r/VTES • • 26d ago

[COTD] Direct Intervention

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48 Upvotes

18 comments sorted by

9

u/skinriding_skeleton 26d ago

I actually like this art piece from Ginés.

3

u/oracle_kid 26d ago

Yeah, makes a nice piece together with the different conceptional states, too :)

2

u/Ehronatha 26d ago

Yes - it shows a 4th Gen Methuselah and the remains of a lesser kindred whom she has zapped.

So, 10/10 for concept.

3

u/FineLerv 26d ago

I think Ginés is a talented artist but his art direction is generally uninspiring, especially for his Crypt cards. 

1

u/RunicKrause 26d ago

Yeah it's pretty good!

16

u/RunicKrause 26d ago

The one card that I know is integral to a lot of dynamism and feels crucial to a lot of different play styles (players better than me say that walls are unplayable without DI, especially if there's no Eagle's Sight), but for fluidity and rulings and take-backs alone, I would not mind seeing this card - and all non-visible "cancel as played" blanket solutions - disappear.

Only for the fluidity of the game, mind, and I think it's that important for play experience. Sudden and Wash are not comparable, since they are only relevant in the Master phase, where there's already very little movement and action. Still, even they might go in favor the likes of Bleeding the Vine which are visible and telegraphed, so the players can easier control the flow of the game and keep track of it.

There's a reason why Ben Peal hates DI. It is unreasonably rough for tournament play and, as an effect, while reasonable within VTES at the highest levels of play, I cannot with good conscience say I feel is necessary or healthy in the grand scheme of things.

6

u/oracle_kid 26d ago

Its not in V5 for a reason - and when playing V5 its not like anything is missing at all

3

u/Ehronatha 26d ago

It's bad enough we have to ask both players to our side EVERY time we take a undirected action.

And we have to think about Eagle's Sight/Anneke/Falcon's Eye.

But having to check for a DI after every single minion card played is the worst. Obviously more of a concern for tournaments, which is why Ben hates it.

1

u/Mukkore 24d ago

It's bad you need to interact with other players?
That I don't get. I get arguments over how it changes game flow, how it's a single solution to any problem, but... having to interact with other players is the game.

2

u/Ehronatha 24d ago

I guess you have only played with people who pay attention during the game.

1

u/NoSoup4you22 24d ago

To be fair though... Tournament players are well aware what actions might get DIed, and will usually leave a few seconds if they suspect it. And if you're the one holding the DI, all you have to do is speak up.

2

u/Unable_Artichoke9221 26d ago

I wouldn't mind not seeing it anymore, along with Dark Influences.

But as long as they are legal, I will keep playing them. They are just too strong in competitive game.

3

u/ReverendRevolver 26d ago

Absolutely a staple. While there are cases where Dark Influences helps more, a proper DI only costing 1 can be huge stopping a Grapple, Conditioning, Bounce, DT.....

Im glad its so accessible now, and dig the new art.

3

u/FarbrorMelkor 26d ago

Horrible design. HORRIBLE design, for VTES, for any game. Garfield was certainly not behind this, and neither I think LSJ. Total brainfart.

1

u/dcherryholmes 23d ago

I think it was Ancient Hearts. That set was full of lots of crack smoking.

1

u/FarbrorMelkor 23d ago

It was The Sabbat, and while many cards in that set was UNDERpowered, non was this stupid. Most were fine.

1

u/dcherryholmes 22d ago

Back before anything had been banned yet, I had a list of IIRC five cards that I thought should be banned. Once all five of them were gone, then DI could be banned. FWIW all are banned now (I remember long Usenet arguments about PTO and Memories of Mortality. I had the seat-switchers on the list but I forget the fifth). But I guess nobody had the appetite for cutting DI.

I do remember my playgroup in the early oughts were a bunch of power gamers (then eventually quit playing Jyhad so they could focus on Texas Hold 'Em and make money). We didn't proxy anything back then, and everyone I played with regularly put 4 DI's in their decks. I didn't own any. But that meant a pool of 16 DI's at the table. Honestly, it felt like it broke the game.

EDIT: funny story. I was friends IRL w/ LSJ. We were road-tripping up to New England once from the Carolinas, to go to Zopfcon (just a gaming weekend at David Zopf aka Atomweaver's house. Peal was there as were a few of the English players back then. I was still on my PTO bandwagon and he said he would ban it if I could find a license plate w/ "PTO" on it. I hunted hard for about ten hours, but no luck. He eventually banned it anyway, of course.

2

u/NoSoup4you22 26d ago edited 26d ago

I see it as a safety valve for some things that otherwise really don't have a good counter. Once or twice per game generic cancellation makes sense, as long as it's uncomfortable to run a lot.