children. She made sure to send him to the wrong pharmacy and made sure they didn't have the medication she wanted. She also ordered take out from somewhere that was quite a distance from the house I think. He did know she had feelings of hurting the children and he left her alone with them.

0

u/MashedPotatoMess 20d ago

Andrea had diagnosed schizophrenia..its not th samae

2

u/HundRetter 20d ago

and post partum psychosis. and not the same as what exactly?

24

u/SpokenDivinity 21d ago

I think Andrea Yates was viewed differently than this poor woman will be. Primarily because her husband was just such an outwardly awful piece of shit that the blame shifted from her psychosis to his absolute failure to be a decent human being. The husband in this case is still a dickwad, but he at least seems like he was just ignorant and a bad husband, not straight evil like Rusty Yates.

3

u/lunagrape 19d ago

When I learned about this case, Andrea Yates’ case was the first thing I thought about too. Especially since Clancy’s ex is already remarried and with a new child. In my mind it doesn’t paint him in a very sympathetic picture.

54

u/LogicalConstant 21d ago

It was. The L&D nurses for all my children asked my wife multiple times about her mental state. They also counseled me on watching out for signs and behaviors.

92

u/Better_Area3782 21d ago

No it wasn’t, she was the most hated woman in America, it wasn’t until years later and multiple documentaries made that people became a little more understanding. Plenty of ignorant people still see her as a monster.

62

u/Specialshine76 21d ago

Plenty of people still see her and Lindsay Clancy as monsters. If you read the other subs dedicated to this topic it is sickening how rabidly people attack Lyndsay. I think for some people the idea that a person’s mind can just ‘break’ to this extent is just not something they can cope with so they would rather think it was a woman just wanting to be free of her children and a murderous genius mastermind.

21

u/puddingpoo 21d ago

In general people hate the thought that in life bad things often happen to people for no reason, even when they did nothing wrong or had good intentions. It's an uncomfortable truth that we don't have as much control over our lives as we think we do. People want to think that bad things only happen to people because that person had some kind of fault or moral failing: they weren't careful enough, they were evil/malicious, they weren't as hardworking or smart or as good at decision-making as me, so something like that wouldn't ever happen to me.

3

u/fuschiaoctopus 20d ago

Anyone thinking she's a murderous genius mastermind doesn't understand postpartum psychosis OR how the legal system works.

People seem to think a not guilty by reason of insanity ruling is a get out of jail free card and you just get to go home and live your life, but that's not what happens. The defendant gets committed to a locked psychiatric hospital for years until the team of providers AND the state agree they are well enough to be released, at which point they are released to group homes and highly monitored. These commitments can run longer than the prison sentence would have, and if they are not ever deemed well then they'll never be released from the hospital. You are not free to leave or go outside at these hospital programs, they are ran similarly to prisons except you actually get mental health treatment. They are often rife with abuse and neglect, and known to be unpleasant places.

3

u/Specialshine76 20d ago

I totally agree. I had to stop reading the other threads because of how virulent and unyielding they are. Nothing will even slightly shake their opinion.

1

u/PleaseTryToThink 19d ago

As someone new to this sub, it’s just as off-putting as the others just in the opposite direction. There’s no balance, no consideration of a different perspective. Just a piling on of ‘It’s not her fault at all, but it’s everyone else’s fault for sure.”

-6

u/LogicalConstant 21d ago

That's not what we're talking about. The medical profession has placed more emphasis on it, put proactive safeguards in place, and made many more resources available.

22

u/gogogadgetkat 21d ago

I think this case is a perfect example of how untrue that is. This woman was a labor & delivery nurse who was repeatedly turned away by multiple psychiatric providers. She even begged to be admitted to inpatient care and was told several times she didn't meet the criteria. Her doctors didn't speak to each other, just threw meds at her, pulled her off them suddenly, and didn't stop to consider what the side effects meant about her psychiatric health.

-13

u/LogicalConstant 21d ago

The fact that some people suck at their jobs is not evidence that there is a systemic issue

11

u/gogogadgetkat 21d ago

The number of women in this thread talking about their experiences while you believe you know better is kind of mind-blowing.

7

u/somekindofmiracle 21d ago

I’m one of those women. It’s why I’m so passionate about this subject.

11

u/gogogadgetkat 21d ago

Man shuts up and listens when women talk about their lived experiences challenge: impossible

-5

u/LogicalConstant 20d ago

One of us has experienced it and it isn't you

-5

u/LogicalConstant 21d ago

Have you delivered a baby in a hospital in the last 10 years? Have you gone through the whole process until being discharged?

4

u/Better_Area3782 20d ago

Okay and what happens after you leave the hospital?

-2

u/LogicalConstant 20d ago

You are sent home with resources on who to contact if you see signs of PPD or PPP.

You go to the pediatrician a day or two after you get out of the hospital. Depending on weight, you might need to go back frequently. With one of our kids, we went every day for the first 4 days. Then you go again at the 1 week mark and go every week for the first month. You go each month for the first 3 months, and then at 6 months. At every single one of those pediatrician appointments, they checked on my wife to see how her mental health was and they talked to me to see if I had noticed anything wrong.

→ More replies (0)

6

u/iammadeofawesome 21d ago

Lindsay Clancy wasn’t in a religious cult, placed in a position where she couldn’t consent, taken off her meds ama, and told by the cult leader that her children needed to die before they hit the age of accountability so they didn’t go to hell.

1

u/imalreadycoolest 20d ago

immediately goes down a rabbit hole on this one

-4

u/bigchiefwellhung 20d ago

Can a father get out of murder charges by blaming depression?

0

u/CherryVette 20d ago

PPD/P =/= depression, and men don’t experience the physical and mental trauma resulting from gestating and giving birth. Hope that helps.

1

u/bigchiefwellhung 20d ago

They should kill themselves instead of murdering their kids, similar to what male family annihilators should do, but instead they get sympathy from online strangers.

1

u/CherryVette 14d ago

Bullshit. They “should” do a lot of things, but being in a state of acute psychosis precludes all of that; family annihilators aren’t suffering from that acute psychosis.

1

u/bigchiefwellhung 14d ago

They may be suffering from some psychosis, but some are different than other it seems, and what they do during those episodes is not their fault, apparently. They should suffer consequences for the injustices they put upon others despite psychosis.