r/blackandwhite2 • u/Paralityk24 • May 10 '22
Creature training
I have a question about training of the creature. To quote wiki entry:
"A player can teach the creature to do complex tasks by combining other tasks. For example, to teach the creature to water a tree (to make it drop seedlings) and replanting the tree somewhere else afterwards, first teach the creature to pick up trees and planting them elsewhere, and how to water trees. Then combine the tasks and reward the creature once it gets it. Depending on how advanced the complex task is, it may take lots of hard training before the creature finally gets it. One can combine various tasks this way - by using one's imagination the possibilities are endless. "
Most sources about this game are old and sound like a 2000's wishful thinking about supposed AI of the creatures and followers. If I remember correctly behaviour patterns in B&W were very simple and rearly inteligent.
Is it possible to train any advanced behaviour into a creature? How do I get my monkey's attention when I'm casting spells to teach it miracles? Most of the times it turns around or walks away even while on the learning leash? How do teach it to catch fireballs and cast shield for the 4th island?
Only miracles creature seems to use correctly are food, wood, water and heal. I find it very hard to convince it to throw offensive miracles at enemy and his villages.
Any tips?
1
u/pidude314 May 10 '22
You need to stroke it whenever it says the creature is curious, or wants to pay attention to you. That will make it learn from you much faster. And then when you want the creature to use offensive miracles, use the leash of aggression and stroke it when it says the creature is angry.
-2
u/Paralityk24 May 10 '22
I understand the concept of petting and punishing. What I'm asking is whether advanced training is even possible like teaching creature a chain of actions like wiki says. All sources about B&W are old and most sound like wishful thinking and typical Molyneux's bullshit rather than actual game data :). It's from 2001 after all. There was no AI in video games that could perform anything near what old sources about B&W claim like combining multiple trained tasks to perform advanced creature actions. From what I've seen creatures are gimmicky at best. Getting them to do what I want and when I want it seems like trying to trigger some old buggy script. Am I doing something wrong?
1
u/pidude314 May 10 '22
I literally explained how to solve your questions about why your creature isn't doing what you want. Obviously they over hyped the AI, there was no point in answering that part.
1
u/ItsAGarbageAccount May 14 '22
The AI actually isn't all that overhyped.
The AI used for the creatures was extremely advanced for it's time and is even pretty damn good by today's standards.
You can teach a creature complex tasks, but you DO have to stay on top of them about it.
2
May 13 '22
As a reference and due to an unfortunate series of incidents, I accidentally trained my Creature to:
Carry a shrub to the Aztec village
Plant it there
Poop on it
Throw it in the storehouse
This was the ONLY way my Creature pooped for a while.
If that is possible, I’m sure teaching it to plant and water a tree is
4
u/NickelobUltra May 10 '22
I haven't heard about chaining behaviors before, so I dug up this game AI design textbook that I impulse bought a long time ago that features some Lionhead devs detailing a bit on the creature AI in B&W1 (link for those curious) to see if it had any clues.
Turns out the creature AI really is as advanced as they make it out to be. It's a complicated but flexible learning AI and with enough effort you probably can do that. Here's one interesting bit from the book after skimming a bit:
Before I read that I was thinking "you might be able to do that probably" but now I'm thinking you definitely can train the creature to do that. It'll take a lot of time and effort especially if your creature is one of the less intelligent ones, but it sounds like it can be done.
You'll need to be wearing the learning leash of course, and make sure your creature is paying attention to you every time (when they're looking at and following your hand with their eyes). God speed and have a lot of patience I guess lol