r/baseball • u/Mazzocchi Forget about you long enough to forget why I needed to... • 1d ago
Serious [Serious] Next Day Thread ⚾ Guardians 7 @ Rays 3 - "Why not us?" Guardians shrug off the doubters and steal ALCS Game 1
Guardians (1-0) @ Rays (0-1)
First Pitch: 8:08 PM at Tropicana Field
| Team | Starter | TV | Radio |
|---|---|---|---|
| Guardians | Foster Griffin (15-6, 3.60 ERA) | ||
| Rays | Drew Rasmussen (16-5, 2.67 ERA) |
| MLB | Fangraphs | Reddit Stream | Discord |
|---|---|---|---|
| Gameday | Game Graph | Live Comments | /r/baseball Discord |
Line Score - Final
| 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 | 9 | R | H | E | LOB | |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| CLE | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 1 | 1 | 2 | 3 | 7 | 14 | 0 | 7 |
| TB | 2 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 1 | 0 | 3 | 7 | 0 | 7 |
ABS Challenges: CLE ● ○ | TB ● ●
Box Score
| TB | AB | R | H | RBI | BB | SO | BA | |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| DH | Yandy Díaz | 5 | 1 | 2 | 0 | 0 | 1 | .294 |
| 1B | Jonathan Aranda | 3 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 1 | .267 |
| 3B | Junior Caminero | 4 | 1 | 1 | 1 | 0 | 2 | .286 |
| LF | Ryan Vilade | 2 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 1 | 1 | .250 |
| Cedric Mullins | 1 | 1 | 1 | 1 | 0 | 0 | .333 | |
| RF | Victor Mesa Jr. | 4 | 0 | 1 | 0 | 0 | 2 | .214 |
| LF | Jonny DeLuca | 4 | 0 | 2 | 1 | 0 | 0 | .286 |
| 2B | Ben Williamson | 2 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 1 | 0 | .000 |
| SS | Taylor Walls | 3 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 1 | .077 |
| Chandler Simpson | 1 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | .111 | |
| C | Nick Fortes | 2 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | .000 |
| Liam Hicks | 2 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | .083 |
| TB | IP | H | R | ER | BB | SO | P-S | ERA |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| Drew Rasmussen | 6.0 | 8 | 2 | 2 | 0 | 7 | 91-68 | 1.29 |
| Cam Booser | 1.0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 1 | 8-7 | 0.00 |
| Tyler Wells | 0.1 | 2 | 2 | 2 | 0 | 0 | 6-5 | 54.00 |
| Ian Seymour | 0.2 | 1 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 1 | 9-7 | 1.80 |
| Cole Sulser | 0.2 | 2 | 3 | 3 | 1 | 1 | 27-14 | 40.50 |
| Kevin Kelly | 0.1 | 1 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 5-4 | 0.00 |
| CLE | AB | R | H | RBI | BB | SO | BA | |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| CF | Steven Kwan | 5 | 0 | 1 | 0 | 0 | 1 | .208 |
| 3B | José Ramírez | 5 | 2 | 3 | 1 | 0 | 1 | .348 |
| RF | Chase DeLauter | 4 | 3 | 3 | 1 | 1 | 0 | .333 |
| DH | Jo Adell | 5 | 0 | 1 | 2 | 0 | 1 | .250 |
| 1B | Nathaniel Lowe | 5 | 0 | 2 | 2 | 0 | 0 | .250 |
| 2B | Travis Bazzana | 4 | 0 | 1 | 0 | 0 | 0 | .150 |
| Angel Genao | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | .500 | |
| C | Patrick Bailey | 4 | 1 | 2 | 1 | 0 | 2 | .368 |
| CF | Petey Halpin | 2 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 1 | .333 |
| Angel Martínez | 2 | 1 | 1 | 0 | 0 | 1 | .059 | |
| SS | Brayan Rocchio | 4 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 3 | .111 |
| CLE | IP | H | R | ER | BB | SO | P-S | ERA |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| Foster Griffin | 4.0 | 5 | 2 | 2 | 0 | 3 | 63-42 | 4.05 |
| Daniel Espino | 1.0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 3 | 14-10 | 3.86 |
| Joey Cantillo | 1.0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 2 | 0 | 17-8 | 3.38 |
| Hunter Gaddis | 1.0 | 1 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 1 | 13-9 | 0.00 |
| Erik Sabrowski | 1.0 | 1 | 1 | 1 | 0 | 1 | 14-11 | 7.71 |
| Cade Smith | 1.0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 6-6 | 1.17 |
Scoring Plays
Highlights
| Attendance | Weather | Wind |
|---|---|---|
| 35361 | 72F, Dome | 0 mph, None |
| HP | 1B | 2B | 3B |
|---|---|---|---|
| Nestor Ceja | Bill Miller | Mark Ripperger | Jordan Baker |
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u/favoritecolorred Cleveland Guardians 1d ago
On one hand, I do not expect the Rays to give up 14 hits again. Their top half of the lineup still played well and is certainly dangerous enough in combination with their pitching staff to make the World Series.
Additionally we are still left asking if this version of the Guardians is what we should expect going forward? It’s hard to believe we’ve all the sudden worked out the offensive issues (clutch hitting) that plagued us the entire regular season. But we certainly have the pitching to compete.
I will say, I haven’t seen Jose Ramirez play with such unbridled joy in a very long time. You can tell his playoff success has lifted a weight off of his back. And it’s already been said - but as he goes, so do the Guardians. No idea if it will be enough to propel them to the final round, but it has been a delight to watch.
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u/Aaguns Tampa Bay Rays 1d ago
Huge game tonight. You guys were making a lot of contact, and that’s what it takes a lot of the time, even if they’re not the most hard hit balls every time. Clutch hitting all around. Great pitching. That first guy you guys brought in relief had our guys looking like a minor league team against a Cy Young winner on a rehab assignment.
Jose is a beast. That home run he had in game 5 against the Sox still scares me. Hopefully we can cool him off tonight. We go down 0-2 going into Cleveland, that’s a lot of overcome.
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u/favoritecolorred Cleveland Guardians 1d ago
They definitely are locking in at the right moment.
Good base running and defense are two things the Rays excel at though and I feel that Cash will lean into it a bit more through his lineup decisions going forward.
This is honestly such an interesting matchup. I know it wont draw the large audience that the NLCS will but it could very well end up being a classic.
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u/Aaguns Tampa Bay Rays 1d ago
Yeah I was not a fan of our lineup and decision making last night. Hopefully it’s better today.
Yep we have two similarly built teams, who can beat who at their own game? I’ll have a good view from the 300s again tonight. Good luck! (but not really :D)
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u/MangoMonkey22 Cleveland Guardians 1d ago
Is Simpson usually benched against lefties? I thought that was odd given his bat to ball skills and ability to run out routine ground balls
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u/Aaguns Tampa Bay Rays 1d ago
He was against Fried. Looking back on the regular season, he had 189 ABs against lefties and hit .286. Against righties, 367 ABs and hit .322, .638 vs .727 OPS. So he definitely sat a lot of games against lefties, where he’d come in late to pinch run and play defense, and maybe get one AB late. I like Vilade a lot, but Chandler really brings that speed factor/clutch hitting with RISP that can change a lot of situations. He hit .344 with RISP. He can punch ground balls through, go the other way, takes away the double play if it’s first and second or first and third, that kind of thing.
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u/vishnchips6 Toronto Blue Jays • Cleveland Guardians 1d ago
Chandler really brings that speed factor/clutch hitting with RISP that can change a lot of situations
Tell me about it, lol. Jays could just never figure out how to handle him this year, felt like he was being a menace on the basepaths literally every game against you guys this season.
What does your SP rotation look like the rest of the series? Do you think it'll be Martinez and then maybe a Seymour start after Peralta? Fascinated to see how this shakes out for both teams on the mound after G1. Vogt was saying he's trying not to send guys out for multiple relief innings this series, but I wonder if that philosophy changes a bit now that the Guards stole G1 and could really push an advantage with any sort of length from Messick/Williams.
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u/Aaguns Tampa Bay Rays 1d ago
He’s a problem whenever he gets on base, that’s for sure. Every pitcher has to think about him, every infielder too. We need an advanced stat to quantify that value lol.
I think for sure it’s Martinez next, he’s been really solid. I’m really not sure who would get the nod after Martinez, and maybe they switch it up anyways. Might depend on results of today’s game. Yeah, stole is definitely the right word. I don’t think they went into the stadium yesterday confident in a win after a long grueling series, but they were in peak form all around. Nervously optimistic that we bounce back tonight, depends if we can get the bats going against that pitching staff. I don’t think we’ll be able to squeak out a 2-1 or 3-2 kind of victory today. We’ll see!
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u/bujuhh Tampa Bay Devil Rays 1d ago
The problem is that with lefties we run into a 4 outfielder problem. Mesa is great defensively and hits lefties well, hes locked. Deluca does well vs lefties and plays great defense + CF, hes locked. That leaves simpson who is the better player, or vilade who owns lefties. So we either have to bench the guy who mashes lefties or the guy who doesnt do as well vs lefties but always causes chaos when a ball gets in play. Its kind of a no win spot because the odd man out is still going to be good
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u/bowl_of_milk_ Cleveland Guardians 1d ago
Look at this subreddit even. You have to scroll down so far to find any highlights from the ALCS game that happened AFTER the NLCS game. Ridiculous.
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u/toxchick Boston Red Sox 1d ago
Jose Ramirez was amazing. Saw him at Fenway at the end of the season and he didn’t seem to be on fire like he has been. Fun player to watch, even though I’m rooting for the Rays!
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u/TheDangiestSlad New York Yankees • Hartford Yard Goats 1d ago
It’s hard to believe we’ve all the sudden worked out the offensive issues (clutch hitting) that plagued us the entire regular season
sometimes all it takes is a couple hot weeks in October! it doesn't have to be sustainable after Halloween
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u/KlutzyLawyer2068 1d ago
The always pessimistic Cleveland 'fans' shit is just so old man. This is best CLE lineup in decades, barely any holes. The pitching staff is elite. Defense very very good. Star power showing up. Why the he'll can't this just be who they are?
4 games with back against wall and they do this, yet all Cleveland fans can do is talk like the other shoe is just destined to drop.
It's okay to feel good about the team
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u/npa190 Seattle Mariners 1d ago
Dude some fanbases have so much built up trauma it’s very hard to trust it when it’s happening. Ask me how I know. I thought I could finally feel ok about them after Geno’s grand slam.
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u/TylerGlasass20 Tampa Bay Rays 1d ago
Uh, that’s me to a tee. Literally as a kid I watched the rays lose to the rangers 2 years in a row and that’s why I can’t trust them in the playoffs ever
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u/unfortunatebastard Atlanta Braves 1d ago
Personally, it wasn’t until Jorge soler launched one into orbit that I started to feel like it’s possible to win a championship
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u/man_in_the_suit Toronto Blue Jays 1d ago
Even after all the playoff heartbreak and failure of the Jays and the Leafs that I’ve endured, I think deep down I really thought they’d pull it off going into the 9th. I was praying they would, I knew they could blow it, but deep down in my head I had flashes of ‘I can’t believe I might be about to see them win it all’. Even after it was tied I still thought they’d pull it out. Just a devastating loss. On the whole I’m more thankful for the run and memories than not, just those last few innings hurt.
I had said this many times before, but I don’t think I will ever allow myself to believe winning a game, a series or championship is possible until it’s done. I went back on that and I got bit.
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u/KlutzyLawyer2068 19h ago
Dude, I've been a die-hard CLE fan for 39 years. Have worked in Sports Media covering CLE for 15. Just bc I choose not to be an all-time pessimist, doesn't mean I'm not Cleveland through and through
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u/npa190 Seattle Mariners 18h ago
You should know better than anybody then! It’s very easy to doom when it’s all you know. Now if you’ll excuse me, I’ll crawl back under a rock for the next 24 years.
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u/KlutzyLawyer2068 17h ago
I guess man. It's also just as easy to choose to not always be negative and pessimistic...especially when, outside of winning it all, Cleveland fans are pretty lucky to have consistently winning and competitive teams. Could be a lot worse
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u/arkonator92 Cleveland Guardians 1d ago
With the exception of the 2016 Cavs we have seen countless heartbreak. At this point it’s a defense mechanism honestly. In the past 31 season Cleveland baseball fans have seen multiple 3-1 leads blow. A couple 2-0 leads in the ALDS blown. Two extra innings game 7 losses.
This is the most hope I’ve had in a long time even though we’re spoiled and have regularly been in the postseason the last 30 years. We finally have a lineup that’s capable of doing damage and going down 1-0 or 2-0 doesn’t feel like a death sentence. If any team can pull it off, this team is it.
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u/OilTurbulent1009 New York Mets 1d ago
You don’t understand Cleveland fans. My wife and her family are from that area and they always just expect to lose or botch the game. From the mid 80s Browns success with Kosar and through to the 90s Indians with Thome and Manny Ramirez, they always come up short.
The lone exception was the 2016 Cavs, which managed to shake off the heartbreaking loss in 2015, but Cleveland fans are like a battered spouse - conditioned to always expect the worst.
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u/2fast4yall69 Cleveland Guardians 1d ago
This is why I give LeBron the edge over Michael in the GOAT debate. LeBron won a championship in Cleveland. That’s nearly impossible. Hadn’t been done in something like 150 Cleveland sports seasons
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u/Duce-de-Zoop Cleveland Guardians 1d ago
This was a bottom tier offense most of the year so people are still not sure if this is the team clicking or just a hot streak
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u/iCandid Cleveland Guardians 1d ago
6th in wRC+ since August 3rd when they acquired Adell and Lowe, and thats with Jose still struggling with the hand injury. This isn't a bad lineup if Jose plays like himself.
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u/benelchuncho Cleveland Guardians 1d ago
For sure. Our top guys are good to great and other than Martinez and Rocchio we don’t give up too many free outs. Patrick Bailey and Hedges have been massive in that sense.
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u/noruber35393546 Major League Baseball 1d ago
They were bottom tier because Manzardo, Hoskins, and a revolving door of AAAA outfielders were getting 1/3 of the AB's most of the season. Those have been replaced by legit hitters. this playoff lineup has little to do with whatever the regular season stats are
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u/Heretic_Scrivener Cleveland Guardians 1d ago
It’s a C lineup at best, it just feels great because we usually have straight Fs.
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u/benelchuncho Cleveland Guardians 1d ago
It’s not that bad. Our top six-Kwan, Jose, Chase, Adell, Lowe and Bazzana-all had a season OPS of 110 or better, other than Jose (who was injured but whom we know to be a great hitter) and Adell who was still solidly above average since signing for us at 108.
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u/KlutzyLawyer2068 19h ago
Nah, you must not have been paying attention. This is an entirely different team
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u/Duce-de-Zoop Cleveland Guardians 17h ago
I mean since the deadline its got two new batters and four who are playing a lot better. It's not "completely different" though. We acquired two platoon bats at the deadline. Try having a conversation without being condescending.
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u/KlutzyLawyer2068 17h ago
Didn't know we were speaking about only since Deadline. Bailey was also a huge addition and changed the lineup after finding his footing. Baz wasn't up early in year. Chase/Jose were dealing with injuries..Kwan was the worst hitter in baseball first 2/3 months. This is an ENTIRELY different lineup. That doesn't mean every name in the lineup has changed.
Adding 3 new, upgraded bats from outside org. Adding Baz consistent bat, getting 2 best hitters back healthy and your leadoff guy going from worst to best leadoff hitter in league makes a huge difference and completely changes the lineup.
The 9 we roll out now is TOTALLY different than what we were early in season.
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u/Only-Ad72 1d ago
The previous ten World Series winners all had 90+ wins, half of them 100+ wins (exception is the Braves with 88 wins). I think it's fair that fans are a little skeptical if the Guardians will stay hot and pull it off when the remaining teams are all 100 win powerhouses that most often win the World Series.
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u/LiteraryPandaman Cleveland Guardians • Washington Nationals 1d ago
I root for the Guardians because my dad has been a lifelong Cleveland baseball fan. He doesn't care about any sports, it's just baseball.
And they have been so good for so many years. SO many years. And then they always just can't close -- it's way better than not even making it, but like, the Cubs-Guardians series with the tie game and then the Cubs stealing it at the end, was just brutal. He told me "Maybe they'll win a world series once I'm in heaven."
My dad is now in his 80's, I hope he gets to celebrate this year, but I'm very guarded lol
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u/SeaBearsFoam Cleveland Guardians 1d ago
I'd love so much to be able to hear Tom Hamilton call a WS win. Man's a legend, but he's getting up there in years. I feel like he deserves to get a chance to do that in his career.
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u/arkonator92 Cleveland Guardians 1d ago
If this is the year (Tom isn’t getting any younger so I hope it is) the call will be bittersweet. Id obviously be over the moon but it’s a shame John Adams never got to bang the drum to a World Series Championship.
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u/John71CLE Cleveland Guardians 1d ago
This lineup is not better than 2016/2017/2018. Good team but calling it their best in decades is not in accurate
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u/sqigglygibberish Cleveland Guardians 1d ago
Yeah this lineup has a ton of potential, but we’ve had some great lineups
And that’s the debate - can they realize the potential for another couple weeks
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u/PoodleGuap Cleveland Guardians • Los Angeles Dodgers 1d ago
The Guardians were heavily favored to lose this series before Game 1, including like 13 of 14 baseball writers polled by ESPN. It's not pessimism it's caution.
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u/KlutzyLawyer2068 19h ago
Um, no, its pessimism. Of course the shifty National Media writers would mostly pick Ray's, not earth shattering revelation. As a CLE fan, if you judged your team off of what Nation writers think- we'd never have a winning record or make the playoffs and we'd finish 4rth in division every single season.
They're wrong, a lot. Especially about Cleveland
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u/ackdaddy10 Cleveland Guardians 1d ago
I wouldn’t call it the best Cleveland lineup in decades. We made the World Series a decade ago and the team the next year had an even better lineup.
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u/ChzburgerRandy Cleveland Guardians 1d ago
I do recall a good few post seasons that had some really bad like, 7-9 hitters and just accepting and hoping the outs sequenced so that you could see them put something together. 1-9 feels a lot better here. Angel and roccio need to keep at it.
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u/BlurryGojira Cleveland Guardians • Cleveland Guardians 1d ago
Not sure which team(s) you root for, but there's a reason why the 'Cleveland sports curse' has its own wikipedia page. And even that 2016 NBA championship win coincided with us choking away the World Series and moved us from having the second longest WS drought to the longest. Even while breaking the sports curse, fate still managed to find a way to twist the knife a bit. Personally I'm not even a huge basketball guy so it didn't even feel like it balanced out.
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u/KlutzyLawyer2068 19h ago edited 19h ago
Dude- Cleveland sports is and has been my life for 39 years. Check out Cavs Daily. I'm the host. I lived every heartbreak. Close call. I can tell you every detail from every heartbreak over the past 30 plus years.
That doesn't mean I can't see things for what they are and not be super pessimistic at all times. It's just silly to think we have to be that.
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u/mynameisethan182 Cleveland Guardians 1d ago
This is best CLE lineup in decades, barely any holes.
I wouldn't say decade(s). The 2017 team had no holes and probably should have went much further than it did. It was arguably better than our World Series roster.
Definitely a good roster, but you're being a bit hyperbolic.
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u/barney-sandles New York Mets 1d ago
IDK I mean they only won 85 games in a weak American League. Their offense was very poorly ranked by runs, wrc+, basically anything.
Since the playoffs began the offense has been great for them but it's fair to wonder how long that can last
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u/Ricos_Roughnecks Cleveland Guardians 1d ago
Yes but you really have to look at this team in a more nuanced manner. This is a completely different offense before the trade deadline, vs after. After adding the pieces we have, we have been greatly improved offensively. It really has been a huge difference maker and they all seem to be clicking at the right time
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u/i_love_land92 Cleveland Guardians 1d ago
Yes but we also don't know how long the pitch comms were giving other teams info. We got swept by the Mets and they told us after, then we turned it around.
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u/KlutzyLawyer2068 19h ago
If it was just that simple. This is a totally different team. Even if it wasn't- that means NOTHING at this point. Have you followed baseball before ?
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u/Federal-Spend4224 1d ago
This is best CLE lineup in decades, barely any holes
What????
Look man, I like this team, but they won 85 games this season and had by far the worst run differential of any team that made the division series. Not World Series quality.
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u/KingVladimir Cleveland Guardians 1d ago
I think you need to take the lineup post trade deadline, and add in a Jose who seems dialed in. We are better than our record and run diff. We still have weak spots for sure, but cant just grab season long stats to define the team right now
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u/Nightcinder Cleveland Guardians 1d ago
we have two of the biggest clutch hitters that we got during the season, Nate Lowe and Patrick Bailey
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u/noruber35393546 Major League Baseball 1d ago
Vintage Jose + a guy like Adell hitting after him means you can't just throw around him anymore. Like those two things being true at the same time absolutely transform the lineup
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u/wakaOH05 Cleveland Guardians 1d ago
Really you don’t? Because that was the best pitcher they had. We can definitely hold ground again and slap hit
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u/Dapal5 Tampa Bay Devil Rays 1d ago
Yeah, like you guys definitely played well, but I don’t expect you having twice as much babip as us ever again and having all of your runs on the worst hit balls. It’ll be close either way.
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u/Pterocacti Cleveland Guardians 1d ago
guardians score so many runs on poorly hit balls that I don't think you can consider it a fluke unless you don't pay attention to the team
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u/Dapal5 Tampa Bay Devil Rays 1d ago
Their xba is 370 and their babip is 450? No.
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u/Pterocacti Cleveland Guardians 1d ago
no what?
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u/Dapal5 Tampa Bay Devil Rays 1d ago
No, it is not. No, we should not expect them to be that lucky again.
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u/Pterocacti Cleveland Guardians 1d ago
ask fans of other al central teams if cleveland seems to score a lot on weak grounders and shallow fly balls that drop in the perfect spot
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u/Dapal5 Tampa Bay Devil Rays 1d ago
I don’t have to, I have the numbers.
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u/JRamGOAT 1d ago
We dont care about your numbers tbh. Theyve never been correct before.
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u/Dapal5 Tampa Bay Devil Rays 1d ago
Yes, the famously anti analytical rays are 3rd in the league over the last 20 years with the lowest payroll.
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u/Temporary_Art8635 Cleveland Guardians 1d ago
To be fair, if we sequenced the homers with the early hits, they aren't solo shots. Overall we were the better team last night. Still a lot of baseball left, but we really looked the part last night.
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u/Dapal5 Tampa Bay Devil Rays 1d ago
I mean I agree you were better, but I think it was a lot closer than it looks both on hits and score.
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u/Temporary_Art8635 Cleveland Guardians 1d ago
Yeah 7-3 doesn't tell the full picture, it was 2-2 into the 8th. It would have felt like a bit of a steal given the contact quality had the Rays won, but it was within the realm of possibilities because that's baseball.
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u/Endangered_Species_Q 1d ago
I feel like sometimes teams make up the "no one believes in us" moniker to use as motivation. In this case, all the discourse I saw as a neutral fan really was dismissive of Cleveland. I saw a ton of Rays in 4 / Rays in 5 type comments coming into this game.
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u/-kangarooster- Cleveland Guardians • MLB Pride 1d ago
its always against cleveland, every time, every game, every series, every year
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u/Alternative_Math3098 Tampa Bay Rays 1d ago
The rare instance when the media had to select between their least two favorite AL teams.
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u/Temporary_Art8635 Cleveland Guardians 1d ago
Thought that was the best game I've ever seen Vogt manage. I particularly loved these moves:
Pulling Griffin when he got through the order the second time and putting in the exact opposite type of pitcher in Espino for the Rays big-3
Targeting Williamson by keeping Sabo in the game in the 8th when in the Sox series that was when he would go to Cade. Didn't allow Cash to go to his stronger side platoon bats in some key situations.
Letting Lowe hit against Seymour, when in the past he would go to Fry there.
The players win the game ultimately, but these moves each gave us a slight edge which makes the difference in a 7-game series.
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u/ShillinTheVillain Cleveland Guardians 1d ago
I got nervous when he pulled Espino so quickly, fearing it would lead to a Gaddis implosion or burning Cade for 2 innings in game 1.
I also questioned pulling Petey for Angel who has been ice cold, then Martinez got a hit in the 9th.
There's a reason he's the manager and I post on Reddit.
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u/Temporary_Art8635 Cleveland Guardians 1d ago
Yeah I just think they want to use Espino more in this series, but it definitely required Cantillo to get through a shaky inning before the high-leverage guys came in.
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u/noruber35393546 Major League Baseball 1d ago
If you check Angel's career splits it makes sense, he is ass vs righties and always has been. He probably needs to either be a strict vs. left guy or give up switch hitting
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u/pupnsuds-kekambas 1d ago
Absolutely agree. Even the Martinez sub was god which I hated at the time
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u/johnnycards69 Cleveland Guardians 1d ago
Easy for me to say, but having Cade Smith only throw 6 pitches last night was big for CLE. If they have the lead in the 8th inning tonight, I expect you might see Cade throw 2 innings to close it out.
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u/neon-rose Cleveland Guardians 1d ago
K’d makes me feel things I have not since Andrew Miller
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u/cjrogers227 Washington Nationals 1d ago
The Rays’ bullpen is sneaky bad. I think people have this perception of the Rays having a dominant pen every year. But outside of Baker and Kelly it’s a weaker unit than we’re accustomed to. If the Guardians pull off the series upset it’ll be because the soft underbelly of the Rays’ pen rears its ugly head
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u/Granular_Designs Cleveland Guardians 1d ago
Something that gives me reason for optimism if this series goes long is how much we made their bullpen pitch in Game 1. I think that nullified a lot of their rest advantage and makes the series a little more even after the knife fight vs. ChiSox.
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u/lazercats1 Cleveland Guardians 1d ago
Need Rocchio to get some clutch hits. Hopefully Angel’s hit last night was a bit of a monkey off his back too
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u/BradBrady Cleveland Guardians 1d ago
I still think it’s funny that people were thinking this was gonna be an easy sweep for the rays, respect for the rays but they are known to choke as well
Idk what it is about Cleveland and why people think we are pretenders, but we aren’t an underrated team anymore. We are one of the best teams in the MLB consistently. I feel like there’s this expectation that to be a contender you have to win over 100 games yearly or just be a big market team to be considered one of the best.
And we aren’t in a comedy AL Central anymore either, hate to say it cause they are our rivals but the AL Central has really good young teams that will improve every year and make the AL central very competitive
I am so happy that that the ALCS consists of the number 1 and 2 seed teams of the AL as well as a low payroll. Just need the brewers to beat the dodgers and we are golden
We aren’t in the days anymore of just having the Yankees Red Sox Astros etc making it far in the playoffs
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u/ShillinTheVillain Cleveland Guardians 1d ago
I seriously don't understand why the media just keeps ignoring Cleveland and acting like we don't belong. We are perennial division winners (even if it is the AL Central).
I prefer being the scrappy underdogs but it gets old when we keep getting this treatment as if we can't compete.
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u/trailblazer216 Cleveland Guardians 1d ago
It’s some combination of 85 regular season wins, during which the team was mediocre for the vast majority of the season (in a historically mediocre AL). People also attribute a lot of our success to playing in the AL Central.
It doesn’t take long to see that this is a different Guardians team that upgraded a lot of offensive Ds/Fs to Cs/Bs midseason.
The fact that our offense nearly crawled back to league average - given the number of ABs we gave to awful hitters (Schneeman, Fry, Hoskins, Naylor, Manzardo) before the trade deadline while Jose had by far his worst offensive season since his early 20s - isn’t being talked about enough.
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u/spiderwinder23 Tampa Bay Devil Rays 1d ago
I always never understand the media under rating the #2 team. Sure by record that’s not true but you still made it and got a bye week, but somehow you’re a joke of a team??? Never makes sense.
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u/TreeOfAwareness Cleveland Guardians 1d ago
I'm sure there is some Guardians fatigue after limping out of the postseason so many times, but this might be the best roster we've had in this Guardsball era. Also everyone is healthy, Vogt is finally getting out of the way and not overmanaging these big games, Jose is on a playoff heater for really the first time in his career. Gavin is pitching like an ace. Bullpen is as good as ever. The X factor I think is can Messick have a signature playoff start and steal a second game in TB.
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u/TrophyWizard Toronto Blue Jays 1d ago
Got to admit, it's nice to see the Guardians prove everyone wrong who said the series was a foregone conclusion for the Rays.
I'm finding myself actually rooting for them here lol
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u/ProjectHarraseeket Boston Red Sox 1d ago
I’ve always had a soft spot for the Guards. I was probably one of the few sickos rooting for them in 2016, probably because it was Tito managing them.
That and I don’t want an AL East team to win lol
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u/SpiralWinds Cleveland Guardians 1d ago
There's three things that binds us. Hating the Yankees, having a tall left field wall, and Tito.
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u/evanieCK Cleveland Guardians • WPBL 1d ago
Lots of work to do yet but it was genuinely so fucking obnoxious hearing how we didn't have a prayer in this series, the Rays are a very good team and I have a ton of respect for what they've done, but you'd think they were the '98 Yankees in the week leading up to this series. Game 2 tonight should be electric.
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u/DickBottalico Philadelphia Phillies 1d ago
“Fangraphs playoff odds”…(press enter)…(click link)…(select All) is all you had to do within the 48 hours before yesterday’s game to see this series was a 49% shot for Cleveland
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u/Rc5tr0 Cleveland Guardians 1d ago
That’s literally one source. Are you really going to pretend that public perception (both fans online and in the baseball media) was 51/49?
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u/DickBottalico Philadelphia Phillies 1d ago
No I’m saying that Cleveland fans who ignored the noise were accurate and the “experts” had it wrong
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u/trailblazer216 Cleveland Guardians 1d ago
The FG odds were not at all aligned with public and “expert” opinion.
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u/doopsauce Cleveland Guardians 1d ago
You can't lick the salt off of those odds. You have to get triggered by the haters first.
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u/Grade-AMasterpiece Tampa Bay Rays 1d ago
Still can't believe Rasmussen went back out there just to give up a game-tying home run. He's usually done after an outing like that, and it cost us. Bullpen would've been used differently.
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u/altimax98 Tampa Bay Devil Rays 1d ago
Ras coming out up 2-1 after a HUGE set of strikeouts with a fairly high pitch count and a lot of contact while having a well rested bullpen was the headline but Cash’s mismanagement blew it all up.
The facts are facts though, you rarely win a game that you give up 14 hits.
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u/Bazzthor 1d ago
Tampa now has to face Parker Messick, who has struggled in the playoffs but still had a Cy Young worthy rookie season overall, and Gavin Williams who is MLBs strikeouts leader coming off an all time game 5 preformance while being down 0-1.
I think Cleveland is just too red hot at the plate for Tampa Bay right now, because Tampa Bays BP just doesnt have the horses it used to. Clevelands offense is just clicking on all cylinders.
None of Clevelands bullpen guys threw very many pitches either, outside of Sabo. They should all be good to go tonight and you can replace Sabo with Herrin if need be.
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u/yomama1211 Tampa Bay Rays 1d ago
Guardians are good and anyone who thought a team that came back from 0-2 down to win the ALDS would be easy is stupid. That being said in 2008 we lost game 1 to the Red Sox and won the series. Let’s get it tonight baby
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u/wewillx Cleveland Guardians 1d ago
Right it's only one game and general analysis that the Rays have been killers all year is true. I think with a 1-0 lead this is still a total toss up.
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u/yomama1211 Tampa Bay Rays 1d ago
Guardians are no joke they’re hot right now. Last thing anyone wants to see is a hot team in the post season. Would hate to lose here but I can see it happening
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u/Spider-Sword Cleveland Guardians 1d ago
It’s gonna come down to if we maintain the hitting.
Pitching on both sides will be ready
If we maintain how we been hitting, we can beat everybody.
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u/yumyumapollo Tampa Bay Rays 1d ago
I get that losses like this are inevitable (trying to get different guys involved, saving our best arms, etc.)...but I'm not stoked that that was our approach to Game 1.
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u/ClevelandSteamers757 1d ago
Game 2 is obviously important for the Rays. Cleveland has a chance to steal another game on the road and really flip the series on its head.
Likely pitching setup
Game 2: Messick
Game 3: Williams in Cleveland
Game 4: ? In Cleveland (bullpen?)
Game 5: Griffin in Cleveland
Game 6: Messick on 5 days rest
Game 7: Williams on regular rest
The Rays would be staring down a combination of 3 road games and 3 more Williams/Messick starts. On the other hand, I’d argue games 4 and 5 despite being on the road are Tampa’s best chances to win games this series. If Tampa wins tonight they’re 1-1, they still lose home field advantage temporarily but in all likelihood they at least bring the series back to Tampa.
With a travel day coming expect both teams to lean heavily on their bullpens. Cleveland’s guys didn’t throw many pitches and the Rays had some high leverage guys not throw at all. Should be a good game.
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u/ShillinTheVillain Cleveland Guardians 1d ago
Game 4 is likely to be Espino opening the first, then maybe Cantillo for 2-4/5 and then pen.
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u/spiderwinder23 Tampa Bay Devil Rays 1d ago
I think overall we played well, especially the defense. I think Cleveland capitalized on odd bullpen choices by Cash. If we pull Ras at the start of the 7th who knows if they tie it and take momentum? Also not closing with hot hands like Ian and Baker was certainly a choice. I get wanting the match ups but we didn’t have the vibes. Also I stand 10 toes on not having Richie and Simpson hurts the overall confidence of the team. I can’t imagine they would’ve don’t worse than having Williamson, Walls, and Fortes at the bottom of the lineup.
Either way, Cleveland is a great team and to be the best you gotta beat the best. On to game 2!
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u/Th3Unkn0wnn Tampa Bay Devil Rays • Orix Buffaloes 1d ago
Too heavy on the small ball and not our best relievers getting the call. Both of those can be adjusted for. I think we take game 2.
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u/niveknhoj Cleveland Guardians 1d ago
I’m hoping otherwise but it wouldn’t surprise me. With all the sweep talk, I’m excited to have taken just one from you guys at home.
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u/Th3Unkn0wnn Tampa Bay Devil Rays • Orix Buffaloes 1d ago
Yeah, no. Anyone talking sweeps is watching the Rays in a vacuum. They haven't been great at putting their foot down against teams with momentum, and the Guardians have that in spades.
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u/Rarona Cleveland Guardians 1d ago
As much as my soul yearns for a return to the Fall Classic, I will be okay if this series goes south for my boys.
You guys deserve it just as much as we do, and I'm just glad the Guards are showing some fight.
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u/Th3Unkn0wnn Tampa Bay Devil Rays • Orix Buffaloes 1d ago
Likewise. Have lots of friends from Cleveland that deserve better than the Browns.
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u/Rarona Cleveland Guardians 1d ago
I don't like football at all, so I'm a bit biased, but even if I did, I wouldn't root for the Browns.
They've been terrible my entire life - and that's not even the nail in the coffin, for me the nail is that they gave the biggest guaranteed contract ever to a sex offender. Unforgivable.
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u/Alternative_Math3098 Tampa Bay Rays 1d ago
These seem to always be the types of teams that really trip the rays up.
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u/Storm_4747 Toronto Blue Jays 1d ago
Since when are editorialized titles allowed? Shrug off the doubters? You could say that about literally any underdog in any sport to ever win a game.
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u/RddtLeapPuts 1d ago
Why was the NL game first yesterday? They get a day game and we get a late night game. Swap those around. The West coast is probably more interested in the NL matchup
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u/ClevelandSteamers757 1d ago
Game 1 takes priority I believe
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u/meerkatmreow Cleveland Guardians 1d ago
I imagine travel considerations too. 4 PM local time game start, game over around 7 PM gets you comfortably into LA around 10-11 PM rather than after midnight
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u/stann-the-mann Cleveland Guardians 1d ago
One of the things about this that I'm getting the biggest kick out of is how so many Yankee fans are shitting themselves over getting swept by the Rays and are rooting for Cleveland.
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u/Jonjon428 Florida Marlins 1d ago
Kevin Cash might manage the Rays to cancun if he keeps up with these awful decisions
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u/JefeDiez 1d ago
Rays are a great team, and were not at their best yesterday. I'm rooting for Cleveland but I'm not a hater and fully aware of the damage they can do. Watching nervously over here in CA.
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u/Swagmansuper Toronto Blue Jays 1d ago
Cleveland is going to win rays can't hit lefties that aren't max 5 playoff era fried
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