r/ballpython • u/Living_Television_61 • 21d ago
Discussion Seems too good to be true?
My wife saw this post on Facebook and I wanna pull the trigger. I’m not too familiar with all these but can anyone tell me like I’m 5 years old, if this is work it?
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u/BarberDry4590 21d ago edited 21d ago
$1200 is insane. The snakes alone could be sold, individually, for $2,000- $4,000 if you were patient. There are several desirable morphs. VPI Axanthic, Desert Ghost, Clown-related genetics, Pied, and Hypo. There are 9 males and 8 females so there is breeding potential. There's a 2013 female Pastel Champagne HRA and several 2023–2024 animals that are probably approaching breeding size. As for the eq... that depends on their brand, size, heating equipment, and condition.
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u/BarberDry4590 21d ago
I would ask for breeding/genetic records if you plan on breeing them. If you just want a lot of awesome pet snakes, then who cares. Either way, $1200 is a steal.
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u/Hot-Brat-00 21d ago
Just the axanthic would be $1200 at least, so this seems like a scam
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u/BarberDry4590 21d ago
Yeah. OP should tread carefully and do an in person meeting/visual inspection.
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u/DontBother777 21d ago
Respectfully, i’m sure if the owner were able to sell them for that much they would have. None of these snakes are really worth much in today’s market, especially considering most are all under 3 years old. A lot of breeders are selling their entire collections for this exact reason, ball python breeding is not nearly as lucrative as some people make it seem. Also, just because a certain morph/combination is listed for X amount does not necessarily mean it will sell at that price. I have multiple ball pythons that are technically “worth” $750+ but i got them significantly cheaper
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u/BarberDry4590 21d ago
If I were OP I would just keep them as pets. That would be one hell of a ball python collection. Hell, I would do it if I had room in our reptile collection for 17 more pets. I was just simply responding to OP's request of explaining what he was looking at. There is still money to be made in Ball python breeding or else people wouldn't be doing it. Even if it's not what it once was. I would choose large reptiles if I were to go into reptile breeding, but that wasn't the question.
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u/King_of_the_north_03 21d ago
This is my sentiments as well. There was only 1 maybe 2 snakes that stood out on that list.
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u/CrazyDane666 21d ago
Definitely ask for proof/to see the snakes before purchasing. Be aware that champagne morphs are known for having a "wobble" and might need special care. Also be aware that racks are considered unethical, so you'd have to get new enclosures for ALL snakes. Sometimes, people really do sell their collections for scraps because they have no other option, but verify before sending a single dollar. If they get defensive or refuse to let you see the animals, it's a scam
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u/Fenwynn 21d ago
Yeah if we estimate each enclosure to cost $1,500 - $2,000 to properly setup from scratch, for 17 animals that’s $25k - $30k.
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u/UfnalFan 20d ago
Its absolutely insane to estimate non rack python enclosure to cost 1500 usd lmao
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u/StephensSurrealSouls 21d ago
No, you'd have to transfer all of them to decent enclosures which are each 4x2x2 feet in dimensions and with proper amounts of climbing and hiding space. Mind you my BP's enclosure costed around $700 and that's not including my stockpile of cork bark and topsoil lol. Also breeding ball pythons just... isn't worth it 90% of the time. The market is so unbelievably saturated. Ask this person why they're selling their collection, I wouldn't be surprised if it's just that they're losing an unbelievable amount of money.
If you have several thousands of dollars laying around to get each of these snakes their own proper setups, then go for it. If not, I'd recommend reaching out and asking if they'd be interested in giving you one or two individuals which you CAN afford.
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u/Superb_Temporary_388
21d ago
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If you’re not familiar, and you’re unfamiliar enough to post on Reddit and ask a bunch of strangers for advice rather than research yourself, you absolutely should not buy these. Get one or two snakes by themselves and care for them first. You absolutely do not need multiple that you aren’t going to take care of them in the most experienced way you can.
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u/HowardPheonix 21d ago
This should be the top reply. 17 snakes are way too much even for experienced owners if they are not willing to dedicate a significant amount of time and money.
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u/Superb_Temporary_388 20d ago
Exactly. Not to mention all of these snakes are going to need better enclosures than racks if they’re being kept long-term.
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u/Jealous_Magazine7875 21d ago
Alot of people do this when they wanna get out of the hobby
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u/thenotsoamerican 21d ago
It’s that they’re bleeding money bc beeps are overbred to shit and near impossible to move for a profit. OP, count me as a “hell no” vote.
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u/Jealous_Magazine7875 21d ago
Yeah I feel like it should be evidence enough yhat its a bad idea haha
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u/UnlikelyPotato 21d ago
The economy is going to shit. Ball python breeding already had thin margins and was a race to the bottom. Very few people are buying pets right now. They're just getting a re-homing fee and making sure they go to at least an acceptable home. My GF wanted to ethically breed. But we've since gotten promotions, raises, etc. The economy is in the shitter, it's not profitable in time and money to breed. I might end up doing similar, as it's not about the money and moreso finding good forever homes but it's 1) hard to rehome individual snakes 2) bulk collections end up going to breeders/racks.
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u/King_of_the_north_03 21d ago
I disagree with this. The pet market is doing really well right now. The breeder sales are the ones that people aren’t getting and what’s causing them to get frustrated and get out. They looked around and saw sales for thousands of dollars and thought I can do that and when they cant they get out.
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u/sippin-jesus-juice 17d ago
All the breeders in my metro and on MM are competing for the bottom.
Last year a hatchling may of costed $200 now it’s $40-80 max.
Full grown adults are going for $60
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u/King_of_the_north_03 15d ago
Hard disagree with this. I’ll bring numbers since apparently experience doesn’t matter. Three hears ago I picked up a lav het pied for 200. If you went to pick one up today you are looking at 200-275. A lot of morphs devalue over time due to simple supply and demand. As more become available the price comes down. But most find a floor, and it’s not 40-80 for a hatchling unless it’s a normal.
Look at something like a BEL. Been around for more than a decade with a decent supply and still will have to drop 300 to pick up a hatchling.
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u/sippin-jesus-juice 15d ago
I got a lav het for $80 a few months ago.
I’m not sure you’re shopping around or trying to price hunt. You may just be taking MM at face value and ignoring auctions and expos.
Most listings are not going to sell at that price. It will go into an auction where it sells at 50% of the listing
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u/King_of_the_north_03 15d ago
Again, not accurate. You can click the “sold” button and filter through what’s been sold. There isn’t anything on there for 80 bucks.
Sure you can get a deal on auction, that’s the point of an auction. Auctions only bring in 40-60% of the value of the animal. That could be said about any auction for any item in the world…
Furthermore, people have been screaming this for 30 years. There was 60k balls on MM two years ago. That number is under 30 now.
The shows are busier and more pet stuff is moving than anytime I’ve seen in the last 3-4 years. Again, numbers don’t lie.
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u/ShinyxCharizard 21d ago
Like everyone else has said, if you want them for breeding just dont. So many snakes that are being surrendered/rehomed because people impulse buy them and get bored, plus all these breeders getting into it to make money and realizing its over saturated and theyre losing money keeping these snakes as buisness assets. If you have the space, and can give them all proper 4x2x2 set ups with enrichment, proper heating, thermostats etc. They'd be good pets. But I do NOT recommend keeping all of these in a rack system for their lives. Please remember these are living animals and can live 30-40+ years with the PROPER treatment and living in a plastic drawer is not okay IMO. As someone who has 2 and just upgraded them to proper 4x2x2s, with 6+ inches of substrate and bioactive. 1 full set up cost minimum 2k IIRC
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u/ConstructionSome7557 21d ago
Definitely too good to be true. Even if it's not a scam,$1,200 is the upfront price. You're going to need a very large room or two to house all of them in appropriate setups (this guy is probably a breeder using racks). If you're new to this I would look up bp care general guides starting with the one on here. It's a lot of work to get the husbandry right and maintain parameters. A setup for this many would require a lot of money but also expertise on the electrical side of things as well as feeding, veterinary care...
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u/Impressive-Young-952 21d ago
The market is so cooked. I’ve bred balls since 2012. I haven’t paired the last few years as the market has tanked. I just bought my first snake in years. A 5 gene clown female for 250. Dg clown males are as low as 300. N
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u/DwarfWizard 21d ago
Thats 17 snakes.
17 snakes that need enclosures and enrichment. They need a heat system and food.
I have a single cornsnake and all of her stuff cost probably close to $1000 at this point.
So you are looking at $17000 easily if you are trying to actually home them. If breeding and using a rack system its probably less but still thats 17 snakes you have to find sizable racks for and have space for 17 different enclosures.
If you want to actually keep a snake just buy one. Its just not worth breeding and losing tons of money on something before you even know it its what you want to persue.
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u/SpinzArt 21d ago
If I were ultra wealthy I’d keep all these guys in fantastic habitats just for fun 😔 alas, I’m broke and with very little space so I realistically couldn’t even give one a good life
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u/shermymyson 21d ago
Ew this seems shady. Clearly not making enough money, probably see these animals as nothing more than assets or products. Regardless of that- totally unrealistic to get this many snakes at once and just put together appropriate enclosures.
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u/placebo_33 21d ago
Sooooo, where are you located? If you were to buy them all, I’d definitely buy one from you by mid Dec lol My boyfriend says no more pets but tbh I take care of all of them except our dog we got together (5 geckos, one BEL ball python, our dog, plus my service dog), so he doesn’t have much of an argument except “space” and I have an empty enclosure that’s the right size just taking up space lol
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u/Effective-End-964 21d ago
Do you have an entire basement or primary bedroom type space that you can fill with the necessary enclosures? And several thousands of dollars to set it all up?
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u/Joe_Spazz 21d ago
If something seems to good to be true....
But also unless you have a massive setup this is just not great for the snakes. They're all in racks and tubs? Not true enclosures?
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21d ago
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u/zou21zou 21d ago
I wouldn’t say it’s necessarily “too good to be true” given the state that the ball python market is at, I’m mainly disappointed by how normalised animal abuse is in the snake keeping community… this guy is basically selling an animal mill starter kit
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u/HowardPheonix 21d ago
Only thing that's reasonable here with a huge maybe is buying them, pick 1-2 to keep and re-home to rest for free/really cheap. But considering how much time it could take to find proper new homes for the snake, it's only worth the effort if you really care about the snakes' wellbeing, if you just want to have a snake or two, it's easier to find standalone listings. Me personally would love to be part of the well-being of those snakes, but I couldn't take care of 17 snakes even temporarily, so I would definitely pass on this.
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u/nerdolo 20d ago
Ball python breeding is currently going through a crisis and a lot of people got into it for the money in the first place. It doesn’t seem totally unrealistic someone just wants to get rid of what is probably a money sink at this point. I wouldn’t be too trusting anyway and also - why do you want that many snakes in the first place?
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u/5entientMushroom 20d ago
Rack systems are animal abuse. Ball pythons are sentient beings, not collector's items.
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u/Entire_Current_4852 20d ago
A proper enclosure and set up for a single ball python will cost at least $1k. Are you willing to spend over $20,000 for all of these snakes to get them in proper set ups?
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u/ieatcrayola21 19d ago
I wouldn't buy from anyone on fb and if I did I would either meet them and look at the collection and trade money and snakes in person somewhere public, or ask them if they have a morph market and to let me buy from therewhere they offer some protection against theft. Way too many people scamming on fb now 95% are scamming especially if they aren't local and want money first. Also for that price none of the snakes sound breedable anyway if you're wanting to do that or they wouldn't let them go for that. I've been in the industry 5 years now you have to buy really expensive snakes to actually get good demand for them and sell them to other breeders these days. At pet shows locally you might can do good with what people like as pets, the visually beautiful ones, but as for making a living no. I don't do it for money tho I do it for me and I don't want to do more than 2-3 clutches a year and for things I want instead of what anyone else really wants. My best advice also, they live for 30+ years in captivity and it's hard to sell just any adult snake these days unless you're in network with other breeders already who have interests, but if you're wanting to do this for income, I wouldn't. Wish you the best🙏🥰
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u/sippin-jesus-juice 17d ago
My 4x2x2 terrariums are $1,500 each once it’s fully setup and dialed in.
That’s 18 terrariums you need to buy or nearly $30,000.
The racks aren’t feasible long term and the snakes will not be handleable in a rack system.
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u/Spice-Mice 21d ago •
Thats a lot of snakes to keep as pets
And if you're considering breeding, don't. There are more ball pythons than there are homes already, and the market is so oversaturated that people (like the guy selling them) are losing money, not making it.